Here's why Nobushi is busted in team modes | Forums

[ScottJund]

No you said it because you are smug. You said it before the comment you are quoting as a reason for you saying it ...

Nothing is implied btw. I am quite happy to spell out that the game should not be balanced around people with their head as far up their own arse as you. People who believe the world revolves around them and they know better than everyone else. The 'everyone else' that you look down on is the playerbase, you are not. At the end of the day, if things are done to please you and they do not please the playerbase, then (more) people will stop playing the game. You think balancing around people like you is working out well so far in terms of how happy the community is with the state of the game?

Its a little ironic you think I don't care about the community when in fact balancing for tournament-level players is how you actually create and retain a community for a fighting game. Its what all major fighting games do. They actually straight up hired FG professionals for SFV. You get people interested in your game if there is a "scene" to the game, or there are notable people who direct traffic to the game. If you suddenly got FG pros pouring into For Honor, do you seriously think the game wouldn't grow massively? Of course it would. The problem is, these people think For Honor is a joke of a game because balance is not done in accordance with tournament placers, so they'd never be here anyway.

This game can be a casual game and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but its clearly not what Ubisoft wants, with the implementation of Ranked Mode, the callouts for Tournaments on Warrior's Den, the flying out of tournament winners to their headquarters to discuss balance, etc. Ubisoft most likely wants a competitive fighting game.

It's Ubisofts call, but if they want to suck up to people like you who couldn't give a rats arse about the community

And please, I've done more for this community and care about it more than you ever will.

[That_guy44]

I refuse to acknowledge this tournament level perspective. Tournament club more like. A lot of these tournaments go under the radar and nobody even knows about it. Until Ubisoft puts in a world tournament mode like Fifa, everyone is a casual. Myself included. I'm not saying there are folks that don't take this game seriously and aren't good, but after watching Ubisoft invite some pretty bad streamers for season 2, I've lost trust in folks claiming tournament level status. I have suspicion that once ranked is included, greag players will pop out of nowhere and the now elite may not seem so elite.

I do believe Nobushi is pretty strong in 4v4. I don't have enough character knowledge to say if she is the best or not currently. I don't think she is hot stuff in 2v2 though. It's pretty easy to block her attacks if she's trying to gank, and as long as you have a competent teammate, she won't have the time to gank in the first place.

[Blasto95]

I refuse to acknowledge this tournament level perspective. Tournament club more like. A lot of these tournaments go under the radar and nobody even knows about it. Until Ubisoft puts in a world tournament mode like Fifa, everyone is a casual. Myself included. I'm not saying there are folks that don't take this game seriously and aren't good, but after watching Ubisoft invite some pretty bad streamers for season 2, I've lost trust in folks claiming tournament level status. I have suspicion that once ranked is included, greag players will pop out of nowhere and the now elite may not seem so elite.

I do believe Nobushi is pretty strong in 4v4. I don't have enough character knowledge to say if she is the best or not currently. I don't think she is hot stuff in 2v2 though. It's pretty easy to block her attacks if she's trying to gank, and as long as you have a competent teammate, she won't have the time to gank in the first place.

I dont think the current elite players will mind at all running into new even better talent. They play at a level where they just want to get better themselves and believe they can.
That Ubisoft invite for some players I think was a joke. One of the streamers even said he was horrible. They brought on talent and personalities. Some with a combination of both, but not every person there was talented and others were simply not fun or exciting to watch. Clearly Ubisoft wanted to bring entertainment for that event, not full on competitiveness.
Nobushi is strong in 4v4 and just as good or even better in 2v2. Ive watched enough not to know why she's that good, but just to see her in 90% of competitive matches tells you something.
I do know one thing. Because of Nobushis range on her ZA, your teammate has to either just attempt a GB, or the Nobushi has to notice someone attempting to GB her teammate, and bam free nonpunishable ZA. Im sure my thought process is wrong in someway but I think im getting the jist of it.

[ScottJund]

I refuse to acknowledge this tournament level perspective. Tournament club more like. A lot of these tournaments go under the radar and nobody even knows about it. Until Ubisoft puts in a world tournament mode like Fifa, everyone is a casual. Myself included. I'm not saying there are folks that don't take this game seriously and aren't good, but after watching Ubisoft invite some pretty bad streamers for season 2, I've lost trust in folks claiming tournament level status. I have suspicion that once ranked is included, greag players will pop out of nowhere and the now elite may not seem so elite.

I do believe Nobushi is pretty strong in 4v4. I don't have enough character knowledge to say if she is the best or not currently. I don't think she is hot stuff in 2v2 though. It's pretty easy to block her attacks if she's trying to gank, and as long as you have a competent teammate, she won't have the time to gank in the first place.

Basing your opinion of tournament players in a tournament that was held almost entirely for publicity isn't the wisest decision. Only a handful of players were there because they were actually good. There have been over a hundred actual open tournaments where anyone could enter over the months, and the same names keep popping up on the ends.

There probably are some unknown excellent people that for one reason or another have decided to not enter any tournaments for months and months, but they will be at a severe disadvantage to the people with months of tournament-level practice.

Better to bring this to attention now, because when ranked drops and people make 2v2 / 4v4 teams, there will be a whole new slew of "Nobushi is completely broken in these modes" posts, I absolutely guarantee it.

[Antonioj26]

It's a real shame that a well thought out post is shouted down with no sort of actual argument or counter point. He's given examples, links, damage values, and tourney results. He's even acknowledged that she's lacking in 1v1, but still no sort of discussion can be had in this place. It always becomes an argument over grammar or cherry picking someone's wording. Great post OP, some interesting stuff.

[That_guy44]

I'm super ****ing glad I'm not working on the balancing issues. For honor runs differently on pc and console. Then 4v4 and duel modes are completely different as well.

These open tournaments have poor advertising. I wouldn't even know to where to look. I'd guess reddit, but I never spend time on reddit. What are the sizes of said tournaments? And is it just the same folks competing? Right now im getting the vibe of of championships in boxing. They have different leagues with different weights and competition size. It's incredibly easy to dodge fighters too. I think a centralized ranking system will do good for For honor.

The folks at For Honor also need to choose which side they want to go with. Will they choose competition or casual? Longetivy lies in competition but the money lies in casual. If they piss off the casuals, the money will stop coming in. This may seem fine for hardcore players, until Ubisoft pulls support for lack of funds. The casual players aren't in the wrong either. They have spent massive cash to make for honor what it is today. The game wouldn't be anywhere near as big without casuals buying copies. I don't know what path the devs will go but I don't think they can hold hands with both. I don't see a way it will work.

[ScottJund]

I'm super ****ing glad I'm not working on the balancing issues. For honor runs differently on pc and console. Then 4v4 and duel modes are completely different as well.

These open tournaments have poor advertising. I wouldn't even know to where to look. I'd guess reddit, but I never spend time on reddit. What are the sizes of said tournaments? And is it just the same folks competing? Right now im getting the vibe of of championships in boxing. They have different leagues with different weights and competition size. It's incredibly easy to dodge fighters too. I think a centralized ranking system will do good for For honor.

The folks at For Honor also need to choose which side they want to go with. Will they choose competition or casual? Longetivy lies in competition but the money lies in casual. If they piss off the casuals, the money will stop coming in. This may seem fine for hardcore players, until Ubisoft pulls support for lack of funds. The casual players aren't in the wrong either. They have spent massive cash to make for honor what it is today. The game wouldn't be anywhere near as big without casuals buying copies. I don't know what path the devs will go but I don't think they can hold hands with both. I don't see a way it will work.

Both money and longevity lie in competition. How do casual players of this game earn the game money? They already bought it, and they're probably not buying steel. The only way they make more money for sure is if they sell more copies of the game, which would happen if the competitive scene raised publicity about the game itself.

It's also not hard to find these tournaments. Five seconds on the competitive subreddit and you have a list right there, with Discords to join for even more information. It may seem like they're super underground or hard to get to, but that just means you haven't tried looking, which means you probably aren't really dedicated enough to be a tournament player regardless. (Not you in particular, just overall)

[Draghmar]

Both money and longevity lie in competition. How do casual players of this game earn the game money? They already bought it, and they're probably not buying steel. The only way they make more money for sure is if they sell more copies of the game, which would happen if the competitive scene raised publicity about the game itself.

I think you have no idea how game company works and how to sell games and how to make money in a long turn. What you describing here are some archaic way of selling games. All the things they doing weekly basis and for seasons are to make money. Not to please us. Just to make money. Unfortunately all I can tell you is that you need to believe me that this is much more lucrative then pleasing 2% of playerbase - those are good for PR and that's it.

[ScottJund]

I think you have no idea how game company works and how to sell games and how to make money in a long turn. What you describing here are some archaic way of selling games. All the things they doing weekly basis and for seasons are to make money. Not to please us. Just to make money. Unfortunately all I can tell you is that you need to believe me that this is much more lucrative then pleasing 2% of playerbase - those are good for PR and that's it.

No ****, that's all any company ever does. The point of a business is to make money. I'm saying, they would actually be more successful and have a better future if they focused solely on competitive. There is a reason Street Figher still exists today.

[Utopie.]

Better to bring this to attention now, because when ranked drops and people make 2v2 / 4v4 teams, there will be a whole new slew of "Nobushi is completely broken in these modes" posts, I absolutely guarantee it.

I really really hope Ubiosft acts on that before releasing ranked because that is exaclty what will happen. Strange enough that the community has the chance to see in every 2v2 tourney that there is a big issue and still the forum acts like their blind.

This rection - to a good tourney player who actually took the effort to explain a BIG problem in High level and competetive play - shows why so many good players dont post here anymore.