What a parry should give you | Forums

[Butonfly]

It's to easy, and to rewarding. We all know the cry of the "defensive meta" and parry is a big part of that.

Idea for change, simply reduce what parry gives you. So no more free guard break.

Instead, an unparriable attack after a parry with the chance for the parried opponent to block. But the block has 50% chip damage.

Then balance according to Hero (some get better perks than others already).

An idea.

[Netcode_err_404]

What should give ? Thats a nice question.

Dark souls 1 had the same problem. I will explain better if you do not know what Im talking about.


In dark souls 1 every weapon in the game except whips are parriable. That for a long period has meant nobody used extreme heavy weapons, because they were too slow to be used with efficiency.

Then, since the game is pretty broken community discovered a couple of glitch to bypass that, such as dead angle. Shields had a dead angle just near their left, that means with an accurate blow you could bypass the shield and do damage.

In the next games they fixed that giving 2 handed heavy weapons unparriable attacks. You can block them with a sheidl but cannot parry, and ofc you can dodge.

But doing the same in for honor is risky. But could wor


BTW probably the easiest suggestion is giving parriies a stun effect for 2-3 seconds. During the stun effect dodging back would make you fall to the ground. so you are forced to side dodge or parry. Both can be punished, but not ina guaranteed way.

[Vingrask]

Ubi need to rethink the entire defense system in my opinion. The game's flow is "impaired" by a chain of factors which lead to the lack of action and poor use of movesets.

Block is free. The chip damage you get from blocking a heavy isn't near to be dangerous, what makes parry optional.
Parry is easy and you can even parry lights. The reward for every parry (or feint) is a free guard break, so the repetition happens over and over and over.
Guard Break is basicaly what defines the match. You have a free heavy hit or more depending if near a cliff or if the enemy has no stamina.

Feint is just a fancy move in the end, because the fight today is based on parry. Someone feint, someone try parry or not, and this is a fight.

There is no follow ups. There is no momentum change. There is no counter per se. For Honor devolved to Chivalry instead evolve to a Street Fighter (you get the point).

[AKDagriZ]

i will speak for my main . Valkyrie . Most of the time she get nothing out of a parry . enemy too far .You can't not even follow with a shield crush ,you will whiff a GB an as a result you'l be free GB

this is really frustrating to a point because me with my main i cannot turtle and rely on free stuff after a parry like an easy throw off cliff i have to rely only on the shoulder pin wich is good but way more dangerous than a parry especially when the input is bad.

Last night i really realize it dueling a warden rep 0 while i am now rep 23 . i had to pull out all my tool bag a lot of artifice to success a single light attack .The warden will always be quick enough to block the second light . And most of warden turtle there way.They always and only top attack or zone attack And the problem is his top light attack is too fast for a deflect and they always feint you top heavy to bait you into his top counter. So you can't guess to try to deflect the top heavy because if its a light you miss it every time and he is not doing anything else that can give you an opening

Not that i don't respect warden but he is a good part of the problem with the turtle meta and too much reward out of a parry

And i would say there is a similar big problem with LAwbringer .If he turtle and parry you there is a good chance you will end up out of stamina for the rest of the entire round.

[MonyBichesHonr]

IMO

Guard Break is too good of a reward for parrying, because a guard break is equal to instant kill on very many locations on very many maps. At worst, it's a heavy attack for a large number of classes.

Parry should no longer give guard break, but instead give a free light attack. You may opt to guard break in a way that wouldn't be countered by the enemy deciding to throw a light attack, but he could counter your guard break and reset to neutral. Many classes get cool features after a successful light attack, and can use that momentum to get further benefits but with the possibility of being countered by an alert opponent.

[MonyBichesHonr]

Rather, Parry should give out GB, but GB should not give out guaranteed heavies, and all 'moves' from GB should be possible to counter...

...and then, GB should give a "set of possible moves" which can individually be countered, so instead of being either a 100% guaranteed heavy damage or 100% guaranteed position change, it should offer opportunities of such.

No... that would be pretty terrible.

What's the point of guard break if guard break can be reacted against and then everything you do from guard break can be reacted against? You might as well not have guard broken to begin with.

[Kitsune..]

Parrying a slow attack (despite it's light or heavy) should give a guaranteed light at best. Parrying a fast attack should be really well rewarded, maybe with an uncounterable GB.
Dividing attacks into light and heavy won't do much good here, because parrying Kensei's light attack != parrying PK's light attack, thus rewards should differ. Significant reduction on parry rewards might enforce people to simple blocking and negate feinting in general, so there should be an incentive to go for a parry.

UPD: Slow attacks (despite light or heavy) can also use some good amount of chip damage to encourage people to use them and to discourage simple blocking. The slower attack is the higher chip damage should be. Fast spammable attacks should not have chip damage in order not to encourage mindless spam. This way feinting will stay viable and ppl will look for ways to outsmart opponents by mixing lights and heavies etc rather then to spam the same stuff. Anyways, I'm completely sure that such changes need individual approach rather than some kind of overall one just to handle exceptions in the best way possible.

[DrExtrem]

It's a hot topic.

But I suggest, that they first equalise the PC and console experiences - by adjusting indicators to console setups - first.

After we are all playing on the sort of even playing field, we can talk about balancing core mechanics.

[Brologna_Xeno]

Not all attacks should result in a free GB when Parried, but some should. Opener attacks like 1st lights or whatever is considered the 'opener' for some heros should be less punished via parry, that way some heros aren't completely shutdown.

But big hits should come with risk. Lke Kitsune said one heros light attack is not the same as another's light attack. To adjust Parry penalty simply by simpling splitting into two categories: light / heavy isn't deep enough. Have to look at each attack in every hero's kit and determine how punishable each individual attack aught to be.

And then there are some attacks that are simply too easy to parry, like Kensei's 2nd light, Conqueror lights, Orochi non-top lights etc. They don't need to necessarily speed these attacks up, could just make the guard direction indicator for them less revealing.

[DrExtrem]

Not all attacks should result in a free GB when Parried, but some should. Opener attacks like 1st lights or whatever is considered the 'opener' for some heros should be less punished via parry, that way some heros aren't completely shutdown.

But big hits should come with risk. Lke Kitsune said one heros light attack is not the same as another's light attack. To adjust Parry penalty simply by simpling splitting into two categories: light / heavy isn't deep enough. Have to look at each attack in every hero's kit and determine how punishable each individual attack aught to be.

And then there are some attacks that are simply too easy to parry, like Kensei's 2nd light, Conqueror lights, Orochi non-top lights etc. They don't need to necessarily speed these attacks up, could just make the guard direction indicator for them less revealing.

I am playing on console and tried to parry the orochis side light attacks in custom match. Its very, very difficult to parry side lights. The light side dash attack ms? No problem - but side light and top light? No way. I tried to get the right timing for my crushing counter - wasted time. Blocking them on console is not a big problem but parry them?

That's why the experience's need to be equalised first.