Warden Shoulder Bash Into Guard Break Needs To Be Removed! | Forums

[cane2simons]

Warden's ability to cancel a shoulder bash into a guard break is very powerful, with a low risk high reward.
My warden is prestige 7, which is also my highest prestige character. Ive won countless 1 v 1 battles using the shoulder bash and shoulder bash cancel into guard break. It's very unfair.
As stated before its a very low risk and high reward, unless you charge the shoulder bash.
If you're playing against a warden 1 v 1 who spams shoulder bash, your MAIN two options is to dodge and risk getting guard broken, or don't dodge and risk getting hit.
Your GUARANTEED options of avoiding his shoulder bash is exiting guard mode and running, or simply backrolling. The easiest to do is backroll so lets touch on that.
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Ive faced many wardens who spam the shoulder bash. If you backroll everytime he executes (not start up. EXECUTE, as in he starts moving) a shoulder bash to simply eliminate the risk of getting hit altogether, you waste stamina quite easily, making it a temporary but non consistent way of avoiding it. Therefore in 1 v 1 it is not effective long term and you will eventually run out of stamina. Exiting guard mode and running away is not viable unless you're in a 4 v 4. Therefore in duels it is not effective.
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So both running away and backrolling, your GUARANTEED chances of avoiding his shoulder bash are tossed out the window in duels.
Oh wait, what about hitting him before he can execute it? Not always an easy thing to do. He can easily intentionally cancel his shoulder bash wind up immediately and parry the attack, leading to a free guard break.
You can also keep your distance, but let's be real, not EVERYONE plays nobushi and this is a close combat game.
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Believe me when i say avoiding this tactic in a 1 v 1 is based on luck unless you keep your distance entirely. I would know this because ive used it countless times against even high skilled players, and assassins, and it WORKS!
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Bottom line, if you try to dodge a shoulder bash, you risk getting guard broken and therefore getting hit. If you don't dodge it you get hit. If you get exhausted its even WORST!
Avoiding this is based on sheer luck. This needs to be changed.
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Shoulder bash should not be able to be canceled into into anything once it starts moving. It should still be able to be canceled during the startup. But once you starts moving you should be forced to follow through, and the recovery time should be removed along with shoulder bash cancel into guard break, as in: If your shoulder bash is dodged, you shouldn't be able to be guard broken since the shoulder bash is quite slow.
Remove shoulder bash into guard break, and to balance it, remove the recovery time after you execute a shoulder bash so you wont get guard broken.
If these changes are implemented: shoulder bash will still be slow but un-cancelable, so you wont be at a high risk or high reward, but you WILL have a way to break an enemy's defense.
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I will update this if need be. If you have any questions or arguements against this post them below. I can clearly see the difference between logical and illogical arguements. mainly looking at sheer facts and through experience. Ill ignore extremely irrational arguements. -.-
If you're wondering why i havent replaced Shoulder Bash and Guard Break with SB and GB, it's because i want everyone to understand clearly what im talking about, incase they don't know what SB and GB mean.

[bmason1000]

I regularly dodge that attack and watch them miss their guard break. That move isn't nearrrly as powerful as you claim. Its a perfectly acceptable piece of their kit that is just fine.

[SerArthur-Dayne]

Or hit them with a light attack which cancels their shoulder bash. Easy.

[bmason1000]

Yeah, its a really simple technique to deal with. I'm surprised you main warden and have trouble handling it against others?

[cane2simons]

Or hit them with a light attack which cancels their shoulder bash. Easy.

Read my post. Not always an easy thing to do, unless youre a berserker, who has the fastest side lights. But even a wardens top light is a little too slow to cancel it everytime. Here's what i said:
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"Oh wait, what about hitting him before he can execute it? Not always an easy thing to do. He can easily intentionally cancel his shoulder bash wind up immediately and parry the attack, leading to a free guard break."

[cane2simons]

Yeah, its a really simple technique to deal with. I'm surprised you main warden and have trouble handling it against others?

There's a reason many players complain about warden and his shoulder bash. But im not here to "cry nerf" im here to lay down hard facts as to why it should be changed. I would happily 1 v 1 someone to show them just how troublesome a shoulder bash spamming warden is in 1 v 1.

[cane2simons]

I regularly dodge that attack and watch them miss their guard break. That move isn't nearrrly as powerful as you claim. Its a perfectly acceptable piece of their kit that is just fine.

Clearly you haven't met a warden who knows how to utilize his shoulder bash lmao...

[darkspawn2101]

I hate the fact it exists.

I hate fighting it, I hate playing it. it's boring. The only light I've been able to interrupt the charge with is Shugoki, for the range.

[MrForz]

When used to full potential, it all comes down to 3 guesses.

-Dodge and risk a cancel into GB
-Stand there in order to counteract the GB and risk eating a raw Shoulder Bash.
-Toss a light attack in order to counteract both the SB and GB and risk a well timed parry.

Now, I do say -risk-. It's not like whatever you do he'll remedy to it. You'll have to learn the hard way whether your Warden opponent tries to be flexible on his methods, or not. Or tried to make you believe he's not flexible, and stuff. And some of the guesses above don't favor the Warden at all and can get him to be punished.

[RoosterIlluzion]

Practice your parry. Warden has to either dodge or use light attack to initiate the charge. If he does a dodge for no reason, get ready to roll. If he tries hitting with a light, parry. Stop crying about a character that is average in all aspects, and is balanced, just because you suck.