Junior Member
this is just my opinion, but the more i play and think about it, this is what i believe to be the issue, and how i think it could be solved.
the problem with the game is that a mechanic that was added in order to break through a player that is being defensive is not used in that manner, it is used offensively to great effect. yes, i am talking about guard breaking. guard breaking is pretty much the key to any character being successful, primarily because it means guaranteed damage, and there are many situations where the guard break cannot be countered. for example, being parried...getting parried means, in most situations, you will be hit with a guard break that you cannot counter, which means you are going to get hit with damage you cannot avoid, or worse thrown off or into one of the many traps all over most maps. it only stands to reason then that you would be pretty careful about throwing the first attack, because you can bet that your opponent is looking to get that parry-guardbreak-damage going. guard break was said to be a way to break guards, but its clear to me that either by inept skill design or by a misleading way of representing it, that it was known to be more of an offensive tool. you need to look no further to see this than the warden, whos whole viability comes from shoulder charge and its 50/50 of either guaranteed side lights or cancel into guard break and side heavy or lights.
parrys are not the only way to get a guaranteed guard break either, as im sure most of you know. guard breaking is the key to dealing safe damage, so its only natural that most players who figure this out are now going to be more defensive, careful about every swing, and always focused on being ready to counter than the attack.
i really feel that the only way to fix the issue is the fully remove guard breaking from the game entirely. it sounds stupid, but follow me on this. if you remove guard breaks, you can still typically land hits off of a parry, so there is still reward for having the timing to do this, just not as damaging or dangerous as their only light attacks. some mechanics would need to change however to make this system not still be a full turtle match.
first off, the damage taken from blocking need to be increased and there needs to be stamina loss from blocking. why there isint now is beyond me...blocking is an action the same as attacking, it takes energy to stop an attack so why isint that represented? the damage to life and stamina from blocks needs to also be different for heavy and light attacks obviously (which they are already i believe). for example, 5 life / 2 stamina for blocking a light, and 10 life / 5 stamina for blocking a heavy. its not just blocking either...parrying an attack should use a small amount of stamina as well.
every character also needs some form of unblockable, yet parryable attack in order to help break through defensive players and as a high risk - high reward type attack.
all block stances would need to be removed all together.
the downfalls of being out of stamina need to be made harsher as well. once out, you shouldnt be able to parry attacks, dash as far or change guards as quickly. rather than the normal .1 second guard change for most classes (some are .2) it should be slowed down to .2 or .3 seconds to change guard. again, this will bring another downfall to either spamming attacks like a madman or trying to shell up.
players will need to pace themselves and be careful about how much they block, or how wildly they attack. feinting will become even more important with this system and highly reward good mixups that fool your opponent.
this type of gameplay would be centered around the players ability to feint attacks, catch parrys, use smart dodges, and maintain a good mix of offensive and defensive play. if you go overly defensive then you get chipped away til you are out of stamina or life, whichever comes first. if you go overly offensive then you end up getting caught by a parry and punished for being reckless, or run out of stamina and become very vulnerable
this would just really be a start, im sure there would need to be more balancing done if this type of system were to be put in place, but i think it would be a good move toward making the gameplay more enjoyable all around while still rewarding solid and good play.
i am really curious to know what peoples opinions are on this idea, and if you feel that guard break is a system that should either be reworked or removed.
Member
Senior Member
Guard Breaking will never work in this game as a means to break the guard in a good way. If defence was an active thing, so you held a button to defend, it could, but right now you defend at all times in one direction. If they added a block key, so you pressed one direction and the block key or one direction and the attack key - it could work.
Getting around defence should not be a one button move however. It must be more dynamic, using feints, movement etc. That's why GB sucks a bit right now. If GB was just called a grab, and the only thing you could do from there was throw, then it would be fine,
You would then have to use the "art of battle" to actually land a hit, with feints. I want to see focus more on that core system, than a one button mechanic. They need to improve feinting to make it smoother and more free form, to allow better combat using the very core "art of battle".
Junior Member
im glad to see i am not the only one who thinks the guard break mechanic is not just broken but out of place in this game.
i had a idea today while at work, rather than having a guard break replace it with a shove.
the shove mechanic would work similar to say warlords headbutt, wardens shoulder charge, or law bringers...well...shove...lol
the concept here is that the shove would knock the opponent back about 3 feet and stagger their guard, leaving them open to attacks for say, .6 seconds...enough time to get in a light attack or start a combo. now to keep this shove from being abused the stamina cost would need to be around 25%, an additional 15% if the shove is dodged. this brings me to the next point of this mechanic, if your shove is dodged then then your character is staggered for the same penalty time, leaving you open to being counter with a light attack...or the opponent can shove you back, and since your character is now staggered then he will fall to the ground leaving him open for a heavy attack to land. if you shove an opponent that is out of stamina then they automatically fall to the ground and are left open to a heavy, this would be a good way to punish players who do not use their stamina wisely. the counter shove, as i suppose it should be called, wouldnt always be the default go to however, as you will take the same 25% cost to use shove, along with the cost of throwing the heavy, and if you do not have enough stamina to use the shove then obviously it wouldnt work, so a light attack counter would be the only option.
another note about this mechanic, you cannot directly counter a shove with another shove, it must be dodged...you cannot stop that much mass moving with that much force from a stand still, it just doesnt work, so you need to either dash backwards, or to the sides to avoid it. the shove also should either have very low to no tracking, so it is nearly dead straight in its movement.
i think a throw would be a bad idea given all of the easy traps along the maps...knocking someone off should either take moderate skill in terms of getting them into a position to be shoved off, or by players being careless about where they stand and being shoved or hit off with heavy attacks. grabbing and throwing someone just seems like it would be almost as annoying as warlords guard break throw distance, or shugokis golf swing from hell.
Senior Member
I think GB should just be a grab, only allowing a push, except against a full block where it would work as it does now.
Then they balance the "art of battle" to actually allow fighting through feints and rebalanced special moves like the headbutt, shove etc. then the current GB to land an attack isn't needed.
Junior Member
