Junior Member
Hello! Before we begin, I would like to state that I am a Peacekeeper main. I'm currently Rep 16 with Peacekeeper (I have a Rep 1 Warden and level 1-10 other heroes) and will continue playing her even if she gets nerfed to infinity, so long as she has relatively similar speed to what she has now. So yeah, I really love playing as this hero. Peacekeeper's kit, with the deflects, stabs, soft feints, good dodging, speed, squishiness, and, well, everything, just screams "me". A friend even admitted that when they first saw the character, they put a bet that it would be my main.
Also, I apologize in advance for poor formatting.
Anyway, it is clear that Peacekeeper is quite strong if you just pick her up and spam Light Attacks and throw in a couple zones. In fact, it's crazy how inexperienced you can be, but still do well as her. It's silly that her classification is "Counter Attacker" when there's little she's doing that is actually countering. True, every character needs a way to initiate combat since some players like to turtle up; however, Peacekeeper does have ways to open an opponent. (And no, I don't mean that painfully obvious lunge attack. Please stop doing those, PKs, it hardly works and I don't know why you keep trying it.) That aside, I put some thought into, what I feel, would benefit PK as well as address some community concerns with the character.
First and foremost, Light Attacks and what can be done to alleviate the pain.
The issue with the light attacks (because every average Peacekeeper goes for two) is that they're extremely fast... is not what I'm going to say. There are two other traits that can be tweaked in order to make the attacks a bit more on the fair side. To begin, a possible remedy would be to tweak the stamina cost of the first light attack. In effect, this would make spamming less efficient stamina-wise. The increase in cost does not have to be absurdly high, but high enough to where it will be less viable. Another possible solution that may be added in addition to or instead of the previous one is a bleed effect on the second light attack in the chain. Okay, hear me out on this!
The second Light Attack would cause bleed but ONLY if it is a left Light Attack.
This addresses another problem people have with Peacekeeper. She's unpredictable and fast. The bleed effect, in the interest of being fair, would do damage similar to the second or even third stab in her grab. This adds some predictability behind her, if she chooses to try and spam lights. Coupled with the suggested increase in the first Light Attack's stamina cost, Peacekeeper would have to start looking for more options. Ideally, her Light Attacks would be sped down to a small degree. Not a big difference, but enough to where a decent reaction will actually, I don't know, help.
Why the left (PK's left; your right when fighting her) Light Attack? Why not top or right? First, the animation is a stab. So, I mean... It's not like it wouldn't make sense. Second, her fast zone attack comes from her left (your right, if fighting her.) For non-assassins who don't have to worry about Reflex Guard, this is the most beneficial. It deters the notion of simply going through two lights to a Zone Attack, since the defending player already has their guard to where your zone would hit. Even if the PK goes for one Light Attack and a Zone, both of the options available to her (second light attack as well as Zone Attack) can be guarded from the same side. If she performed the second Light Attack, regardless of hit, block, or miss, a player is likely to change their guard to prevent a Zone Attack. As such, the PK will then have to target the top or the other side. Even if the first hit lands, one would be able to predict that her following strike will likely come from the Top or the Right (Her left, the side that also inflicts minor bleed).
In addition, for her Light, Light, Heavy attack chain, Light Attack Spammers, as you might have guessed, don't go for that heavy attack. When I get an opening, I don't typically go for the heavy attack either. I'll feint it. Perhaps that's what it's purpose is, considering it is terribly slow and her kit lets her cancel into a Light or Grab. (Fun Fact: the chained Heavies don't seem to be able to soft feint into GB/Light. Which is probably for the better.) Anyway, another idea I've had, which could coax keepers into continuing the combo is reducing the stamina cost of the Heavy Attack. Granted, it would be required to keep the Attack and Speed as slow as it is. Reducing the cost may cause the Peacekeeper to follow through, or at least feint it. Regardless of feint or not, this also still gives the opposing player (the one fighting the PK) some time to catch their breath as it would be a small pause in the flurry of swings. (Which, mind you, they could also disengage in that time)
Combining all three of the above suggestions may actually be feasible. The first attack has increased stamina cost and the last has reduced, balancing out the cost of the entire chain. The second attack, unlike the first, would be more likely to come from the Peacekeeper's left, adding predictability. The finishing Heavy Attack, if feinted, gives the defending player a small window with which to gather themselves. I've been grabbed while I try my feint sometimes! Coincidentally, the defending player's guard would now be on their right (PK's Left; assuming they defended the stab and did not react to a top/left feint) which would force a PK LA spammer to attack top or left (We all know they don't know how to feint to get an opening) on another start-up Light Attack, causing them to become predictable. The defending player is also likely to return their Guard to their Right, in hopes of blocking the PK Zone anyway. Further, the finishing Heavy Attack (if followed through) would be extremely rewarding if it lands, but the likelihood of that happening is low due to the sluggish nature of it.
As a side note, an increase in cost on the first Light Attack in her chains would also increase the overall cost of Light Attack -> Zone -> Retreat. And speaking of retreats, I've got a small fix for that too!
Let's talk about her dashes now.
I like being able to dodge everything, don't get me wrong. I absolutely love it, but it makes it too easy to simply spam Light Attack/Zone, run out of stamina, and play keep-away. Her side and forward lunges are, truthfully, fair. If she follows up with the attack, it's going to come from the side she dashed. Further, the only follow up that she has is the stab. If she misses the side/lunge attack, she'll be in a rather lengthy recovery. (Also, PKs, please stop using them against somebody who knows the kit. That's how you get yourself killed.) The problem lies in her backwards dash. If she wants to run away from you, I think the best option would be to have her dash backwards and roll. Not just repeated dashes backwards. I've had players catch up to me if I start retreating because I'm low on health or they're in revenge and I'm not taking that fight. However, with the amount of dodging that she can do when she is exhausted and in your face is still incredible.
So, my suggestion is this: reduce to amount of space covered by Peacekeeper's backwards dodge. If she wants to disengage, she is going to need enough stamina to roll away. Alternatively (or additively), reduce the distance that all of her dodges in all directions while exhausted. A common issue is that a Peacekeeper will unload (their attacks) on a player's face, run out of stamina, and run away so that their opponent has an impossible time punishing them.
Side note: Perhaps also tweak all hero exhaustion states so that (a) light attacks do small damage on blocks, (b) you cannot parry, or (c) both. Your dodges will need to be perfect if you want to avoid all damage. This might change the game too drastically, however.
Now that I've covered Light Attacks and Dodges, let's bring up her Zone Attack.
Her zone attack is surprisingly fast. However, since many below-average Peacekeepers are predictable, you can get the sense of when they're going to use it and block or parry accordingly. The speed is definitely an issue, but, aside from a stamina tweak (you can do three with stamina cost reduction, if you're fine with going into exhaustion) or a speed tweak (perhaps as fast as a Warden top-light? The zone indicator bug needs to be fixed for that, though) I have only come up with a few options to balance it.
The first is to make the start-up animation more obvious. The movement of her arms isn't very clear. For example, after some practice, you can Block a Warden/Orochi zone attack by watching the animation. You can block consistently and, if you're god-tier Parry/Deflect it. However, Peacekeeper's animation isn't the most noticeable, meaning you definitely have to rely on the indicator or prediction. Considering the indicator is having issues with zone attacks, prediction seems to be the last resort.
Side note: Some players have suggested that the issue stems from the fact that pressing Light and Heavy produces the zone. Being in a different stance than where your zone comes from, you hit Light Attack first and Heavy closely after and it produces the flicker. I understand why this bug hasn't been fixed, considering it is tricky. Change the timing and players will be doing light attacks instead of zones. Do nothing, and the problem persists. Personally, I would re-map zone attack to LB/L1 on the controller. Quick Chat would go to Select/Home/Whatever-Its-Called-Now. Scoreboard would be bound to holding down B/Circle. As far as I'm aware, holding B/Circle only affects ladder descent speed, which you could probably default to Sprint. Zone Attack having it's own button would definitely be beneficial, I'd say. You will have to alert the community since it would be a large change, in-game would be best. I admit I haven't watched a single dev stream. I MEAN IM GOING TO BUT I JUST DIDNT KNOW ABOUT THEM AT FIRST IM SORRY.
Continuing on her Zone Attack!
Another issue is that she can cancel the zone and immediately act. Is that necessary? Zone Attacks, blocked or not, still stagger the opponent and give you space. In fact, as it stands, you can time her Zone attack to a Guard Break. Though, too soon and it fails and the enemy gets a free one. One would think that, considering the stamina cost, she would be forced to back up or be limited to a few attacks before retreating and one would be correct in that assumption. But when a Peacekeeper goes into Revenge mode, they turn into a blender. Or, more accurately, a child throwing a tantrum, flailing their arms wildly until they get what they want.
My second solution to her Zone Attack is simple. Add a delay for when she cancels. Not just any delay. Cause her second Zone Attack animation to follow through to the point where she has fully rotated and is about to swing, but have that second attack be a proper feint. Alternatively, it could be a soft feint too, similar to Nobushi's Zone Attack's canceled second hit. Do nothing with the damage. Assuming both, mostly the second, solution can be employed, I think the damage may be fine.
Though, to be fair, an increase in the stamina cost would be completely called for. I just don't think that's the right way to go about it.
Reminder: The purpose of Zone Attacks are to hit enemies while you are surrounded, not just to kill minions. It also gives you some much needed space to reformulate your strategy or reflect on your team's performance.
SIDE NOTE: Please stop hitting me with your Zone Attacks, teammates. I'm trying to hold him down so you guys can get some heavy attacks off. Maybe I should make a small guide on Mugging/Ganking/Jumping a lone opponent.
And the last suggested tweak that I have after this super long post
is in relation to her stab. I love the bleed effect, don't get me wrong. However, I do believe that it is too much. I know that it is a punishing tool because, a good amount of the times, I will not be able to get a GB from neutral, but I do believe it's somewhat heavy. Yes, it's over time. Yes, it relies on me being able to stab three times (which is easy after a while). Yes, it can be more enticing to kick them away, with our without stabs. Yes, some characters are born from gods and cannot bleed (I'm okay with that, sincerely. I start stabbing them out of frustration at that point).
But I think-- I'm going to say it-- I think the bleed does too much damage. A small decrease, truthfully, would be feasible. I know what some other PK main might try to bring up (probably not tbh) and that's "Well if it's a punishing tool, it makes sense to do that much damage. You could choose to deal a heavy attack instead."
Let me take this one apart for a moment. If the enemy is near a wall, you can stab them twice, dealing a majority of your bleed, and chain into a lunge + stab or, if you're too close, initiate a light attack combo. You can dish some absolutely disgusting damage. Sure, it's satisfying to see, but it strikes me as odd that I can punish that hard.
"But you said it yourself. PK is a counter-attacker. Her counter-attacks should be strong."
Compared to other Counter-Attackers, I don't think they have as much reward. Their risk is higher, at times, as well. And let's not forget that Peacekeeper also is the only hero with this level of speed in basically everything. Speed and power? It's a little much, in my opinion.
"Well your opinion doesn't matter."
Okay.
All in all, I do believe that the stabbing does need a small reduction. Nothing huge. Yes, the stabs are a punish, but you don't punt a puppy across a football field for having an accident on your shoes.
In conclusion, these are some fixes, I think, that would help balance Peacekeeper. Implementing all of my suggestions (because that's an extreme as I'm sure that might do something... unintended) would further cement her place as a Counter Attacker whilst keeping her main attributes as a fast character with counter-attacking opportunities. Her damage and speed would remain relatively the same while also punishing those who are not capitalizing on openings but simply abusing one or two attacks. I'm not saying that we should "punish players for playing this character wrong." That's not the intention since there is no concrete way to play a character. What I'm saying is that the skill floor desperately needs to be raised.
Thank you for your time, to all those who read all of this. Thank you for your time, to all those who even skimmed over this. My hopes is that the Zone Indicator Bug Thingy would at least be implemented, if nothing else.
Member
Well, after reading this waaay to huge post with waaay to little information inside...
I want to give you a fair chance and still discuss the issue.
What is the reason the PK is categorized as a counter attacker? Her deflect, her dodge attack, but what's more important: The Guard break. As a PK, you will allways get close to your enemy because of your own very short attack range. When you parry an attack, and are as close as you should be, the parry will guarantee a guard break. The most powerfull Guardbreak in the game to be precise.
Now that we have that clarified, let's talk about the PK's problem. the light attack speed. And yes, I do understand how fcking fun those attacks are. when i first started the game, I played the PK till i reached rep level 7. For the same reason you had, everything about her is ellegant, looks cool, and makes the enemy look like a fool. Unlike you however, I was getting bored after i hit rep 7. I was winning every duell and every brawl, i could only be killed in 4v4, and only when i was alone. So i picked up other heroes. And that was when i noticed just how bad it feels to fight against the PK. Fighting as PK can be a ****load of fun, But fighting against her doesn't feel challenging, it feels impossible. That's not fun, it's the opposite - It is frustrating. Now i don't know what plattform you are playing on, but I am playing on console. I didn't have the money for a good Pc. And on console there is a great issue with fast attackspeeds. A problem caused by the framerate. the game is designed with 60 fps in mind, but on console it is locked to 30 fps. Add a little input lag to the guardswitch animation and you'll notice that blocking 15 frame attacks is impossible. I'm not even talking about the second attack here, the second attack is 12 frames fast. No, i'm complaining about her very first attack. because when it hit's you, it guarantees the second hit aswell. The only viable method I've found that helps fighting PK, is being an Assassin. yes, that's how bad it is. on console you can ONLY counter PK as an assassin. or maybe as a shugoki, but even then only if you are veeery good. You won't be able to block her, you will sure as hell not be able to parry her, so you only are left with two options: Option A. Zone flicker.
Option B. Shugo Armor.
With normal heroes you can never get a hit on her unless she's dumb. And you will not be able to prevent being hit either.
Now, what you are suggesting, is to keep her speed as it is and add some way to make her more predictable. But how will that work when the first, the very fcking first attack is allready a problem? And maybe blocking her is possible on PC, but even then it will be hard as fck i imagine. She is to low risk high reward, that's why people complain. Do you remember playing AC3 and AC4? boring as hell right? press x to murder. that's basically what you do as PK. just with a little more button presses.
