The revenge stats need to be removed from gear outright. | Forums

[Mr_Gallows]

If the revenge stats are removed from the game and revenge is removed entirely from duels - then Everything will be fine. Revenge attack and defence should just scale from the basic stats.

I have full revenge gear and exploiting it is just so easy. The mechanic is great but with the gear stats it's completely broken.

[War-Wolf9]

No, we just want to end the match... If it's 4v1 you already lost, why do you want to be able to drag it out? Stop wasting everyone's time.


Like I told the other guy, and I will just copy paste this: It's not ganking, it's a 4v4, not 4 1v1s on the same map, the 1 is supposed to be at a severe disadvantage when outnumbered, that's how multiplayer games have always worked, you rely on your team or you die.

We can tell that the game is meant to be played this way because that is precisely how Ubisoft Intentionally programmed the bots to play it, they gang up on people, as is intended for 4v4.



I'll copy paste this one as well: it's called FOR Honor not WITH Honor, that means Honor is WHY we fight not HOW we fight, learn basic English, OK?

You apparently don't realize that you just gave an example of a situation which removing revenge gear would not change the outcome of in any way... If they are chasing around an ungeared person, that means he has no revenge stats, so the removal of revenge stats wouldn't change his experience. Do you even read this **** back to yourself before you post it? This example has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also, as I have said before, it's a team game, if your enemy is grouped up, YOU need to group up, that's how it works, adapt to their tactics or you deserve to die.

thank you for correcting my grammar although I'm not here to write a book to be published lol I just disagree with you and that's ok not everyone is going to agree with you at times snow flake

[meppho]

Unavoidable death should not be punishment for a single knockdown or parry.

It is not unavoidable if it's a punish. Logic?
There's a clear warning when the guy has revenge stacked. You know he's waiting for your attack. You give it to him, you failed and you get punished.

If i'm in an attack animation they cannot guardbreak me, they try, regularly. The person who doesn't get knocked down is usually in recovery from their attacks and can't GB in time, or was in the middle of a chain that they couldn't cancel in time after the previous hit gave me Revenge and gets knocked down too. The first person who gets knocked down gets it because he was mid swing when the other guy gave me Revenge and it was already too late.

You need to finish the revenge animation before starting the attack. You are vulnerable between them (it's not a large window, but it's not that short either). The person who doesn't get knocked down can't be recovering from their attack or they would be knocked down (same goes for the chain, dunno why you made a difference there). If the revenge procs while you are midswing and you get parried by insta-activation though luck, maybe don't spam randomly going for the lulzgank (it might not be your fault, just the second guy's, but it changes nothing).

This assumes one of the characters involved has such a move, many don't.

If they lack it, they still got guard break.

No it doesn't.

I'm happy we agree on something. Wish you could see how that and your request share the same principle. Too bad.

Many would argue it isn't, this is a separate issue. I'd personally rather the feats weren't a thing either, mostly the catapult, I feel like 100% cheese when I use that thing.

Direct Damage feats are a much greater issue than revenge imho, and should not be in game as they are (arrows to catch runners would be fine, but they would need a minimum range so they don't get spammed in melee. Catapults could only affect minions but they are still a weird thing). Luckily they don't affect the serious gamemodes, like gear, so whatever. Let kids have their call of duty mode.
Also, if you think something's stupid, why do you abuse it? You feel "like 100% cheese" when you use it, so don't. I feel the same and I don't use it.
This combined with revenge makes you sound like a scrub joining those he can't beat while still crying how wrong it is.

Well maybe the revenge stackers you face are just awful?

Maybe. Most of the people I face feel awful ever since I learned how to escape GBs anyway.

[Divenity]

It is not unavoidable if it's a punish. Logic?

The logic is it shouldn't be able to kill you from 100%, 100% to dead is far too much punishment for one mistake.

There's a clear warning when the guy has revenge stacked. You know he's waiting for your attack. You give it to him, you failed and you get punished.

If he gets it stacked while your attack is already flying, there is nothing you can do about it unless it's a heavy that you JUST started.

You need to finish the revenge animation before starting the attack. You are vulnerable between them

Not really, during that revenge animation you are in a state of parry, in which you also ignore being guardbroken, just as you do if you are parrying outside of revenge... If they don't time their GB perfectlly (starting it before the revenge animation ends) they will not be able to GB me before I start attacking, if they hit a little too early, or llate, they will fail the GB and be in recovery more than long enough for me to kill the other guy.

If they lack it, they still got guard break.

See above.

I'm happy we agree on something. Wish you could see how that and your request share the same principle. Too bad.

Except it doesn't.

Direct Damage feats are a much greater issue than revenge imho, and should not be in game as they are (arrows to catch runners would be fine, but they would need a minimum range so they don't get spammed in melee. Catapults could only affect minions but they are still a weird thing). Luckily they don't affect the serious gamemodes, like gear, so whatever. Let kids have their call of duty mode.

Feats are an entirely different problem

Why? Why should 4v4 be relegated to "CoD' mode and the rest of us who want a balanced gaming experience don't get to enjoy anything bigger than 2v2?

Also, if you think something's stupid, why do you abuse it? You feel "like 100% cheese" when you use it, so don't.

I don't, I don't play any of the Knights right now, I don't enjoy their playstyles.
.

This combined with revenge makes you sound like a scrub joining those he can't beat while still crying how wrong it is.

Using something, like revenge builds, because they are the only viable thing to use doesn't change the fact that it needs to be changed, using it doesn't make me a "scrub", not using it would make me an idiot - It is the only viable way to gear right now, I will use it until it gets changed because it's the only way to stay on an even field with others... I'm not going to intentionally put myself at a disadvantage, I'm not an idiot.



Also, it would seem the devs and I agree, revenge stacking is overpowered.

Also, as more people are getting gear and optimising it, we have some stacking of values that were not intended, especially on the Revenge, that now are becoming too powerful. We always wanted the stats to not replace the skill. With Revenge, we're getting to the point where, actually, when I'm an Orochi and I'm blocking two attacks and I'm getting my Revenge full, maybe the stat is a little bit OP. So yes, definitely there is rebalancing we need to do on some stats. We're currently looking at that,

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/20...-big-questions


I would prefer the stats get removed, but I will settle for a rebalance.

[meppho]

The logic is it shouldn't be able to kill you from 100%, 100% to dead is far too much punishment for one mistake.

That's your opinion. I'd say if there's a big sign saying "DO NOT CROSS" and you cross, you deserve whatever comes. Let's say we just disagree on this.

If he gets it stacked while your attack is already flying, there is nothing you can do about it unless it's a heavy that you JUST started.

I already answered to this, but you cut the part. I'll copy paste it, maybe you'll read it this time.
If the revenge procs while you are midswing and you get parried by insta-activation though luck, maybe don't spam randomly going for the lulzgank (it might not be your fault, just the second guy's, but it changes nothing).

Before you try to dodge this too, revenge can't get stacked before a hit, so if you're mid-swing, someone's already hitting the dude.

Not really, during that revenge animation you are in a state of parry, in which you also ignore being guardbroken, just as you do if you are parrying outside of revenge... If they don't time their GB perfectlly (starting it before the revenge animation ends) they will not be able to GB me before I start attacking, if they hit a little too early, or llate, they will fail the GB and be in recovery more than long enough for me to kill the other guy.

Not sure about the first sentence, I specifically said "between the two", two being "parry animation" and "attack animation".
The rest... If they don't time it right they will not be able to GB. Well though **** you need to do things right to avoid failing. That's an enlightening point, thank you very much.

Except it doesn't.

"No u."
Make an effort if you want to reply, this is a twelve year old response.

Feats are an entirely different problem

Yes.

Why? Why should 4v4 be relegated to "CoD' mode and the rest of us who want a balanced gaming experience don't get to enjoy anything bigger than 2v2?

Because marketing.
I despise it as well, so I play 2v2 and 1v1, except when with friends or for Orders.
Or I could just become a CoD kiddy and yet whine about it, like you seem to be doing. But no thanks.

I don't, I don't play any of the Knights right now, I don't enjoy their playstyles.

So lemme guess, you throw arrows instead? My point isn't about the specific skill. My point is: if you despise a behaviour, act differently.

Using something, like revenge builds, because they are the only viable thing to use doesn't change the fact that it needs to be changed, using it doesn't make me a "scrub", not using it would make me an idiot - It is the only viable way to gear right now, I will use it until it gets changed because it's the only way to stay on an even field with others... I'm not going to intentionally put myself at a disadvantage, I'm not an idiot.

Saying something's wrong and doing it anyway is idiotic to me.
Going for the overpowered build to get an advantage in a non-competitive game/gamemode (no ranked yet), especially if you don't find it fun or "just", is idiotic to me.
You are fundamentally making excuses. Which is... Idiotic, since nobody really cares about your performances. I wouldn't think so, at least, though I can only speak for myself. Objectively, it's not relevant for balancing issues for sure.

Also, it would seem the devs and I agree, revenge stacking is overpowered.

Ironically, what you quoted only refers to revenge gain, which has been my point as well.
There's no mention of damage. Do you even read? I'm starting to doubt it after this reply.

[Divenity]

Before you try to dodge this too, revenge can't get stacked before a hit, so if you're mid-swing, someone's already hitting the dude

except if you've been in a 1v1 for a while with a skilled opponent, and it's slow going, and while you have him in a GB, with a heavy too far cast to cancel and your ******* teammate comes flying in from out of your field of view with a sprint attack and gives him revenge before your hit lands.

It's not always about "spamming for the lulz", I've had this kind of **** happen far more often than I would like, at least a few times a day.

Not sure about the first sentence, I specifically said "between the two", two being "parry animation" and "attack animation".
The rest... If they don't time it right they will not be able to GB. Well though **** you need to do things right to avoid failing. That's an enlightening point, thank you very much.

The downtime is absurdly short, the window is FAR too small to rely upon as a tactic, I have yet to have anyone do this right to me, not for lack of trying.

"No u."
Make an effort if you want to reply, this is a twelve year old response.

You put no more into yours than I did into mine.

So lemme guess, you throw arrows instead? My point isn't about the specific skill. My point is: if you despise a behaviour, act differently.


Saying something's wrong and doing it anyway is idiotic to me.

When did I ever say I despised the behavior? I despise the design, I don't blame people for using what the devs gave them.

Going for the overpowered build to get an advantage

Not doing it to get an advantage, doing it to not be at a disadvantage, those are two very different things.

You are fundamentally making excuses. Which is... Idiotic, since nobody really cares about your performances. I wouldn't think so, at least, though I can only speak for myself. Objectively, it's not relevant for balancing issues for sure.

No, I'm really not, if this were just me blabbering on making excuses, the devs wouldn't share a similar opinion.

Ironically, what you quoted only refers to revenge gain, which has been my point as well.
There's no mention of damage. Do you even read? I'm starting to doubt it after this reply.

"stacking of values that were not intended"

The word stacking wouldn't be used if he was talking about a lone stat, one stat from a single piece of gear doesn't stack, multiple stats from multiple pieces of gear stack... That is of course unless he doesn't understand how that word works.

[redrixx]

Revenge stat should be only activated when you go on battles against the odds and thats only one reason which it should exists in the game .But while we are discussing it i have seen the guy who were dueling against me and poped up revenge TWICE .So imagine infinite stamina and doubled health bar.Yea Great.... Next thing about this game is completly imbalanced .You got a people with ridiculusly high level and MAXED GEAR against noobs like me now question is why matchmaking is so screwed up.Or yah lets play this game and you got 3 including one bot vs 4 players with again high end gear and level .HOW FRUSTATING IT IS .IM gonna say no.

[dquinnell]

I was on a team of four and got riped a part by one player all ways in revenge he killed all four of us one after the other ****ing ******** game sort this **** out or bye bye for honor

[meppho]

except if you've been in a 1v1 for a while with a skilled opponent, and it's slow going, and while you have him in a GB, with a heavy too far cast to cancel and your ******* teammate comes flying in from out of your field of view with a sprint attack and gives him revenge before your hit lands.

It's not always about "spamming for the lulz", I've had this kind of **** happen far more often than I would like, at least a few times a day.

So is that because the second guy hitting it. Why do you repeat what I just wrote implying a different result?

The downtime is absurdly short, the window is FAR too small to rely upon as a tactic, I have yet to have anyone do this right to me, not for lack of trying.

Maybe you just found awful opponents? I do it all the time, and have it done to me on few occasions.
That the windows might be too short is subjective. But the window is there, this is objective.

You put no more into yours than I did into mine.

Because I expressed my opinion. If you want to deny it, you need to explain why. If you don't then just don't bother replying to it at all, simple enough.
You disagree, bring forth points and we discuss those points to (hopefully) reach a consensus. That's how discussions work.

When did I ever say I despised the behavior? I despise the design, I don't blame people for using what the devs gave them.

What's the difference except semantics? You despise the design yet embrace and exploit it fully.

Not doing it to get an advantage, doing it to not be at a disadvantage, those are two very different things.

Ahaha, how are they different? Let's hear it!

No, I'm really not, if this were just me blabbering on making excuses, the devs wouldn't share a similar opinion.

"With Revenge, we're getting to the point where, actually, when I'm an Orochi and I'm blocking two attacks and I'm getting my Revenge full, maybe the stat is a little bit OP."
I read no mention of damage. I read about an issue with frequency.
You lack reading comprehension on a huge scale, apparently. Or just try too hard to make things what you want. Either way, lulz.

"stacking of values that were not intended"

The word stacking wouldn't be used if he was talking about a lone stat, one stat from a single piece of gear doesn't stack, multiple stats from multiple pieces of gear stack... That is of course unless he doesn't understand how that word works.

That sentence is clearly generic about all stats, not just Revenge, or he wouldn't have specified "especially on the revenge".
What we can objectively take from that excerpt is that they deem Revenge coming out too often (which I've been saying myselft too since the beginning, and is pretty obvious), nothing else, regardless of your speculation.


[edit]
Oh, btw, I had a long duel session this night/morning (2 to 5 am roughly) with a nobuchi, and revenge still procced for me twice or thrice and once for him, despite gear being off.
This means something's already "wrong" with the base values.
Just a piece of info.

[Divenity]

So is that because the second guy hitting it. Why do you repeat what I just wrote implying a different result?

Because you said that "not spamming for the lulzgank" would prevent it, which is clearly not true.

Because I expressed my opinion. If you want to deny it, you need to explain why. If you don't then just don't bother replying to it at all, simple enough.
You disagree, bring forth points and we discuss those points to (hopefully) reach a consensus. That's how discussions work.

You did the exact same thing, you just disagreed without bringing forth a point, hypocrite.

What's the difference except semantics? You despise the design yet embrace and exploit it fully.

It's the only viable way to gear, I'm not putting myself at a disadvantage for no reason - This is the way the game is currently designed, I will play it optimally until it is changed.

Ahaha, how are they different? Let's hear it!

An advantage puts you above other players, not being at a disadvantage means being on the same level, do you not own a dictionary?

"With Revenge, we're getting to the point where, actually, when I'm an Orochi and I'm blocking two attacks and I'm getting my Revenge full, maybe the stat is a little bit OP."
I read no mention of damage. I read about an issue with frequency.
You lack reading comprehension on a huge scale, apparently. Or just try too hard to make things what you want. Either way, lulz.

That sentence is clearly generic about all stats, not just Revenge, or he wouldn't have specified "especially on the revenge".
What we can objectively take from that excerpt is that they deem Revenge coming out too often (which I've been saying myselft too since the beginning, and is pretty obvious), nothing else, regardless of your speculation.

Yes, he said "stacking of values that were not intended, especially on the Revenge", which means stacking revenge stats, how are you not getting this? They knew how much revenge gain by defense they were putting on one item, how could they have not known that? They didn't expect people to stack revenge stats from multiple items.

Oh, btw, I had a long duel session this night/morning (2 to 5 am roughly) with a nobuchi, and revenge still procced for me twice or thrice and once for him, despite gear being off.
This means something's already "wrong" with the base values.
Just a piece of info.

Maybe, but if that person had 108 gear stacking revenge would have gotten it what, nearly every fight instead of what I can only assume is maybe 5-10% of them? And then done triple damage during all of them instead of double while also being more durable than normal revenge? #totallybalanced.