WTF Wardens | Forums

[MiyamotoMikku]

Hi guys I know discussions have already occurred about this hero, but I still wanted to put my 2 cents in.

As far as I understand it, the warden has 2 of the fastest attacks in the game, which for reflex blockers like PK, Orochi and Zerker, these matchups are clearly unfavourable. But thats part of the game right, at high levels it becomes more about the matchups and the advantages and disadvantages of the different styles.

However, the Warden is also the ONLY character I know of that has this 50/50 thing people are calling it, where he can faint any shoulder bump into a Guardbreak, and loop this move every 2-3 strikes. Personally I'm not overly against 50/50 moves but if there's only 1 character that has it then that's a big deal.

I mainly do 1v1 duels, and the amount of stress, and focus required to fight a Warden compared to any other class is off the charts. I mainly use the assassin classes so I'm pretty biased. But I honestly don't understand how a Vanguard class has faster attacks than any of the assassin classes, let alone the 50/50 mixup game. I like to think my reaction timing is pretty damn above average but standard blocking reactions or dodge deflections just aren't happening against this hero.

I really hope something is done to help balance this hero, though it pains me that I don't have any easy answers. At the very minimalist slowing down the frames of either the zone, side light or super awesome speed overhead deflect light. I personally feel if he loses his 50/50 ability he might fall off the balance almost entirely so whatever they come up with I hope they don't over do it. Cheers

MH

[MrForz]

You're an assassin. By doing the dodge+attack move before the shoulder bash you stop both aspects of his combo flat because the guardbreak won't work against someone who's already attacking.

[MiyamotoMikku]

MrForz, Thank you for taking the time to reply. I'm already well aware of Orochis ability to negate the 50/50 attack patterns of the warden, though other classes aren't so lucky. My main complaint/concern is more directed at Wardens overall abilities as a "Vanguard" Class. He has the health of a Vanguard balance type. His Zone attack is the fastest in the game. His overhead superior light, while can be worked around, is still on par in terms of speed to the zone. He has the double tap from side-light attacks (similar to Orochi's overhead double-tap lights). He has his 50/50 mixup that he can repeat multiple times over, and doesn't seem to have to sacrifice anything for having all that. He has no real weakness or flaws to make up for his incredible kit and potential. As much as I'm biased due to my assassin class preference, many other classes I don't believe can achieve the same level of performance.

Kharneth88, I also appreciate you responding to my venting post. I miss-spoke when i referred to his side-light attack being fast. What I meant to say was his Zone attack. Although costing alot of stamina like all other zones, for a balance style class having the fastest zone attack in the game is a little much. When it comes to the reaction time of being able to avoid these 2 moves, the focus and response time needed is higher than any other opponent you'll ever face. PK isn't even fast by comparison. Granted on any other class they can leave their block on one of the 2 directions and work from there, and this is a disadvantage for reflex-block based heroes. But what exactly does the Warden expose exactly when having all this incredible potential? In regards to your tips for not attacking with overheads, it kind of goes without saying...but thank you. Additionally, I'm well aware of how effective side-dash attacks can be vs the warden but like any other class, when used to often you become easily predictable and you can't cancel a side-dash attack. At higher levels of dueling this is problematic. I've vsed alot of mirror matchups of Orochi vs Orochi and my word do they love the side-dash so much regardless of how many times I parry it.

In any case, I appreciate the time you've both taken to try and help. However my opinion on the Warden class still stands. I feel, more than strongly, that he gets too many options that require insane levels of reaction timing to deal with, along with luck of the draw guessing every 2-3 moves the hero makes. I don't dread going up against any other class. I've found what opens up other heroes, exposes them, and what makes them balanced, relatively. I just don't see the balance in Warden. Cheers.

MH

[Waynedetta40k]

Zone attack has a high risk
If you block it you get a guranteed guardbreak and it costs half his stamina in addition the dmg is only moderate.

[PantocratorFR]

Hi guys I know discussions have already occurred about this hero, but I still wanted to put my 2 cents in.

As far as I understand it, the warden has 2 of the fastest attacks in the game,

Seems you didnt understand it far enough.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gm5L19vZiEg

For the rest and like you said, there is already a ton of topics already opened about this.
But apparently it is important for every one to have his own personnal corner to cry

[Salt_Fist]

I can feel your sodium levels Rising but in all actuality you do need to play the match up a little better spacing is very important against a warden. knowing and reading their attacks very important, when you get an offense going the warden cant really get started.

Hit that man in the face

[Felheric]

Hi guys I know discussions have already occurred about this hero, but I still wanted to put my 2 cents in.

As far as I understand it, the warden has 2 of the fastest attacks in the game, which for reflex blockers like PK, Orochi and Zerker, these matchups are clearly unfavourable. But thats part of the game right, at high levels it becomes more about the matchups and the advantages and disadvantages of the different styles.

However, the Warden is also the ONLY character I know of that has this 50/50 thing people are calling it, where he can faint any shoulder bump into a Guardbreak, and loop this move every 2-3 strikes. Personally I'm not overly against 50/50 moves but if there's only 1 character that has it then that's a big deal.

I mainly do 1v1 duels, and the amount of stress, and focus required to fight a Warden compared to any other class is off the charts. I mainly use the assassin classes so I'm pretty biased. But I honestly don't understand how a Vanguard class has faster attacks than any of the assassin classes, let alone the 50/50 mixup game. I like to think my reaction timing is pretty damn above average but standard blocking reactions or dodge deflections just aren't happening against this hero.

I really hope something is done to help balance this hero, though it pains me that I don't have any easy answers. At the very minimalist slowing down the frames of either the zone, side light or super awesome speed overhead deflect light. I personally feel if he loses his 50/50 ability he might fall off the balance almost entirely so whatever they come up with I hope they don't over do it. Cheers

MH

First of all warden cant do endless vortex like people say, only one charge is real, second one you can hit him out of it with any fast light atack. try it yourself against friend or someone.
Warden overhead is fast, but with kinda big recovery on whiff /try to feint heavy top if you see tryhard parring with his light, its guarantee side dash attack on any assasins..
his side light atacks are complete joke - slow, no wide spread - no tracking.
Warden zone atack always come from left of your side and its unsafe on block no need to parry and you have guarantee grab, on whiff recovery its even bigger. If you play against warden and you out of his range of owerhead atack you just block left and he cant throw it out without getting punished.
When you up close it guessing but as ppl allready mention there are faster zone atacks which are safe on block.
He needs it because otherwise he would get completely bullied by any assasin with their dashes and hit run tactic.

[Itsaku]

Yeah, Warden is the best class in the game atm. Not that I think he's too strong (or he wouldn't be if GB wasn't broken af), I think everyone else should be buffed to his level.


Also, you said you use mainly assassin classes. Assassins are bad. PK is MAYBE middle tier, Orochi is bad, and Berserker is trash. They're only GOOD against noobs.

[DeathZoldat]

Hahaha go home. Best class in the game, yea right. You little sh!t peacekeepers can just spam light attack and walk through a warden. But id still say that both the warden and peacekeeper are good where they are, the Valkyrie buff on the other hand has me a little worried as a warden though.....

[ZEONesp]

PK can keep dodging and spam light hits because warden is to slow to counter attack after a block, oh sure, you can alway parry a ultra fast switching side light attack but doesnt happen often and more considering the crappy **** p2p system.

Then, what can a Warden do agains a good PK? guardbreak is countered by a fast light or dodge light, shoulder bash is countered by exacly the same way, light attacks starts too slow so, even when pj or orochi starts later, they hit u firts.

If you want to break the warden, give him something different to be waiting for a lucky parry, gb, light etc etc combo.

I think that blocking a hit should open a windows to fast attack assasins instead of being spammed by light attacks.