Lawbringer needs a total rework | Forums

[ShrimplyPibles]

Don't take it this way, the Lawbringer is truly strong but well, you need inhuman reflexes and being able to parry light attacks. It's easy to parry heavy attacks, our guard change is fast enough, but for light attacks ... That's exactly what I'm saying, we need a faster guard change speed, it's way too slow for light attacks. And kinda stupid too that a parry focused class can't change guard fast enough ...

You need to read what people write, you're being agressive for something that I said lmao, the only buff we need is faster guard change.

How is that even a thing btw ? Why some classes should be slower than others at changing guard ?

I don't know, but it wasn't you that ticked me off here, it's the guy who's saying that he is right where he needs to be we just aren't good enough to use him. "lol Git gud huh huh" I understand how he works, I am good at this game. I agree with the guard change speed, it's crippling him right now, an assassin can just chain lights after a fein and you can change guard fast enough to stop them from connecting. I think his heavy's and counters need to come out faster as well, other than that he can be used, but against someone good, you are gonna get stomped.

[TheCadian_]

I'm going to be that guy (who mains the Lawbringer) and suggests that he absolutely does not need a complete rebalance in the slightest, but rather a few small tweaks to improve quality of life and make him more competitive.

Only gripe I have is that perception that his stance change speed is too slow... because Peacekeeper light attack spam always seems to throw me for a loop.

[jhaas909]

I agree with the guy above me, the Law doesnt need a total rework. just some quick tweaks here and there. For example, i believe these three changes could completely change the game for him:

1) faster guard change
2) make light attacks moderately faster, and heavy attacks slightly faster
3) make the joust unblockable, a la the raider

adjust stamina as necessary after some testing and bam, hero with a viable toolkit. right now, to be successful with a lawbringer one must have perfect fundamentals. not saying thats bad, but most LB mains can easily switch characters and perform nearly identical fighting styles. that does not an interesting hero make. i feel these changes would allow the LB to make the most out of his "counter-attacker" moniker. deadly and dangerous in the right hands, but not insurmountable.

for those wondering, the reason i suggest making the joust unblockable is to give the LB a decent mixup for parrys. and given the stamina cost, there should be some kind of payoff.

[HighGround_S3G]

Embarrassing to say the least, that after all the hype for this character and all the tech tests Ubisoft did, this guy is so laughingly useless against anyone who can play the game. If you connect a combo, that player is trash, easily parried, effortlessly so. His counter attacks, one of his supposed "strengths" are the worst in the game, you can get a light, for next to no damage, or go for a heavy to give away a free parry to your opponent. The block into push to drain stamina is all you can do with him now to try and win a fight against a non garbage player. And even then they will stop attacking you. The only way to get any damage is parry, into guardbreak, and every character can do that, and seeing as he changes stances so slow, he is even worse at that than anybody else, but maybe shugoki, who's strengths make up for it. Everything he can do, just about anyone else can do better, with less effort. A buff, isn't enough to make this character good, his kit needs to be completely reworked, right down to his stance, his combos, his counters, everything he can do. Laugahably bad, totally dropped the ball on this character. I'm a dedicated main of this hero, because I love the way he is supposed to work, but right now he is a noob stomper character, and plenty of other hero's can do that better than he can too.

You obviously have never 1v1 against a good lawbringer. Lawbringers are one of the most over powered classes in the game currently. They can deplete your stamina and throw you around like a rag doll and block/parry like a mad fiend.

[Shinimas]

You obviously have never 1v1 against a good lawbringer. Lawbringers are one of the most over powered classes in the game currently. They can deplete your stamina and throw you around like a rag doll and block/parry like a mad fiend.

Just don't dash after he shoves. Wait for a GB, tech it, then dash back. LB's blocks are the slowest in the game and his parries into top heavies only deal 5 more damage than Warden's. He is not very good and certainly not overpowered. 4v4 is a different story, however.

[TheCadian_]

You obviously have never 1v1 against a good lawbringer. Lawbringers are one of the most over powered classes in the game currently. They can deplete your stamina and throw you around like a rag doll and block/parry like a mad fiend.

That is indicative of the quality of the player rather than the class being in a good place. Then again the class isn't exactly in a terrible place.

[Exo_Electron]

I agree with the guy above me, the Law doesnt need a total rework. just some quick tweaks here and there. For example, i believe these three changes could completely change the game for him:

1) faster guard change
2) make light attacks moderately faster, and heavy attacks slightly faster
3) make the joust unblockable, a la the raider

adjust stamina as necessary after some testing and bam, hero with a viable toolkit. right now, to be successful with a lawbringer one must have perfect fundamentals. not saying thats bad, but most LB mains can easily switch characters and perform nearly identical fighting styles. that does not an interesting hero make. i feel these changes would allow the LB to make the most out of his "counter-attacker" moniker. deadly and dangerous in the right hands, but not insurmountable.

for those wondering, the reason i suggest making the joust unblockable is to give the LB a decent mixup for parrys. and given the stamina cost, there should be some kind of payoff.

My issue with lawbringer is mainly the guard change. A counter-attacker should have a fast guard stance but slower attack speed. I think that maybe the stun time should be increased over the the normal attack speed though. However attack speeds in a chain should increase. This would make counter-attacking effective by allowing a slightly higher change of starting and completing a chain that follows but normal attacking still bad (that chain attacks can still be blocked but would need a faster reaction to do so increasing how often you can pull them off).

with point 3 i disagree in its current state since it has a godly range, use it to catch up with people and guard break them, dont use it when they are looking at you. (its range is worth the stamina in my opinion.

[Aarpian]

I'd like to see the current defence system looked at first, but in lieu of that, I don't think he needs to be reworked, just tweaked.

-Light confirms off of shove
-Heavy confirms off of Long Arm
-More damage on lights and heavies
-Stamina improvements

[VMPL1]

Just don't dash after he shoves. Wait for a GB, tech it, then dash back. LB's blocks are the slowest in the game and his parries into top heavies only deal 5 more damage than Warden's. He is not very good and certainly not overpowered. 4v4 is a different story, however.

Warden's is more situational though, if you don't attack from the top, you should be fight against him. LB on the other hand can get Blind Justice out of all sides, characters that tend to use light attacks (Orochi, Berserker, PK, Nobushi) are exposed to great risk with every strike. I believe that's why they nerfed his block speed to the ground, if not then those guys wouldn't even be able to attack him. I don't see how we can increase the speed without making him OP.

My issue with lawbringer is mainly the guard change. A counter-attacker should have a fast guard stance but slower attack speed. I think that maybe the stun time should be increased over the the normal attack speed though. However attack speeds in a chain should increase. This would make counter-attacking effective by allowing a slightly higher change of starting and completing a chain that follows but normal attacking still bad (that chain attacks can still be blocked but would need a faster reaction to do so increasing how often you can pull them off).

with point 3 i disagree in its current state since it has a godly range, use it to catch up with people and guard break them, dont use it when they are looking at you. (its range is worth the stamina in my opinion.

Yes, his chains should be fast enough that ppl cannot interrupt it. As of right now, you don't even need to block or parry, just light attack and you can stop his chain, even the unblockable one. Those chains should be at least safe to pull off, the unblockable should be uninterruptable but not guaranteed. Therefore, if opponents commit too much, he'll pay for it.

[Abloec]

Warden's is more situational though, if you don't attack from the top, you should be fight against him. LB on the other hand can get Blind Justice out of all sides, characters that tend to use light attacks (Orochi, Berserker, PK, Nobushi) are exposed to great risk with every strike. I believe that's why they nerfed his block speed to the ground, if not then those guys wouldn't even be able to attack him. I don't see how we can increase the speed without making him OP.

So what you are saying is that, because the fast classes would have a harder time dealing with him, his block change should be slower than the fast attackers. Do you realize you are basically saying a character should be gimped so the fast attackers don't have to try as hard? Lawbringers literally have to hope that the way you changed your block to lands on where they attack next, if you chase a PK whos spamming light attacks you will get wrecked.

Also its not like every single person can actually parry light attacks, some attacks are insanely fast and only people who have insane reaction speed would be able to parry them.