Count Guard Break | Forums

[Biocoast]

It works a ltiile different now. You should press key not when he started but when he touch you. It's more logical anyway and generally you have more time for this. Tutorial is now obsolete because it teach that you should do that in old style - when red shield icon is visible but now this icon is like alert that you should prepare for counter attack. So you should do this after ~0,5 second after that.

The problem with that, the counter-guradbreak is super unreliable and since guardbreak in itself is so super powerful combined with other things like the environment, it needs to be they way it was, easy to counter. Otherwise you reward people for abusing a easy mechanic that is hard to counter far to heavily.

[WingedHussar_PL]

The problem with that, the counter-guradbreak is super unreliable and since guardbreak in itself is so super powerful combined with other things like the environment, it needs to be they way it was, easy to counter. Otherwise you reward people for abusing a easy mechanic that is hard to counter far to heavily.

I though the same but when I teach how it works now ( different than in beta ) most of them I can counter now. But still the best way is to keep distance

[Biocoast]

I though the same but when I teach how it works now ( different than in beta ) most of them I can counter now. But still the best way is to keep distance

I could maybe live with the changes if they werent so damn random and actually had a real indicator like attacks show the red arrow, and the red arrow blinks when you can reliably parry/deflect. Guardbreak just doesnt have that. It seems sometimes you have to wait for the connect of the guardbreak and othertimes you have to do it just before that. The window to execute that counter is simply to small and like i mentioned seems to shift, depending on the ping/lag of the game making it nearly impossible often to work with.

[Knight_Raime]

Ah yes. the "if you disagree with me you're wrong" argument whilst not posting any evidence of your own. Bravo.
I've been watching people stream since launch and plenty of people are still able to tech a GB when they want to.
Funny thing is you say spamming it is the only way to tech it...when I heard the same thing in the betas.

I honestly don't care how it used to be or how it is currently. I care about what it looks like when people are actually good at this game. and right now GB's are too easy to tech. so if they indeed tightened the window on when you have to try and tech that makes me happy. defensive play in this game is far too rewarding anyway imo.

[Dez_troi_aR]

I was very frustrated by guardbreaking in the beta, too but i can do it quite well now.

It is not supposed to be reacted to but predicted+reacted. YOu have to exclude its use by spacing and light attacks. Guard breaks beeing there keep the game from becoming too defensive. If they could be blocked easily, they would loose their value and fights would become much more slow paced.


So i disagree. They are fine now

[Biocoast]

I was very frustrated by guardbreaking in the beta, too but i can do it quite well now.

It is not supposed to be reacted to but predicted+reacted. YOu have to exclude its use by spacing and light attacks. Guard breaks beeing there keep the game from becoming too defensive. If they could be blocked easily, they would loose their value and fights would become much more slow paced.


So i disagree. They are fine now

I agree with you that the gaurdbreak is there to keep people from turtling and the game from becoming to defensive... the issue i just see is that GB is to unreliable, the timeframe needs to be adjusted some atleast. GB is simply to strong for how easy it is, while the counter needs perfection and if you miss it you can instantly die? I dunno, i don't call that balancing.

[Colt-556]

Guardbreak is going to be the thing that makes me quit the game. It's just too damned good for what it is. It SHOULD be a way of getting through turtling players, but now it's the go-to way of beating people. I've had fights that were nothing but attacks and guard-breaks, because for a lot of heroes a successful guard-break is a guaranteed hit, and for some of those heroes that's a LOT of free damage.

Guardbreak needs to be nerfed, hard. It should be one of many-skills, not the be-all end-all of PVP.

[Fardriven]

The mandatory post for counter guard breaking.
For old players the window remains the same it has just been moved around 0,5 seconds later.
For new players or people struggling. Go into advanced practice and get 100% counter there. Then jump into a match and find the perfect timing there too(It changes a little because of connectivity)
Also If you are certain someone is going to guard break you, you can attack him to stop it. While you are attacking he can't guard break you so I recommend heavy attack while you are at it.
Don't try to dodge out of a guard break! The enemy will just follow you. The game is half reflexes and half premonition always keep that in mind. If you are not mentally prepared for a guard break you are going to get grabbed. If there are environment kills on the map and you are struggling with countering, move away for them and choose the place you are going to fight.
Now about the 2 people guard breaking thingy that happens. I hadn't noticed it in previous version of the game so I assume it was added or rather tweaked. From my personal experience the second person who pressed guard break but isn't grabbed(there is like half a second in the beginning when you are not grabbed) will grab the other one. Meaning if you want to counter and press it too soon you are getting grabbed anyways. In previous installations you would just grab the enemy. Granted the time windows is so small that you can't really time it so most of the times it is and looks random rather than a skill based system. Still I think it is there to accommodate the new 0.5 delay on countering.

Personally I don't believe countering should be any easier. The attacker must put pressure on the defender. He can do that through attacks, feints, specials and guard breaking and all of them must be a force to be reckoned with. The defender can parry, feint, (usually dodge but it depends on situation) and counter guard break respectively. If you remove one of them you lighten pressure and make it easier for the defender to deal with the rest. If you make no mistakes the enemy can't deal damage to you so it must be made so you make mistakes due to pressure, The alternative would be to have 100% methods to deal damage on the attackers part but that would be less fun for everyone.

[Devil_Sparda]

from my expirience, hope to not have more than 20 ms of pings.. and a good host, or you are done.. a little bit of latency is enough to deny the chance to counter BG
on top of that, when i trying to fish BG ( luring your opponent in some ways to push him try a BG), i m always screwed.. no matter what.. spamming the key or press it at the right moment
feelsbadman

[Biocoast]

After tinkering and trying the counter to guardbreak a bit more, the window to hit the counter is so ridiculousy small now that it's almost impossible to counter that GB in the midst of battle, sure people with super good reflexes and all will probably counter one or the other, but it seems that in order to GB you have to wait approx as long as a light attack to counter it, with guradbreak not being as obvious as any swing will come out of nowhere unless being in a really predictable place that even when you see the GB icon pop up, like i mentioned before, so hard to hit that sweet moment because you dont have the indication when the counter could be possible.

Besides the moment when 2 people hit GB at the same time, the person hitting it likely first (or with the better connection?) wins is IMO not necessarily a good mechanic, since this doesn't really rely on skill anylonger.

Despite these changes i think the new mechanic could maybe work if the time frame would be adjusted a bit and indicated like any other attack in order to have a chance to counter it. With the quick reflexes it requires right now to hit the perfect timing, that can only be guessed, to counter a "light attack" fast mechanic which can ultimatively instant kill you, it is far to hard to manage and is beyond a get good issue and needs some serious love. And let's not forget this still runs online, with a P2P setup (even with dedicated servers) and there will always be ping/lag that will shift that sliver of timeframe to counter around a bit.

I am all up for it to invest my time and learn mechanics and addapt to them, but in this case it's just a thing that has to many flaws to work and causes to many unnecesary frustrating moments.