Gamebreaking mechanics at high-level-play: Defensive Invulnerability | Forums

[TouchFluffyTail]

People are missing assassin and warlord have parry/deflections moves, nerf base parry and everyone will just play assassin and warlord

[Pariah695]

People are missing assassin and warlord have parry/deflections moves, nerf base parry and everyone will just play assassin and warlord

Is the timing on deflect as generous as parry that you can do it as easily? I never played any assassins in the betas.

[Icepick_Trotsky]

In a real fight you are compelled to be offensive? There are plenty of real fights where being offensive did nothing but get that person destroyed by a counter attack.

How is that a counter-argument to what I said? Counter atack is still an atack. Defense on it's own doesn't get you anywhere

In reality it's not about who is offensive first it's about who makes the first mistake.

Yes - mistake in a defense. Mistake you will eventually make, because it's not within human capabilities to reliably defend every single atack for long. And as I said, defense doesn't get you anywhere. In every martial art a proper defense leads to counter atack - which then can be countered by opponent. So it goes like this back and forth.
So you can see how different it is in this game? here a defense mechanic and counter-atack are ONE thing.

[TouchFluffyTail]

Is the timing on deflect as generous as parry that you can do it as easily? I never played any assassins in the betas.

its the "parry" for assassin just change heavy for a dodge and have the same timing just its tied to a moveset unlike parry (unless you are warlord then parry its a moveset)

so we need careful how parry/deflection should be nerfed.

[Pariah695]

its the "parry" for assassin just change heavy for a dodge and have the same timing just its tied to a moveset unlike parry (unless you are warlord then parry its a moveset)

so we need careful how parry/deflection should be nerfed.

Well, considering it's on dodge that seems like less of a problem because you actually have to commit to it. Wouldn't that mean you can feint someone into dodging and GB them? Never fought an assassin that was any good so I never got to see.

Edit: Wait never mind I'm stupid. If they do a dodge attack they can't be GBd. Meaning the thing to do then is feint and parry. Then it just turns into R,P,S again. Yeah, that's no good.

[Knight_Raime]

it's good to see this catching on in 2 seperate threads. Hopefully that means the devs will do something. Here is my response from the other thread:

"I'm deff not amazing at this game. and i'm not really versed in top tier fighting games in general. so bare with me. But I initially came across this by viewing parries as being too strong because it guarentes you a GB which just gives free damage. Anyway these would be my suggestions. someone who's super good at this game or fighting games can tell me how good/bad these suggestions might be:

~Make it so you can stop a throw by pressing the GB button if they attempt to throw you.

~Let GB's be stopped by fast attacks.

~let back dashes be immune to GB.

~or alternatively don't let the GB's be stopped by fast attacks. But they would be slower.

~fix what happens when both hit eachother with GB. it should bounce people off eachother instead of randomly giving one side the GB.

Those changes should allow GB to be counterable. and should deter from being able to do what people do now which is just react tech.

~feints happen faster.

~feints can be done on more things besides heavies for all heros.

~prevent the use of being able to feint immediately on a whiffed parry attempt. (not sure how to make this happen in game mechanically.)

~Feints cost less stamina.

This makes feinting less predictable, adds some commitment to parrying, and makes it a more available option. At best right now you can feint maybe 2-3 times. too little.

~Parrying someone has less stagger frames in general.

~the amount of stagger frames is dependent on the type of attack you parried. (ex a parrying a light would result in fewer stagger frames and parrying heavies/certain special attacks would grant more stagger frames.) Obviously this would have to be tweaked really precisely. But I think only a few attacks should be able to be parried and give the current amount of stagger frames. maybe parrying zone attacks or attacks that followed a feint.

~Parrying takes up slightly more stamina for the person parrying and the person being parried.

This should tone back how powerful/easy parrying can be. while still making it worth while. and also add a decision process instead of if can parry=parry like it is now.

here are some general things that I think might help the game combat.

~increase the speed of nearly all attacks in the game.

~tighten the window for GB's, parries, and deflects by some.

~repeated attacks of the same direction* should result in doing less damage or more stamina usage.

~Give everyone some kind of quick 1 hit basic attack that can't be seen via the indicator. can only be seen through the stance of the character. Move should be different for each warrior. it shouldn't be parryable or deflectable. But it would be slow enough to be able to reasonably react block to IF you recognize the stance of the character.

I think that is all of my ideas. Thanks in advance for anyone who gives feedback.

*= (not sure exactly how i'd do this. but if you are familiar with super smash bros you might understand what i'm getting at. They have a system where landing the same hit will weaken the damage and knock effect from the attack. I'm not sure how for honor would add this in. But I think it would be beneficial for the game to do so.)"

[Wrander]

How is that a counter-argument to what I said? Counter atack is still an atack. Defense on it's own doesn't get you anywhere

Yes - mistake in a defense. Mistake you will eventually make, because it's not within human capabilities to reliably defend every single atack for long. And as I said, defense doesn't get you anywhere. In every martial art a proper defense leads to counter atack - which then can be countered by opponent. So it goes like this back and forth.
So you can see how different it is in this game? here a defense mechanic and counter-atack are ONE thing.

Wrong, the attacks you can do in this game are clearly shown and slow enough. It IS in human capabilities to block/counter everything. And the counters are not counterable so your second point dosn't make any sense. You cannot do anything when you got parried or if an assassin dodged your attack and counter attacks.

[Kav0rk4]

Just make blocking take chip damage.


Easy fix.

[Icepick_Trotsky]

Wrong, the attacks you can do in this game are clearly shown and slow enough. It IS in human capabilities to block/counter everything. And the counters are not counterable so your second point dosn't make any sense. You cannot do anything when you got parried or if an assassin dodged your attack and counter attacks.

dude, I'm not talking about the game in this comment...

[Wrander]

dude, I'm not talking about the game in this comment...

whoops, sorry. Overread the last sentance and without it it sounds like you are saying that for honor fights in this current state are as dynamic as real fights where you acutally can do mistakes no matter how long you practiced.