A detailed analysis of unblockable "body charges", and the coded issue they have | Forums

[TeoHTime]

The defender now is faced with a coded trap with no reaction possible to the attack other than a guess on what his opponent will do.

The problem with these "body charge" attacks is the fact they do not allow defenders to use a defensive ability just before the moment of the hit, like every other attack in the game.

This is not a problem. Actually, the game needs a lot more of this. Passively defending in a game where every offensive option can be stopped on reaction breaks the game once players are experienced enough to be able to deal with everything. The lack of any unreactable options at all on some classes can lead to defensive stalemates where neither player is in danger so long as they don't attempt to attack/parry.

The actual problems with Warden charge mixups are that they're true 50/50s against classes with no dash attack, and they lead back into the same mixup with the same reward each time.

Guessing games are normal in fighters, but that does not mean that they can be compared to Rock Paper Scissors. RPS has static risk and reward, so you can play to a stalemate by simply picking options at random. Fighting game mixups are defined by constantly variable risk/reward where the challenge is in weighing those odds on the fly, and this need for some kind of thought process opens people up to reads, creating something comparable to high speed real time Poker. Without those variable risks and rewards, what you have left really is just a mindless coin flip.

Ideally if this were to be changed, we'd want there to be a distinct difference between the guesses. Perhaps you add recovery time to the charge, and then allow that recovery time to be cancelled by pressing light, causing a unique follow up attack. You prevent that followup from being cancelled into charge, and now getting hit by the charge means the vortex can't continue. If you dodge the charge you could eat GB into light charge again, but choosing to not dodge the charge means you accept a possible damage followup in return for ending the sequence. Now you have some actual thought process in there, and players can make reads based on that thought process.

Then give everybody else something equivalent please.

[Oupyz]

warden's GB and cancel tactic is a true 50/50. Which this game sorely needs considering how easy it is to play defensively.
the only unblockable that imo is an issue is warlords headbutt since it comes out waaay too fast in order to reasonably react to. At best your dodge still gets you hit by the headbutt but you can't get hit by the sword follow up. at worst you do.

Conq's shield charge is pretty easy to dodge if you are an assassin. heavies and vanguards don't have the dash distance to avoid it. Also nobushi can flat out hidden stance to avoid it and other charge attacks (not sure about raiders grab though.)

I believe the reason they have a different timing is to making you learn more than one kind of timing. and it's also probably helping the game direct and connect charges easier. if you could last second dodge on anyone that would just make defensive style even more broken then it currently is.

Are you sure nobushi hidden stance avoid charge attacks , never seemed to work in the openbeta ? Or is their something im missing here ?