RIP: Peace Keeper, Nobushi, Warlord | Forums

[Zea1ot]

Such a pleasure read all those cries from unskilled players which was amuse their self-esteem during the beta, using cheap moves all day long(most of them even don't know the move list of their "main" character)

[DSD_Breaker]

Interestingly how you picked the 3 classes known to have OP moves as mains. I mean, Warlord and the Assassin classes are very different in playstyle so it might only be your preference for an easy win? I also played warlord a lot but just stopped half way through the Beta and played some other classes because I was sure some things will be nerfed and changed.

Besides that…There will always be changes ongoing and that’s a good thing. Besides balancing getting better and better (although there might be setbacks), it also forces people to adapt and rethink their tactics.

People tend to think they are the best in a game because they win often while it is more often just a balancing thing.
And if you think the changes are made only because people are crying in the forums for nerfs, that’s just ignorant. There are cold, hard numbers supporting nerfs, like you can find here for the alpha test. The Hero vs Hero Winrate:

http://static2.cdn.ubi.com/ForHonor/...o_Winrates.jpg

Given a big enough number of players to compensate for different skill levels, this kind of statistic makes a pretty good indicator if a class is OP or not.

[Peligrad]

Interestingly how you picked the 3 classes known to have OP moves as mains. I mean, Warlord and the Assassin classes are very different in playstyle so it might only be your preference for an easy win? I also played warlord a lot but just stopped half way through the Beta and played some other classes because I was sure some things will be nerfed and changed.

Besides that…There will always be changes ongoing and that’s a good thing. Besides balancing getting better and better (although there might be setbacks), it also forces people to adapt and rethink their tactics.

People tend to think they are the best in a game because they win often while it is more often just a balancing thing.
And if you think the changes are made only because people are crying in the forums for nerfs, that’s just ignorant. There are cold, hard numbers supporting nerfs, like you can find here for the alpha test. The Hero vs Hero Winrate:

http://static2.cdn.ubi.com/ForHonor/...o_Winrates.jpg

Given a big enough number of players to compensate for different skill levels, this kind of statistic makes a pretty good indicator if a class is OP or not.

From what I've seen, Ubi seems to pay a lot more attention to what the highest skill level folks are doing more than the full player-base stats.

You can find several examples of balance change on things that the average player didn't even know enough to take advantage of.

Prime example being Orochi's storm rush cancel being nerfed because the top players were using it to bait and throw the defender off-balance (plus it looked ridiculous damaging immersion).

But yeah... saying "RIP" to classes because they got tweaks is just ignorant.

Especially saying "RIP" to the Warlord when he only received very subtle balance changes and he was previously able to do things that didn't fit his role.

[DSD_Breaker]

From what I've seen, Ubi seems to pay a lot more attention to what the highest skill level folks are doing more than the full player-base stats.

You can find several examples of balance change on things that the average player didn't even know enough to take advantage of.

Prime example being Orochi's storm rush cancel being nerfed because the top players were using it to bait and throw the defender off-balance (plus it looked ridiculous damaging immersion).

Of course. This kind of statistics gets more meaningful if you observe high skill players and the moves they exploit. But I guess they have the data to generate this charts also for only players with a certain amount of hours played or whatever they want to use as a separator.
Or even by which moves are used most often and damage done with which move etc. Of course I don’t know what they are able and willing to do for balancing in detail.

In addition to that a half way decent statistician could easily come up with a model which reduces the impact of skill level.

[SethUnleashed]

talking only about PK:

this change HIGHLY depends on the amount that the dot has been nerfed, but if its anything above 30%, than the peacekeeper needs a dmg buff on lights and heavy attacks as its time to kill is rather low for an assassin already imo

[DrExtrem]

Hmmmmm..... ok I will bite. What empirical data are you talking about that they used and how did they use this data in determining how much to nerf each class without making the class useless? I think only testing these classes in open Beta we will be able to know for sure. I have seen this before in many other games where people cry about a specific class on a forum and the publisher applies a nerf and makes that class useless in the balance of the whole game because the nerfs have not been properly tested. Hope this is not the case with Ubisoft but I guess there will be ongoing adjusting of all the classes. As for me I am going to still play the class I like most I just like those style of classes (assassins, hybrids). At least when I win no one will be able to say .... OP OP OP waa waa waa ;-)

Its quite simple. The devs collect data like, wich class won how often, compared to other classes. Were players more successful with a class, than with other classes they played with. How high wad the k/d. What average damage did the class. What moves did they primarily use.

Based on this data (and even more), you can deduct how strong a class is.

I guess they decided, that three of the classes were to strong in the last beta build.


Its not the first adjustment a d certainly not the last.

[Oupyz]

Nobushi , didn't get the nerf as most suggested , they just wanted to shut some whinners with that -12hp less =)))

i don't consider that a nerf though , don't get me wrong i dont think she needed one in the first place

[Juuudass]

https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/co...ay_overnerfed/

There you go, im gonna sumarize it for people that dont want to read all.

First of all im not saying that nerf is not needed, nerf was needed but 75% reduction on bleed damage is too much.

Bleed damage was nerfed around 75% this includes whole bleeds (grab + 3 stabs, dodge + heavy + bleed, leap + heavy + bleed) lets think about this for a moment, her whole kit got nerfed, the strong point of the character is the bleed.

Stamina comsuption of her grab + 3 stabs is around 1/3 of the stamina pool and it applies a dot of 15.5 damage, (when it used to do 53 damage) lets not forget that one subdivision of the hp bar is 20hp, when a light peacekeeper attack does 17 instant damage. Paying attention to those numbers it turns out that it is not worth in terms of stamina comsuption and damage applied to try to grab and get 3 stabs it is better to hit 1 light attack makes no sense to stab now.

[Machine_Diesel]

https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/co...ay_overnerfed/

There you go, im gonna sumarize it for people that dont want to read all.

First of all im not saying that nerf is not needed, nerf was needed but 75% reduction on bleed damage is too much.

Bleed damage was nerfed around 75% this includes whole bleeds (grab + 3 stabs, dodge + heavy + bleed, leap + heavy + bleed) lets think about this for a moment, her whole kit got nerfed, the strong point of the character is the bleed.

Stamina comsuption of her grab + 3 stabs is around 1/3 of the stamina pool and it applies a dot of 15.5 damage, (when it used to do 53 damage) lets not forget that one subdivision of the hp bar is 20hp, when a light peacekeeper attack does 17 instant damage. Paying attention to those numbers it turns out that it is not worth in terms of stamina comsuption and damage applied to try to grab and get 3 stabs it is better to hit 1 light attack makes no sense to stab now.

Exactly. Anyone who sits here and says a 75% nerf to one of the only tools the PK has wasn't overkill or game breaking, must of been one that lost over and over to them in closed. Like I said in another post, I'll wait to see for myself tomorrow, but it looks like my preorder will be canceled.

[SethUnleashed]

https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/co...ay_overnerfed/

There you go, im gonna sumarize it for people that dont want to read all.

First of all im not saying that nerf is not needed, nerf was needed but 75% reduction on bleed damage is too much.

Bleed damage was nerfed around 75% this includes whole bleeds (grab + 3 stabs, dodge + heavy + bleed, leap + heavy + bleed) lets think about this for a moment, her whole kit got nerfed, the strong point of the character is the bleed.

Stamina comsuption of her grab + 3 stabs is around 1/3 of the stamina pool and it applies a dot of 15.5 damage, (when it used to do 53 damage) lets not forget that one subdivision of the hp bar is 20hp, when a light peacekeeper attack does 17 instant damage. Paying attention to those numbers it turns out that it is not worth in terms of stamina comsuption and damage applied to try to grab and get 3 stabs it is better to hit 1 light attack makes no sense to stab now.

thats exactly what i was thinking...

time to till is so bad now... an assassin hero that does the least dmg of all classes xD and without bleeds she is just a blad and boring hero too