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  1. #1

    Orochi is broken...

    I've now played the game in an alpha event and also in a beta event. I hit prestige 2 during alpha and prestige 1 level 15 in the beta so I've played quite a bit.

    In my observation Orochi makes the other characters in the game feel very lackluster.

    The main reason for Orochi being ridiculous is that he has way too many safe options to deal damage and control a fight while dealing high damage.

    Any single one of them can be guarded against, sure, and some can even be punished. But because Orochi deals such high damage (and a whole kit full of ways to exploit more damage when he does land 1 hit) each time he does catch you off-guard he can punish you heavily. Orochi also has so many options that guessing the right one inherently has losing odds and it's just not possible to be prepared for them all.

    Zephyr strike is by far my largest complaint about the character. When combined with Orochi's innate ability to dodge while recovering AND his deflect now being on his dodge as well, this skill allows Orochi to mitigate most of the attacks in the game while simultaneously dealing damage. That's freaking insane and terribad design. IMO Zephyr strike should have a massive stamina cost to limit it's use because it is extremely hard to punish and extremely easy to take advantage of people with.

    Storm rush definitely is strong. Not because the skill itself is difficult to counter but because the fact that you can cancel storm rush and go into literally any other attack without any kind of indicator frame is ridiculous. You can so easily bait someone into guarding against storm rush and then take advantage of them because of the utter lack of indicator or ability to react. There NEEDS to be some kind of brief indicator frame to allow people to react against storm rush cancels if you are going to give a character such a swift way to engage and disengage and potentially deal solid harass damage. As of right now storm rush cancel options are just too strong and difficult to counter.

    Back step into overhead is such a ridiculously strong tool for Orochi players when he can already keep his opponent so off balance (without much skill required). Orochi's overhead attack is already fast and brutally powerful and it gets free tech in his kit for even more damage. With Orochi's ability to engage and disengage so quickly, the ability to also withdraw and deal massive damage to anyone trying to preemptively strike is insane.

    Orochi's attacks in general are extremely fast. His heavy attacks are much faster than most other characters in the game and just as damaging and with his ability to feint guarding against just his attacks can get overwhelming even without his absurd mobility. When everything is linked together he's flat out enraging to try to defend against. Oh yeah... and he gets double damage on overhead light attacks... seems fair...

    Orochi seems to do everything Beserker can do, and more, and has longer attack range. Makes me wonder why anyone would ever want to play Beserker.


    I'm not saying that Orochi needs nerfs to everything I've mentioned but as of right now having all these tools in addition to deflect makes Orochi risk/reward ratio plainly too high. In comparison to any other character in the game I find him just infuriating to play against.

    I find that I can very easily defend against Berserkers, Raiders and Warlords. Conquerors, Peacekeepers, and nobushi get through my defense about equally as often as I get through theirs. I find Kensie very inconsistent, I don't see many decent ones so I haven't gotten much practice against good ones, but I know I need to parry more so when I do lose to one I know why.

    But in my experience Orochi is just plain broken. They have him listed as a "counter-attacker" but if that's the truth they need to strip away some of his ability to straight up assault people and force him to rely on his ability to react. If that is really the way they want Orochi to play out then they need to hard nerf his offensive mobility options and the inherent speed of his attacks and force him to make openings off of defensive moves.


    Edit: Played a lot more in open beta. For those of you wondering how to deal with Orochi, I found that attacking their stamina bar works nicely. I got significantly better with parrying and was able to end Orochi's aggression much earlier by doing so. If you can confine him into narrow spaces he is also much easier to deal with.
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  2. #2

    Orochi rant

    I do not feel the same way as You. First of all some classes like nobushi and the warriors with shields have an advantage against orochi. Peacemaker and berserker seem on par. Warden has also a lot of built in counters for orochi, the only ones i almost always win vs are kensei and raider. Orochi seems really good on paper with all the fast guaranteed attacks and counters and mobility, but in reality it is rather difficult to land all the deflects, parrys and zephyr strikes on demand - in fact so difficult and unreliable that they are not even worth it, especially on a skilled unpredictable opponent. It requires a very deep knowledge to effectivly defend and counter every move and even then its like 100% and best case scenario You get 1-2 free light hits in as a reward. I understand that newer players might feel that orochi is an op opponent if they get storm rush+top light attack combo spammed but skilled opponents seem to have no problems countering everything.
    Also You say that orochi does a lot more DPS than other classes, well i dont really see this since peacemaker and berserker can shred people up just as fast, just like any class.
    I think that we can get a clearer picture once the game is out and then look at the leaderboards, which already seemed to favor shielded classes and nobushi..
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  3. #3
    Wow...

    First off...Nobushi does not counter Orochi. Orochi counters Nobushi.

    Nobushi has a lot of tools for reaching, but her attacks are largely straight out away from her. Her sweeping attacks that can hit dodging opponents are very predictable and easily defended against.

    Assassins (Orochi, Peacemaker, and Beserker) are the very best characters for taking on Nobushi because they have so much side to side motion that Nobushi can't keep them away like she can the less mobile characters who have to straight up defend against an onslaught just to get into range to attack.

    As I said earlier and stated very specific reasons why, Orochi is very hard to defend against when played with a level of skill.

    There were only 2 shield classes available in the Beta: Warlord and Conqueror. Both these classes rely on defending to whittle down their opponent. An enemy that is difficult to defend against COUNTERS characters that rely on defense. Not the other way around.

    That said, Warlord probably does have the best match up against Orochi of anyone in the entire game because he gets a similar amount of "free" light attacks as what Orochi gets and his larger health pool off-sets the fact that Orochi hits harder. But 2 skilled players, that match-up is still 50/50. And the Warlord has struggles against other classes and honestly is very simple and predictable and hence easily countered.

    Orochi has a clear advantage over Conqueror. Conqueror really doesn't have tools against Orochi like Warlord does.

    One of the biggest benefits of playing conqueror is having a chargable heavy attack. But you should never get one to land on Orochi though. He's too fast. Conqueror will either go for the attack and get punished after he misses or he will have to cancel the charge for a stamina loss. Conqueror's tech is all linear straight forward and easily avoided and punished by Orochi's dodge and ability to attack while dodging. Any non-noob Orochi will block and end Conqueror's light attack chain before it can do much. A good Orochi should have no problems at all with Conqueror, the fact that you say otherwise says something...
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  4. #4
    Assassin classes in general, seem to be posterchildren of devs in this game .

    Nice to see an honest Orochi player .
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  5. #5
    @Peligrad
    Do you play Orochi?
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  6. #6
    orochi already got nerfed to oblivion. leave him alone; he's fine
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  7. #7
    whis-'s Avatar Junior Member
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    Nov 2016
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    Stop crying about heros. All classes have strong points and weak points. The game is balanced, you just have to improve ur skills bro.
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  8. #8
    Originally Posted by Foly- Go to original post
    Stop crying about heros. All classes have strong points and weak points. The game is balanced, you just have to improve ur skills bro.
    The game is beta "bro"

    25% of the characters haven't even been publicly play tested. And the balance changes we've seen since alpha already say you're wrong.

    So just be quiet child
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  9. #9
    whis-'s Avatar Junior Member
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    And cause of that u r saying orochi is overpowered? the game is almost released, orochis has already been nerfed.. just improve ur skills kid. it's easier to cry about it than get better.
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  10. #10
    Orochi is not unbalanced nor op, especially after the nerf. It is still easy to counter orochis moves and punish him hard just like any class can do vs any other class. High mobility is just something Orochi has, but tbh EVERY class has good mobility moves and a lot of them are more rewarding than orochis.
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