1. #1

    [MINI-GUIDE] Counter Guardbreaking

    This is going to be a short one and also I've never done guides before so bear with me.

    A fundamentals guide for defense has already been done by zefurr explaining guard breaking so you shouldn't need a refresher. If you do need one, the link will be at the bottom.




    Counter-guardbreaking or "tech" is one of the most difficult things for most people to have learned from the alphas, technical tests and the recently ended closed beta (RIP for two weeks For Honor) and some people think that you have to mash the guard break button, anticipate1 it or push it right as the icon appears.

    In my experience, this is wrong.

    I spent some time on the closed beta's opening night to refresh myself on how to play (my God, I was rusty) and found out that there's a small window that you can successfully tech (and is reliable) - it just takes some practice and muscle memory but don't worry, the latter will build.

    Full time


    Drastically slowed down

    I wouldn't consider this a lot of information to take in (except for when you're 2+ v 1ing, then it's a lot because other stuff you already know) but there are five (5) things that you should note. The fifth is just a bonus.

    • The red shield on the enemy mini-boss training dummy. That lets the player know that they've thrown out their guard break. It also lets you know this too.

    • Pretty close to immediately, you'll notice the small white shield appear on my toon (or you for the sake of the example). This is not the window you're supposed to tech. This is the wind up. Notice how both the aggressor and you are starting a pusher/pushee dynamic.

    • A broken red shield with a white slash going through it. Still not the right time. This is when the animation has started to occur and will continue until...

    • The white shield that appears is the small window when HUD players (general population) should tech.

    • This one's a bonus for you no-HUD players. When your (Kensei) body is completely exposed, this is where you tech and not a moment sooner.





    A couple of side notes:

    Another way I can put it is: when you parry, there's the red icon on your guard HUD then it turns white (not including light attacks, this has a layer of timing on its own) for heavies and unblockables... except teching has white semi-solid -> red solid -> white blink instead of black (neutral) -> red solid -> white blink.

    Another way to think about it is when someone is breaking your guard, you are pushing them off of you. You're not trying to beat them to the push.

    I have no idea how to end this so [insert faction memes here]. Peace




    Zefurrs defense guide here


    Hall of Heroes Guides

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    1- anticipate is sort of correct as you need to know some base knowledge of a toon's combo to anticipate it but not use it to immediately press your (in this case) tech button stop it is what I meant.





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  2. #2
    Thank you very much for this guide. It has eased my mind a little bit, in the sense that I was missing the timing a lot due to not knowing what it was, then to actually misstiming the input It's a lot later than I thought. And I even wonder if it has changed from the Alpha.

    Yet another surprise is that you're suppose to perform the input after your fighter is grabbed. His animation is interrupted, he enters this specific animation of GB victim, then you tech. I thought you had to start your own GB animation, before the opponent's connected, in order to tech. The reason I thought this was that you cannot tech after being parried; when you're caught while dodging; or after being blocked, in some cases. All these things have one thing in common: you are recovering from doing something else. So, my reasoning was: you can't tech GB while you're recovering, which means that you must be able to (start to) execute your own GB, in order to tech. And so I thought the timing was a lot earlier.

    And I'm now also puzzled as to why they forbid the player to tech after being parried or blocked (in some cases). I really thought this was simply how the speed of the actions worked, not that the devs thought it was particularly fair to allow a guaranteed GB after a parry (which sounds like a bit of an excessive reward). Now, please don't take this as a suggestion to allow techs after parries. In general it sounds like a good idea to me, as a way to nerf turtling. BUT I have no idea how this would impact the Heroes balance.

    Thanks again for the guide and gifs and all.
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  3. #3
    Altair_Snake,

    I found that's generally what people thought you have to do (anticipate or beat them to the punch when they attempt to guard break you, else you spam).

    The tech dynamic is different than parrying, dodging or after being blocked is because you're still in a neutral frame rate compared to when you're parrying, dodging, blocked. You're still in a stunned frame rate, so it makes sense that you get guaranteed guard broken.

    I think it's more to keep the game moving and you're not safe all the time. If you could tech after parrying, the game would be For Stalemate because nothing would happen.

    Thanks for reading.
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  4. #4
    I disagree.

    It's precisely because it's different that it should be blockable. You can't defend attacks while recovring form an action, becuase you need time to block. But in the case of GBs, it's the same. Whether or not you were recovering from something, your character ends up in the same state (animation). So, based on the character's movements, they should always be able to tech. I'm not saying that should be the case for balance. But as a general rule, that is how it should be and how it is on 3D arcade fight games.

    I even slightly suspect that GBs ended up bein undeniable in the situations they currently are, simply because of a bug due to coding the recovery as a cooldown in a way that even if the animation is broken, the cooldown remains.

    I also don't think GB after parries favors offense. It favors turtling, because it's basically increasing the punishent granted by parrying. The naked GBs are the true offense.

    But I'd say I'm just splitting hairs in relation to what you said. I don't think we disagree about how things work or should work.
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  5. #5
    Originally Posted by Altair_Snake Go to original post
    I disagree.

    It's precisely because it's different that it should be blockable. You can't defend attacks while recovring form an action, becuase you need time to block. But in the case of GBs, it's the same. Whether or not you were recovering from something, your character ends up in the same state (animation). So, based on the character's movements, they should always be able to tech. I'm not saying that should be the case for balance. But as a general rule, that is how it should be and how it is on 3D arcade fight games.

    I even slightly suspect that GBs ended up bein undeniable in the situations they currently are, simply because of a bug due to coding the recovery as a cooldown in a way that even if the animation is broken, the cooldown remains.
    I think in this case it was to follow the theme of rock-paper-scissors and to keep it simple. You throw out paper (gb) and I counter with scissors (tech).

    Originally Posted by Altair_Snake Go to original post
    I also don't think GB after parries favors offense. It favors turtling, because it's basically increasing the punishent granted by parrying. The naked GBs are the true offense.
    It can go either way but my point was not to rule out being on the offense after parrying since it is a mind game (assuming someone's been defensive, this change can turn the fight around for the individual).

    Originally Posted by Altair_Snake Go to original post
    But I'd say I'm just splitting hairs in relation to what you said. I don't think we disagree about how things work or should work.
    Nah, we cool.
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