What are your thoughts on the loot system? | Forums

[Joe_Corleone]

Jason Vanderberghe said in an interview at E3 that there is a loot system that will drop weapon parts for us to basically craft our own weapons for each class. I'm wondering if this also includes armor, colors, emblems, etc. also if you will only get drops based on what class you're playing as or if you will get drops for all classes regardless of who you are. I think it's amazing that they are including a loot system. This game seems to have more and more content everytime we see it. Hype is very real.

[bububoosh]

I personally love this. I have played looters all my life and didn't know that they were going to introduce this into the game. It will be cool to compare some of the stuff you get to your friends and be like "Ha I got this drop last night check it out". It will bring more community I think and more stuff to talk about on here so I am excited for it.

[Chaf--]

I don't like it. At all.

This game attracts me because of the Art of Battle. This battle system is focused on watching your opponent, predict his moves, outsmart your opponent and manages your ressources. As we know, the game will have classes per faction. Each classes will have a fixed weapon, style, strength, speed and abilities that cannot be modified. And that's good, because it makes the game relying on the knowledge you have on the class you're playing and on the class the opponent is. This is really important, because with the time, automatisms and 1v1 strategies will be built to give FH a really grounded game to balance.

As Vanderberghe describes, the loot could change the abilities of your class. And this is really hurtful for the competitive aspect of the game. That makes the player not only rely on skill and knowledge, but also on the loot your character you'll have. Even if it's on the slightiest, it's still gonna impact the gameplay and that could be critical in certain situation, coasting you a match, because the opponent has better loot items than you. I'm not against the loot system, but it should be 100% cosmetic. Like cool armor pieces that you can color for your characters on each factions, so that makes encourage you to play every classes on every factions. But nothing more.

Also, competition on fixed characters and classes lets you showing your skill without having to play on your online profile. If loots are important, it makes offline and LAN tourneys really difficult to make, because usually, on tourney consoles/PCs, everything on the game will be by default. Lv1 characters should be able to beat Lv20 characters, if the Lv1 player actually outsmart the high ranked player.

[bububoosh]

I don't like it. At all.
As Vanderberghe describes, the loot could change the abilities of your class. And this is really hurtful for the competitive aspect of the game. That makes the player not only rely on skill and knowledge, but also on the loot your character you'll have. Even if it's on the slightiest, it's still gonna impact the gameplay and that could be critical in certain situation, coasting you a match, because the opponent has better loot items than you. I'm not against the loot system, but it should be 100% cosmetic. Like cool armor pieces that you can color for your characters on each factions, so that makes encourage you to play every classes on every factions.

I don't think it will change anything in multiplayer though friend. I think having a certain item won't let you have an edge over someone without that item. Just like anything else people are going to have to learn combat styles no matter what.

[Chaf--]

I don't think it will change anything in multiplayer though friend. I think having a certain item won't let you have an edge over someone without that item. Just like anything else people are going to have to learn combat styles no matter what.

Never underestimate how damaging a small change can do. Especially on high level play. Friendlies matches will never saw the difference if the loot system isn't as huge as, say, Dark Souls. But +5% here or -10% there could coast an entire match and change everything.

[Be1dou]

As Vanderberghe describes, the loot could change the abilities of your class.

Link?

[Runic]

Link?

Agreed. A link would be great as I had not heard about this. Sounds interesting but I would like to know more.

[MisterWillow]

Link?

(20:20)

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However, to say that the loot 'changes the abilities of your class' isn't entirely accurate, at least in regard to multiplayer.

To quote Jason "Your weapon has different pieces you get and you can mix and match. Each of those pieces has stats attached to it, and those stats are mostly going to be trade-offs, right? In the single player campaign, you'll have more of a power progression, and then you can bring some of those; the same idea, in multiplayer, where you can modify your stats. There won't be a power curve in multiplayer, of course, but you can modify your character, and customise the way you want to fight, with that gear." (bolded the relevant bits)

To me, all this means is that you'll be able to fine-tune a Hero to fit your playstyle, which, with the sort of system of trade-offs I'm imagining, can be easily implemented without compromising overall game balance.

For example, say you get a heaver blade, which will do more damage but will be slower to swing; or a heavier pommel that will increase speed but, say, decrease blocking (so, you'll incur greater chip damage while defending---or incur some where you otherwise might not, like light attacks). Armour could be the same way---heavier pieces may protect you more, add an additional segment to your health bar (in this video, for example, you'll notice the Sugoki has more than the Raider), but may restrict how far you are able to dash or overall movement speed, or affect how much stamina is used when attacking (again, all hypothetical).

Additionally, they could have this be done without having a bunch of different variations or literal 'stats' attached to the multiplayer gear. They could subdivide equipment very simply into Light, Heavy and Balanced, and then make a hundred different cosmetic pieces to fit into each one of those. It would all be fairly self-explanatory, I think---Light equipment allowing freer, faster movement while making your character more vulnerable to damage, and perhaps dealing a bit less overall, but also using less stamina, Heavy equipment slowing you down while allowing you to absorb damage and dish it out more, and using more stamina, and Balanced equipment being a middleground between the two---but that way they avoid making it like a literal 'shooter with swords' like The Division or Destiny, where you need that epic loot with 500% damage buffs or whatever, while giving the player an additional level of customisation, and still having a plethora of cosmetic options.

[Be1dou]

Thanks for the link and timestamp.

Going by how he described the loot system as weapons having various pieces with different stats attached, I believe it'll be more like how Evolve Stage 2 is handling its perk system. With perks, you don't exactly have any subtractions to stats, but you do have a limited (3) amount of perks with bonuses and upgrades to choose from, allowing for a variety of customizations and play styles. e.g. - a monster you chose could be slow with high defense and you could focus on buffing the speed. I like this because it gives players a sense of progression without feeling like they've lost something in the process.

[MisterWillow]

Going by how he described the loot system as weapons having various pieces with different stats attached, I believe it'll be more like how Evolve Stage 2 is handling its perk system. With perks, you don't exactly have any subtractions to stats, but you do have a limited (3) amount of perks with bonuses and upgrades to choose from, allowing for a variety of customizations and play styles. e.g. - a monster you chose could be slow with high defense and you could focus on buffing the speed. I like this because it gives players a sense of progression without feeling like they've lost something in the process.

I haven't played Evolve, so I could be misunderstanding, but I really don't want a system where players can augment their weaknesses without being compromised in another way.

In single player, that's fine, but in multiplayer, something like that would open up room for ultimate builds where certain players have the best of all worlds (or close to it), and when that's tied into progression, it could create a situation where newer players would be unnecessarily punished for not having the right gear.

Of course, there could have been a little slip of the tongue in that interview, when he said 'you can bring some of those' and then stopped himself, he could mean that you keep everything you get in singleplayer to use in multiplayer, with all the stats that constitute the campaign's power curve removed. In that scenario, it would be less of an issue, but I'd prefer the system I suggested above.