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ffimbroisi
04-04-2004, 10:25 AM
When i start the game, I turn the aircraft on and the plane starts to go left and get out of the runway? Does any one knows what's going on? Thanks!

ffimbroisi
04-04-2004, 10:25 AM
When i start the game, I turn the aircraft on and the plane starts to go left and get out of the runway? Does any one knows what's going on? Thanks!

RidgeR5
04-04-2004, 10:30 AM
Last night I'd start up the P-38, engine 1 first, then 2. Even with throttle at 0, the plane was slowly spinning around like engine 1 was maxxed out!

S!

Ridge

tsisqua
04-04-2004, 10:33 AM
That is torque from the prop, combined with other forces. The prop blade cuts air differently (on the ground) on the way UP than it does on the way DOWN. On takeoff, if you pull the nose up too sharply, you will find that the plane wants to flip over to the left. That is from the prop, engine, and everything that is spinning at high rpm creating a gyroscope. All these forces are causing you to have to correct to the right.

The planes in this sim are not perfect, but they are awful darn close to what it is like in a real plane.

Tsisqua

p.s. welcome to the boards

Chuck_Older
04-04-2004, 10:34 AM
Welcome to flight sims http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


ffimbroisi-

try this experiment-

Take the front wheel off of a bicycle. No, really http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif hear me out. Take off the wheel and hold the hubs in your hands,so the wheel can spin. Have someone spin the wheel. Now turn the wheel left or right. Feel the pull on one side, and the resistance when you go to the other?

OK, now imagine the prop is like that wheel. On the ground, the landing gear wheels do not power the aircraft. It's forward motion is because of the propeller. The gyroscopic effect wants the plane to pull to the left.

This is normal.

Counter this with a little right rudder, not with right aileron roll http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

*****************************
Punk Rockers in the UK, they won't notice anyway. They're all too busy fighting for a good place under the lighting~ Clash

Heavy_Weather
04-04-2004, 10:36 AM
this effect is caused by the torque of the propeller. depending on what type of aircraft you're flying, whether its German or Russian. most German A/C, the propeller turns to the left, causing the A/C to start to take off in that direction. to counter this effect you have to apply right rudder. the same applies to A/C with blades that turn in the opposite direction.

"The wise man is often the man who plays dumb."

tsisqua
04-04-2004, 10:36 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ridge_Runner_5:
Last night I'd start up the P-38, engine 1 first, then 2. Even with throttle at 0, the plane was slowly spinning around like engine 1 was maxxed out!

S!

Ridge<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

the P-38 seems to have torque that it shouldn't. I believe that this is from the games flight engine being designed to model single engine fighters in the inception. We may have to live with it.

Tsisqua

lil_labbit
04-04-2004, 10:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tsisqua:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ridge_Runner_5:
Last night I'd start up the P-38, engine 1 first, then 2. Even with throttle at 0, the plane was slowly spinning around like engine 1 was maxxed out!

S!

Ridge<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

the P-38 seems to have torque that it shouldn't. I believe that this is from the games flight engine being designed to model single engine fighters in the inception. We may have to live with it.

Tsisqua<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes; I read somewhere the IL-2 game engine can't handle the counter rotating props in a p38, hence you do get torque where there should be none...

http://members.home.nl/lil.labbit/lilseesya.jpg
Night is better than Day

Luftkillier
04-04-2004, 11:32 AM
Wrong. What is happening in the P-38 is really simple. You need to select then start engine #1, then select and start engine #2, then select "all engines". Now throttle input will go to "both" engines. What was happening is that you still just had "1" engine selected and that is what is causing the P-38 problem you described.

tsisqua
04-04-2004, 12:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Luftkillier:
Wrong. What is happening in the P-38 is really simple. You need to select then start engine #1, then select and start engine #2, then select "all engines". Now throttle input will go to "both" engines. What was happening is that you still just had "1" engine selected and that is what is causing the P-38 problem you described.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, that is possible. You always must make sure that you have selected all engines after getting them started. However, there is still a slight problem with the torque thing on the P-38. If you do not believe me, then go watch the Zeno's movie about flying the P-38, paying particular attention to the stall clip. The nose should come straight down in a low-speed, 1G stall, then recover normally. What happens in the game is a snap over to left, followed by a spin. Whether that is torque, or some other thing being modeled, it is there . . . something that constantly pulls the plane to the left.

Tsisqua

VW-IceFire
04-04-2004, 12:07 PM
Many people have trouble with twin engined aircraft.

You have to select engine 1, start it, select engine 2, start it, and then select both engines and move your throttle to the 0 position otherwise the first engine is likely to have a value other than 0.

The flight engine was never designed to operate with an aircraft with two props spinning in opposite directions. So while they have tried to kill the torque as much as possible I have read that it was impossible for it to disappear completely (the same with the jet engines). Thats ok...we'll accept that limitation. The P-38 is still one of the most stable and easy to fly at stall speed aircraft than virtually anything else.

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RCAF 412 Falcon Squadron - "Swift to Avenge"

Luftkillier
04-04-2004, 12:13 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tsisqua:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Luftkillier:
Wrong. What is happening in the P-38 is really simple. You need to select then start engine #1, then select and start engine #2, then select "all engines". Now throttle input will go to "both" engines. What was happening is that you still just had "1" engine selected and that is what is causing the P-38 problem you described.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, that is possible. You always must make sure that you have selected all engines after getting them started. However, there is still a slight problem with the torque thing on the P-38. If you do not believe me, then go watch the Zeno's movie about flying the P-38, paying particular attention to the stall clip. The nose should come straight down in a low-speed, 1G stall, then recover normally. What happens in the game is a snap over to left, followed by a spin. Whether that is torque, or some other thing being modeled, it is there . . . something that constantly pulls the plane to the left.

Tsisqua<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't get me wrong I know you are correct about the torque thing. Take a quick look at the top two posts. They are describing the unselected engine issue that most people encounter when first flying the P-38. They just simply forget to activate ALL engine once they start the second one. ~S~

Capt.LoneRanger
04-04-2004, 12:13 PM
The Il2-engine HAS problems with 2-engined planes. But AFAIK this problem is only concerning the flight modell, because the P38 should be one of the most stall-free and stable planes. It isn't in IL2, because the engine is not able to simulate a plane with counter-rotating probs.
However, on the ground, I never had a problem with torque.

greets
Capt.LoneRanger

http://www.imageshack.us/img1/7182/1703abcdefg.gif

tsisqua
04-04-2004, 12:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Capt.LoneRanger:
The Il2-engine HAS problems with 2-engined planes. But AFAIK this problem is only concerning the flight modell, because the P38 should be one of the most stall-free and stable planes. It isn't in IL2, because the engine is not able to simulate a plane with counter-rotating probs.
However, on the ground, I never had a problem with torque.

greets
Capt.LoneRanger

http://www.imageshack.us/img1/7182/1703abcdefg.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, Kemosabe. The more I read and reread this, the more I am convinced that there is a problem getting both engines under control.

I mapped one key to desellect all engines, and another one to select all . . . in addition to the keys that select individual powerplants. When both engines are turning, I deselct to "clear" the values that I have been inputting, then select all. After this, all things are good.

Tsisqua