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View Full Version : Tomahna & The Cleft ??



ZHorkmeister
08-14-2004, 01:03 PM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif Uhhh .... Just HOW CLOSE are Tomahna & The Cleft to each other?? We are talking about somewhere in New Mexico, right?? Yeesha said in URU -- " My parents brought me here... "

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif Uhhh ... so Atrus, Catherine, Anna, & Yeesha all hail from somewhere in New Mexico??

So..... in MYST IV ... we'll be travelling to Tomahna, Haven, Serenia, Spire, and where-ever the hell else Atrus wants us to go?? Interesting ..... Anyone think we'll have to go in search of more red & blue pages ??

If Sirrus and Achenar are on two different ages -- then why would we have more than a total of 3 ages to deal with ??

VELLY INTERESTING .... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

ZHorkmeister
08-14-2004, 01:03 PM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif Uhhh .... Just HOW CLOSE are Tomahna & The Cleft to each other?? We are talking about somewhere in New Mexico, right?? Yeesha said in URU -- " My parents brought me here... "

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif Uhhh ... so Atrus, Catherine, Anna, & Yeesha all hail from somewhere in New Mexico??

So..... in MYST IV ... we'll be travelling to Tomahna, Haven, Serenia, Spire, and where-ever the hell else Atrus wants us to go?? Interesting ..... Anyone think we'll have to go in search of more red & blue pages ??

If Sirrus and Achenar are on two different ages -- then why would we have more than a total of 3 ages to deal with ??

VELLY INTERESTING .... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

TheThunder55
08-14-2004, 01:40 PM
i think weve discussed some of this, and were still scpetical about parts, but i dont think there will be any more red and blue pages.

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Cierdwyn
08-14-2004, 01:53 PM
I'm pretty sure that in the Book of Ti'ana, Anna and her father lived in a cliff-like area a couple of miles from the cleft/cauldera. I've sort of wondered if that's not where Tomahna is.

Cierdwyn

ZHorkmeister
08-14-2004, 09:05 PM
Well -- I think the two locales can't be THAT far from one another... at any rate, Atrus has been doing a very good job of keeping Tomahna completely hidden from us Terrans http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

ArienMalfoy
08-16-2004, 05:18 PM
That's what originally made me assume that Tomahna was another age. For one thing, it has a name of it's own. I've never heard of Tomahna, NM (though it might exist; I've never actually checked), nor did Catherine or Atrus just say it was New Mexico.

But reliable sources have stated that Tomahna is officially in New Mexico and is not far from the Cleft, so I'm cool with that.

JustBrett
08-16-2004, 09:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ArienMalfoy:
That's what originally made me assume that Tomahna was another age. For one thing, it has a name of it's own. I've never heard of Tomahna, NM (though it might exist; I've never actually checked), nor did Catherine or Atrus just say it was New Mexico.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
First, "Tomahna" is a D'ni word meaning "home". It's the name Atrus gave to his estate, which is something we humans also do on occasion. For example, Elvis called his home "Graceland". Thomas Jefferson called his "Monticello". The names people give their homes don't usually appear on maps.

Second, neither Atrus nor Catherine would ever have said "New Mexico". Tomahna was built around 1815, when New Mexico wasn't even a territory, much less a state. As far as Atrus was concerned, he just homesteaded a piece of nameless, unclaimed wilderness. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

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ArienMalfoy
08-16-2004, 09:39 PM
Please remember that the bulk of my experience with the Myst "universe" is through the novels (which I haven't read in years) and the games (which, with the exception of URU and Exile, I also haven't played in years). So I had no idea until recently that Tomahna even was in New Mexico, or that the events of the games was supposed to take place hundreds of years ago.

Going strictly off the games and novels, there's really no information that would lead one to believe that Tomahna was in what is now New Mexico (until URU, that is). In fact, the books give the false impression that the Cleft is somewhere in the Middle East or Africa.

Cierdwyn
08-17-2004, 08:26 AM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif You are right ArienMalfoy, in the books it does seem that the cliff area where Anna and her father lived, and the cleft/cauldera area were in the middle east somewhere. The names of the characters, nearby towns and the use of camel caravans all suggest the middle east someplace.

The powers that be, probably did a little "creative adjustment" to move things to the New Mexico for Uru - especially since most people would be unfamiliar with the books anyway.

Cierdwyn

ArienMalfoy
08-17-2004, 09:26 AM
I seem to remember reading somewhere in these boards that David Wingrove, co-author of the novels, took some creative license himself, and that Rand and Robyn never necessarily planned for the Cleft to be set in the Middle East.

Cierdwyn
08-17-2004, 09:47 AM
That would make sense, because they never actually give a specific location - you're just left to assume it's the middle east by the names that they use and other odd bits of information that imply that that is where they are.

Cierdwyn http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

earthinvasion
08-17-2004, 11:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ArienMalfoy:
I seem to remember reading somewhere in these boards that David Wingrove, co-author of the novels, took some creative license himself, and that Rand and Robyn never necessarily planned for the Cleft to be set in the Middle East.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I remeber reading that too. I think it was in one of RAWA's statements on Myst.

__________________________________________________ _____________________________________

What is this invasion?
For the fourth time, they come.
Two come to war;
Two run from war;
Two die;
Two live although they kill.
All of them;
Above whom are none
They believe.

Marth in Until Uru

ZHorkmeister
08-17-2004, 12:56 PM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif Wellllll .... my original question remains .... how " close " are Tomahna & The Cleft to each other?? REAL close ?? Down the road from Clem's, hang a left at the Whark ??
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

ArienMalfoy
08-17-2004, 01:23 PM
I'm wondering if Atrus and Catherine ever visit the place she lived in with her father. Wasn't that supposed to be only a mile or so from the Cleft?

JustBrett
08-17-2004, 01:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ZHorkmeister:
Wellllll .... my original question remains .... how " close " are Tomahna & The Cleft to each other?? REAL close ?? Down the road from Clem's, hang a left at the Whark ??<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
"Several miles" is the only figure we've been given. I would guess that means somewhere between, say, 5 and 20. Some claim that you can see the volcano far in the background of one of the Revelation screen shots of Tomahna. In any case, I would imagine Tomahna is somewhere in the mountains that you can see in the distance when you visit the Cleft in Uru.

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*SLMW 1.0* No animals were harmed in the production of this message.

ArienMalfoy
08-17-2004, 05:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JustBrett:Some claim that you can see the volcano far in the background of one of the Revelation screen shots of Tomahna.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

And can we even guarantee it's the same volcanic mountain? Where there's one, there's usually others.

Eat_My_Shortz
08-17-2004, 06:29 PM
She does say "Here in Tomahna" at the end of Uru. As if maybe Tomahna encompasses all of the area near and including the cleft.
Also in Exile at least the terrain looks a lot like the Cleft from Uru.

_______________________________________________
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ArienMalfoy
08-17-2004, 07:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Eat_My_Shortz:
She does say "Here in Tomahna" at the end of Uru.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

When did she say that? I don't remember it at all. Guess I'll have to play URU again (like I needed an excuse! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ).

Eat_My_Shortz
08-20-2004, 10:28 PM
lol.
SPOILERS!
Check out this page which contains transcripts of the speech:
http://www.dnidesk.com/yeesha_cleft_02.html
Its right near the end of her cleft speech.

Also if you want to listen to it, you don't have to replay the game. Just go back to the cleft and click the button to listen to the speech.

_______________________________________________
I touch them... and they are real... (http://plasma.cyanworlds.com)
00113229 on Tapestry
00100487 on Guild of Greeters

ArienMalfoy
08-20-2004, 11:41 PM
Cool, thanks!! It helps to have it written down in front of me. My short-term memory is pretty pathetic (though my long-term memory is very good; go figure).

MTigerV
08-25-2004, 06:11 PM
i know the whole debate about where tomahna and the clef really are will probably rage on till after were all gone...

but since were still here...

1. the first print edition of MYST: The Book of Ti'anna came with a very detailed (and beautiful) map of D'ni, the caves and a very National Geographic-ish drawing of the volcano. any geological surveyors from new mexico might recognize it
P.S. its also in the From Myst to Riven book (also a beaut) id scan a picture but the poster is framed and the books in a safe deposit vault in the bank (for a $65 book of that size its worth it)

2. any enterprising MYST fan who works at the New Mexico Department of Motor Vehicles could check the address listed with Zandi's permenant trailer licence plate. (how CYAN got NM to release their offical licence plate design into a digital medium ill never know...and DONT NOBODY GET ANY SLICK IDEAS, OK?!?)

GEAUX TIGERS!

[This message was edited by MTigerV on Wed August 25 2004 at 06:06 PM.]

Eat_My_Shortz
08-25-2004, 11:25 PM
lol - (2) I don't know why theres an issue with showing a generic NM license plate in a game. Isn't it too faded to make out some of the letters?

(1) - This has been said many times (I'm not saying you should know, I'm just stating that it has) - When they made the books, David Wingrove who wrote them got the idea somehow that it was a middle-eastern desert, even though Cyan understood it was new mexico.
Therefore the books have subtle references to a middle-eastern desert, and the game has some less subtle references (ie the license plate) to New Mexico.
We have to go by the game.

The map in Ti'ana was made by Cyan - I believe the very same map appears in Uru somewhere but I can't remember where. Apparently the volcano DOES exist somewhere in New Mexico - I saw a photo of it.

_______________________________________________
I touch them... and they are real... (http://plasma.cyanworlds.com)
113229 on Tapestry

_ Paula _
08-26-2004, 06:39 AM
Back during beta, someone did manage to get a clear shot of the license tag. Not only that, but an enterprising (no surprise) tester found the NM tag in a personal collection displayed online.

We never got the scoop on whether it was just one of those weird coincidences or not.

Since that time, I can't say as if I've really looked at the tag again to see if it's been obscured enough that you can't truly make out the number or not.

The explanation we got about the differences in the location of the cleft was that despite the fact that Rand and Robyn were listed as co-authors that basically they gave David Wingrove a story outline and he fleshed it out. Even though they probably noticed that David apparently set the area in a middle-eastern desert, it's also apparent they decided to let the matter slide.

Now, any time information released by Cyan conflicts with the book's storyline, the book's "error" is called a Wingrovism". At one point, I think some of the discrepancies were even explained as translation errors from Catherine's journals.

As far as I'm concerned though, Cyan retains the last word on the storyline.

Paula (Pa'lua in Cavern)
"I'm confused.......no wait, maybe I'm not"