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View Full Version : when your plane's on fire, YOU GET OUT!!!



Luftcaca
06-22-2004, 12:39 PM
So why oh why, after sooooo many patches, the AI still stick by its single engine fighter on fire????

you see the 190 on fire (you know where the fuel tank is) the guy is right in the middle of the fire. Prolly his flight leader will tell him to go back to base or something, but the guy will just go back to fight til it smells BBQ in his cockpit.

it makes ya realise that the AI really love its plane, how sweet, but then why the hell does the AI bail out of a plane that only lost its rudder controls???

pls Mr Maddox and other devs, make the AI BAIL OUT RIGHT AWAY from single engine fighters that are on fire, it would be more realistic, PLUS it would be a good way to prevent the AI from stealing kills from firing at a flying burning wreckage

it would be win-win isnt it?

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Formerly ''known'' as Gunther Aeroburst

Luftcaca
06-22-2004, 12:39 PM
So why oh why, after sooooo many patches, the AI still stick by its single engine fighter on fire????

you see the 190 on fire (you know where the fuel tank is) the guy is right in the middle of the fire. Prolly his flight leader will tell him to go back to base or something, but the guy will just go back to fight til it smells BBQ in his cockpit.

it makes ya realise that the AI really love its plane, how sweet, but then why the hell does the AI bail out of a plane that only lost its rudder controls???

pls Mr Maddox and other devs, make the AI BAIL OUT RIGHT AWAY from single engine fighters that are on fire, it would be more realistic, PLUS it would be a good way to prevent the AI from stealing kills from firing at a flying burning wreckage

it would be win-win isnt it?

http://www.ifrance.com/boussourir/luftcaca.jpg

Formerly ''known'' as Gunther Aeroburst

Capt._Tenneal
06-22-2004, 01:08 PM
I've also followed a burning AI plane (burning fuselage, mind you) where the pilot just sits in the cockpit for about 10 secs., enough to fry him alive, but is still able to bail out !!
Either he has fire ******ant skin or..? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

VW-IceFire
06-22-2004, 01:19 PM
Reminds me of two types of people you see online:

1) Their engine is on fire and they continue to fight and then complain when their aircraft explodes.

2) Their target (or friendlies target) is on fire and about to explode. To exacerbate the situation they fly on in with guns blazing attempting to either steal the kill or do goodness knows what and they manage to ram their target which means that they have not only ensured their targets destruction (which was sure before) but also their own.

Really amazing http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

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Luftcaca
06-22-2004, 02:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
Reminds me of two types of people you see online:

1) Their engine is on fire and they continue to fight and then complain when their aircraft explodes.

2) Their target (or friendlies target) is on fire and about to explode. To exacerbate the situation they fly on in with guns blazing attempting to either steal the kill or do goodness knows what and they manage to ram their target which means that they have not only ensured their targets destruction (which was sure before) but also their own.

Really amazing http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

lol
thats proves something
no matter how good and realistic the sim is, theres one thing that will never be simulated: the attitude of the pilot

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Formerly ''known'' as Gunther Aeroburst

JG5_UnKle
06-22-2004, 02:38 PM
OK slightly OT but....
The human piloted Bf-110G2 is a nightmare, it can burn forever http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Last night I was hit by a good burst from a P40 and both my engines set on fire.

I proceeded to drop iron and start shooting at the enemy http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif and then ran from the fight and landed safely. All the time engines on fire.....

So maybe the DM is just wierd in places anyway, and we all know AI cheat with everything else http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/10.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

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Magister__Ludi
06-22-2004, 03:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG5_UnKle:
OK slightly OT but....
The human piloted Bf-110G2 is a nightmare, it can burn forever http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Last night I was hit by a good burst from a P40 and both my engines set on fire.

I proceeded to drop iron and start shooting at the enemy http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif and then ran from the fight and landed safely. All the time engines on fire.....

So maybe the DM is just wierd in places anyway, and we all know AI cheat with everything else http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/10.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Not in my experience. Bf-110 starts to burn with just a couple of MG hits in the engine (usually far outside the range of MG) and in about 10 seconds it explodes. Believe me, I flew Bf-110 a lot from the moment it became available (though I never flew it online, my observation is about offline play.

gates123
06-22-2004, 04:52 PM
I've actually put out alot of fires by cutting the throttle and diving real quick, open up rads and head back to friendly territory. Hopefully they wont light up again, if they do its usually bail time on the 2nd flare up

http://www.flightjournal.com/images/index_photos/gunslinging.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

Luftcaca
06-22-2004, 05:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gates123:
I've actually put out alot of fires by cutting the throttle and diving real quick, open up rads and head back to friendly territory. Hopefully they wont light up again, if they do its usually bail time on the 2nd flare up


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

yes it would be cool if the AI would do this too, but at least make it do something! Bailing out right away would be a good start, and guys dont you forget, like I said, it would help to reduce the KILL STEALING

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Formerly ''known'' as Gunther Aeroburst

Bull_dog_
06-22-2004, 07:01 PM
Something weird about Fw engine fires specifically... I noticed that in most planes (off line), you get credit for a kill when you torch a plane...but not with a Fw. The Fw will continue to fly and sometimes my wingmen will even move in and steal the kill.

I could be all wrong here, but this seems to only happen with the Fw...all other planes seem to be "dead" when on fire and the AI act appropriately.

Luftcaca
06-22-2004, 07:28 PM
Hmmm I noticed that this happens with the 190 but I dont know if it happens ONLY with the 190.
I currently fly Yak 9 with the Normandie Niemen, and believe me, those 190's are tough, especially now with the new improved AI, the 190's flew by vets and aces are lethal! (thats good)

so when I manage to put one 190 on fire, well I sure dont wanna have no7 named Didier Something coming in and steal my kill SCREAMING "JOLIE TIIIIIIIIIIIIR!!!" http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

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Formerly ''known'' as Gunther Aeroburst

Vmf513_Smokey
06-22-2004, 09:47 PM
Well the single engien planes blow up and every thing when there on fire but the twin engine planes rarly if ever blow up. I fly the p38 alot and I get shot in one of both of my engiens they get on fire. Well then i just turn off the one engien on fire open my rad and dive a few hundred feet then the fire goes out. Then i go back itno the fight. But if my fire doesnt go out or it comes back on then ill just fly around and keep dogfighing with it till either someone comes and realy finishes me off or I run out of gas or bullets and have to head home. the plane just never blows up Oleg should fix that so it will ocasionaly blow up.

Harh
06-23-2004, 06:08 AM
There is one more issue about AI behavior with aircraft damage. Example: when you fly Bf110 and getting one engine on fire, AI count you dead and, therefore, no longer paying attention to you. That means, they don't chase you and bomber gunners no longer shoot at you. Such things also happens sometimes, when, for example, you have rudder teared up. You still can fly (without tight turns http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif ), but AI no longer see you.

Philipscdrw
06-23-2004, 09:12 AM
Better AI and DM and score system would be nice.

Are we all aware that there will be no major changes in the AI or DM for FB/AEP? It's too late for major work to be worthwhile, with PF and BoB around the corner.

Some parts of FB are the same since Il-2, including the AI's behaviour when critically damaged, the User Interface, the damage model, the comms model, ect. But as BoB will be built from scratch, Oleg will get these nearly perfect this time round.

Hopefully we can get small changes to FB in a patch, like getting AI to bail when burning, and bigger changes in PF, like how the AI decides what aircraft are too damaged to be worth attacking, and major changes in BoB, like the fire and crew and fuel and the interaction thereof.

PhilipsCDRw

"Nietzsche is dead." - God.

View Cpt. Eric Brown's review of FB here (http://www.aerosociety.com/raes/news/SimReview.pdf) and discuss it here. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=63110913&m=309109534&r=875101634#875101634)

Harh
06-23-2004, 10:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Philipscdrw:
Better AI and DM and score system would be nice.

Are we all aware that there will be no major changes in the AI or DM for FB/AEP? It's too late for major work to be worthwhile, with PF and BoB around the corner.

Some parts of FB are the same since Il-2, including the AI's behaviour when critically damaged, the User Interface, the damage model, the comms model, ect. But as BoB will be built from scratch, Oleg will get these nearly perfect this time round.

Hopefully we can get small changes to FB in a patch, like getting AI to bail when burning, and bigger changes in PF, like how the AI decides what aircraft are too damaged to be worth attacking, and major changes in BoB, like the fire and crew and fuel and the interaction thereof.

PhilipsCDRw
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I hope so, that BoB will get more adequate damage model, especially for the point, that it going to have enough of biplanes. Their damage model for now is... wierd. Also, maybe there will be any changes in small caliber MG damage model. It is also wierd a bit.

About "nearly perfect"... I doubt it.

Brain32
06-23-2004, 01:07 PM
Something like this would put a smile to my face:
When you hit a plane with one 30mm+ it shoud go down!!!
2-3 20mm's should do the yob as well.
2nd WW planes werent made of titan and kevlar (as much as I know)!!!

PBNA-Boosher
06-23-2004, 07:00 PM
Not always. It depends where you are and your situation. Remember, bailing out is always a last resort. It is the pilot's job to not only shoot down enemy aircraft, but to keep his/hers intact as best they can. You should always try means of putting out the fire however necessary when you have one, instead of bailing. Diving at high speed works a lot of the time, and if you're low enough, you could just belly land and then run. True, it's unnerving to have to sit there in a burning plane, but if that plane is lost, that's one less plane that can help the cause, which can mean that the next day, 2000 lbs. of bombs might not be able to be dropped on a strategic target. Sometimes pilots were given small bonuses for keeping their aircraft intact. Medals, extra money, (not to mention they weren't dead.) Bailing had its problems. Many, many pilots were injured while they bailed out by their body smacking into their falling planes! During the Great Patriotic War in Russia, the women of the 588th NBAP/46th GvNBAP were not supplied with parachutes until 1944! They had no choice but to keep the plane flying until they got down! And their planes, the Po-2/U-2VS, according to Nadya Popova, "were easily caught on fire by as little as a tracer bullet!"

Luftcaca
06-23-2004, 07:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PBNA-Boosher:
Not always. It depends where you are and your situation. Remember, bailing out is always a last resort. It is the pilot's job to not only shoot down enemy aircraft, but to keep his/hers intact as best they can. You should always try means of putting out the fire however necessary when you have one, instead of bailing. Diving at high speed works a lot of the time, and if you're low enough, you could just belly land and then run. True, it's unnerving to have to sit there in a burning plane, but if that plane is lost, that's one less plane that can help the cause, which can mean that the next day, 2000 lbs. of bombs might not be able to be dropped on a strategic target. Sometimes pilots were given small bonuses for keeping their aircraft intact. Medals, extra money, (not to mention they weren't dead.) Bailing had its problems. Many, many pilots were injured while they bailed out by their body smacking into their falling planes! During the Great Patriotic War in Russia, the women of the 588th NBAP/46th GvNBAP were not supplied with parachutes until 1944! They had no choice but to keep the plane flying until they got down! And their planes, the Po-2/U-2VS, according to Nadya Popova, "were easily caught on fire by as little as a tracer bullet!"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

interesting, but still
Admiting that EVERY AI pilot in Il2/FB/AEP is equipped with a parachute, then staying in the burning plane WITHOUT trying to extinguish the fire would not even be a solution, then better make em Bail out then nothing isnt it?

and you talk about some pilots not even being equipped with a parachute til 44? is that modeled in FB? No, then make em bail out!
Early Polykarpovs werent equipped witha radio? No but still in the game every single plane has a radio

http://www.ifrance.com/boussourir/luftcaca.jpg

Formerly ''known'' as Gunther Aeroburst