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XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 12:37 AM
Just saw the P80 in the dev update... lookin good

Now all we need to complete the plane set from SWOTL is a DO335 http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Considering we are gettin on the CD:
P38
P80
P51B
GO229
ME163

SWOTL, I loved that game, almost as much as FB http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"Culpam Poena Premit Comes"

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 12:37 AM
Just saw the P80 in the dev update... lookin good

Now all we need to complete the plane set from SWOTL is a DO335 http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Considering we are gettin on the CD:
P38
P80
P51B
GO229
ME163

SWOTL, I loved that game, almost as much as FB http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"Culpam Poena Premit Comes"

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 01:13 AM
Pffft. A very transparent concession to Allied-leaning pilots whose only reason to have it in the planeset is because, "Well, the Germans have a jet....and the Russians have a rocket. I want a jetplane too..."

Would be better to take both the "neverflew in WWII" P80 and the "drawing board" Bi-1 and throw 'em BOTH in the ashcan. Then weigh 'em down with (all 6) MiG-3Us.

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XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 01:20 AM
hahaha http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

yeah maybe, but life is pretty Straight without twisties http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"Culpam Poena Premit Comes"

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 02:04 AM
Stiglr wrote:
- Pffft. A very transparent concession to
- Allied-leaning pilots whose only reason to have it
- in the planeset is because, "Well, the Germans have
- a jet....and the Russians have a rocket. I want a
- jetplane too..."
-
- Would be better to take both the "neverflew in WWII"
- P80 and the "drawing board" Bi-1 and throw 'em BOTH
- in the ashcan. Then weigh 'em down with (all 6)
- MiG-3Us.

Nah,I have to disagree. Oleg has said he would include planes up to 1947,so it'd be possible to have "what-if" situations where WWII didn't end in 1945. By your logic,the Go-229,He-162,and Do-335(Gib's doing it,Rugame./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif ) should be scrapped as well. None of 'em saw combat and saw little flying time. Personally,as far as jets go,I think someone should do the Meteor or Vampire.

<center>47|FC <img src="http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg"<

Message Edited on 12/05/03 07:31PM by necrobaron

Message Edited on 12/05/0307:32PM by necrobaron

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 03:03 AM
Stiglr wrote:
- Pffft. A very transparent concession to
- Allied-leaning pilots whose only reason to have it
- in the planeset is because, "Well, the Germans have
- a jet....and the Russians have a rocket. I want a
- jetplane too..."
-
- Would be better to take both the "neverflew in WWII"
- P80 and the "drawing board" Bi-1 and throw 'em BOTH
- in the ashcan. Then weigh 'em down with (all 6)
- MiG-3Us.
-
- http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


And top it off with the never flew Bf-109Z and the flew once and crashed Go-229.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/chimpy_2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 03:22 AM
Dang, I thought it was cause Gibbage made the thing, totally missed this conspiracy.

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 03:32 AM
Jets are for kids.

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg


Oh yeah, I'm a P-63 whiner too! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 04:18 AM
And brains are for grown ups...

Yet we dont question your existance

"Culpam Poena Premit Comes"

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 04:48 AM
i cant wait for the addon.........the more planes the better!!!!!! expecially if they are Luft-46 they look great and would be great to fly

HONK HONK HONK - TheGoose

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 06:16 AM
yep. there will be some maqjor oWnAgE on the Me-262 when the p-80 comes to town /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 07:01 AM
http://www.aviation-history.com/dehavilland/mosquito.html

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 10:18 AM
Stiglr ..... this game was NEVER limited to planes that were production A/C

re: BI-1
re: MIG-3U


the P-80 flew in europe during WW2

it was a WW2 developed & produced A/C

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 11:37 AM
Don't worry about the Stig's ragging, he only wants to see EF a/c./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif It hasn't dawned on him that this is the best prop flight sim on the market with the potention to have all WW2 theatres included.


http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.gif



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 12:11 PM
Is that an El Diablo, Milo?

Sweet bike /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

<center>

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Omega drivers for the people!

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 05:34 PM
Korolov wrote:
- Jets are for kids.

Uh-huh I agree with you! I bet that in realistic setting in jet planes may have short lifespan on kids. LOL

Sheesh, I hate to admit as don't want sound like I am kid but I would like to see Ta-183 into FB for just challenge to fly it.

We should know that He-162 Volksjaeger is so dangerous to fly as not suitable for Youth. Are we up for challenge to fly it 25 time without crash it in realistic setting?

Regards
SnowLeopard

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 05:45 PM
need that 1000mph british jet /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
that got canceled/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

whineingu /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 06:44 PM
I think the He-162 should be added, But not the Do-335 & the Go-229,

How about

Arado Ar-234 Jet bomber
He-177
He-219 (i know it was a night fighter but at least it actually saw combat)
Do-217
Fw-200 (more anti-shipping missions)

+

any flyable Russian bomber would be nice

"An attack against a unit of Flying Fortresses was something like controlled suicide...Sometimes 50, Sometimes 80 machine guns were firing at you... You attempted to close your eyes & continue to fire, Frightened to death, Frightened to death."

Oberst Johannes Steinhoff (176 kills)

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 07:57 PM
Skychimp wrote:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>And top it off with the never flew Bf-109Z and the flew once and crashed Go-229.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Right you are, Chimp. Get rid of all the novelty crap.

I don't so much mind the "other theatre" planes, now that they have maps to go with them....

but the addition of "once-offs" was just a bad move, and set a terrible precedence. The 3U was clearly stuffed into the game to give VVS flyers a "big 'ol gun" (I mean come on, the other more representative MiG-3s were "added on" in later revisions!!), and there was, and never will be, any excuse or reason for the Bi-1. A waste of time, effort and damaged the "simulation credibility" of the sim.

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XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 09:19 PM
Well, just a personal Choice, but I would rather have early WAR Biplanes and monoplanes instead of Buck Rogers over the Eastern Front, but Stiglr you may want to upgrade your system before whining about the sim's credibility. Although, I will admit, the BI~1 fits in as well as that 1GB DDR there. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif But perhaps not....

About 60 BI~1s constructed were destroyed in a factory fire. And the BI~1 is the only way we can get retractable skis on a winter map. Who knows, they could have been developed into a reconnasaince rocket plane, towed near the front by Pe~2 and releaced. And the Ar~234 really did give Luftwaffe perfect freedom to spy over "allied" ground forces.

Wish they made some Yaks with skis. That would be Awsum!

XyZspineZyX
12-06-2003, 10:34 PM
I may say something that might sound odd coming from me, but at this stage I only dislike the addition of the 109Z, which isn't just an exotic, but a project.

This sim has multiple levels of game play and in the end a "balanced plane set" (multi-)play enviorment works, even with exotic types.

If you don't like exotics, look for a server that shares your views or if that fails, host your own game.

Now I have finally learned to trust Oleg, not blindly, but based on the line of develepment and his remarks about the modeling of these rare warbirds.

A Go229 which has serious design issues, Me262s with sensitive engines etc. Why not throw in a YP-80, or even Yak-15...would be a great early jet, what if, together with the last of the piston engine fighters. Realistic 1945-46 a/c could be great fun in a "realistic" set up.

But in the end I hope that for any exotic there are at least 3-4 general workhorses of WW2.

Can't wait to light that Me163B >/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Ruy "SPADES" Horta
http://www.xs4all.nl/~rhorta
-----------------------------
Il-2 - VEF JG 77
-----------------------------
'95-02 - WB Jagdgeschwader 53
'99-00 - DoA Jagdstaffel 18
-----------------------------
The rest is history...

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XyZspineZyX
12-07-2003, 07:17 AM
The P-80 allows you to build a realistic Korean Scenario versus Red WW2 VVS aircraft used by the North Koreans,

We only host historical servers not arcade games

XyZspineZyX
12-07-2003, 09:50 AM
Pay no attention to Stiglr.

We at the "flame pit" of SimHQ (yeah right) and players at Hyperlobby know about this little prat. Suffice to say (in Harry Potter terms) that Stiglr is a "pure-blood" who feels that interacting with so-called "Muggles" (in this case, non-EF a/c) is the height of disgrace toward this sim.

But get him in a game online and get on his six. Go ahead, do it...and then shoot him down (please).

"You should have disengaged. It was lag that got you on my six."

Don't deny it Stiggie...

Oh and don't get me started on his "full real" diatribes.

/i/smilies/16x16_man-very-happy.gif

But as for me and the P-80, I say BRING IT ON!
(as I do with all new a/c...and so should you! the designers are working for free, after all!)

--------------------
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XyZspineZyX
12-08-2003, 02:04 AM
Why are you asking someone else to get on my 6 and shoot me down, Goodwood? Can't do it yourself, I imagine. Unless you have AI robogunners to do your work for ya.

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XyZspineZyX
12-08-2003, 04:49 AM
/me votes for every one of those drawing-board German planes that I saw on the Discovery channel. o.o

>>K =D

XyZspineZyX
12-08-2003, 06:39 AM
KcDohl wrote:
- /me votes for every one of those drawing-board
- German planes that I saw on the Discovery channel.
- o.o
-
- >>K =D
-
-

The problem with planes that never got off the drawing board is how to accurately portray performance under various conditions, How would those planes perform at extreme high altitude or low altitude, Those kinds of questions have to be answered before you put them into a flight sim, Otherwise you get a possible super plane or a lead balloon.

"An attack against a unit of Flying Fortresses was something like controlled suicide...Sometimes 50, Sometimes 80 machine guns were firing at you... You attempted to close your eyes & continue to fire, Frightened to death, Frightened to death."

Oberst Johannes Steinhoff (176 kills)

XyZspineZyX
12-08-2003, 08:06 AM
As fas as the He162 is concerned it flew and saw action in ww2 I think htere's at least one confirmed kill for it and several losses to enemy action so it did saw some use during the closing stages of the war.

And the Do335 was formed in a staffel strength if I'm not mistaken to defend the dornier factory.

As far as the P-80 is concerned this first Gen US aircraft compared to its contemporaries had many things to envy the Meteor and Me-262 especially in the speed departed it was not much faster than a P-51 was.

Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one wing"

"Kurt Tank is your daddy"

XyZspineZyX
12-08-2003, 08:21 AM
There's conflicting reports that an He-162 might've shot down a Typhoon(or was it a Tempest?),but there has been no proof of this.

<center>47|FC <img src="http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg"<

XyZspineZyX
12-08-2003, 08:25 PM
Like I said it's not certain whether or not is has a victory but it does have losses to enemy action in the air. I think one of the Staffeln of JG301 was equipped with the Volksjager

Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one wing"

"Kurt Tank is your daddy"

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 12:01 AM
Glassess wrote:

- As far as the P-80 is concerned this first Gen US
- aircraft compared to its contemporaries had many
- things to envy the Meteor and Me-262 especially in
- the speed departed it was not much faster than a
- P-51 was.


I don't understand what you are trying to say here. Are you suggesting the P-80 wasn't much faster than the P-51?

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/chimpy_2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 12:08 AM
Yes , though it's not a suggestion that's the fact jack. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one wing"

"Kurt Tank is your daddy"

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 12:41 AM
Glassess wrote:
- Yes , though it's not a suggestion that's the fact
- jack.

We're talking the Lockheed P-80 Shooting Star here, correct? You're not confusing it with the Bell P-59 Airacomet are you? If not, what do you base that assertion on what?

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/chimpy_2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 01:11 AM
Glassess wrote:
- Like I said it's not certain whether or not is has a
- victory but it does have losses to enemy action in
- the air. I think one of the Staffeln of JG301 was
- equipped with the Volksjager
-
-

The He162 was operational with I./JG1 at Leck but were basically without fuel. There is also reports of He162s in Czechoslovakia.



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"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 06:22 AM
Thanks Milo, I base my reports on the evaluation of post war Me-262s by the US were they were said to be astonished as to the performance of the 262 comapred to their P-80. It was more a show of what they were developing so they brought those P-80s to Italy to say "look here boys we have a jet too" though by that late stage it was over. The Meteor would have been a contender to the 262 than the Shooting Star.

Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one wing"

"Kurt Tank is your daddy"

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 06:34 AM
Glassess wrote:
- The Meteor would have
- been a contender to the 262 than the Shooting Star.
-
-

Only in that it(Meteor) fired its guns in anger. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


http://www.f1boat.com/03/images/start.jpg



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 04:46 PM
According to this website http://www.aviation-history.com/lockheed/p80.html the P-80A could do 898kph at sea level and 792kph at 12192 meters. Its not a slow aircraft by any stretch of the imagination. I've been told that the Me-262 was faster by some 50kph but I can't find a reliable source for the speed of the Me-262 (maybe someone else can provide).

The Meteor was slower than both of them but definately had the middle ground for firepower (the Me262 maybe having too much for downing a single fighter and the P-80 having the least amount of firepower).

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"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." - Winston Churchill

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 05:50 PM
the meteor would have been a hell of alot better if it wasnt for the bloody politcs of the English goventment at that time /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif , we would of had a jet fighter before the Battle of Britain broke out if it wasnt for the Govt and Brass of the RAF being complete tits /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 06:04 PM
not to mention i put the AI he 162 in my DF server, and man is that thing fast... but handles like poopooo

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 08:26 PM
JG26_Red wrote:
- not to mention i put the AI he 162 in my DF server,
- and man is that thing fast... but handles like
- poopooo


Yeah,I heard the placement of the engine on the Volksjaeger caused stability problems,so what you experienced might not be so inaccurate. Nevertheless,I can't wait to fly her./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


As long as we're talking about WWII-era jets,was the Vampire any good? I've never heard much about that one.

<center>47|FC <img src="http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg"<

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 09:40 PM
The Vampire served in 26 AFs so had to be a descent a/c. This will get you stared.

http://www.vflintham.demon.co.uk/aircraft/vampire/vampire.htm

There was also the Vampire's sibling, the Venom.



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"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-09-2003, 10:30 PM
the real daddy woulda been the 1000mph jet the brits where devloping, that got canceled for no reason. no one knows why /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif
and yes it would of done 1000mpg, a 1/2 scale model of it passed the sound barrier easily. americans copied it for the X1 :\

i image it would rather deadly, being able to pass the sound barrier at will n all /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


whineingu /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 12:14 AM
Thanks Milo./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<center>47|FC <img src="http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg"<

XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 04:01 AM
Glassess wrote:
- Thanks Milo, I base my reports on the evaluation of
- post war Me-262s by the US were they were said to be
- astonished as to the performance of the 262 comapred
- to their P-80. It was more a show of what they were
- developing so they brought those P-80s to Italy to
- say "look here boys we have a jet too" though by
- that late stage it was over. The Meteor would have
- been a contender to the 262 than the Shooting Star.
-
-
-
- Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one
- wing"
-
- "Kurt Tank is your daddy"

In my research on the subject, I found references to as many as five different direct comparisons between the P-80 and the Me-262. The result of two were clearly favorable to the P-80. The results of two are unknown to me. But the one that seems to get the most "air time" by fans of the the Me-262 was a comparison between the Me-262 with no armament and the XP-80 - a portion of which is referenced in the the 4th volume of "Me-262". It's worth noting that the XP-80 was a dimensionally smaller plane than the YP-80A or P-80A. In addition, it had an engine with 1,000 lbs less thrust. And based on this one comparison, sweeping declarations of Me-262 superiority are made.

However, a comparision between production planes stats will show the YP-80A was superior in almost every performance respect to the Me-262.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/chimpy_2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 05:22 AM
I dont mind the new plane set at all. In fact i hope they put a Mig in there too by the time the last add on comes out. That was jet combat in prop style... before you had the total fly by wire stuff. Sweet... Hey man.... I would take the Wright Flyer if it was in here i dont care..this sim is just great and any addition is welcome to me.

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XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 03:32 PM
Now that we have the other jets a Meteor would be a nice addition as well...I always liked its looks over the Vampire anyways. There's hope perhaps for having one...but it depends on third party modelers.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/temp_sig.jpg
"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." - Winston Churchill

XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 03:55 PM
Bearcat99 wrote:
- I dont mind the new plane set at all. In fact i hope
- they put a Mig in there too by the time the last add
- on comes out. That was jet combat in prop style...
- before you had the total fly by wire stuff. Sweet...
- Hey man.... I would take the Wright Flyer if it was
- in here i dont care..this sim is just great and any
- addition is welcome to me.
-
-

If it was a Mig it would have to be MiG-9, though the MiG-15 just makes into the 1947 cut-off./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.ctrl-c.liu.se/misc/ram/mig9_1.jpg

http://www.ctrl-c.liu.se/misc/ram/mig-9-2.jpg


The other a/c would be the Yak-15 which had its acceptence testing completed in May 1947.

http://www.ctrl-c.liu.se/misc/ram/yak15yak.jpg

http://www.ctrl-c.liu.se/misc/ram/yak-15-sh2p324b.jpg


Then there is the Sukhoi imitation of the Me262, the SU-9.



http://www.f1boat.com/03/images/start.jpg



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 05:29 PM
As Milo's pictures suggest neither Yakovlev nor Mikoyan-Gurevich seemed to be able fancying different tail constructions.

Resemble FB Yaks and MiG 3s.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 07:07 PM
IMO I think the He 162 will perform better than the verdict given to it by history. From the data I compliled and sent to Oleg, it seems that it was potent aircraft whose main weakness was the high sensetivity of its control surfaces. As Eric Brown notedm in his book, the lateral stability problems were solved, visibility was excellent, and it had very good firepower. Of course, given the state of the Luftwaffe in 1945, it's almost certain that the Spatz would've had high loss rates, due to so many rookie pilots filling the ranks of the Jadgeschwadern.

As for its combat record, it is known that two units (1./JG1 and 3./JG1) flew the aircraft. In addition, it saw combat both in the West near Leck and in the East in Poland. VVS ace Khozedub recalls seeing He 162's attacking IL-2's, and he himself was credited with shooting down one He 162 (it was erroneously reported as an Me 262; the combat report he filed stated he shot down, more or less, "a jet fighter with an engine above its fuselage"). Plus, there are several photos that show captured He 162's being tested after the war by the Soviets.

...and, lest I forget, there is also the story of the VVS ace who sat in the cockpit of a 162 and accidentally launched the ejection seat. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif He would have to spend several months in a hospital to pay for his mistake.

I/JG54^Lukas
He 162 A-2 Cockpit Modeler

Message Edited on 12/10/03 07:10PM by JG54_Lukas

Message Edited on 12/10/0306:10PM by JG54_Lukas

XyZspineZyX
12-10-2003, 11:30 PM
As far as the Meteor is concerned it did fire shots in anger maiunly ground attack over Belgium after retreating German forces. It did not encounter Me262s because most if not all were being tasked to Reichsverteidigung duties. The P-80 performance circa end of the war were inflated to do just that inflate the moral of the combat crews that were being mauled by the Schwalbe saying lookie here we got a jet too that can compete with theirs. Simply put if the P-80s were put sure I bet they would have had success especially if introduced in numbers,since this is America's greatest asset during the war . But in equal terms it would have been gone square out to the 262, one burst one carcass. I'm not saying it wouldn't have been a competent fighter but the 262s at least would have been faster than the 1st gen Shooting Star.

Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one wing"

"Kurt Tank is your daddy"

XyZspineZyX
12-11-2003, 12:12 AM
JG54_Lukas wrote:
- IMO I think the He 162 will perform better than the
- verdict given to it by history. From the data I
- compliled and sent to Oleg, it seems that it was
- potent aircraft whose main weakness was the high
- sensetivity of its control surfaces. As Eric Brown
- notedm in his book, the lateral stability problems
- were solved, visibility was excellent, and it had
- very good firepower. Of course, given the state of
- the Luftwaffe in 1945, it's almost certain that the
- Spatz would've had high loss rates, due to so many
- rookie pilots filling the ranks of the
- Jadgeschwadern.
-
- As for its combat record, it is known that two units
- (1./JG1 and 3./JG1) flew the aircraft. In addition,
- it saw combat both in the West near Leck and in the
- East in Poland. VVS ace Khozedub recalls seeing He
- 162's attacking IL-2's, and he himself was credited
- with shooting down one He 162 (it was erroneously
- reported as an Me 262; the combat report he filed
- stated he shot down, more or less, "a jet fighter
- with an engine above its fuselage"). Plus, there are
- several photos that show captured He 162's being
- tested after the war by the Soviets.
-
- ...and, lest I forget, there is also the story of
- the VVS ace who sat in the cockpit of a 162 and
- accidentally launched the ejection seat. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif He would have to spend several
- months in a hospital to pay for his mistake.

Interesting, thanks for the info and thanks for the FB He-162./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<center>47|FC <img src="http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg"<

XyZspineZyX
12-11-2003, 01:48 AM
Glassess wrote:
- As far as the Meteor is concerned it did fire shots
- in anger maiunly ground attack over Belgium after
- retreating German forces. It did not encounter
- Me262s because most if not all were being tasked to
- Reichsverteidigung duties. The P-80 performance
- circa end of the war were inflated to do just that
- inflate the moral of the combat crews that were
- being mauled by the Schwalbe saying lookie here we
- got a jet too that can compete with theirs. Simply
- put if the P-80s were put sure I bet they would have
- had success especially if introduced in
- numbers,since this is America's greatest asset
- during the war . But in equal terms it would have
- been gone square out to the 262, one burst one
- carcass. I'm not saying it wouldn't have been a
- competent fighter but the 262s at least would have
- been faster than the 1st gen Shooting Star.

I guess I don't understand why you think this. Here is a comparison between the Me-262 and the "1st generation" Shooting Star, the P-80A (YP-80A had the same specs).

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/comparison.JPG


BTW, this chart was compiled by a German author, in the event it would otherwise be considered "biased."





Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/chimpy_2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
12-11-2003, 07:06 AM
Amazing numbers for lo alt speed but doesn't say much for high speed at high alt though I see the 262 has some 6kmh more in cruise. I suspect at lo altitude it would have been competitive but at hih alt the 262 would have fared better.

Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one wing"

"Kurt Tank is your daddy"

XyZspineZyX
12-11-2003, 08:27 AM
Kind of hard to "Schwalbe" isn't it?


http://forums.ubi.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif





"We will welcome them with bullets and shoes."

XyZspineZyX
12-11-2003, 01:48 PM
Glassess wrote:
- Amazing numbers for lo alt speed but doesn't say
- much for high speed at high alt though I see the 262
- has some 6kmh more in cruise. I suspect at lo
- altitude it would have been competitive but at hih
- alt the 262 would have fared better.
-
-

Yes that is correct, slightly slower, BUT at an altitude 3000m higher. (6000m compared to 9000m)

At 9000m the 262 was ~10kph faster than what it was at SL. (taken off a original Messeschmitt AG max speed graph) This graph has SL speed as seen in SC's post.


http://www.f1boat.com/03/images/start.jpg



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-11-2003, 07:17 PM
i have look up other pages and see a bunch of confilicting speeds on these planes... i see some for 262 in 835-880kph area, this is for the A1 fighter

i have seen P80 speeds from 850 to 965kph??? diff versions for p80 here???

XyZspineZyX
12-12-2003, 01:13 AM
Glassess wrote:
- Amazing numbers for lo alt speed but doesn't say
- much for high speed at high alt though I see the 262
- has some 6kmh more in cruise. I suspect at lo
- altitude it would have been competitive but at hih
- alt the 262 would have fared better.

As Milo pointed out, the P-80A's cruise speed was at 9,000 meters, the Me-262's was at 6,000 meters.

Additionally, the P-80A had a ceiling that was some 8,000 feet higher than the Me-262.



JG26_Red wrote:
- i have look up other pages and see a bunch of
- confilicting speeds on these planes... i see some
- for 262 in 835-880kph area, this is for the A1 fighter
- i have seen P80 speeds from 850 to 965kph??? diff
- versions for p80 here???

With regards to the P-80, its important to know which model you are looking at. Slowest of all was the XP-80, which was dimmensionally smaller and had a far less powerful engine than the (Y)P-80A.

The P-80A in the chart above was the model that went into production before the end of the war in the ETO. After a few hundred P-80As had rolled off, the engine was upgraded along with speed and general performance. Comparison to that P-80A would have shown an even wider performance gap between it and the Me-262.

The YP-80A we are getting in FB in the pay add-on should perform in a manner identical to the P-80A in the chart, since they were substantially the same plane.




Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/chimpy_2.jpg