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SleazySaint
06-25-2004, 04:26 PM
Hello, I just bought the gold pack of IL2:FB. Having come from Battlefield 1942, I am very new to accurate flight sims. And one thing that has especially confused me is flaps.

What is the difference between raised flaps and combat flaps? Is the difference important in preventing stalls? And do you even need takeoff flaps to take off?

Thanks in advance

SleazySaint
06-25-2004, 04:26 PM
Hello, I just bought the gold pack of IL2:FB. Having come from Battlefield 1942, I am very new to accurate flight sims. And one thing that has especially confused me is flaps.

What is the difference between raised flaps and combat flaps? Is the difference important in preventing stalls? And do you even need takeoff flaps to take off?

Thanks in advance

F19_Gazoo
06-25-2004, 04:35 PM
Well, I use combatflaps sometimes when in a turnfight. You don´t stall that easy when you have them on, but you loose speed.
Takeoff-flaps is used when takingoff (obviously!) and landingflaps when landing(again, obvious!). I find easier to take off and land when using them, but it´s not necesary when youtake off with low fuel. Try it out!

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Shifty101
06-25-2004, 05:35 PM
I only use take-off flaps when I am lifting off with a heavy load, be it 75-100% fuel or a bombload. I havn't been able to effectively learn how to use combat flaps so I barely use them at all. I'm sure someone will be along shortly with a wealth of knowledge.

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KGr.HH-Sunburst
06-25-2004, 05:50 PM
flaps is the magic key in a slow turning fight
for example 109 , if you use them you can make very high angles for a short time to get that 1 sec deflection shot to kill the enemy
but stay out of turn fights in a 109 if you dont need to ,when facing a equal or worse turning plane just go for it and use those flaps

and when slow in a turn fight dont be afraid to use full flaps to get a shot at your enemy
but make sure you have a slight speed/E advantage to recover

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Chuck_Older
06-25-2004, 06:06 PM
Flaps are a misunderstood thing


For one thing, "Combat flaps" is completely misleading.

Flaps are deployed in degrees typically, like 5*, 10* or 15*. In some US and other planes, a small amount of flaps was termed "combat" flaps. often it was termed as "sneaking in" a "notch or two" of flap.

Flaps change the shape of the wing and do two things primarily: generate more lift, and cause drag

In my opinion, flaps should be thought of as a lift genrating device first, and an aid to combat as a bonus. Do you have a heavy take-off load? better use flaps. Want a nice slow, high angle approach for landing? better use flaps.

Combat flaps were not just deployed when entering combat. In some situations you don't want flaps deployed in combat, like when you want speed.

In FB, typically if you drop combat flaps breifly and then retract them, it is better than just leaving them on all through a manuever

In real life, 5* (typically what is thought of as "combat" flaps) was not the only flap setting used in combat, as well. I myself routinely use two 'notches' of flap position in FB, especially in vertical manuevers in which I intentionally stall. Just remember to retract them before you dive, or they will jam.

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Bearcat99
06-25-2004, 08:38 PM
The key to using flaps in combat is timing. If tyou keep them deployed for too long they will slow you down or get jammed depending on how fast you are going. Just a touch at the beginning of a turn to give you that added lift to get into the turn.. then raise them so you can keep your speed up.. but its all timing.. Im talking seconds.

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heywooood
06-25-2004, 10:08 PM
Chuck Older - I wanted to say this for a long time...We need FLAPS ON A SLIDER !!!ahahahahaha

you are correct absolutely and I have been tolerating it until now but the flaps settings should be by degree not 'combat' 'take-off' and 'landing' - it is a terrible concession to gamers vs simmers... but whatever.

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HART_dreyer
06-25-2004, 10:24 PM
Well the labels for the varying degree's of flaps does serve a certain purpose. Nobody would use flaps higher than "combat" in combat (not in a LW aircraft at least, possibly in very rare situations), so thus the name fits in well.

Combat flaps do not jam btw, ever.

Take-off flaps is redundant with fighter aircraft without bombs or any other load.

Landing flaps is very useful for, ba da bam, landings.

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wayno7777
06-25-2004, 10:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by heywooood:
Chuck Older - I wanted to say this for a long time...We need FLAPS ON A SLIDER !!!ahahahahaha

you are correct absolutely and I have been tolerating it until now but the flaps settings should be by degree not 'combat' 'take-off' and 'landing' - it is a terrible concession to gamers vs simmers... but whatever.

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<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bump.Every plane I've ever seen had a wheel or lever to adjust flaps.

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heywooood
06-25-2004, 10:39 PM
exactly wayno - and I personally dont want to wait for BoB to be able to set flaps properly- but one does what one must I 'spose.

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horseback
06-25-2004, 10:41 PM
Saint-

First, let's make sure you know what flaps are. They are the control surfaces located on the wing between the fuselage and the aileron on the trailing edge. They only lower, and in some cases, are either up (retracted) or down in landing position. In most cases, though, you have the choice of combat, takeoff, and landing positions, landing being the lowest and combat being the highest without being fully retracted.

Lowering the flaps increase your wing area, and therefore lift. This allows you to turn tighter or climb faster at a given speed. However, they also increase drag, which limits your speed. Retracted, your wing is 'clean', and allows you to reach your best speed.

Most aircraft have a speed above which deploying your flaps leads to Bad Things. The best of these is jammed flaps, meaning that you can't retract them, and limiting you to 'easy meat' speeds. At really high speeds, they can tear off, or one can jam and one retract, which can be really unpleasant.

hope this helps

cheers

horseback

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Tully__
06-25-2004, 11:40 PM
You may find Andy Bush's article (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_002a.html) on flaps at SimHQ's Air Combat Library to be helpful.

As for takeoff, you wont need flaps most of the time except on very short strips or at maximum load. You can use them if you prefer, but they aren't necessary.

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FI.Spitsfire
06-26-2004, 08:08 AM
Quick note:
I used to have a M$ Sidewinder wheel,
I used to use my flaps on a pedal(You couldent use it as rudderhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif), you could ajust them perfectly http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I had the brakes on the other, and used my stick and throttle as normal.
Then I tidyed the desk area and didnt really have the space for it anymorehttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

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GT182
06-26-2004, 12:32 PM
There are some a/c in Forgotten Battles that do not have combat or takeoff flaps... only flaps for landing. Like in the Spits, so do not try using them for "Combat". http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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LStarosta
06-26-2004, 12:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GT182:
There are some a/c in Forgotten Battles that do not have combat or takeoff flaps... only flaps for landing. Like in the Spits, so do not try using them for "Combat". http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

"GT182" / "Stab/JG51_vonSpinmeister"
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"Fly to Survive, Survive to Fly"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's a bunch of bullcrap. I use flaps in the Spit and Hurris ALL the time in combat situations. You just gotta learn how to use flaps like that.

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heywooood
06-26-2004, 03:22 PM
well 'loadacrap' is a bit stern but... if you toggle flaps down-up whilst turning - you get a better turn rate in the Spits and Hurri's.

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