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Dirous
01-22-2004, 06:09 AM
Hallo everybody,
I like IL2 FB very much but I think that there is something that is not real.
I prefer flying Bf 109s. In reality Luftwaffe fighter pilots on the easy front used hit and run tacticts very frequently.
In FB it is not possible. It is very easy to force AI Bf 109s pilots to start dog fighting and horizontal manoeuvres.
In this position it is easier for VVS figters to destroy them (esspecially Bf109 contra I16 or I 153).
What about to add different modes for air attacks into updates?
Sorry for my poor English.
Have a good day.

Dirous
01-22-2004, 06:09 AM
Hallo everybody,
I like IL2 FB very much but I think that there is something that is not real.
I prefer flying Bf 109s. In reality Luftwaffe fighter pilots on the easy front used hit and run tacticts very frequently.
In FB it is not possible. It is very easy to force AI Bf 109s pilots to start dog fighting and horizontal manoeuvres.
In this position it is easier for VVS figters to destroy them (esspecially Bf109 contra I16 or I 153).
What about to add different modes for air attacks into updates?
Sorry for my poor English.
Have a good day.

XyZspineZyX
01-22-2004, 10:34 AM
It is *completely* possible to do this in FB.

It's not *easy*, but it is possible.

The key is to use mostly VERTICAL maneuvers, avoiding turning (even though most 109 models are capable, if not great turners).

You should learn how to do a shallow climb extention, which is the proper way to do the "run" portion of hit and run. Too many people use energy-burning, steep climbs after a gunpass, which can mean disaster if you've underestimated your target's energy state, and haven't damaged him with your gunpass. He *may* be able to follow you for a short time, long enough to singe your tail feathers.

However, there isn't much he can do about a shallow extention, because that is done without a lot of energy loss, and the distance increases faster than with a steep recovery.

====================================
The AI is a different story. I agree that they don't have the full bag of LW tricks programmed in, and that plays to the Russian advantage.

blabla0001
01-22-2004, 02:43 PM
Not easy to do B&Z attacks?

I find it a lot easier because you almost never have to watch your six, leaving me a lot more relaxed.

I even started to use B&Z attacks with some allied planes like the LA5FN/LA7, P-47/P-51 and the Hurricane IIc is also pretty good as a B&Z aircraft.

I cannot wait for the Tempest V for it's good high speed handeling and awsome zoom climb not to forget the kick butt 4x20mm Hispano's.

Muhahahahaha!!

blabla0001
01-22-2004, 02:46 PM
@ Dirous:

The current AI cannot counter B&Z attacks so against the AI it's very easy to pick them off one by one with B&Z attacks.

Sometimes I can even pick of 2 in one B&Z attack.

Dirous
01-23-2004, 02:19 AM
For me it is not difficult to use B&Z tactics, but for AI it is almost impossible.
Especially beginning of Barbarosa operation is not real at all. I16 and I153 are causing to IA Bf109 heavy loses, but this fighters are technologically inferior. ( esspecially Bf 109F vs. I16 and I153).
During 1 week I lost whole staffel.
On the other hand when I fly I16 or I 153, it is no problem to shot down 3 or more Bf109 during one mission.
If this kill ration was in reality, LF would be without aircrafts in 1 month.

BBB_Hyperion
01-23-2004, 02:45 AM
I agree partly on this. But Emil and I16 are not that far apart in performance. What i dont like is the AI dont use strengths in the Planes. Why for example a flight of Emils engage a group of i16 without alt advantage ? . Or why all Planes head after 1 target only and are not concerned about the tactical situation.

But there are also surprising moments for good ai. For example in a dcg mission a 109 did use a spiral climb to get away from my il2 and was
successfull with it. But then it followed me down to 50 m and was slow on speed so brought itself from a tactical good move to bad position. The AI seems however improved since latest patch. Lost only 1 plane in collision yet.

Regards,
Hyperion

Dirous
01-23-2004, 05:54 AM
Hallo BBB_Hyperion
I am so delighted that anybody is interested in air war tactics. I have the same opinion like you about AI tactics.
What do you think about a idea to give a commander different tactics options ( do you remember UFO1 - safe or risky way of intercept, safe way=less kills and lower self losses ).
Player as commander can choose the best tactics options according to opponents.
Enjoy this weekend.