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View Full Version : is it posible to cause a freeze on purpose when you are about to be shooted



raaaid
06-10-2004, 06:12 AM
it happens to me sometimes that a certain guy always produces lag in the exact moment to shoot him may he be causing it someway on purpose?

raaaid
06-10-2004, 06:12 AM
it happens to me sometimes that a certain guy always produces lag in the exact moment to shoot him may he be causing it someway on purpose?

TugZooey
06-10-2004, 06:14 AM
Yes.

Have you really been registered since 2002?

raaaid
06-10-2004, 06:19 AM
iv been playing since the old cfs1 online
but not read too much the forums but at least now i know that upgrading my graphic ard wouldnt solve this problem

if my opinion counts a little i still think european air war was the best multiplayer game ever so i hope bob is made the same way

raaaid
06-10-2004, 06:29 AM
boy do i miss the one vs one same plane same altitude

there you saw who was best


i remember guys saying to be afraid of having a heart attack (because of the adrenaline)

that was a game not this where what counts is the shooting not the flying

i still cant understand how people like to fly biplanes servers with which you pull the stick fully and doesnt stall (you fly to the limit with the joystick fully pulled,pfff),if that is not arcade,the funy thing is they do it full real

bartflaster1
06-10-2004, 06:34 AM
This sort of cheating can be mimimized by the host tightening his timeout settings though ?

I run these settings if I host:

checkServerTimeSpeed=1
checkClientTimeSpeed=1
checkTimeSpeedDifferense=0.04
checkTimeSpeedInterval=1

[MaxLag]
farMaxLagTime=2.5
nearMaxLagTime=2.5
cheaterWarningDelay=1.0
cheaterWarningNum=1

I thought that virtually eliminates "lag" type cheats ?

1.JaVA_Razer
06-10-2004, 07:23 AM
it happens. it can be from 3 things according to me

1) The muzzle flashes "millifreezign" your system for a quick moment
2)the server was getting the "shoot" packages and is to slow to handle that and the planes
3) the guy uses some sort of printscreen scheat and stuff

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LeadSpitter_
06-10-2004, 07:25 AM
I dont think so, I think the freezes are serverside related, It seems the happen with new joiners and spawning, or pc related due to LOD mdl changes. I hear some people get them from sound initial firing/muzzle flash pause.

With the bf110 109z and me262 with 512k it will cause a pause when firing, even with a gig or ddr it does it from time to time with those aircraft.

The only time i seen people initial freezes on purpose is with the 108 cannon when on thier tail donw low over a city they will fire all thier ammo looking like 200, 1000lb bombs went off and that causes studders and pauses for me

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WOLFMondo
06-10-2004, 07:50 AM
Someone hitting print screen or starting a track will cause freezes. People do this deliberatly online and its blatantly obvious when they do it. If the printscreens saved as JPG's this would help a great deal.

Leadspitter is right about the server side although its caused by the client as well.

If the map is built and none of the planes that are selectable are placed as static on the map, each time those planes are selected people have to load them into the clients memory and each plane is about 3mb to load in. Thats why its best if map builders put the bulk of the choosable planes on the map as static planes and keep the list of planes limited. If all planes are selectable to fly and its a big server then theres gonna be problems.

Also people loading in custom skins also cause freezes.

Ideally a server should have all the planes on the map already so there loaded into the clients memory and skin download should be off. Only then would freezes be caused by print screening and starting tracks.

If theres one thing IL2 does not have is good net code. Out of all the games i've played and managed servers for Il2 is by far the worst for its net code and net related issues. Even BF1942's netcode and server side intensive collision and hit detection and the way it does it is better than Il2's and thats saying somthing.

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DuxCorvan
06-10-2004, 08:30 AM
Not, but freezes in FB -even in offline game- tend to happen when you first cross an enemy plane. I think the game stops to load gun sounds or maybe the external engine sounds of a new plane when you first come near to it.

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Tully__
06-10-2004, 08:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 1.JaVA_Razer:
it happens. it can be from 3 things according to me

1) The muzzle flashes "millifreezign" your system for a quick moment
2)the server was getting the "shoot" packages and is to slow to handle that and the planes
3) the guy uses some sort of printscreen scheat and stuff

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

4) Client machine loads a higher LOD model from hdd
5) Client machine loading gun sound effects from hdd
6) Client machine loading enemy aircraft engine sounds from hdd
7) You get within the range where the gap between postional packets from the server becomes obvious
8, 9 & 10) Enemy's PC doing 4, 5 or 6 causes his machine to be too busy to send positional data for a significant fraction of a second.

etc....

There are possibly as many as 20 things that can cause this, only about 5 or 6 of which might be deliberate (they may equally well be limitations of your, the hosts or the other player's hardware). I'd be very reluctant to assume that it was the other player deliberately doing something without sitting behind him at his computer and actually watching him at it (or he admits it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif)

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TooCooL34
06-10-2004, 08:34 AM
Hmm, usual Raaaid post. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

How about a hammer or shotgun to hit your PC.

Cajun76
06-10-2004, 08:56 AM
Suspected people of using Print Screen before, but just figured it was one of those spawn in, crashes or system related things. Until tonight, that is. Close in with the bandit, dodging back and forth, finally lined up a very nice solution on him when there was a big pause, and he immediately got autokicked. No skimming the ground at 1000kph, or going orbital, just disappeared as the host dropped him. Didn't accuse him when he came back minutes later, and it's possible that it could be something else, but I'll be watching him and his squad closely for awhile. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

On my old vid card and system, it never failed there was a pause as the high-res plane was loaded. One second the plane would be rather small and indistinct, the next, twice as big and clear, with only 10-20 meters difference in distance. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Good hunting,
Cajun76

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Ki_Rin
06-10-2004, 09:13 AM
Yes, I have noticed this often, in fact, for me its pretty typical, prob due to my anemic sys (celereon 800, 384RAM 64MB vid)...

Very frustrating, wether little or much lag in game, always the same thing, just as you get perfect firing solution, THATS when yo uget even the tiniest of stutter, and it makes a HUGE difference in getting that clean kill, or indeed in even hitting the guy....

somethimes its so bad i often get screen freezes fo ranywhere from 3 seconds to ...well, honestly, a few minutes, sometimes, usually ending with me crashing or having been totally destroyed mid-air by someone

Im sure its sometimes from those blooody mk 108 type cannon and the ridiculous flash, (and any resulting ground explosions)

I dont know about comps or stuff like packet loss, what is that?.....seems to me the loading sound of other ac is right, that is why stutter at certaiin range, usually at critical time to fire http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

I have heard that FB uses a way that makes lag when ppl join/exit game, and respawn, cant remember what it was called, but cant and shouldnt this be rectified? (guess not, all effoet going into BoB, I suspect)

I know skin dl can be turned off by server, to help lag, but cant they turn off ability to print screen and save track as well? could this ability be put into a patch?would be nice to make sure ppl couldnt prt scrn or save trk and make lag...we dont all have bloody supercomputers!

"Consequences are for lesser beings; I am Ki-Rin...that is sanction enough"

Tully__
06-10-2004, 09:26 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cajun76:
Suspected people of using Print Screen before, but just figured it was one of those spawn in, crashes or system related things. Until tonight, that is. Close in with the bandit, dodging back and forth, finally lined up a very nice solution on him when there was a big pause, and he immediately got autokicked. No skimming the ground at 1000kph, or going orbital, just disappeared as the host dropped him. Didn't accuse him when he came back minutes later, and it's possible that it could be something else, but I'll be watching him and his squad closely for awhile. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Cajun, ANY of the things that I listed above that are in the target's machine could cause enough packet loss to result in an autokick. The autokick does not distinguish between user induced packet loss and hardware deficiency induced packet loss.

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Dem4n
06-10-2004, 09:37 AM
Thing I notice is that everyone talks about people using print screen and save track, but aren't we the people? But I don't use it and you don't use it, right? So who does? maybe it's just one big myth to explain why it lags. Cause it can't be your fault right? And it ain't mine either so gotta be that other guy who cheats and lives among us but can't be pointed at.

A normal lag like in any other online game just makes a hell of a lot more difference in something like FB. Quit complaining, it seems to be a normal phenomenon that is well known. And if it happens to you, it happens to him too!

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Hoarmurath
06-10-2004, 09:42 AM
Tully, there are some plane behaviour online that seem very strange, and none of the reasons you gave seem to apply...

Yesterday evening i was flying in a dogfight, i lined up an ennemy plane, and as soon as i began hitting him, he he tried to dodge by jerking ... As soon as he began to maneuver, as i was at a constant distance behind him, with no new sound coming (i was already firing), the lag began. There was small warping of the plane, maybe half a second each time, at one/two seconds intervals but it became very hard to line him (and indeed while he was damaged from the first shots, i didn't finished him, couldn't). It's not the first time i observe this, and curiously it only happen when you're on the six of somebody, you never observe it for plane being in your six. Of course it mean nothing, it can be them that see you warping then. And what is strange is that it don't happen with all planes in a dogfight. Well, it is not really to the point of being unplayable, but it is somewhat annoying, and with all the rumors about cheating, everyone become suspiscious of those pilots.
If there is a legitimate reason for this phenomenon, we need to know to clear the matter, don't you think so?

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SeaFireLIV
06-10-2004, 09:51 AM
I`m not accusing anyone of cheating (yet), but just today on Warclouds I dived behind a 109 in my Spit. He immediately began to turn to escape me and also did the `stutter` effect. THREE times it happened as I was chasing him, I had not opened fire at all - and I lost him. Stutter stops.

It`s situations like this that make me wonder.

1. Flying for 20 minutes, no stutter.
2. Didn`t open fire at all when on bogey.
3. Stutter only happened when he must have known I was on his 6 (since he began evading).
4. the sutter appeared `spaced` almost as if coming equally one after the other.
5. Stutter NEVER happens if I hit them (and destroy them) when they don`t know i`m there.

Conclusion? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

SeaFireLIV...


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WHERE is he???

WOLFMondo
06-10-2004, 09:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dem4n:
Thing I notice is that everyone talks about people using print screen and save track, but aren't we the people? But I don't use it and you don't use it, right? So who does? maybe it's just one big myth to explain why it lags. Cause it can't be your fault right? And it ain't mine either so gotta be that other guy who cheats and lives among us but can't be pointed at.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Theres a hell of allot of people who play IL2 that don't participate in these forums or they may read them and never post.

I belive the server can detect people print screening however I don't know how to find this information. If anyone does it would be appreciated.

As I say, if screen shots were saved as JPG's and not 2mb tga files then it might help a bit. One thing though is other games when you take a print screen it doesnt effect the other clients or the server. Ever play on a 64 player BF1942 with the correctly alloted bandwidth (server side)? Lag is minimal, most of the problems are caused by insufficient hardware of the client (which is called 'rubber banding' due to a GFX card which cannot deal with the polygons on screen) which does not effect the other clients. When 1 user gets a screen stack/fps drop the other clients are not effected, the server reports and readouts support this as well.

Allot of these problems could most likely be solved by a revision of IL2 netcode.

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Dem4n
06-10-2004, 10:04 AM
Wolfmondo

Thats fine if you know where the problem lies. But I highly doubt that anyone would buy the game (or maybe they didn't) and purposely start pressing print screen once your on his six, while not visiting the forum, where most people found out about it in the first place.

Ok maybe they looked up the "cheat" and otherwise don't post. But then who goes ahead and cheats anyway? Where's the fun in that? Where's the fun in playing FB with immortality for example? If they're that bad then you won't have any problems getting on their six again and again until the print screen button pops off their keyboard...
(or maybe they assingned it to their stick? right next to the fire button. Named it "evasive action" and think they're flying an F16.) Oh please... that ain't worth the time...

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"I don't know what weapons well be fighting with in WWIII, but in WWIV it will be sticks and stones." -Einstein

SeaFireLIV
06-10-2004, 10:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dem4n:
Ok maybe they looked up the "cheat" and otherwise don't post. But then who goes ahead and cheats anyway? Where's the fun in that? Where's the fun in playing FB with immortality for example? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don`t you believ it pal. I gotta m8 who owns a PS2 and all he ever does is cheat on it! And he aint no 7 year old. I pop round to his and he`s playing some game and I`ll notice he`s invulnerable with unlimited ammo, (always everytime) walking around blowing away everything in his path. He completes it in a few hours to a day - takes it back. He gets a new game, buys a `cheat-disc` thing or the cheat book. Does it all over again - constantly.

What`s the ruddy point? I ask him. There`s no challenge, no sense of achievement - it`s totally pointless, as well as a waste of money! Silence.

It`s a money-making industry on the PS2!

He`s not the only one, there are younger kids loving to cheat on the PS2 and the PC. I think there`s a whole website devoted to pissing people off online by cheating!

Well at least he only cheats himself against AI and not online against humans! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

crazyivan1970
06-10-2004, 10:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bartflaster1:
This sort of cheating can be mimimized by the host tightening his timeout settings though ?

I run these settings if I host:

checkServerTimeSpeed=1
checkClientTimeSpeed=1
checkTimeSpeedDifferense=0.04
checkTimeSpeedInterval=1

[MaxLag]
farMaxLagTime=2.5
nearMaxLagTime=2.5
cheaterWarningDelay=1.0
cheaterWarningNum=1

I thought that virtually eliminates "lag" type cheats ?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Those are very relaxed settings mate... and not quiet correct ones too

checkServerTimeSpeed=1
checkClientTimeSpeed=1
checkTimeSpeedDifferense=0.05
checkTimeSpeedInterval=5

[MaxLag]
farMaxLagTime=3
nearMaxLagTime=1
cheaterWarningDelay=3
cheaterWarningNum=2

Take my word for it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
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Dem4n
06-10-2004, 10:21 AM
Seafire
That IS strange. He should have his head examined (no offence). I mean where is the point?
Even if they wanted to piss me off. They'd never know... especially in FB where typing messages is complicated.
I mean of course I know people do cheat like in CS for example, but it's free and every idiot can run around with a pumpgun blazing away. A game like Il2 is difficult to learn and extremely hard to master. And if you made it, why give the achievement a virtual headshot by cheating away just to piss me off, when I don't even complain and in most cases don't notice or care.. I'm sorry but I don't get the point, and noone can be that stupid. I believe in the good human nature...
Back to your friend: Where's the challenge?

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"I don't know what weapons well be fighting with in WWIII, but in WWIV it will be sticks and stones." -Einstein

SeaFireLIV
06-10-2004, 11:37 AM
I`ve pondered on it a long time...

Hawgdog
06-10-2004, 12:43 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TugZooey:
Yes.

Have you really been registered since 2002?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

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Tully__
06-11-2004, 07:08 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
Tully, there are some plane behaviour online that seem very strange, and none of the reasons you gave seem to apply...

Yesterday evening i was flying in a dogfight, i lined up an ennemy plane, and as soon as i began hitting him, he he tried to dodge by jerking ... As soon as he began to maneuver, as i was at a constant distance behind him, with no new sound coming (i was already firing), the lag began. There was small warping of the plane, maybe half a second each time, at one/two seconds intervals but it became very hard to line him (and indeed while he was damaged from the first shots, i didn't finished him, couldn't). It's not the first time i observe this, and curiously it only happen when you're on the six of somebody, you never observe it for plane being in _your_ six. Of course it mean nothing, it can be them that see you warping then. And what is strange is that it don't happen with all planes in a dogfight. Well, it is not really to the point of being unplayable, but it is somewhat annoying, and with all the rumors about cheating, everyone become suspiscious of those pilots.
If there is a legitimate reason for this phenomenon, we need to know to clear the matter, don't you think so?

http://hoarmurath.free.fr/<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Reason 7. It only shows when the bad guy is not flying reasonably straight. The gaps in positional data are "filled in" by your machine using last known direction and speed of the target. As soon as he starts manouvering, he's no longer travelling in the last known direction/speed. Next time you get an update, his plane warps to the latest real data position.

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Tully__
06-11-2004, 07:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
I`m not accusing anyone of cheating (yet), but just today on Warclouds I dived behind a 109 in my Spit. He immediately began to turn to escape me and also did the `stutter` effect. THREE times it happened as I was chasing him, I had not opened fire at all - and I lost him. Stutter stops.

It`s situations like this that make me wonder.

1. Flying for 20 minutes, no stutter.
2. Didn`t open fire at all when on bogey.
3. Stutter only happened when he must have known I was on his 6 (since he began evading).
4. the sutter appeared `spaced` almost as if coming equally one after the other.
5. Stutter NEVER happens if I hit them (and destroy them) when they don`t know i`m there.

Conclusion? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

SeaFireLIV...


http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/whereishe.jpg

WHERE is he???<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

See my response to Hoarmurath just above.

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