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projectpat06
01-26-2014, 11:33 PM
While finally playing freedom cry, I kept thinking how playing as multiple assassins could really change up the gameplay. Having the ability to change between Edward and Adewale would have created diversity and increased options in tackling objectives.

In a future AC game, Incorporate the GTAV mechanics of being able to switch between assassins. Give the player the freedom of going about things solo or request for back up. You can also switch between assassins who have their unique abilities and weapons.

This also open up the avenue for Co op gameplay. I believe the next gen Ac games should really push new mechanics that separate them from the last gen games. Having multiple assassins could be a fresh way to change things up.

TheElderSons
01-26-2014, 11:38 PM
So...you want AC: V to be GTA: Now with Parkour?

roostersrule2
01-26-2014, 11:42 PM
So...you want AC: V to be GTA: Now with Parkour?He said he wanted to incorporate a GTA V mechanic not make it become Historical, Parkour GTA.

I'd like a game with multiple Assassins just not in the GTA style, I'd prefer three separate stories that eventually tie into one.

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 12:16 AM
He said he wanted to incorporate a GTA V mechanic not make it become Historical, Parkour GTA.

I'd like a game with multiple Assassins just not in the GTA style, I'd prefer three separate stories that eventually tie into one.

This. I wouldn't want the character switching mechanic (except at the end of the game, but that could be through a menu or something) but a multiple-character story could be good provided that the characters don't detract from one another (looking at you, Haytham/Connor). It would have to be a pretty damn long game to do the individual characters justice. I think three characters is too much (GTA suffered from this too, as Franklin's story totally got the shaft). It might help if the characters were already established. Perhaps they could do a Connor/Aveline game, or an Edward/Connor one.

Fatal-Feit
01-27-2014, 12:25 AM
They've already done something similar with Revelations and AC:3. Two of the most underrated AC games.

roostersrule2
01-27-2014, 12:29 AM
They've already done something similar with Revelations and AC:3. Two of the most underrated AC games.As much as I love ACR Altair had so little screen time and in AC3 as Loyal said Haytham and Connor detracted from one another.

SixKeys
01-27-2014, 12:40 AM
Multiple ancestors would be great. The problem with ACR was that they were both already established characters with huge fanbases, so naturally when Alta´r only got a few short segments (plus a different voice actor and Ezio's animations, so really it wasn't Alta´r at all), one half was going to feel shafted. The problem with AC3 was that the trailers led us to believe Connor was the major star of the story, yet we played as his dad for the first three hours. And arguably, the dad ended up getting more positive feedback than the main hero. So it's a tough balancing act. For a successful game with multiple protagonists it would be best not to have any of them be established characters (so no Connor popping up in Aveline's memories and vice versa, that kind of stuff), and they should all have roughly equal screen time.

Consus_E
01-27-2014, 02:35 AM
I'd rather have a single protagonist to be honest (I may make an exception is one character is a Templar)

Shahkulu101
01-27-2014, 02:57 AM
I adore the idea of multiple characters in a game - even if it we are given a switch option similar to GTA V. If the two stories intertwine, and we play as both characters for a roughly equal amount of time then I would be peeved if we couldn't switch over during free-roam - especially during the end game.

Although, I wouldn't like it if we could start the same missions with both Assassin's which results in a different objective etc. Have a separate set of missions for both, and when both are featured give us the option to switch but keep objectives similar - no going of a doing their own thing.

projectpat06
01-27-2014, 04:51 PM
Have the main story interwoven but also have separate solo missions. Have one assassin more agile and stealthy while the other is a killing machine/brute. The animus is no longer limited to just tapping into your own ancestors. The researcher could switch from one of the two or three assassins based on the genetic memory he/she has on file.

When playing as one assassin, you could now even utilize the other assassin through commands. This could be a more elaborate system of AC3's recruit abilities. Of course, each assassin would have unique command options. Depending on which assassin you are playing as at that point in time, the other will have certain command abilities. This adds player customization/choice and it creates more needs to replay missions.


For one situation that I wish this was implemented in ac4 is whenever Edward sneaks up to an enemy ship. I wish edward could silently take the ship then sail it with some of his crew once he has captured it. Adewale could follow in the Jackdaw or vice versa. The assassin that you are controlling could send commands to the other so both ships are attaching a target in unison.

PedroAntonio2
01-27-2014, 05:05 PM
It would be epic a three characters system. One character is working for Abstergo, the other is an Assassin and the last one work for Erudito Collective. The Abstergo Character would explore French Revolution, the Assassin would explore Brazil in 1600-1700 period and the Erudito would explore World War I.

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 05:21 PM
Multiple ancestors would be great. The problem with ACR was that they were both already established characters with huge fanbases, so naturally when Alta´r only got a few short segments (plus a different voice actor and Ezio's animations, so really it wasn't Alta´r at all), one half was going to feel shafted. The problem with AC3 was that the trailers led us to believe Connor was the major star of the story, yet we played as his dad for the first three hours. And arguably, the dad ended up getting more positive feedback than the main hero. So it's a tough balancing act. For a successful game with multiple protagonists it would be best not to have any of them be established characters (so no Connor popping up in Aveline's memories and vice versa, that kind of stuff), and they should all have roughly equal screen time.

I disagree. If, for example, Connor and Haytham (both newly established characters) shared the spotlight equally, we'd have felt that BOTH of them got inadequate screen time. Haytham only felt like he got enough because he was a total surprise; we were expecting zero hours of Haytham, but we got like 3-5. Conversely, even though Connor got a full nine sequences, he felt underutilized and his portions were hampered by an unnecessarily lengthy prologue (and keep in mind, both new ancestors would likely be getting intro sequences as well, so that's a good chunk of the game taken up right there).

I've resigned myself to the fact that AC games are most likely going to top out at around 14 sequences max, so if there were two new characters sharing the screen they'd each only be getting seven sequences tops. I don't think that's enough to do a new ancestor justice. You're right in saying ACR's approach kind of flopped, but that's not because people knew both Altair and Ezio; it's because Altair only got five crappy missions (the first of which was completely ancillary and had nothing to do with the plot) after being at the center of the hype campaign for like eight months. I mean, the freaking Aveline DLC for AC4 was longer than all five of them combined. AVELINE. The handheld protagonist that like 3/4 of the fanbase didn't even know about, compared to the ultimate AC legend, Altair.

I think if Connor and Edward got a game, it could work. Tie up the loose ends of the Kenway Saga by bringing it full circle from grandfather to grandson. I'd love both a game in London and a game that finishes off Connor's story, so if you roll them into one, it would be pretty great, I think. They'd have to do some Memory Seal BS or something to justify following Edward past the point where Haytham was born, but hey. Maybe Edward put some of his own blood in a blood vial shortly before he died?

SixKeys
01-27-2014, 05:49 PM
I've resigned myself to the fact that AC games are most likely going to top out at around 14 sequences max, so if there were two new characters sharing the screen they'd each only be getting seven sequences tops. I don't think that's enough to do a new ancestor justice. You're right in saying ACR's approach kind of flopped, but that's not because people knew both Altair and Ezio; it's because Altair only got five crappy missions (the first of which was completely ancillary and had nothing to do with the plot) after being at the center of the hype campaign for like eight months. I mean, the freaking Aveline DLC for AC4 was longer than all five of them combined. AVELINE. The handheld protagonist that like 3/4 of the fanbase didn't even know about, compared to the ultimate AC legend, Altair.


Seven sequences for two characters sounds fine to me. Not every story has to be as lengthy and all-encompassing as Ezio's in AC2, where we followed him literally from birth to his 40s. Alta´r's story in AC1 only spanned about a year or so. Multiple ancestors would open up the possibility for smaller, self-contained stories.

Your point about ACR is pretty much what I was trying to say. Had Alta´r been a previously unknown character, it would have been an interesting addition to have Ezio explore the memories of this new ancestor and people likely wouldn't have been as disappointed with the short missions. But Alta´r had a legendary status among the fans, which is why they were so pissed that he only got a few crappy missions, when the marketing had led them to believe both assasins would be getting roughly equal screentime.

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 06:01 PM
Seven sequences for two characters sounds fine to me. Not every story has to be as lengthy and all-encompassing as Ezio's in AC2, where we followed him literally from birth to his 40s. Alta´r's story in AC1 only spanned about a year or so. Multiple ancestors would open up the possibility for smaller, self-contained stories.

Your point about ACR is pretty much what I was trying to say. Had Alta´r been a previously unknown character, it would have been an interesting addition to have Ezio explore the memories of this new ancestor and people likely wouldn't have been as disappointed with the short missions. But Alta´r had a legendary status among the fans, which is why they were so pissed that he only got a few crappy missions, when the marketing had led them to believe both assasins would be getting roughly equal screentime.

A long story doesn't necessarily have to mean a long time frame. It could be seven sequences all in the same year for all I care. I just don't want to get two separate stories that don't feel long enough to introduce, then tell an interesting story about, two new characters. AC stories aren't really that long anyway, and we're talking about cutting that length in half... I just think it would work better if the characters needed no introduction, no backstory, and for the love of God no Assassin training sequences. We'd just be picking up where we left off. Altair was a disappointment in Revelations because he didn't get equal screentime with Ezio, but if he had gotten it, it would have been fine. That's basically what I'm suggesting for a Connor/Edward game. It could be cut from the same cloth as Revelations (i.e. Connor reliving Edward's memories like Ezio relived Altair's) except both Assassins would be given a roughly equal share of the spotlight. And both of them given at least one free-roam map, Edward having London and Connor having a wilderness one (not the AC3 frontier; something relatively rural like that, but with more towns, life, and activities). THAT is a game I could get behind.

UKassassinsfan
01-27-2014, 06:03 PM
I still think I'd prefer the one assassin but have a better more intertwined story. The stories thus far have been quite narrow but imagine having a handful of stories that intertwined but you didn't realise until you've done a few that the assassinations are linked. Like how you have in murder dramas lots of different victims linked by one or two similarities, you never find out till later on in the episode/series.

TheArcaneEagle
01-27-2014, 06:15 PM
No. You've just got the idea of GTA V, which may work in that game, but not in a story dependent game like the Assassin's Creed franchise. Besides, there wouldn't be enough character arc for multiple assassins in one game. Hell, Connor barely had a character and he was alone in one game.

Sticking to one assassin that we grow to love is character development.

Pandassin
01-27-2014, 06:28 PM
I like this idea. I'm hoping that for the last AC game, they bring together all the Assassins through some Animus trickery. Not sure how the story would turn out, but it'd be cool for all the Assassins to team up and work together. Or even if they make a multiplayer game where we can play as any Assassin/Templar we want from the AC Franchise. That'd be pretty cool.

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 06:31 PM
I like this idea. I'm hoping that for the last AC game, they bring together all the Assassins through some Animus trickery. Not sure how the story would turn out, but it'd be cool for all the Assassins to team up and work together. Or even if they make a multiplayer game where we can play as any Assassin/Templar we want from the AC Franchise. That'd be pretty cool.

Yeah, I want to see all of the Assassins united in the end somehow. Bleeding effect, maybe? Definitely not a whole game featuring all of them (that would just be a mess) but it would be an epic final sequence to see Altair, Ezio, Connor, Edward, and whoever else they come up with all together for the final chapter.

Hans684
01-27-2014, 08:13 PM
Yeah, I want to see all of the Assassins united in the end somehow. Bleeding effect, maybe? Definitely not a whole game featuring all of them (that would just be a mess) but it would be an epic final sequence to see Altair, Ezio, Connor, Edward, and whoever else they come up with all together for the final chapter.

Maybe their spirits/ghosts with the help of an Apple Of Eden?

Fatal-Feit
01-27-2014, 09:13 PM
Maybe their spirits/ghosts with the help of an Apple Of Eden?


Yeah, I want to see all of the Assassins united in the end somehow. Bleeding effect, maybe? Definitely not a whole game featuring all of them (that would just be a mess) but it would be an epic final sequence to see Altair, Ezio, Connor, Edward, and whoever else they come up with all together for the final chapter.

Oh man, that would be the cheesiest ending of any franchise, ever. Every AC fans will be cringing so hard on their seats when all of the Assassins hold up their blades and shout ''Vittoria agli Assassini!''.

I hope this happens.

BATISTABUS
01-27-2014, 09:24 PM
Controlling multiple characters over the course of a story? I'm not really a fan of that. Co-op on the other hand...

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 09:29 PM
Oh man, that would be the cheesiest ending of any franchise, ever. Every AC fans will be cringing so hard on their seats when all of the Assassins hold up their blades and shout ''Vittoria agli Assassini!''.

I hope this happens.

Naw, not one of those again. I don't mean literally together fighting alongside each other, I just mean all of them making an appearance together via the Black Room, bleeding effect, sync nexus, or whatever the hell they want to make up.

dxsxhxcx
01-27-2014, 09:33 PM
It didn't work in ACR, it didn't work in AC3 and it won't work in any other game unless proper time is given to write the story and develop the game..

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 09:39 PM
It didn't work in ACR, it didn't work in AC3 and it won't work in any other game unless proper time is given to write the story and develop the game..

Hopefully we've reached that point. There was a dark period there for a few years when they were getting their yearly release schedule on track (ACB and ACR being short and stagnant, AC3 being sloppy and unfinished) but AC4 was the first one since AC2 that felt like a full, complete game that had enough dev time to really round it out. Part of me says AC4 was a one-off, but I'm hoping they've hit their stride with the yearly releases and each game will have had at least two full years of development.

projectpat06
01-27-2014, 09:54 PM
It didn't work in ACR, it didn't work in AC3 and it won't work in any other game unless proper time is given to write the story and develop the game..

I'm talking about one story that revolves around two assassins who work closely together. So say in Paris during the french revolution, you can control one to take out guards on the roof then immediately switch to the other assassin to stop a guillotine execution.

Fatal-Feit
01-27-2014, 09:56 PM
I'm talking about one story that revolves around two assassins who work closely together. So say in Paris during the french revolution, you can control one to take out guards on the roof then immediately switch to the other assassin to stop a guillotine execution.

Actually, I change my mind. That could work.

Hans684
01-27-2014, 10:12 PM
It didn't work in ACR, it didn't work in AC3 and it won't work in any other game unless proper time is given to write the story and develop the game..

And AC2 Desmond(modern day), Ezio(Renissance) and Alra´r(one memory in Acre thought the bleeding effect with only Desmond talking).

dxsxhxcx
01-27-2014, 10:18 PM
Hopefully we've reached that point. There was a dark period there for a few years when they were getting their yearly release schedule on track (ACB and ACR being short and stagnant, AC3 being sloppy and unfinished) but AC4 was the first one since AC2 that felt like a full, complete game that had enough dev time to really round it out. Part of me says AC4 was a one-off, but I'm hoping they've hit their stride with the yearly releases and each game will have had at least two full years of development.

all AC4 did was put the focus in a new and fresh feature to distract us from the flaws of the AC formula, so IMO this feeling that they did it right this time isn't surprising, remove the naval mechanic from the equation and we won't have something that different from what ACB and ACR were, and as soon as naval goes away you can bet that ACB~3 feeling wil be there again, unless they find a new "naval feature" to sugar-coat the stale state this franchise is and from which I don't see it going anywhere unless more development time is given to the devs...

does this make AC4 a bad game? No, it certainly is the best experience I already had with a pirate game, but it doesn't make it a big improvement over the others either, most of the flaws the previous AC games had are still there...



I'm talking about one story that revolves around two assassins who work closely together. So say in Paris during the french revolution, you can control one to take out guards on the roof then immediately switch to the other assassin to stop a guillotine execution.

this would make it even more difficult, if they can't make scripted sequences work, imagine changing characters all the time like in GTA 5, they would still need to write two separated stories for each one, different cutscenes depending of who one of the protagonists will interact with, different outcomes leading to different missions depending of which protagonist you're controlling and what he's doing, some unique missions for each character, etc...

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 10:28 PM
all AC4 did was put the focus in a new and fresh feature to distract us from the flaws of the AC formula, so IMO this feeling that they did it right this time isn't surprising, remove the naval mechanic from the equation and we won't have something that different from what ACB and ACR were, and as soon as naval goes away you can bet that ACB~3 feeling wil be there again, unless they find a new "naval feature" to sugar-coat the stale state this franchise is and from which I don't see it going anywhere unless more development time is given to the devs...

does this make AC4 a bad game? No, it certainly is the best experience I already had with a pirate game, but it doesn't make it an improvement over the others either, most of the flaws the previous AC games had are still there...

I disagree wholeheartedly, AC4 fixed MANY of AC3's flaws, most important of which are the broken stealth and detection AI (although I admit it placed too much focus on stalking zones). Even without the naval, AC4 would have been a great game. The only thing that seriously needs a revamp is combat. Social stealth could use a look too, but when we transition back to more populous locales that should take care of itself to a large extent. AC4 didn't have much social stealth because there just weren't that many people around.

dxsxhxcx
01-27-2014, 10:50 PM
I disagree wholeheartedly, AC4 fixed MANY of AC3's flaws, most important of which are the broken stealth and detection AI (although I admit it placed too much focus on stalking zones). Even without the naval, AC4 would have been a great game. The only thing that seriously needs a revamp is combat. Social stealth could use a look too, but when we transition back to more populous locales that should take care of itself to a large extent. AC4 didn't have much social stealth because there just weren't that many people around.

something will always be improved from one game to other, but can you say that (without take the focus on the naval mechanic in consideration) the jump from AC3 to AC4 was the same from AC1 to AC2? (IMO) That kind jump is what this franchise needs (something that makes the game feel new and fresh but at the same time keep the old identity this franchise is known for), improvements made piece by piece (while better than nothing) won't lead us to a different direction than the one we already are going (the premature death of this franchise due to franchise fatigue), these little changes will be noticed of course and this might work for some time, but IMO won't be enough to keep this franchise (and our interest in it) alive for much time...

LoyalACFan
01-27-2014, 11:11 PM
something will always be improved from one game to other, but can you say that (without take the focus on the naval mechanic in consideration) the jump from AC3 to AC4 was the same from AC1 to AC2? (IMO) That kind jump is what this franchise needs (something that makes the game feel new and fresh but at the same time keep the old identity this franchise is known for), improvements made piece by piece (while better than nothing) won't lead us to a different direction than the one we already are going (the premature death of this franchise due to franchise fatigue), these little changes will be noticed of course and this might work for some time, but IMO won't be enough to keep this franchise (and our interest in it) alive for much time...

I mean... what you're asking for is kind of unrealistic, to be honest. The law of diminishing returns is always going to kick in at some point; every game can't be a huge monstrous leap in a new, fresh direction while still preserving the spirit of the original. AC1 was an OK game and AC2 was a great one. AC4 was already a great game, so what's it supposed to jump to? Jesus Christ incarnate? :p I agree that some of the mechanics need to be ironed out, but we're never going to feel that same AC1->AC2 jump in quality again. Unless they make a crap game and follow it up with a good one. *coughcoughAC3cough*