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View Full Version : OMG! Middle Earth Shadow of Mordor is basically Assassins Creed.....



salman147
01-25-2014, 08:25 AM
I just watched the news 8 mins gameplay and for a moment I thought I was watching a Next Gen Assassins Creed!
Or was I having serious hallucinations?
Your thoughts?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=2VXvPqZRc9o

Tell me that the wall climbing,jump to higher ledge,air assassination,eagle vision replacement with Wraith vision is a completely new original idea.Even the 'take human shields and throw them at any direction' seems like a rip off from AC2.Then there are assassination missions,ledge takedowns,ledge movement.....etc.

FreeKnowledge
01-25-2014, 08:29 AM
Oh my god here we go again.

HiddenKiller612
01-25-2014, 08:30 AM
I give this thread an hour before it's either locked or derailed into the ground.

BridgetFisher
01-25-2014, 08:59 AM
I doubt any company would ripoff how boring and mediocre the AC games are, I mean their just like history chapters in a game. Also all the boring fetch quests, basically that is the main style of gameplay in AC games, pretty sure every other company is more creative than doing the same thing over and over.

salman147
01-25-2014, 10:57 AM
I doubt any company would ripoff how boring and mediocre the AC games are, I mean their just like history chapters in a game. Also all the boring fetch quests, basically that is the main style of gameplay in AC games, pretty sure every other company is more creative than doing the same thing over and over.

Even an ex AC2 developer exclaimed at the video...and screamed.

Locopells
01-25-2014, 11:43 AM
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg282/cjb204/InBeforeTheLock.gif

I'm keeping that one!

yankeegamergirl
01-25-2014, 12:15 PM
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg282/cjb204/InBeforeTheLock.gif

:)

Thanks for the vid....now I understand what all the fuss is about (having read the other thread). I'm not going to pretend to know about copyright within game development or anything like that because I'm completely ignorant but wow that's does look suspect. lol.

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-25-2014, 01:38 PM
I'm not gonna lie... this looks like it ripped off Assassin's Creed.

And you know what? I'm fine with that. The more the merrier. I love AC and to see another game similar to it is great. That said, It seems pretty different if not in the basic gameplay mechanics, then definitely in the whole character generation for unique enemies and the way characters are connected to each other. I love that there are numerous approaches in tackling a mission: they showed of 2 stealthy ones and one action one: a direct approach, using a diversion to sneak in, or just using traditional stealth to bypass enemies. I WANT THIS GAME NOW.

Definitely getting this when I get next gen. Because it's next gen as well as 360/PS3, it falls into my rule of waiting and only getting the next gen version of games that are released once I have a next gen console.

thewhitestig
01-25-2014, 03:08 PM
I know it's LOTR, sure, but I don't like it's dark colours and the dark setting. It doesn't feel interesting. I'm perfectly fine with them ripping off AC mechanics.

AdamPearce
01-25-2014, 03:22 PM
This game is everything AC should be, definetely looking forward to it, looks freaking awesome.

pacmanate
01-25-2014, 06:13 PM
You need a slap OP, 3rd thread about this.

D.I.D.
01-25-2014, 06:24 PM
Watch Dogs bites a lot of GTA, this bites a lot of AC, and ir's hard to think of many games that don't lean on the proven mechanics of others. Hopefully it will just push all the games to be better. At worst, it gives us more games through the year that have a similar feel.

Mr_Shade
01-25-2014, 06:26 PM
IF the community can refrain from spamming / insults to other members or Ubisoft and can try to have a civil debate about the similarities - or not - then the thread can stay..


IF it's just a general 'chit chat' thread about the game - it belongs in the 3rd party discussion thread..

Your choice guys.. ;)

silvermercy
01-25-2014, 06:27 PM
I actually like the dark theme. I wasn't particularly interested in LOTR games until this. lol

E-Zekiel
01-26-2014, 02:55 AM
I'm not gonna lie... this looks like it ripped off Assassin's Creed.

And you know what? I'm fine with that. The more the merrier. I love AC and to see another game similar to it is great. That said, It seems pretty different if not in the basic gameplay mechanics, then definitely in the whole character generation for unique enemies and the way characters are connected to each other. I love that there are numerous approaches in tackling a mission: they showed of 2 stealthy ones and one action one: a direct approach, using a diversion to sneak in, or just using traditional stealth to bypass enemies. I WANT THIS GAME NOW.

Definitely getting this when I get next gen. Because it's next gen as well as 360/PS3, it falls into my rule of waiting and only getting the next gen version of games that are released once I have a next gen console.
This is basically how I feel about it. Does it look like it ripped a lot of animations from AC?
Yes.
Am I okay with this?
Yes, actually. It makes me want to get the game.

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 03:07 AM
I'm gonna laugh so hard if/when Ubisoft brings out Assassin's Creed: Amsterdam 1666 and everybody who's okay with this game ripping off AC is going to be outraged: "OMG how dare they rip off Patrice's game?!"

Theft is theft. It doesn't matter if you "improve" it.

Fatal-Feit
01-26-2014, 03:19 AM
^^^ Like with the Shia Labeouf's Twitter incident.

I could care less about the copy&paste climbing. The combat is the real concern. It's not even trying to hide the fact that it's directly ripping off the Arkham games.

AlmightySteveO
01-26-2014, 04:00 AM
And Darksiders blatantly ripped off Legend of Zelda, if the companies are ok with certain aspects.. or in some rare cases.. every aspect being similar or outright copied, then so be it.

That being said, I want this game.

Fatal-Feit
01-26-2014, 04:05 AM
And Darksiders blatantly ripped off Legend of Zelda, if the companies are ok with certain aspects.. or in some rare cases.. every aspect being similar or outright copied, then so be it.

That being said, I want this game.

But in this case, it's not. AC:2's coder is making a tantrum.

FreeKnowledge
01-26-2014, 04:18 AM
Playing favorite I see,I'll have to contact ubisoft support after the weekend passes by.proof is right here on the boards.my lawyers gonna love this he's gonna laugh his *** off.

Black_Widow9
01-26-2014, 04:24 AM
Playing favorite I see,I'll have to contact ubisoft support after the weekend passes by.proof is right here on the boards.my lawyers gonna love this he's gonna laugh his *** off.
Please take a look at Mr_Shade's post near the top of the page explaining why it will or will not stay open.

FreeKnowledge
01-26-2014, 04:31 AM
Tell your Masters I am coming for them!

E-Zekiel
01-26-2014, 04:36 AM
Okay, to all you guys who are talking about ripping off the Arkham games, let me tell you something.

Arkham's combat system did not start in Arkham. That whole "press this to counter, this to dodge, this to strike" etc that has become more prevalent in modern adventure games?

Maybe it came earlier in this, but the first place I saw it in the incarnation it's in now, and has been for the better part of 7+ years, came from The Matrix: Path of Neo. Which was an expanded-upon (vastly expanded on) version of the combat used in its predecessor: Enter the Matrix. But the most stark and obvious place, and earliest place I'm aware of is taken from the Matrix: Path of Neo. Free flow combat? Yep. Multi-person counters? Yep. Hell, even the jump from the Arkham games (the over-the-top-dodge-jump-roll) is almost the same as Neo when he becomes the One in Path of Neo.

You can call it theft and complain about people copying games, but always remember, kids, that game you're saying everybody ripped off, may have "ripped off" somebody else.

Kagurra
01-26-2014, 04:46 AM
Looks pretty good to me...

AssassinHMS
01-26-2014, 04:56 AM
I'm gonna laugh so hard if/when Ubisoft brings out Assassin's Creed: Amsterdam 1666 and everybody who's okay with this game ripping off AC is going to be outraged: "OMG how dare they rip off Patrice's game?!"

Theft is theft. It doesn't matter if you "improve" it.

Look, this is partially Ubisoftís fault. If they had given a **** for the core mechanics they would be so complex and sophisticated by now that ďstealingĒ them would be a much greater task. ACís core is underdeveloped as hell, itís easy to copy it and improve. Not only that but, this complexity would bind the core mechanics to the game, to AC, it would make them more specific and less compatible with other games. On the other hand, underdeveloped core mechanics can be used as the base for the gameplay of many other games.

Now, if Ubisoft was this fair company that actually cared about ACís integrity, I would feel bad if someone stole their work. But this is not the case, Ubisoft couldnít care less about ACís core mechanics (in other words, about Assassinís Creed itself) and they deserve to get ripped off on this (assuming this is the case).

Also, both as a gamer and as an AC fan, Iím very happy about this, so called, rip off. By improving ACís core (in a different game), these developers are showing Ubisoft how itís done, theyíre showing what they should have done from the start and, most importantly, they are showing the value of the core mechanics (which Ubisoft ignored). This is good.
And, as if this wasnít enough, they are making a very promising game which Iím looking forward to so, who cares if they based heavily on AC?


Again, if ACís core mechanics were in a decent state, this would likely not have happened. Ubisoft had it coming.

FreeKnowledge
01-26-2014, 05:11 AM
∆this,amen!

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 05:49 AM
Look, this is partially Ubisoftís fault. If they had given a **** for the core mechanics they would be so complex and sophisticated by now that ďstealingĒ them would be a much greater task. ACís core is underdeveloped as hell, itís easy to copy it and improve. Not only that but, this complexity would bind the core mechanics to the game, to AC, it would make them more specific and less compatible with other games. On the other hand, underdeveloped core mechanics can be used as the base for the gameplay of many other games.

Now, if Ubisoft was this fair company that actually cared about ACís integrity, I would feel bad if someone stole their work. But this is not the case, Ubisoft couldnít care less about ACís core mechanics (in other words, about Assassinís Creed itself) and they deserve to get ripped off on this (assuming this is the case).

Also, both as a gamer and as an AC fan, Iím very happy about this, so called, rip off. By improving ACís core (in a different game), these developers are showing Ubisoft how itís done, theyíre showing what they should have done from the start and, most importantly, they are showing the value of the core mechanics (which Ubisoft ignored). This is good.
And, as if this wasnít enough, they are making a very promising game which Iím looking forward to so, who cares if they based heavily on AC?


Again, if ACís core mechanics were in a decent state, this would likely not have happened. Ubisoft had it coming.

If you work hard on a piece of art, music, writing, whatever, and someone else comes along and takes it and claims it as their own, and when you say "hey, wait a minute, that's my work", they'll just laugh and say "yeah, but I made it better, so that makes it okay. Now I'm gonna sell this piece and you're not seeing a penny of it." Would you say you deserved to have your work stolen just because you didn't do as good a job on it as the person who "improved" it?

I don't feel bad for corporations, I feel bad for the employee who recognized his own code, *knows* someone just copied his hard work and there's zilch he can do about it. I feel bad when I see people actively praising WB for encouraging this type of behavior. It means people don't have respect for artists and coders. Feel however you want about the company, but at least try to have some respect for the individuals whose work is being shamelessly stolen here.

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 05:53 AM
BTW, if you think this type of thing is going to encourage Ubi devs to work even harder on their craft, think again. Would you be encouraged to work hard on your next piece of creative work if you knew it was eventually going to get shamelessly stolen and the thief would get all the credit for your hard work? If anything, I would be less inclined to give a **** about the quality of my work, since people are obviously happy to settle for less.

FreeKnowledge
01-26-2014, 06:02 AM
Wonder if sixkeys got a infraction for cursing, I know I did so,cough cough,favortisim anyone!

FreeKnowledge
01-26-2014, 06:18 AM
How is it the original op got banned for this thread but its not closed yet hmmmmm?

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-26-2014, 06:27 AM
If you work hard on a piece of art, music, writing, whatever, and someone else comes along and takes it and claims it as their own, and when you say "hey, wait a minute, that's my work", they'll just laugh and say "yeah, but I made it better, so that makes it okay. Now I'm gonna sell this piece and you're not seeing a penny of it." Would you say you deserved to have your work stolen just because you didn't do as good a job on it as the person who "improved" it?

I don't feel bad for corporations, I feel bad for the employee who recognized his own code, *knows* someone just copied his hard work and there's zilch he can do about it. I feel bad when I see people actively praising WB for encouraging this type of behavior. It means people don't have respect for artists and coders. Feel however you want about the company, but at least try to have some respect for the individuals whose work is being shamelessly stolen here.

Babe I'm Gonna Leave You - Led Zeppelin
25 or 6 to 4 - Chicago
Brainstew - Green Day
Dead Leaves and the Dirty Ground - White Stripes.

Tik Tok - Ke$ha
California Gurls - Katy Perry

It happens all the TIME. As an artist, yes I'd hate for someone to blindly rip off my work. At the same time... how many truly ORIGINAL films are there? Most action movies take and use things used in several other films.

Watchmen came up with an idea of superheroes being regulated by the government, some conform while others decide to quit and some like Rorschach continue doing it without revealing anything to the government. Pixar took that idea and incorporated it into their film, the Incredibles: government wants to regulate heroes, some quit, some don't. Spoilers for both Watchmen AND the Incredibles follow: they both feature a previous "good guy" as the main antagonist. Later on, Marvel took the idea and incorporated it into their storyline "Civil War." In each case, the government regulation is generally caused by some event that spiraled out of control as well. Watchmen and Incredibles both feature a superhero getting their cape stuck and dying due to the cape. Both Incredibles and Watchmen are fantastic stories and Incredibles can be seen as a kid friendly version of the former that follows the same themes and ideas but in a way that's easier for a child to digest.

Nothing is new under the sun. How many films feature the heroes crawling through vents? Someone had to have had the idea originally. Dr. No in the 60's has Bond in vents, Die Hard in the 80's has John crawling through vents, Star Wars has Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon escape into the vents in the late 90's. Alien also had vents.

I am an artist, I love to draw. I'm not nearly at the level I wish to be at but hey, it's something I enjoy doing and people seem to like it for the most part. OF COURSE I would hate if someone took one of my drawings and claimed it as their own. OF COURSE I'd be upset if a character idea I had was taken by someone and then made. But what you have to understand is that people take and incorporate ideas all the time. Prince of Persia incorporated parkour elements such as running across walls as a method of travel, used in puzzles and to avoid traps. The Darksiders franchise uses this exact wall running mechanic in the same manner. Unlike PoP, you are able to run on a wall and then leap to the next wall and start another wall run -- regardless, it's the same mechanic.

Do you complain that numerous first person shooters use RT to shoot and LT to aim down ironsights? Someone had to have originally had the idea. Who was it? Was it Medal of Honor? Call of Duty? Battlefield? I honestly don't know. Saboteur and inFamous have both used the same sort of "climb up buildings in an open world." Dishonored took a similar setting as the Thief series and had first person stealth that was similar. Rayman Origins features 4 player co-op in a 2D platformer, features collectible items that are often hidden or hard to reach and you can bounce off one another and no one criticized Ubisoft for taking the same cooperative idea that New Super Mario Bros. Wii used.

Do we even know if it FOR SURE copied CODE? Because yes, that would kind of suck. But the guy's not even too upset, he tweeted that the game looks great and he loves AC so it's like a double win. If they did, in fact, use code -- they should probably have it in the credits just like how they show when they use Havok or whatever. Ubisoft has given no comment on the situation. For now, we have one guy's assumption that it's code he worked with. Without dissecting the code, we can't know for sure. Besides, isn't it the combat that's accused of being AC code? Not sure. I do wonder how often this happens. I'd wager it happens a whole lot more often than we're aware...games utilizing other game code for certain aspects. I just now found out about this claim but at the same time, we still don't know 100% that it's his code, even if it is -- he gave it his blessing, Ubisoft hasn't given any indication on its thoughts.

AssassinHMS
01-26-2014, 06:39 AM
If you work hard on a piece of art, music, writing, whatever, and someone else comes along and takes it and claims it as their own, and when you say "hey, wait a minute, that's my work", they'll just laugh and say "yeah, but I made it better, so that makes it okay. Now I'm gonna sell this piece and you're not seeing a penny of it." Would you say you deserved to have your work stolen just because you didn't do as good a job on it as the person who "improved" it?

I don't feel bad for corporations, I feel bad for the employee who recognized his own code, *knows* someone just copied his hard work and there's zilch he can do about it. I feel bad when I see people actively praising WB for encouraging this type of behavior. It means people don't have respect for artists and coders. Feel however you want about the company, but at least try to have some respect for the individuals whose work is being shamelessly stolen here.

So are you saying everyone who makes an action game should pay to the first team who made the original action game?
If you make something good, people are bound to use it as basis for their own stuff. If, in order to use something to further improve it forces you to pay to the original creator, then evolution, development would be severely decreased if not almost extinct.

No one denies that the developers borrowed heavily from AC, but there is no proof that they stole the code. Everything you are saying is nothing but an assumption which means it has no real weight in this discussion. Until there is proof that they stole the code, you canít use that as an argument.

Also, whoís stopping Ubisoft from stealing this improved version of theirs and further improve it?
Every improvement is only possible through ďtheftĒ. ďStealingĒ is how we improve.


Blatantly stealing an idea is wrong. Using anotherís idea in order to improve it is good. Everyone knows Shadow of Mordorís developers used ACís ideas so there is no injustice here, no one is claiming they didnít. Now, if you can prove they stole the actual code and pasted it into their game, then thatís a whole new story. But, so far, this is nothing but assumptions.
Did they based heavily on AC? Yes. Did they actually steal from them? No one knows and I personally think not.



BTW, if you think this type of thing is going to encourage Ubi devs to work even harder on their craft, think again. Would you be encouraged to work hard on your next piece of creative work if you knew it was eventually going to get shamelessly stolen and the thief would get all the credit for your hard work? If anything, I would be less inclined to give a **** about the quality of my work, since people are obviously happy to settle for less.

Again, you canít know if they stole from Ubisoft. And what exactly is this ďlessĒ that people are happy to settle for? If youíre referring to ACís core mechanicsí current state, then Iím sure people wonít settle for this same condition for another game.
Also, I provided real reasons why Ubisoft should feel encouraged to work even harder, soÖÖ.no.

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-26-2014, 07:01 AM
Honestly, I do hope this spurs Ubisoft to up it's game. I hope this game is immensely successful and that both games have a stake in the open world, climb on everything genre.

MeMckee
01-26-2014, 07:05 AM
Spot on post BoBwUzHeRe1138.



The only thing that really interests me in all of this is the so called nemesis thingamabob. It probably wont turn out to be a groundbreaking advancement or anything but I wish it would. I would love to see Ubi or any other game studio reverse engineer it. I see a future where not just bosses/enemy AI are enhanced and more realistic BUT ALL the AI become better/more realistic. The way that the protag in SOM could gain so much info from the orc that he "took" is extremely interesting and I can imagine myriad uses for that in a game like AC. Imagine not being told squat about who's in charge or who to go and kill. Side missions and investigations could become vital and exhilarating without feeling dumb/repetitive. Being able to see the entire templar power base/structure in the city that you're currently in and using that to decide for yourself how best to take them down.
Also, not just enemies but with all the characters in the game. Friends,enemies, acquaintances, merchants........... A system like this that the player can use to glean knowledge from both enemy and friendly contacts could go a long way towards fixing some of the problems that have caused AC to become a bit stagnate. Social stealth could take on heightened importance as you wouldn't be able to just leave an area and come back if you screwed up, you'd have to make adjustments to your plan of attack because the enemy is now on to you. Tons and tons of other stuff I could think of but this has already turned into a rant so......

TL;DR I see uber potential here. Will buy the game for sure just to see if nemesis is something that's going to pave the way foward.

FreeKnowledge
01-26-2014, 07:10 AM
∆this

LoyalACFan
01-26-2014, 07:25 AM
@HMS The literal code itself is sort of irrelevant; even if it's technically a different code written by someone else, it still looks like they watched a video of some AC2 gameplay and aped it at every turn. Lots of games have parkour, but Mordor's climbing animations and obstacles (even those random little clothesline things he runs across) are exactly like AC's. Lots of games have altered vision modes, but Mordor's is aesthetically and functionally exactly like AC's. Lots of games have aerial takedowns, but the Mordor's air assassinations look exactly like AC's. I could go on, but I think you get the gist. Even if it's not the exact same code, it's pretty much the same thing.

It would be as if, say, Martin Scorsese made a movie, and somebody else refilmed the entire thing with the same dialogue but different actors.

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-26-2014, 10:02 AM
@HMS The literal code itself is sort of irrelevant; even if it's technically a different code written by someone else, it still looks like they watched a video of some AC2 gameplay and aped it at every turn. Lots of games have parkour, but Mordor's climbing animations and obstacles (even those random little clothesline things he runs across) are exactly like AC's. Lots of games have altered vision modes, but Mordor's is aesthetically and functionally exactly like AC's. Lots of games have aerial takedowns, but the Mordor's air assassinations look exactly like AC's. I could go on, but I think you get the gist. Even if it's not the exact same code, it's pretty much the same thing.

It would be as if, say, Martin Scorsese made a movie, and somebody else refilmed the entire thing with the same dialogue but different actors.

No, it'd be like if they had a completely different plot, different actors, but numerous scenes and shots are very similar. Kind of like how Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope is essentially Kurosawa's Hidden Fortress in that it shares numerous scenes and events and has a similar plotline.

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-26-2014, 10:10 AM
Spot on post BoBwUzHeRe1138.



The only thing that really interests me in all of this is the so called nemesis thingamabob. It probably wont turn out to be a groundbreaking advancement or anything but I wish it would. I would love to see Ubi or any other game studio reverse engineer it. I see a future where not just bosses/enemy AI are enhanced and more realistic BUT ALL the AI become better/more realistic. The way that the protag in SOM could gain so much info from the orc that he "took" is extremely interesting and I can imagine myriad uses for that in a game like AC. Imagine not being told squat about who's in charge or who to go and kill. Side missions and investigations could become vital and exhilarating without feeling dumb/repetitive. Being able to see the entire templar power base/structure in the city that you're currently in and using that to decide for yourself how best to take them down.
Also, not just enemies but with all the characters in the game. Friends,enemies, acquaintances, merchants........... A system like this that the player can use to glean knowledge from both enemy and friendly contacts could go a long way towards fixing some of the problems that have caused AC to become a bit stagnate. Social stealth could take on heightened importance as you wouldn't be able to just leave an area and come back if you screwed up, you'd have to make adjustments to your plan of attack because the enemy is now on to you. Tons and tons of other stuff I could think of but this has already turned into a rant so......

TL;DR I see uber potential here. Will buy the game for sure just to see if nemesis is something that's going to pave the way foward.

Which post? (x

And definitely. To me this sounds very Molyneux-esque: promising something so groundbreaking and so revolutionary that it's too good to be true. IMO, there's potential like you said but I highly, HIGHLY doubt it'll be as in depth as it says. If it is, HOLY SH**#@$**!)& But 99% sure it won't live up to the hype and what it's proclaiming. However... it IS cool and even if it's only a shell of what was promised, it'll be really interesting.

One major difference between this and AC is that there didn't appear to be much if any crowds of just civilians. We saw creatures, we saw enemies and allies (which coincidentally seems like a more magic-infused variant of the Recruits in AC where you twist and corrupt them to your cause and actually get to go on missions with them), we saw enemies to fight, enemies you can sneak by or distract, etc. But one thing that's odd is that I didn't see any civilians. I hope they also rip from AC when it comes to crowds. I don't necessarily mean a blending mechanic though Hitman is attempting to introduce a blend system as well, I just hope to see plenty of civilians walking the streets that you can move between either slowly and gently or sprint through and shove them aside. Sleeping Dogs has a really neat system for that where if you just push forward while sprinting, you'll slam into people but if you kind of flick the thumbstick to the left or right, you'll swerve around them. It's pretty cool and works pretty well.

This game could have something like that. I also liked the crouching. Not sure if it's a toggled ability that you press a button for or if it's automatic when moving around enemies who don't know you're there but either way, it was a cool visual.

FreeKnowledge
01-26-2014, 10:28 AM
Adam sesller has a interview up on his YouTube channel called rev games,in this interview he interviews the lead designer on the game shadows of mordor and asks him about all this.check it out maybe you'll learn something!

HiddenKiller612
01-26-2014, 03:09 PM
Most games take some kind of influence from other games. I like the look of this game, but the mechanic I'm most interested in is the nemesis thing... that just looks awesome.

Fatal-Feit
01-26-2014, 03:17 PM
Most games take some kind of influence from other games. I like the look of this game, but the mechanic I'm most interested in is the nemesis thing... that just looks awesome.

Don't get your hopes up. It's probably going to be majorly scripted. If these guys are going to cop&paste contents/mechanics with QTEs, I don't trust them enough to actually make a new mind-blowing system.

HiddenKiller612
01-26-2014, 03:20 PM
Don't get your hopes up. It's probably going to be majorly scripted. If these guys are going to cop&paste contents/mechanics with QTEs, I don't trust them enough to actually make a new mind-blowing system.
True, the footage shown is a early version of the game... but you never know.

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 06:43 PM
I am an artist, I love to draw. I'm not nearly at the level I wish to be at but hey, it's something I enjoy doing and people seem to like it for the most part. OF COURSE I would hate if someone took one of my drawings and claimed it as their own. OF COURSE I'd be upset if a character idea I had was taken by someone and then made. But what you have to understand is that people take and incorporate ideas all the time. Prince of Persia incorporated parkour elements such as running across walls as a method of travel, used in puzzles and to avoid traps. The Darksiders franchise uses this exact wall running mechanic in the same manner. Unlike PoP, you are able to run on a wall and then leap to the next wall and start another wall run -- regardless, it's the same mechanic.


For the hundredth time: there is a difference between using *similar* assets, and then there's using the SAME CODE. There's a difference between making a painting that was heavily inspired by another artist's style, and then there's taking that artist's image from Google, drawing a moustache on it, and claiming it as your own, original work.

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 06:50 PM
Look guys! Totally original work!

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y200/JessKat/Mona_Lisa_zpsca137466.jpg


I used some dude named Leo's work as "reference", and then improved it. Think I could make some pretty good money off this?

aL_____eX
01-26-2014, 06:56 PM
OMG! This is what I call a unique piece of art! Well done SixKeys!

The beard just looks like real life, I wish I could draw like that.

LoyalACFan
01-26-2014, 07:02 PM
I used some dude named Leo's work as "reference", and then improved it. Think I could make some pretty good money off this?

If you were a Dada artist you probably could :rolleyes:

No joke, this is an actual thing.

http://daleowen.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/dada-lhooq-lg.jpg

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-26-2014, 07:18 PM
For the hundredth time: there is a difference between using *similar* assets, and then there's using the SAME CODE. There's a difference between making a painting that was heavily inspired by another artist's style, and then there's taking that artist's image from Google, drawing a moustache on it, and claiming it as your own, original work.

And you have no idea IF they even USED said code. So your point is entirely moot. There's absolutely no way you can tell from gameplay if it's using the code. No way that AC2 dev can either. As much as he claims he can tell, there's no actual way. He'd have to see the code they used for himself.

AssassinHMS
01-26-2014, 08:03 PM
So why isn’t Randal pissed off? Why is he so cool about this? Because this is good for him. With Ubisoft he got nowhere. If anything, Ubisoft showed how crappy Randal’s work can be put to use. Taking this to the extreme, it’s as if they turned a rainbow into crap. The potential of Randal’s work would never be shown with Ubisoft in charge.

Now, Shadows of Mordor shows the value of his work. Everyone says a big part of the gameplay is heavily based on his work. This is good for him.
If it wasn’t for them, Randal’s work would never be recognized. Heck, Ubisoft thinks naval is more attention-worthy than anything Randal made.
With Shadow of Mordor, Randal’s work gets the spotlight.

And people are pissed off at Monolith Productions! Seriously?

SixKeys, you use Mona Lisa as an example for Randal’s work but you fail to understand that his work, unlike Mona Lisa, was never recognized or acknowledged in the first place. These developers are proving the value of his work. And they are proving it, not because they stole anything, but because they borrowed from that work of art.
This is a new hope for those who want to see his work acknowledged and put to good use.

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 09:23 PM
And you have no idea IF they even USED said code. So your point is entirely moot. There's absolutely no way you can tell from gameplay if it's using the code. No way that AC2 dev can either. As much as he claims he can tell, there's no actual way. He'd have to see the code they used for himself.

Can we be 100% sure? Not without seeing the code, no. But you can't be 100% sure I didn't draw that Mona Lis-- I mean, totally original piece of work either. You can still take a pretty solid guess though.

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 09:28 PM
So why isn’t Randal pissed off? Why is he so cool about this? Because this is good for him. With Ubisoft he got nowhere. If anything, Ubisoft showed how crappy Randal’s work can be put to use. Taking this to the extreme, it’s as if they turned a rainbow into crap. The potential of Randal’s work would never be shown with Ubisoft in charge.

Now, Shadows of Mordor shows the value of his work. Everyone says a big part of the gameplay is heavily based on his work. This is good for him.
If it wasn’t for them, Randal’s work would never be recognized. Heck, Ubisoft thinks naval is more attention-worthy than anything Randal made.
With Shadow of Mordor, Randal’s work gets the spotlight.

And people are pissed off at Monolith Productions! Seriously?

SixKeys, you use Mona Lisa as an example for Randal’s work but you fail to understand that his work, unlike Mona Lisa, was never recognized or acknowledged in the first place. These developers are proving the value of his work. And they are proving it, not because they stole anything, but because they borrowed from that work of art.
This is a new hope for those who want to see his work acknowledged and put to good use.

His work was never recognized or acknowledged? Then how do you explain how many people instantly recognized his animations as soon as they saw the Mordor footage? The same people who played and loved AC2?

I'm not gonna get into the turning rainbows-into-crap argument because you obviously hate anything that isn't AC1.

lothario-da-be
01-26-2014, 09:35 PM
You know people, maybe the animations are the same because its still pre-alpha. Maybe they will change them in the dev process. At least thats what i tell myself.

SixKeys
01-26-2014, 09:37 PM
You know people, maybe the animations are the same because its still pre-alpha. Maybe they will change them in the dev process. At least thats what i tell myself.

That doesn't explain why they look so similar in the first place.

Fatal-Feit
01-26-2014, 10:06 PM
You know people, maybe the animations are the same because its still pre-alpha. Maybe they will change them in the dev process. At least thats what i tell myself.

To avoid anymore claims, of course they will. I personally think this game looks terrible. The Arkham combat sucks IMO, and the parkouring, despite looking similar to AC and being next-gen, looks much worse by comparison. I don't understand why people are seeing some mediocre climbing and going ''Oh, it's what AC is suppose to be, but better''. It's clearly not. The only thing this game has going for it is its Nemesis System, which I believe with be heavily scripted, and the eye-candy effects, which will most likely not look as great in the real game.

AssassinHMS
01-26-2014, 10:21 PM
His work was never recognized or acknowledged? Then how do you explain how many people instantly recognized his animations as soon as they saw the Mordor footage? The same people who played and loved AC2?
People recognized Assassin's Creed, the brand, not the actual person who worked on those specific features. Shadow of Mordor was Randall's chance to step up. Besides, we're not in AC2's days, the franchise has long forgotten itself and those aspects that used to be a trademark, that used to be the spotlight are currently not much more than dust. Shadow of Mordor brings those aspects back to the spotlight reviving them. Get it? Randall's work is back on the spotlight with the chance of being improved. Obviously this will have an effect on AC in the near future. Seriously, do I need to keep going? This should be quite obvious.

The fact is, they recognized the value of ACís core (something Ubisoft failed to do) and are basing their game on it. This is nothing but a huge display of recognition for his work.




I'm not gonna get into the turning rainbows-into-crap argument because you obviously hate anything that isn't AC1.
:rolleyes:

wraithcontrol
01-26-2014, 10:40 PM
Yeah ppl recognized the assassins creed franchise, yeah they recognize it for being the stale franchise that it is lol.im not giving ubisoft anymore money, ill just get their games used now for ten bucks thats all their worth lol.

AdamPearce
01-26-2014, 10:45 PM
I don't even understand why people are complaining. It's like saying CoD copied BF because you press the same button to reload you guns...this is so dumb.

Rugterwyper32
01-26-2014, 10:49 PM
The most important thing to me regarding this (besides looking like a great game that I'll certainly buy) is that it's giving Ubi some competition gameplay-wise. I'd like to see more companies step up and compete setting-wise (as honestly, the lack of historical open-world games makes me sad), but this is still for the better, it'll force Ubi's hand and make it so the series can stand out more in terms of gameplay. At least, ideally, that's what should happen. Now to see how it all goes.

Open world Mordor interests me, though. People need to learn Mordor is more than ashen wastelands and volcanoes. Hopefully the sight of the inland sea of Nurnen will make people rethink how they imagined Mordor.

Xx El Kino xX
01-27-2014, 03:22 AM
I doubt any company would ripoff how boring and mediocre the AC games are, I mean their just like history chapters in a game. Also all the boring fetch quests, basically that is the main style of gameplay in AC games, pretty sure every other company is more creative than doing the same thing over and over.
why are you on these forums then...?

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-27-2014, 04:07 AM
Can we be 100% sure? Not without seeing the code, no. But you can't be 100% sure I didn't draw that Mona Lis-- I mean, totally original piece of work either. You can still take a pretty solid guess though.

You know what's funny. That argument is really, really poor. Know why? Because both Blacklist and Chaos Theory from SC use the same engine and yet you'd never be able to tell they were the same. Things that look drastically different can use the same code just like completely different code can wind up looking very similar. And what your Mona Lisa analogy fails to show is that you can tell with your eyes alone that it's Da Vinci's work. Or at least a good forgey. Either way, even if it's a forgery -- I attribute it to Da Vinci because it's very obviously his style and his piece. I can SEE that. But again...all you're seeing is the OUTCOME of code: the gameplay. You're not looking AT the code itself because then yes, you'd be able to see if it was the same or not.

What we're arguing about is the CODE. I don't give a rat's behind about what the game looks like during gameplay. If we're looking at a painting and wondering who made the piece, then we look at the brush work ad all that and we figure out that it's Da Vinci. We may discover it's a forgery but we'll know who the original artists was regardless. Since we're not discussing the similarity of the VISUAL aspect because no sh*t it has gameplay VERY similar to AC but it's the CODE that's being questioned. Without seeing the code, we have no idea if it's the same or not. You can't take a guess because you're making complete assumptions. I could make the same assumption that Darksiders uses code from Prince of Persia because look -- he's running on walls in an almost identical manner! Look the combat is somewhat similar too! And yet there's no proof that DS uses PoP code, they';re just similar. Likewise, SoM is similar to AC and we have absolutely no idea whether it uses AC2 code. One dev claims it's the same and it looks very similar. That's all we have. Do you know how many modern war games you could accuse of using the same code as one another since they have the same mechanics, same look, same everything? Or how many J-RPG's you could claim use the same code as they all play very similar to one another and more or less have an anime vibe?

You're using visuals as supposed evidence for CODE. Frankly, that's inane. I'm no coder but I'm pretty sure there are multiple ways to code the same things. There is absolutely no evidence of stolen code except for one AC2 dev. That same dev also gave the game his blessing more or less ANYWAY.

Farlander1991
01-27-2014, 01:50 PM
Couldn't resist checking in back for a bit to see if this is discussed here, and I see the discussions are multi-threaded (most of them closed) and epic :D Honestly, though, I think it shows just how weird our brain works. All over the Internet people are yelling AC-ripoff just because of the animations when Shadow of Mordor, holistically speaking, is really insanely similar to Batman: Arkham City. To make the comparison short: historical tourism with crowds of neutral NPCs and lots of colors vs. a lonely predatorial experience behind the dark and grim enemy lines to crush the forces from within. I'm sorry, Shadow is a lot closer to the second one. And in all three games you can climb whatever you like and have different acrobatic moves and silent (or loud) takedowns.

But my main question is... so what if the character moves insanely similar to Assassins? It's still a different experience overall. Now if Shadows of Mordor tried to create a historical title, then maybe there would've been some grounds to be angry. But then maybe we'd have something like this on our hands (http://store.steampowered.com/app/263680/) :p Only with somewhat more quality, since, well, Monolith. :p

PS. Oh, and it's impossible to say if a code's been stolen without seeing the code. Just saying. Otherwise the first Call of Duty game has stolen the code from Medal of Honor: Allied Assault :p (both awesome games, btw). Okay, well, maybe not the best example since they both use the same Quake III engine, but you know what I mean! :p

EDIT: Speaking of engines, Monolith uses their own proprietary Lithtech engine (well, I don't think it's called Lithtech right now, but that's not the point). The legacy of this engine goes way back from 1998. Assassin's Creed uses Anvil. With legacy going back way to 2003 with the Jade engine (IIRC Jade was the base for Anvil, I may be wrong). If people think that transferring code written for one proprietary engine that had things building up in it (and rewritten and refactored as time went on) from way-way-way before (and has things working a certain way in a certain structure) to another proprietary engine that had separate things building up in it (and rewritten and refactored as time went on) from way-way-way before (that has things working in its own certain way with its own certain structure) is a piece of cake, they're REALLY wrong :p It's a lot less hassle to just write the 'ripped-off' parts from scratch.

marcbryan
01-27-2014, 01:57 PM
To avoid anymore claims, of course they will. I personally think this game looks terrible. The Arkham combat sucks IMO, and the parkouring, despite looking similar to AC and being next-gen, looks much worse by comparison. I don't understand why people are seeing some mediocre climbing and going ''Oh, it's what AC is suppose to be, but better''. It's clearly not. The only thing this game has going for it is its Nemesis System, which I believe with be heavily scripted, and the eye-candy effects, which will most likely not look as great in the real game.

I agree minus the bits about Arkham's combat system and the Nemesis System. Maybe it was just the brooding commentary but I was really unimpressed. If we are to play as a ranger there should be less emphasis on special powers and more on hand to hand combat. I really like the Tolkien universe but it just seems like they are trying too hard on this one! I'll give it a chance.

ACII mechanics were not that impressive.

BandicootBeav
01-27-2014, 03:19 PM
Don't see why people are getting angry over this, the air assassination animation is completely different from the one used in ac2. Plus how many ways can the human body actually climb up something like that, if I did it would probably look exactly the same. I used to do parkour and sometimes be with over 50 people doing it, and yes we are all individuals but how some people jump, vault and climb looks exactly the same, well to me anyway. I don't think they have "ripped off" ac by any means, and im a huge ac fan. I don't see how you can have vaulting, climbing and jumping without looking similar to something that's already been done in another game.

I think people need to calm down about this, this can only be a good thing in my opinion especially for lord of the rings fans like myself. Haven't had a decent game in that universe since the movie games and the third age which I love. Conquest was an abomination and war in the north was meh as well. I hope this game will be as good as it looks. So yeah maybe Ubisoft will take a look at this game and see it as a bit of competition in this open wolrd/ parkour / stealth genre, can only be a good thing :)

UKassassinsfan
01-27-2014, 06:06 PM
Personally don't care, AC is getting boring with the same mechanics and missions so it was be nice to see another franchise have another crack at the "ac style game"

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-27-2014, 10:55 PM
To avoid anymore claims, of course they will. I personally think this game looks terrible. The Arkham combat sucks IMO, and the parkouring, despite looking similar to AC and being next-gen, looks much worse by comparison. I don't understand why people are seeing some mediocre climbing and going ''Oh, it's what AC is suppose to be, but better''. It's clearly not. The only thing this game has going for it is its Nemesis System, which I believe with be heavily scripted, and the eye-candy effects, which will most likely not look as great in the real game.

AC does still have the best climbing/parkour animations in any game. Aside from Mirror's Edge which is linear but has more input from the player and feels more like real parkour do to the first person view (but that's an unfair comparison as the two are vastly different) but Shadow of Mordor is second best. Saboteur tried open world parkour and climbing and the animations were bad. Infamous does it and it's not that great. It's not as bad as the Saboteur but it just doesn't look as realistic as AC's. But you're wrong saying that climbing looked bad. There were virtually no differences in the climbing animation (for instance, what it looks like when he shimmies on a ledge or is on the wire connection between buildings). About the only thing that looked worse was a moment where he had his back against a wall on a ledge and then turned and jumped up to a ledge and even that wasn't that bad.

Mediocre, it is not. inFamous, Saboteur have much more "mediocre" climbing than this game.

Then again, you think Arkham's combat sucks and that's just. Wow. Ok.

dxsxhxcx
01-27-2014, 11:09 PM
The Arkham combat sucks IMO.

other than the aesthetic differences (Arkham is hand to hand while AC relies on weapons) what makes the Arkham combat system so different from AC's? Arkham combat is what AC's combat should've been at this point, both combat systems gives you the option to button mash your way through the enemies or rely on counters, the difference is that Arkham combat system is much more fluid in both sides, I really can't tell how that can be worse than what we have in AC where enemies take ages to attack you and don't represent any challenge...

also the Arkham system makes a MUCH better use of your weapons/tools during combat (and the game in general)...

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-27-2014, 11:26 PM
other than the aesthetic differences (Arkham is hand to hand while AC relies on weapons) what makes the Arkham combat system so different from AC's? Arkham combat is what AC's combat should've been at this point, both combat systems gives you the option to button mash your way through the enemies or rely on counters, the difference is that Arkham combat system is much more fluid in both sides, I really can't tell how that can be worse than what we have in AC where enemies take ages to attack you and don't represent any challenge...

also the Arkham system makes a MUCH better use of your weapons/tools during combat...

The only thing is that AC's more grounded. Like you said, Arkham's got a better flow to it's combat but that also is because if you look, Batman almost slides and glides around. I'm okay with this in Arkham because it's based on a comic book where things are already wildly fantasy even for Batman (for instance, the size of Batman in the comics vs. his ability to run around on rooftops and do flips doesn't make sense.) At the same time, I can justify this floatiness to his cape helping him during combat.

AC's on the other hand is more realistic in that you're kind of planted to the ground as you move about though some sort of ability to vault over people like Batman's might be cool but it'd have to be pretty realistic looking for me to buy it.

Oh and I HOPE Shadow of Mordor doesn't change it's animations. I mean, they might cause of all the AC comparisons but maaaan. AC shouldn't be the only game that gets to have that kind of climbing. I've yet to see a game that handled parkour and climbing just as well and this game finally did it and they even seem to apply it differently: it looks more focused on entering enemy-controlled areas and reamining either undetected or fighting your way through as opposed to crowded cities with civilians and the like. I do hope there are cities with civilians to explore and that you can push your way through them. There doesn't have to be a blend mechanic (because hello more AC comparisons) but just crowds of civilians will make the areas more fun IMO. I don't want to be in an open world full of JUST bad guys.

dxsxhxcx
01-27-2014, 11:45 PM
The only thing is that AC's more grounded. Like you said, Arkham's got a better flow to it's combat but that also is because if you look, Batman almost slides and glides around. I'm okay with this in Arkham because it's based on a comic book where things are already wildly fantasy even for Batman (for instance, the size of Batman in the comics vs. his ability to run around on rooftops and do flips doesn't make sense.) At the same time, I can justify this floatiness to his cape helping him during combat.

AC's on the other hand is more realistic in that you're kind of planted to the ground as you move about though some sort of ability to vault over people like Batman's might be cool but it'd have to be pretty realistic looking for me to buy it.

Oh and I HOPE Shadow of Mordor doesn't change it's animations. I mean, they might cause of all the AC comparisons but maaaan. AC shouldn't be the only game that gets to have that kind of climbing. I've yet to see a game that handled parkour and climbing just as well and this game finally did it and they even seem to apply it differently: it looks more focused on entering enemy-controlled areas and reamining either undetected or fighting your way through as opposed to crowded cities with civilians and the like. I do hope there are cities with civilians to explore and that you can push your way through them. There doesn't have to be a blend mechanic (because hello more AC comparisons) but just crowds of civilians will make the areas more fun IMO. I don't want to be in an open world full of JUST bad guys.


I should've mentioned that slide movement he does because I was certain someone would bring that up, I don't have a problem with it in Batman as well, while I think we could have something similar in AC (by making the character roll and hit another enemy), do that with the same frequency we do on Batman would be weird (but from what I can remember that movement was manual in the Arkham games), but did you already tried to wait for the enemies to attack you to rely on counter or avoid to use that slide movement during combat?

The enemies attack you much faster in that game, this alone brings a lot of fluidity to combat (and IMO is something that needs to be improved in AC), animations are shorter as well what certainly helps...

Fatal-Feit
01-28-2014, 12:15 AM
other than the aesthetic differences (Arkham is hand to hand while AC relies on weapons) what makes the Arkham combat system so different from AC's? Arkham combat is what AC's combat should've been at this point, both combat systems gives you the option to button mash your way through the enemies or rely on counters, the difference is that Arkham combat system is much more fluid in both sides, I really can't tell how that can be worse than what we have in AC where enemies take ages to attack you and don't represent any challenge...

also the Arkham system makes a MUCH better use of your weapons/tools during combat (and the game in general)...

I enjoy the Arkham games a lot, but the combat was never something satisfying or even fun for me, personally. I'm a HUGE fan of 3rd person action games, don't get me wrong. I play my DmCs, Bayonetta, and Darksiders religiously, but that's not what the Arkham series are. The HUD's too flashy and I'm not a fan of being patronized by numbers in games like that. It's probably because I play very hardcore in action games that I don't find the Arkham combat fun in the least. You dodge,flip, counter, punch --repeat, repeat and more than once for certain enemies. It does a great job of keeping its own unique flow and changing up the formula, I give it that, but it becomes messy at times and the animations starts looking...inconsistent and fake by even Batman measures. Assassin's Creed isn't all realistic and you can take down swarms of enemies just as easily, but it stays true to its realism. And it looks much better by comparison, IMO. You aren't sweeping across the map or blocking at the speed of light in combat, you see your Assassin turn/jog/run up to them. You aren't flipping all over the place, you're making a stand, blocking and countering, which I personally think looks better. And when you try to be aggressive, there's a more stable realistic flow to it. But again, these are my opinions. I can understand if some of you prefer Arkham's combat. My friend John does too and whenever I'm at his house, we always make bets to see how many points we can get in the Carnival.


AC does still have the best climbing/parkour animations in any game. Aside from Mirror's Edge which is linear but has more input from the player and feels more like real parkour do to the first person view (but that's an unfair comparison as the two are vastly different) but Shadow of Mordor is second best. Saboteur tried open world parkour and climbing and the animations were bad. Infamous does it and it's not that great. It's not as bad as the Saboteur but it just doesn't look as realistic as AC's. But you're wrong saying that climbing looked bad. There were virtually no differences in the climbing animation (for instance, what it looks like when he shimmies on a ledge or is on the wire connection between buildings). About the only thing that looked worse was a moment where he had his back against a wall on a ledge and then turned and jumped up to a ledge and even that wasn't that bad.

Mediocre, it is not. inFamous, Saboteur have much more "mediocre" climbing than this game.

Then again, you think Arkham's combat sucks and that's just. Wow. Ok.

True, the parkour isn't that bad, but it's not AC level, and that's the point I'm trying to make. The game isn't AC in the least. The parkouring is similar, but it's not better, and the game itself is very different. ToKW, which is a short 3 episodes DLC, is not the entire AC franchise. Assassin's Creed didn't create stealth. If anything, I think this game looks more like a LOTR Tenchu.

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-28-2014, 12:17 AM
I should've mentioned that slide movement he does because I was certain someone would bring that up, I don't have a problem with it in Batman as well, while I think we could have something similar in AC (by making the character roll and hit another enemy), do that with the same frequency we do on Batman would be weird (but from what I can remember that movement was manual in the Arkham games), but did you already tried to wait for the enemies to attack you to rely on counter or avoid to use that slide movement during combat?

The enemies attack you much faster in that game, this alone brings a lot of fluidity to combat (and IMO is something that needs to be improved in AC), animations are shorter as well what certainly helps...

I tend to mix it up. I like to counter, I like to do the cape/daze/stun move and then repeatedly punch them quickly, I move between multiple enemies, I vault over them, I use gadgets. It just depends.

Yeah the roll to another enemy would be a good way of hiding it but you couldn't have it happen as often. I do like the rate of attacks as well in Arkham. That said... BOTH games suffer from only a few enemies attacking one at a time or only a handful attacking (though I love how Arkham has enemies attack in pairs or even in 3 way more often than AC) but what I think would be cool...perhaps moreso for Arkham than AC but both really -- dogpile. If a group is large enough, there should be a chance that they'll all dogpile you and you'll have to both counter while they try and knee and punch you on the ground AND press the attack button rapidly to do this sort of move that knocks them off of you. It works better for Arkham because again, comic cook -- you can buy Batman being able to do that and send them off of him a feet or two but in AC... not as believable. Though it could involve using the hidden blade to kill an enemy and then use the body to sort os dislodge the others and then slide out?

If they could incorporate it in a way that would work, a dogpile would be awesome as it would finally do away with the whole "why do they only attack one at a time" for the most part. But yes, enemies need to attack together more often in AC.

Fatal-Feit
01-28-2014, 12:28 AM
I would like to add that I DO think the Arkham combat is better than Assassin's Creed, but it's not my cup of tea. By suck, I don't mean it's universal, it's just a personal opinion of mine.

BoBwUzHeRe1138
01-28-2014, 12:43 AM
True, the parkour isn't that bad, but it's not AC level, and that's the point I'm trying to make. The game isn't AC in the least. The parkouring is similar, but it's not better, and the game itself is very different. ToKW, which is a short 3 episodes DLC, is not the entire AC franchise. Assassin's Creed didn't create stealth. If anything, I think this game looks more like a LOTR Tenchu.

I agree then. To me, if we're using AC as a yardstick and saying it's parkour is best, a 10/10. Then I'd say this is an 8 or 9. Good but not perfect. Where as inFamous would be like a 7 and Saboteur a 5 or 6.

I also agree... AC is all about densely populated cities with crowds to weave in and out of to get to your targets and whatnot. This game was more about traditional stealth -- stay out sight. He was sneaking by enemies. I know AC introduced missions like that (for example the war machine memories in Brotherhood but those werent the FOCUS of the game. I never got into Tenchu but I see what you mean.

Hans684
01-28-2014, 06:14 AM
Not a big diffrence, just another AC with additions in Midle Earth.