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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 01:50 PM
from: http://www.achtungpanzer.com/t34.htm

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/t34_58.jpg

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/ger_t34.jpg


http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/flakt34.jpg

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/flakt34_s.jpg




http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/air_power/ap18a.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 01:50 PM
from: http://www.achtungpanzer.com/t34.htm

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/t34_58.jpg

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/ger_t34.jpg


http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/flakt34.jpg

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/flakt34_s.jpg




http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/air_power/ap18a.jpg

fluke39
07-01-2003, 01:54 PM
hmmm cool

obvously the russian untermunchen stole all the t34 off the germans, so the germans had to start making panthers!






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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:30 PM
IIRC one of the few Finnish armoured units was equipped with captured Soviet T-28's.

And the 21st (or 22nd) Panzer Division that performed the very first counterattack against the Normandy landings what equipped with captured French armour like the Renault, the Somua and the Hotchkiss.

cheers/slush

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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:39 PM
The phrase "friendly fire" springs to mind! Those guys were just asking to get bombed, shot up or shelled!

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:45 PM
Slush69 wrote:
- IIRC one of the few Finnish armoured units was
- equipped with captured Soviet T-28's.

The Finns also operated a limited number of captured T34's, about nine of them IIRC. They were used on the Karelian front and later against the Germans in Lapland in '44 and '45.

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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 03:12 PM
Slush69 wrote:
- IIRC one of the few Finnish armoured units was
- equipped with captured Soviet T-28's.


In reality there were IIRC only two or three T-28 in use at any given time. Finnish had loads of T-26 though, so you may be thinking about that. T-26 is copied Vickers tank (6-ton tank?) and Finland bought some from UK before the war and then captured great deal more during the Winter War.

Finnish also utilised several T-34 later in the war (two of them still stand at guard on the gate of a armoured brigade in H¤meenlinna. Also in use were (number IIRC) 2 JSU-152's, number of BT-7 (aka "Christie") tanks, and a variety of other vehicles.

There was only one armored unit. It started as a armoured batallion, and was later expanded to a complete division. It is simply known as Panssaridivisioona (Armoured Division).

Here is a link to modern unit, Panssariprikaati. (http://www.panssariprikaati.fi/#) Pages are in Finnish, but don't be put of, there is quite a few nice pictures and especially the intro videos are quite nice. Just choose 320x240 and stereo to see the videos. If you choose section "perinteet", or in english heritage you will get to see war time footage of T-28, T-26 and BT-7 tanks.


-jippo

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 03:34 PM
SS Division "Das Reich" had at least a company equipped with captured T34's on the Eastern Front in mid-1943.

The Afrika Korps also employed captured British Matildas in 1941.

... and, to prove that beauty must truly be in the eye of the beholder, the Australians at one time actually operated a unit equipped with captured Italian tanks during the early Desert War.


Blutarski

fluke39
07-01-2003, 04:18 PM
BLUTARSKI wrote:
- SS Division "Das Reich" had at least a company
- equipped with captured T34's on the Eastern Front in
- mid-1943.

i bet that wasn't widely publicised at the time!


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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 05:31 PM
T-34s were also still being used in the Yugoslavian civil war in the 1990s.

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 07:17 PM
i think germans were first about to rebuild the t-34 .... but then constructed the panzer V (panther) which is quite similar to the t-34

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 10:56 PM
Bazoooooka wrote:
- i think germans were first about to rebuild the t-34

That was the leading idea of the 30 tons class tank request, and the whole design of one of the proposed project, but...

- .... but then constructed the panzer V (panther)
- which is quite similar to the t-34
-

Finally the tank that emerged from that request, the panther, got a very few to see with the T34.

The only similarity point is sloped armour.

All the rest is different.

Diesel engine versus petrol engine, rear gearbox and drive vs front, complete different suspensions ( double torsion bars for the panther ), supply power for turret traverse, interleaved road wheels, etc.

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 03:20 AM
I might be wrong, and probably I am, but in the second pic, the german cross on the turret, seems to be a little too small and also it seem to have a dark point in the midddle, wich will make it look more like the Mihai's Cross, the romanian signs used in WW2.
Pityfull, I realy don't know of any T-34 used in fact on the front, although , it seem to be some captured by romanian units at the begining of the war.
Again, I may be wrong...
if anyone knows anything, tell me
Best regards.

"The show must go on..."

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 12:27 PM
Maraudeur wrote:

-
- Finally the tank that emerged from that request, the
- panther, got a very few to see with the T34.
-
- The only similarity point is sloped armour.
-
- All the rest is different.

didnt want to say that the panther is similar to the t-34 from the technical point of view.... just that the germans looked at the t-34 and realized that they had do construct something equivalent to it... thats quite the panther... so "similar" should be replaced by "equivalent" ...thats right m8 ... i thinks thats what you said too

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 12:53 PM
But the Panther was totally superior to the T34 in terms of weaponry, armour, and visibility from the tank

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 01:10 PM
Kajari wrote:
- But the Panther was totally superior to the T34 in
- terms of weaponry, armour, and visibility from the
- tank

Hm... "totally superior" is not necessarily the kind of expression I would use. The late-war T-34/85 packed quite a wallop - enough to be a part of armies long after WW2.

No doubt that the Panther was a fine, if expensive, tank. But as the Germans had shown in 1939 and 1940, it's not about having the "best" tank, but having them in sufficient numbers at the right place. The Soviets could do exactly that with the T-34.

cheers/slush



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XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 01:19 PM
compare

http://www.onwar.com/tanks/germany/plans/pz5g.gif


http://www.onwar.com/tanks/ussr/plans/t3485m44.gif


http://www.onwar.com/tanks/ussr/plans/t347641.gif




http://www.stenbergaa.com/stenberg/white-dickeautos.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 01:36 PM
hmmm... they look pretty much the same. can´t see a big difference. perhaps the onwar.com in the middle has be captured? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif




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under 30k?

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 03:02 PM
The use of captured tanks on the EF was nothing of unusual practice.


http://www.battlefield.ru/captured/029.jpg



http://www.battlefield.ru/captured/041.jpg




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