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View Full Version : Ammar rebalancing and other modifications - Date to be defined



Aza404
10-11-2013, 02:55 PM
Dear champions,

After a lot of discussion between our designers and our VIP balancers, we came with a solution about the very strong Ammar.

Here’s what his new ability will be :
>>When you play a spell for the first time this turn, if your [MAGIC] level is 6 or more and your [DESTINY] level is 3 or more, draw a card<<

We will do our best to update the game before the finals of Road to Paris. We will keep you updated as soon as we can.
If we are not able to update for the finals, we will find another solution.

Update by Kimmundi:

Jared Pearson, Game Designer, leaked new infos on the patch during the Team Stream:


The cost of Strength of the Sea will rise from 3 to 4 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will increase from 3 to 4.
The cost of Gate to Nowhere will drop from 4 to 3 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will also drop from 4 to 3.


Also, some Achievements bugs, such as the Premium Deck, will be fixed.

Still no date, but it is targeted for end of october, beginning of november!


Thanks for your help and your understanding.
Aza404 and the DoC team

MamuzShah
10-11-2013, 03:06 PM
That's a pity. It was a good hero's ability.

SarethITA
10-11-2013, 03:11 PM
Best fix possible, not hard to find....

Durajczyk
10-11-2013, 03:16 PM
Ubi we love you! XD XD XD

NoobFish
10-11-2013, 03:17 PM
Hey,

i agree it is pretty strong, but i like playing against it. I almost have a deck against it which is also fine against others but i need some extra turns (like 3-4). Sometimes he starts his magic tricks in turn 5 which is way too early for a combo like this. maybe putting the requirements to 8 magic 4 fortune is a thing? i donīt know.

You cannot kill him in 5 turns when you are not super agro and he has his 1-0-5 wizard dude to defend and his splash spells to stop an early onslaught. furthermore, the turn before he starts his cycling he often drops like 3 or 4 of his no cost magic resist, magic channel dudes hoping at least on of them survives, which they often do, since i donīt know how to kill 3-4 dudes with 5 ressources.
Mizu-Kami is nice against him, since it withstands every spell and he has literally nothing to remove it. It can even block the wizard. Akane can also dispell every enchantment which is nice. The thing is i donīt always have the nut-draw to deal with everything and turn 5 is way too early. So i play Sanctuary and i see a chance if i adjust my deck with some stuff but i donīt know how the other factions do.

i like the idea of having this one special archenemy who you try to beat. it gives me a reason to play. i donīt know what i am playing for when there is nothing to achieve and just compete with the 1337 decklists everybody plays.

greetz

Revalon
10-11-2013, 03:17 PM
Maybe one should lower the requirements for the ability, since it would be a bit underpowered with this change, but good to see that something is done about this.

One could also just have changed chain casting to reducing spell costs to a minimum cost, maybe 1 or half the costs rounded up or something like that.
Would have kept Ammar's ability strong, but not as OP as it is.

ElkazFATE
10-11-2013, 03:18 PM
No more free wins on jp with my hakeem:(:(:(

GJ crry-babies

Freyjan
10-11-2013, 03:25 PM
Pretty much the template I've been saying it should have had at release.

Good looking out, look forward to seeing this soon. The ability will still be good and the hero will still have strong spell schools.

alternative83
10-11-2013, 03:27 PM
I must admit I didn't expect such an appropriate fix. It sounds like he's going to be exactly in line with most other expansion heroes, which is just great. (still 100 times better than Siham) Thanks devs, it is really the right thing to do (soon).

RedEmperor30
10-11-2013, 03:43 PM
Thank you dev's - this was going to be a game breaker for me

Nillicomes
10-11-2013, 03:55 PM
I am happy!

Durajczyk
10-11-2013, 03:57 PM
We all should play Ammar or Hakeem..
Brilliant idea man..

M0rw47h
10-11-2013, 03:57 PM
I am happy!

I am not.
No more Ammar tears when they got empty library, hand and graveyard.
And their tears were so sweet :mad:.

Evilcr33p
10-11-2013, 04:20 PM
if you are fixing stuff, please consider fixing the pimped out deck achievement too,

it's been reported that the devs are aware of the bug : http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/797500-Pimped-out-deck

so dont forget to fix that !
need dem 600 seals... already have the deck

Elementalist.
10-11-2013, 05:05 PM
Please fix Kieran and Siegfried too while at it ;)

smaster414
10-11-2013, 05:45 PM
The designers at UBISOFT and our so called VIP balancers need to stop catering to all the lazy whiners on these forums. All this so called "fix" is going to do is turn Ammar in to another un-played hero. He's perfectly fine the way he is. Speaking as someone who has been playing him for over a week now I can honestly tell you that he is far from a sure win each fight and is 1000% better than any OTK deck made in the past. No game makes it past 9 rounds and the game is over is less than 5 min. The opponent actually gets to play in every round except the one when Ammar starts his card drawing combo. My win rate is roughly 2 in 3 matches (around 65%), most of them coming from either good players that haven't run into him much so don't know how he works, bad players that shouldn't be above 1k elo to start with. Or lazy players that know how he works, but can't be bothered to play the counters to him. He's not that hard to beat here guys. There are only 12 creatures in this deck, 12 for god’s sake. It takes a min of 6 turns to get the combo going unless we pull of a miracle opening hand and get very good top deck draws. We have to have the catalyst fortune in our hand to make it work and there are only 4 in the deck. We also need to have a creature in play for 1 whole turn to attack you with. We can also only do a maximum of 18 damage in one turn. So if all of you that think this nerf is actually needed because you can't find a way to limit the cards we play a turn. Can't think of a way to take cards out of our deck. Can't find a way to kill a creature in 6 rounds. Can't keep your hero above 18 health. Or can't prevent any damage to your hero to start with. I encourage you to maybe try another game, solitaire comes to mind. Where the thinking is minor and any loses you get will be of no fault but your own. So when you complain it won’t affect the rest of the player base...

silentbobus
10-11-2013, 05:54 PM
The designers at UBISOFT and our so called VIP balancers need to stop catering to all the lazy whiners on these forums. All this so called "fix" is going to do is turn Ammar in to another un-played hero. He's perfectly fine the way he is. Speaking as someone who has been playing him for over a week now I can honestly tell you that he is far from a sure win each fight and is 1000% better than any OTK deck made in the past. No game makes it past 9 rounds and the game is over is less than 5 min. The opponent actually gets to play in every round except the one when Ammar starts his card drawing combo. My win rate is roughly 2 in 3 matches (around 65%), most of them coming from either good players that haven't run into him much so don't know how he works, bad players that shouldn't be above 1k elo to start with. Or lazy players that know how he works, but can't be bothered to play the counters to him. He's not that hard to beat here guys. There are only 12 creatures in this deck, 12 for god’s sake. It takes a min of 6 turns to get the combo going unless we pull of a miracle opening hand and get very good top deck draws. We have to have the catalyst fortune in our hand to make it work and there are only 4 in the deck. We also need to have a creature in play for 1 whole turn to attack you with. We can also only do a maximum of 18 damage in one turn. So if all of you that think this nerf is actually needed because you can't find a way to limit the cards we play a turn. Can't think of a way to take cards out of our deck. Can't find a way to kill a creature in 6 rounds. Can't keep your hero above 18 health. Or can't prevent any damage to your hero to start with. I encourage you to maybe try another game, solitaire comes to mind. Where the thinking is minor and any loses you get will be of no fault but your own. So when you complain it won’t affect the rest of the player base...

Heh, heh, it looks like this article was pretty timely http://www.cracked.com/blog/6-groundbreaking-ways-video-games-are-screwing-players:
"This system was recently removed, triggering a backlash from the players (which is proof that online gamers will complain about any change). If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers."

Personally I think Ammar is still pretty strong after the nerf, but will require a different style of play. Sometimes just outdrawing your opponent 3 to 2 is enough to get the win in drawn out games.

Iciclewind
10-11-2013, 06:04 PM
The designers at UBISOFT and our so called VIP balancers need to stop catering to all the lazy whiners on these forums. All this so called "fix" is going to do is turn Ammar in to another un-played hero. He's perfectly fine the way he is. Speaking as someone who has been playing him for over a week now I can honestly tell you that he is far from a sure win each fight and is 1000% better than any OTK deck made in the past. No game makes it past 9 rounds and the game is over is less than 5 min. The opponent actually gets to play in every round except the one when Ammar starts his card drawing combo. My win rate is roughly 2 in 3 matches (around 65%), most of them coming from either good players that haven't run into him much so don't know how he works, bad players that shouldn't be above 1k elo to start with. Or lazy players that know how he works, but can't be bothered to play the counters to him. He's not that hard to beat here guys. There are only 12 creatures in this deck, 12 for god’s sake. It takes a min of 6 turns to get the combo going unless we pull of a miracle opening hand and get very good top deck draws. We have to have the catalyst fortune in our hand to make it work and there are only 4 in the deck. We also need to have a creature in play for 1 whole turn to attack you with. We can also only do a maximum of 18 damage in one turn. So if all of you that think this nerf is actually needed because you can't find a way to limit the cards we play a turn. Can't think of a way to take cards out of our deck. Can't find a way to kill a creature in 6 rounds. Can't keep your hero above 18 health. Or can't prevent any damage to your hero to start with. I encourage you to maybe try another game, solitaire comes to mind. Where the thinking is minor and any loses you get will be of no fault but your own. So when you complain it won’t affect the rest of the player base...

Sorry I stopped reading after 2 lines. Clearly something is wrong if 80% of the players in T1 are using Ammar.

Ramymanify
10-11-2013, 06:17 PM
I encourage YOU to maybe play another game, you're complaining about people not thinking really ??
I find it atrociously funny coming from an Ammar abuser to be complaining about brain function when all you need to do is vomit your whole deck on one creature who will give you 0 resources spell advantage
2 tsunamis with 0 resource is very brain-oriented mechanic
now keep crying and let me enjoy my nerf

CrazehCrackah
10-11-2013, 06:33 PM
I was wondering how were you planning to fix Ammar without making him completely useless. It's funny that this simple, yet elegant, solution never crossed my mind. I am very pleased with this change.

DaveJame
10-11-2013, 06:39 PM
Btw. Another thing you could fix is the "Week of training" and "Nether soul"
Each of them work fine, until they meet. The problem is WoT gives a +1 bonus to a creatures under "Nether soul", but nether soul reads "Creatures A is always 0". There is a bug or a bad text somewhere.

Hantziie
10-11-2013, 06:44 PM
I usually don't get many problems with Ammar (except when i get a ****ty hand) but i'm pleased with this fix. Good Job team.

Revelataen
10-11-2013, 06:55 PM
WoW. Great job, good idea and very fast initiative :)

ElkazFATE
10-11-2013, 07:10 PM
The designers at UBISOFT and our so called VIP balancers need to stop catering to all the lazy whiners on these forums. All this so called "fix" is going to do is turn Ammar in to another un-played hero.

+1

btw. Im playing Kelthor and Hakeem the most.

ps. What was beta tester doing while beta tests of forgotten wars?

atord-Nordos
10-11-2013, 07:16 PM
I don't understand what you guys mean with 'unplayablle', tbh. It can be achieved pretty fast, to get to 6 magic, with Djinn mentor and Magic Channel. The only possible change could be to switch estiny with might (so, 3 might and 6 magic requirement), to make it more useful

hubin80
10-11-2013, 07:33 PM
Finally this will be fixed :)

smaster414
10-11-2013, 07:35 PM
I encourage YOU to maybe play another game, you're complaining about people not thinking really ??
I find it atrociously funny coming from an Ammar abuser to be complaining about brain function when all you need to do is vomit your whole deck on one creature who will give you 0 resources spell advantage
2 tsunamis with 0 resource is very brain-oriented mechanic
now keep crying and let me enjoy my nerf

My friend you make me laugh and just serve to prove my point. Even if I did "vomit" my entire deck up in the 2 min timer I've allowed. I can still only do 18 dmg in one turn to you. That means you have to let me keep a creature on the board for 1 full turn after I get 6 magic and 3 fortune while letting me some how do 2 dmg to you (or you do it to yourself). All the while not forcing me to discard any key cards or protecting your life or limiting the amount of cards I can play in a turn.

"Sorry I stopped reading after 2 lines. Clearly something is wrong if 80% of the players in T1 are using Ammar. "

Of course they are. It's highly effective and more importantly the games take less than 5 min. I can play 3 games using Ammar in the time it takes me to play with any other hero and personally I enjoy the games alot more. Besides, if the 80% weren't playing Ammar they'd all be playing something else. The meta changes with each new expansion and with each nerf that follows. This will always be the case. Why Ubi would nerf Ammar like this when there are so many counter cards that can be played by pretty much every hero is beyond me. Case in point, get yourself to T1 and start playing a Dhamara discard deck. You literally can't lose VS any Ammar deck.

alternative83
10-11-2013, 07:51 PM
You literally can't lose VS any Ammar deck.

Wait, what?

If Ammar is so bad, why are you even upset about the fix? And why would you even play this poor, feeble Ammar to whom there are so many counters??

Xandrios
10-11-2013, 08:07 PM
Ammar is perfectly balanced as he is. The problem is that every other hero in the game is underpowered, every single hero should have the ability to draw their entire deck in a turn in my opinion.

SoAmazinglyBad
10-11-2013, 08:26 PM
The designers at UBISOFT and our so called VIP balancers need to stop catering to all the lazy whiners on these forums. All this so called "fix" is going to do is turn Ammar in to another un-played hero. He's perfectly fine the way he is. Speaking as someone who has been playing him for over a week now I can honestly tell you that he is far from a sure win each fight and is 1000% better than any OTK deck made in the past. No game makes it past 9 rounds and the game is over is less than 5 min. The opponent actually gets to play in every round except the one when Ammar starts his card drawing combo. My win rate is roughly 2 in 3 matches (around 65%), most of them coming from either good players that haven't run into him much so don't know how he works, bad players that shouldn't be above 1k elo to start with. Or lazy players that know how he works, but can't be bothered to play the counters to him. He's not that hard to beat here guys. There are only 12 creatures in this deck, 12 for god’s sake. It takes a min of 6 turns to get the combo going unless we pull of a miracle opening hand and get very good top deck draws. We have to have the catalyst fortune in our hand to make it work and there are only 4 in the deck. We also need to have a creature in play for 1 whole turn to attack you with. We can also only do a maximum of 18 damage in one turn. So if all of you that think this nerf is actually needed because you can't find a way to limit the cards we play a turn. Can't think of a way to take cards out of our deck. Can't find a way to kill a creature in 6 rounds. Can't keep your hero above 18 health. Or can't prevent any damage to your hero to start with. I encourage you to maybe try another game, solitaire comes to mind. Where the thinking is minor and any loses you get will be of no fault but your own. So when you complain it won’t affect the rest of the player base...

LOL.... today i played a game dhamira vs ammar... till turn 10 i manage to clear every creature (djinn, tutors, schoolars) i managed to discard 2 or 3 chain casting, dealt about 15 dmg and what happens? He put pao, cosmic singularity, use observatory picks discarded chain casting and kills me in this round... like real wtf i can do more i used 2 halls of amnesia (for ice weapons) 2 or 3 discard from dhamira and im still losing... if i would face sandal, adar malik or anything else and i did 15 dmg and discard few vital cards i would win 100% sure... but with ammar its different... Not to mention that ability to use about 30 cards in on turn is just ridicolous

coinskasad
10-11-2013, 08:27 PM
No game makes it past 9 rounds and the game is over is less than 5 min.

While i personally do not feel that Ammar isn't beatable (I have won plenty matches against him) that very point that you have made is what I have against him. Having met multiple Ammars back to back in jackpot, with every match literally being "Oh lets see if i got the right draws to see if I can win before he starts his combo", the game gets boring VERY fast.

ElkazFATE
10-11-2013, 08:34 PM
,,LOL.... today i played a game dhamira vs ammar... till turn 10 i manage to clear every creature (djinn, tutors, schoolars) i managed to discard 2 or 3 chain casting, dealt about 15 dmg and what happens? He put pao''

Where was your earth grasp?^^

SoAmazinglyBad
10-11-2013, 08:36 PM
Just to clear up my post.... I would like to say that Im ok if ammar used his resources just as any other hero in game... U have cards in hand, u have ur resources... u can use it but dont use just every single card in ur deck in turn 6 or turn 10... while u had @ beginning of the turn, 5 or 6 cards.... that just ******ed.... and i think it just destroys rules of card game...

SoAmazinglyBad
10-11-2013, 08:39 PM
,,LOL.... today i played a game dhamira vs ammar... till turn 10 i manage to clear every creature (djinn, tutors, schoolars) i managed to discard 2 or 3 chain casting, dealt about 15 dmg and what happens? He put pao''

Where was your earth grasp?^^

not enough cards in hand from my side i guess

lordmorto
10-11-2013, 10:11 PM
to much nerf on him are u planning on changeing him again?

like getting at max of X cards base on the number of resources.

hanika666
10-11-2013, 11:08 PM
Thank you dev's - this was going to be a game breaker for me

It was for me. Was already kinda annoyed at things like Wombo Combo etc. Started playing over a month ago and played die hard everyday, Spent cash on it, until I hit a few Ammars in a row and was like.......Ok, what other card games are out there. lol.

Frrfrr
10-12-2013, 01:02 AM
i dont get it. finally some cool patch removing test mistakes and people complain. i see huge development in UBI starting to do right things. the people defending amar deck should wake up. fully unbalanced game prefering 1 deck and no variety seems gone
good job devs! even later saying we did wrong and now we do better is cool!
please, make the cards available for every deck!
thx

ManlyMantonio
10-12-2013, 01:04 AM
I love the players that are trying to rationalize Ammar as balanced. Were they defending old-school Prison decks too?

Good times, good change.

ArcaneAzmadi
10-12-2013, 01:16 AM
While I'm glad you recognised the problem -these "draw my entire deck in 1 turn and 1-shot you" decks were ridiculous and stupid- I think that's a bit too much. Maybe reduce it to "the first 2 spells you play in a turn".

Yuber90
10-12-2013, 01:39 AM
Noooo, it was so easy to reach T1 with Ammar, now I have to play using my brain? ;__;

Fakirbocko
10-12-2013, 09:05 AM
nice, like i say in other theme, this is best solutions for ammar and i am happy for it :)

Durajczyk
10-12-2013, 09:24 AM
Good point man XD

SoAmazinglyBad
10-12-2013, 10:13 AM
While I'm glad you recognised the problem -these "draw my entire deck in 1 turn and 1-shot you" decks were ridiculous and stupid- I think that's a bit too much. Maybe reduce it to "the first 2 spells you play in a turn".

First time i agree with you. Nice change.

B4ldry
10-12-2013, 12:44 PM
PLS fix the achivment "pimped out deck" too

Zergspawner
10-12-2013, 03:19 PM
Dear champions,

After a lot of discussion between our designers and our VIP balancers, we came with a solution about the very strong Ammar.

Here’s what his new ability will be :
>>When you play a spell for the first time this turn, if your [MAGIC] level is 6 or more and your [DESTINY] level is 3 or more, draw a card<<

We will do our best to update the game before the finals of Road to Paris. We will keep you updated as soon as we can.
If we are not able to update for the finals, we will find another solution.

Thanks for your help and your understanding.
Aza404 and the DoC team


Fine solution, the card seemed a bit on the OP side.
That being said. Any hope of getting a wildcard refund as the card is now "worthless"?

RoyceLin
10-12-2013, 05:45 PM
I still think instead of adding restriction "once per turn", adding restriction on the spell "with cost at least 1 resource" will be better. No matter how, please balance Ammar asap. Thanks.

Radoslawl
10-12-2013, 05:52 PM
6 games in jackpot - 4 ammars.
Just fix it asap.

Maxmeisel
10-12-2013, 10:31 PM
Very good step forward!

Best part of the fix is the wildcard loss to all those ammar lamers.

Next step is to add "cant play any card this turn" to alot of the active hero abilities like dhamiria or akane.

Revalon
10-12-2013, 11:27 PM
Very good step forward!

Best part of the fix is the wildcard loss to all those ammar lamers.

Next step is to add "cant play any card this turn" to alot of the active hero abilities like dhamiria or akane.

Yeah, but why not banish all the abilities? And give every hero every spell school. There would be no "bla bla that hero is OP"-whining anymore.
Or even better: change the whole concept, make every match a simply coin flip deciding who wins. 50/50 win rate for evrybody, hooray!

ulpsz
10-13-2013, 01:54 AM
While i personally do not feel that Ammar isn't beatable (I have won plenty matches against him) that very point that you have made is what I have against him. Having met multiple Ammars back to back in jackpot, with every match literally being "Oh lets see if i got the right draws to see if I can win before he starts his combo", the game gets boring VERY fast.

this kind of sums up my thoughts ....

deck was definatley beatable ..NOT A GUARANTEED WIN at all...but it got boring fast

hope I win him from swiss untill the nerf so , I can abuse him a little too...



but the nerf is too drastic...now the ability is kind of underpowered as the requirements are too high..maybe lower the requirements a bit ; like 5 magic /2 fortune...

SoAmazinglyBad
10-13-2013, 08:19 AM
this deck was unbalanced because only a very few decks could have win vs it with no problem and even if u did a lot of right you still could lose in 1 turn if he topdecked correct card(like chain casting/catalyst jinn)

nerf is so hard that i am sure that ammar decks wont be made to use that ability because he will be force to go creatures now (cause stall decks sucks now and he cant combo you in 1 turn) and if he goes creature spell deck i am sure that everyone will just go to pick up gazal or myranda cause of better (useful) abilities

lafreca
10-13-2013, 12:49 PM
Hey,guys.Yesterdey i spend 200 wc to build Ammar and now you nerf it to tier5.So what about me?I need to farm 100000 lvl and build new deck?Why not nerf Dharmia?Or Sandalpgon?!

Durajczyk
10-13-2013, 01:20 PM
Cucu reached 400 level yesterday so good luck Ammar!

swifF101
10-13-2013, 04:17 PM
WoW Ubisoft. Now u have to face noobs request a nerf every week. Congratulations!!

really bad decision, because there are so many ppl who farmed a deck for him. i see many ppl quitting this game with that decision.
gz

ioulios
10-13-2013, 05:06 PM
good job we dont like abusers!

Radoslawl
10-13-2013, 09:02 PM
So u r crying beause going for a cheap deck to devastate low elo players and bore to death others in JP?

Ha ha ha ha roofles.

Gelerth108
10-13-2013, 09:23 PM
Noooo, it was so easy to reach T1 with Ammar, now I have to play using my brain? ;__;
Great! Probably this is the main problem of opponents of nerf. There is no brain offered for seals.

lynn2baie
10-13-2013, 11:06 PM
Hurry it up. Ammar has made Swiss negative fun for me. Done with DoC until the fix.

P.s. I have the cards make the same deck but broken is broken, have some pride people.

swifF101
10-14-2013, 03:04 PM
Please also nerf those necro decks with wasteland, throne, etc ... MUCH MORE OP THAN AMMAR!!!! very annoying to play against it, so it should also be nerfed like ammar now

Radoslawl
10-14-2013, 05:50 PM
Hahaaaa the tears of nobrainers and farmers.

swifF101
10-14-2013, 07:27 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/800805-What-is-the-next-card-to-get-nerfed

After nerfing the first card from the new set. this thread is according to your attitude in nerfing things so fast. there are much more powerful combos out there, which are harder to counter than ammar.

Qzin89
10-14-2013, 09:58 PM
Okay here's my thought:

You went too far with that nerf. I mean seriously I'd see it much more balanced with ability:

"Each time you play instant spell" or I'd lower requirement to only be 6 magic levels and NONE in fortune. Because 1 more card is not that much of advantage. It sure is, but it's not that big ;).

The way it's gonna work it's just gonna be underpowered. The day you implement the change you'll see all the blind arbiters back in collections.

swifF101
10-14-2013, 11:43 PM
Okay here's my thought:

You went too far with that nerf. I mean seriously I'd see it much more balanced with ability:

"Each time you play instant spell" or I'd lower requirement to only be 6 magic levels and NONE in fortune. Because 1 more card is not that much of advantage. It sure is, but it's not that big ;).

The way it's gonna work it's just gonna be underpowered. The day you implement the change you'll see all the blind arbiters back in collections.

Thats exactly the point. Or maybe limit the cards drawed to 2-3

hubin23
10-15-2013, 09:40 AM
When will this balancing patch finally be out?

No point of playing swiss until then (unless one plays Amar himself perhaps).

swifF101
10-15-2013, 04:40 PM
and then there will come a new tactic u cant beat in your swisses and u wont play them until this get nerfed too?
really clever hubin ;)

razcrux
10-15-2013, 06:13 PM
The sooner the better for this patch. Hopefully yesterday.
;-)

New ability will make Ammar follow the same pattern as the other new heroes "the first time you ____ gain/do ____" -- which will make him more balanced (gain 1 health, enemy takes 2 damage etc.)

Qzin89
10-15-2013, 09:54 PM
The sooner the better for this patch. Hopefully yesterday.
;-)

New ability will make Ammar follow the same pattern as the other new heroes "the first time you ____ gain/do ____" -- which will make him more balanced (gain 1 health, enemy takes 2 damage etc.)


Well Morgan should heal FIRST time then too ;). Oh wait this won't happen until people CRY A LOT ;).

Seriously I dont play ammar anymore. I've found new OP deck for me that's working pretty nicely. People will whine anyway when it gets more popular but hey not my problem :). I find Ammar weak by comparison ;). (Unless it was my version with paos!)


Still I hope he will get nerfed a little - not totally. I mean get his magic requirement down to 5 and remove fortune one and he is good. Not OP.

Same with morgan: Make it first time in turn and make his requirements 4 might, 3 fortune and he is also good but not overpowered ;).

Durendal100
10-15-2013, 10:57 PM
Well its kinda boring out there tbh. We got like few heroes playable at high lvl. The rest is just bleh. Ofc we can start nerfing some of them like Ammar here but maybe instead lets buff those ******ed ones we got already? Jezziel, Sieg, Belias,Acamas, Noboru etc..... jeez how many more freakng exp we need to see those heroes in game?

Just to picture how ******ed the situation is i will show the most known ****** vs new just added hero

[IMG]http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/9241/d74a.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/211/d74a.png/) vs http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/3710/fd3b.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/41/fd3b.png/)

xthatwhiteguyx
10-16-2013, 06:50 PM
Maybe one should lower the requirements for the ability, since it would be a bit underpowered with this change, but good to see that something is done about this.

One could also just have changed chain casting to reducing spell costs to a minimum cost, maybe 1 or half the costs rounded up or something like that.
Would have kept Ammar's ability strong, but not as OP as it is.

In what way will an extra card every turn be underpowered? You have seen the other heroes, haven't you?

SasMeng
10-17-2013, 02:15 AM
I think this update is a mistake. Having played ccgs since 1992 I have seen all sorts of new cards warp the meta game and demand adjustments. In my experience that has always been a good thing keeping competitive players on their toes and thinking. Only in cases where there is no way to stop a deck should a nerf be considered. Given the nature of this game revolving about heroes, I don't see the value of introducing new heroes that don't offer any compelling reason to use them (as Ammar will now become useless).

AmineM2
10-17-2013, 09:44 AM
I think this update is a mistake. Having played ccgs since 1992 I have seen all sorts of new cards warp the meta game and demand adjustments. In my experience that has always been a good thing keeping competitive players on their toes and thinking. Only in cases where there is no way to stop a deck should a nerf be considered. Given the nature of this game revolving about heroes, I don't see the value of introducing new heroes that don't offer any compelling reason to use them (as Ammar will now become useless).

Agree with everything you wrote, apart from the useless Ammar line: It will be useful to a degree.

sterkmonster
10-18-2013, 12:45 PM
i dont see any tactic behind Ammar,is just an auto win at turn 6 against most of the decks,all that says the opposite are the people that used wildcards to complete that deck and now feel a little bad ,but that was clearly a game ruining hero . you should have smelled this nerf

silentbobus
10-18-2013, 02:37 PM
I think this update is a mistake. Having played ccgs since 1992 I have seen all sorts of new cards warp the meta game and demand adjustments. In my experience that has always been a good thing keeping competitive players on their toes and thinking. Only in cases where there is no way to stop a deck should a nerf be considered. Given the nature of this game revolving about heroes, I don't see the value of introducing new heroes that don't offer any compelling reason to use them (as Ammar will now become useless).

Indeed, adjustments to the meta via card rebalancing helps to keep players on their toes. It's the slow and inflexible ones that have trouble adjusting and repeatedly cry out against nerfs. Once they've found one way to win they'd rather repeat it and not have to come up with something new once the OP deck they've been playing is brought down to a more managable level.

But I disagree that once this nerf is in place that Ammar will be useless. The deck that everyone is running right now certainly will not be played, but I see no reason outdrawing your opponent 3 cards to 2 can't win you the game over a long enough timeline. This nerf should kill the current 1/6/3 OTK version of Ammar, but there's still a control version that people haven't bothered to explore.

Kimundi
10-18-2013, 05:59 PM
Jared Pearson, Game Designer, leaked new infos on the patch during the Team Stream:


The cost of Strength of the Sea will rise from 3 to 4 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will increase from 3 to 4.
The cost of Gate to Nowhere will drop from 4 to 3 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will also drop from 4 to 3.


Also, some Achievements bugs, such as the Premium Deck, will be fixed.

Still no date, but it is targeted for end of october, beginning of november!

Freyjan
10-18-2013, 06:08 PM
Interesting...pretty big SotS nerf. Doubt the Gate buff will make it much more playable since I don't believe the cost is what was holding it back.

You don't mention the actual Ammar nerf, is that implied to be in the next patch as well?

Kimundi
10-18-2013, 06:09 PM
Yes of course :) It's in addition to the Ammar rebalancing!

coinmagic45
10-18-2013, 06:29 PM
Interesting...pretty big SotS nerf. Doubt the Gate buff will make it much more playable since I don't believe the cost is what was holding it back.

You don't mention the actual Ammar nerf, is that implied to be in the next patch as well?

Since SotS is the only Unique Spell I don't have, I'm not too upset about this one. Actually, considering I play against it a ton, I'm pretty happy about it!

I agree completely about Gate. It needs to be modified to be useful. Even if it cost 1 with a 1 Magic requirement, I doubt it would be worth playing...

Freyjan
10-18-2013, 06:41 PM
I bought mine with WC nearly immediately. Since then I've pulled 3 more. Go figure, lol.

silentbobus
10-18-2013, 06:43 PM
Jared Pearson, Game Designer, leaked new infos on the patch during the Team Stream:


The cost of Strength of the Sea will rise from 3 to 4 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will increase from 3 to 4.
The cost of Gate to Nowhere will drop from 4 to 3 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will also drop from 4 to 3.


Also, some Achievements bugs, such as the Premium Deck, will be fixed.

Still no date, but it is targeted for end of october, beginning of november!

I agree with both of the stated changes, but if you're going to be modifying unique epics, shouldn't someone be taking a look at Might of Nature? Might of Nature was already ahead of Strength of the Sea on power level before the Strength of the Sea nerf.

RoyceLin
10-18-2013, 07:52 PM
Jared Pearson, Game Designer, leaked new infos on the patch during the Team Stream:
The cost of Gate to Nowhere will drop from 4 to 3 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will also drop from 4 to 3.


Please modify its ability so that it is playable :)

Sesouma
10-18-2013, 08:55 PM
5 times Ammar in jackpot Tournament, why you need always so long for a patch. This is now fun to play always against this..... .

Revalon
10-18-2013, 09:14 PM
Didn't think that SotS needed a nerf.
Not as gamebreaking as MoN or wombo combo.

Qzin89
10-18-2013, 11:06 PM
Well people will ALWAYS complain. Aspecially ones that can't figure on their own how to outplay someone's combo ;).

Right now i have 100% win ratio vs Ammar.decks ;). Either with paos or without them ;).

And you know what? Meta is balancing itself. Always. Blind Arbiters are used now because there are many decks on Ammar and Ammars are getting punished badly ;)

razcrux
10-19-2013, 04:14 AM
Well people will ALWAYS complain. Aspecially ones that can't figure on their own how to outplay someone's combo ;).

Right now i have 100% win ratio vs Ammar.decks ;). Either with paos or without them ;).

And you know what? Meta is balancing itself. Always. Blind Arbiters are used now because there are many decks on Ammar and Ammars are getting punished badly ;)

The fact that everyone is running blind arbiters is proof that it is IMBA. Without them my deck would have zero chance against the zero skill Ammar players I come across. ;-)

As for SotS vs MoN. MoN does nothing if you dispel it immediately, SotS gives an immediate huge amount of damage buff and the fortune ward part of it decimates a lot of possible fortune based decks. Imagine if the card gave all your creatures Spell ward? That would invalidate more than half the heroes who use spells...

MoN costs 4 and SotS is easily also worth 4. It's always been underpriced for what it gives you.

Wombo is a one time deal and requires two/three cards to pull off. It's powerful but you can plan around it; just like forbidden flame.

These balance changes are all very positive and I'm happy that the designers aren't afraid to make important changes for the greater good of the game experience and to keep high level competitive play as diverse and exciting as possible.

Jarrman
10-19-2013, 07:27 AM
Dear champions,

After a lot of discussion between our designers and our VIP balancers, we came with a solution about the very strong Ammar.

...

Thanks for your help and your understanding.
Aza404 and the DoC team

What about buffing awfully bad cards, you guys, designed? I don't want to sound rude, but methinks you went pretty nuts balancing them.

http://i.imgur.com/UkxQgok.jpg

SoAmazinglyBad
10-19-2013, 10:14 AM
The fact that everyone is running blind arbiters is proof that it is IMBA. Without them my deck would have zero chance against the zero skill Ammar players I come across. ;-)

As for SotS vs MoN. MoN does nothing if you dispel it immediately, SotS gives an immediate huge amount of damage buff and the fortune ward part of it decimates a lot of possible fortune based decks. Imagine if the card gave all your creatures Spell ward? That would invalidate more than half the heroes who use spells...

MoN costs 4 and SotS is easily also worth 4. It's always been underpriced for what it gives you.

Wombo is a one time deal and requires two/three cards to pull off. It's powerful but you can plan around it; just like forbidden flame.

These balance changes are all very positive and I'm happy that the designers aren't afraid to make important changes for the greater good of the game experience and to keep high level competitive play as diverse and exciting as possible.

That every creature fortune ward is just broken sadly :(

Revelataen
10-19-2013, 12:22 PM
Thx for great update! :)
SotS should costs 4 and now it will be ok.
GtN-> Nice, I think it won't be played anyway but in future... who knows?
Good rebalances, keep up good work and good luck! :)

@Jarrman
I'm not sure what are you talking about. There should be some good and some bad cards, like in all tcg.
Although, this Crusader is pretty nice...

luorax
10-19-2013, 04:57 PM
The fact that everyone is running blind arbiters is proof that it is IMBA. Without them my deck would have zero chance against the zero skill Ammar players I come across. ;-)

As for SotS vs MoN. MoN does nothing if you dispel it immediately, SotS gives an immediate huge amount of damage buff and the fortune ward part of it decimates a lot of possible fortune based decks. Imagine if the card gave all your creatures Spell ward? That would invalidate more than half the heroes who use spells...

MoN costs 4 and SotS is easily also worth 4. It's always been underpriced for what it gives you.

Wombo is a one time deal and requires two/three cards to pull off. It's powerful but you can plan around it; just like forbidden flame.

These balance changes are all very positive and I'm happy that the designers aren't afraid to make important changes for the greater good of the game experience and to keep high level competitive play as diverse and exciting as possible.

Well said :) MoN is also damn strong for decks that have no way of dispelling things, like my Adar deck. Both Fire and Dark schools lack dispelling spells, and these uniques are really strong against them.

Malvass
10-19-2013, 07:18 PM
I really hope the patch will come asap! Ammar is so MUCH annoying.

iZosiek
10-21-2013, 08:05 AM
Hello.
I have some ideas for the "balancing path". Not sure if Devs are reading this on 9th page tho...

Ammar:
>>When you play a spell AND fortune for the first time this turn, if your [MAGIC] level is 6 or more and your [DESTINY] level is 3 or more, draw a card<<
-if i cast spell for the first time- draw a card
-if i cast fortune for the first time -draw a card
-It will open some room for playing with fortunes and not only with spells. Still u will draw max 2 cards in a turn.

Weaker Version:
>>When you play a spell OR fortune for the first time this turn, if your [MAGIC] level is 6 or more and your [DESTINY] level is 3 or more, draw a card<<
-if i cast spell for the first time- draw a card (but no draw if casted fortune before)
-if i cast fortune for the first time -draw a card (but no draw if casted spell before)
-draw max 1 card in a turn but open some possibilty with playing ammar fortune and not only spells.

I agree with SOTS nerf. It just stops fortunes too Fast. U tutor it on turn 2 and play it in turn 3. Fortune decks have "dead cards" in hand. Its almost "GG". Increasing the cos and req. is giving some fortune decks 1 or 2 turns more. But still keeps powerfull effect.

The cost of Gate to Nowhere will drop from 4 to 3 Resources, and its Magic Requirement will also drop from 4 to 3.
I think it should be added: ALL creatures in this row deals half the damage rounded up/down(not only enemy creatures).
-The problem with GtN u still getting dmg. Its to easy to play around the "removal" effect for the enemy. Reducing dmg = my opponent will think twice if its profitable to sacrifice his creature for the dmg. in the other way, my creatures will be dealing less dmg, so i dont take full control of this row so easy.

Not sure about MoN.. Maybe something like this:
-For the first time in a turn, ALL friendly creatures receive half damage.
-so it apply to all ur creatures (buff)
-but it works only once for each creature each turn.
-If u attack a creature for the first time it receive half dmg, second time it receive full dmg
-if u cast AoE spell like Insect Swarm, it will prevent half dmg, but after this every attack or another spell will deal full dmg.

Another idea about ongoing unique spells aka "the simply balancing way"
Make them active. Like u cast the spell u get the effect until ur next turn. than u have to active it (pay 1 or 2). The effect will remains to ur next turn.
Example MoN.
U cast the spell - u get the effect to ur next turn. Than at ur next turn u may choose to active it or not (like an active event). So u pay the cost (1 or 2) u get the effect. if not, u lose it, but the spell remains casted, so u can use it in the future. With this change you may change the spell cost form 4 to 3 maybe. Its just an idea.

Revalon
10-21-2013, 09:18 AM
Another idea about ongoing unique spells aka "the simply balancing way"
Make them active. Like u cast the spell u get the effect until ur next turn. than u have to active it (pay 1 or 2). The effect will remains to ur next turn.
Example MoN.
U cast the spell - u get the effect to ur next turn. Than at ur next turn u may choose to active it or not (like an active event). So u pay the cost (1 or 2) u get the effect. if not, u lose it, but the spell remains casted, so u can use it in the future. With this change you may change the spell cost form 4 to 3 maybe. Its just an idea.

Yay, let me play SotS but still get my Pao back on my hand if I want to.

iZosiek
10-21-2013, 09:48 AM
Whats the problem ? So u have to have 4 magic for sots and at least 3 fortune for bridge and still might for creatures. To make a "trick"

Revalon
10-21-2013, 10:05 AM
Whats the problem ? So u have to have 4 magic for sots and at least 3 fortune for bridge and still might for creatures. To make a "trick"

Ok, don't know about higher elo, but I did well around 1000-1200 elo with my 4/4/3 Seria, and it would be even better with that.

iZosiek
10-21-2013, 10:35 AM
Its not like now u cant use pao+ bridge. And u cant have pao+ bridge and +1 dmg from sots active. I dont think its a big deal. But its just an idea. Devs will do what they want.

Revalon
10-21-2013, 01:00 PM
Its not like now u cant use pao+ bridge. And u cant have pao+ bridge and +1 dmg from sots active. I dont think its a big deal. But its just an idea. Devs will do what they want.

Sure, but right now you have to decide if you play SotS or keep the possibility for Pao+Bridge. And the Altar of Asha and those Necro fortunes where you sacrifice a creature to resurrect or heal a creature/hero.
It's a tactical element that would be take away. I don't saY that it would change much, but it might.

greenoctober
10-21-2013, 05:53 PM
Gate to nowhere, still a total coaster. Reducing the cost of total crap doesn't turn it into gold. I wouldn't play the card even for one resource to be honest. SotS nerf is meh. I disagree with it, but I doubt anything will prevent it from actualizing so yeah. Basically I see one good change (ammar) and two semi random changes for no apparent reasons. SotS already gets amnesiad turn one anyway, guess control needed one extra free turn to deck snipe/autolose. Only one tier one deck really uses the spell to the full extent of its power anyway (imo).

All in all, would like to see balancing on some more cards, or more specifically cards that are actually unbalanced.

razcrux
10-21-2013, 06:57 PM
Gate to nowhere, still a total coaster. Reducing the cost of total crap doesn't turn it into gold. I wouldn't play the card even for one resource to be honest. SotS nerf is meh. I disagree with it, but I doubt anything will prevent it from actualizing so yeah. Basically I see one good change (ammar) and two semi random changes for no apparent reasons. SotS already gets amnesiad turn one anyway, guess control needed one extra free turn to deck snipe/autolose. Only one tier one deck really uses the spell to the full extent of its power anyway (imo).

All in all, would like to see balancing on some more cards, or more specifically cards that are actually unbalanced.

You clearly have never built a deck around Namtaru-Channeler. Gate to nowhere works very-very well with that card, and now it will be even stronger.

greenoctober
10-21-2013, 08:45 PM
You clearly have never built a deck around Namtaru-Channeler. Gate to nowhere works very-very well with that card, and now it will be even stronger.

You're right, but I have played against the deck (maybe it was a bad one) and I don't consider it to be a top tier (or even a second tier deck) deck, and thus somewhat irrelevant.

aelkoa
10-21-2013, 10:35 PM
I am really sorry for a possible misposting, but WHEN the deck-out mechanics have been changed?
I am pretty sure that it was an auto-loss when you could not draw a card. Today (at last!!!) I've bought my third FW-box and got my first Academy hero. Rushed to make and try out a milling deck ASAP, but when i got my opponent to 0 cards in deck he only loosed 1 hp on the next turn! WTF?!?

Radoslawl
10-22-2013, 12:33 AM
Nope, you are loosing 1hp for each card draw if your deck pool is equal to 0.
So not only the beginning of turn will drain your health but also event cards like Celebrations.

Irgy_
10-22-2013, 07:02 AM
Does anyone else find Ammar 10x more annoying now that they've announced a nerf, but it hasn't happened yet? I mean, the devs have officially declared it OP, the deck has no long term future so I have no interest in playing it for practice or experience. I don't really even care if my decks lose to it because in the long term that won't matter. Everyone playing it still is just getting cheap wins while they can. Which I might do too but why would I want to spend wildcards on Chain Castings now if they'll be possibly quite worthless after the nerf?

hubin23
10-22-2013, 09:27 AM
Yeah, I am waiting for the patch too. Until then, I don't play tournaments.
If I run into Ammar, I just surrender. Why bother...

aelkoa
10-22-2013, 10:39 AM
Nope, you are loosing 1hp for each card draw if your deck pool is equal to 0.
So not only the beginning of turn will drain your health but also event cards like Celebrations.

But it was not like that some time ago! It was an insta-loss...
Or I am mistaken?

I just want to know when and why it happened, cause I haven't seen anything about it in pathcnotes!

atord-Nordos
10-22-2013, 10:50 AM
But it was not like that some time ago! It was an insta-loss...
Or I am mistaken?

I just want to know when and why it happened, cause I haven't seen anything about it in pathcnotes!

Are you sure you don't confuse it with, for example, Magic the Gathering?

Narutoisonfir3
10-22-2013, 10:50 AM
Seriously just wtf Ubisoft.
You destroy the game!
How long do you need for such a simple fix?
Already 4 of my Friends quit the game because of 24/7 ammars and its not even worth buying tickets to play swiss or participate at jp tournaments.
Sensless....
especially new players cant build "anti" ammar decks or even play it themselfes... such community and new player unfriendly enviroment...
gg gj destroying the game and dont do anything at all.
Imagine Blizzard or League of Legends find a massive exploit and lets say take 1-2 months to fix it .... They would not even blink and try their best to fix is asap!

Ubisoft on the other hand ... yeah well lets see, we can make money with all these ammar decks, people buy it like crazy to win and then when we got enough money we fix it ...
So people be friendly again and keep buying....

marketing thats all...

klaount
10-22-2013, 11:13 AM
Seriously just wtf Ubisoft.
You destroy the game!
How long do you need for such a simple fix?
Already 4 of my Friends quit the game because of 24/7 ammars and its not even worth buying tickets to play swiss or participate at jp tournaments.
Sensless....
especially new players cant build "anti" ammar decks or even play it themselfes... such community and new player unfriendly enviroment...
gg gj destroying the game and dont do anything at all.
Imagine Blizzard or League of Legends find a massive exploit and lets say take 1-2 months to fix it .... They would not even blink and try their best to fix is asap!

Ubisoft on the other hand ... yeah well lets see, we can make money with all these ammar decks, people buy it like crazy to win and then when we got enough money we fix it ...
So people be friendly again and keep buying....

marketing thats all...

It's funny how if you go on Blizzard or Riot forums you will see absolutely the same "complaint" and even more.

You're just raging. Besides, 24/7 ammars? Since they announced the nerf especially I hardly play against 1 Ammar per day. Also you should read the thread before posting, the patch is officially announced for end of October/start of November.

guest-sHNIj3VF
10-22-2013, 11:45 AM
Just to be clear : there is NO massive exploit used in league or starcraft. In DoC, decks like Ammar have NO counterplay : since you can't guess what does the opponent deck is, once you encounter Ammar you're screwed.

In league there is a counter to most of the overpowered champions : bans. And Riot tend to be better at balancing the game recently (overpowered champions aren't completely ******ed, and you can pick several viable items for 1 champion).

Starcraft is overall balanced, because blizzard knows how to update a game, and they HOTFIX it if there is something going wrong. THAT IS HOW ITS DONE.

About duel of champions : ubisoft is just too dumb to test the game ; seriously, you could just look at the chain spell card and Ammar hero and say : this will go wrong. Second, ubisoft if too dumb to hotfix the game. Why would you take 3 weeks to fix this ?? Third, ubisoft is apparently not able to balance a game overall : strength of the sea was clearly overpowered and overused since the LAST update, let's nerf it... NOW ; like 5 months later. 4th thing, look at the patchnote of the last update and realise how cheap it was, something like 6 changes.

Ubisoft is clearly not trying to make DoC a competitive game. They just introduce new overpowered strategies each update, so that the previous overpowered strategy becomes obselete. League was a bit like this earlier, but league is so much harder to update ! This a card game, there are not many things to consider when balancing the cards. The problem also comes from the fact that in TCG, it's easy to copy the pro startegies : just copy the deck !

Ubisoft is either dumb or doesn't care at all.

Radoslawl
10-22-2013, 11:55 AM
Guess Agile development means nothing to Ubisoft devs :confused:

klaount
10-22-2013, 12:20 PM
Just to be clear : there is NO massive exploit used in league or starcraft. In DoC, decks like Ammar have NO counterplay : since you can't guess what does the opponent deck is, once you encounter Ammar you're screwed.

In league there is a counter to most of the overpowered champions : bans. And Riot tend to be better at balancing the game recently (overpowered champions aren't completely ******ed, and you can pick several viable items for 1 champion).

Starcraft is overall balanced, because blizzard knows how to update a game, and they HOTFIX it if there is something going wrong. THAT IS HOW ITS DONE.

About duel of champions : ubisoft is just too dumb to test the game ; seriously, you could just look at the chain spell card and Ammar hero and say : this will go wrong. Second, ubisoft if too dumb to hotfix the game. Why would you take 3 weeks to fix this ?? Third, ubisoft is apparently not able to balance a game overall : strength of the sea was clearly overpowered and overused since the LAST update, let's nerf it... NOW ; like 5 months later. 4th thing, look at the patchnote of the last update and realise how cheap it was, something like 6 changes.

Ubisoft is clearly not trying to make DoC a competitive game. They just introduce new overpowered strategies each update, so that the previous overpowered strategy becomes obselete. League was a bit like this earlier, but league is so much harder to update ! This a card game, there are not many things to consider when balancing the cards. The problem also comes from the fact that in TCG, it's easy to copy the pro startegies : just copy the deck !

Ubisoft is either dumb or doesn't care at all.

Look, you can say whatever you want about testing or else, but stop make ridiculous comparisons. Most of us are familiar with games like SC2 and LoL, and 1) the grass is NOT greener on the other side 2) both those games are very well known for being ridiculously slow to patch and especially LoL is far from being ever balanced (you can ban a hero - i grinned there) 3) those games make a massive amount of money more than MMdoC so they have bigger dev teams etc.

aelkoa
10-22-2013, 12:35 PM
Are you sure you don't confuse it with, for example, Magic the Gathering?

I'm pretty sure, cause that's the way I have beaten Fleshbane in my campaign at the beginning of the game. I just used Garan't Purge fortune to wipe out all of his Lingering Ghosts and he decked out on the next turn and lost.

Radoslawl
10-22-2013, 01:01 PM
Oh yeah but please things like string correction in message boxes? Just change 50 to 59 and stop pissing off ppl or at least move the warning box to the Find Opponent on-click event where the deck is already chosen.
Not that hard and it require 1/16 of developer.
Still wont change my mind that either dev team or project manager sux big time :)

guest-sHNIj3VF
10-22-2013, 01:18 PM
You don't need a big dev team to balance a card game. Ubisoft just spends everything on creating new cards instead of using the already existing ones.

Narutoisonfir3
10-22-2013, 01:38 PM
you can all say what you want ... its not hard to bring out a hotfix....
At least hotfix ammar the rest maybe next patch.

The game should not be like I build my deck against ammar, cause I could run into it.. .It should be like the best deck against all decks.. And people play arbiter only for ammar ... seriously 4 nice events waste...

And I had 5 Ammars in a row on last jp on high telo...
3 out of 4 swisses Ammar 3 : 0
tell me more about its not played a lot ....

And the fact that you announce it for late octobre or early november, invites all people to play ammar since then ...
fast hotfix done.

nvm you lost many players anyway....

Aegon82
10-22-2013, 03:15 PM
Any real news about the date of this patch?

I didn't mind playing against Ammar some weeks ago, but after this patch was announced, Ammar is literally everywhere.
And that's what's bothers me. Why should I play against a deck that won't exist in 1-2 weeks?
And why people play it more now that it has a date limit?

PLEASE, RELEASE THE PATCH!!

AS_UR
10-22-2013, 04:10 PM
some thoughts,
hotfix of the ammar problem should be made already but seems like its not so easy since they need to work stuff out with apple?
okay with that in mind u know how much players *abuse* it over quite alot of weeks.
so how about an elo reset? i think u should reach a certain elo with skill and knowledge
elo seperates not longer the good players from less good ones,(if u take the 15XX//16XX players)which is the key of that system or?

so..elo dont matters that much (only for some egoīs :P) u think maybe i shouldn complain but otherwise a reset would not be
so painfull as it may sound. (beside the fact that u would get rid of some old crag abusers too which is a pain to see so high on the ladder)
i think that has to be done sooner or later anyways since the game wants to be more competetive + its just *healthy* overall after all these abuses which normally needed instant fixes.
good players will get their elo back anyway+ all get motivated to be at the *new* top which is a spot that now is impossible to be at for the players who deserve it!

edit: if u have thoughts on that pls dont replay here and use the topic that i am doing in the balance section of the forum! thx!

amoshias
10-23-2013, 01:05 AM
Look, you can say whatever you want about testing or else, but stop make ridiculous comparisons. Most of us are familiar with games like SC2 and LoL, and 1) the grass is NOT greener on the other side 2) both those games are very well known for being ridiculously slow to patch and especially LoL is far from being ever balanced (you can ban a hero - i grinned there) 3) those games make a massive amount of money more than MMdoC so they have bigger dev teams etc.

I don't know SC2, and I haven't played LoL in a while. But doing a quick search on LoL patch notes, I see that on average, they have released a patch about every 3 weeks for the last 6 months at least. And LoL didn't START with a huge dev team. They made a good game, took care of it, got tons of players... and now they're rolling in it.

Oh, and of COURSE LoL is "far from being ever balanced". I think you might be missing the point here...

guest-sHNIj3VF
10-23-2013, 01:39 AM
I actually blame the dev team, not because the hotfix is kinda long to come (before there's a hotfix the stretegy must be discovered first so it may takes some time), but more because they design new cards without looking at them, apparently. "Let's make a hero that picks up a card with each spell played, and another card that allows you to play as many spells as you want". That is obviously stupid, and on top of that it is an academy hero that can play good magic-boost creatures. Seriously it feels like they didn't think a second...

Radoslawl
10-23-2013, 10:25 AM
Well a public test realm would solve most of the card issues :)
Ofc as for card game it should be online only for a specific amount of time but still people would dig 10 times more bugs/balancing issues/ideas than a bunch of testers.

FaustOWnia
10-23-2013, 03:32 PM
How fking hard is to nerf one ONE ONE card. Thats all what should be done. I just don't get it.

amoshias
10-24-2013, 04:08 AM
Wait... Song of the Sea is being nerfed? Why? Have they given an explanation anywhere? I'm generally a control player. This is the single scariest card out there for most of the decks I play, and one of the main things IMO which keeps control decks in check. Bumping it up to 4/4 makes it vastly weaker, and makes Altar of Shadows and Broken Bridge - already decent cards - proportionally more powerful.

Baduruu
10-24-2013, 04:20 AM
i propose a Sry-for-Ammar redeem code!

Aegon82
10-24-2013, 05:41 AM
I'm not sure why are they nerfing SotS and leaving MoN as it is...
Both are really powerfull, but MoN is clearly better, even at 1 more resource/magic, if they cost the same...
Actually this is kind of a buff to stall decks.

Revalon
10-24-2013, 06:10 AM
i propose a Sry-for-Ammar redeem code!

I'd say there should not be a code within one month after the last code-begging.
Every time there is anew expansion, problems with servers, issues with a card or bad weather, people want a code for compensation, it's annoying.

Baduruu
10-24-2013, 06:57 AM
I'd say there should not be a code within one month after the last code-begging.
Every time there is anew expansion, problems with servers, issues with a card or bad weather, people want a code for compensation, it's annoying.

Oops my bad, I forgot the /sarcasm

Revalon
10-24-2013, 08:05 AM
Oops my bad, I forgot the /sarcasm

Wasn't sure, so I wrote somerhing fitting either way.

ManlyMantonio
10-24-2013, 08:28 AM
Poor Gate to Nowhere. Even with the reduction in cost it is still terrible. At least it is less terrible now.

ManWhoLostTooth
10-25-2013, 04:17 PM
I have been playing this game for a week and I just want to say that the balance in this game is comical. There are must-have cards that cost more in terms of wildcards, showing the developers' profit-based mind-set. They released the expansion with broken cards and then don't fix them. "Date to be decided". Okay guys.

tuchmybubs
10-26-2013, 02:15 PM
costs are based by expansion, not by cards. Try again.

Revalon
10-26-2013, 02:20 PM
costs are based by expansion, not by cards. Try again.

Well, in many (or only some?) cases, the better cards are rarer and thus cost more, but in genetal, yes.

schattentaucher
10-28-2013, 09:56 AM
go for changing crag hack as well then.. there is no way allowing a deck to plopp out 3 creatures on their starting turn and be able to do at least 10 dmg on next turn.. without earthmagic there is fairly no Chance to handle this - with earth, it depends on your luck of manastorms..

MistuhJones
10-30-2013, 04:23 AM
Well done Devs' I've been having Ammar a good while from the Achievement, but refused to play him because of the ridiculousness of the card. Can't wait to give him a shot after the patch.

luisarcher
10-30-2013, 05:52 AM
I'll just leave this here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow-W5VXmkKU

MistuhJones
10-30-2013, 06:28 AM
lol! That was hilarious.

Vogue_77
10-30-2013, 07:56 PM
Proposed additional fixes:

-Sandal ability: Banish card from hand to gain 2 resource (instead of discard)
-Ishuma ability: Discard a card to deal 2 dmg to hypnotized creature

Kataklysm6661
10-30-2013, 08:59 PM
I'll just leave this here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow-W5VXmkKU

So epic! That's great spirit (even if I don't understand much, but the music does the trick !)

Radoslawl
10-31-2013, 12:00 PM
Haha oh the irony.
So they posted this on FB:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbrG3b-F8YM
And top 5 game 3 is about ammar OTK.
Well done Ubisoft :)

Ablakasandar
11-01-2013, 02:29 PM
Can we just delete Ammar and work it out in the lore? Say.. the old sod sat on a Throne of Renewal, thinking himself cunning - little did he know that the throne happened to be placed in a lane enchanted with the Gate to Nowhere! Muhahahahahaha.
The perpetrator behind this act would be the one none would presume capable of such magickery and deception! Siegfried! The Lord Haart of MMDoC!

Baduruu
11-01-2013, 06:10 PM
when the hell is this going to happen....seriously...why announce it 3 weeks ago and do nothing. i know your waiting on apple or whatever but in other games the apple approval takes two weeks at most.

jacqui2
11-02-2013, 02:01 AM
When 20% of your games are against ammar and there's 42 heroes in the game you know something is not right. Let's get this fixed already.

DanielKurzempa
11-02-2013, 11:48 AM
When 20% of your games are against ammar and there's 42 heroes in the game you know something is not right. Let's get this fixed already.

When 75% of your games are against Ishuma or Hack you know something is not right. Let's get this fixed already :)

AmineM2
11-02-2013, 12:13 PM
When 20% of your games are against ammar and there's 42 heroes in the game you know something is not right. Let's get this fixed already.


When 75% of your games are against Ishuma or Hack you know something is not right. Let's get this fixed already :)

That leavs just 5% for: Sandal/Cassandra prison + Adar Malik + Dhamiria creatures/Slow Poke. Guys, are you sure your estimations are close to reality? I know it is not a big sample but I can provide stats for my last 100 games: Ishuma 10%,Cassandra 8%, Dhamiria 7%, Ammar 6%, Crag Hack 6%, Sandalphon 4% (Those games were played from 23 of October till today. I played virtually every JP during this time always getting to t3 with 1.2 or 3 loses. The other games are swisses - probably 9 games - and the ladder).

jacqui2
11-02-2013, 08:12 PM
From my jackpot experiences ammars are more heavily present in t1-2 area than in t3-5 area. I hardly meet any in t3-5 but the higher I go up in telo the higher the % chance of facing ammar becomes. They are much more uncommon in swiss and ladder.

MindVega
11-03-2013, 10:44 AM
Seriously what's the hold up with the patch?

AmineM2
11-03-2013, 11:22 AM
From my jackpot experiences ammars are more heavily present in t1-2 area than in t3-5 area. I hardly meet any in t3-5 but the higher I go up in telo the higher the % chance of facing ammar becomes. They are much more uncommon in swiss and ladder.

There are around 120-150 places for t1/t2 at the moment so vast majority of the players shouldn't meet Ammar too frequently, should they? The Ammar problem concerns a couple of hundreds of players (the ones who are t1/t2 or fight to get there. Some of them use Ammar themselves and some of them have good counters so they dont complain) and I don't think it's a big issue.

zoran--
11-05-2013, 11:17 AM
Fix this stupid unbalanced card NOW or just disable it for tourny.

Im close to stop this game because of this and i already got 4 friends (guildies that discover the game by me) that have leaved.
At this moment they are doing a strong negative publicity because of this.

It is to long to change for a such minor fix, and dont say any excuse, this card was unblanced before it even become live, did you even tested it befor implement ?

Fix now or your game will simply die.

Dahuslann
11-05-2013, 12:46 PM
No date, no news, community is in darkness.

Ubisoft is waiting for Apple agreements to patch his own game... Nice... Or not.

guest-OHiOyVIS
11-06-2013, 09:18 AM
No date, no news, community is in darkness.

Ubisoft is waiting for Apple agreements to patch his own game... Nice... Or not.

they wait the agreement tim jobs, be patient plz

Aegon82
11-06-2013, 10:21 AM
Do we have any real source to confirm it is Apple's fault?
Because when any other app has a bug, it gets updated in less than a week, AS LONG AS IT WORKS.
Maybe that is the problem...

Aatranis
11-06-2013, 11:48 AM
We are still forced to wait for this indispensable nerf. Ubisoft, are you serious?

alternative83
11-06-2013, 03:35 PM
I bet all Apple workers play Ammar decks

M_Ridcully
11-07-2013, 09:32 PM
prison abuse should be fixed too