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Jexx21
07-30-2013, 06:30 PM
Yea, I'm sure there's been a poll like this before, but since we have two topics for each side of the argument, let's have a nuetral zone where opinions are respected and accounted for.

So what's your take on this situation, do you think that there should be another game for Connor? Do you think he should be developed more?

EDIT: If you want to do some reading on possible Connor game ideas, here you go:


I do want to see another Connor game, and I'd actually like to see it in North America, but not the area we've been in, though. Go further north/northwest from the Homestead. And maybe Ohio/part of Michigan (we could have a native village in Sandusky and Connor's people could be there!) and the area around the great lakes. In fact, I'd add Philadelphia or Baltimore (to not repeat cities) to make things come full circle. How? Well, here's my take on it.

First, the Homestead. Seeing it grow further, taking shape and getting a name proper. We've only known it as the Homestead, but maybe they could make it grow to look like a real location in New Hampshire/Maine and seeing it get the name of that location, maybe see it under pressure of government officials forcing them to play by their rules.

We'd have a city in still colonial Canada (I'm thinking Quebec or Montreal as those have the most potential to be interesting cities) representing the part of the revolution that wasn't full of energy and wishing for freedom from the crown, the loyalist side. If Quebec was used, we could have some french variety in there, too. Being the capital of lower Canada and the third largest port of North America at the time could be interesting too. These quotes also got me interested in how it could work:
"[English Canada] inherited, not the benefits, but the bitterness of the Revolution. It got no shining scriptures out of it. It got little release of energy and no new horizons of the spirit were opened up. It had been a calamity, pure and simple. "
"The British ignored part of the treaty and maintained their military outposts in the Great Lakes areas it had ceded to the U.S., and continued to supply their native allies with munitions. The British evacuated the outposts with the Jay Treaty of 1795, but the continued supply of munitions irritated the Americans in the run-up to the war of 1812."

Then we have the area around the great lakes, including Ohio and Michigan. Native villages around the area, farms and smaller settlements, maybe have Pittsburgh and Detroit as small towns. It would be the frontier for this game, showcasing the situation for the natives but also putting Connor in a hard place seeing them taking munitions from the British and maybe going after small settlements, seeing how complicated the situation is.

Finally either Philadelphia/Baltimore. I'd say if Kingston turns out to be a great location, bring on Philly. It would work as a good representative of the newly formed country and the results of the revolution. There's also the fact people who escaped from Saint Domingue during the Haitian Revolution brought slaves with them but they were actually freed upon arriving to Philadelphia, as slavery there was abolished in 1780. Maybe that could give Connor some hope (because he direly needs some). If not, Baltimore works. We have also some involvement with the Quasi-War there:
"The population reached 14,000 in 1790, but the decade was a rough one for the city. The Bank of England's suspension of specie payments caused the network of Atlantic credit to unravel, leading to a mild recession. The Quasi-War with France in 1798-1800 caused major disruptions to Baltimore's trade in the Caribbean. Finally, a yellow fever epidemic diverted ships from the port, while much of the urban population fled into the countryside."

Wow that was longer than I thought. But yeah, that's my take on how it could work.


I fully advocate this. But what about instead of Quebec or Montreal we go to a Maritime city? Anything in New Brunswick, Prince Edward Island, Newfoundland.. that would be awesome. Unless Quebec is a Maritime territory. I'm just thinking in terms of having a naval free-roam area again, it would be awesome to have areas around Newfoundland. But the Naval free-roam area should be a lot smaller than Black Flag, and I would think that the Frontier should be a bit smaller than the AC3 frontier as well. I just think that the Aquila needs some free-roam action as well. :)


Actually, it is possible to see the death of Connor if one of his children witnesses it.

Opening of Assassin's Creed V:

Connor and his wife have a baby girl. This girl is trained in the ways of the Assassins, not wanting to ignore his child like Edward did just because she's female. We train as Connor's daughter, and eventually we are taken on her first mission. during this mission, Connor faces an enemy that gets the better of him (I'm thinking that Connor would be in his lat 40's, early 50's by this point, and his daughter would be in her late teens), and he is killed in front of her daughter. His daughter wants revenge, but in his last dying breaths Connor warns her about pursuing revenge and how it can keep you from the truth (trying to get his daughter to learn from his own mistakes with Lee). We then play as Connor's daughter for this game up to the point to where she gets married (and possibly retires from active Assassin business), giving up the Kenway name and ending the Kenway Assassin saga.


I'd like something like that. Nothing motivates the player and the character at the same time as seeing your previous PC getting killed ;)

*runs from Connor fangilrs*


Why do you think a another Connor game is coming, if you don't mind me asking :)


The fact that they imply another Edward game is not happening and that we should know everything we need to know about Edward from Black Flag and the novels. They haven't advertised this game as the end of the Kenway saga (they did advertise Revelations as the end of Ezio's and Altair's stories). Both Haytham and Edward's life stories have/will be told, while Connor's life story hasn't been told yet. If you're going to have a "Kenway saga" you should finish all of the stories. Plus the fact that Juno says "You have made a difference, and you will do so again." to Connor.

Ubisoft also already knew that the reception to Connor was going to be mixed before they released the game, they pretty much said that you would either love him or hate him. They still put his character out there without trying to change it. They still have story to tell for Connor, and I don't believe that something as small as a mixed reaction will stop them from continuing Connor's story, especially when he's a character that has received awards and recognition.


Well, this story sounds incredible. My concern is will it be fun. Because my problem with AC3 was the story was great but especially with the Haytham segment and Connor's childhood bits, the gameplay was stale with a capital 'S.' And even when the game took off the training wheels and finally let us explore like a proper AC game, Boston and New York were dull and underwhelming. I did thoroughly enjoy the frontier, though.

I fear that Montreal, Baltimore, and Philly will be just as dull as NY & Bos.


I mostly added either Baltimore or Philly thinking about them more... Thematically, should we say. If it was, say, Quebec and Philly+Frontier, we'd have the results of the revolution on Canada with the bitterness from all loyalists who made it out, the results on the US which we already know how it goes and it'd show a great contrast. Add to it if you met Connor's people in a village in the Frontier having escaped from the chaos and getting help from Loyalists and the Homestead being forced to play by the rules of a new government, it could make for some interesting thematic and the fact that Quebec would have some nice French architecture and Philly/Baltimore would be closer to what we saw in AC3 but would already have some more interesting stuff and stuff built during that time could be around.
Of course, I'd be all for a game set all in Canada and the Homestead. Quebec and St. John's, for example. Quebec was one of the biggest ports in North America at the time and St. John's is one of the oldest cities in North America. Fredericton could work too. "Nothing big would be happening!" you could say. Well, nothing big was going on in Cyprus when Altair visited it besides the island having been sold to Templars by King Richard. Constantinople wasn't going through exactly a big moment when Ezio went, either. I think it could work.


Well, I thought that New York and Boston were actually amazing cities. I felt like there was this rustic Colonial feeling, and I loved hearing the criers in the streets and the marching drum of the squad of soldiers. They were very cool cites, and I thought they were great. I felt Philadelphia was missing from AC3, and I would really appreciate it being a city in a possible Connor sequel. After looking into it a bit more, Quebec would be awesome as well, and it actually is a perfect location to be a lead in to a naval free-roam map around Newfoundland.

What's funny, is that in the Comi-con Panel, Todd Macfarlane sort of teased this situation. When someone was asking about a Persian setting for Assassin's Creed, Todd said something about making a setting in Canada, maybe Newfoundland "Nothing better than a Newfie Pirate!".

Rug, I'm curious as to what you would think about a free-roam naval map up around Newfoundland and the Maritime area.


Man these forums are having issues lately took forever to log in again. In any case...
I can agree with that. New York is easily one of my favorite cities in the series, but it suffers from being criminally underused. And Philly was indeed missing. I could understand their reasoning back then, but now with Kingston it'll be the tipping point to see if it would really have not worked or if they could have managed to get it working.
As for Newfoundland/New Burnswick/northeast Canada: I think it could work rather well, actually! I'm thinking like this: Naval to the east (From the homestead down to Philly and up to St. John's, Quebec and the Canada area overall) with a good amount of terrain to explore, and frontier towards the west, with smaller towns, forts, native villages and the such going for it. Big enough I'd say it would make for a pretty good game and a good sendoff to North America and lead-on to a new location entirely.


This setting might actually be cool if they really boost the detail and immersion via next gen capabilities...

Montreal:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/72/View_of_Montreal_1852.jpg

Philly:
http://teachingamericanhistory.org/wp-content/themes/tah-main/images/imported/convention/philly_skyline.jpg

Quebec:
http://img77.imageshack.us/img77/4650/quebecvueaerienne1926baab8.jpg

I'm just really weary of these settings after the bad taste AC3 left in my mouth.


Hey, why should Connor always be thrown into a war or Revolt of some kind?? the 19th century was an age of advancement for mankind, right?? Wasn't that the time the Templars starting influencing great minds to the betterment of humanity?? this could be a good theme for the moral grey area between the Templars and Assassins and it can create a sort of conflict of they`re actually advancing mankind, why should I eradicate them??


In a way, what I'm thinking came out of that. The idea I had when reading of Canada after the revolution gave me an image on a game focusing on the outcome of the Revolution, how both locations reacted after it. And in a way that's also why I like the idea of a Frontier area going with it, too, not only for gameplay elements. The British in Canada WERE giving munitions to the natives who fled west to pester settlers. A few native villages, forts and small settlements would make for something potentially interesting thematically, I think.


I just think that anything involving the natives heavily would just give more crap to Connor. He learned about compromise, so maybe that could be used as a small window for him to at least partially succeed...

for example, Connor manages to convince a few tribes to migrate away from the war with Americans. I like the idea of the British still providing munitions to the Natives. it adds friction to an already troubled relationship between the Natives and the British, Connor and the Americans and the Assassins and Templars..

You know I always thought that Connor would be the one that kills GW in the end for some reason...he`d leave him alone for such a long time to lead the country then end his life for all the crimes he committed against the Natives....just a thought


I just wish that if we get another Connor game, it shows him in a totally different location. Florence, Venice and Rome were much more interesting places to explore. I understand that America wasn't as advanced as Italy was in the 1400s but I'd still like to see a different civilization. Perhaps Connor will go to Africa. In Ethiopia, Eden existed millennia ago so perhaps there is something to investigate. After all, Ezio did venture to Turkey and Syria for various reasons and Altair went to Cyprus, so why not Connor?

It would be good to see a totally different setting this time, anyway. Africa, China, Japan and the Middle East/Arabian Peninsula or even India would give a great setting for Connor with vast desert (in arabia) or the forests of Africa..etc. so one wouldn't feel too alienated from Connor's Frontier zone anyway.


Quebec City:

"Much of the city's most notable architecture is located east of the fortification walls in Vieux-Québec (Old Quebec) and Place Royale. This area has a distinct European feel with its stone buildings and winding streets lined with shops and restaurants."

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/34/Basilique-Cathédrale_Notre-Dame_Québec.JPG/450px-Basilique-Cathédrale_Notre-Dame_Québec.JPG

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/57/Québec_-_Notre-Dame_des_Victoires.jpg/220px-Québec_-_Notre-Dame_des_Victoires.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/Holy_Trinity_Quebec_City.jpg/250px-Holy_Trinity_Quebec_City.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/22/Québec-Grand-Séminaire-1.JPG/440px-Québec-Grand-Séminaire-1.JPG

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/05/Porte_St._Jean.JPG/800px-Porte_St._Jean.JPG

Montreal:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e3/Montreal_NDame1_tango7174.jpg/660px-Montreal_NDame1_tango7174.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/83/Montreal_13_db.jpg/800px-Montreal_13_db.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Hotel-Dieu_de_Montreal_16-MARCH-2006.JPG

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1c/Chapelle_Notre-Dame-de-Bon-Secours_01.jpg/450px-Chapelle_Notre-Dame-de-Bon-Secours_01.jpg

A few historical inaccuracies on purpose (like they're doing with Havana and probably Kingston and Nassau for this game, or the cities in AC1) would make it even better. Chose mainly images from buildings of the French colonial era.


I'd like it as a sendoff for North America, a good note to end our adventures there. I don't think there's much more in North America we could do (even though I'd appreciate South America one day).
Personally, I still hope for a Dutch Revolt game and a Thirty Years' War one. Dutch Revolt would have locations such as Amsterdam, Brussels and Antwerp, while Thirty Years War could go all over Europe. Places such as Copenhagen, Stockholm, Heidelberg, Konigsberg, Prague... You have a lot of good stuff. Maybe involve Munich somehow (man I'd love that).
Or Spain. Either during the times of Almanzor with some cities under Moorish control, and a few cities of the Kingdoms to the north (Say Cadiz, Sevilla and Cordoba as Moorish cities and Leon, Pamplona and Barcelona as cities they don't hold) or under Napoleonic control (Again with Barcelona and Cadiz, and add Madrid. Oh yes).
China during the Ming Dinasty sounds like a fun setting in Asia. Or the Khmer Empire in Cambodia, that architecture is pretty damn cool I think.

Here are some notable discussions from the topic, so you can get right into the discussion (updated as of Page 54):

There's also one thing I can think of: Admittedly, it was more fun to mess around with the most ruthless Connor from TokW, even in episode 1 when he wasn't yet so aggressive. I think we'd end up seeing a side of him more willing to do what needs to be done, more aggressive and still as goal-focused as ever. He did plan shelling New York, you saw how he dealt with Charles' bodyguards, and then how he interrogated the guy in the tavern before going for Charles. He's changed. And then we had TokW in which I didn't feel it was out of character killing guards mercilessly. I went through most of the game using only fists, admittedly, using weapons only on whoever I actually needed to kill, when it was needed for optional objectives or when hunting. It changed in the last 2 sequences and during TokW.


I was actually confused at why Pacman voted for I don't care rather than yes, because I saw a post of his saying that he does want another Connor game.

Anyway, I wanted to ask Rugter about the Frontier in the idea for the Connor sequel. If the Frontier contained certain areas of the Northwest territory and Canada, how are they going to handle the great lakes? I mean, I know the frontier screwed up pretty much all of the geography in AC3 to suit the gameplay, but they can't just ignore the great lakes.

Here's a map of the Northwest territory, for those interested:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Northwest-territory-usa-1787.png

I was thinking, maybe we should leave the Frontier for the American areas, and a Naval free-roam area to the Canadian provinces. That would work I think. Of course, I would think that the Frontier would be smaller than the one in AC3, and that the Canadain Naval free-roam area would be smaller than the Caribbean free-roam in Black Flag.


Sorry for taking so long, I was in class
In any case. I don't really think they should strive to be too accurate. I'd say keep the Kanien;Keh, Black Creek and Valley Forge areas of the original Frontier (enter the place through the mountain road you first take when heading to the homestead in AC3) but modify how they fit and then expand to the west. Kanien;Keh above Valley Forge, with people building stuff over the area where Connor's village was, Valley Forge to the south with the camp mostly abandoned (add an exit to Philly or Baltimore to the south was it needed), Black Creek to the west but with the area around Fort Duquesne modified with the two rivers surrounding it and the village of Pittsburgh growing around it (and Fort Pitt for good measure), and then expand the Frontier west and northwest as it goes through Ohio all the way to Michigan, with Detroit being at the northwest end of the Frontier and Sandusky at the southwestern end where Connor's people would be. That's my take on it at least.


Nah, I'd be fine if you didn't answer it for a couple of hours.

So you would keep the Frontier area in America? And just discard the great lakes pretty much?

Yea, I was just wondering because Kanatahseton is in New York, and there's obviously some huge lakes in the way of the village and the Northwest territory. Of course, Valley Forge is also in Pennsylvania. The AC3 frontier wasn't accurate at all in terms of actual town placements, so it wouldn't surprise me that the AC4: Homestead Flag (lol) frontier wouldn't be accurate. But ignoring the great lakes... that's kind of huge.



If anything, i'd think we could focus on Lake Ontario and north of it so we'd have a route to Quebec and/or Montreal from there or something. Maybe expand north of Kanien;Keh too. And also Lake Erie on the way to Detroit, maybe. It could always work. I don't know. We could find a way for it to work somehow. But you're right, it needs more terrain in Canada. And adding the Niagara Falls would be such a nice touch and an opportunity not to be missed, actually.


Oh yea, the Niagara Falls are amazing. Yea, that would need to be in any game that deals with Eastern Canada. Mmm.. is the river that leads into Lake Ontario the same river that Quebec City is on? Because I was thinking that river would make a nice route for the Aquila, obviously. Anyway, that would be a nice place to put one of those Naval fast-travel places, on a pier at Lake Ontario. Naval Fast travel would also let you get into the Canadian seas as well.

I'm just thinking, would the new Frontier be the same size or smaller than the AC3 frontier? I'm just thinking in terms of also including a small(er than Black Flag's) naval free-roam Area in Canada. I wouldn't want there to a mismanagement of resources :/

Agh, the game I want would be too big :P

As to spider sith, I put lol because I can't come up with a good subtitle for a Connor game.


Anyway, I would want naval free-roam to be in the Gulf of Saint Lawrence for a Connor game. Here's some pictures to illustrate:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Golfe_Saint-Laurent_en.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/af/Grlakes_lawrence_map.png

Saint Lawrence River goes past Quebec City and Montreal, leads into Lake Ontario. This means that if they wanted to, we could potentially have free-roam on the great lakes as well, but I doubt that there's much interesting stuff on the Great Lakes, besides vistas, so it wouldn't be worth it.


I was thinking more or less the same. So I thought: Why not naval around the great lakes? There ARE islands in the great lakes (31 in Lake Erie alone, in fact. Less in Lake Ontario but still) and we could see the smaller settlements around the coasts. Maybe a smaller map for the eastern seaboard with way to make it to Philadelphia, Quebec and the Homestead, but with less going on for it (Maybe have a small version of Nova Scotia/New Burnswick). So imagine this: Both the frontier with the great lakes and the smaller eastern seaboard map would make the total size of the AC4 naval map. Sounds good? I think it'd work.


I think that's a possibility. The main thing was about the game missing the great lakes, though I'd love to see more of the eastern seaboard focusing on the Gulf of Saint Lawrence. I suppose you could go by foot from Quebec to the Frontier and just follow the lake around until you get to the Niagara Falls and further along all the way to the end of Lake Erie. The frontier could be mainly focused on the edge of the great lakes and down south until a point stops you from going further. Maybe being able to go around the northern edge of Lake Erie to get to Detroit, too, and being able to use a smaller boat to get to the 31 islands in Lake Erie or something. It would all be compacted so that's possible, after all. I have a map from the war of 1812 here that shows names of locations and the such too so I'll edit it to show more or less the area I'm thinking it could cover. Of course, for game purposes it'd probably be compacted and not entirely accurate.


Uhh, who's been saying that seems like the consensus? Was there a poll? Because I'm pretty sure that you're the only person on the forums that has suggested this. Look, just say that you would like it to be called Genesis, rather than saying that you think that's what everyone wants..


Thanks bud. No idea why people feel the need to insult others so much for their ideas on when to engage in sex. It's not like I'm forcing that idea on others. People can do what they want.



I wouldn't mind a free-roam area in either the Great Lakes of the Gulf of St. Lawrence. I would love both to be available. And honestly, the idea of a Frontier/Great Lakes map the size of the Black Flag game world sounds awesome, but I'd be concerned about what we could discover in these areas. In the Gulf of St. Lawrence we could possibly find Viking stuff, which I think would be pretty cool. I wouldn't mind introducing a Norse First Civ, and then possibly introducing some celtic elements (leading to Ireland or Scotland with Connor's daughter? :P).


Nothing wrong with Connor, though he's less interesting than Altair or Ezio, and a lot more of a barbarian. I just don't like the environment for AC North America. It's not romantic.


Yeah I think I get the picture now. You all think 'romantic' means 'related to matters of love'. Well it does but not in the sappy man-woman sense. I was talking in the sense of heroic chivalry - moral qualities of the horseman warrior, which can be traced to the time and place of the first AC game. I'm sorry but I think AC was wasted on most of you and perhaps Connor was a wise marketing move on the part of Ubisoft from that point of view. You guys have no idea about the amount of research work that went into AC 1, 2, Brotherhood and Revelations. You think a Native American at the time of the Civil War is an example of a 'civilised' man, because you assume that rescuing ladies or having compassion means someone is 'civilised'. WRONG. Being 'civilised' means you're part of a civilisation. The Nizari Ismailis were at the leading edge of science, philosophy and rationalism in their time. Then of course Renaissance Italy. Nothing needs to be said about that I hope. Then the height of the Ottoman military organisation in 1453. Bringing artillery and siege warfare to Europe.. And you compare some wigwam-dwelling barbarian swinging through the trees with the very best examples of historical civilisations we have... Just because in a story, he saves some people. Words fail me, seriously. But perhaps they fail YOU more. The kind term you're looking for, for Connor, is 'noble savage', not 'civilised man'. A real damn shame we are actually comparing Native American neolithics with the Nizari Ismaili citadel-state, Renaissance Italy, Ottoman Istanbul, etc.

I fear for the future of AC. The market doesn't appreciate the product.


You think that Colonial America doesn't contain romanticism? I applaud you for thinking that somehow, Connor isn't a man that can be someone's knight in shining armor. Connor was part of a civilization making its roots, and I fear that you haven't been paying attention to the learnings of Connor. You strike me as a man that thinks that somehow, young nations are inferior to older nations and have no chance of improving themselves. You failed to understand that Connor wasn't holding on to what he learned in his tribe. He was taught many things by Achilles, relating to history, philosophy, and morals. Do you have any idea the amount of research that go into all of the Assassin's Creed games? Not just the ones that you deem to have "romantic" qualities?

What irks me the most is that you say that we are comparing the civilization of the Native Americans to those of the civilizations of the previous settings.

The thing is Alim, you think that you are somehow superior to us, or at least that's what it comes off as. Wrong, all men are equal. All men have the potential to rise up and have this higher morale you seek. It's not limited to the Nizari Ismaili, or the Italians, or the Ottomans, or the Chinese. You say that Connor is barbaric because he isn't part of a civilization, yet Achilles told him that the small town that he built up is a shining example of a brick that will make the foundation for the United States.


No. We all knew what you meant by Romantic and I can safely say your views are Idiotic. no offense to your opinion of course, I mean..you hold the view that a human from a newer civilization is a savage barbarian, thus you are the epitome of every moron whose lived during the Colonial times and excused the crappy treatment of Africans and Natives on them being an inferior race and "barbarians"

You disgust me


You say all men are equal, but that's one of the biggest lies of all. The implication is, everyone's opinion is worth the same. But that's not really the issue. You have imputed that I am taking a position of superiority over you. That's not exactly true. I have a superior knowledge of some relevant things, but that's not the same as saying my statement here is worth more than yours, or that yours is of equal value to mine, etc. Look at the title of this thread. It's inviting everyone's opinion. I paid for the AC games just like you did, and I don't regret a penny I spent on them. But if I strike you as having a superior attitude, that's really your problem not mine. It doesn't interest me and isn't relevant.

Now I doubt you have as much knowledge of the Nizari Ismailis for instance as I do. But then not many people do because it's something I specialise in, in real life. You may very well have other knowledge in some specialist field that I don't. Everyone has something they know about. This is why the AC series is so fascinating for me and it's also the main reason I want it to remain true to the great tradition of rational enlightenment and civilisation. I recognise many things, the things said by Al Mualim in particular, that have been the subject of a lot of gnostic and philosophical discussion within the Ismaili intellectual tradition. That's why I really appreciate what went into the preceding AC games, and I want them (Ubisoft) to place the same importance on those elements as they did previously.

From my point of view, the recourse ever further into the fantastical, stretching the bounds of credibility well beyond the 'Apple of Eden' idea, by taking Nizari Ismailism into North American Civil War period is a stretch too far. I hope this makes it absolutely clear what my position is. I do appreciate that Connor's wisdom is a borrowed wisdom. As you put it, he learned the precepts of the order from a master. But still, it's foreign to North America. According to the story, he gets his lifeline of wisdom from a foreign tradition.

Regarding Romanticism, it has a connection with North American literature and imagination, but I don't see any of that in the example of Connor. That Romantic Edgar Allen Poe type of Romantic imagery is missing from AC3.

To be fair, the original AC with Altair was deficient in some respects, particularly in the martial arts. There is quite a lot of information about the martial arts used by the Ayyaran (the bands that overthrew the Abbasids and later united under Hassan Sabbah against the Saljuqs), and the Iranian sword arts, the knives used by Nizari Ismailis as well, but this wasn't researched for the game. A shame.


actually native americans were probably as old as most civilizations during that time, they just weren't able to grow as fast due to geographical constraints. Just watch "Guns, Germs, and Steel."


If you consider the Native Americans as a 'civilisation' as opposed to the Mayans or Aztecs for instance then why stop there? Polynesian cannibals were just as civilised as the ancient Greeks, right? Australian aborigines not only had a 'civilisation' but their was equal to the Ancient Egyptians, right?

Your implications are idiotic, but carry on. You amuse me.


Maybe you should realize that this game isn't a historical book. It's a game, designed to appeal to a very wide audience. Sure, if it was more historically accurate, that would be cool, but it doesn't always make a good game.

As for Connor going into the Civil War period.. that's way past Connor's time. In the lore of Assassin's Creed, the Assassin group let go of their strict organizational structure and spread across the world. They could potentially take part in any significant event in the history of the world past the siege of Masyaf (or, I guess, Alamut in real life).


We're all ancients. But some human societies developed into civilisations proper while others did not. Native Americans no doubt had and have many fine qualities but just look again at the paintings and architecture and history in AC2 Brotherhood for instance. They never had such achievements. I don't know about the cause of that. Maybe the environment wasn't as good. But still, it means there is less to look at. Perhaps some nicely decorated bows, but doesn't compare to Renaissance paintings etc. That's really my point. I want to see more amazing stuff in AC games.


Your examples are shameful, surely with your "superior" knowledge you could come up with something that makes more sense...Polynesian Cannibals?? Wow xD and I never brought "equal" into anything..heck i`v never even made a comparison between civilizations. I merely expressed disgust at your views...which are Native Americans were Savage barbarians. you`re an elitist jerk, mate...there`s no way around it.

Look for amusement elsewhere, sonny


I personally find tribal designs more interesting than art from the Rennaisance. It's a personal taste.

I can't deny that the Rennaisance was very conducive for the intellectual mind, but some of the things "discovered" during the time of the Rennaisance really were just rediscoveries.

In the area of what is now Timbuktu, there was a great school that had more students than London had citizens during the 17th or 18th century (I think it was that time frame), and texts were recovered from it that detail lunar cycles and evidence that the planet was a sphere. They date back to a time period long before the Renaissance. Unfortunately, I haven't studied that for a while now, so the exact time periods elude me, but my point still stands.


What you wrote neither adds nor rebuts anything and is mere personal abuse expressed as an emotional 'reaction', and an attempt to make yourself feel morally superior on the basis of your opinion about something.

If you want to join 'civilisation' why not try to explain why, in your view:

1) Native Americans can be grouped together as one people;
2) That they cannot only be grouped together as one people but can be termed a 'civilisation';
3) That the word 'civilisation' just means a group, race or tribe of people somewhere rather than an ordered society.


You're probably right. I don't know about Native Americans.

The cool thing about AC is that the Order is always a little bit ahead. The Assassins see things from the eagle's higher POV. From ziplines to poison darts and knives, and concealed handguns. This means it's a bit of a challenge for the developers to choose the perfect situation where all those elements of relative advancement can be present but still stay shy of the modern/industrial period. A big theme in the series is the idea of rediscovered knowledge from a previous age. That was a huge preoccupation for the historical assassins as well as their Iraqi predecessors under the Buwayhids. It would be cool to see them focus on the early modern period in Europe though, and place the philosophers of the early modern period as either secret Assassins or secret Templars, with access to an Apple or the tradition of either Order, and bring in the Kants, Hegels, Hobbeses, etc. as rediscoverers of ancient wisdom from the Apple via the Nizari Ismailis. That would be credible and really interesting.


Yes, that would be interesting, and I'm not saying that they shouldn't go into those settings.

The point of this topic is just to say that I feel like a lot more could be done with Connor's character. And if they stay in America, it would still be possible to be retrieving knowledge and tools from civilizations past. There are Celtic, Gaelic, and Norse roots in the eastern Canadian provinces. We could delve into their mythologies, their knowledge. And besides that, the stereotypical image of Vikings sort of feels like a combination of pirates and natives, it would be a cool experience.


Why Connor deserves a sequel to develop his story and character further

Connor is a character who received mixed views. Personally, I feel that this was partly due to people being used to Ezio and some of the game mechanics, which some people thought were flawed in some areas in comparison to previous games.

For me, Connor possesses a number of qualities: humility, generosity, kindness and heroism. He had a tragic life from an early age, yet his love for his people and his belief that everyone deserved to be free drove him. In many cases, the outcome wasn’t what he had hoped but still he continued trying to make a difference. I think this quote summarises this exactly:

"I realize now that it will take time, that the road ahead is long and shrouded in darkness. It is a road that will not always take me where I wish to go... But I will travel down it nonetheless." ~ Connor Kenway

He was determined even though he was uncertain where the path would lead him. Thus, this highlights another quality: courage.

I feel that Connor’s character was just misunderstood. For example, some people refer to him as being angry and rude. Then I think people tend to forget that he's human and nobody is perfect. In relation to his anger, personally, I feel that he had many reasons to be angry. He had already lost his mother at a young age. His people and the only life he ever knew, was being threatened:

“I have known true freedom. I have known a world of peace and remarkable spirit. A world, which was taken from me.” ~ Connor Kenway

Also, he had an absent father and didn’t really have anyone like that until he found Achilles. Regarding his rudeness, personally, I feel he was quite young and inexperienced and spoke his mind. I'm sure everyone has been rude to someone they care about at some point in their lives, even people they care about. Also, Connor does actually apologise to Achilles as well. Additionally, Connor may have found it difficult to trust other people, which may have come across as being rude. Especially, since he is half-Native American (Mohawk) and half-English, he was caught between two worlds. He was pulled in so many directions because of it and he probably struggled with where he fit in. An example of this is when his own best friend believed that he had turned against him when all he wanted was to prevent a war between his people and the colonists.

Anyway, I feel that a sequel would develop Connor’s character further and more people may appreciate him or they still may not. However, I believe that his character does deserve to be explored further as the sequences focused on Connor’s story were quite short.

Also, personally, if a sequel does come about, I feel like Connor has had enough tragedy in his life and would not like him to have a tragic ending. The reason being, at the end of ACIII, I felt that although Connor did do a lot of good with regards to building the homestead community and stopping the Templars for now, he actually lost a lot. He lost his mother, his best friend, his father, and Achilles, his mentor who was also like a father to him. Then, I really feel that he does not deserve a tragic ending.

Regarding Connor’s character development, at the end of ACIII I felt that in Achilles letter to Connor, it seemed that Achilles was leaving Connor in charge to continue the fight against Templars. Then because Achilles meant so much to Connor and because of his qualities, especially fighting for what he believes is right, I can’t see Connor just giving up and retiring. Also, he did recruit Assassins in ACIII and I feel that they would follow him to fight against any new Templar threat. Then, it was like the beginning of a fully-fledged Assassin Order. That is, in ACIII, it is implied that the Templars got rid of many Assassins and that they were few in number when Connor joined Achilles. Hence, regarding the Assassins that do remain, Connor could be the one to unite them.

Then in a sequel, I believe Connor would be more mature and much wiser due to his experiences. Also, I do feel that we need to see how his tragic past impacted him or how he came to terms with it. Personally, I feel that Connor already did express his emotions, but some people felt like he didn’t, which is why they must have found it harder to empathise with him. For example, this was probably due to time and technical constraints, but we never actually got to see how Connor felt for killing his best friend and for killing his own father. I believe it was implied because I feel that I do understand his character. However, for some, I think it may have come across as he didn’t care and just did what he had to do. Then, perhaps in a sequel, we could see Connor’s reflections on his past. I am aware that some aspects may have been covered in the novel “Forsaken”. The fact is, not everyone reads the books, which may also partly account for the mixed reception.

Overall, Connor is humble, compassionate and courageous and doesn't give up easily. He may have been naïve, but there is nothing wrong with believing that something shouldn’t be a certain way and that it should and can get better eventually. Then, Connor fights for what he believes is right for the good of all, and that is the type of character we need.

silvermercy
07-30-2013, 06:31 PM
Yes and yes.

Spider_Sith9
07-30-2013, 06:36 PM
No will soon take over the Yes option.

pirate1802
07-30-2013, 06:36 PM
No will soon take over the Yes option.

I hope..

Jexx21
07-30-2013, 06:38 PM
No will soon take over the Yes option.
yea, I did a count of Connor defenders to Connor haters in the "I don't want a Connor game" topic. There were more defenders..

ladyleonhart
07-30-2013, 06:39 PM
Yes, I would like another game with Connor. I do believe that his character can be developed further, which may even appeal to fans who don't like him so much. I feel that he will be more mature, stronger, and wiser due to his experiences... etc.

The rest of my case for why we need a Connor sequel:

This thread: You know what? Do YOU want another Connor game?
Link: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/783566-You-know-what-Do-YOU-want-another-Connor-game/page46

x___Luffy___x
07-30-2013, 06:41 PM
hell yeah :D

I-Like-Pie45
07-30-2013, 06:43 PM
FFS Jexx

pirate1802
07-30-2013, 06:48 PM
Jexx would be disappointed Pies didn't vote for the pies option. :/

Rugterwyper32
07-30-2013, 06:55 PM
There's also one thing I can think of: Admittedly, it was more fun to mess around with the most ruthless Connor from TokW, even in episode 1 when he wasn't yet so aggressive. I think we'd end up seeing a side of him more willing to do what needs to be done, more aggressive and still as goal-focused as ever. He did plan shelling New York, you saw how he dealt with Charles' bodyguards, and then how he interrogated the guy in the tavern before going for Charles. He's changed. And then we had TokW in which I didn't feel it was out of character killing guards mercilessly. I went through most of the game using only fists, admittedly, using weapons only on whoever I actually needed to kill, when it was needed for optional objectives or when hunting. It changed in the last 2 sequences and during TokW.

Jexx21
07-30-2013, 07:02 PM
Hope you don't mind Rugter, I updated the OP with some of your stuff from the first Connor game topic.

silvermercy
07-30-2013, 07:29 PM
Talking about aggressive Connor... Has anyone seen Drogo from Game of Thrones? I'd like to see a different Connor, and would love to imagine him like that! He's been bitter enough last time we saw him to make it possible to go this way.

If not Connor, at least another assassin...
But maybe that should be for another thread: Assassin aggressiveness ("barbarian" levels).

Drogo:

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110626031735/gameofthrones/images/1/1f/Drogo_1x01b.jpg

Jexx21
07-30-2013, 07:35 PM
I don't really like the idea of an aggressive Connor. In fact, I was confused when Connor ordered for part of New York to be shelled. Part of the creed is don't kill innocents.

Maybe it's an Ezio in Cappadocia situation... wait, Connor did also order an evacuation of that part of the city, right? Or at least for his Assassins to try to move the citizens.

pirate1802
07-30-2013, 07:35 PM
Isn't it Drogo.. ?

silvermercy
07-30-2013, 07:39 PM
Isn't it Drogo.. ?
Ah yeah. I'll change it now. I've heard it pronounced this way in my own language. lol

Theologian1
07-30-2013, 07:43 PM
I found that I cared more for Connor than any other playable character in the franchise. I mean I loved him. I want to know more about him and what happens after AC3. I felt like we were given the best character yet, but he got a bad wrap because of the bad mechanical and gameplay issues of AC3. I want a sequel with Connor in it. I want to know who he marries and how his children carry on the Assassin's story. He was the best character yet, but got clipped because of gameplay issues. Bring him back! Give us a sequel like Revelations, but with Connor.

Spider_Sith9
07-30-2013, 07:44 PM
Talking about aggressive Connor... Has anyone seen Drogo from Game of Thrones? I'd like to see a different Connor, and would love to imagine him like that! He's been bitter enough last time we saw him to make it possible to go this way.

If not Connor, at least another assassin...
But maybe that should be for another thread: Assassin aggressiveness ("barbarian" levels).

Drogo:

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110626031735/gameofthrones/images/1/1f/Drogo_1x01b.jpg
Then people would hate him for his sudden character change :P

silvermercy
07-30-2013, 07:46 PM
Then people would hate him for his sudden character change :P
Ah yes. Totally forgot about that... :|

lol

ze_topazio
07-30-2013, 07:49 PM
I voted yes but let me make this very clear, i do like pie, specially Portuguese style almond pie.

Jexx21
07-30-2013, 07:49 PM
I think very few people "hate" Connor. There's more people that just don't care than people who hate him according to this poll data.

Of course,the poll needs more time. :P

Jexx21
07-30-2013, 07:50 PM
I voted yes but let me make this very clear, i do like pie, specially Portuguese style almond pie.
The I like Pie choice was for our very own member named I like pie

silvermercy
07-30-2013, 07:52 PM
Fortunately, you didn't put chocolate cake. I would be very tempted.

pirate1802
07-30-2013, 08:17 PM
I was tempted to vote for the Pie option. Scubag Jexx..

Wolfmeister1010
07-30-2013, 08:44 PM
I don't really like the idea of an aggressive Connor. In fact, I was confused when Connor ordered for part of New York to be shelled. Part of the creed is don't kill innocents.

Maybe it's an Ezio in Cappadocia situation... wait, Connor did also order an evacuation of that part of the city, right? Or at least for his Assassins to try to move the citizens.

Connor only wanted to she'll the FORT part of New York...which he did. Very few civilian casualties, if any.

Wolfmeister1010
07-30-2013, 08:45 PM
SidSpyker will be pretty pissed with how the poll ended up.....

Spider_Sith9
07-30-2013, 09:05 PM
Connor only wanted to she'll the FORT part of New York...which he did. Very few civilian casualties, if any.

Not to mention this WAS a war.

Wolfmeister1010
07-30-2013, 09:08 PM
Not to mention this WAS a war.

Exactly. Plus...im not sure ezio did much to help the civilians. He was basically like shepherd in the mass effect DLC before the steroid hit the planet. He told the population of the planet "ummmm, so yeah...imma blow up your entire planet in about 5 minutes....but um...you should probably go...." He kinda half assed it.

ACHILLES4713
07-30-2013, 10:00 PM
A thousand times YES! I really enjoyed Connor's story, and liked how Ubisoft was stepping up to the plate once again since AC1 in giving us a minority as the hero in a story. I don't really get the arguments that he was bland and naive. Well DUH! Connor grew up in a village away from the white man's world, so of course he's going to experience some massive culture shock. And his life wasn't exactly peachy during that periode of time, so he's not going to be happy-go-lucky; as well as the fact that he's more of an introvert in personality than Ezio's extrovertedness. God forbid we get an Assassin that isn't an Ezio clone once an awhile.

ACHILLES4713
07-30-2013, 10:04 PM
Don't get me wrong, I thouroughly enjoy Ezio as a characture as well, and I'm sure I will love Edward, but does every single Assassin going foward NEED to be this Cpt. Kirk lady's man type of character? That would get old real fast. There's other types of characters one can write.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 01:05 AM
Exactly. Plus...im not sure ezio did much to help the civilians. He was basically like shepherd in the mass effect DLC before the steroid hit the planet. He told the population of the planet "ummmm, so yeah...imma blow up your entire planet in about 5 minutes....but um...you should probably go...." He kinda half assed it.

Yea, Ezio didn't do much.

And are you sure that Connor was only shelling the fort?

It seemed like it was a larger area.

RinoTheBouncer
07-31-2013, 01:13 AM
Here's my answer ;) http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/783142-You-know-what-I-do-want-another-Connor-game/page1

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 05:28 AM
I wish all the discussion from the other two threads would move to this thread because it's all the same damn topic anyway.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:36 AM
Hey! FirestarLuva voted Yes! Apparently he still scopes around these forums a bit. Missed your ideas on Native Connor stuff.

OSantaClownO
07-31-2013, 08:10 AM
Damn it I want to vote.
But I like Pie. :(

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 04:43 PM
everyone likes pie :)

pacmanate
07-31-2013, 04:46 PM
Whoever voted Pie meant to say no, but wanted Pie.

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 04:48 PM
Whoever voted Pie meant to say no, but wanted Pie.
Whoever voted anything other than yes wanted to say yes, but had Pac threatening them with a BB gun over their heads

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 04:50 PM
Whoever voted anything other than yes wanted to say yes, but had Pac threatening them with a BB gun over their heads
Lies. It was just a small 243 Winchester Super Short Magnum.

pacmanate
07-31-2013, 04:54 PM
Lies. It was just a small 243 Winchester Super Short Magnum.

It was actually my ****.

pacmanate
07-31-2013, 04:57 PM
Lies. It was just a small 243 Winchester Super Short Magnum.

No it wasn't

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 04:57 PM
I was actually confused at why Pacman voted for I don't care rather than yes, because I saw a post of his saying that he does want another Connor game.

Anyway, I wanted to ask Rugter about the Frontier in the idea for the Connor sequel. If the Frontier contained certain areas of the Northwest territory and Canada, how are they going to handle the great lakes? I mean, I know the frontier screwed up pretty much all of the geography in AC3 to suit the gameplay, but they can't just ignore the great lakes.

Here's a map of the Northwest territory, for those interested:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Northwest-territory-usa-1787.png

I was thinking, maybe we should leave the Frontier for the American areas, and a Naval free-roam area to the Canadian provinces. That would work I think. Of course, I would think that the Frontier would be smaller than the one in AC3, and that the Canadain Naval free-roam area would be smaller than the Caribbean free-roam in Black Flag.

ladyleonhart
07-31-2013, 05:06 PM
I know the frontier screwed up pretty much all of the geography in AC3 to suit the gameplay, but they can't just ignore the great lakes.


I honestly don't know anything about the geography of the great lakes, but do you think they might implement canoes, as in AC: Liberation? There is an image featuring Connor in a canoe.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 05:08 PM
They'd only do it if they decide that a great lake or two should take up a certain amount of space in like the middle of the map.

Or if there's enough rivers or something.

Canoes in AC3 honestly wouldn't have helped that much. The Bayou in Liberation was a freaking swamp though. You needed canoes in that game.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 05:09 PM
I was actually confused at why Pacman voted for I don't care rather than yes, because I saw a post of his saying that he does want another Connor game.

Anyway, I wanted to ask Rugter about the Frontier in the idea for the Connor sequel. If the Frontier contained certain areas of the Northwest territory and Canada, how are they going to handle the great lakes? I mean, I know the frontier screwed up pretty much all of the geography in AC3 to suit the gameplay, but they can't just ignore the great lakes.

Here's a map of the Northwest territory, for those interested:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Northwest-territory-usa-1787.png

I was thinking, maybe we should leave the Frontier for the American areas, and a Naval free-roam area to the Canadian provinces. That would work I think. Of course, I would think that the Frontier would be smaller than the one in AC3, and that the Canadain Naval free-roam area would be smaller than the Caribbean free-roam in Black Flag.

I really want Rugter to see this -_-

dxsxhxcx
07-31-2013, 05:09 PM
Connor certainly has the potential to become a great character after the events of AC3 (unless they make him bitter because of what happened) but IMO the place for a new game about him should've been now, right after AC3, so unless Edward has something important to show that we need to know before have another Connor game (which means that AC4's events could affect the events of the next Connor game and with hope this chain of events would make possible for us to defeat Juno in the next game after AC4), just move on and choose a new protagonist, I don't want them to make a new game about Connor just for the sake of doing it (I would prefer a new movie like Embers to end his story if this was the case)

ladyleonhart
07-31-2013, 05:14 PM
They'd only do it if they decide that a great lake or two should take up a certain amount of space in like the middle of the map.

Or if there's enough rivers or something.

Canoes in AC3 honestly wouldn't have helped that much. The Bayou in Liberation was a freaking swamp though. You needed canoes in that game.

Thanks for the reply. :) I agree with you about ACIII not needing canoes, it would have been rather pointless. I was just curious if anyone thought that they might be implemented in a sequel.

pacmanate
07-31-2013, 05:15 PM
I voted I don't care... because I don't.

I know I said I want another Connor game, but thinking about it properly, I don't really mind if we do or not. Same for Edward. I am happy to go wherever the devs take us.

Bastiaen
07-31-2013, 05:23 PM
Wow! That's an overwhelming poll. I hope that this gets passed on. Shade?

Rugterwyper32
07-31-2013, 05:24 PM
I was actually confused at why Pacman voted for I don't care rather than yes, because I saw a post of his saying that he does want another Connor game.

Anyway, I wanted to ask Rugter about the Frontier in the idea for the Connor sequel. If the Frontier contained certain areas of the Northwest territory and Canada, how are they going to handle the great lakes? I mean, I know the frontier screwed up pretty much all of the geography in AC3 to suit the gameplay, but they can't just ignore the great lakes.

Here's a map of the Northwest territory, for those interested:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Northwest-territory-usa-1787.png

I was thinking, maybe we should leave the Frontier for the American areas, and a Naval free-roam area to the Canadian provinces. That would work I think. Of course, I would think that the Frontier would be smaller than the one in AC3, and that the Canadain Naval free-roam area would be smaller than the Caribbean free-roam in Black Flag.

Sorry for taking so long, I was in class
In any case. I don't really think they should strive to be too accurate. I'd say keep the Kanien;Keh, Black Creek and Valley Forge areas of the original Frontier (enter the place through the mountain road you first take when heading to the homestead in AC3) but modify how they fit and then expand to the west. Kanien;Keh above Valley Forge, with people building stuff over the area where Connor's village was, Valley Forge to the south with the camp mostly abandoned (add an exit to Philly or Baltimore to the south was it needed), Black Creek to the west but with the area around Fort Duquesne modified with the two rivers surrounding it and the village of Pittsburgh growing around it (and Fort Pitt for good measure), and then expand the Frontier west and northwest as it goes through Ohio all the way to Michigan, with Detroit being at the northwest end of the Frontier and Sandusky at the southwestern end where Connor's people would be. That's my take on it at least.

Mr_Shade
07-31-2013, 05:42 PM
interesting...

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 06:18 PM
Sorry for taking so long, I was in class
In any case. I don't really think they should strive to be too accurate. I'd say keep the Kanien;Keh, Black Creek and Valley Forge areas of the original Frontier (enter the place through the mountain road you first take when heading to the homestead in AC3) but modify how they fit and then expand to the west. Kanien;Keh above Valley Forge, with people building stuff over the area where Connor's village was, Valley Forge to the south with the camp mostly abandoned (add an exit to Philly or Baltimore to the south was it needed), Black Creek to the west but with the area around Fort Duquesne modified with the two rivers surrounding it and the village of Pittsburgh growing around it (and Fort Pitt for good measure), and then expand the Frontier west and northwest as it goes through Ohio all the way to Michigan, with Detroit being at the northwest end of the Frontier and Sandusky at the southwestern end where Connor's people would be. That's my take on it at least.

Nah, I'd be fine if you didn't answer it for a couple of hours.

So you would keep the Frontier area in America? And just discard the great lakes pretty much?

Yea, I was just wondering because Kanatahseton is in New York, and there's obviously some huge lakes in the way of the village and the Northwest territory. Of course, Valley Forge is also in Pennsylvania. The AC3 frontier wasn't accurate at all in terms of actual town placements, so it wouldn't surprise me that the AC4: Homestead Flag (lol) frontier wouldn't be accurate. But ignoring the great lakes... that's kind of huge.

Rugterwyper32
07-31-2013, 06:33 PM
Nah, I'd be fine if you didn't answer it for a couple of hours.

So you would keep the Frontier area in America? And just discard the great lakes pretty much?

Yea, I was just wondering because Kanatahseton is in New York, and there's obviously some huge lakes in the way of the village and the Northwest territory. Of course, Valley Forge is also in Pennsylvania. The AC3 frontier wasn't accurate at all in terms of actual town placements, so it wouldn't surprise me that the AC4: Homestead Flag (lol) frontier wouldn't be accurate. But ignoring the great lakes... that's kind of huge.


If anything, i'd think we could focus on Lake Ontario and north of it so we'd have a route to Quebec and/or Montreal from there or something. Maybe expand north of Kanien;Keh too. And also Lake Erie on the way to Detroit, maybe. It could always work. I don't know. We could find a way for it to work somehow. But you're right, it needs more terrain in Canada. And adding the Niagara Falls would be such a nice touch and an opportunity not to be missed, actually.

Spider_Sith9
07-31-2013, 06:38 PM
Nah, I'd be fine if you didn't answer it for a couple of hours.

So you would keep the Frontier area in America? And just discard the great lakes pretty much?

Yea, I was just wondering because Kanatahseton is in New York, and there's obviously some huge lakes in the way of the village and the Northwest territory. Of course, Valley Forge is also in Pennsylvania. The AC3 frontier wasn't accurate at all in terms of actual town placements, so it wouldn't surprise me that the AC4: Homestead Flag (lol) frontier wouldn't be accurate. But ignoring the great lakes... that's kind of huge.


What's so bad about the Homestead Flag? ;__;

AC2_alex
07-31-2013, 06:51 PM
Here's a map of the Northwest territory, for those interested:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Northwest-territory-usa-1787.png

I was thinking, maybe we should leave the Frontier for the American areas, and a Naval free-roam area to the Canadian provinces. That would work I think. Of course, I would think that the Frontier would be smaller than the one in AC3, and that the Canadain Naval free-roam area would be smaller than the Caribbean free-roam in Black Flag.

This is very appealing to me. I'd love to see a more grizzled and tame Connor. I think the idea of an old Connor is much more bad a.s.s than old Ezio (whom I thought was kinda monotonous). Also, this would keep the naval tradition alive in the AC franchise.

Ya know, this naval thing is yet another thing that makes AC unique and special amongst other games, and it is another reason why I think the franchise will hold up just fine now that it has been annualized.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 06:52 PM
If anything, i'd think we could focus on Lake Ontario and north of it so we'd have a route to Quebec and/or Montreal from there or something. Maybe expand north of Kanien;Keh too. And also Lake Erie on the way to Detroit, maybe. It could always work. I don't know. We could find a way for it to work somehow. But you're right, it needs more terrain in Canada. And adding the Niagara Falls would be such a nice touch and an opportunity not to be missed, actually.

Oh yea, the Niagara Falls are amazing. Yea, that would need to be in any game that deals with Eastern Canada. Mmm.. is the river that leads into Lake Ontario the same river that Quebec City is on? Because I was thinking that river would make a nice route for the Aquila, obviously. Anyway, that would be a nice place to put one of those Naval fast-travel places, on a pier at Lake Ontario. Naval Fast travel would also let you get into the Canadian seas as well.

I'm just thinking, would the new Frontier be the same size or smaller than the AC3 frontier? I'm just thinking in terms of also including a small(er than Black Flag's) naval free-roam Area in Canada. I wouldn't want there to a mismanagement of resources :/

Agh, the game I want would be too big :P

As to spider sith, I put lol because I can't come up with a good subtitle for a Connor game.

AC2_alex
07-31-2013, 06:56 PM
As to spider sith, I put lol because I can't come up with a good subtitle for a Connor game.

Assassin's Creed: North West

http://i.i.cbsi.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim/2012/08/28/Kim-and-Kanye-2012_620x350.jpg

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 07:01 PM
As to spider sith, I put lol because I can't come up with a good subtitle for a Connor game.
Hey, that'd be fun to do actually!

Maybe we should make a new thread?? Not just for Connor. Any future game.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:03 PM
Anyway, I would want naval free-roam to be in the Gulf of Saint Lawrence for a Connor game. Here's some pictures to illustrate:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Golfe_Saint-Laurent_en.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/af/Grlakes_lawrence_map.png

Saint Lawrence River goes past Quebec City and Montreal, leads into Lake Ontario. This means that if they wanted to, we could potentially have free-roam on the great lakes as well, but I doubt that there's much interesting stuff on the Great Lakes, besides vistas, so it wouldn't be worth it.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:04 PM
Hey, that'd be fun to do actually!

Maybe we should make a new thread?? Not just for Connor. Any future game.
No, I hate making new threads for no reason. Keep it here. :)

please.

Rugterwyper32
07-31-2013, 07:04 PM
Oh yea, the Niagara Falls are amazing. Yea, that would need to be in any game that deals with Eastern Canada. Mmm.. is the river that leads into Lake Ontario the same river that Quebec City is on? Because I was thinking that river would make a nice route for the Aquila, obviously. Anyway, that would be a nice place to put one of those Naval fast-travel places, on a pier at Lake Ontario. Naval Fast travel would also let you get into the Canadian seas as well.

I'm just thinking, would the new Frontier be the same size or smaller than the AC3 frontier? I'm just thinking in terms of also including a small(er than Black Flag's) naval free-roam Area in Canada. I wouldn't want there to a mismanagement of resources :/

Agh, the game I want would be too big :P

As to spider sith, I put lol because I can't come up with a good subtitle for a Connor game.

I was thinking more or less the same. So I thought: Why not naval around the great lakes? There ARE islands in the great lakes (31 in Lake Erie alone, in fact. Less in Lake Ontario but still) and we could see the smaller settlements around the coasts. Maybe a smaller map for the eastern seaboard with way to make it to Philadelphia, Quebec and the Homestead, but with less going on for it (Maybe have a small version of Nova Scotia/New Burnswick). So imagine this: Both the frontier with the great lakes and the smaller eastern seaboard map would make the total size of the AC4 naval map. Sounds good? I think it'd work.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:07 PM
Hmm, yea, that might work.

I would also enjoy Prince Edward Island by the way. Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland were my favorite places when I went on a trip to the Northeast provinces of Canada.

Although, I still don't see the Great Lakes being that exciting :/

EDIT: I dunno, I just see the Gulf of Saint Lawrence also being an awesome place to sail in.

ze_topazio
07-31-2013, 07:09 PM
AC games are made in Montreal, a game there would make a lot of sense.

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 07:13 PM
No, I hate making new threads for no reason. Keep it here. :)

please.

okay then!

My Connor titles:
(some inspired by music albums I've listened to, some are mine):


-AC4: Close To The Edge
-AC4: For Earth Below
-AC4: After the Gold Rush
-AC4: Ascension
-AC4: The Silent Way
-AC4: First Utterance
-AC4: Ashes Against The Grain
-AC4: Desert Shore
-AC4: Aurora
-AC4: Stories From The Sky

-AC4: Thriller (naaah, just kidding... :p)

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 07:15 PM
okay then!

My connor titles:
(some inspired by music albums i've listened to, some are mine):


-ac4: Close to the edge
-ac4: For earth below
-ac4: After the gold rush
-ac4: Ascension
-ac4: The silent way
-ac4: First utterance
-ac4: Ashes against the grain
-ac4: Desert shore
-ac4: Aurora
-ac4: Stories from the sky

-ac4: Thriller (naaah, just kidding... :p)
Ac4: CBB

ze_topazio
07-31-2013, 07:16 PM
Assassin's Creed IV Electric boogaloo

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:17 PM
Assassin's Creed IV: Northern Ascent

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 07:19 PM
Ac4: CBB
Does CBB stand for Connor Be Back? lol


I'd suggest Electric Boogie, topazio! :p Connor discovering electricity and the joys of Dancing to the Boogie.

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 07:21 PM
Does CBB stand for Connor Be Back? lol
No, Connor`s back *****es...or Candy & beach buggies

ladyleonhart
07-31-2013, 07:22 PM
ACIV: Trinity

Well, there are three Kenways! :)

So, maybe they could link the past (Edward & Haytham) to Connor's future in some way. I guess ACIV: Black Flag would have to link to or have some direct influence on a new Connor game.

pirate1802
07-31-2013, 07:23 PM
Assassins Creed IV: Never Expected This!

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 07:26 PM
Assassins Creed IV: Never Expected This!
hahahahaaaaa!!!!


No, Connor`s back *****es...or Candy & beach buggies
or... AC4: YBTINBBBHIA (You B****es Thought I'D Never Be Back But Here I Am)

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 07:27 PM
AC4: What woman like?

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:28 PM
more people need to add more ideas to the canadian connor game idea. :)

ladyleonhart
07-31-2013, 07:29 PM
AC4: What woman like?

Not funny -_-

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 07:30 PM
AC4: What woman like?
I'm sure he will have learned by then and doesn't ask that question again! LOL

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:46 PM
Yes yes.. Connor was a virgin in AC3.

Hope you realize that being a virgin isn't bad. People who use it as an insult put some kind of egotistical stock into having sex.

ladyleonhart
07-31-2013, 07:47 PM
Yes yes.. Connor was a virgin in AC3.

Hope you realize that being a virgin isn't bad. People who use it as an insult put some kind of egotistical stock into having sex.

I don't think it's bad. :)

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 07:48 PM
Yes yes.. Connor was a virgin in AC3.

Hope you realize that being a virgin isn't bad. People who use it as an insult put some kind of egotistical stock into having sex.
I`v never been in a romantic relationship :|

T`was a joke

ladyleonhart
07-31-2013, 07:50 PM
I`v never been in a romantic relationship :|

T`was a joke

Which part...?

pirate1802
07-31-2013, 07:51 PM
Yes yes.. Connor was a virgin in AC3.

Hope you realize that being a virgin isn't bad. People who use it as an insult put some kind of egotistical stock into having sex.

'Tis bad.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 07:52 PM
I`v never been in a romantic relationship :|

T`was a joke
It wasn't directed at you..

In any case.. my personal beliefs regarding sex is that you should only do it if you and your partner are positive you would want to spend the rest of your lives together learning from each other and building each other up.

..so yea.

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 07:54 PM
Which part...?
AC4: What woman like? <----- that one :P

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 07:54 PM
In any case.. my personal beliefs regarding sex is that you should only do it if you and your partner are positive you would want to spend the rest of your lives together learning from each other and building each other up.
That's refreshing to hear. I agree. :)

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 08:00 PM
So.. let's get back to Connor game ideas.

Nah, I'd be fine if you didn't answer it for a couple of hours.

So you would keep the Frontier area in America? And just discard the great lakes pretty much?

Yea, I was just wondering because Kanatahseton is in New York, and there's obviously some huge lakes in the way of the village and the Northwest territory. Of course, Valley Forge is also in Pennsylvania. The AC3 frontier wasn't accurate at all in terms of actual town placements, so it wouldn't surprise me that the AC4: Homestead Flag (lol) frontier wouldn't be accurate. But ignoring the great lakes... that's kind of huge.



If anything, i'd think we could focus on Lake Ontario and north of it so we'd have a route to Quebec and/or Montreal from there or something. Maybe expand north of Kanien;Keh too. And also Lake Erie on the way to Detroit, maybe. It could always work. I don't know. We could find a way for it to work somehow. But you're right, it needs more terrain in Canada. And adding the Niagara Falls would be such a nice touch and an opportunity not to be missed, actually.


Oh yea, the Niagara Falls are amazing. Yea, that would need to be in any game that deals with Eastern Canada. Mmm.. is the river that leads into Lake Ontario the same river that Quebec City is on? Because I was thinking that river would make a nice route for the Aquila, obviously. Anyway, that would be a nice place to put one of those Naval fast-travel places, on a pier at Lake Ontario. Naval Fast travel would also let you get into the Canadian seas as well.

I'm just thinking, would the new Frontier be the same size or smaller than the AC3 frontier? I'm just thinking in terms of also including a small(er than Black Flag's) naval free-roam Area in Canada. I wouldn't want there to a mismanagement of resources :/

Agh, the game I want would be too big :P

As to spider sith, I put lol because I can't come up with a good subtitle for a Connor game.


Anyway, I would want naval free-roam to be in the Gulf of Saint Lawrence for a Connor game. Here's some pictures to illustrate:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Golfe_Saint-Laurent_en.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/af/Grlakes_lawrence_map.png

Saint Lawrence River goes past Quebec City and Montreal, leads into Lake Ontario. This means that if they wanted to, we could potentially have free-roam on the great lakes as well, but I doubt that there's much interesting stuff on the Great Lakes, besides vistas, so it wouldn't be worth it.


I was thinking more or less the same. So I thought: Why not naval around the great lakes? There ARE islands in the great lakes (31 in Lake Erie alone, in fact. Less in Lake Ontario but still) and we could see the smaller settlements around the coasts. Maybe a smaller map for the eastern seaboard with way to make it to Philadelphia, Quebec and the Homestead, but with less going on for it (Maybe have a small version of Nova Scotia/New Burnswick). So imagine this: Both the frontier with the great lakes and the smaller eastern seaboard map would make the total size of the AC4 naval map. Sounds good? I think it'd work.


Hmm, yea, that might work.

I would also enjoy Prince Edward Island by the way. Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland were my favorite places when I went on a trip to the Northeast provinces of Canada.

Although, I still don't see the Great Lakes being that exciting :/

EDIT: I dunno, I just see the Gulf of Saint Lawrence also being an awesome place to sail in.


Current question: Gulf of Saint Lawrence free-roam or Great Lakes free-roam?

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 08:07 PM
So.. let's get back to Connor game ideas.













Current question: Gulf of Saint Lawrence free-roam or Great Lakes free-roam?
Gulf of Saint Lawrence.

Spider_Sith9
07-31-2013, 08:43 PM
Assassin's Creed: Genesis seems like the consensus for another Connor game name. So I'll go with that Assassin's Creed/V: Genesis.

ze_topazio
07-31-2013, 08:49 PM
It wasn't directed at you..

In any case.. my personal beliefs regarding sex is that you should only do it if you and your partner are positive you would want to spend the rest of your lives together learning from each other and building each other up.

..so yea.

That's straight out of the XIX century.

Rugterwyper32
07-31-2013, 08:51 PM
I think that's a possibility. The main thing was about the game missing the great lakes, though I'd love to see more of the eastern seaboard focusing on the Gulf of Saint Lawrence. I suppose you could go by foot from Quebec to the Frontier and just follow the lake around until you get to the Niagara Falls and further along all the way to the end of Lake Erie. The frontier could be mainly focused on the edge of the great lakes and down south until a point stops you from going further. Maybe being able to go around the northern edge of Lake Erie to get to Detroit, too, and being able to use a smaller boat to get to the 31 islands in Lake Erie or something. It would all be compacted so that's possible, after all. I have a map from the war of 1812 here that shows names of locations and the such too so I'll edit it to show more or less the area I'm thinking it could cover. Of course, for game purposes it'd probably be compacted and not entirely accurate.

stingray110
07-31-2013, 08:52 PM
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8250/8508429692_10aa83d706_z.jpg

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 10:02 PM
Assassin's Creed: Genesis seems like the consensus for another Connor game name. So I'll go with that Assassin's Creed/V: Genesis.
Uhh, who's been saying that seems like the consensus? Was there a poll? Because I'm pretty sure that you're the only person on the forums that has suggested this. Look, just say that you would like it to be called Genesis, rather than saying that you think that's what everyone wants..


That's straight out of the XIX century.
Thanks bud. No idea why people feel the need to insult others so much for their ideas on when to engage in sex. It's not like I'm forcing that idea on others. People can do what they want.


I think that's a possibility. The main thing was about the game missing the great lakes, though I'd love to see more of the eastern seaboard focusing on the Gulf of Saint Lawrence. I suppose you could go by foot from Quebec to the Frontier and just follow the lake around until you get to the Niagara Falls and further along all the way to the end of Lake Erie. The frontier could be mainly focused on the edge of the great lakes and down south until a point stops you from going further. Maybe being able to go around the northern edge of Lake Erie to get to Detroit, too, and being able to use a smaller boat to get to the 31 islands in Lake Erie or something. It would all be compacted so that's possible, after all. I have a map from the war of 1812 here that shows names of locations and the such too so I'll edit it to show more or less the area I'm thinking it could cover. Of course, for game purposes it'd probably be compacted and not entirely accurate.

I wouldn't mind a free-roam area in either the Great Lakes of the Gulf of St. Lawrence. I would love both to be available. And honestly, the idea of a Frontier/Great Lakes map the size of the Black Flag game world sounds awesome, but I'd be concerned about what we could discover in these areas. In the Gulf of St. Lawrence we could possibly find Viking stuff, which I think would be pretty cool. I wouldn't mind introducing a Norse First Civ, and then possibly introducing some celtic elements (leading to Ireland or Scotland with Connor's daughter? :P).

Kagurra
07-31-2013, 10:06 PM
NO.

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 10:08 PM
Why not :(

Assassin_M
07-31-2013, 10:08 PM
NO.
i`m so scared of capitalized letters D:

Jexx21
07-31-2013, 10:30 PM
Aww.. more people who don't want a Connor game are voicing their opinion.

Actually, I'm rather surprised by the fact that there are more people that say "No" rather than people saying "I don't care."

Hmm.. maybe I should have asked "Would you buy another Connor game?" rather than should there be..

Hmm...

I'll make another poll covering that after Black Flag releases..

Poll response is still positive though, in terms of people wanting another Connor game.

silvermercy
07-31-2013, 10:31 PM
i`m so scared of capitalized letters D:I'm not!! Bring it on! Bring on all your capital letters! http://a.deviantart.net/avatars/s/p/spartaplz.gif

White24Room
08-01-2013, 02:23 AM
I'd say yes and no.

I want another Connor game because we didn't play as Connor as long as it should have been. Only 6 sequences as an assasin and the last sequences had only a few memories.

But, in a way, his ending was also satisfying.
He realizes that there'll always be conflits and he can't save everyone. I really liked this noble character with a great heart, but i'm still disappointed we didn't play him a lot...

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 02:43 AM
Yup, I definitely should have made the question "Would you buy and play another Connor game?"

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 03:28 AM
I knew the Noes would come harder just as the Templars would. Kinda proves my point that there are ALOT of Connor haters or at least do not want another game with him.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 03:30 AM
Wtf. Comparing people who don't like Connor to templars is just stupid. plain and simple.

And yea, there are definitely mostly connor haters. That's why the noes make up like 26% of the votes. I think that most of the noes would actually buy a second connor game if they released one, at least if the gameplay looked good.

afddsgadgagsdagdsgd

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 03:35 AM
Wtf. Comparing people who don't like Connor to templars is just stupid. plain and simple.

And yea, there are definitely mostly connor haters. That's why the noes make up like 26% of the votes. I think that most of the noes would actually buy a second connor game if they released one, at least if the gameplay looked good.

afddsgadgagsdagdsgd I meant the Alliegances polls months ago. xD It started out Assassins then Templars quickly took over. Only difference is the Connors have a large advantage. But now the Noes are getting near half the bar.

However, Connor publicity would prevent it from selling as well as other titles regardless of how good it is.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 03:38 AM
Dude, no. Shut up. you assume things too much. I mean seriously, you think you know ****ing everything. this may be the coffee talking but you really need to learn that not everyone even cares about connor.

most people are enticed by the idea of killing people in a historical setting. I imagine that most of the general audience doesn't care about the characters or the story that much. plenty of games are popular that have crappy stories and characters but they still sell a good amount.

so yea. stop assuming things.

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 03:44 AM
Dude, no. Shut up. you assume things too much. I mean seriously, you think you know ****ing everything. this may be the coffee talking but you really need to learn that not everyone even cares about connor.

most people are enticed by the idea of killing people in a historical setting. I imagine that most of the general audience doesn't care about the characters or the story that much. plenty of games are popular that have crappy stories and characters but they still sell a good amount.

so yea. stop assuming things.
You really gotta stop berating me. I'm saying Connor may suffer Reverse Wolverine Publicity. You come after me only on these things. Maybe Rino should've made it about buying a game after all.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 03:45 AM
I made this poll >.>

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 03:47 AM
I made this poll >.>

Oops. With how many identical thread names there have been I got crossed up. :p

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 03:47 AM
You really gotta stop berating me. I'm saying Connor may suffer Reverse Wolverine Publicity. You come after me only on these things. Maybe Rino should've made it about buying a game after all.
yea, no. I get on anyone's case who assumes that they think that they are in the majority/minority, because there's no way to fully know unless you poll everyone. look at some of my previous posts, I'm pretty sure I've gotten on the cases of silvermercy and leonheart. not just you

On this poll, the people who think Connor should get another game outnumber the people who don't.

Also, making up disorder-like sounding names is strange.

I'll berate anyone who I want because I'm Jexx the Kind ******* who likes to use oxymoronic statements

like sophomore and emotional intelligence.

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 03:54 AM
yea, no. I get on anyone's case who assumes that they think that they are in the majority/minority, because there's no way to fully know unless you poll everyone. look at some of my previous posts, I'm pretty sure I've gotten on the cases of silvermercy and leonheart. not just you

On this poll, the people who think Connor should get another game outnumber the people who don't.

Also, making up disorder-like sounding names is strange.

I'll berate anyone who I want because I'm Jexx the Kind ******* who likes to use oxymoronic statements

like sophomore and emotional intelligence.

You are a jerk is what you are. :)

http://www.gamongirls.com/IMG/jpg/altair1.jpg

I don't come from these parts. Alot of areas and gaming in general dislikes Connor so excuse me if I am jaded. Is that a crime?

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 03:57 AM
i know i'm a jerk, i live on jerkiness.

actually, people tell me i'm frank.

I actually don't mean most of what I say in a mean way, I just tell people what I see.

I see a lot of people who dislike Connor as well, but to be honest, I can't poll thousands of people. Ubisoft knew that Connor was gonna be a mixed bag when they released him, so yea.

AND YES IT TOTALLY IS A CRIME A CRIME WORTHY OF PUNISHMENT IN A THOUSAND COTTAN CANDIE STICKS

get hyper like me. hyper hyper hyper.

get some of that new drug out there. it's called coffee

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 04:10 AM
Regardless, I have wishes but no longer do I have hope. Compared to how I was adamant on it the past few months. I guess I....kinda accepted it at this point.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 04:13 AM
Then you give up to easily. never give up hope.

keep that big s on your chest

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 04:19 AM
"Life is not a fairytale! There are no happy endings!" - Achilles Davenport

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 04:21 AM
then kill myself

VitaminsXYZ
08-01-2013, 04:38 AM
Voted yes.

Honestly one of the main reasons, for me, is because of how little we actually played as Connor. I actually found him to be the most interesting assassin and would've loved to see him develop further. I know they're trying to do the whole Kenway saga thing, so they had to squeeze Haytham in somewhere, but I wish they had at least added more Connor sequences to make up for the sharing. (Hell, even the book was about Haytham.) If AC3 had been Connor's own full game, then I would've been fine with it ending there.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 05:04 AM
I wouldn't have been if they left of his story in a similar fashion.

VitaminsXYZ
08-01-2013, 05:13 AM
I wouldn't have been if they left of his story in a similar fashion.

To each his own. Personally I like how tragic it was, how despite everything he did he still couldn't win. (History tells us as much anyways.) He starts off bright and idealistic, and instead grows to become incredibly jaded. Quite the opposite of how protagonists usually progress, as will be Edward's case.

Anyways, seeing as how they cut his soliloquy, I feel like he will appear in some form again. Maybe not a full game, but that monologue seemed too conclusive, so they're probably saving it for a future appearance...I hope.

I-Like-Pie45
08-01-2013, 05:22 AM
Connor never gave up.

Not when his mom died in front of him.

Not when he recruited some mentally unhinged Canadian cooking bastard into the Assassins.

Not when he had to kill his father in the name of ideology.

Not when he had to kill his best friend.

Not when he betrayed his people for the colonist's freedom.

Not when he found out the man he had been supporting killed his mommy.

Not when he couldn't kill said man to get his revenge because that would've been what the Templars wanted.

Not when his mentor died in his greatest period of crisis.

Not when his mother died in front of him again and he got shot and stabbed a couple of times. And then some more weird stuff happened. And I think he might've been corrupted in an alternate dimension.

But the point is, Connor never gave up even at the points where he was at his lowest when all had turned their backs on him and most would've walked away. He continued on, BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE WILL

And if you give up so easily, I think you don't deserve to be a Connor fan

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 05:32 AM
To each his own. Personally I like how tragic it was, how despite everything he did he still couldn't win. (History tells us as much anyways.) He starts off bright and idealistic, and instead grows to become incredibly jaded. Quite the opposite of how protagonists usually progress, as will be Edward's case.

Anyways, seeing as how they cut his soliloquy, I feel like he will appear in some form again. Maybe not a full game, but that monologue seemed too conclusive, so they're probably saving it for a future appearance...I hope.

In the book, the lines after the soliloquy say "I return to my people, to the Assassins. It's time for new blood."

This can allude to a new war with the Templars, and recruiting new Assassins.

****ing yes. I just came up with a perfect title for a new Connor game.

Assassin's Creed IV: New Blood

pirate1802
08-01-2013, 06:22 AM
No I don't want a new Connor game. What does Sid call him? McWoodson or something?

I-Like-Pie45
08-01-2013, 06:31 AM
Connor can be our woody and Sid can be our buzz

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 06:33 AM
kill.

Sid can be our buzzkill.

I-Like-Pie45
08-01-2013, 06:36 AM
Do you want to be our buzz, Jexx

Legendz54
08-01-2013, 06:43 AM
Do you want to be our buzz, Jexx

Im angry at you, You spoiled some AC4 to me.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 06:56 AM
Lol.

So, potential artifacts we could find on the great lakes or in the Gulf of St. Lawrence?

For the gulf of St. Lawrence, I'm thinking some Viking stuff, possibly some Celtic and Gaelic stuff, at least for the Gulf of St. Lawrence.

I don't know what we could find on the Great lakes. Peg leg trinkets? :P

pirate1802
08-01-2013, 07:17 AM
Im angry at you, You spoiled some AC4 to me.

hahaha

Legendz54
08-01-2013, 07:27 AM
hahaha

Im serious he literally did, I got spoiled who one of the damn templars are ****!!!!

pirate1802
08-01-2013, 07:28 AM
Im serious he literally did, I got spoiled who one of the damn templars are ****!!!!

Thats not too bad. The downside of basing games of history is if you know you history well, most of the game is auto-spoiled for you :p

Legendz54
08-01-2013, 07:37 AM
Thats not too bad. The downside of basing games of history is if you know you history well, most of the game is auto-spoiled for you :p

I know its not that bad but i was just hoping for a complete spoiler free experience.. Oh well. At least I know its not too important or a boss fight since the game ends in 1725 and they die before that. After the Havana Demo Im gone. All it takes is one rotten pie to spoil everything..

pirate1802
08-01-2013, 08:18 AM
i was just hoping for a complete spoiler free experience..

That's not possible brother :(. Believe me I've tried. The only way is to cut off you internet wire and shut yourself out completely fro the world. I'm lucky (o unlucky?) enough to not have any real life friend around me who is into videogames, so most of my spoilers come from the interwebz :|


. All it takes is one rotten pie to spoil everything..

Its like walking through a minefield. You think you are doing well. Then one careless moment and you are done. The worst feeling ever! I lost my appetite after I got Bioshock Infinite spoiled for me :X

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 08:18 AM
I have some combat and parkour improvement ideas. I'll post them in a new topic later..

Legendz54
08-01-2013, 08:36 AM
That's not possible brother :(. Believe me I've tried. The only way is to cut off you internet wire and shut yourself out completely fro the world. I'm lucky (o unlucky?) enough to not have any real life friend around me who is into videogames, so most of my spoilers come from the interwebz :|



Its like walking through a minefield. You think you are doing well. Then one careless moment and you are done. The worst feeling ever! I lost my appetite after I got Bioshock Infinite spoiled for me :X

Yea i feel you, The day i got AC3 ending spoiled i couldn't sleep for days, and the worst thing was that i had an AC3 poster right across from my bed staring back at me every night, constantly reminding me I screwed up. Not going to let that happen with AC4.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 09:16 AM
I'd suggest going dark real soon.

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 10:04 AM
Im angry at you, You spoiled some AC4 to me.

Yeah, during another one of his GW Campbell-esque attacks, he even spoiled the ending to TLOU. What gets into this guy?


Yea i feel you, The day i got AC3 ending spoiled i couldn't sleep for days, and the worst thing was that i had an AC3 poster right across from my bed staring back at me every night, constantly reminding me I screwed up. Not going to let that happen with AC4.

If it wasn't for this particular Youtube Comment (it was the video that showed Modern Day screens), I may not have rushed the game.

Legendz54
08-01-2013, 10:17 AM
Yeah, during another one of his GW Campbell-esque attacks, he even spoiled the ending to TLOU. What gets into this guy?



If it wasn't for this particular Youtube Comment (it was the video that showed Modern Day screens), I may not have rushed the game.

Yea I thought he was joking so i read that little list and realised some of it was true, Luckily I finished TLOU but im kinda pissed right now, After havana i am hightailing out of here.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 03:49 PM
Ha. There are 69 votes.

pirate1802
08-01-2013, 04:22 PM
Ha. There are 69 votes.

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121030060432/meme/images/9/9f/MeGustaBlackSS.png

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 06:54 PM
Alot more people against it. D:

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 06:56 PM
Alot more people against it. D:
You know, People who voted no don`t necessarily dislike Connor...

also, it`s 44 to 18 -_-

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 06:59 PM
You know, People who voted no don`t necessarily dislike Connor...

also, it`s 44 to 18 -_-

The "Yes" vote has only gone up by one since yesterday though. -_- I'm sure people are joining the forums just to say "No".

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 07:04 PM
They aren't. I checked.

silvermercy
08-01-2013, 07:05 PM
I feel like posting this thread link on tumblr since they're unaware. But then it will be unfair for the NO voters. I mean... 1000 to 18 within a day... :p

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 07:06 PM
Silver, I'd actually appreciate if you would spread this poll around to as many places as possible.

Spider, since you seem to know places where a lot of Connor haters roam, post this there to.

I like to have as many votes as possible, it gives a better idea of what the results are.

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 07:06 PM
They aren't. I checked.

I'm sure it was 43 yesterday.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 07:07 PM
I'm sure it was 43 yesterday.
No, I mean, there aren't people joining just to say no.

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 07:08 PM
Okay.... We're doomed. -_-

silvermercy
08-01-2013, 07:09 PM
They'd need to register though... Not sure if they will... And I'll need to create a new anonymous blog. *sigh* LOL

I know polls in deviantart with hundreds of votes and Connor almost always wins though. :)

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 07:09 PM
No, I mean, there aren't people joining just to say no.

Thanks. :) Great to know! xD

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 07:11 PM
They'd need to register though... Not sure if they will... And I'll need to create a new anonymous blog. *sigh* LOL

I know polls in deviantart with hundreds of votes and Connor almost always wins though. :)
Meh, they don't have to vote. There would still be a few people that would register to vote though..

By the way, there are more than twice as many Yes's as No's. So.. yea, there are still a great number of people who would want another Connor game.

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 07:12 PM
I`m sure this will make you happy

http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/726877-Why-don-t-you-guys-like-Connor-spoilers-Forums

http://gyazo.com/9aab2144e14f91562ec03f141ae5ce72.png

pirate1802
08-01-2013, 07:14 PM
The percentage of "Yes" is going down at an alarming rate :O

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 07:14 PM
I`m sure this will make you happy


Don't know if that was aimed at me, but... Thank you, M!! :D

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 07:15 PM
Don't know if that was aimed at me, but... Thank you, M!! :D
it was aimed at everyone who`s worried :P

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 07:17 PM
The percentage of "Yes" is going down at an alarming rate :O

It's still the largest in the poll.

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 07:18 PM
it was aimed at everyone who`s worried :P

Okay. I'm not grateful. I take it back.

It wasn't for my benefit because I wasn't worried at all anyway. Why should I be?

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 07:19 PM
Okay. I'm not grateful. I take it back.

It wasn't for my benefit because I wasn't worried at all anyway. Why should I be?
That escalated quickly :O

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 07:21 PM
That escalated quickly :O

I didn't escalate anything.

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 07:23 PM
I didn't escalate anything.
Okay. I`m sorry :|

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 07:23 PM
Lol.

pirate1802
08-01-2013, 07:38 PM
Well that de-escalated quickly!

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 07:40 PM
ESCALATORS ESCALATOR ESCALATORS!!

eels..

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 07:57 PM
ESCALATORS ESCALATOR ESCALATORS!!

eels..

I don't like escalators. :( I'm kind of afraid of heights. o_0

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 08:00 PM
I don't like escalators. :( I'm kind of afraid of heights. o_0
Aww...I was planning to take you on my carpet :|

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 08:04 PM
Aww...I was planning to take you on my carpet :|

I still like roller-coasters! xD I know that probably doesn't make sense... Anyway, why would I want to go with you?

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 08:07 PM
I still like roller-coasters! xD I know that probably doesn't make sense... Anyway, why would I want to go with you?
Because i`m irresistible..

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 08:20 PM
Because i`m irresistible..

Maybe you are. I don't know. You haven't been irresistible to me... Anyway, I thought you were taking Jexx. ^_^

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 08:24 PM
I still like roller-coasters! xD I know that probably doesn't make sense... Anyway, why would I want to go with you?

Celestia's Mane! I love Roller Coasters~! <3 Especially the ones where there are unexpected drops that catches you off guard! Gives me a slight blush~ I even bounce butt first on my bed when I'm excited especially to music.

But do not force me on your lap and bounce me like a pony. I do not enjoy embarrassment. I'm no child and I must keep my stoic exterior.

Alim501
08-01-2013, 08:24 PM
Nothing wrong with Connor, though he's less interesting than Altair or Ezio, and a lot more of a barbarian. I just don't like the environment for AC North America. It's not romantic.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 08:25 PM
The Crusades weren't romantic either.

So.. yes let's go back to Ezio.

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 08:27 PM
it's not romantic.
I fear for AC :|

Also, prepare yourself for Lady`s onslaught :P

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 08:27 PM
Nothing wrong with Connor, though he's less interesting than Altair or Ezio, and a lot more of a barbarian. I just don't like the environment for AC North America. It's not romantic.

Connor is NOT a barbarian.

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 08:29 PM
Connor is NOT a barbarian.
Did you forget when he saves Prudence from the bear?? or when he collects flowers for Norris?? or when he gets Prudence the doctor?? or when he helps Norris hook up with Myriam?? and when he personally pays for the building of a church?? or when he personally pays for an Inn?? or when he calls the Homsteaders his friends not his townsfolk??

What a barbarian..all those are the actions of a barbaric, senseless monster

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 08:38 PM
Did you forget when he saves Prudence from the bear?? or when he collects flowers for Norris?? or when he gets Prudence the doctor?? or when he helps Norris hook up with Myriam?? and when he personally pays for the building of a church?? or when he personally pays for an Inn?? or when he calls the Homsteaders his friends not his townsfolk??

What a barbarian..all those are the actions of a barbaric, senseless monster


WHY are you provoking me!?

When Connor saves Prudence from the bear, it's heroic. When he collects flowers for Norris, he is helping a friend who is incapable of doing it himself. When he gets Prudence a doctor, it's because he cares. When he helps Norris get together with Myriam, it is out of kindness for a friend and like I said, because Norris can't do it himself. He pays because he is generous. He calls the homesteaders his friends because he isn't arrogant and doesn't believe he is better than anybody else!

Those are not the actions of a barbaric, senseless monster!! So, therefore... YOU ARE WRONG!!!!

So your vocabulary choice is wrong.

Connor's qualities consist of kindness, caring, generosity, heroism and humility! :)

Well, I hope that is clearer for you, M!

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 08:40 PM
M wasn't being serious.

ladyleon, do you understand satire?

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 08:41 PM
WHY are you provoking me!?

When Connor saves Prudence from the bear, it's heroic. When he collects flowers for Norris, he is helping a friend who is incapable of doing it himself. When he gets Prudence a doctor, it's because he cares. When he helps Norris get together with Myriam, it is out of kindness for a friend and like I said, because Norris can't do it himself.

Those are not the actions of a barbaric, senseless monster!! So, therefore... YOU ARE WRONG!!!!

So your vocabulary choice is wrong.

Connor's qualities consist of kindness, caring and heroism! :)

Well, I hope that is clearer for you, M!
I can prove to you that he`s barbaric. He apologizes to Achilles and risks his life to fetch him his old outfit...he also brings him the painting all the way from NY and dismisses the notion that Achilles, being dark skinned, is inferior by saying "that is not true"

Another example is when he stops Putnam from kicking Hickey`s body, because he`s still a man.

He`s extremely barbaric and a senseless monster

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 08:43 PM
Nothing wrong with Connor, though he's less interesting than Altair or Ezio, and a lot more of a barbarian. I just don't like the environment for AC North America. It's not romantic.

Romance settings are glossy.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 08:45 PM
what does glossy mean in a metaphorical sense. I understand physical glossiness..

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 08:46 PM
M wasn't being serious.

ladyleon, do you understand satire?

Jexx, honestly, I can never tell when he is being serious or not. o_0; He does it on purpose. -_-

Yes, I do, but I don't understand M at all. :'(

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 08:48 PM
Yes, I do, but I don't understand M at all. :'(
That`s because you haven't tried my magical carpet...

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 08:52 PM
Jexx, honestly, I can never tell when he is being serious or not. o_0; He does it on purpose. -_-

Yes, I do, but I don't understand M at all. :'(

This is the forums in a nutshell.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 08:54 PM
you're my brain in my butt in a buttgun

Alim501
08-01-2013, 10:31 PM
Yeah I think I get the picture now. You all think 'romantic' means 'related to matters of love'. Well it does but not in the sappy man-woman sense. I was talking in the sense of heroic chivalry - moral qualities of the horseman warrior, which can be traced to the time and place of the first AC game. I'm sorry but I think AC was wasted on most of you and perhaps Connor was a wise marketing move on the part of Ubisoft from that point of view. You guys have no idea about the amount of research work that went into AC 1, 2, Brotherhood and Revelations. You think a Native American at the time of the Civil War is an example of a 'civilised' man, because you assume that rescuing ladies or having compassion means someone is 'civilised'. WRONG. Being 'civilised' means you're part of a civilisation. The Nizari Ismailis were at the leading edge of science, philosophy and rationalism in their time. Then of course Renaissance Italy. Nothing needs to be said about that I hope. Then the height of the Ottoman military organisation in 1453. Bringing artillery and siege warfare to Europe.. And you compare some wigwam-dwelling barbarian swinging through the trees with the very best examples of historical civilisations we have... Just because in a story, he saves some people. Words fail me, seriously. But perhaps they fail YOU more. The kind term you're looking for, for Connor, is 'noble savage', not 'civilised man'. A real damn shame we are actually comparing Native American neolithics with the Nizari Ismaili citadel-state, Renaissance Italy, Ottoman Istanbul, etc.

I fear for the future of AC. The market doesn't appreciate the product.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 10:43 PM
You think that Colonial America doesn't contain romanticism? I applaud you for thinking that somehow, Connor isn't a man that can be someone's knight in shining armor. Connor was part of a civilization making its roots, and I fear that you haven't been paying attention to the learnings of Connor. You strike me as a man that thinks that somehow, young nations are inferior to older nations and have no chance of improving themselves. You failed to understand that Connor wasn't holding on to what he learned in his tribe. He was taught many things by Achilles, relating to history, philosophy, and morals. Do you have any idea the amount of research that go into all of the Assassin's Creed games? Not just the ones that you deem to have "romantic" qualities?

What irks me the most is that you say that we are comparing the civilization of the Native Americans to those of the civilizations of the previous settings.

The thing is Alim, you think that you are somehow superior to us, or at least that's what it comes off as. Wrong, all men are equal. All men have the potential to rise up and have this higher morale you seek. It's not limited to the Nizari Ismaili, or the Italians, or the Ottomans, or the Chinese. You say that Connor is barbaric because he isn't part of a civilization, yet Achilles told him that the small town that he built up is a shining example of a brick that will make the foundation for the United States.

ladyleonhart
08-01-2013, 10:55 PM
Great argument, Jexx. Very true.

Rugterwyper32
08-01-2013, 10:58 PM
That guy's sounded so much like Edgar Ross in his posts it's not even funny. At least that's how it sounded in my mind.
And I was no fan at all of Edgar Ross.

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 11:08 PM
You think that Colonial America doesn't contain romanticism? I applaud you for thinking that somehow, Connor isn't a man that can be someone's knight in shining armor. Connor was part of a civilization making its roots, and I fear that you haven't been paying attention to the learnings of Connor. You strike me as a man that thinks that somehow, young nations are inferior to older nations and have no chance of improving themselves. You failed to understand that Connor wasn't holding on to what he learned in his tribe. He was taught many things by Achilles, relating to history, philosophy, and morals. Do you have any idea the amount of research that go into all of the Assassin's Creed games? Not just the ones that you deem to have "romantic" qualities?

What irks me the most is that you say that we are comparing the civilization of the Native Americans to those of the civilizations of the previous settings.

The thing is Alim, you think that you are somehow superior to us, or at least that's what it comes off as. Wrong, all men are equal. All men have the potential to rise up and have this higher morale you seek. It's not limited to the Nizari Ismaili, or the Italians, or the Ottomans, or the Chinese. You say that Connor is barbaric because he isn't part of a civilization, yet Achilles told him that the small town that he built up is a shining example of a brick that will make the foundation for the United States.

Tell that to Haytham fanboys or Templar sheep.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 11:28 PM
Get off my lawn sith.

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 11:29 PM
Okay :(

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 11:30 PM
good kid.

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 11:34 PM
Yeah I think I get the picture now. You all think 'romantic' means 'related to matters of love'. Well it does but not in the sappy man-woman sense. I was talking in the sense of heroic chivalry - moral qualities of the horseman warrior, which can be traced to the time and place of the first AC game. I'm sorry but I think AC was wasted on most of you and perhaps Connor was a wise marketing move on the part of Ubisoft from that point of view. You guys have no idea about the amount of research work that went into AC 1, 2, Brotherhood and Revelations. You think a Native American at the time of the Civil War is an example of a 'civilised' man, because you assume that rescuing ladies or having compassion means someone is 'civilised'. WRONG. Being 'civilised' means you're part of a civilisation. The Nizari Ismailis were at the leading edge of science, philosophy and rationalism in their time. Then of course Renaissance Italy. Nothing needs to be said about that I hope. Then the height of the Ottoman military organisation in 1453. Bringing artillery and siege warfare to Europe.. And you compare some wigwam-dwelling barbarian swinging through the trees with the very best examples of historical civilisations we have... Just because in a story, he saves some people. Words fail me, seriously. But perhaps they fail YOU more. The kind term you're looking for, for Connor, is 'noble savage', not 'civilised man'. A real damn shame we are actually comparing Native American neolithics with the Nizari Ismaili citadel-state, Renaissance Italy, Ottoman Istanbul, etc.

I fear for the future of AC. The market doesn't appreciate the product.
No. We all knew what you meant by Romantic and I can safely say your views are Idiotic. no offense to your opinion of course, I mean..you hold the view that a human from a newer civilization is a savage barbarian, thus you are the epitome of every moron whose lived during the Colonial times and excused the crappy treatment of Africans and Natives on them being an inferior race and "barbarians"

You disgust me

Alim501
08-01-2013, 11:35 PM
You say all men are equal, but that's one of the biggest lies of all. The implication is, everyone's opinion is worth the same. But that's not really the issue. You have imputed that I am taking a position of superiority over you. That's not exactly true. I have a superior knowledge of some relevant things, but that's not the same as saying my statement here is worth more than yours, or that yours is of equal value to mine, etc. Look at the title of this thread. It's inviting everyone's opinion. I paid for the AC games just like you did, and I don't regret a penny I spent on them. But if I strike you as having a superior attitude, that's really your problem not mine. It doesn't interest me and isn't relevant.

Now I doubt you have as much knowledge of the Nizari Ismailis for instance as I do. But then not many people do because it's something I specialise in, in real life. You may very well have other knowledge in some specialist field that I don't. Everyone has something they know about. This is why the AC series is so fascinating for me and it's also the main reason I want it to remain true to the great tradition of rational enlightenment and civilisation. I recognise many things, the things said by Al Mualim in particular, that have been the subject of a lot of gnostic and philosophical discussion within the Ismaili intellectual tradition. That's why I really appreciate what went into the preceding AC games, and I want them (Ubisoft) to place the same importance on those elements as they did previously.

From my point of view, the recourse ever further into the fantastical, stretching the bounds of credibility well beyond the 'Apple of Eden' idea, by taking Nizari Ismailism into North American Civil War period is a stretch too far. I hope this makes it absolutely clear what my position is. I do appreciate that Connor's wisdom is a borrowed wisdom. As you put it, he learned the precepts of the order from a master. But still, it's foreign to North America. According to the story, he gets his lifeline of wisdom from a foreign tradition.

Regarding Romanticism, it has a connection with North American literature and imagination, but I don't see any of that in the example of Connor. That Romantic Edgar Allen Poe type of Romantic imagery is missing from AC3.

To be fair, the original AC with Altair was deficient in some respects, particularly in the martial arts. There is quite a lot of information about the martial arts used by the Ayyaran (the bands that overthrew the Abbasids and later united under Hassan Sabbah against the Saljuqs), and the Iranian sword arts, the knives used by Nizari Ismailis as well, but this wasn't researched for the game. A shame.


You think that Colonial America doesn't contain romanticism? I applaud you for thinking that somehow, Connor isn't a man that can be someone's knight in shining armor. Connor was part of a civilization making its roots, and I fear that you haven't been paying attention to the learnings of Connor. You strike me as a man that thinks that somehow, young nations are inferior to older nations and have no chance of improving themselves. You failed to understand that Connor wasn't holding on to what he learned in his tribe. He was taught many things by Achilles, relating to history, philosophy, and morals. Do you have any idea the amount of research that go into all of the Assassin's Creed games? Not just the ones that you deem to have "romantic" qualities?

What irks me the most is that you say that we are comparing the civilization of the Native Americans to those of the civilizations of the previous settings.

The thing is Alim, you think that you are somehow superior to us, or at least that's what it comes off as. Wrong, all men are equal. All men have the potential to rise up and have this higher morale you seek. It's not limited to the Nizari Ismaili, or the Italians, or the Ottomans, or the Chinese. You say that Connor is barbaric because he isn't part of a civilization, yet Achilles told him that the small town that he built up is a shining example of a brick that will make the foundation for the United States.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 11:36 PM
actually native americans were probably as old as most civilizations during that time, they just weren't able to grow as fast due to geographical constraints. Just watch "Guns, Germs, and Steel."

Alim501
08-01-2013, 11:39 PM
No. We all knew what you meant by Romantic and I can safely say your views are Idiotic. no offense to your opinion of course, I mean..you hold the view that a human from a newer civilization is a savage barbarian, thus you are the epitome of every moron whose lived during the Colonial times and excused the crappy treatment of Africans and Natives on them being an inferior race and "barbarians"

You disgust me

If you consider the Native Americans as a 'civilisation' as opposed to the Mayans or Aztecs for instance then why stop there? Polynesian cannibals were just as civilised as the ancient Greeks, right? Australian aborigines not only had a 'civilisation' but their was equal to the Ancient Egyptians, right?

Your implications are idiotic, but carry on. You amuse me.

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 11:40 PM
What does this have to do with a Conn... oh never mind. This damn poll is gonna have more Noes as well in due time.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 11:42 PM
Maybe you should realize that this game isn't a historical book. It's a game, designed to appeal to a very wide audience. Sure, if it was more historically accurate, that would be cool, but it doesn't always make a good game.

As for Connor going into the Civil War period.. that's way past Connor's time. In the lore of Assassin's Creed, the Assassin group let go of their strict organizational structure and spread across the world. They could potentially take part in any significant event in the history of the world past the siege of Masyaf (or, I guess, Alamut in real life).

Alim501
08-01-2013, 11:43 PM
actually native americans were probably as old as most civilizations during that time, they just weren't able to grow as fast due to geographical constraints. Just watch "Guns, Germs, and Steel."

We're all ancients. But some human societies developed into civilisations proper while others did not. Native Americans no doubt had and have many fine qualities but just look again at the paintings and architecture and history in AC2 Brotherhood for instance. They never had such achievements. I don't know about the cause of that. Maybe the environment wasn't as good. But still, it means there is less to look at. Perhaps some nicely decorated bows, but doesn't compare to Renaissance paintings etc. That's really my point. I want to see more amazing stuff in AC games.

Assassin_M
08-01-2013, 11:44 PM
If you consider the Native Americans as a 'civilisation' as opposed to the Mayans or Aztecs for instance then why stop there? Polynesian cannibals were just as civilised as the ancient Greeks, right? Australian aborigines not only had a 'civilisation' but their was equal to the Ancient Egyptians, right?

Your implications are idiotic, but carry on. You amuse me.
Your examples are shameful, surely with your "superior" knowledge you could come up with something that makes more sense...Polynesian Cannibals?? Wow xD and I never brought "equal" into anything..heck i`v never even made a comparison between civilizations. I merely expressed disgust at your views...which are Native Americans were Savage barbarians. you`re an elitist jerk, mate...there`s no way around it.

Look for amusement elsewhere, sonny

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 11:45 PM
What does this have to do with a Conn... oh never mind. This damn poll is gonna have more Noes as well in due time.

Dude, seriously, get off my lawn.

You're so negative. I hoped this poll would show you that the response for Connor is mostly positive.

Also, I need you and Silvermercy to spread this poll to these places where these Connor-haters and Connor-lovers hide. Apparently Sith knows a lot of Connor-haters, and Silver knows a lot of Connor-lovers. I would appreciate more votes.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 11:50 PM
We're all ancients. But some human societies developed into civilisations proper while others did not. Native Americans no doubt had and have many fine qualities but just look again at the paintings and architecture and history in AC2 Brotherhood for instance. They never had such achievements. I don't know about the cause of that. Maybe the environment wasn't as good. But still, it means there is less to look at. Perhaps some nicely decorated bows, but doesn't compare to Renaissance paintings etc. That's really my point. I want to see more amazing stuff in AC games.
I personally find tribal designs more interesting than art from the Rennaisance. It's a personal taste.

I can't deny that the Rennaisance was very conducive for the intellectual mind, but some of the things "discovered" during the time of the Rennaisance really were just rediscoveries.

In the area of what is now Timbuktu, there was a great school that had more students than London had citizens during the 17th or 18th century (I think it was that time frame), and texts were recovered from it that detail lunar cycles and evidence that the planet was a sphere. They date back to a time period long before the Renaissance. Unfortunately, I haven't studied that for a while now, so the exact time periods elude me, but my point still stands.

Alim501
08-01-2013, 11:53 PM
What you wrote neither adds nor rebuts anything and is mere personal abuse expressed as an emotional 'reaction', and an attempt to make yourself feel morally superior on the basis of your opinion about something.

If you want to join 'civilisation' why not try to explain why, in your view:

1) Native Americans can be grouped together as one people;
2) That they cannot only be grouped together as one people but can be termed a 'civilisation';
3) That the word 'civilisation' just means a group, race or tribe of people somewhere rather than an ordered society.




Your examples are shameful, surely with your "superior" knowledge you could come up with something that makes more sense...Polynesian Cannibals?? Wow xD and I never brought "equal" into anything..heck i`v never even made a comparison between civilizations. I merely expressed disgust at your views...which are Native Americans were Savage barbarians. you`re an elitist jerk, mate...there`s no way around it.

Look for amusement elsewhere, sonny

Spider_Sith9
08-01-2013, 11:54 PM
mostly...

Also, I do know one place I can get to but the other no one woould care and there's no set placing I could post this at.

I wonder if Connor fits the criteria of what Alim is describing. I mean Ziio freakin' jumped off a tree and gave a person chasing her a such a run (pun) for his money he was left breathless.

Jexx21
08-01-2013, 11:56 PM
I really don't like how civilisation looks.. it looks so much better with a z.

..and there are some words I actually like better spelled the british way. Like colour.

Alim501
08-02-2013, 12:01 AM
You're probably right. I don't know about Native Americans.

The cool thing about AC is that the Order is always a little bit ahead. The Assassins see things from the eagle's higher POV. From ziplines to poison darts and knives, and concealed handguns. This means it's a bit of a challenge for the developers to choose the perfect situation where all those elements of relative advancement can be present but still stay shy of the modern/industrial period. A big theme in the series is the idea of rediscovered knowledge from a previous age. That was a huge preoccupation for the historical assassins as well as their Iraqi predecessors under the Buwayhids. It would be cool to see them focus on the early modern period in Europe though, and place the philosophers of the early modern period as either secret Assassins or secret Templars, with access to an Apple or the tradition of either Order, and bring in the Kants, Hegels, Hobbeses, etc. as rediscoverers of ancient wisdom from the Apple via the Nizari Ismailis. That would be credible and really interesting.


I personally find tribal designs more interesting than art from the Rennaisance. It's a personal taste.

I can't deny that the Rennaisance was very conducive for the intellectual mind, but some of the things "discovered" during the time of the Rennaisance really were just rediscoveries.

In the area of what is now Timbuktu, there was a great school that had more students than London had citizens during the 17th or 18th century (I think it was that time frame), and texts were recovered from it that detail lunar cycles and evidence that the planet was a sphere. They date back to a time period long before the Renaissance. Unfortunately, I haven't studied that for a while now, so the exact time periods elude me, but my point still stands.

ladyleonhart
08-02-2013, 12:06 AM
I really don't like how civilisation looks.. it looks so much better with a z.

..and there are some words I actually like better spelled the british way. Like colour.

Jexx, are you American...? Just curious. :)

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 12:11 AM
born and raised in Pennsylvania.

Assassin_M
08-02-2013, 12:11 AM
born and raised in Pennsylvania.
You lied to me. I thought you were born in America:mad:

I-Like-Pie45
08-02-2013, 12:14 AM
born and raised in Pennsylvania.

is that the place where the cheesesteak and Hersheys come from

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 12:16 AM
You're probably right. I don't know about Native Americans.

The cool thing about AC is that the Order is always a little bit ahead. The Assassins see things from the eagle's higher POV. From ziplines to poison darts and knives, and concealed handguns. This means it's a bit of a challenge for the developers to choose the perfect situation where all those elements of relative advancement can be present but still stay shy of the modern/industrial period. A big theme in the series is the idea of rediscovered knowledge from a previous age. That was a huge preoccupation for the historical assassins as well as their Iraqi predecessors under the Buwayhids. It would be cool to see them focus on the early modern period in Europe though, and place the philosophers of the early modern period as either secret Assassins or secret Templars, with access to an Apple or the tradition of either Order, and bring in the Kants, Hegels, Hobbeses, etc. as rediscoverers of ancient wisdom from the Apple via the Nizari Ismailis. That would be credible and really interesting.

Yes, that would be interesting, and I'm not saying that they shouldn't go into those settings.

The point of this topic is just to say that I feel like a lot more could be done with Connor's character. And if they stay in America, it would still be possible to be retrieving knowledge and tools from civilizations past. There are Celtic, Gaelic, and Norse roots in the eastern Canadian provinces. We could delve into their mythologies, their knowledge. And besides that, the stereotypical image of Vikings sort of feels like a combination of pirates and natives, it would be a cool experience.

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 12:17 AM
is that the place where the cheesesteak and Hersheys come from

I guess so.

VitaminsXYZ
08-02-2013, 12:19 AM
You're probably right. I don't know about Native Americans.

The cool thing about AC is that the Order is always a little bit ahead. The Assassins see things from the eagle's higher POV. From ziplines to poison darts and knives, and concealed handguns. This means it's a bit of a challenge for the developers to choose the perfect situation where all those elements of relative advancement can be present but still stay shy of the modern/industrial period. A big theme in the series is the idea of rediscovered knowledge from a previous age. That was a huge preoccupation for the historical assassins as well as their Iraqi predecessors under the Buwayhids. It would be cool to see them focus on the early modern period in Europe though, and place the philosophers of the early modern period as either secret Assassins or secret Templars, with access to an Apple or the tradition of either Order, and bring in the Kants, Hegels, Hobbeses, etc. as rediscoverers of ancient wisdom from the Apple via the Nizari Ismailis. That would be credible and really interesting.

Why does it matter so much? The Assassins operated everywhere, and consisted of people from all different backgrounds. AC3 just chose to explore one that happened to not be set in a European or Middle-Eastern setting. No, you don't have to like it, but I'm just glad we're actually getting to visit other places.


born and raised in Pennsylvania.

Hello from Massachusetts!

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 12:21 AM
I'm from Mennonite-Land. BTW Mennonites aren't Amish.

They're entirely different.

I heard you have witch trials up in Salem.

Rugterwyper32
08-02-2013, 12:23 AM
born and raised in Pennsylvania.

Had you said West Philadelphia the theme of the Fresh Prince would have started playing in my head
Actually nevermind it did anyway

VitaminsXYZ
08-02-2013, 12:25 AM
I'm from Mennonite-Land. BTW Mennonites aren't Amish.

They're entirely different.

I heard you have witch trials up in Salem.

We do. They always claim they're innocent but we don't fall for that.

I-Like-Pie45
08-02-2013, 12:28 AM
I was born in Colorado, where I was North America Fall Webworm in my past life.

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 12:31 AM
Hey. I once asked some AC4 dev if the modern day protagonist was the same guy as the AC3 MP player. They said no.

Who's the AC3 MP player if it isn't you?

(I know off-topic, but I was redoing my signature and that came to me when I put down my own name as the character we play as in the AC3 MP)

ladyleonhart
08-02-2013, 12:56 AM
Hey. I once asked some AC4 dev if the modern day protagonist was the same guy as the AC3 MP player. They said no.

Who's the AC3 MP player if it isn't you?

(I know off-topic, but I was redoing my signature and that came to me when I put down my own name as the character we play as in the AC3 MP)

I thought the AC3 MP player was yourself too. Additionally, I'd think that would be the same for AC: Liberation since you are also using an Abstergo product.

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 01:27 AM
Yea, me too, I'm not sure if we're supposed to be the same person that then gets a job at Abstergo Entertainment.

I mean, as a consumer, those Abstergo Entertainment dev diaries were terrible.

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 04:33 AM
ten more votes since this morning.

ladyleonhart
08-02-2013, 05:12 PM
51 "Yes" votes!! :D

DisbandedBox359
08-02-2013, 05:23 PM
You know what... I like pie

But had to give the vote to yes

pirate1802
08-02-2013, 05:25 PM
You know what... I like pie

But had to give the vote to yes

Pies would be disappointed...

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 05:28 PM
In all honesty, I count "I like pie" the same as "I don't care"

Because if you feel strongly about this issue you would vote for either yes or no even if the I like Pie choice tempts you.

people who don't care.. just don't care.

LoyalACFan
08-02-2013, 06:19 PM
Yea, me too, I'm not sure if we're supposed to be the same person that then gets a job at Abstergo Entertainment.

I mean, as a consumer, those Abstergo Entertainment dev diaries were terrible.

Perhaps "you", as the consumer, found Erudito's hacked messages that uncovered Abstergo's plot, and took it upon yourself to infiltrate Abstergo and figure out what the hell is going on?

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 06:23 PM
I just watched the videos on youtube. It sounds like Abstergo hired "us" because we got 100% synergy with the Animus, and Erudito wants us to resist manipulation by Abstergo.

pirate1802
08-02-2013, 06:24 PM
I like where this is going...

I-Like-Pie45
08-02-2013, 07:19 PM
New 52

TheHumanTowel
08-02-2013, 07:25 PM
New 52
The Superiour 52
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/04/Cover_52_Week_One_(May_10,_2006).jpg/250px-Cover_52_Week_One_(May_10,_2006).jpg

Jexx21
08-02-2013, 10:31 PM
I want 17 more votes. Pwetty pwease.

AssassinGame1
08-03-2013, 12:29 AM
Connor's appearance didn't really stand out like Altair and Ezio's so im going with no.

AssassinDeeja
08-03-2013, 12:48 AM
Please conclude his story Ubisoft! He deserves it :)

adventurewomen
08-03-2013, 01:08 AM
Yes please bring back Connor, I loved him more than Ezio!

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 01:29 AM
Well uh..

I got a lot more than just 17 more votes.

I guess Silvermercy did her work.

Time for Spider Sith to do his. Bring on the people who don't want a Connor game.

TheHumanTowel
08-03-2013, 01:31 AM
Did this get linked somewhere or something? Bit of a surge of votes.

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 01:35 AM
It must have got linked on tumblr by silvermercy.

I would appreciate even more votes though.. if I could have made this poll more public, I would have. (and yes, even "no" votes are appreciated)

Spider_Sith9
08-03-2013, 01:36 AM
Well uh..

I got a lot more than just 17 more votes.

I guess Silvermercy did her work.

Time for Spider Sith to do his. Bring on the people who don't want a Connor game.

Here we go...

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 01:38 AM
You doing it? Yay!

Yes, let's post it on Initiates, apparently that's where all the Templar sheep hide or something. I can do that myself, I have an account there.

Edit: posted it on Initiates.

If people from there come there and see this, I just want to say that I was kidding with the Templar sheep comment, I put that there to annoy Spider sith. :P

adventurewomen
08-03-2013, 01:42 AM
Did this get linked somewhere or something? Bit of a surge of votes.
Well isn't that a good thing though? I've not logged into UBI Forums in AGES and I rarely check these forums and this poll has bought me back here because Connor is amazing best character in AC ever! I'm saying this because I've been playing AC games since 2007 and other lead assassins didn't have much character development, (Ezio had some development, Altair none until Revelations) Connor is the most diverse character in terms of his story and yes he does express his emotions. The AC3 ending for Connor it wasn't enough for him, it's just left his story in a cliff-hanger! I'm happy more Connor fans are speaking up!

TheHumanTowel
08-03-2013, 01:43 AM
Well isn't that a good thing though? I've not logged into UBI Forums in AGES and I rarely check these forums and this poll has bought me back here because Connor is amazing best character in AC ever! I'm saying this because I've been playing AC games since 2007 and other lead assassins didn't have much character development, (Ezio had some development, Altair none until Revelations) Connor is the most diverse character in terms of his story and yes he does express his emotions.
I'm not complaining. Just noting.

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 01:45 AM
Well isn't that a good thing though? I've not logged into UBI Forums in AGES and I rarely check these forums and this poll has bought me back here because Connor is amazing best character in AC ever! I'm saying this because I've been playing AC games since 2007 and other lead assassins didn't have much character development, (Ezio had some development, Altair none until Revelations) Connor is the most diverse character in terms of his story and yes he does express his emotions.

I just want to say that I think that all of the Assassins showed character development in each of their installments.

Especially Altair.

adventurewomen
08-03-2013, 01:49 AM
I'm not complaining. Just noting.
That's ok, I just wanted to make sure.


I just want to say that I think that all of the Assassins showed character development in each of their installments.

Especially Altair.
I found Altair to be dull as dishwater, in AC1 - omg his american accent LOL! Revelations he got better but still I don't count him to be great, when you compare Altair's character to Ezio: Alty is lacking.

TheHumanTowel
08-03-2013, 01:50 AM
I just want to say that I think that all of the Assassins showed character development in each of their installments.

Especially Altair.
Yeah Altair had a load of development in AC1. He's completely different at the end from when the game starts.

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 01:57 AM
I found Altair to be dull as dishwater, in AC1 - omg his american accent LOL! Revelations he got better but still I don't count him to be great, when you compare Altair's character to Ezio: Alty is lacking.

But that has nothing to do with character development. Altair developed to be an entirely different person over the events of Assassin's Creed. He went from being a brash hothead to being a more patient, calm, and thoughtful person.

DomdudeDaGreat
08-03-2013, 01:59 AM
I love the way Mr. Shade voted for yes

scooper121s
08-03-2013, 01:59 AM
To be frank, I do not care! The story will go where it goes, if it goes back to connor (forward? :P) then I will get it, as long as the games continue to be fun, I will play them.

pirate1802
08-03-2013, 02:02 AM
whoa. 29 Yes-es since I went to sleep O.o

adventurewomen
08-03-2013, 02:04 AM
But that has nothing to do with character development. Altair developed to be an entirely different person over the events of Assassin's Creed. He went from being a brash hothead to being a more patient, calm, and thoughtful person.
That dishwater comment was my imo, about him in general. When I was playing AC1 - Altair's character had minor changes but nothing really changed about him in AC1. In Revelations we got to know him more, which was interesting. Honestly I've never been a fan of Altair tbh, I liked Ezio a lot from AC2, ACB & Revelations we saw how his life changed and how he developed from a teenager into the smart noble man by the end his story was developed over time.

That's what I would like to see for Connor, his character developed further into a vew game after AC4, I hope he has atleast another game or two! He deserves it, people who doubt have yet to truly experience who he is to those who doubt him!

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 02:07 AM
A lot changed about Altair in AC1.

But I digress, I agree that Connor should have another game. I fully expect it as well. it can't be a coincidence that they've been telling the entire life stories of these characters.

TheHumanTowel
08-03-2013, 02:16 AM
A lot changed about Altair in AC1.

But I digress, I agree that Connor should have another game. I fully expect it as well. it can't be a coincidence that they've been telling the entire life stories of these characters.
I think it's a coincidence. Ezio got his whole life story told because he was an extremely popular character and Ubi thought they could make more money by keeping him as a protagonist. Altair's life story was kind of tacked on to an Ezio game to justify releasing yet another yearly game. ACR wasn't even supposed to be made. It was a DS title they hastily developed into a console release in 10 months.

adventurewomen
08-03-2013, 02:18 AM
But I digress, I agree that Connor should have another game. I fully expect it as well. it can't be a coincidence that they've been telling the entire life stories of these characters.
Exactly, it would only be fair to further develop Connor's character and the time period of his life by the end of AC3 has many themes and history to be explored.

It's like Ezio at the end of AC2 some people disliked him then but grew to love him by Brotherhood.

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 02:23 AM
I think it's a coincidence. Ezio got his whole life story told because he was an extremely popular character and Ubi thought they could make more money by keeping him as a protagonist. Altair's life story was kind of tacked on to an Ezio game to justify releasing yet another yearly game. ACR wasn't even supposed to be made. It was a DS title they hastily developed into a console release in 10 months.
I don't think it is at all. Why? Because, it's better to focus on finishing a character's story in terms of story-telling.

The way I see it is: They need to tell us what the characters do while they are Assassins. Connor didn't retire from being an Assassin, Juno said that Connor would do something important again, so thus, I logically conclude that there will be another game.

We have the full stories of almost all of our protagonists:

Altair
Ezio
Clay
Desmond
Haytham
Edward (will have, with Black Flag)
Nikolai
Daniel

We would just have Connor and Aveline to finish up, and that's only if Aveline's story isn't completed with the Playstation ACIV DLC.

iSoTryHard
08-03-2013, 02:24 AM
I liked Ezio... Ezio was nice.

Jexx21
08-03-2013, 02:25 AM
Yea, well.. Ezio isn't returning.

adventurewomen
08-03-2013, 02:26 AM
I liked Ezio... Ezio was nice.
Sorry to tell you lol, but Ezio died his character is done. ;)

Connor FTW! :cool: