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AssassinHMS
05-28-2013, 07:48 PM
I apologize in advance for the extensive text…

Assassin’s Creed, as a franchise, has taken the most and the biggest changes I’ve seen in a long time. From gameplay to story this series has been given a great number of personalities. But did it get any better? Due to the advances of technology and the increasing monetary power, technically speaking, the franchise has improved astonishingly. However, in terms of the game itself, it became soulless, faceless, nameless… What happened to the franchise?

The first assassin’s creed was sort of a test to see the potential of the series. It worked and from a simple, yet complex idea, the developers built upon it turning it into a more commercial experience. The bits that were considered boring or unnecessary (like pickpocket, eavesdropping and planning an assassination) were cut off or changed in order to ease their presence allowing the developers to work on other features (considered more important). On the other hand, the most praised factors of AC1 were expanded and developed such as the open world filled with viewpoints to show off the verticality and the detailed cities. And so AC2 was made. It was set to be an appealing experience both for players who just wanted to have some fun playing the game (who didn’t care about planning assassinations, who found the job of an assassin to be boring, who wanted to try out many swords and daggers but that didn’t feel the need for a sheath…) and for those who cared about the franchise (about the story, about assassinating, about the creed…). It had linear missions, a beautiful world but also codex pages containing interesting information about Altair and assassination missions. And it SOLD!

From then on the strategy hasn’t really changed and with AC3, the most commercial game we had so far, Ubisoft had already given up on the assassin’s creed initial idea and only used its name as a bait to lure those who were still hoping for an assassin’s creed game like the first one. Again, AC3 sold and Ubisoft’s strategy was proven successful.
And now we come upon AC4 Black Flag, another product of the same strategy used before. Don’t have second thoughts; AC4 BF is a pirate game. Not only that, but it is an action packed adventure again with the praised factors of AC1 (a rich, huge open world and an interesting historical setting) but also without the things that once made this series unique. While it’s true the game won’t come out until October, we have already seen the trailers and even gameplay footages. And all of them point to the same conclusion: lots of explosions and ships but only one assassination in order to “earn” the name of AC.
Every installment the franchise loses a part of itself that ends up being replaced by new ambitious features. Every year the franchise becomes less about itself and more about everything else. However this process can be reverted, we can still have an AC game about AC. Ubisoft listens to money. They listened to the consumer’s reaction after AC1 and worked on their own solution, AC2. We are the consumers; we have the money; they listen to our money which means they have to listen to us. If we want to have a proper Assassin’s Creed game that focus on the core pillars and that brings back the feeling of the franchise, we have to show them we do not want them to turn AC into a pop game, into a casual game. We have to make them understand that we do not care about ambitious features that overshadow the franchise, that what we care about is the franchise. How? By not buying AC4 BF.

It’s that simple: if Ubisoft doesn’t get the money their predictions assumed, they’ll have to readjust their strategy; they’ll have appeal to us by showing us what we want to see.
That is why I hereby vow not to buy AC4 BF.
Do not buy or preorder AC4 Black Flag. It’s most definitely nothing more than an ok game to spend a few hours with. And by ignoring the explosions in the trailers and remaining skeptical towards the promises the devs make we can have our AC game. Also, for those who have seen AC3’s propaganda and still believe the developers and for those who know how boring it can be to roam an empty world and yet are eager to explore AC4’s world I say that they should know better by now.


So I ask you:
Do you rather have some fun now with an ok game or ignore the bait and have 100 times more fun with a real AC game?
Do you rather ignore Black Flag for the sake of the franchise or ignore the franchise for the sake of having fun (if even that)?
Are you willing do this or is it too much to ask in the name of Assassin’s Creed?

pacmanate
05-28-2013, 07:51 PM
I ask you:

Do you know if this game will not bring back the AC1 feel like they said they are acknowledging?
Do you know for a fact that AC4 will not be fun and will be the same experience as AC3?
Why are you bashing a game that we literally know nothing about? We don't know ANYTHING about the story.

Mr_Shade
05-28-2013, 07:56 PM
I ask you:

Do you know if this game will not bring back the AC1 feel like they said they are acknowledging?
Do you know for a fact that AC4 will not be fun and will be the same experience as AC3?
Why are you bashing a game that we literally know nothing about? We don't know ANYTHING about the story.
indeed.

Those who are concerned, I suggest you wait and see - E3 is just around the corner, with hopefully some new info..

OR


Wait for reviews.


Bashing something without playing or knowing the full facts, can sometimes be assuming too much..

pacmanate
05-28-2013, 08:00 PM
I'm not going to start acting like some saint for what AC has become but you cannot say this will downright suck/boycott the game with the little knowledge we have. It seems like you are saying not to buy AC4 because AC3 was not good. That doesn't mean that the developers cannot turn this around. If anything, the fans have been most vocal about AC3 than any other game in the franchise, I am pretty sure they are acknowledging that too.

If you are sceptical, then fair enough, I am pretty sure most of us are, but that shouldn't mean not buying the game when we only have 2-3 trailers.

silvermercy
05-28-2013, 08:03 PM
I think the problem with being an AC fan (and this applies to any game) is that it comes a point where the game will not cater to a certain number of fans by default.
Some fans will want it one way and one way only. Well, that's not going to happen. (If it was up to certain fans we'd only have Ezio as an assassin *shivers* lol)!

Edit: I also liked AC3 and it's my fave AC game so far. Just like many other people's.

AssassinHMS
05-28-2013, 08:06 PM
I ask you:

Do you know if this game will not bring back the AC1 feel like they said they are acknowledging?

Like I said the game will only be released in October but everything points towards a linear action packed game, including trailers, screenshots, gameplay videos, you name it. They're marketing the game. If you ignore that and hope for the best then you're naive specially when AC3 devs already promised many things and didn't fulfill them. Besides if they felt like doing an AC game they wouldn't choose the Caribean when there are many more suitable settings. They chose it for the naval gameplay. See?


Do you know for a fact that AC4 will not be fun and will be the same experience as AC3?

Like I said AC4 BF will probably be a fun game but an assassin's creed game (keeping in mind the original)? Most certainly not. And AC3's experience (in terms of gameplay) is bad considering it's an AC game.



Why are you bashing a game that we literally know nothing about? We don't know ANYTHING about the story.

We already know many things about the gameplay. I wasn't refering to the story, all the examples I gave were gameplay only.

silvermercy
05-28-2013, 08:10 PM
Why are some fans SO obsessed with the original game??? O_o
What actually makes it assassin-like to you is not for others. Not for me for example. These things are subjective so telling others not to buy it because YOU don't think you'll like it is not very wise?

AssassinHMS
05-28-2013, 08:17 PM
indeed.

Those who are concerned, I suggest you wait and see - E3 is just around the corner, with hopefully some new info..

OR


Wait for reviews.


Bashing something without playing or knowing the full facts, can sometimes be assuming too much..

I know what I said are nothing but assumptions but they aren't unfounded. I don't want to appear to know it all or to ruin the business, I just said this in order to explain my idea, because I don't think Ubisoft is actually listening to us. I think Ubisoft should reconsider and take into special account the opinions of the people who allowed the success of the franchise. I feel like they ignored those opinions and thus the thread.

pacmanate
05-28-2013, 08:20 PM
Like I said the game will only be released in October but everything points towards a linear action packed game, including trailers, screenshots, gameplay videos, you name it. They're marketing the game. If you ignore that and hope for the best then you're naive specially when AC3 devs already promised many things and didn't fulfill them. Besides if they felt like doing an AC game they wouldn't choose the Caribean when there are many more suitable settings. They chose it for the naval gameplay. See?

What? Everything points to linear gameplay? We have seen trailers with swordplay, ships fighting each other, some stalking zones, some facial close ups, you call that pointing to a linear packed game. I am not hoping for the best, I am hoping for them not to make the same mistakes. I don't think they chose AC4 for naval. They said they mapped up the whole Kenway thing from the start. They obviously saw potential for Naval in AC3, and it was a good thing to test it in AC3 so it was better for AC4.


Like I said AC4 BF will probably be a fun game but an assassin's creed game (keeping in mind the original)? Most certainly not. And AC3's experience (in terms of gameplay) is bad considering it's an AC game.

Like I said, the devs have said they acknowledge AC1's freedom, mission designs and investigations and what to bring them back in some form. What more do you want? The fact that they have acknowledged this is a great start.

We already know many things about the gameplay. I wasn't refering to the story, all the examples I gave were gameplay only.

Um... we know there is fighting (as usual) and naval naval (like AC3). I don't see what that has got to do with anything

STDlyMcStudpants
05-28-2013, 08:20 PM
AC 1 was boring..get over it
Assassins Creed gets better every year. ;)
Yes the story lost its spark a bit in AC3...but the gameplay outshined the story..and thats why i buy games...to enjoy them
But Ezio went back to learn about the creed in a Revelations story
And I'm sure they will do the same with the Kenway Trilogy in a Genesis story
I'm not convinced that Ubi forgot about the actually creed yet....

But its human nature to fear change...face your fears or just replay assassins creed 1 on mute making up new dialog in your head since you want every game to be like AC 1...

itsamea-mario
05-28-2013, 08:32 PM
But.... Pirates....

Rugterwyper32
05-28-2013, 08:46 PM
Like I said the game will only be released in October but everything points towards a linear action packed game, including trailers, screenshots, gameplay videos, you name it. They're marketing the game. If you ignore that and hope for the best then you're naive specially when AC3 devs already promised many things and didn't fulfill them. Besides if they felt like doing an AC game they wouldn't choose the Caribean when there are many more suitable settings. They chose it for the naval gameplay. See?

The issue here is, there is just so much you can do with ground based gameplay. Naval is a good addition to AC, maybe you won't feel like that because of combat, but for navigation. It opens up tons of options. The Caribbean could very well prove to be one of the best settings to date, for one. The fact they planned a Kenway saga with some time for planning and the fact there's little documentation for the time makes it so it can take the idea from AC1 and twists things around.

Like I said AC4 BF will probably be a fun game but an assassin's creed game (keeping in mind the original)? Most certainly not. And AC3's experience (in terms of gameplay) is bad considering it's an AC game.

We won't know until it's released how much they looked back at AC1. The fact they have acknowledged it far more than the devs of AC3 says a lot to me.

We already know many things about the gameplay. I wasn't refering to the story, all the examples I gave were gameplay only.

We know a lot, and at the same time we don't know enough. I will only trust what I play myself and not what the devs or the press say, myself

That being said, I plan on getting the game anyway. I play this series because of the sheer fun I find in it, and that's good enough for me. So long as they keep going to unique settings few other games represent the way this series does and there is fun to be had, I'll keep following this series. If you find another series that approaches history in a similar way this one does, though, I'd appreciate you telling me, I honestly would like more games based on these sort of historical eras the way they represent them.

lothario-da-be
05-28-2013, 08:46 PM
AC as most of us have known it is gone. Accept it there isn't a big chance they will return to the original formula. Its better to like the game how it is now then dislike a good non ac game.

JamJar502
05-28-2013, 08:54 PM
Huh, funny. I always thought it was my choice whether to buy a game or not.

Assassin_M
05-28-2013, 08:56 PM
Okie dokie

wait...

lothario-da-be
05-28-2013, 08:57 PM
Okie dokie

wait...
Wait for what?

pacmanate
05-28-2013, 08:58 PM
huh, funny. I always thought it was my choice whether to buy a game or not.

not anymore *****!

Assassin_M
05-28-2013, 09:02 PM
Wait for what?
For the dreeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaam traaaaaaaiiiiiin

lothario-da-be
05-28-2013, 09:03 PM
For the dreeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaam traaaaaaaiiiiiin
Yeeeaaaaahhhhhhhh, exactly
wait...

Assassin_M
05-28-2013, 09:05 PM
Yeeeaaaaahhhhhhhh, exactly
wait...
Hahaaa you got it now

lothario-da-be
05-28-2013, 09:18 PM
Hahaaa you got it now
You have my everlasting gratitude sir!

BATISTABUS
05-28-2013, 09:18 PM
Nothing has matched the feeling of the first game for me. Other games have surpassed it and fell short of it in other aspects, but the first one is still my favorite.

That being said, I expect AC4 to be a completely different experience from everything before. Even if it's nothing like AC1, as long as it delivers on the pirate fantasy, that won't matter.

ACfan443
05-28-2013, 09:20 PM
Everything about it (apart from Havana) as an Assassin's Creed game makes me not want to buy it.

Hopefully whatever's shown at E3, and in other forthcoming demos warrants a purchase. But to be honest, with my long term commitment to the series I'll end up buying it regardless. :nonchalance:

SixKeys
05-28-2013, 09:43 PM
Why are some fans SO obsessed with the original game??? O_o
What actually makes it assassin-like to you is not for others. Not for me for example. These things are subjective so telling others not to buy it because YOU don't think you'll like it is not very wise?

AC1 was objectively the most assassin-like game and that is a fact. This is because it was the only game based around the real historical Hashashin order, their way of life, their philosophy and the way they carried out their assassinations (always in public, always in broad daylight). The sequels, while still (mostly) entertaining, take a much more Hollywood-style approach towards people's idea of being an assassin, i.e. working in the shadows, using lots of different tools, etc.

With that said, I agree with the people saying this thread is premature. I'm skeptical of AC4 myself, but I'm not going to go around telling other people not to buy or pre-order a game they think they will enjoy. If AC4 turns out as disappointing to me as AC3, I'm giving up on the series and those who enjoy the new direction are free to keep on enjoying it. At this point we cannot realistically expect the devs to undo everything they worked hard on for the past 3-5 years and bring back AC as we knew it from the Ezio games. I just hope they'll have listened to at least some of the fan feedback on the biggest problems and will address those in AC4. But again, I'm not telling other people they shouldn't be excited for the game if it looks appealing to them.

Sushiglutton
05-28-2013, 09:53 PM
I'm gonna wait for reports on the amount of handholding in the game. If it is like AC3 I'll skip it, just like I did with Tyranny. If the missions are more open I'll get it soon after launch (on PC so likely a month after).

STDlyMcStudpants
05-28-2013, 10:32 PM
Assassins Creed feels different every game..and thats what i like about it...the year one AC feels the same as last years we cant open our mouth around COD fans....

AssassinHMS
05-28-2013, 10:35 PM
After reading everyone's posts I realize too that the thread is premature. I doubt AC4 BF will focus on stealth, on open ended missions and on the role of being an assassin. It will likely have many swords to buy but no sheath to place them. The world is beautiful indeed but also immensely huge. However, will it have enough side missions (that are actually good)? They also promised random events, open ended assassinations in the style of AC1, a seamless world, 50 different locations, improved naval battles... Those are a lot of promises. Promises that only a huge ambition can justify. In AC3 that same ambition was its downfall.
After AC3, after all these promises, all the explosions, action, and ships, I seriously doubt the final product will be anything like whatever is shown in E3: maybe there will be one open ended assassination mission, a few simplistic random events (in a far smaller scale than the ones promised) even though I bet the naval battles will turn out pretty good (after all the effort and money put into them how could they not?)

However I'll never understand why some people can't see, or choose not to see, the change in the heart of the series and ask "What defines Assassin's Creed?" "Why do you say this isn't Assassin's Creed?" Well, I'll tell you what it didn't use to be: A failed Hollywood attempt.

Anyway, in the remote event that AC4 BF turns out to be a proper assassin's creed (yeah...right) game, then I'll take back what I said about Ubisoft.
Until then I'll remain skeptical because I learned from the mistake of buying AC3 expecting to find a shred of the franchise's soul (in terms of gameplay) and trusting both trailers and devs.



Also,


AC 1 was boring..get over it
Assassins Creed gets better every year. ;)

This is a good example of what I said in my post, hence why you enjoy AC3's gameplay. You're one of those players "who didn’t care about planning assassinations, who found the job of an assassin to be boring, who wanted to try out many swords and daggers but that didn’t feel the need for a sheath…" Good thing you like explosions and Hollywood movies then.



But its human nature to fear change...face your fears or just replay assassins creed 1 on mute making up new dialog in your head since you want every game to be like AC 1...

Wow, you really understood what I said...

Gi1t
05-29-2013, 12:02 AM
After AC3, after all these promises, all the explosions, action, and ships, I seriously doubt the final product will be anything like whatever is shown in E3:

Well, it might be, but that may not be a good thing. -__- One of the reasons I didn't get AC3 was because of their E3 demo where they get into a fight right in front of the main gate, then run away, go around the back, and just when they're finally starting to act a bit stealthy, they set off an explosion (by setting off as conveniently placed explosive storage unit -__-) and just run the guy down. The primary issue I had wiht that demo wasn't just that they weren't playing the game the wayh I would have, but that they weren't even trying to appeal to the players who preferred the more subtle ways of playing the game. It was like social stealth wasn't even important enough to be part of the demo.


However I'll never understand why some people can't see, or choose not to see, the change in the heart of the series and ask "What defines Assassin's Creed?" "Why do you say this isn't Assassin's Creed?" Well, I'll tell you what it didn't use to be: A failed Hollywood attempt.

Part of the appeal of the first one wasn't just the way the game itself played, but also the fact that it was just getting started at that point and was really on track to become something incredible. I think a lot of use identify it as the best not only because of what it was, but because of all the annoying scripted Holywood-esque things it didn't have back then. The profusion of content wasn't there and though that left it a little empty, that also left it fairly pure as well.

I really think one of the main factors that would make the game feel more like AC1 would be to minimize scripted events (even story related ones would be optional) between getting your target and killing them. Another thing (which may return in this game) was that in AC1 it really felt like you were a hostile malefactor under the surface; a grave threat nobody could detect, but if they knew, they'd be running like hell. With Ezio, having so many sources of support, it often felt like there were more people on your side than against you, which kind of took that feeling away.

STDlyMcStudpants
05-29-2013, 12:09 AM
Also,
This is a good example of what I said in my post, hence why you enjoy AC3's gameplay. You're one of those players "who didn’t care about planning assassinations, who found the job of an assassin to be boring, who wanted to try out many swords and daggers but that didn’t feel the need for a sheath…" Good thing you like explosions and Hollywood movies then.

No I enjoy the job of an Assassin - Assassinating...there was no planning in AC 1...I just went up to my target and pressed square...
I planned more in AC 2 and AC3 when it was forced on me.....
And I actually hate a variety of weapons...I hate crafting...1 sword or axe and a hidden blade is all i need...
What I found boring in AC1 was the repetitive missions (you either pick pocketed, sat on a bench, or killed 3 targets without being detected for info...rinse and repeat for 5 characters...
And lack of cinematics
it isnt needed for games like dead island, skyrim, or borderlands because they are open world mission/leveling up based RPG
AC isnt..it is an open world game telling a story like 2013 Tomb Raider
I couldnt possibly play a game the size of AC 2 or AC 3 without the "Hollywood" stuff
It would make them just as boring...
Bottom line Assassins Creed was made to tell a story and make you think..not to just put you in a world to level up and explore in

Gi1t
05-29-2013, 12:33 AM
No I enjoy the job of an Assassin - Assassinating...there was no planning in AC 1...I just went up to my target and pressed square...
I planned more in AC 2 and AC3 when it was forced on me.....
And I actually hate a variety of weapons...I hate crafting...1 sword or axe and a hidden blade is all i need...
What I found boring in AC1 was the repetitive missions (you either pick pocketed, sat on a bench, or killed 3 targets without being detected for info...rinse and repeat for 5 characters...
And lack of cinematics
it isnt needed for games like dead island, skyrim, or borderlands because they are open world mission/leveling up based RPG
AC isnt..it is an open world game telling a story like 2013 Tomb Raider
I couldnt possibly play a game the size of AC 2 or AC 3 without the "Hollywood" stuff
It would make them just as boring...
Bottom line Assassins Creed was made to tell a story and make you think..not to just put you in a world to level up and explore in

I think those are very good points.

In regard to planning, that's really up to the player. I definitely planned my specific actions when assassinating people in AC1 whereas by the time I got to Brotherhood, it felt like I would follow a bunch of painfully obvioius steps that would guide me right to the moment of the target's death. Even when I veered off into my own plans, I would, say, be approaching along the rooftops and then CUTSCENE! then I'd be stuck in some required fighting sequence etc. Even though Ac1 always started things with a cutscene to introduce the target, it would then leave you to figure things out on your own. Running targets could be caught up with at any time as long as you succeeded in catching them. (My third mark made it about two and a half steps down the street before I caught up with him.) The investigation missions were obviously their early attempts at in-game planning, but they never really developed that idea. I wish they had. They could have turned investigation into a totally optional list of tasks that could offer any number of benefits to those clever enough to find and/or make use of them.

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 01:22 AM
#2edgy4me


Not in the mood to be constructive.

STDlyMcStudpants
05-29-2013, 01:33 AM
I think those are very good points.

In regard to planning, that's really up to the player. I definitely planned my specific actions when assassinating people in AC1 whereas by the time I got to Brotherhood, it felt like I would follow a bunch of painfully obvioius steps that would guide me right to the moment of the target's death. Even when I veered off into my own plans, I would, say, be approaching along the rooftops and then CUTSCENE! then I'd be stuck in some required fighting sequence etc. Even though Ac1 always started things with a cutscene to introduce the target, it would then leave you to figure things out on your own. Running targets could be caught up with at any time as long as you succeeded in catching them. (My third mark made it about two and a half steps down the street before I caught up with him.) The investigation missions were obviously their early attempts at in-game planning, but they never really developed that idea. I wish they had. They could have turned investigation into a totally optional list of tasks that could offer any number of benefits to those clever enough to find and/or make use of them.

I'm sure If it was my first AC game I would have planned out too, but it being the 3rd ac game i beat, I knew what to expect and knew what i was doing so i just went in guns blazing (or hidden blade blazing) and that is the kind of gameplay i enjoy..i dont mind having to scope out a room but i can see how people would like it to be a choice again even though when we arent given a choice it has to be done with stealth...
The constrictive missions do bug me and having to Sync 100% almost ruins it for me...its like playing a video game with a checklist of trophies in mind the entire time..completely ruins the experience.
I do wish they would scrap that bit.

I'm a trophy hunter and I always check how many kills i have to get with x weapon before I play a game...and it just takes the enjoyment out for me and even though i have a choice to not get trophies...i feel obligated to and that im forced to use a certain weapon at certain times.
I feel like Syncing has the same take you out of the moment effect...
I mean trophies are done to make a game replayable...but AC already gives you 30 hrs..i dont need trophy hunting AND going back to re do missions i didnt get 100 on -_-

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 01:48 AM
If you were an AC fan like you so zealously claim, then you would have read news articles about AC4, consequently, you would have known that the game actually has open-ended missions, covering the stealth pillar. You would have also known that Havana was bigger than Boston, with a Venice-like structure, covering the navigation pillar. Last but not least, the game is set in the Golden Age of Piracy, automatically, this covers the History tennet. As for social stealth, they returned prostitutes and removed the silly notorious system, therefore, improving social stealth. I understand that the status quo here is to be cautious about hype, but you're just going overboard.



P.S
Sir Yves Guillmont of the milking lands has clearly stated that Ubisoft doesn't expect increased sales for AC4, rendering your boycotting crusade absolutely redundant, considering that Ubisoft doesn't really think they'll have outstanding sales.



The most elaborate article I found (it should answer ALL questions):
www.gamersbook.com/scene/news/assassins-creed-4-black-flag-qa-tons-of-new-screens/

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 01:52 AM
And for the love of God, THE TRAILERS ARE NOT MADE FOR YOU, THE ARTICLES ARE. CAN YOU UNDERSTAND HOW BORING STEALTH IS, IN A TRAILER?

SixKeys
05-29-2013, 02:20 AM
And for the love of God, THE TRAILERS ARE NOT MADE FOR YOU, THE ARTICLES ARE. CAN YOU UNDERSTAND HOW BORING STEALTH IS, IN A TRAILER?

It is?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2rknjtrA7I

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 02:52 AM
It is?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2rknjtrA7I

Are you serious? This is a CGI trailer. It's an exception. Let's also not forget that the AC4 CGI trailer had some stealth at the end of it. Watch the rest of the AC1 trailers. None of them purely showed stealth. The rest of the AC4 trailers have some bits of stealth here and there, but they are only there to attract the pirate fanatics that probably won't bother to read the articles.

I probably should have worded it better. Personally, I despise 'SPLOSIONS with a burning fury and would rather have stealth eloquently inserted into a trailer with some professional editing, but still, it isn't what I would particularly call "exciting", which is pretty much marketing suicide considering that sneaky sneaky stabby stabby doesn't really capture the pirate spirit that many yearn for.


If it means anything, even a heavily stealth-centric game like Splinter Cell can only show a limited number of "stealth" scenes:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=77nYiyLItUE

WVUgirly
05-29-2013, 03:09 AM
I think stealth can be pretty exciting. It's more of a rush to me than just running in and stabbing everyone. It can be hard to potray as being awesome in a trailor, so I understand some of the explosion, open-conflict insanity in the trailor.

At first I wasn't sure about AC4 mostly because I love the main Desmond storyline. The pirate theme kind of threw me off too.

Overtime I've just gotten more and more interested in how the new direction will play out. Hopefully the people that are going to E3 will share what they think after seeing more of it (really wish I could have won one of those tickets, nerdy developer dream crushed :( )

I'm definitely not boycotting the game based on the few trailors and game play first looks we've had.

FrankieSatt
05-29-2013, 03:22 AM
indeed.

Those who are concerned, I suggest you wait and see - E3 is just around the corner, with hopefully some new info..

OR


Wait for reviews.


Bashing something without playing or knowing the full facts, can sometimes be assuming too much..

Lets see......

1) The Box Art is prominently shows ships
2) 90% of all videos show ships and ship battles
3) Instead of Edward being known as an assassin he's known first and foremost as a pirate

Yeah, I think I have a good idea what this game is and it's far from a real Assassin's Creed game. It's a Pirate Ship simulator with just enough Assassin's Creed sprinkled in to actually use the name Assassin's Creed.

I think the assumptions critics are making are based on the facts so far, and the lack of anything resembling Assassin's Creed being shown.

So, unless they show a video of something without ships, which I doubt seriously they can do, and show something that makes Edward look like an actual Assassin I don't see how I can assume anything else.

This is why my interest in Black Flag is pretty much zilch and why I might not even waste my money on this crap.

hoodrat94
05-29-2013, 03:33 AM
Can we expect a new CGI trailer at E3?

GreySkellig
05-29-2013, 03:41 AM
I do not fall into the category of hardcore AC1-style fans. I've really enjoyed each subsequent game more than the last. (with the exception of Brotherhood--AC2 definitely overshadowed it) That said, I'll acknowledge AC3 had problems. It was restrictive, overly scripted, and action-heavy. I liked Connor. He was honest, brave, and dedicated. But he was a warrior, not an assassin. An assassin should be clever, quiet and elusive. Connor was none of those things, and neither was his game. I still enjoyed the game, but it didn't feel like Assassin's Creed.

However--Even if the devs hadn't acknowledged an intent to create a more assassination-focused game with emphasis on stealth and freedom (They have in a few interviews), even if trailers were cause for concern (They aren't--they're put together by the marketing department with what they think will sell. We've seen that, for good or ill, trailers aren't a good indicator), and even if this thread wasn't jumping the gun on a game we still know almost nothing about (As Mr. Shade said, wait for reviews. Boycott it then if you still want to).......

,,,,,,,a boycott, be it by everyone on this thread or everyone in the AC forums, won't do anything serious. If Ubisoft is really what some people have accused them of being--a cash-hungry giant--they won't give a hoot about a boycott here. AC3 sold over 12 million copies. Despite ACIV's lower predicted sales, it's still going to be a huge game, and a few thousand sales lost (a generous estimate, I think) is a drop in the bucket compared to the stakes of the market at large. If, as a lot of folks feel, Ubisoft has really cast the die and gone all-in on AC as an action franchise--and maybe they have, though early indications for this game show (IMO) that there is a movement back towards the older AC model--then the amount of money we're talking about is way too big to be swayed by us here. What a lot of forum members are looking for is a specialized game, and Ubisoft seems to think they've honed in on something with broader appeal. Sounds pessimistic, I guess, but that's how I figure it.


For my part, I am very cautiously optimistic for ACIV. It promises a load of new features and revisions back to a more stealthy, open pre-AC3 style. Whether those promises are delivered, we'll have to see. But I at least am going to reserve judgement until I've actually seen gameplay, and seen the game reviewed after release.

I'm definitely not saying "Don't be dissuaded from buying the game." It's your time, your money, etc, and if you don't like what you see, definitely vote with your feet. I'm just saying I wouldn't hold out for a big reaction from Ubisoft.

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 03:46 AM
Lets see......

1) The Box Art is prominently shows ships
2) 90% of all videos show ships and ship battles
3) Instead of Edward being known as an assassin he's known first and foremost as a pirate

Yeah, I think I have a good idea what this game is and it's far from a real Assassin's Creed game. It's a Pirate Ship simulator with just enough Assassin's Creed sprinkled in to actually use the name Assassin's Creed.

I think the assumptions critics are making are based on the facts so far, and the lack of anything resembling Assassin's Creed being shown.

So, unless they show a video of something without ships, which I doubt seriously they can do, and show something that makes Edward look like an actual Assassin I don't see how I can assume anything else.

This is why my interest in Black Flag is pretty much zilch and why I might not even waste my money on this crap.

Cause Assassins are strictly European and Arabian guys, roaming around only Europe and the Middle East cities and roads since these are the only places that had assassins and not the whole damn world like it really is?

Forsaken they are for not showing us Edward born with ahidden blade attached to his arms and the Assassin tennets engraved in his memory. I mean, it's not like all assassins sort of slowly transitioned to actual assassins (like in AC1). They probably all just became strong adherents to the Creed in a day, therefore, Edward is not an assassin, since he ACTUALLY slowly adapts to the Assassin beliefs. Damned is Ubisoft for showing us how he eventually rids himself of narcissism and becomes an assassin. Definitely not an Assassin's Creed game, but when Altaďr is demoted and slowly rises through the ranks, learning his lesson like Edward, it's definitely a full-fledged AC.


When was the last time the box art not just the hero in a certain pose with a washed out background? What does this have to do with the game itself? The Bioshock Infinite box anyone?

90% of all videos show ship battles? Read the articles. 60% of the game is on land and the naval parts can be easily ignored and you can just go on an good 'ol sneaky boat assassination, JUST LIKE IN EVERY OTHER AC GAME.

Assassin_M
05-29-2013, 04:29 AM
Cause Assassins are strictly European and Arabian guys, roaming around only Europe and the Middle East cities and roads since these are the only places that had assassins and not the whole damn world like it really is?

Forsaken they are for not showing us Edward born with ahidden blade attached to his arms and the Assassin tennets engraved in his memory. I mean, it's not like all assassins sort of slowly transitioned to actual assassins (like in AC1). They probably all just became strong adherents to the Creed in a day, therefore, Edward is not an assassin, since he ACTUALLY slowly adapts to the Assassin beliefs. Damned is Ubisoft for showing us how he eventually rids himself of narcissism and becomes an assassin. Definitely not an Assassin's Creed game, but when Altaďr is demoted and slowly rises through the ranks, learning his lesson like Edward, it's definitely a full-fledged AC.


When was the last time the box art not just the hero in a certain pose with a washed out background? What does this have to do with the game itself? The Bioshock Infinite box anyone?

90% of all videos show ship battles? Read the articles. 60% of the game is on land and the naval parts can be easily ignored and you can just go on an good 'ol sneaky boat assassination, JUST LIKE IN EVERY OTHER AC GAME.
Uhh, dude....he`s already made up his mind >_>

He wants footage without ships and then he`ll be convinced. That`s quite foolish, even if you`re the harshest of critics. That`s like saying...advertise AC II without showing Italy....heck the flying machine had only one mission and it was advertised like hell

I suggest you back off slooooowly and leave him be <_<

monster_rambo
05-29-2013, 04:36 AM
Is not gonna happen. 60% gameplay on land. 40% on ships. And that is just an approximate, so is probably more sea gameplay than 40% because if they said anymore, people will start to get scared about the gameplay. but at e3, is definetly gonna be ship gameplay for sure.

Assassin_M
05-29-2013, 04:53 AM
but at e3, is definetly gonna be ship gameplay for sure.
Well DUUUUUH...AC III had ship gameplay last year too...

Wanna bet that AC4 will not have ONLY ship gameplay??

JB sig bet :|

STDlyMcStudpants
05-29-2013, 06:34 AM
ships are the only thing having me drag my feet haha...hated that in ac 3

BATISTABUS
05-29-2013, 06:59 AM
ships are the only thing having me drag my feet haha...hated that in ac 3
The worst things about naval in AC3 for me were that most of the time the narrative element was weak, and the missions were fairly restrictive. Both of these factors shouldn't really exist in AC4. Not sure if that helps.

bveUSbve
05-29-2013, 07:55 AM
Meanwhile the OP himself admitted that his original stance was premature.

But what's definitely sound: As an informed and rational customer you shouldn't pre-order or buy immediately in the first days after release - IF you were severely dissatisfied with how ACIII turned out.
Of course, pre-ordering in general isn't a sign of acting as an informed and rational customer...

I personally think that today even first waiting for "professional" reviews before deciding to purchase or not is delusional. Because reviews, even those done by the few "good" journalists, tend to be perfunctory and uncritical. It's much better to wait for first-hand impressions of other fans, taking into account that many of them also tend to be perfunctory and uncritical.

----

Another thing to consider: Buying or not buying aren't the only alternatives. You can buy later. As little time as some weeks makes a significant difference in price. And then there will still be "enough" buzz and discussion around the game to take part in.

Wait half a year and the game will have become substantially cheaper - and Ubisoft may actually recognize by the sales numbers over time that many gamers probably considered the initial price as "too high" in relation to the expected subjective "quality". Shenanigans like pro-order bonuses/exclusives should also factor into this line of thought, both for the customer and those who plot such annoying marketing strategies.
Since offering a newly released game cheaper right from the start is not an option, they might think a little about what actually constitutes "quality" for the core audience they want to sell AC games to...

pacmanate
05-29-2013, 08:21 AM
The worst things about naval in AC3 for me were that most of the time the narrative element was weak, and the missions were fairly restrictive. Both of these factors shouldn't really exist in AC4. Not sure if that helps.

That was Connors fault. His dialogue also sounded like it was recorded in a completely different way

silverASSASSIN79
05-29-2013, 08:29 AM
Understandable but let other people the game and don't force your opinion on others. If you don't wanna buy the game then don't. If that's the way you feel, then don't go around saying that you will not purchase a game that could possibly be a fantastic game. However I do feel that the way it was in AC 1 isn't in ACR and AC3. But right now we shouldn't be so against a game we haven't seen to much of gameplay and story wise. If you want to try it then go and rent it or borrow it and see how you go.

Assassin_M
05-29-2013, 10:49 AM
Meanwhile the OP himself admitted that his original stance was premature.

But what's definitely sound: As an informed and rational customer you shouldn't pre-order or buy immediately in the first days after release - IF you were severely dissatisfied with how ACIII turned out.
Of course, pre-ordering in general isn't a sign of acting as an informed and rational customer...

I personally think that today even first waiting for "professional" reviews before deciding to purchase or not is delusional. Because reviews, even those done by the few "good" journalists, tend to be perfunctory and uncritical. It's much better to wait for first-hand impressions of other fans, taking into account that many of them also tend to be perfunctory and uncritical.

tl;dr...ehh just don`t buy the game...or anything...keep waiting..

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 10:51 AM
Uhh, dude....he`s already made up his mind >_>

He wants footage without ships and then he`ll be convinced. That`s quite foolish, even if you`re the harshest of critics. That`s like saying...advertise AC II without showing Italy....heck the flying machine had only one mission and it was advertised like hell

I suggest you back off slooooowly and leave him be <_<

Bbbbbbbut...... they showed La Habana prominently in the last trailer. Ok, I'll back off now. Too agressively defensive tonight :-(

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 10:52 AM
Meanwhile the OP himself admitted that his original stance was premature.

But what's definitely sound: As an informed and rational customer you shouldn't pre-order or buy immediately in the first days after release - IF you were severely dissatisfied with how ACIII turned out.
Of course, pre-ordering in general isn't a sign of acting as an informed and rational customer...

I personally think that today even first waiting for "professional" reviews before deciding to purchase or not is delusional. Because reviews, even those done by the few "good" journalists, tend to be perfunctory and uncritical. It's much better to wait for first-hand impressions of other fans, taking into account that many of them also tend to be perfunctory and uncritical.

----

Another thing to consider: Buying or not buying aren't the only alternatives. You can buy later. As little time as some weeks makes a significant difference in price. And then there will still be "enough" buzz and discussion around the game to take part in.

Wait half a year and the game will have become substantially cheaper - and Ubisoft may actually recognize by the sales numbers over time that many gamers probably considered the initial price as "too high" in relation to the expected subjective "quality". Shenanigans like pro-order bonuses/exclusives should also factor into this line of thought, both for the customer and those who plot such annoying marketing strategies.
Since offering a newly released game cheaper right from the start is not an option, they might think a little about what actually constitutes "quality" for the core audience they want to sell AC games to...

Good luck avoiding spoilers. I'll be saluting you from far.

AssassinHMS
05-29-2013, 10:53 AM
Uhh, dude....he`s already made up his mind >_>

He wants footage without ships and then he`ll be convinced. That`s quite foolish, even if you`re the harshest of critics. That`s like saying...advertise AC II without showing Italy....heck the flying machine had only one mission and it was advertised like hell

I suggest you back off slooooowly and leave him be <_<


What about gameplay trailers? Why not even one assassination? Why only eplosions, guns, swords and ships? I know the trailers are made for "casual" players but shoudn't we be Ubisoft's target after all that happened? They are still trying to do a commercial game and as long as they do that they can't focus on a true assassin's creed experience. These trailers, these screenshots aren't meaningless, they show who the game is being targeted for and, even though they may have plans for us, the game won't be half as good as it could be if it was made, not to be commercial but to be about the assassin's creed (and not just the story).
So far, this game needs a "This is still Assassin's Creed" trailer which is ridiculous. The fact that the devs say the missions will be open ended and that they will encourage stealth in some occasions means nothing, not just because they could be lying like AC3 devs, but also because the game is still being shown as a mindless action game made for every kind of player. This is the problem, this is not assassin's creed original (and real) personality (a world of grey morale where you're not rambo, but an assassin who relies not on thousands of weapons, but on stealth and on the hidden blade, that plans missions, obeys and reflects about the creed).
I wouldn't assume this if I didn't know the franchise's direction, if I hadn't played AC1, AC2, ACB, ACR and AC3. But I did, and it all points to AC4 being another step in the wrong direction, in the direction of caos. The time for a pure assassin's creed game is gone and I'm not even aiming for that. What I expect from this franchise is an assassin's creed game and that's something that we probably won't even get.





Also I'm not forcing anyone not to buy AC4 BF because I don't even have that power, what I want is for people to realise that this is no longer AC but mix of features to attract all kinds of consumers and that AC4 BF is no exception.

ArabianFrost
05-29-2013, 10:55 AM
Well DUUUUUH...AC III had ship gameplay last year too...

Wanna bet that AC4 will not have ONLY ship gameplay??

JB sig bet :|

It's probably going to have naval with land gameplay at the beginning or end to show the "seamlessnes" of the game. Just like every other AC game, it'll probably have random events that will not make it in the final product.

LoyalACFan
05-29-2013, 11:38 AM
What about gameplay trailers? Why not even one assassination? Why only eplosions, guns, swords and ships? I know the trailers are made for "casual" players but shoudn't we be Ubisoft's target after all that happened? They are still trying to do a commercial game and as long as they do that they can't focus on a true assassin's creed experience. These trailers, these screenshots aren't meaningless, they show who the game is being targeted for and, even though they may have plans for us, the game won't be half as good as it could be if it was made, not to be commercial but to be about the assassin's creed (and not just the story).
So far, this game needs a "This is still Assassin's Creed" trailer which is ridiculous. The fact that the devs say the missions will be open ended and that they will encourage stealth in some occasions means nothing, not just because they could be lying like AC3 devs, but also because the game is still being shown as a mindless action game made for every kind of player. This is the problem, this is not assassin's creed original (and real) personality (a world of grey morale where you're not rambo, but an assassin who relies not on thousands of weapons, but on stealth and on the hidden blade, that plans missions, obeys and reflects about the creed).
I wouldn't assume this if I didn't know the franchise's direction, if I hadn't played AC1, AC2, ACB, ACR and AC3. But I did, and it all points to AC4 being another step in the wrong direction, in the direction of caos. The time for a pure assassin's creed game is gone and I'm not even aiming for that. What I expect from this franchise is an assassin's creed game and that's something that we probably won't even get.





Also I'm not forcing anyone not to buy AC4 BF because I don't even have that power, what I want is for people to realise that this is no longer AC but mix of features to attract all kinds of consumers and that AC4 BF is no exception.

Evidently you're one of those people who disregard the fact that the reveal trailer had the only true low-profile assassination EVER in a cinematic AC trailer.

Besides that, though, of course they're going to advertise the hell out of the naval content, as it was the one feature of AC3 that was almost universally acclaimed.

I could also go on at length about their immensely promising claim to deliver a mature "HBO version" of piracy, since IMO that's one thing that AC3 royally ****ed up. The tone of AC1 was probably among the most starkly brutal of any game I've ever played, and that felt RIGHT for an game about assassination. They didn't skirt around any of the harsh realities and moral paradoxes of wartime. However, AC3, although it delivered a fairer representation of the Templars, almost completely glossed over the themes of racial inequality, slavery, treason, etc. that I fully expected for a game about a Native American in the 1700s. Honestly, after hyping myself up for an intense story about Connor not belonging to either of two worlds ("on this land I am torn...") rubbing shoulders with EVERY important colonial statesman, not to mention the multiracial utopia of the Homestead, felt like a slap in the face.

Long story short, recapturing the feel of AC1 isn't about the stealth, it's about the grit and brutality that's been slowly waning since AC2, and then took a dramatic nose dive with AC3. Hopefully, they'll be true to their word on this, and if they are, we'll be back to what made AC1 great IMO. If Edward really is a charming thug in a chaotic world of scumbags, we're on the right track. If they keep the mission structure as non-linear as they're saying, we'll have struck gold.

I'm not saying you shouldn't be skeptical (I am, after the great big broken promise that was AC3) but try to see the potential here instead of just blindly bashing it.

bveUSbve
05-29-2013, 12:00 PM
Good luck avoiding spoilers. I'll be saluting you from far.
You are right, by reading what others have to say about a game the risk of being spoiled is always present. But when primarily looking out for general assessments and if you are prepared to stop reading as soon as you realize a spoiler might come up, it's probably not more risky than reading your average "professional" review.

RinoTheBouncer
05-29-2013, 12:06 PM
The thing is, why are we asking for an AC1 kinda game? The gameplay was so repetitive and boring. It was amazing story-wise and I agree the story was much more fun back then but ACII and AC:R would make the best games. I don't have a problem with linear gameplay as long as it's rich and long enough to be worth the wait and with high replay value. I want more Modern Day play to increase the fun and the variety of settings.

I think ACIV is gonna be good though I'm not a big fan of Naval gameplay.

The only disadvantage is that they made it as if Ezio and Desmond's stories are moving simultaneously and then with ACIII they bumped in another historical protagonist and now the Modern Day story is still moving in the same pace as far as we know since ACIII ending was obviously a cliffhanger and now they're changing everything again. I would've been happier if Desmond's story ended with modern concept as well not just drop Desmond and get someone new to continue after all the training Desmond has received all this time.

Farlander1991
05-29-2013, 12:25 PM
Evidently you're one of those people who disregard the fact that the reveal trailer had the only true low-profile assassination EVER in a cinematic AC trailer.

Which reminds me, Under the Black flag trailer has got more assassinations than one of the first AC1's gameplay trailers :D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ixr2q8bHo8

AssassinHMS
05-29-2013, 02:55 PM
Evidently you're one of those people who disregard the fact that the reveal trailer had the only true low-profile assassination EVER in a cinematic AC trailer.
Just watch the "Altair was here" trailer.


Besides that, though, of course they're going to advertise the hell out of the naval content, as it was the one feature of AC3 that was almost universally acclaimed.
Because it was the only feature they got right in AC3. They invested so much money and time in that (non-assassin's creed related) feature that there was no way it could go wrong. If they had invested that time in order to properly improve and introduce stealth (or anything else by the way) those features would be acclaimed as well. But you know, the greed and the mindless ambition didn't let them.



Long story short, recapturing the feel of AC1 isn't about the stealth, it's about the grit and brutality that's been slowly waning since AC2, and then took a dramatic nose dive with AC3. Hopefully, they'll be true to their word on this, and if they are, we'll be back to what made AC1 great IMO. If Edward really is a charming thug in a chaotic world of scumbags, we're on the right track. If they keep the mission structure as non-linear as they're saying, we'll have struck gold.

True. But I also want them to recapture, not the feel of AC1, but the essence (fighting should be harder and stealth encouraged, the hidden blade is the assassin's most important weapon and not just another tool in a huge arsenal, the player should be required to act like an assassin, planning missions, being nothing but a blade in the crowd, gathering information, infiltrating, assassinating and escaping) By the way, gathering information could be very entertaining if done properly.


try to see the potential here instead of just blindly bashing it.

Bashing something without playing or knowing the full facts, can sometimes be assuming too much..
I’m not bashing anything; I’m simply describing what has been shown so far. Bashing my post, or saying I’m bashing the game, without knowing the full facts, can sometimes be assuming too much…
I admit this game has the potential of becoming an amazing pirate game… but an assassin’s Creed game? Not from what they’ve shown, not when taking in account the evolution of the franchise, not when keeping in mind last year’s fail and specially not when considering what the game is set to be and the way the developers are treating it.


No I enjoy the job of an Assassin - Assassinating...there was no planning in AC 1...I just went up to my target and pressed square...
I planned more in AC 2 and AC3 when it was forced on me.....
It seems you don’t know what the job of an assassin is or what it takes. Assassinating is only a small part of it. Also you’re the one who didn’t even know you could be stealthy in AC1, not to mention, you said you never tried to (or even knew that you could) plan anything in AC and that your “tactic” was to go Rambo style and kill everyone. It seems you actually need the game to hold your hand because you don’t think for yourself. Like you said you only played stealthy after AC1 because games like AC2 forced you to. If you never understood the role of an assassin, never tried to act or think like one, never used stealth in AC1, how could you understand what I’m talking about?
No wonder you think this franchise got better every year (with AC3 being the best) since each game was more linear than the previous culminating in AC3 (the one that held your hand the tightest).

Megas_Doux
05-29-2013, 03:37 PM
Just watch the "Altair was here" trailer.

.

That has been the ONLY one stealth trailer in the AC franchise, hear me out:


ACI Altair attacked in the middle of an execution!
ACII Ezio interrupts the carnival.
ACB Ezio interrupts a parade in the centre of Roma.
ACR, Ezio is fighting off dozens of guys.
ACIII Connor charges a BATTALION.....

See????

Also, And I am not defending the lack of stelath either, I think is too soon to judge! I hope that, as the devps have been saying, they will bringing back some of the ACI´s elements.......

GreySkellig
05-29-2013, 04:10 PM
Seriously guys, nobody is convincing anybody here. Folks seem to have their opinions and they're sticking to them.

I could go blue in the face trying to tell AssassinHMS things like "Devs don't make the trailers, marketing does, so you can't view them as a promise from the game designers," or that targeting a game at his demographic of hardcore fan would turn too many casuals away from the series for Ubisoft to justify it to their wallet. But he has his opinion, his right to it, and apparently won't be convinced to change it. TBH, I mostly agree with him regarding some of the growing problems with the series. I just don't think it's panic time yet regarding ACIV.

Maybe we can all revisit this discussion farther down the line, when we all know a little more about the game--i.e. after we've seen some actual gameplay (not just gameplay footage).

AssassinHMS
05-29-2013, 04:17 PM
That has been the ONLY one stealth trailer in the AC franchise, hear me out:


ACI Altair attacked in the middle of an execution!
ACII Ezio interrupts the carnival.
ACB Ezio interrupts a parade in the centre of Roma.
ACR, Ezio is fighting off dozens of guys.
ACIII Connor charges a BATTALION.....

See????

Also, And I am not defending the lack of stelath either, I think is too soon to judge! I hope that, as the devps have been saying, they will bringing back some of the ACI´s elements.......

Even the CGI trailers show the increasing lack of assassinations and the preponderance of action and battles. But I get what you're saying. In normal circumstances I would agree that it's too soon to judge (even though we already got a lot of explosions and ships) but there is a pattern here. Everything points to another mindless action packed game, from the explosions to the smallest details (like "assassinating" with swords instead of hidden blades). I haven't seen a single sign or any hidden message (other than the one assassination) that the devs intend to bring back the heart of the series. It seems to me that they wanted to make a pirate game from the start but, given AC3's bad reception, they adjusted their strategy and said what we wanted to hear, to ease us and make us pre-order it. I could be wrong but the game isn't giving much of a choice, not o mention, I promised my wallet and my brain that I'd be skeptical.
I still think that, assuming this game will be a pirate game (even though I don't see how it could not be), the best thing to do in order to make Ubisoft listen, is to refrain from buying or, at least, pre-ordering the game.

Mr_Shade
05-29-2013, 05:51 PM
Maybe we can all revisit this discussion farther down the line, when we all know a little more about the game--i.e. after we've seen some actual gameplay (not just gameplay footage).

indeed.

And as you point out - Trailers are not always made to show everything - and tbh an action packed trailer - will appeal to more players than a stealth one..

But, we all know that..

I can only suggest as before, wait and see.

STDlyMcStudpants
05-29-2013, 06:05 PM
It seems you don’t know what the job of an assassin is or what it takes. Assassinating is only a small part of it. Also you’re the one who didn’t even know you could be stealthy in AC1, not to mention, you said you never tried to (or even knew that you could) plan anything in AC and that your “tactic” was to go Rambo style and kill everyone. It seems you actually need the game to hold your hand because you don’t think for yourself. Like you said you only played stealthy after AC1 because games like AC2 forced you to. If you never understood the role of an assassin, never tried to act or think like one, never used stealth in AC1, how could you understand what I’m talking about?
No wonder you think this franchise got better every year (with AC3 being the best) since each game was more linear than the previous culminating in AC3 (the one that held your hand the tightest).
It seems as though you took it upon yourself to define what it means to be an Assassin in it's creed and are being a giant baby because Ubi took that away from you and tell you what it means in later games and you dont agree with their definition :)
I mean I don't think for myself?
You played the game with stealth simply because you believe "Assassins are supposed to"
THAT is not thinking for yourself..you are following order right freakin there by doing "what you're supposed to"!
We weren't SUPPOSED to do anything but kill our targets and mark our feathers with their blood.
The fact that I played the entire game with 0 stealth is enough in itself to say it isnt a stealth based game..just because YOU chose to play that way, doesnt make it fact.

IceHot100
05-29-2013, 06:14 PM
Although I agree with you , but you have no right to tell what others should buy and what not. AC is becoming more commercial, because commercial= bigger audience. Even if we went by your way by not buying BF (which practically is impossible but let's just assume), they still would never readjust their franchise just for a couple of hardcore fans.

AssassinHMS
05-29-2013, 07:00 PM
It seems as though you took it upon yourself to define what it means to be an Assassin in it's creed and are being a giant baby because Ubi took that away from you and tell you what it means in later games and you dont agree with their definition :)
I mean I don't think for myself?
You played the game with stealth simply because you believe "Assassins are supposed to"
THAT is not thinking for yourself..you are following order right freakin there by doing "what you're supposed to"!
We weren't SUPPOSED to do anything but kill our targets and mark our feathers with their blood.
The fact that I played the entire game with 0 stealth is enough in itself to say it isnt a stealth based game..just because YOU chose to play that way, doesnt make it fact.

I meant that you are a player who requires linear games or, otherwise you won't realise/discover what the game offers you. I used stealth in AC1 pretty much all the time, not because I thought I had to, but because I wanted to, because I explored the game enough to realize I could carry out the assassinations anyway I wanted and I chose stealth. That's the beauty of open ended missions. You, on the other hand, only did things that the game forced you to do: "Oh I have to kill the target? Ok." Enter through the front door, fight the way through and press square upon the target. Like I said you don't explore the game, you just accept your mission and do it without planning, without major brain activity, without thinking if it's better to use stealth rather than brute force. You even thought there was no stealth or mission planing in AC1. Not only there is stealth but also many ways to reach the target, many ways to escape and the things you did outside assassination missions could help you when in a bind. Games aren't movies where you can't express yourself or where your ideas are useless (at least AC1 isn't).
And after all this you say I made my own definition of assassin and creed. To begin with, I never said to you what my definition was, I only said assassination is just a small part of their job. But it was set in AC1 that an assassin is a person who thinks openly, that doesn't follow religious cults or other people's ideas without analyzing them first and judging their truth. An assassin is committed to the creed... But I'm tired and I don't feel like explaining you everything. Just play AC1 if you want to learn more about it.
Finally, stealth is a core element of the franchise (or used to be) and if you actually try to play the games using stealth you'll see what happened. Also the problem with the franchise is not just the lack of stealth or open ended missions but I've already explained that in other posts. I suggest you look for them or for other people's posts that speak openly about the current state of the series.

STDlyMcStudpants
05-29-2013, 08:21 PM
I meant that you are a player who requires linear games or, otherwise you won't realise/discover what the game offers you. I used stealth in AC1 pretty much all the time, not because I thought I had to, but because I wanted to, because I explored the game enough to realize I could carry out the assassinations anyway I wanted and I chose stealth. That's the beauty of open ended missions. You, on the other hand, only did things that the game forced you to do: "Oh I have to kill the target? Ok." Enter through the front door, fight the way through and press square upon the target. Like I said you don't explore the game, you just accept your mission and do it without planning, without major brain activity, without thinking if it's better to use stealth rather than brute force. You even thought there was no stealth or mission planing in AC1. Not only there is stealth but also many ways to reach the target, many ways to escape and the things you did outside assassination missions could help you when in a bind. Games aren't movies where you can't express yourself or where your ideas are useless (at least AC1 isn't).
And after all this you say I made my own definition of assassin and creed. To begin with, I never said to you what my definition was, I only said assassination is just a small part of their job. But it was set in AC1 that an assassin is a person who thinks openly, that doesn't follow religious cults or other people's ideas without analyzing them first and judging their truth. An assassin is committed to the creed... But I'm tired and I don't feel like explaining you everything. Just play AC1 if you want to learn more about it.
Finally, stealth is a core element of the franchise (or used to be) and if you actually try to play the games using stealth you'll see what happened. Also the problem with the franchise is not just the lack of stealth or open ended missions but I've already explained that in other posts. I suggest you look for them or for other people's posts that speak openly about the current state of the series.

In any game I play - if I rush forward on my target is a decision based simply on their patterns and what is in between the 2 of us.
Im a mighty assassin. 3 guards and a fat guy in a robe preaching isnt enough to make me sit back like batman and ponder on what im going to do.
But youre right, i didnt explore AC 1..because it was bland -_- I couldnt wait to finish it...

AssassinHMS
05-29-2013, 09:34 PM
In any game I play - if I rush forward on my target is a decision based simply on their patterns and what is in between the 2 of us.
Im a mighty assassin. 3 guards and a fat guy in a robe preaching isnt enough to make me sit back like batman and ponder on what im going to do.

You have a point. I agree, the difficulty is not high enough to properly encourage stealth or planning (and it only got easier with every new installment). But since assassin's creed is being targeted for casual gamers it has to be easy in order to, well, to feel casual and give that false sense of control and power (that comes from completing easy challenges that are meant to appear difficult). No worries though, for those who want challenge, there's allways Norris and the minigames or guards that can see through walls in order to make stealth a harder aproach...

Bashilir
05-29-2013, 10:07 PM
You have a point. I agree, the difficulty is not high enough to properly encourage stealth or planning (and it only got easier with every new installment). But since assassin's creed is being targeted for casual gamers it has to be easy in order to, well, to feel casual and give that false sense of control and power (that comes from completing easy challenges that are meant to appear difficult). No worries though, for those who want challenge, there's allways Norris and the minigames or guards that can see through walls in order to make stealth a harder aproach...



They basically went from ******ed guards to super high intelligent guards that have X-Ray goggles. They tried improving guards and obviously didn't test the AI enough... Anyway, the way I see it is, AC1 really wasn't stealth. Obviously, you could choose to be stealthy. Now, the point is that, you could choose what type of assasin you were. One that no one knew you were there(kind've like Altair, except almost his assassinations ended up where everyone knew he was there) or the assassin that wants to strike fear into the hearts of the Templars. The second option is obviously more appealing to a wider audience. Only a select few will want to be unkown. I don't know, that's my 2 cents. If they'd work on Social Stealth like I said in my thread awhile back and made the game have ATLEAST 3 ways to do a mission. 1. Guns blazing, 2. Extreme hardcore stealth, or 3. this one is a little different. This one is basically a mix if that makes sense. You could go into combat kill several people, hide and go stealthy and basically have the ability to switch back and forth. Unlike AC3 is where once you get detected, 50 guards from 5 streets down know EXACTLY where you are.

Gi1t
05-29-2013, 10:31 PM
They basically went from ******ed guards to super high intelligent guards that have X-Ray goggles. They tried improving guards and obviously didn't test the AI enough... Anyway, the way I see it is, AC1 really wasn't stealth. Obviously, you could choose to be stealthy. Now, the point is that, you could choose what type of assasin you were. One that no one knew you were there(kind've like Altair, except almost his assassinations ended up where everyone knew he was there) or the assassin that wants to strike fear into the hearts of the Templars. The second option is obviously more appealing to a wider audience. Only a select few will want to be unkown. I don't know, that's my 2 cents. If they'd work on Social Stealth like I said in my thread awhile back and made the game have ATLEAST 3 ways to do a mission. 1. Guns blazing, 2. Extreme hardcore stealth, or 3. this one is a little different. This one is basically a mix if that makes sense. You could go into combat kill several people, hide and go stealthy and basically have the ability to switch back and forth. Unlike AC3 is where once you get detected, 50 guards from 5 streets down know EXACTLY where you are.

I think your third option would basically be the way it's shown in the AC1 opening and also my favorite way to do things. :) Stay under the radar using social stealth until a precise moment in which you take out the protection for the target and the target all in one burst of energy that's too quick for people to react to and then you run away and vanish into the crowds. It's ultimately a high profile Assassination, but it's stealthy until you're close enough to execute your plan. It's the act of assassination itself that exposes you, btu by then it's too late. My favorite thing to do was not to fight my way out afterward, but to merely circumvent the guards with a few swift actions and just run. I like the idea of taking out only a couple of people in the process. At the party-gone-awry in Damascus I took out the target from overhead and when his two personal guards ran forward after the cutscene, I simply grabbed one and shoved him into the other, sending them both sprawling and I was gone before they were on their feet again. Before all of that, they didn't even know I was there really. :D

I think it would be a good idea for them to show a demo (at least one demo even if it's one they post online instead of showing it publicly) where they directly appeal ot the concerns issued by 'AC1 fans'. If they're really trying to develop some of those features that have sort of gone by the wayside lately, I wouldn't think it'd be a stretch to come out and say 'this is what we're doing to address this concern, and that concern'. I'm tired of always hearing 'we're confident people will like it' as their only response to questions about issues concerning the series. -__- Do the opposite of what you did in the AC3 demo at E3 and demonstrate the social stealth mechanics too. Maybe do two demos of the same mission done one way and then another. That might actually turn some of the critics around. If you just show exactly what all the harsh critics are expecting, you're just adding fuel to the fire.

Bashilir
05-29-2013, 10:33 PM
I think your third option would basically be the way it's shown in the AC1 opening and also my favorite way to do things. :) Stay under the radar using social stealth until a precise moment in which you take out the protection for the target and the target all in one burst of energy that's too quick for people to react to and then you run away and vanish into the crowds. It's ultimately a high profile Assassination, but it's stealthy until you're close enough to execute your plan. It's the act of assassination itself that exposes you, btu by then it's too late. My favorite thing to do was not to fight my way out afterward, but to merely circumvent the guards with a few swift actions and just run. I like the idea of taking out only a couple of people in the process. At the party-gone-awry in Damascus I took out the target from overhead and when his two personal guards ran forward after the cutscene, I simply grabbed one and shoved him into the other, sending them both sprawling and I was gone before they were on their feet again. Before all of that, they didn't even know I was there really. :D

I think it would be a good idea for them to show a demo (at least one demo even if it's one they post online instead of showing it publicly) where they directly appeal ot the concerns issued by 'AC1 fans'. If they're really trying to develop some of those features that have sort of gone by the wayside lately, I wouldn't think it'd be a stretch to come out and say 'this is what we're doing to address this concern, and that concern'. I'm tired of always hearing 'we're confident people will like it' as their only response to questions about issues concerning the series. -__- Do the opposite of what you did in the AC3 demo at E3 and demonstrate the social stealth mechanics too. Maybe do two demos of the same mission done one way and then another. That might actually turn some of the critics around. If you just show exactly what all the harsh critics are expecting, you're just adding fuel to the fire.



I don't think I could possibly agree with this anymore. You hit the nail on the head.

AssassinHMS
05-29-2013, 10:44 PM
They basically went from ******ed guards to super high intelligent guards that have X-Ray goggles. They tried improving guards and obviously didn't test the AI enough... Anyway, the way I see it is, AC1 really wasn't stealth. Obviously, you could choose to be stealthy. Now, the point is that, you could choose what type of assasin you were. One that no one knew you were there(kind've like Altair, except almost his assassinations ended up where everyone knew he was there) or the assassin that wants to strike fear into the hearts of the Templars. The second option is obviously more appealing to a wider audience. Only a select few will want to be unkown. I don't know, that's my 2 cents. If they'd work on Social Stealth like I said in my thread awhile back and made the game have ATLEAST 3 ways to do a mission. 1. Guns blazing, 2. Extreme hardcore stealth, or 3. this one is a little different. This one is basically a mix if that makes sense. You could go into combat kill several people, hide and go stealthy and basically have the ability to switch back and forth. Unlike AC3 is where once you get detected, 50 guards from 5 streets down know EXACTLY where you are.

Exactly. I absolutely agree but let me just add that I think combat should be really hard and viewed from a different perspective. An assassin isn't a warrior. To be honest I'm tired of this concept that, in order to be a hero or a main character in a game you have to be an experienced killer, a badass that beats the crap out of everybody. Why can't an assassin be a slim guy that uses his brain rather than fists? This would encourage stealth and cunning but also would make it more realistic...



Although I agree with you , but you have no right to tell what others should buy and what not.

I can't and don't want to force anyone to abstain from buying BF I just said what I thought that should be done.



AC is becoming more commercial, because commercial= bigger audience. Even if we went by your way by not buying BF (which practically is impossible but let's just assume), they still would never readjust their franchise just for a couple of hardcore fans.

Hardcore fans aren't the only ones who want AC to build upon its original idea instead of adding features to cover up the fact the franchise isn't evolving. I truly think that, if all of us, who think this way, ask Ubisoft to let AC return to its roots and show them that a pirate game doesn't replace an assassin's creed game, causing a significant drop in the sales they will have to change their strategy in order to win us back. After all it's common sense that, if a company loses it's core fanbase it won't survive long.

rupok2
05-30-2013, 05:38 AM
I agree with you, although we haven't seen much of AC4, this is the least interested I have ever been of an AC game, I used to remember back during AC2 days looking forward to the next AC right after I finished one. It was one of those games that I preordered the moment I could and a game I knew would be good if nothing else was. And now.... I don't even care. I haven't been on the forums in more than a month and I almost completely forgot about the game. First time I won't be preordering, from the AC3 stuff during E3 we know already that what they show during E3 doesn't represent the game. From the trailers they already showed I have a feeling its gonna be another one man army game with slaughtering guards left and right, soulless murder and hollywood explosions. But whatever, I am not gonna rage or anything, no point, game companies will never listen to us no matter how loud you are. If its a real assassins creed game after release Ill get it, if not then I won't, simple as that.

warner4692
05-30-2013, 01:37 PM
indeed.

Those who are concerned, I suggest you wait and see - E3 is just around the corner, with hopefully some new info..

OR


Wait for reviews.


Bashing something without playing or knowing the full facts, can sometimes be assuming too much..

Each new reveal about ACIV has only made it look worse. E3 previews are usually inaccurate, and trusting a critic to tell me if the game is any good or not is a poor substitute. Especially critics - they NEVER get it right. When they say something is good, it rarely is, or they make it look better than it is. And vice versa.


I'm not going to start acting like some saint for what AC has become but you cannot say this will downright suck/boycott the game with the little knowledge we have. It seems like you are saying not to buy AC4 because AC3 was not good. That doesn't mean that the developers cannot turn this around. If anything, the fans have been most vocal about AC3 than any other game in the franchise, I am pretty sure they are acknowledging that too.

If you are sceptical, then fair enough, I am pretty sure most of us are, but that shouldn't mean not buying the game when we only have 2-3 trailers.

The developers had a chance to turn things around with ACR and ACIII. But the general decisions they've made have been questionable, at the very least. You're right in saying the game may be good, despite not looking like it...

...but I'm not going to not buy the game because the last installment was bad - I'm not buying (without a rent first) because I've given the developers several chances.


I agree with you, although we haven't seen much of AC4, this is the least interested I have ever been of an AC game, I used to remember back during AC2 days looking forward to the next AC right after I finished one. It was one of those games that I preordered the moment I could and a game I knew would be good if nothing else was. And now.... I don't even care. I haven't been on the forums in more than a month and I almost completely forgot about the game. First time I won't be preordering, from the AC3 stuff during E3 we know already that what they show during E3 doesn't represent the game. From the trailers they already showed I have a feeling its gonna be another one man army game with slaughtering guards left and right, soulless murder and hollywood explosions. But whatever, I am not gonna rage or anything, no point, game companies will never listen to us no matter how loud you are. If its a real assassins creed game after release Ill get it, if not then I won't, simple as that.

This is quite possibly the best post ever. You'd think after Mass Effect 3 (which I didn't have much of a problem with, personally, but still), game developers of this day and age would listen more.

I mean, how hard is it to figure out? Video gaming has been around long enough by now that we should all know better than this. ACII was definitely my favorite, but about 95% of everything that made up the resonance of the series has been destroyed. And for no real reason, at that.

I'll give it a rent, in case it's any good. After all, it might be. But I'm more than just a little skeptical after ACR AND ACIII.

Sushiglutton
05-30-2013, 01:56 PM
Each new reveal about ACIV has only made it look worse. E3 previews are usually inaccurate, and trusting a critic to tell me if the game is any good or not is a poor substitute. Especially critics - they NEVER get it right. When they say something is good, it rarely is, or they make it look better than it is. And vice versa.

I think some critics are great, some not so much. A tip is to go to metacritic (http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/assassins-creed-iii/critic-reviews) and try to find someone who matches your taste. For example I think this (http://www.pcgamer.com/review/assassins-creed-3-review/2/) review form PC-gamer is spot on about a lot of the issues. So when AC4 is released I will check what PC gamer thinks about it before I decide when to get it.

AssassinHMS
05-30-2013, 09:56 PM
I agree with you, although we haven't seen much of AC4, this is the least interested I have ever been of an AC game, I used to remember back during AC2 days looking forward to the next AC right after I finished one. It was one of those games that I preordered the moment I could and a game I knew would be good if nothing else was. And now.... I don't even care. I haven't been on the forums in more than a month and I almost completely forgot about the game. First time I won't be preordering, from the AC3 stuff during E3 we know already that what they show during E3 doesn't represent the game. From the trailers they already showed I have a feeling its gonna be another one man army game with slaughtering guards left and right, soulless murder and hollywood explosions.

Exactly!


But whatever, I am not gonna rage or anything, no point, game companies will never listen to us no matter how loud you are.

If everyone thought like that then we'd be doomed.


If its a real assassins creed game after release Ill get it, if not then I won't, simple as that.

A wise decision.
All in all everything works this way. Even life itself becomes casual after a while...but hopefully not as fast as AC

warner4692
05-31-2013, 05:41 AM
I think some critics are great, some not so much. A tip is to go to metacritic (http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/assassins-creed-iii/critic-reviews) and try to find someone who matches your taste. For example I think this (http://www.pcgamer.com/review/assassins-creed-3-review/2/) review form PC-gamer is spot on about a lot of the issues. So when AC4 is released I will check what PC gamer thinks about it before I decide when to get it.

Metacritic is a serious issue with the progression of entertainment, and unfortunately, Ubisoft are one of those companies that takes what its critics have to say waaay too seriously.

There are a hundred billion people in this world. When a product is given a Metascore, it's based entirely on the reviews of only 30-50 people. This world is a lot bigger than what those few people can represent.

And, truth be told, I don't need someone else to tell me if a product is good or not. I'll decide for myself what I think of a product, instead.

Sushiglutton
05-31-2013, 09:57 AM
Metacritic is a serious issue with the progression of entertainment, and unfortunately, Ubisoft are one of those companies that takes what its critics have to say waaay too seriously.

There are a hundred billion people in this world. When a product is given a Metascore, it's based entirely on the reviews of only 30-50 people. This world is a lot bigger than what those few people can represent.

And, truth be told, I don't need someone else to tell me if a product is good or not. I'll decide for myself what I think of a product, instead.


I didn't say look at the combined score. I said choose one critic whose opinion on AC3 you agree with. Then check what he thinks of AC4. To decide for yourself is kind of backwards as it implies buying the product. But once you have it's too late.

Dev_Anj
05-31-2013, 03:14 PM
I think that the better option would be to frankly try it out for a while and see how good it is. After all, it would be harsh to assume the game isn't good just because it has some features that take away from the core gameplay.

As for feeling like an Assassin's Creed game, I would be happy if they actually focused more on the social stealth aspects and assassinations. The assassinations have been mostly turned rather similar and easy in execution. But focusing more on the sea aspect won't hurt. I personally think it would help if they made a good Assassin's Creed game that had great social stealth and assassinations with some good naval battles and ocean explorations as well. Let's see.

warner4692
05-31-2013, 04:55 PM
I didn't say look at the combined score. I said choose one critic whose opinion on AC3 you agree with. Then check what he thinks of AC4. To decide for yourself is kind of backwards as it implies buying the product. But once you have it's too late.

Why would I take someone else's opinion over my own?

I'll rent it. Simple. That way, I've spent a lot less money on it, in case it turns out unsatisfactorily, and I've still played it.

The latter is particularly important, because when people try to tell me things like "ITZ A GOOD GAM U NEVER PLAYED IT", I'll know that I have.

Sushiglutton
05-31-2013, 05:10 PM
Why would I take someone else's opinion over my own?

I'll rent it. Simple. That way, I've spent a lot less money on it, in case it turns out unsatisfactorily, and I've still played it.

The latter is particularly important, because when people try to tell me things like "ITZ A GOOD GAM U NEVER PLAYED IT", I'll know that I have.

You read my posts in a very weird fashion. First you thought I recomended checking the aggregated score when that was clearly not what I said. Now you believe I recomend taking someone else's opinion over your own, which is again clearly not what I said. It's too tedious to discuss this with you, so I'm just gonna wish you a good day and move on :)!

warner4692
05-31-2013, 05:30 PM
You read my posts in a very weird fashion. First you thought I recomended checking the aggregated score when that was clearly not what I said. Now you believe I recomend taking someone else's opinion over your own, which is again clearly not what I said. It's too tedious to discuss this with you, so I'm just gonna wish you a good day and move on :)!

Never said you recommended checking the aggregated score. I was pointing out that Metacritic's reviews are a bad source of information when you're looking to find out how the "majority" feels about something.

Never said you said I should take other people's opinions over my own, either. I was pointing out that I don't care what ANY critics have to say.

Quite simple, really.

Sushiglutton
05-31-2013, 05:41 PM
Never said you recommended checking the aggregated score. I was pointing out that Metacritic's reviews are a bad source of information when you're looking to find out how the "majority" feels about something.

Never said you said I should take other people's opinions over my own, either. I was pointing out that I don't care what ANY critics have to say.

Quite simple, really.

My assumption was that your replies were about the things I suggested. But it seems you just choosed some related topics, that weren't all that relevant to what I said, and discussed them instead. It's actually not as simple to follow as you might think. Well anyway, now I'm really done, adios!

silverASSASSIN79
05-31-2013, 11:04 PM
@warner4692 now all you are doing is bashing the company. Companies can only cater to so much people without receiving some form of negative feedback by the people that weren't happy with what they got. I was happy with AC 3 at first but it got old and didn't have much replay value for me. The only games I like in the franchise now are ACB and AC2. Those games really were the best for me. Brotherhood had you climb a giant castle, 2 had you infiltrate the Vatican and passing the gaurds with close to no blend groups to work with (though the groups would flee as soon as they saw a body. But the best bit about all of the games is that you can CHOOSE to play stealthy or rush in like a crazy decapitated chicken and kill everyone in sight.

silverASSASSIN79
06-01-2013, 05:14 AM
With the exception of a few missions

silverASSASSIN79
06-01-2013, 05:18 AM
@ AssassinHMS it sounds like all you are really doing is hating on a game you know nothing about and trying to force what you think is right on others.

Assassin_M
06-01-2013, 05:39 AM
But the best bit about all of the games is that you can CHOOSE to play stealthy or rush in like a crazy decapitated chicken and kill everyone in sight.
I think you`re mistaking ACB and AC II for AC I...

AC II and ACB had you instantly desynced if you`re detected...if a missions`s set path is NOT to be detected..most were like that...AC I was the only game were you REALLY had a choice

GreySkellig
06-01-2013, 07:14 AM
@ AssassinHMS it sounds like all you are really doing is hating on a game you know nothing about and trying to force what you think is right on others.

You know not what dragon you've woken.

Assassin_M
06-01-2013, 07:17 AM
You know not what dragon you've woken.
this`ll be interesting to watch

GreySkellig
06-01-2013, 07:34 AM
After going ten rounds with Montage I have learned to avoid expressing any strong opinion on here...ever.

Locopells
06-01-2013, 11:38 AM
You know not what dragon you've woken.

Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus...

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 01:10 PM
@ AssassinHMS it sounds like all you are really doing is hating on a game you know nothing about and trying to force what you think is right on others.

When I see a white shape with small claws in motion followed by a long pink tail and, if I hear it squealing, I will naturally think it’s a rat, not because I hate it, but because everything points towards that conclusion (especially if I already saw a rat last year).
And I’m not forcing anyone not to buy it. Do you see me pointing a gun at you? I didn’t even use an exclamation mark. It’s an advice (like: “Don’t jump that cliff” or “Don’t wake up dragons without life insurance.”). You’re free to do anything you want and that’s the beauty of open ended missions…

pacmanate
06-01-2013, 01:11 PM
I don't get it... why are you hear if you don't want people to buy AC4?

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 01:19 PM
I don't get it... why are you hear if you don't want people to buy AC4?

Hmm...because I think people shouldn't buy it for the reasons I explained in my original post.

Locopells
06-01-2013, 01:21 PM
When I see a white shape with small claws in motion followed by a long pink tail and, if I hear it squealing, I will naturally think it’s a rat, not because I hate it, but because everything points towards that conclusion (especially if I already saw a rat last year).
And I’m not forcing anyone not to buy it. Do you see me pointing a gun at you? I didn’t even use an exclamation mark. It’s an advice (like: “Don’t jump that cliff” or “Don’t wake up dragons without life insurance.”). You’re free to do anything you want and that’s the beauty of open ended missions…

A escaped pet rat, presumably...

pacmanate
06-01-2013, 01:30 PM
Hmm...because I think people shouldn't buy it for the reasons I explained in my original post.

You just said you aren't forcing people not to buy it, yet you want people not to buy it. And my question is why are you here? To keep telling people not to buy it which is basically harassing them not too?

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 01:40 PM
A escaped pet rat, presumably...

Scabbers? Could be...but I won't assume anything without the full facts.




You just said you aren't forcing people not to buy it, yet you want people not to buy it. And my question is why are you here? To keep telling people not to buy it which is basically harassing them not too?

If you feel harassed then, please, call the police. No one is forcing you to enter this thread and interact with me. If you don't understand the obvious difference between an advice and a threat then you should go fetch a dictionary.

pacmanate
06-01-2013, 01:41 PM
If you feel harassed then, please, call the police. No one is forcing you to enter this thread and interact with me. If you don't understand the obvious difference between an advice and a threat then you should go fetch a dictionary.

Pretty **** advice to be honest seeing as you have no evidence on the quality of Black Flag, only previous games.

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 01:53 PM
Pretty **** advice to be honest seeing as you have no evidence on the quality of Black Flag, only previous games.

I'm not talking about its quality as a game (as I already said it has the potencial of being an interesting/fun pirate game), but as an assassin'a creed game.
I suggest you read my post again until you realise my assumptions aren't big at all considering everything we know about the game, about the franchise and about Ubisoft.

montagemik
06-01-2013, 01:53 PM
Hmm...because I think people shouldn't buy it for the reasons I explained in my original post.


Then shouldn't your 'original post' BE the full extent of your views & discussion on this subject ? :confused:

You stated reasons for others to consider ................You've already seemingly decided to NOT buy /pre-order AC-4 .
Advising what others Should & Shouldn't buy ...............Is probably best left until you're actually asked for such advice.

Be happy with your decision/choice & let others be happy with theirs ............ Their decision either way does not influence any aspect of your life - Does it ??

pacmanate
06-01-2013, 01:59 PM
I'm not talking about its quality as a game (as I already said it has the potencial of being an interesting/fun pirate game), but as an assassin'a creed game.
I suggest you read my post again until you realise my assumptions aren't big at all considering everything we know about the game, about the franchise and about Ubisoft.

1. Hardly know anything about the game, nothing about the story, we know Edward is a pirate.
2. AC:B was an extension and did alright. AC:R was a DS game turned Console, which was impressive. AC3, yes disappointing from a story and mission design view, but they can change that.
3. About Ubisoft.... I don't know what you mean by this one. They already said they want more investigations and more open ended designs like AC1. Ive said this many times, the fact that they are even ACKNOWLEDGING this is such a great thing for fans that though AC lost it after AC1.

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 02:15 PM
Then shouldn't your 'original post' BE the full extent of your views & discussion on this subject ? :confused:

It is. I explained there my view of the meaning of what we've seen so far and I discussed it, presenting my solution.


You stated reasons for others to consider ................You've already seemingly decided to NOT buy /pre-order AC-4 .

I already said this thread was a bit premature but I believe in what I said, I trust my statements and therefore my decision. So far what Ubisoft has shown is a pirate game (they even said they knew from the start they were going to do a pirate game). If I pre-order the game right now I'll be showing Ubisoft that I want a pirate game full of explosions and ships. If I buy the game later it means that I fall in the category the game is targeted for. Hence my decision.


Advising what others Should & Shouldn't buy ...............Is probably best left until you're actually asked for such advice.

Certainly, but understand that my point isn't being accepted or to wait for the best time to talk (because it may be too late for what I want). My goal here is to let people understand that Ubisoft has no actual interest in the franchise (other than financial) and that their target is a game made for every kind of gamer, a casual game, a diluted version of AC.


Be happy with your decision/choice & let others be happy with theirs ............ Their decision either way does not influence any aspect of your life - Does it ??
I'm happy with my decision/choice and I let others be happy with theirs. It's not like I go to every thread or send emails to everyone demanding them to abstain from buying the game, I made a simple thread explaining my opinion. That's all. Their decision won't influence my life but it will influence the franchise. Nevertheless it's their decision and, like I allways said, I can't and don't want to force it.

Assassin_M
06-01-2013, 02:21 PM
My goal here is to let people understand that Ubisoft has no actual interest in the franchise (other than financial)
The Corporate identity of Ubisoft, maybe...just UBISOFT is such a big generalization..also



Certainly, but understand that my point isn't being accepted or to wait for the best time to talk (because it may be too late for what I want). My goal here is to let people understand that Ubisoft has no actual interest in the franchise (other than financial) and that their target is a game made for every kind of gamer, a casual game, a diluted version of AC.
Let people understand (i.e, people do not understand...i.e i`m more intelligent and thus have put myself above everyone else proclaiming wisdom)

sounds about right??

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 02:35 PM
The Corporate identity of Ubisoft, maybe...just UBISOFT is such a big generalization..also

Only the section that works on AC (most of them at least)



Let people understand (i.e, people do not understand...i.e i`m more intelligent and thus have put myself above everyone else proclaiming wisdom)

sounds about right??

My first language is not English...that isn't what I meant and you know it.

Assassin_M
06-01-2013, 02:49 PM
Only the section that works on AC (most of them at least)
Uhhh no...those who WORK, as in, the developers..actually put work into those games...years of work...to say that these guys do not care about THEIR work is a bit of a....stretch




My first language is not English...that isn't what I meant and you know it.
Heh...whatever you say

Sushiglutton
06-01-2013, 02:57 PM
Uhhh no...those who WORK, as in, the developers..actually put work into those games...years of work...to say that these guys do not care about THEIR work is a bit of a....stretch

Exactly! That companies only care about money is a common missconception. A company is a dead entity. It's incapable of caring about anything, just as a rock or a piece of paper are. It's the humans that work at, or own, the company that are capable of such thoughts. And they do what they do for a wide variety of reasons. Some just for money, most of them for several other reasons.

People tend to believe in the most cynical description, but it's rarely the most accurate one ;)!

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 03:04 PM
Uhhh no...those who WORK, as in, the developers..actually put work into those games...years of work...to say that these guys do not care about THEIR work is a bit of a....stretch

I didn't say they don't care about their work because they clearly do. However, most of them, don't care about the whole assassin's creed idea (about the franchise itself), otherwise they wouldn't change the franchise's direction (that much) to appeal everyone turning it into a mix of flashy features that are only there to attract consumers, even if they don't have anything to do with the franchise, even if they overshadow the franchise...The core elements of the franchise haven't evolved much since the first game (not even going to talk about stealth) They also lied during their AC3 propaganda. Each game is all about introducing new features. They care so much about AC's original idea that they've abandoned Desmond's story in such a way that it's even sad. They wonder so far from the franchise's ideals. And now, for AC4 BF, they said that they were going to make a pirate game.

pacmanate
06-01-2013, 03:14 PM
I didn't say they don't care about their work because they clearly do. However, most of them, don't care about the whole assassin's creed idea (about the franchise itself), otherwise they wouldn't change the franchise's direction (that much) to appeal everyone turning it into a mix of flashy features that are only there to attract consumers, even if they don't have anything to do with the franchise, even if they overshadow the franchise...The core elements of the franchise haven't evolved much since the first game (not even going to talk about stealth) They also lied during their AC3 propaganda. Each game is all about introducing new features. They care so much about AC's original idea that they've abandoned Desmond's story in such a way that it's even sad. They wonder so far from the franchise's ideals. And now, for AC4 BF, they said that they were going to make a pirate game.

Did you even read?



1. Hardly know anything about the game, nothing about the story, we know Edward is a pirate.
2. AC:B was an extension and did alright. AC:R was a DS game turned Console, which was impressive. AC3, yes disappointing from a story and mission design view, but they can change that.
3. About Ubisoft.... I don't know what you mean by this one. They already said they want more investigations and more open ended designs like AC1. Ive said this many times, the fact that they are even ACKNOWLEDGING this is such a great thing for fans that though AC lost it after AC1.

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 04:00 PM
Did you even read?


They already said they want more investigations and more open ended designs like AC1. Ive said this many times, the fact that they are even ACKNOWLEDGING this is such a great thing for fans that though AC lost it after AC1.

They had to acknowledge that because of AC3's reception. Before that , however, they decided to do a pirate game (like they said) but, since many people complained about those aspects in AC3 they said what we wanted to hear (probably to make us pre-order/buy the game). The fact that the devs said the missions will be open ended and that they will encourage stealth in some occasions, means nothing, not just because they could be lying like AC3 devs, but also because the game is still being shown as a mindless action game made for every kind of player. The most likely cenario is that they just acknowledged this after AC3's reception which means that, if those aspects are present in AC4 BF, they'll be rushed additions to a pirate game. How is this good news? Sure, it would be worse if they didn't say a word about them but this is not enough after all the stunts pulled.

Assassin_M
06-01-2013, 04:05 PM
They had to acknowledge that because of AC3's reception. Before that , however, they decided to do a pirate game (like they said) but, since many people complained about those aspects in AC3 they said what we wanted to hear (probably to make us pre-order/buy the game). The fact that the devs said the missions will be open ended and that they will encourage stealth in some occasions, means nothing, not just because they could be lying like AC3 devs, but also because the game is still being shown as a mindless action game made for every kind of player. The most likely cenario is that they just acknowledged this after AC3's reception which means that, if those aspects are present in AC4 BF, they'll be rushed additions to a pirate game. How is this good news? Sure, it would be worse if they didn't say a word about them but this is not enough after all the stunts pulled.
so many baseless assumptions....my god

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 04:18 PM
so many baseless assumptions....my god

For those who do not know how to add 1 plus 1, the signs are only assumptions. Take the example of Abbas and do not repeat the same mistake.

Assassin_M
06-01-2013, 04:33 PM
For those who do not know how to add 1 plus 1, the signs are only assumptions. Take the example of Abbas and do not repeat the same mistake.
what?

pacmanate
06-01-2013, 04:39 PM
so many baseless assumptions....my god

Its making feel ******ed

Locopells
06-01-2013, 05:55 PM
Scabbers? Could be...but I won't assume anything without the full facts.

Nah, he was grey...

Mr_Shade
06-01-2013, 05:57 PM
Well I won't be buying it for myself.. I get it for free ;)


I will be recommending it to others though ;)

lothario-da-be
06-01-2013, 05:58 PM
Well I won't be buying it for myself.. I get it for free ;)


I will be recommending it to others though ;)
Do you gett all ubi games for free?

Mr_Shade
06-01-2013, 06:01 PM
Do you gett all ubi games for free?

Yeap - well the ones I want ;)

Part of the job playing games - it's REALLY tough.. ;)

Locopells
06-01-2013, 06:03 PM
How do I get your job?!

ProletariatPleb
06-01-2013, 06:11 PM
How do I get your job?!
Mug Yves, make him beg for mercy.

Oh and another method, become a gaming journalist and start podcasts. Get all Ubi people on it every time, keep doing it, if reviews come your way always make them positive, they'll hire you :p

Mr_Shade
06-01-2013, 06:13 PM
How do I get your job?!
Trust me - the free games don't make up for the hassle ;)


And, I suspect you would have to apply for it, after I leave? :P

montagemik
06-01-2013, 06:38 PM
It is. I explained there my view of the meaning of what we've seen so far and I discussed it, presenting my solution.






That's your response ^^^ ?? :rolleyes:...................Then you're clearly just trolling against a game you don't like ............Nothing else .

You claim you're just expressing your opinion & Why you think people shouldn't buy it ........& That's your only purpose in this thread.
So i asked you = ""Then shouldn't your 'original post' BE the full extent of your views & discussion on this subject ?

The correct answer was YES - if pointing out your reasons why people shouldn't buy it is your only intention in this thread .....
Those reasons should be in your 1st post ,....... You have no reason to keep restating your opinion to anyone who disagrees . YOU Already explained your view .........................
As it is , you're just arguing against it for the sake of arguing against it .............


BTW - The AC series has been a guaranteed sales Hit since AC-2 / AC-B .............Most people who join the official forum have been aware of this for years - So i'm not sure who you're trying to enlighten with the Greedy corporation angle .
Doesn't matter if you show Ubisoft you don't want a Pirate game .............Ubisoft will make whatever kind of AC game they choose , with or without your support .
The franchise can survive with only Half the current sales & customers.
So you either play or don't .............Your personal choice only matters to you , Not the rest of the community & Not Ubisoft .

(No need to respond - your 1st post already covers the only things you're here to point out ;) )

AssassinHMS
06-01-2013, 07:14 PM
That's your response ^^^ ?? :rolleyes:...................Then you're clearly just trolling against a game you don't like ............Nothing else .

You claim you're just expressing your opinion & Why you think people shouldn't buy it ........& That's your only purpose in this thread.
So i asked you = ""Then shouldn't your 'original post' BE the full extent of your views & discussion on this subject ?

Look I have no idea what we're talking about anymore but my objective was to point out what is happening to the franchise, why, and my idea to stop it and help the series get back on track.



Those reasons should be in your 1st post ,....... You have no reason to keep restating your opinion to anyone who disagrees . YOU Already explained your view .........................
As it is , you're just arguing against it for the sake of arguing against it .............

I guess you're right. I thought they didn't read everything I said or didn't understand my point, so I tried to explain it in a different way. Now I see I shouldn't have lost my time answering those who said I was forcing an opinion, harassing (really? ahahah) everyone or bashing my posts for the sake of bashing them.



(No need to respond - your 1st post already covers the only things you're here to point out ;) )
You're right again. Thanks :)

GreySkellig
06-01-2013, 07:19 PM
@AssassinHMS

I mean no disrespect--you have your opinion and you're entitled to it. Do I think it's baseless? Yes. Is it a commentary on your opinion that even master cynic M thinks you're out on a limb? Yup. But that doesn't matter, it's your right to express your views. And if all you were doing was expressing your opinion in a straightforward way, that's be totally cool by me. But that's not what you're doing, you're repeatedly bashing all comers over the head with your dislike of a yet-unreleased game--and not only on this thread (which you did create for the purpose) but on other threads as well. You keep bringing up the same argument. Well, that's your choice, but could you at least limit your concerns over ACIV to one thread, so that I don't open every thread thinking "Is this going to be the same comment war again?"

This isn't about whether I agree with you, it's just about promoting productive discussion around here.

Locopells
06-01-2013, 07:33 PM
Trust me - the free games don't make up for the hassle ;)

And, I suspect you would have to apply for it, after I leave? :P

Looks like a job for an Assassin, 'evil laugh'...

Dangerzone50
06-01-2013, 10:37 PM
Well i know a lot of folks will be passing up Ac4 when they have been loyal fans of the franchise since its beginning, I was on the fence about my pre-order for the longest time before i cancelled it... Too many things they did with AC3 and liberation left a sour taste in my mouth, and so far none of the hype they have shown about AC4 has proved that they are back on track or revived any of that former fan-boy in me.

being passed up once again for the collectors edition was the final nail in the coffin... ill give my money to a developer who is offering an actual complete collectors edition and not worried about having an exclusive deal with every retailer in NA (specifically I pre-ordered the GTAV collectors edition instead)

montagemik
06-02-2013, 10:35 AM
Well i know a lot of folks will be passing up Ac4 when they have been loyal fans of the franchise since its beginning, I was on the fence about my pre-order for the longest time before i cancelled it... Too many things they did with AC3 and liberation left a sour taste in my mouth, and so far none of the hype they have shown about AC4 has proved that they are back on track or revived any of that former fan-boy in me.

being passed up once again for the collectors edition was the final nail in the coffin... ill give my money to a developer who is offering an actual complete collectors edition and not worried about having an exclusive deal with every retailer in NA (specifically I pre-ordered the GTAV collectors edition instead)


Have Ubisoft confirmed NA isn't getting ANY Ubi-shop collector editions for AC-4 yet ?
Has the game been released for sale in stores already in NA ?

Nope .

Whatever i feel for a game - my decision to buy 'the game' is Never determined by the number of collectibles available to buy .
If i see no pre-order /collectible content that interests me 'before' the game goes on sale - I Don't pre-order that game .

I know 6 people not buying AC-4 on my friend list (who are longstanding AC fans ) , But that's more to do with them splurging on Next gen or other 'real world' reasons. Nothing to do with the game itself.

silverASSASSIN79
06-03-2013, 03:49 AM
This thread is just going in a back and forth argument between buying the game and not buying it. Seriously guys. This got from a statement about the game to a full blown fight. -_-

silverASSASSIN79
06-03-2013, 05:50 AM
I think you`re mistaking ACB and AC II for AC I...

AC II and ACB had you instantly desynced if you`re detected...if a missions`s set path is NOT to be detected..most were like that...AC I was the only game were you REALLY had a choice

For some missions but other than that you are compeletly correct.

monsenor
06-03-2013, 07:00 AM
At first I felt sort of disconnected because of the character. The Director did a TERRIBLE job explaining why Edward is an assassin.
He said, "He meets up with assassins, and they train him, for their reasons..."
WAT
But the gameplay looks amazing, even though blowing up ships is not real stealthy.

roostersrule2
06-03-2013, 07:02 AM
At first I felt sort of disconnected because of the character. The Director did a TERRIBLE job explaining why Edward is an assassin.
He said, "He meets up with assassins, and they train him, for their reasons..."
WAT
But the gameplay looks amazing, even though blowing up ships is not real stealthy.Ah he's probably leaving the explanation for the game.

Assassin_M
06-03-2013, 07:04 AM
Ah he's probably leaving the explanation for the game.
How dare he do that?? Might as well tell us the ending

MasterAssasin84
06-03-2013, 03:10 PM
OP

why not wait and till E3 ? or better still reserve judgement till you have played it .

silverASSASSIN79
06-04-2013, 02:46 AM
Hate it when they put hype on a game. The suspense kills me.

A.R.T.H
06-04-2013, 07:17 AM
Change is the way of life and so it is for games
i strongly disagree with you on all the points you have stated
In assassin Creed I we were pupil so we followed orders and investigated and pick-pocketed
from assassin creed II, we had different sources on gathering info on assassination targets
then Ezio turned in to a master, Recruited assassin's and all then in Rev. our den masters did the investigation
anyway the point is assassin creed changed and it was for good
no one would like same repetitive game-play over and over again in every game
that would be robbing, without any innovative idea's
don't just criticize games based on a hollow argument
i really liked all assassin creed games and the way they changed, innovated, gave us something new to do each an every time

warner4692
06-04-2013, 07:30 PM
My assumption was that your replies were about the things I suggested. But it seems you just choosed some related topics, that weren't all that relevant to what I said, and discussed them instead. It's actually not as simple to follow as you might think. Well anyway, now I'm really done, adios!

My replies WERE about the topics you brought up. You recommended to me that I find a critic whose reviews I trust, and I responded by telling you that... quite honestly... there are NO critics' reviews that I trust.

As I said, simple.


@warner4692 now all you are doing is bashing the company. Companies can only cater to so much people without receiving some form of negative feedback by the people that weren't happy with what they got. I was happy with AC 3 at first but it got old and didn't have much replay value for me. The only games I like in the franchise now are ACB and AC2. Those games really were the best for me. Brotherhood had you climb a giant castle, 2 had you infiltrate the Vatican and passing the gaurds with close to no blend groups to work with (though the groups would flee as soon as they saw a body. But the best bit about all of the games is that you can CHOOSE to play stealthy or rush in like a crazy decapitated chicken and kill everyone in sight.

You're right, dude - companies can't please absolutely everyone.

But, as I've previously stated, Ubisoft could be trying harder. A LOT harder to avoid making such blatant, obvious mistakes with the franchise.

It's not as if Ubisoft are merely making a misstep or two, here and there.

They're pretty much destroying the whole series.

And it's not like the mistakes they're making are easy-to-miss ones, either. They're HUGE, and they're as basic as the alphabet is.

MasterAssasin84
06-04-2013, 07:32 PM
Here we go again !!

silverASSASSIN79
06-05-2013, 02:44 AM
Change is the way of life and so it is for games
i strongly disagree with you on all the points you have stated
In assassin Creed I we were pupil so we followed orders and investigated and pick-pocketed
from assassin creed II, we had different sources on gathering info on assassination targets
then Ezio turned in to a master, Recruited assassin's and all then in Rev. our den masters did the investigation
anyway the point is assassin creed changed and it was for good
no one would like same repetitive game-play over and over again in every game
that would be robbing, without any innovative idea's
don't just criticize games based on a hollow argument
i really liked all assassin creed games and the way they changed, innovated, gave us something new to do each an every time

True and a lot of people did like the changes. But it comes back to my other post. Some didn't like those changes and bashed ubi for it.

nekitbro1234567
06-05-2013, 04:52 AM
I apologize in advance for the extensive text…

Assassin’s Creed, as a franchise, has taken the most and the biggest changes I’ve seen in a long time. From gameplay to story this series has been given a great number of personalities. But did it get any better? Due to the advances of technology and the increasing monetary power, technically speaking, the franchise has improved astonishingly. However, in terms of the game itself, it became soulless, faceless, nameless… What happened to the franchise?

The first assassin’s creed was sort of a test to see the potential of the series. It worked and from a simple, yet complex idea, the developers built upon it turning it into a more commercial experience. The bits that were considered boring or unnecessary (like pickpocket, eavesdropping and planning an assassination) were cut off or changed in order to ease their presence allowing the developers to work on other features (considered more important). On the other hand, the most praised factors of AC1 were expanded and developed such as the open world filled with viewpoints to show off the verticality and the detailed cities. And so AC2 was made. It was set to be an appealing experience both for players who just wanted to have some fun playing the game (who didn’t care about planning assassinations, who found the job of an assassin to be boring, who wanted to try out many swords and daggers but that didn’t feel the need for a sheath…) and for those who cared about the franchise (about the story, about assassinating, about the creed…). It had linear missions, a beautiful world but also codex pages containing interesting information about Altair and assassination missions. And it SOLD!

From then on the strategy hasn’t really changed and with AC3, the most commercial game we had so far, Ubisoft had already given up on the assassin’s creed initial idea and only used its name as a bait to lure those who were still hoping for an assassin’s creed game like the first one. Again, AC3 sold and Ubisoft’s strategy was proven successful.
And now we come upon AC4 Black Flag, another product of the same strategy used before. Don’t have second thoughts; AC4 BF is a pirate game. Not only that, but it is an action packed adventure again with the praised factors of AC1 (a rich, huge open world and an interesting historical setting) but also without the things that once made this series unique. While it’s true the game won’t come out until October, we have already seen the trailers and even gameplay footages. And all of them point to the same conclusion: lots of explosions and ships but only one assassination in order to “earn” the name of AC.
Every installment the franchise loses a part of itself that ends up being replaced by new ambitious features. Every year the franchise becomes less about itself and more about everything else. However this process can be reverted, we can still have an AC game about AC. Ubisoft listens to money. They listened to the consumer’s reaction after AC1 and worked on their own solution, AC2. We are the consumers; we have the money; they listen to our money which means they have to listen to us. If we want to have a proper Assassin’s Creed game that focus on the core pillars and that brings back the feeling of the franchise, we have to show them we do not want them to turn AC into a pop game, into a casual game. We have to make them understand that we do not care about ambitious features that overshadow the franchise, that what we care about is the franchise. How? By not buying AC4 BF.

It’s that simple: if Ubisoft doesn’t get the money their predictions assumed, they’ll have to readjust their strategy; they’ll have appeal to us by showing us what we want to see.
That is why I hereby vow not to buy AC4 BF.
Do not buy or preorder AC4 Black Flag. It’s most definitely nothing more than an ok game to spend a few hours with. And by ignoring the explosions in the trailers and remaining skeptical towards the promises the devs make we can have our AC game. Also, for those who have seen AC3’s propaganda and still believe the developers and for those who know how boring it can be to roam an empty world and yet are eager to explore AC4’s world I say that they should know better by now.


So I ask you:
Do you rather have some fun now with an ok game or ignore the bait and have 100 times more fun with a real AC game?
Do you rather ignore Black Flag for the sake of the franchise or ignore the franchise for the sake of having fun (if even that)?
Are you willing do this or is it too much to ask in the name of Assassin’s Creed?


I like the part where you make no mention of all the bugs and flat out broken DLC releases.\ where they never solve it.. Remember the music bug that took 12 years to fix.. and it was the community, not UBI, that ultimately found a fix in some brazilian file. I still can't play the DLC past that stupid wolf bait mission. I can't even finish the dam game because of it. Why should I consider buying something from them even if I love the story?

roostersrule2
06-05-2013, 04:56 AM
I like the part where you make no mention of all the bugs and flat out broken DLC releases.\ where they never solve it.. Remember the music bug that took 12 years to fix.. and it was the community, not UBI, that ultimately found a fix in some brazilian file. I still can't play the DLC past that stupid wolf bait mission. I can't even finish the dam game because of it. Why should I consider buying something from them even if I love the story?Broken DLC? Ha it was meant to be in 3 episodes haha.

montagemik
06-05-2013, 08:32 AM
How dare he do that?? Might as well tell us the ending

He was heard muttering this on the way into the interview ( Honest ) :p

"" It's because Blackbeard is a Templar known by the Assassins to be searching the west indies for some artefact - The local Assassin's are crap at sailing , So recruit Edward ,who's becoming known/respected amongst other pirates .
The Assassin's & Blackbeard each allow Edward to do all the investigation/discovery /exploration - Ending in an epic swashbuckling face off when Blackbeard tries to steal the prize from Edward.
Our hero wins & claims the prize - which allows access to the greatest 1st civ temple of all time containing lollipops & lemon drops & the fountain of youth needed to re-animate the bodies of Juno ,Minerva & Desmond . (oh & there's a shiny sword & 1st civ hidden plasma blades in there too) though i don't wanna spoil things so don't quote me on this stuff "


:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :p

freddie_1897
06-05-2013, 07:11 PM
I'll buy whatever the hell i want.

AssassinHMS
06-05-2013, 09:43 PM
I'll buy whatever the hell i want.

Great, no one is stopping you.
Also what do you think about my thread?
Do you feel the franchise has gone downhill or that each game is better than the previous? Do you think the direction the series took is good (more explosions, bigger world full of emptiness, lots of useless weapons, big focus on naval and other implements, disregard for stealth and for assassinations, no mysteries or conspiracies, no creed, lots of action, quantity before quality…)?
Do you think the next game should go back to the assassin’s creed idea? You know, the goal of the game is for the player to gather information and assassinate targets for (what’s considered) the greater good, being a blade in the crowd, a game that encourages the player to use stealth and cunning rather than brute force (since an assassin is not a warrior and would probably lose against more than three enemies).
Did you notice that, since AC1, the developers have tried to appeal to a wider audience adding features that exist for the sake of appearing to be entertaining (increasing the sales) even if they don’t have anything to do with the franchise? And, while they were making that effort, they increasingly ignored and abandoned the elements that used to be pivotal to the series (stealth, assassinations, investigations, the atmosphere…) and focused instead on adding features (economy, hunting, naval…).
And what about the assassin feeling? Did you feel like an assassin in AC3, carrying many weapons (including a hidden blade that is pretty much just another tool instead of an assassin’s primary and most important weapon), acting like one man army killing thousands of redcoats, hiding in plain sight with a bow on your back, walking like a predator, protecting a village and herding pigs?
Do you care about feeling like an assassin when playing an “assassin’s creed game”?
Does it matter to you that Ubisoft turned Assassin’s Creed into a casual franchise to appeal casual gamers (who like explosions, Hollywood moments, naval battles, having fun while mindlessly murdering redcoats and think that the job of an assassin is boring) in order to increase sales?

If so, do you think my “wake-up call” would be enough for the devs to go back to the franchise’s roots?

MasterAssasin84
06-05-2013, 10:20 PM
Great, no one is stopping you.
Also what do you think about my thread?
Do you feel the franchise has gone downhill or that each game is better than the previous? Do you think the direction the series took is good (more explosions, bigger world full of emptiness, lots of useless weapons, big focus on naval and other implements, disregard for stealth and for assassinations, no mysteries or conspiracies, no creed, lots of action, quantity before quality…)?
Do you think the next game should go back to the assassin’s creed idea? You know, the goal of the game is for the player to gather information and assassinate targets for (what’s considered) the greater good, being a blade in the crowd, a game that encourages the player to use stealth and cunning rather than brute force (since an assassin is not a warrior and would probably lose against more than three enemies).
Did you notice that, since AC1, the developers have tried to appeal to a wider audience adding features that exist for the sake of appearing to be entertaining (increasing the sales) even if they don’t have anything to do with the franchise? And, while they were making that effort, they increasingly ignored and abandoned the elements that used to be pivotal to the series (stealth, assassinations, investigations, the atmosphere…) and focused instead on adding features (economy, hunting, naval…).
And what about the assassin feeling? Did you feel like an assassin in AC3, carrying many weapons (including a hidden blade that is pretty much just another tool instead of an assassin’s primary and most important weapon), acting like one man army killing thousands of redcoats, hiding in plain sight with a bow on your back, walking like a predator, protecting a village and herding pigs?
Do you care about feeling like an assassin when playing an “assassin’s creed game”?
Does it matter to you that Ubisoft turned Assassin’s Creed into a casual franchise to appeal casual gamers (who like explosions, Hollywood moments, naval battles, having fun while mindlessly murdering redcoats and think that the job of an assassin is boring) in order to increase sales?

If so, do you think my “wake-up call” would be enough for the devs to go back to the franchise’s roots?

Ubi are trying new things simple ! AC3 they took a bold creative decision which in my opinion was brave one that worked . the series has to evolve and as much as i love AC1 i would get pretty pissed of and bored with the franchise if every Assassins creed game was developed on the basis of the first game.

For you to say do not buy Black Flag is a pretty shallow thing to say as there are fans on here including myself who are looking forward to this game and secondly you have not even played the game, no one is asking you to buy the game if thats the way you feel !

AssassinHMS
06-05-2013, 10:36 PM
Ubi are trying new things simple ! AC3 they took a bold creative decision which in my opinion was brave one that worked . the series has to evolve and as much as i love AC1 i would get pretty pissed of and bored with the franchise if every Assassins creed game was developed on the basis of the first game.


New things? Like other franchises? "OK who feels like doing a pirate game with AC as the title so that it sells better?" (like the devs said, they knew from the start they were going to do a pirate game) "What about making a game about the american revolution where you play as a super soldier that kills redcoats and people (who happen to be templars) for the sake of his village plus naval battles?"
I'm ok for innovation as long as they don't turn AC into another franchise and as long as they respect the original idea. What their doing is nothing like that.



For you to say do not buy Black Flag is a pretty shallow thing to say as there are fans on here including myself who are looking forward to this game and secondly you have not even played the game, no one is asking you to buy the game if thats the way you feel !

You still don't get the purpose of this thread. It's not about AC4 BF, it's about the series as a whole. The devs already stated the direction they want to take, so waiting for AC4 BF will only show if the pirate game has assassin's creed elements or not.

Mr_Shade
06-05-2013, 10:38 PM
You still don't get the purpose of this thread. It's not about AC4 BF, it's about the series as a whole. The devs already stated the direction they want to take, so waiting for AC4 BF will only show if the pirate game has assassin's creed elements or not.Which in turn will show the direction they are going?

They have also said they want to go back to some of the core values found in AC1, like investigations etc etc


So, until you know what happens in ACIV - you can't really complain about the series as a whole?

pacmanate
06-05-2013, 10:40 PM
You still don't get the purpose of this thread. It's not about AC4 BF, it's about the series as a whole. The devs already stated the direction they want to take, so waiting for AC4 BF will only show if the pirate game has assassin's creed elements or not.


Which none of us know yet. Not us, not you.

MasterAssasin84
06-05-2013, 10:47 PM
New things? Like other franchises? "OK who feels like doing a pirate game with AC as the title so that it sells better?" (like the devs said, they knew from the start they were going to do a pirate game) "What about making a game about the american revolution where you play as a super soldier that kills redcoats and people (who happen to be templars) for the sake of his village plus naval battles?"
I'm ok for innovation as long as they don't turn AC into another franchise and as long as they respect the original idea. What their doing is nothing like that.




You still don't get the purpose of this thread. It's not about AC4 BF, it's about the series as a whole. The devs already stated the direction they want to take, so waiting for AC4 BF will only show if the pirate game has assassin's creed elements or not.

then I would recommend you change the title of this thread because its making no sense to me , you have started off by saying don't by black flag then go on by saying its feedback for ubi to make them aware that tour valid opinion is the series is going down the toilet .


The devs has already stated that from a tonne of feedback from the fans that a pure Assassins Creed game is in high demand they have took taken the time to address these concerns.

this threads arguement is seriously invalid

Mr_Shade
06-05-2013, 10:49 PM
The devs has already stated that from a tonne of feedback from the fans that a pure Assassins Creed game is in high demand they have took taken the time to address these concerns.

Indeed.

While I am all for feedback etc - sometimes it's better to wait and see - before jumping to assumptions and slating the series..

;)

AssassinHMS
06-05-2013, 10:50 PM
Which in turn will show the direction they are going?

No, the direction is the one they first set out for, which is, making a pirate game.



They have also said they want to go back to some of the core values found in AC1, like investigations etc etc

Yes, like I said, AC4 BF may have assassin's creed elements but in terms of core it's, as the devs said, a pirate game. And didn't AC3 devs said similar things about stealth etc etc and failed to stand by their word?



So, until you know what happens in ACIV - you can't really complain about the series as a whole?

And AC V isn't out yet, so, following your line of thought, we can never see the series as a whole...which is convenient for some.
Also, it's easy to see the direction the series took, and even though AC4 BF isn't out yet, the direction the devs took is quite obvious.

pacmanate
06-05-2013, 10:50 PM
Indeed.

While I am all for feedback etc - sometimes it's better to wait and see - before jumping to assumptions and slating the series..

;)

Giving feedback for a game we havent seen yet :P LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL pingu

MasterAssasin84
06-05-2013, 10:54 PM
No, the direction is the one they first set out for, which is, making a pirate game.




Yes, like I said, AC4 BF may have assassin's creed elements but in terms of core it's, as the devs said, a pirate game. And didn't AC3 devs said similar things about stealth etc etc and failed to stand by their word?




And AC V isn't out yet, so, following your line of thought, we can never see the series as a whole...which is convenient for some.
Also, it's easy to see the direction the series took, and even though AC4 BF isn't out yet, the direction the devs took is quite obvious.


ok well don't buy the game ! as Shade and Pacmante said to give feed back on a game you have never played is an opinion based on bad fact.

MasterAssasin84
06-05-2013, 10:57 PM
Indeed.

While I am all for feedback etc - sometimes it's better to wait and see - before jumping to assumptions and slating the series..

;)


Exactly .. to aptly title a thread don't buy black flag and imediately proclaim to be general feed back thread which in turn spouts negative feedback is in someways biased !

AssassinHMS
06-05-2013, 11:06 PM
Exactly .. to aptly title a thread don't buy black flag and imediately proclaim to be general feed back thread which in turn spouts negative feedback is in someways biased !

You're really slow... "Do not buy Black Flag" is the title because it's my answer to the problem at hand. The thread is mainly about the problem in case you haven't read it yet and it's not my fault that you have a problem with my answer when you don't even think about the problem.


And Mr_Shade, what is the feedback that I gave in my previous comment about AC4 BF?

warner4692
06-05-2013, 11:09 PM
Which in turn will show the direction they are going?

They have also said they want to go back to some of the core values found in AC1, like investigations etc etc


So, until you know what happens in ACIV - you can't really complain about the series as a whole?

Not necessarily. Each AC game thus far has demonstrated a direction, but it rarely lasts.

They've made promises and failed to live up to them more times than not since ACB. And the sad thing is, this franchise is only a little over five years old.

That's... stupid. There's five whole main games (and numerous other spin-offs, if you really want to get into all that) games, presently.

A person doesn't have to play ACIV to not like the general direction of the franchise at its current point.


then I would recommend you change the title of this thread because its making no sense to me , you have started off by saying don't by black flag then go on by saying its feedback for ubi to make them aware that tour valid opinion is the series is going down the toilet .


The devs has already stated that from a tonne of feedback from the fans that a pure Assassins Creed game is in high demand they have took taken the time to address these concerns.

this threads arguement is seriously invalid

Again, the devs have said several things. Usually and unfortunately... nothing comes of it.


ok well don't buy the game ! as Shade and Pacmante said to give feed back on a game you have never played is an opinion based on bad fact.

The word "fact" doesn't apply to video games.

It is all 100% about opinions.

pacmanate
06-05-2013, 11:12 PM
The word "fact" doesn't apply to video games.

It is all 100% about opinions.

Well does it matter? What I said still stands, he hasn't seen the game.

MasterAssasin84
06-05-2013, 11:15 PM
You're really slow... "Do not buy Black Flag" is the title because it's my answer to the problem at hand. The thread is mainly about the problem in case you haven't read it yet and it's not my fault that you have a problem with my answer when you don't even think about the problem.


And Mr_Shade, what is the feedback that I gave in my previous comment about AC4 BF?

What so people on here assumed that naming a thread don't buy black flag is your way of getting a point across to ubi that they are ruining the series ! if sounded like to me that you was slating ACBF because you don't like the pirate theme which is fine because its your opinion. but your judging a game before you have even played it, I've seen this from different people own here AC is going down the pan because ubi have failed to produce a game that was like AC1, AC1 did set the benchmark I agree but it's like your finding fault with a game that's not even out yet .

MasterAssasin84
06-05-2013, 11:17 PM
Not necessarily. Each AC game thus far has demonstrated a direction, but it rarely lasts.

They've made promises and failed to live up to them more times than not since ACB. And the sad thing is, this franchise is only a little over five years old.

That's... stupid. There's five whole main games (and numerous other spin-offs, if you really want to get into all that) games, presently.

A person doesn't have to play ACIV to not like the general direction of the franchise at its current point.



Again, the devs have said several things. Usually and unfortunately... nothing comes of it.



The word "fact" doesn't apply to video games.

It is all 100% about opinions.


What giving feed back on a game that's not even out yet ? yeah makes a huge amount of sense

warner4692
06-05-2013, 11:19 PM
Well does it matter? What I said still stands, he hasn't seen the game.

True, but a successful argument could also be made that this is the sixth installment of the franchise.

And what's he's seen thus far, he doesn't like. Neither do I.

I'm still going to rent it and give it a shot, though. It may still be a good game (in its own right).

I'm just not very hopeful at this point.


What giving feed back on a game that's not even out yet ? yeah makes a huge amount of sense

Giving feedback on what we HAVE seen of the game so far DOES make sense, though.

That is... after all... the very reason game publishers and developers do trailers, previews, and interviews.

I don't know necessarily if that's what he was doing, though. I think he was just expressing his general distaste for the road the franchise has turned down.

AssassinHMS
06-05-2013, 11:24 PM
What so people on here assumed that naming a thread don't buy black flag is your way of getting a point across to ubi that they are ruining the series ! if sounded like to me that you was slating ACBF because you don't like the pirate theme which is fine because its your opinion. but your judging a game before you have even played it, I've seen this from different people own here AC is going down the pan because ubi have failed to produce a game that was like AC1, AC1 did set the benchmark I agree but it's like your finding fault with a game that's not even out yet .

When I reply to a thread I read the original post, not just the title so that I know 100% what we're talking about.
I'm not speculating, I didn't say AC4 BF is bad or good, that it has or hasn't AC elements. What I said is that it is a pirate game (like the devs said) and that it has a lot of explosions and naval battles (as shown in every trailer). So, like I said before, AC4 BF migh (possibly) turn out a good pirate game with AC elements but that doesn't change the direction the series has taken (AC4 BF included), the audience that is mainly being targeted for, and the fact that it is a pirate game. Now I'd rather if we talked about the series, as a whole (since that is my main point with the thread).

bigjohn9397
06-06-2013, 10:14 AM
It's obvious. The OP is clearly a Templar member trying to keep us from playing the next installment of the series.

Rockpixel
06-06-2013, 10:42 AM
Still buying it :p

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 10:46 AM
When I reply to a thread I read the original post, not just the title so that I know 100% what we're talking about.
I'm not speculating, I didn't say AC4 BF is bad or good, that it has or hasn't AC elements. What I said is that it is a pirate game (like the devs said) and that it has a lot of explosions and naval battles (as shown in every trailer). So, like I said before, AC4 BF migh (possibly) turn out a good pirate game with AC elements but that doesn't change the direction the series has taken (AC4 BF included), the audience that is mainly being targeted for, and the fact that it is a pirate game. Now I'd rather if we talked about the series, as a whole (since that is my main point with the thread).


But they said so they are bringing back AC1 elements, I have said this so many times. You are basing things on what you have seen, and the past of the franchise.

What about the stuff you HAVENT seen?

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 11:07 AM
True, but a successful argument could also be made that this is the sixth installment of the franchise.

And what's he's seen thus far, he doesn't like. Neither do I.

I'm still going to rent it and give it a shot, though. It may still be a good game (in its own right).

I'm just not very hopeful at this point.



Giving feedback on what we HAVE seen of the game so far DOES make sense, though.

That is... after all... the very reason game publishers and developers do trailers, previews, and interviews.

I don't know necessarily if that's what he was doing, though. I think he was just expressing his general distaste for the road the franchise has turned down.

Giving feedback on trailor and giving feedback on a game is 2 completely different things.. i would not be so ignorant to completely slate a game based on a few early screens that have been launched which is why developers stipulate that what we are seeing is not representitive of the final game, lets not forget black flag is still 6 months away so plenty of time to polish the game up.

AC3 was slated by many fans because the lack of stealth and some players felt it was not polished enough which is why ubi released a survey based on most feedback that was given here in the forums as the Assassins Creed team do read the comments that is posted on here. i have seen interviews with most of the Black Flag development teams and production managers and the concerns that Assassins Creed was drawing from its stealth roots was something that has been addressed by ubi as the comments was and i quote a comment from ubi gabe at Pax was " this is going to be a pure Assassins Creed game " and Ashraf and Darby have said on quite a few occasions that Black Flag is going to focus on stealth more than AC3.

Wether or not one is excited about the game or not you cant use a few Tiltle reveals to openly slate the series. Atleast wait untill you have played the game before giving an opinion, action packed trailors appeal to the wider audience so ubi are clearly trying to blance the gameplay experience to please both types of gamer.

The developers have said so many times that ACBF is going back to AC1's stealth roots !

The trailor below at 1.55 shows an example of stealth


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dx363aZL4A

Again more stealth gamplay shown below

1.06 ( Edward stalking enemies from the canopies of the Jungle to line up for a stealth Kill )
1.01 ( Edward closing in on an unsuspecting Templar or Soldier in )
1.12 ( Edward stalking the enemies through a sugar plantatio )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT0VWhyEXX0

So lets look at the concept - Assassins Pirates Kings Templars ! i would say this is an ideal concept of an Assassins Creed game.

Here is a comment from Ashraf Ismail

"And the stealth itself, they were outlaws, they needed to be hidden, even when they plundered certain ships."

AssassinHMS
06-06-2013, 11:10 AM
It's obvious. The OP is clearly a Templar member trying to keep us from playing the next installment of the series.

That would be strange since Abstergo are the ones who want the player to get in the animus and mainly play the game.
Besides, a real Templar doesn’t care if you play a pirate game and suffer from the bleeding effect allowing you to sail through the Atlantic.
By the way, did you read my original post where I show the direction the series took and talk about my solution?



But they said so they are bringing back AC1 elements, I have said this so many times. You are basing things on what you have seen, and the past of the franchise.

What about the stuff you HAVENT seen?

What is left to see are AC elements that the game may or may not have. This has nothing to do with the direction the series took. AC4 BF was made to be a pirate game and that is the problem. Nowadays, every assassin’s creed game is made to be a different game (about something else other than assassins) with only some AC elements to “earn” the title. AC3 was not made to be an assassin’s creed game and it didn’t have enough assassins’ creed elements to cover it up. AC4 BF may have AC elements to cover it up but that is the same, the franchise, assassin’s creed is just a second thought, a coat and not the core of the game. What I just said isn’t speculation, it is the reality, it is what the developers said and it’s what has been shown.
Just because AC devs say the game has AC elements means nothing. They were forced to include AC elements (because people complained about their lack in AC3 and because, after all, they are developing an AC game) but the game itself, the core of the game is the one of a pirate’s. Every year the franchise is less about itself and more about something else; having AC elements alone doesn’t change that. Explosions, ships, “pirate game”, “fight like a devil dressed as a man”; this is what shows the direction of the series. If anything, AC4 BF should have been an assassin’s creed game with pirate elements but never the opposite.

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 11:16 AM
What is left to see are AC elements that the game may or may not have. This has nothing to do with the direction the series took. AC4 BF was made to be a pirate game and that is the problem. Nowadays, every assassin’s creed game is made to be a different game (about something else other than assassins) with only some AC elements to “earn” the title. What I just said isn’t speculation, it is the reality, it is what the developers said and it’s what has been shown.
Just because AC devs say the game has AC elements means nothing. They were forced to include AC elements (because people complained about their lack in AC3 and because, after all, they are developing an AC game) but the game itself, the core of the game is the one of a pirate’s. Every year the franchise is less about itself and more about something else; having AC elements alone doesn’t change that. Explosions, ships, “pirate game”, “fight like a devil dressed as a man”; this is what shows the direction of the series. If anything, AC4 BF should have been an assassin’s creed game with pirate elements but never the opposite.

Firstly, yes it was made to be a pirate game, but a pirate game under the Assassin's Creed franchise. They have already said that the Brotherhood has a stronger presence in this game.
Secondly, what you said is speculation, as you are speculating what the next game will be like based on past opinions.
Thirdly, the core of the game is pirates, because that is the era they are showcasing. Whats the point going to the golden age of piracy if you cannot be a pirate.

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 11:25 AM
Firstly, yes it was made to be a pirate game, but a pirate game under the Assassin's Creed franchise. They have already said that the Brotherhood has a stronger presence in this game.
Secondly, what you said is speculation, as you are speculating what the next game will be like based on past opinions.
Thirdly, the core of the game is pirates, because that is the era they are showcasing. Whats the point going to the golden age of piracy if you cannot be a pirate.

Piates Assassins Kings and Templars ! i could not want anything more from an AC game to be honest !

AssassinHMS
06-06-2013, 11:30 AM
Firstly, yes it was made to be a pirate game, but a pirate game under the Assassin's Creed franchise. They have already said that the Brotherhood has a stronger presence in this game.

A pirate game never the less and, like I explained before, that is the problem. And it's under the Assassin's Creed franchise for the sole purpose of selling.



Secondly, what you said is speculation, as you are speculating what the next game will be like based on past opinions.

No it isn't speculation. I simply said what the devs already said (a pirate game) and it is true that AC games have been progressively more about something else other than assassins (just play the games and you'll see). So I'll say it again: This is not speculation because I'm not talking about things that are yet to be seen, but about things that have already been said and shown by the devs.


Thirdly, the core of the game is pirates, because that is the era they are showcasing. Whats the point going to the golden age of piracy if you cannot be a pirate.

Good point. Then why not make a real pirate game outside the AC franchise? Because they want to make a pirate game but also because they know that, if they name it Assassin's Creed, it will sell more. And that is the current use of this franchise: a carrier for other franchises, a way to make any game they want with the bonus of extra sales.

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 11:37 AM
You say things that devs have said, but what about thing everyone keeps saying! Here, read this article, I will highlight things for you.

Source: http://www.joystiq.com/2013/03/04/assassins-creed-4-black-flag-pushing-hard-for-more-assassina/

"Yes, we are a pirate game, and we advertise ourselves as a pirate game. It's even in our title," says Ashraf Ismail, Game Director at Ubisoft Montreal for Assassin's Creed 4: Black Flag. "But it's an Assassin's Creed game, and this is very important, because this is how we're able to build a pirate game. We have this really solid foundation that is the core and the heart of the experience. The story is about a guy who is an assassin and the conflict he goes through to become this guy. We actually have more assassinations than AC1 had."

Following a presentation at Ubi's offices in San Francisco, Ismail explains the "older philosophy" of Assassin's Creed as an important consideration for Black Flag, even if appearances suggest otherwise. "This is something we did learn, we do listen to our fans a lot," Ismail says. "We know that in AC3 there was a lot more handholding done, and we do want to go back to an older philosophy where we just present you with a simple objective and we let you choose the gameplay you want."

"At some point, people were asking us – do pirates in Assassin's [Creed] make sense?" says Ismail. "They're very different fantasies. But, actually, the gameplay mechanics of being an assassin completely fit in line with being a pirate. For example, navigation: well, pirates were sailors, and they climbed masts, and they were actually really great climbers, so that makes sense. Fighting? Well, they were melee fighters and used guns, and this is why Edward has four pistols. "And the stealth itself, they were outlaws, they needed to be hidden, even when they plundered certain ships."


See how they acknowledge everything down to "Do pirates make sense", to stealth, to AC1 feel, to more open ended missions?

silverASSASSIN79
06-06-2013, 11:45 AM
To be honest I really don't see the point in arguing about this game. It won't make Ubisoft change their game. It won't stop people from buying the game. And although you probably don't mean to hate on it, the way in which you say about going about this betrays your intentions. Stop fighting a pointless battle. And so what if you manage to get some people on your side. You are fighting a planet full of people that want to buy a game. The futility of this blabbering amazes me.

AssassinHMS
06-06-2013, 12:01 PM
You say things that devs have said, but what about thing everyone keeps saying! Here, read this article, I will highlight things for you.

Source: http://www.joystiq.com/2013/03/04/assassins-creed-4-black-flag-pushing-hard-for-more-assassina/

"Yes, we are a pirate game, and we advertise ourselves as a pirate game. It's even in our title," says Ashraf Ismail, Game Director at Ubisoft Montreal for Assassin's Creed 4: Black Flag. "But it's an Assassin's Creed game, and this is very important, because this is how we're able to build a pirate game. We have this really solid foundation that is the core and the heart of the experience. The story is about a guy who is an assassin and the conflict he goes through to become this guy. We actually have more assassinations than AC1 had."

So AC4 BF is a pirate game and an assassin's creed game? Two games in one, two franchises as one...hmm, we'll see how that plays out.


[/SIZE][/I][/B][/U]"At some point, people were asking us – do pirates in Assassin's [Creed] make sense?" says Ismail. "They're very different fantasies. But, actually, the gameplay mechanics of being an assassin completely fit in line with being a pirate. For example, navigation: well, pirates were sailors, and they climbed masts, and they were actually really great climbers, so that makes sense. Fighting? Well, they were melee fighters and used guns, and this is why Edward has four pistols. "And the stealth itself, they were outlaws, they needed to be hidden, even when they plundered certain ships."

This is just bollocks. An excuse to try to make assassins and pirates similar in terms of approach. This is not true. While assassins stalk their targets in shadows, eveasdrop, pickpoket and ocasionaly assassinate, pirates drink, fight, sail their ships, fight, murder, invade other ships, fight, search for gold and hunt. An assasin avoids fighting, an assassin is not a great fighter while a pirate usually is. A pirate is loud, notorious and answers provocations since they care about their image while an assassin is the opposite. A pirate and an assassin are two completely different things and this statement's goal is to trick people.


See how they acknowledge everything down to "Do pirates make sense", to stealth, to AC1 feel, to more open ended missions?

They have to acknowledge because they know they should be making an assassin's creed game with pirate elements and not a pirate game with assassin's creed elements. They say this because they know some people see what they are doing and don't want to play a pirate game. Their goal with this statement is to ease those people's minds with false statements like "in gameplay terms pirates and assassin's are the same" and say they want to go back to AC1's style when their goal is to make a pirate game.
Sorry but I don't trust them because their actions and their statements don't add up.

Farlander1991
06-06-2013, 12:16 PM
pirates drink, fight, sail their ships, fight, murder, invade other ships, fight, search for gold and hunt

You seem to have a very broad stereotypical view of pirates. Blackbeard, for example, tried to avoid as much fighting as possible. In fact, he used theatricality to strike fear and get what he needed without getting into a battle. Which is, btw, very similar to assassins' theatricality back in the day, in sense that they ON PURPOSE murdered their targets in broad daylight infront of everybody. While I don't think anybody can say that pirates absolutely equal assassins, the similarities that Ismail has listed are not as out of place as you think.

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 12:17 PM
They have to acknowledge because they know they should be making an assassin's creed game with pirate elements and not a pirate game with assassin's creed elements. They say this because they know some people see the truth and don't want to play a pirate game. Their goal with this statement is to ease those people's minds with false statements like "in gameplay terms pirates and assassin's are the same" and say they want to go back to AC1's style when their goal is to make a pirate game.
Sorry but I don't trust them because their actions and their statements don't add up.

So you solution is for people to dont buy the game so it gives ubi a wake up call as to they have been neglecting franchise from its prime roots ?

1 that is never going to happen because people are excited about this game ( well atleast the majority are )
2 its an Assassins Creed game with a pirate theme to it Edward Kenway is a Pirate trained by Assassins.

However you want to take this information is down to you but the fact remains it was stated from the begining that Assassins Creed 4 will be going to the AC1's stealth roots and in all honesty some of the trailors i have seen have shown more stealth than than the gameplay structure of AC3.

I dont know if you received the survey after AC3 was launched but the concerns about stealth was addressed from the response of these surveys Ismail Ashraf quoted saying we learned our Lesoon from previous AC games !

if you dont trust them thats fine no one is asking you to but atleast reserve judgement till you have played the game ! Like i said Giving feedback from a few trailors and giving feedback from an actual game are two completely different things and i dont see it as leverage to slate the whole series.

People are not gonna just not buy the game as form demonstration that some people feel the series has deteriated over the years thats just Riddiculous and especialy if we have not played the game.

AssassinHMS
06-06-2013, 12:19 PM
To be honest I really don't see the point in arguing about this game. It won't make Ubisoft change their game. It won't stop people from buying the game. And although you probably don't mean to hate on it, the way in which you say about going about this betrays your intentions.

I don't hate the game, like I said I'll probably have to make an effort to avoid buying it (even though there are many other games).

Stop fighting a pointless battle. And so what if you manage to get some people on your side. You are fighting a planet full of people that want to buy a game. The futility of this blabbering amazes me.

The assassins fight for a difficult cause too (freedom and/or peace). But as long as they don't give up, there is still a chance. If I learned anything about AC is that, endless wars can be worth fighting because, while fighting we achieve many things that, if it wasn't for that struggle, we would have never achieved.
I'm fighting for an assassin's creed game and I think it is worth it. If you think its futile then that is your problem.

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 01:09 PM
This thread is beyond useless.

montagemik
06-06-2013, 01:14 PM
A pirate game never the less and, like I explained before, that is the problem. And it's under the Assassin's Creed franchise for the sole purpose of selling........................................... .................................................. ....

No it isn't speculation. I simply said what the devs already said (a pirate game) and it is true that AC games have been progressively more about something else other than assassins (just play the games and you'll see). So I'll say it again: This is not speculation because I'm not talking about things that are yet to be seen, but about things that have already been said and shown by the devs.............................................. ...............................................

Good point. Then why not make a real pirate game outside the AC franchise? Because they want to make a pirate game but also because they know that, if they name it Assassin's Creed, it will sell more. And that is the current use of this franchise: a carrier for other franchises, a way to make any game they want with the bonus of extra sales.


You originally Bought AC-1 , soon announced to be the 1st in a Trilogy.

The series was obviously going to carry on past AC-3 (obvious since AC-1 for me & since AC-2 for many others)
The Devs have stated their intentions as a Franchise & outlined AC-4's direction .

So if any of this offends 'the original core' you began following since AC-1 ............ DITCH THE SERIES - That core trilogy idea is done with.

If you don't like the 'new direction' the franchise is headed towards .........DITCH THE SERIES - before having played or discovered the plot within AC-4 , your choice.

Can only imagine HOW POINTLESS it is to keep posting about a game i've Never played / Don't intend to play / Don't agree with for months before release & then probably Still keep discussing it months after it's released.
Actually kind of pathetic on the official forum of that game franchise.

Most logical reasoning behind this thread i can think is - TROLLING
Make an obviously controversial THREAD title ( ooooh 16+ pages - of people disagreeing with ya) - State all your reasons why you're out & what's wrong with the franchise ...................Then continue to hammer /repeat yourself against any response.

If you're only purpose is to point out the series flaws /loss of direction & why you are not buying it - Then you did that already.
Don't like how the series or any part of it went - is going - will go = JUST DITCH IT (read my signature), or copy paste your faults into a Feedback thread .

Just sounds like you're trolling the same lines , you seem more fixated on Pirates than the Developers TBH.

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 01:18 PM
They have to acknowledge because they know they should be making an assassin's creed game with pirate elements and not a pirate game with assassin's creed elements. They say this because they know some people see what they are doing and don't want to play a pirate game. Their goal with this statement is to ease those people's minds with false statements like "in gameplay terms pirates and assassin's are the same" and say they want to go back to AC1's style when their goal is to make a pirate game.
Sorry but I don't trust them because their actions and their statements don't add up.

Firstly, two games in one, two franchises in one doesnt make sense. A pirate life is not a franchise, you are now making things up.
Secondly, "A pirate trained by assassins". I expect the game to start out ruthless, then when Edward is recruited, he turns more stealthy like an Assassin. It makes sense.
Third, Yes, they say in gameplay terms pirates and assassins are the same, but that is a comparison. Yes they also they are returning to more AC1 style = Freedom. That goes down to mission design.

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 01:32 PM
Firstly, two games in one, two franchises in one doesnt make sense. A pirate life is not a franchise, you are now making things up.
Secondly, "A pirate trained by assassins". I expect the game to start out ruthless, then when Edward is recruited, he turns more stealthy like an Assassin. It makes sense.
Third, Yes, they say in gameplay terms pirates and assassins are the same, but that is a comparison. Yes they also they are returning to more AC1 style = Freedom. That goes down to mission design.

I could not think of anything better than a Pirate trained by Assassins ! and the interesting aspect is seeing Edward handle the conflict between these two identities ! his alleigence is to his crew but he is dedicated to the Assassins Creed which is the polar opposite of what Pirates stand for .

He will go from this reckless brash brutal Pirate to a highly disciplined Assassin, what is also interesting is they both believe in absolute freedom which is the core agenda the only difference being is Pirates tend to worship riches and are quite happy flout the rules and do what ever it takes to achive this but as they say Nothing is true everything is permited ! and i think the Black Flag concept will reflect perfectly.

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 03:05 PM
I could not think of anything better than a Pirate trained by Assassins ! and the interesting aspect is seeing Edward handle the conflict between these two identities ! his alleigence is to his crew but he is dedicated to the Assassins Creed which is the polar opposite of what Pirates stand for .

He will go from this reckless brash brutal Pirate to a highly disciplined Assassin, what is also interesting is they both believe in absolute freedom which is the core agenda the only difference being is Pirates tend to worship riches and are quite happy flout the rules and do what ever it takes to achive this but as they say Nothing is true everything is permited ! and i think the Black Flag concept will reflect perfectly.

Thats why I find this AC intriguing, we have never had a character that doesn't start off as the polar opposite of the Creed. I think it leads for some interesting character development.

Billiam301
06-06-2013, 03:17 PM
The assassins fight for a difficult cause too (freedom and/or peace). But as long as they don't give up, there is still a chance. If I learned anything about AC is that, endless wars can be worth fighting because, while fighting we achieve many things that, if it wasn't for that struggle, we would have never achieved.
I'm fighting for an assassin's creed game and I think it is worth it. If you think its futile then that is your problem.

as if you're comparing posting annoying threads telling people to stop buying the game to the Assassin's cause xD mate, I don't think you're getting through to anyone, I think you should stop complaining and deal with it :)

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 03:23 PM
Thats why I find this AC intriguing, we have never had a character that doesn't start off as the polar opposite of the Creed. I think it leads for some interesting character development.

Nailed it ! Character development ! which is something i am anticipating we will see .

I cant really see the major complaint in all this rather than just trolling !

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 04:10 PM
Nailed it ! Character development ! which is something i am anticipating we will see .

I cant really see the major complaint in all this rather than just trolling !

Yup. The pirate lifestyle contrasts with the Assassin's a lot, they are have different ideologies. Seeing how these two merge will hopefully be amazing and I hope the transition for Edwards character is handled properly. As we know Edward loves money, whoring etc. What makes him turn this all down for the creed?

Tune in next time.

LOL jk but siriuslie I think it has the most potential out of every AC game. Combine that with the article I posted a page back and we should have a good base for the game. Now we just need those things in the game, matched with great mission design.

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 04:21 PM
Yup. The pirate lifestyle contrasts with the Assassin's a lot, they are have different ideologies. Seeing how these two merge will hopefully be amazing and I hope the transition for Edwards character is handled properly. As we know Edward loves money, whoring etc. What makes him turn this all down for the creed?

Tune in next time.

LOL jk but siriuslie I think it has the most potential out of every AC game. Combine that with the article I posted a page back and we should have a good base for the game. Now we just need those things in the game, matched with great mission design.

Bro this has the potential to be the best Assassins Creed ever made and Edward Kenway is gonna seriously rock not just from a playability point of view but from his personality and character.

Look at it from this point Assassins and Pirates both crave freedom and the belief that its every man and woman for themselves ! they are in control of the own destiny not being governed by undemocratic governments and autocrats that come from weath privlage ( As Edward so rightly put it ) The Pirates wanted to establish their own lawless republic in the Caribbean but the Templars operating within royal families and island goveners threaten to destry everything the Pirates have built so there is the anti hero element but in turn Edward is also setting the foundations for a better future were mankind can make his own decision and truly live free whilst fighting to preserve the Pirate code !

Kings Assassins Templars Pirates ! this could be the Assassins Creed we have been waiting for and especialy when the devs have stated so many times they will be going back to the stealth formular that made AC1 such a favorite .

Pacmanate i ask you can you see any fault there ?

Hans684
06-06-2013, 04:26 PM
You seem a bit paranoid(no offence) . When everyone says the Devs has said their learning from theire mistakes you turn it down as if it was a conspiresy. However when you say the Devs have said something everyone is wrong & it's to trik us to by the game.

Here are some cores of AC you have missed:

1. History. Well the golden age of piracy is a part of history. Naval battle is part of history to. Also the time period the games are sett in also detirmins the amount of stealt. That also makes pirates a part of AC since they are a part of history. Why can't Edward be a pirate and assassin. Pirate assassin? "History is our playground" ~ Ubisoft. Or do you want a game in the future with the mission design of AC1? Since history seems to be a less core then stealt to you.

2. Animus. The one thing that makes it possible to get to dose time periods.

3. Modern Story. It gives everything a reason. Instead of just playing a lot of time periods without any connection at all with diffrent story. The modern story also drives the series. It's also the reason for the yearly releases. Unless you want to play a game about saving the world from going under in 2012 in 2016.

4. The assassin vs templar war. The assassins are always going to hunt the templars either they are on ships in the Carribean of the Vatican in Italy. No matter the time period.

5. The Creed. The Creed is always in all the games. They don't need to say "Nothing is true, Everything is permitted" for it to make it an Assassin's Creed game. The same about stealth & action.
As an example Connor is the only ancestor of Desmond to not broken the creed. also just becouse the optional objectives tells you to go action paked, you don need to do it it's optional and is there for challenge and replay value.

By the way I'm ACsenior from the AC wiki. I highly recommend to read a bit at the wiki. It helps to uderstand the series a lot more. http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Assassin%27s_Creed_Wiki
I also recommend you to talk to Master Sima Yi if there is some thing you don't uderstand about AC series. Like its core.

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 04:34 PM
You seem a bit paranoid(no offence) . When everyone says the Devs has said their learning from theire mistakes you turn it down as if it was a conspiresy. However when you say the Devs have said something everyone is wrong.

Here are some cores of AC you have missed:

1. History. Well the golden age of piracy is a part of history. Naval battle is part of history to. Also the time period the games are sett in also detirmins the amount of stealt. That also makes pirates a part of AC since they are a part of history. Why can't Edward be a pirate and assassin. Pirate assassin? "History is our playground" ~ Ubisoft. Or do you want a game in the future with the mission design of AC1? Since history seems to be a less core then stealt to you.

2. Animus. The one thing that makes it possible to get to dose time periods.

3. Modern Story. It gives everything a reason. Instead of just playing a lot of time periods without any connection at all with diffrent story. The modern story also drives the series. It's also the reason for the yearly releases. Unless you want to play a game about saving the world from going under in 2012 in 2016.

4. The assassin vs templar war. The assassins are always going to hunt the templars either they are on ships in the Carribean of the Vatican in Italy. No matter the time period.

5. The Creed. The Creed is always in all the games. They don't need to say "Nothing is true, Everything is permitted" for it to make it an Assassin's Creed game. The same about stealth & action.
As an example Connor is the only ancestor of Desmond to not broken the creed. also just becouse the optional objectives tells you to go action paked, you don need to do it it's optional and is the for challenge and replay value.

By the way I'm ACsenior from the AC wiki. I highly recommend to read a bit at the wiki. It helps to uderstand the series a lot more. http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Assassin's_Creed_Wiki
I also recommend you to talk to Master Sima Yi if there is some thing you don't uderstand about AC series. Like its core.


Assassins and Templars have moved throughout History and have been present in most if not all major historical events that have taken place over the centuries, i think the problem with some fans is that they have become so fixated with Altair and his monk like appearence that its has instantly become just that thats how an Assassin must be reperesented wether its the crusade or the American Revolution, i had this argument wihen Assassins Creed 3 was announced " Connor aint an Assassins he looks nothing like one blah blah blah " but failing to take into consideration that the Assassin's robes and appearence had to be relevent to that time period, i mean Altair would look so out place in Boston during the revolution as would Connor in the Holy lands during the crusade.

Templars and Assassins are always going to be fighting eachother what ever era they are present !

By the way Assassins Creed wiki your doing a great job !

pacmanate
06-06-2013, 04:36 PM
You seem a bit paranoid

This LOL /thread :p

Hans684
06-06-2013, 06:07 PM
Assassins and Templars have moved throughout History and have been present in most if not all major historical events that have taken place over the centuries, i think the problem with some fans is that they have become so fixated with Altair and his monk like appearence that its has instantly become just that thats how an Assassin must be reperesented wether its the crusade or the American Revolution, i had this argument wihen Assassins Creed 3 was announced " Connor aint an Assassins he looks nothing like one blah blah blah " but failing to take into consideration that the Assassin's robes and appearence had to be relevent to that time period, i mean Altair would look so out place in Boston during the revolution as would Connor in the Holy lands during the crusade.

Templars and Assassins are always going to be fighting eachother what ever era they are present !



By the way Assassins Creed wiki your doing a great job !

Thanks, however i haven't done so much for the wiki. I only post news becouse i like to be updated myself. So i share it with the rest to the wiki to when i find something. Everyone should know what kind of game their buying.

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 06:16 PM
Thanks, however i haven't done so much for the wiki. I only post news becouse i like to be updated myself. So i share it with the rest to the wiki to when i find something. Everyone should know what kind of game their buying.

I should frequent Assassins Creed wiki more ! but hey welcome to the forums dude ! on topic Black Flag has huge potential to be the best AC made IMO

Hans684
06-06-2013, 06:29 PM
I should frequent Assassins Creed wiki more ! but hey welcome to the forums dude ! on topic Black Flag has huge potential to be the best AC made IMO

It does have a dangersly huge potential becouse the most people hated/disliked AC3/Connor story/gameplay. So Black Flag can either have dangersly low sales(damaging the series) or save it. Thanks for the good welcome :D

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2013/06/06/e3-2013-press-conferences-schedule-and-live-stream-locations.aspx. A gift from me, it showers when the Ubisoft press conference is.


Monday, June 10, 2013

Ubisoft Press Conference,*6 PM Eastern / 3 PM Pacific

MasterAssasin84
06-06-2013, 07:29 PM
It does have a dangersly huge potential becouse the most people hated/disliked AC3/Connor story/gameplay. So Black Flag can either have dangersly low sales(damaging the series) or save it. Thanks for the good welcome :D

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2013/06/06/e3-2013-press-conferences-schedule-and-live-stream-locations.aspx. A gift from me, it showers when the Ubisoft press conference is.


Monday, June 10, 2013

Ubisoft Press Conference,*6 PM Eastern / 3 PM Pacific


Ah yes i think ive seen this already ! thanks anyway though dude,

The interesting this about that is Ubi have already said that they are not expecting Black Flag to do as well as AC3 , wether they are covering their backs or simply being modest i dont know but from the recent interviews and webcasts with the dev team it certainly seems that this time around we can expect a good solid Assassins Creed game which is pure in its form ( that was worded by Ubi Gabe ) .

freddie_1897
06-06-2013, 07:43 PM
Great, no one is stopping you.
Also what do you think about my thread?
Do you feel the franchise has gone downhill or that each game is better than the previous? Do you think the direction the series took is good (more explosions, bigger world full of emptiness, lots of useless weapons, big focus on naval and other implements, disregard for stealth and for assassinations, no mysteries or conspiracies, no creed, lots of action, quantity before quality…)?
Do you think the next game should go back to the assassin’s creed idea? You know, the goal of the game is for the player to gather information and assassinate targets for (what’s considered) the greater good, being a blade in the crowd, a game that encourages the player to use stealth and cunning rather than brute force (since an assassin is not a warrior and would probably lose against more than three enemies).
Did you notice that, since AC1, the developers have tried to appeal to a wider audience adding features that exist for the sake of appearing to be entertaining (increasing the sales) even if they don’t have anything to do with the franchise? And, while they were making that effort, they increasingly ignored and abandoned the elements that used to be pivotal to the series (stealth, assassinations, investigations, the atmosphere…) and focused instead on adding features (economy, hunting, naval…).
And what about the assassin feeling? Did you feel like an assassin in AC3, carrying many weapons (including a hidden blade that is pretty much just another tool instead of an assassin’s primary and most important weapon), acting like one man army killing thousands of redcoats, hiding in plain sight with a bow on your back, walking like a predator, protecting a village and herding pigs?
Do you care about feeling like an assassin when playing an “assassin’s creed game”?
Does it matter to you that Ubisoft turned Assassin’s Creed into a casual franchise to appeal casual gamers (who like explosions, Hollywood moments, naval battles, having fun while mindlessly murdering redcoats and think that the job of an assassin is boring) in order to increase sales?

If so, do you think my “wake-up call” would be enough for the devs to go back to the franchise’s roots?

you seem to be basing your judgement on what you think AC4 will be like, but you, like the rest of us have almost no idea. allow me to elaborate, i understand what you are saying and yes i would prefer AC to go back to its better days, not to AC1, that game was repetitive, AC2 was my favourite, but i still really liked the others.

Now i also understand that your argument is not based on black flag but on the entire series, fair enough. You want the series to go back to it's good ol' days, however boycotting is not the answer.

Firstly there is the fact that asking a few people on the AC forums to boycott a multi-million selling game isn't going to do much difference, in fact you could have the sworn testimony of everyone on reddit agree to not buy it but even then it won't be enough. Realise this; A boycott will not solve your problems.

Then there is the seemingly age old argument that you have not played the game, so you can't judge. Again I acknowledge that this is a series thing. However you must realise that because you haven't played the game you do not know whether it actually makes the improvements you want it to, and if it becomes the AC you want to achieve thanks to a Boycott, do you see what i'm saying? The game could quite easily be the game you have wanted from Assassins creed since the first one.

Finally there is proof for the previous, in that the developers have acknowledged that fans want a return to the older games style, they are not simply saying this, or i mean they could just be saying this but that is unlikely since they want the game to sell, if they've realised what the majority of gamers want then why wouldn't they do that? especially when they've clarified this is what they're going to do. Why would they dig themselves a hole and not bring a ladder?

Hans684
06-06-2013, 07:45 PM
Ah yes i think ive seen this already ! thanks anyway though dude,

The interesting this about that is Ubi have already said that they are not expecting Black Flag to do as well as AC3 , wether they are covering their backs or simply being modest i dont know but from the recent interviews and webcasts with the dev team it certainly seems that this time around we can expect a good solid Assassins Creed game which is pure in its form ( that was worded by Ubi Gabe ) .

Got a point, however the pure AC is coming next year. http://news.softpedia.com/news/Assassin-s-Creed-4-Black-Flag-Sequel-Already-in-Development-at-Ubisoft-341213.shtml

The Toronto and Montreal studios of video game publisher Ubisoft are already working on a sequel to the upcoming Assassin’s Creed 4: Black Flag, which will presumably be launched on next-generation consoles during 2014.

The information comes from Jade Raymond, the leader of the Toronto studio, who told Polygon about the project, but failed to offer any details about it.

She stated, “The thing that’s great to me is that there is still some of my favorite people who, you know, we were in the trenches shipping that first one. We lived through all of that stuff together and some of those guys are still on the franchise and have been there.”

It’s unclear whether this new Assassin’s Creed title will continue the story told in Black Flag or whether the publisher is creating two parallel series based on the same universe, similar to what Activision has done with Call of Duty.

Black Flag will focus on naval combat, but it will also include important land-based exploration sections, set on Carribbean islands.

Raymond has also talked about other projects that will soon be announced, adding, “We have two big collaborations coming that we’re not talking about, on two of the biggest franchises at Ubisoft. We also have two new IP.”

warner4692
06-07-2013, 04:19 AM
It's obvious. The OP is clearly a Templar member trying to keep us from playing the next installment of the series.

Why? Technically, the protagonist of the next game is an Abstergo employee.


Giving feedback on trailor and giving feedback on a game is 2 completely different things.. i would not be so ignorant to completely slate a game based on a few early screens that have been launched which is why developers stipulate that what we are seeing is not representitive of the final game, lets not forget black flag is still 6 months away so plenty of time to polish the game up.

There's no way around this, dude. I can see you're really trying, but it just isn't there...

Sure, it may be a different thing to give feedback on a trailer versus a game, but there's also such a thing as simply not liking the way an upcoming installment in a continuing franchise looks.

And as I said, I'm not sure he was talking about just ACIV.

I think he was talking about the entire series.


AC3 was slated by many fans because the lack of stealth and some players felt it was not polished enough which is why ubi released a survey based on most feedback that was given here in the forums as the Assassins Creed team do read the comments that is posted on here. i have seen interviews with most of the Black Flag development teams and production managers and the concerns that Assassins Creed was drawing from its stealth roots was something that has been addressed by ubi as the comments was and i quote a comment from ubi gabe at Pax was " this is going to be a pure Assassins Creed game " and Ashraf and Darby have said on quite a few occasions that Black Flag is going to focus on stealth more than AC3.

There's more behind ACIII's fan-negative reaction than just the lack of stealth gameplay.

In fact, there's more to the general down grading of the entire SERIES than just the gameplay.

Do you believe everything the developers say? They might intend to make ACIV "a pure Assassin's Creed game", but that doesn't mean that it actually will be.

They could think that something will make for a good game, and then it turns out to be complete garbage. As I said, I'll be giving the game a try to find out for sure, but it doesn't look too good at this point.

In other words, just because the developers SAY something doesn't mean it's actually TRUE.


Wether or not one is excited about the game or not you cant use a few Tiltle reveals to openly slate the series. Atleast wait untill you have played the game before giving an opinion, action packed trailors appeal to the wider audience so ubi are clearly trying to blance the gameplay experience to please both types of gamer.

The developers have said so many times that ACBF is going back to AC1's stealth roots !

The trailor below at 1.55 shows an example of stealth

I've seen all the trailers. You're saying two different things, here, though.

On the one hand, you say the original poster's criticisms are invalid because he doesn't know anything about the actual game...

...but on the other hand, you're saying the game will be better and more stealthy based on nothing more than just the TRAILER.

Oh, right. And the word of the developers.

Which wouldn't be bad advice, usually. But Ubisoft have promised and failed to deliver many times before.

There's little to no reason to believe it should be any different this time.

Especially since this game is being handled by the team who did REVELATIONS.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dx363aZL4A

Again more stealth gamplay shown below

1.06 ( Edward stalking enemies from the canopies of the Jungle to line up for a stealth Kill )
1.01 ( Edward closing in on an unsuspecting Templar or Soldier in )
1.12 ( Edward stalking the enemies through a sugar plantatio )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT0VWhyEXX0

So lets look at the concept - Assassins Pirates Kings Templars ! i would say this is an ideal concept of an Assassins Creed game.

Here is a comment from Ashraf Ismail

"And the stealth itself, they were outlaws, they needed to be hidden, even when they plundered certain ships."

Pirates, as a conceptual decision for the Assassin's Creed series, are a... well, let's just use the word "questionable" to describe it.

Pirates aren't really the most natural fit for this franchise.

That doesn't mean they're bad... and it doesn't mean the game will automatically be terrible just because of it.

But ACIII has come under a lot of fan fire, and for a fair number of valid reasons. Reasons that go far beyond just the lack of stealth gameplay.

The story's gotten weaker (to put it mildly). The graphics have. The music. The entire franchise has just lost so much of the resonance that once made it so compelling and unique.

It feels like a generic, M-rated killing game, now.

If I were Ubisoft, I don't think I'd be taking a chance like this, at the moment.

Pirates just makes it feel like they're either...

...A) following a strict, pre-planned course of action or...

...B) just cramming things in, hoping something will work and stick.

Either way, this just isn't as good as it used to be.

And again, not just a LITTLE not-as-good. A LOT not-as-good.

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 04:46 AM
You're saying two different things, here, though.

On the one hand, you say the original poster's criticisms are invalid because he doesn't know anything about the actual game...

...but on the other hand, you're saying the game will be better and more stealthy based on nothing more than just the TRAILER..
Yeah, you`re right...it sounds awfully familiar..what he`s doing i mean...kinda like what you and the OP are doing...

On one hand you`ll quote Ubisoft devs and fully believe them when they say "it`s a pirate game", but then on the other hand you`ll completely ignore, disregard or at least question anything implying a return to the roots coming from the same Ubisoft devs who you and the OP so eloquently quote to further your argument...isn't that strange??

by the way, I know this is pointless anyway, i`v no intention of doing a prolonged discussion about this...kinda boring..I`ll just watch, but...I want to enjoy watching this hassle, so AT LEAST remain consistent...

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 04:48 AM
The graphics have.
No..

warner4692
06-07-2013, 06:46 AM
Yeah, you`re right...it sounds awfully familiar..what he`s doing i mean...kinda like what you and the OP are doing...

On one hand you`ll quote Ubisoft devs and fully believe them when they say "it`s a pirate game", but then on the other hand you`ll completely ignore, disregard or at least question anything implying a return to the roots coming from the same Ubisoft devs who you and the OP so eloquently quote to further your argument...isn't that strange??

by the way, I know this is pointless anyway, i`v no intention of doing a prolonged discussion about this...kinda boring..I`ll just watch, but...I want to enjoy watching this hassle, so AT LEAST remain consistent...

No, actually. It's not strange at all.

Especially since I don't (fully) agree with the original poster.

Oh, yeah. And then there's that I didn't actually do that. I don't see myself once quoting the developers.

Oh, yeah, dude. "Boring". You know it. Totally boring. 'Cause, you know, you're just sooo cool and above all this. -_-

Spare me.

Don't open the can of worms, then, if that's how you're feeling. Just keep your endlessly-cynical opinion to yourself.

Else wise, you risk a...

*gasp*

...response.


No..

Yes. The graphics in the original were realistic, better-lit, and better-shaded.

Since, they have become almost a children's cartoon.

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 07:00 AM
No, actually. It's not strange at all.

Especially since I don't (fully) agree with the original poster.

Oh, yeah. And then there's that I didn't actually do that, in any case. I didn't see myself once quoting the developers.

Oh, yeah, dude. "Boring". You know it. Totally boring. 'Cause, you know, you're just sooo cool and above all this. -_-

Spare me.

Don't open the can of worms, then, if that's how you're feeling. Just keep your endlessly-cynical opinion to yourself.

Else wise, you risk a...

*gasp*

...response.

I`m sorry for exposing you to my cynical opinion:( I just assumed you were totally agreed with the OP, since all you`v been doing since getting here is take his side (maybe I missed a post where you mention where you disagree with him) please forgive me:(

Yes, i`m above it all...i`m above you too. never forget that......hey you said it, not me:cool:

Of course i wanted a response....crap must always get a response, i mean...i didn't post here to get no response did i?? I`m merely suggesting a smarter strategy to the OP (and you, although that`s of no use now) for arguing your points....a strategy that`s less boring to watch, heck..i`m actually helping the OP. (i`m the one who started this whole "i`m not buying BF thing..OP is just a copy cat:rolleyes:)



Yes. The graphics in the original were realistic, better-lit, and better-shaded.

Since, they have become almost a children's cartoon.
since BEFORE AC III....(and ACR to an extent) AC II and ACB had cartoony graphics, but since ACR they started fixing this and with AC III, managed to get the best looking visuals and graphics in the series, i`d argue in detail, but...i`ll let someone else do it, since this is.......boring...too much effort that`s off topic anyway

warner4692
06-07-2013, 07:18 AM
I`m sorry for exposing you to my cynical opinion:( I just assumed you were totally agreed with the OP, since all you`v been doing since getting here is take his side (maybe I missed a post where you mention where you disagree with him) please forgive me:(

Yes, i`m above it all...i`m above you too. never forget that......hey you said it, not me:cool:

Of course i wanted a response....crap must always get a response, i mean...i didn't post here to get no response did i?? I`m merely suggesting a smarter strategy to the OP (and you, although that`s of no use now) for arguing your points....a strategy that`s less boring to watch, heck..i`m actually helping the OP. (i`m the one who started this whole "i`m not buying BF thing..OP is just a copy cat:rolleyes:)

I don't recall taking his side. I agree the series has lost a lot of what made it great, but I don't think it can ever get it back.

Not that it can't still be good - it would just have to be good in a vastly-different way. It'll probably never be as mysterious, compelling, and involving as it used to be. And it takes more than stealth.

But the responses he's gotten saying that he "can't bash the game" because he "knows nothing about it" are thus far a long stretch. I'd almost say those people were PURPOSEFULLY pretending not to understand what he's very clearly saying.

Which is very simply that the series has lost merit, overall. At least, as far as I can tell.

You could try wording your suggestions a little less argumentatively. And maybe just as a general rule posting a little less argumentatively. And/or cynically. It would help.


since BEFORE AC III....(and ACR to an extent) AC II and ACB had cartoony graphics, but since ACR they started fixing this and with AC III, managed to get the best looking visuals and graphics in the series, i`d argue in detail, but...i`ll let someone else do it, since this is.......boring...too much effort that`s off topic anyway

I'd rather AC1 or ACII. Their graphics added a lot to the immersive universe. ACB wasn't too bad. I found ACR to be horrible.

I think the problem with ACIII is more the environments. It had its issues with over-saturated colors, too, and that detracted from the old sense of excitement...

...but there never should've been an AC game set in a forest.

More ON topic, there shouldn't be one set on the seas, either.

And graphically, it's easy to tell this was built by the Revelations team.

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 07:31 AM
I don't recall taking his side. I agree the series has lost a lot of what made it great, but I don't think it can ever get it back.

Not that it can't still be good - it would just have to be good in a vastly-different way. It'll probably never be as mysterious, compelling, and involving as it used to be. And it takes more than stealth.

But the responses he's gotten saying that he "can't bash the game" because he "knows nothing about it" are thus far a long stretch. I'd almost say those people were PURPOSEFULLY pretending not to understand what he's very clearly saying.

Which is very simply that the series has lost merit, overall. At least, as far as I can tell.

You could try wording your suggestions a little less argumentatively. And maybe just as a general rule posting a little less argumentatively. And/or cynically. It would help.
Well, arguing against who he`s arguing against is sorta....you know...taking his side? you don`t have to go all romantic and announce "I have thus joined this fellow in his struggle", it can be implied and I assumed....wrong I guess...you`re not taking his side...you just agree with him...which is sorta....*chuckle* taking his side:rolleyes:

anyway..




I'd rather AC1 or ACII. Their graphics added a lot to the immersive universe. ACB wasn't too bad. I found ACR to be horrible.

I think the problem with ACIII is more the environments. It had its issues with over-saturated colors, too, and that detracted from the old sense of excitement...

...but there never should've been an AC game set in a forest.

More ON topic, there shouldn't be one set on the seas, either.

And graphically, it's easy to tell this was built by the Revelations team.
That`s called ATMOSPHERE and VISUALS, not graphics (i should`v known you didn't understand what graphics are based on you saying AC III`s graphics are horrible -_-)

carrying on, factually, AC III has the best graphics in the series to date...preference of Color and atmosphere is different...(although I find it hilarious that you`re putting AC I and that abomination of visuals and graphics called AC II together in an implied status of superiority)

Locopells
06-07-2013, 07:34 AM
Will the lot of you bang your heads together and agree to disagree, until we actually have a game to base this on?!

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 07:35 AM
Will the lot of you bang your head together and agree to disagree, until we actually have a game to base this one?!
You really expect anyone will listen to you??

warner4692
06-07-2013, 07:37 AM
Well, arguing against who he`s arguing against is sorta....you know...taking his side? you don`t have to go all romantic and announce "I have thus joined this fellow in his struggle", it can be implied and I assumed....wrong I guess...you`re not taking his side...you just agree with him...which is sorta....*chuckle* taking his side:rolleyes:

anyway..

No. Not really.

It simply means I don't necessarily agree with THEM, either.

I agree the series has lost a lot of its flair. Doesn't mean I agree with everything else.





That`s called ATMOSPHERE and VISUALS, not graphics (i should`v known you didn't understand what graphics are based on you saying AC III`s graphics are horrible -_-)

carrying on, factually, AC III has the best graphics in the series to date...preference of Color and atmosphere is different...(although I find it hilarious that you`re putting AC I and that abomination of visuals and graphics called AC II together in an implied status of superiority)

At that point, it becomes a matter of opinions. There's no such thing as a "fact" when it comes to a video game-related preference of any kind.

And what it basically boils down to is: you didn't like AC1 or ACII's visuals, and you're treating that personal opinion of yours like its an obvious "fact", and anyone who doesn't "see" that is an idiot.

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 07:48 AM
No. Not really.

It simply means I don't necessarily agree with THEM, either.

I agree the series has lost a lot of its flair. Doesn't mean I agree with everything else.
Y-yeah..say what you want, but...i`m pretty sure most, if not all, thought the way I did and put 1 and 1 together...some guy...comes here...disagrees with NOTHING in the OP and argues against anything against the OP...sorry, couldn't have seen it any other way



At that point, it becomes a matter of opinions. There's no such thing as a "fact" when it comes to a video game-related preference of any kind.

And what it basically boils down to is: you didn't like AC1 or ACII's visuals, and you're treating that personal opinion of yours like its an obvious "fact", and anyone who doesn't "see" that is an idiot.
Ah no...Graphics are factual...atmosphere and visuals are subjective, but not graphics..why?? cuz Graphics have details and facts supporting them....Poly count, texture quality, shaders...etc

Colors, ambiance, general atmosphere and artistic direction have no facts, because there`s no "better" color, ambiance, atmosphere or artistic direction...it`s up to the beholder which he/she prefers...please try to understand the difference i`m portraying before you play the tired old card "you`re bashing other people`s opinions" and playing victim...

ahhh see?? you got me into a trap...i`m arguing now..well, i`m done here...anything further can be perfectly explained by someone who`s more inclined to join in this nice fest..

warner4692
06-07-2013, 08:14 AM
Y-yeah..say what you want, but...i`m pretty sure most, if not all, thought the way I did and put 1 and 1 together...some guy...comes here...disagrees with NOTHING in the OP and argues against anything against the OP...sorry, couldn't have seen it any other way

Doesn't matter if that's what they thought. That's not how it is.

Not that there's any reason to jump to the conclusion you just did, though. It's a hasty assumption to make.


Ah no...Graphics are factual...atmosphere and visuals are subjective, but not graphics..why?? cuz Graphics have details and facts supporting them....Poly count, texture quality, shaders...etc

Colors, ambiance, general atmosphere and artistic direction have no facts, because there`s no "better" color, ambiance, atmosphere or artistic direction...it`s up to the beholder which he/she prefers...please try to understand the difference i`m portraying before you play the tired old card "you`re bashing other people`s opinions" and playing victim...

You're arguing the technicalities of it. But the end result matters most. A game with technically superior graphics doesn't matter if it doesn't look as good, overall.

Try making your points clearer, then. Explain them without the expert-on-internet-psychology act.


ahhh see?? you got me into a trap...i`m arguing now..well, i`m done here...anything further can be perfectly explained by someone who`s more inclined to join in this nice fest..

Believe it or not...

...not everyone sees conversation that way.

And if you don't want arguments, don't start 'em with argumentative comments (here or on any other thread) and then pretend that's not what you're doing.

Locopells
06-07-2013, 08:18 AM
You really expect anyone will listen to you??

Sadly, no...

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 08:24 AM
Doesn't matter if that's what they thought. That's not how it is.

Not that there's any reason to jump to the conclusion you just did, though. It's a hasty assumption to make.
Not hasty, just logical....though there`s a nice line further below that i liked...it has so much to do with this too...the line goes like....."then pretend that's not what you're doing"



You're arguing the technicalities of it. But the end result matters most. A game with technically superior graphics doesn't matter if it doesn't look as good, overall.

Try making your points clearer, then. Explain them without the expert-on-internet-psychology act.
Like I said...i`ll let someone who`s more into this fest to continue this particular subject with you...although I do love the "technicalities" card...lot of people use it when they don`t know what else to say, or rather ignorant about the subject at hand..haha...quite frankly, if you`re not up to an argument, WHICH WILL INCLUDE TECHNICALITIES, don`t go further...




...not everyone sees conversation that way.

And if you don't want arguments, don't start 'em with argumentative comments (here or on any other thread) and then pretend that's not what you're doing.
"Doesn't matter if that's what you thought. That's not how it is." heh:rolleyes: oh I just love your posts....everything is there for me to use...you`re such a dear

byyyyyyeeeee

warner4692
06-07-2013, 08:56 AM
Not hasty, just logical....though there`s a nice line further below that i liked...it has so much to do with this too...the line goes like....."then pretend that's not what you're doing"



Like I said...i`ll let someone who`s more into this fest to continue this particular subject with you...although I do love the "technicalities" card...lot of people use it when they don`t know what else to say, or rather ignorant about the subject at hand..haha...quite frankly, if you`re not up to an argument, WHICH WILL INCLUDE TECHNICALITIES, don`t go further...




"Doesn't matter if that's what you thought. That's not how it is." heh:rolleyes: oh I just love your posts....everything is there for me to use...you`re such a dear

byyyyyyeeeee

I made it clear in several of my posts I didn't agree fully. And I've now explained it several times. If you jumped to that conclusion (under the delusion it was “logical”), it's on you.

Hiding behind “technicalities” is a way of making yourself feel superior. In this particular case, “obviously” ACIII has better graphics, because it has better technicalities. And there's always the “you're ignorant” move to fall back on, if all else fails, right?

You play nice on one thread, then go and leave snarky comments on others. It's a game people like you play. People who cause trouble on the internet for no other reason than to cause trouble on the internet. It can be seen from space.

And I've seen it all before, too. Once again, if you don't want arguments – or aren't “up” to them, so-to-speak – don't start 'em.

Assassin_M
06-07-2013, 09:16 AM
Sadly, no...
Good...then don`t ask people to stop...Just enjoy watching

pacmanate
06-07-2013, 09:47 AM
Yeah, you`re right...it sounds awfully familiar..what he`s doing i mean...kinda like what you and the OP are doing...

On one hand you`ll quote Ubisoft devs and fully believe them when they say "it`s a pirate game", but then on the other hand you`ll completely ignore, disregard or at least question anything implying a return to the roots coming from the same Ubisoft devs who you and the OP so eloquently quote to further your argument...isn't that strange??

by the way, I know this is pointless anyway, i`v no intention of doing a prolonged discussion about this...kinda boring..I`ll just watch, but...I want to enjoy watching this hassle, so AT LEAST remain consistent...

And this is why the thread should be locked. OP is only using some of the things the devs say, the things that he can use to defend his opinion, but completely disregards anything the devs say against it.

The thread should just be locked because OP is going round in circles and the people who are trying to tell him otherwise keep saying the same thing "going back to roots", yet OP continues to disregard this because he hasn't seen it in any trailers.

Locopells
06-07-2013, 12:32 PM
Good...then don`t ask people to stop...Just enjoy watching

You gotta try, we've been seeing to many of these arguments lately...

AssassinHMS
06-07-2013, 12:39 PM
Hey! Troll 1! Yes, you montagemik.
If you’re going to repeat yourself walking in circles without saying anything productive, ditch the thread.
If you don’t like the thread then ditch the thread.
Can only imagine how pointless it is to keep posting pointless posts without any results.
It’s kind of pathetic that you keep following the thread when you’re one neuron short of a synapse.
I suggest you stop trolling, grow up and get a real job (because trolling is not your forte)

Troll 2! So you say my thread should be locked because I disregard some of the developers’ statements while believing others.
Ahahahah……………………..you should go hide under a bridge because your trolling is the worst.
Not only they said they’re doing a pirate game but they also showed a pirate game in every poster, trailer, screenshot available, so there is no doubt that it is a pirate game. While it’s true they said they acknowledged stealth, AC1 and open ended assassination missions, their original idea was to make a pirate game and I strongly think that, if so many people didn’t complain about the lack of those features in AC3, the developers wouldn’t have brought that up or acknowledged it. Also the past of the franchise makes it hard to believe them (at least for me). And finally, the combat still seems to be the main core aspect, too easy and too appealing (which has a negative impact in stealth). Why do I think combat is like that? Due to “Fights like a devil, dressed as a man…” and all the combat shown in trailers, screenshots, gameplay footage… Not to mention an easy combat system that provides small satisfaction by gruesome kills is a good way to appeal casual players and that is the direction the franchise took.
Also you’re the one who is walking in circles chasing your own tail without questioning the obvious or acknowledging anything that I said (simply because you’re here, not to discuss, but to troll) so you’re the one who should be locked.



But the responses he's gotten saying that he "can't bash the game" because he "knows nothing about it" are thus far a long stretch. I'd almost say those people were PURPOSEFULLY pretending not to understand what he's very clearly saying.

Thank you. At least someone else sees it.
Those “people” are trolls who like to bash any strong opinion (even if it’s based on facts and everything points towards that same conclusion). I never thought this forum was so full of trolls that spend their lives trolling. It’s clear they have nothing better to do than to ask to lock threads from people who actually want to help the franchise. It’s a shame…



i`m actually helping the OP. (i`m the one who started this whole "i`m not buying BF thing..OP is just a copy cat:rolleyes:)

Copycat? I’m the one who came up with this thread and these statements are my own.
But if you agree with what I said about the series and have a better solution then I’m all ears.

pacmanate
06-07-2013, 12:41 PM
Troll 2! So you say my thread should be locked because I disregard some of the developers’ statements while believing others.
Ahahahah……………………..you should go hide under a bridge because your trolling is the worst.
Not only they said they’re doing a pirate game but they also showed a pirate game in every poster, trailer, screenshot available, so there is no doubt that it is a pirate game. While it’s true they said they acknowledged stealth, AC1 and open ended assassination missions, their original idea was to make a pirate game and I strongly think that, if so many people didn’t complain about the lack of those features in AC3, the developers wouldn’t have brought that up or acknowledged it. Also the past of the franchise makes it hard to believe them (at least for me). And finally, the combat still seems to be the main core aspect, too easy and too appealing (which has a negative impact in stealth). Why do I think combat is like that? Due to “Fights like a devil, dressed as a man…” and all the combat shown in trailers, screenshots, gameplay footage… Not to mention an easy combat system that provides small satisfaction by gruesome kills is a good way to appeal casual players and that is the direction the franchise took.
Also you’re the one who is walking in circles chasing your own tail without questioning the obvious or acknowledging anything that I said (simply because you’re here, not to discuss, but to troll) so you’re the one who should be locked.



Are you touched in the head?

Mr_Shade
06-07-2013, 12:43 PM
Calling people who have a valid point, a troll - is one way to get the thread locked..

It's also a way to get an infraction..


I suggest we wait and see if the game is indeed 'a pirate game' - even though the devs have stated a few times, it's also a true AC game - returning to it's roots.



IF you want to remake this thread to talk about the game AFTER we know for sure [release] - they I suggest you don't attack those you disagree with..


There are members who have been here many years, and have seen many titles come and go, so please try and accept their viewpoints, if you want a discussion to happen.



Thread locked.

And with it - any chance you had to make a point - due to your own actions.