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Wolfmeister1010
05-12-2013, 06:15 AM
Just a small idea. Please feel free to worship me like a god or drown me in your hat


What do you think of being able to crouch along cover and roll quickly cover to cover stealthily like in splinter cell, another 3rd person stealth game by ubisoft?

Farlander1991
05-12-2013, 06:48 AM
I may be in the minority here, but... I don't think we need that function. I know there are a lot of people here who want it, but, no. I think that smart placement of the stalking zones is enough.

Assassin's Creed's focus is social stealth (at least, supposedly, heh), and that's the way most of the improvements should go, adding a whole functionality to crouch and roll between cover is not part of that way.

Assassin_M
05-12-2013, 08:05 AM
Social stealth pleeeeease...

While I wont necessarily drown you in a hat :P, I don't really want a crouch button..


Assassin's Creed's focus is social stealth (at least, supposedly, heh), and that's the way most of the improvements should go, adding a whole functionality to crouch and roll between cover is not part of that way.
THIS

shobhit7777777
05-12-2013, 09:00 AM
Social Stealth and Crouching aren't mutually exclusive

A 'Stealth' game which focuses heavily on one aspect of stealth while neglecting another which is in fact an equally important part of the game is IMO daft

The thing is that while Social Stealth is cool and all..most of the AC situations rely on good ol' fashion sneaking about...and as such the game suffers due to the absence of a 'stealth' mode.
Physically lowering your profile to hide and avoid detection is a basic feature mandatory for any LOS based stealth game

Rooftops, the wilderness, forts or pirate dens....all require old school sneaking around

The reason why stalking zones are not enough is because it really restricts the player to a few select areas where he/she can really hide and also not provide the necessary control precision required in stealth games.....haven't we all faced a situation where Connor just pops up out of 'stalking zones'?

A crouching ability allows you- the player - the best utilize the environment for hiding....in game geometry which was previously just there..can now be used to hide...low walls, fences, low vegetation which is not a stalking zone

The ultimate goal is to provide a seamless transition from social to LOS stealth....or at least it should be. Hitman Absolution is a somewhat good example of how they've achieved the blend...inspite of a few quirks

Focus on Social Stealth.....but give us a crouching option

Sushiglutton
05-12-2013, 09:57 AM
I'm with Shobbit and TC on this one. Crouching an hiding behind objects is such a natural thing to do in a stealth situation. It's what I would do in real life and It's a feature that just should be there. When you stand close to a low object and you notice a guard is coming your way, the inability to hide feels like the equivalent of a cheap death. Why can't this master assassin do such a trivial thing?

Crouch and cover is also something the devs know how to do and it would be relatively easy to implement. It's in Splinter Cell, Watchdogs (don't know if there is a crouch button, but you can hide behind low cover), Farcry. Social stealth on the other hand is an elusive concept. Even if you throw money at it, there's no guarantee it would feel right anyway.

The biggest problem with stealth atm is def the poor enemy AI, that really needs improvement (perhaps they are waiting until they can switch completely to next gen). Next step imo would be to implement a crouch/cover system of some kind (I would prefer a softer cover system more similar to the new Tomb Raider (I know TR doesn't have a crouch button), than Splinter Cell). Do these two things well and, combined with all the other features, the fundamentals are there.

Edit: Seems like Watch Dogs has the same basic cover system as Splinter Cell, just as wolfmeister wants for AC.

bveUSbve
05-12-2013, 10:39 AM
I'm not against improvements to social stealth. But I'd like crouching - in a deliberately controllable way, not automatically in "zones" (which was really awful in ACIII!) - nonetheless.

ArabianFrost
05-12-2013, 10:45 AM
I am sure you guys read about the simpler detection system for AC4. It sounds to me like one of two things. Enemies that will detect you on sight or utterly stupid enemies that win't recognise you if you wore an "I am Edward Kenway" sign. I understand the devs focused more on non-linear mission design, but they don't seem to heavily boast about or market a renovated stealth system, compared to the intensive marketing about the naval and freedom. Just like how the stealth-oriented marketing for AC3 was not extensive, the lack of advertising about a reinvented an improved stealth system for AC4, insinuates that we will indeed have a lot of stealth...... that will probably suck.

Farlander1991
05-12-2013, 12:34 PM
Edit: Seems like Watch Dogs has the same basic cover system as Splinter Cell, just as wolfmeister wants for AC.

What Watch Dogs seems to have, and what I think would be better than a crouch button for AC too, is that you get into a crouch mode when you're in a restricted area (ala how in Tomb Raider Lara gets into a crouch mode when enemies are nearby... and I just noticed after writing this sentence that you wrote about Tomb Raider too, I guess that's what happens when you don't read the whole post :D ).

If you have a crouch button, you'll have to incorporate it into the whole social stealth system, which right now is not a perfect system to begin with (though I still have fun with it and think there's lots of potential), and crouch will just needlessly complicate it.

montagemik
05-12-2013, 01:32 PM
Just a small idea. Please feel free to worship me like a god or drown me in your hat


What do you think of being able to crouch along cover and roll quickly cover to cover stealthily like in splinter cell, another 3rd person stealth game by ubisoft?


Don't you mean like in 'TENCHU' ............The game AC copied many of it's Assassin abilities/ mechanics from ? (years before splinter cell)

Yeah seems like a good idea for a stealth assassin game .

SixKeys
05-12-2013, 02:42 PM
The whole idea behind social stealth is acting like a normal person, even in situations where you're in danger of getting caught. If you're sneaking around in a restricted area and a guard spots you, it makes more sense to nonchalantly walk away behind a corner like you didn't hear them. In that scenario there's still a slight possibility they might mistake you for a confused hobo that just wandered in for no reason. But if a guard spots you rolling around behind some barrels, there's nothing stealthy about that. It's even more stupid when you're on a rooftop. In AC games I've always just pretended the rooftop guards have bad eye sight and when they see a distant figure walking around where their buddy used to be, they just assume you're another guard. Rolling from cover to cover on a rooftop would destroy even that excuse.

projectpat06
05-12-2013, 04:23 PM
I think they just need to allow the assassin to take cover behind shorter objects and kneel down. We already have a cover system that worked great but for cases when there's not a 6 ft gravestone to take cover behind, it would be nice if the character could crouch down behind it. This is as far as I would take it. As stated before, crouching in a city to avoid detection would only grab the attention of people around you. I would rather them improve the social stealth aspects and give us more side missions (endless like random events) where we can utilize them. Ac3 had all these awesome blending options but I felt like I could hardly ever use them in missions.

prince162010
05-12-2013, 04:47 PM
Roll quickly from cover to cover that would be so cool < agreed.... but crouch meh !! i'm not with you

Sushiglutton
05-12-2013, 05:28 PM
What Watch Dogs seems to have, and what I think would be better than a crouch button for AC too, is that you get into a crouch mode when you're in a restricted area (ala how in Tomb Raider Lara gets into a crouch mode when enemies are nearby... and I just noticed after writing this sentence that you wrote about Tomb Raider too, I guess that's what happens when you don't read the whole post :D ).

If you have a crouch button, you'll have to incorporate it into the whole social stealth system, which right now is not a perfect system to begin with (though I still have fun with it and think there's lots of potential), and crouch will just needlessly complicate it.

I'm on my phone, so can't link, but if you check the latest WD vids you can see button prompts for moving to the next cover, similar to how it works in SC (there is a circled A and the word "cover" when Aiden is sneaking around the car in the ctOS compound). Obv it could still be an auto crouch in hostile area function. It was the cover to cover feature I was thinking of when comparing it to SC.

I think the TR system of auto-crouch would be much harder to get to work properly in AC as it is an open world game. So it's not really clear when you are in a hostile area (for example when sneaking up on some guards in the woods). In TR they know exactly when Lara should crouch and when the last enemy in that area is dead, so she can stand up again. I was more thinking of adopting the cover system in TR that doesn't use a cover button. Then combine it with a crouch button.

When crouching all social stealth features should simply be disabled, because like you said crouching in a crowd stands out. Sounds easy enough to me :)!

Farlander1991
05-12-2013, 05:43 PM
So it's not really clear when you are in a hostile area (for example when sneaking up on some guards in the woods).

When you're in the red restricted zone (most of those zones don't have civilians anyway... and, maybe, there could be two type of restricted zones - no civilian restricted zone that puts you into crouch mode and restricted zone with civilians where you still have to use social stealth but guards are more wary of you) seems logical enough to me. All the other times I don't see any reason why the traditional functions couldn't be properly used without any trouble, even in the woods (where I've personally spent most of my time on the trees anyway, but even when I didn't, never felt hindered by the inability to crouch).

Sushiglutton
05-12-2013, 05:55 PM
When you're in the red restricted zone (most of those zones don't have civilians anyway... and, maybe, there could be two type of restricted zones - no civilian restricted zone that puts you into crouch mode and restricted zone with civilians where you still have to use social stealth but guards are more wary of you) seems logical enough to me. All the other times I don't see any reason why the traditional functions couldn't be properly used without any trouble, even in the woods (where I've personally spent most of my time on the trees anyway).

Meh don't like this solution. It's annoying if you sometimes can hide behind a barrel and sometimes you can't just because of a gamey device like a colored zone. I want to feel in control of the character. What about rooftops? Should you always crouch when up there? I don't like it as it doesn't match the freerunning and standing tall on a roof looking down. On the other hand sometimes I wanna hide behind a box or a low chimney, so I do feel the need for crouch on the roofs. A slide+crouch button like in Farcry3/Arkham City would be perfect. While we're at it AC should borrow the slide over roof-edge => instant hanging position- trick from Arkham City (the game with the best overall gameplay of any game ever made :)!)!

Farlander1991
05-12-2013, 06:02 PM
It's annoying if you sometimes can hide behind a barrel and sometimes you can't just because of a gamey device like a colored zones.

Do you ever REALLY feel the need to hide behind a barrel when you're not in some sort of an enclosed military encampment, but on the streets or in a village? I personally can't answer that question positively.


What about rooftops? Should you always crouch when up there?

Well, no. Unless you're in a restricted zone maybe? I don't think that you should ever crouch on the rooftops, because that takes away from the Assassin badassery feel. Just the LoS has to be fixed and become a little bit more systemized, so, for example people from the streets wouldn't actually see you when you're on a rooftop (maybe less realistic, but it's better gameplay-wise).

Not exactly sure what to do with rooftop guards yet. They're too blind and stupid in AC2/ACB, but too far-seeing in AC3. I still think there can be a fine solution that doesn't require a specific crouch function.

Sushiglutton
05-12-2013, 06:14 PM
Do you ever REALLY feel the need to hide behind a barrel when you're not in some sort of an enclosed military encampment, but on the streets or in a village? I personally can't answer that question positively.



Well, no. Unless you're in a restricted zone maybe? I don't think that you should ever crouch on the rooftops, because that takes away from the Assassin badassery feel. Just the LoS has to be fixed and become a little bit more systemized, so, for example people from the streets wouldn't actually see you when you're on a rooftop (maybe less realistic, but it's better gameplay-wise).

Not exactly sure what to do with rooftop guards yet. They're too blind and stupid in AC2/ACB, but too far-seeing in AC3. I still think there can be a fine solution that doesn't require a specific crouch function.

Overall the balance between rooftops and streets is off in terms of difficulty to maneuver. It should be harder to move on the streets, thus forcing parkour and social stealth. It should feel fairly effortless to move around on the rooftops. Since the climbable city is one of the franchises strongest features the game should be designed to encourage that (this would also be more realistic actually). Running around in the streets without some social stealth technique (disguise, hiding in crowd etc) should result in the guards spotting you.

Sorry a bit off-topic.

I sometimes feel like I want to crouch in the frontier, but obv it's not needed to survive. I really don't get what's so problematic with a crouch button. They obv have all the tech at Ubi Montreal since they have used it in several of their latest projects. It's something a human can and would do in a real life stealth situation. It's a nice feature to have.

pacmanate
05-12-2013, 07:02 PM
There is no need to crouch as AC games suck at stealth.

Farlander1991
05-12-2013, 07:42 PM
. I really don't get what's so problematic with a crouch button. They obv have all the tech at Ubi Montreal since they have used it in several of their latest projects. It's something a human can and would do in a real life stealth situation. It's a nice feature to have.

Well, I personally don't look at it in the way, 'all stealth games have crouch, crouch is useful, therefore crouch is going to make AC stealth parts better'.

Well, most stealth games are in a constantly hostile environment. Crouch is important there. Not so in AC. Yeah, you're always under suspicion, but you're not always in a hostile environment.

Here's the way the Assassin's Creed stealth system works: low profile actions are socially acceptable, high profile actions are socially unacceptable (and even though in AC2 onwards the notoriety system somewhat diminished the 'socially unacceptable part', even in AC3 there's elements of socially unacceptable behavior like pushing through crowds of people while running attract guards' attention... and since in AC4 they say they're getting rid of notoriety system, I hope socially acceptable/unacceptable gets a higher role again). Simple, easy to understand.

First question: which profile do we put the crouch action in? It's a low profile action, but it's socially unacceptable. That already causes problems from a systematic point of view and player understanding point of view. (plus, what button do we map it? All other buttons are already taken by weapon, tools, fast walk/jump and interact/release/catch/drop down)

So, do we make crouch a separate mode not related to the low/high profile system? That would make sense, since it's a socially unacceptable low profile action, it would not cause confusion and we don't have to map it to one of the four main controller buttons. Plus, that way we'll be able to still move and rotate the camera easily (which is kinda a pain if you also have to hold crouch on one of the X/Y/A/B/PS3 equivalent buttons). But... Okay, so not only do we have to keep track of low/high profile then, but also crouch and profile.

Btw, is it a toggle mode or, like the low/high profile, a hold to activate mode?

What happens when we move while holding the crouch and high profile button? We crouch faster? What happens when we hold crouch, high profile and jump? Do we jump? Or is it some other action, like roll?

If it's a toggle mode, what happens when we get to a place like a market stand? Do we stand up and blend in with the crowd, or do we have to press to untoggle? (which, btw, I would find uncomfortable).

Oh, but that's not all, why would we be able to blend in after just crouching near the crowd? That would be weird and socially unacceptable, so we have to program in the AI of them being weired out for that.

And that's not all questions that have to be thought out and answered. 'Crouch' is not just 'an action to make the stealth better', it's a whole set of systems. Questions that have to be answered, AI that has to be programmed, proper transition between stances that has to be decided, how the already implemented systems interact with that. And really, for what? The only reason most people really want to crouch is to make the stealth flow better in the constantly hostile environments (like enemy forts) and rooftops, because outside of those environments there's actually plenty of civilians to blend and hide amongst them (I would say that there's only a problem with moving crowds in AC3, it would be nice to have more of them).

So, I personally don't see the need for crouch from a systematic point of view in a social environment - I feel that the end result will not be justified by the amounts of work that has to be done, I'd rather perfect the already present social system. I can see the use for crouch in a constantly hostile environment (which are already present in the games and defined by red zones), and since it's socially unacceptable to be there by default, I can see sense in making a transition from walking to crouching (and fast walking to fast crouching) in those environments specifically.

And it makes sense from the narrative/world point of view. In social environments an assassin would use the crowds to get lost, not hide behind a barrel. But he would hide behind a barrel in a place where there's no crowd to be lost in.

Rooftops would require some other solution though.

lothario-da-be
05-12-2013, 08:54 PM
It makes no sense that they can't crouch. And i think a good transition between normal stealth and social stealth can make the experience a lot better and immersive.

shobhit7777777
05-12-2013, 09:25 PM
*snipped for great brevity ;).

Hi Farlander, for the sake of convenience I will be answering the gist of your posts in this thread...I hope you don't mind

First off...you're right about crouching having a ripple effect on the existing systems.....its a matter of tweaking damn near everything in the game. However it is worth..as I hope to demonstrate shortly

I'll just illustrate how I feel they can implement Crouching

1. Controls - Click on RS/LS to toggle Crouch. Obviously its a toggle having it any other way would be stupid for obvious reasons

2. Effect on Social Status: What is the crowd's reaction to Connor climbing a building? What was the crowd's reaction to Altair climbing a building? The answer to this riddle is simple - A natural reaction towards natural actions

See the thing is that the game's social stealth DOESN'T really rely on socially acceptable/unacceptable actions but on the attention drawn by the player when in LOS of the AI. Running, pushing, jumping are basically weightage added to some parameter which governs the detection rate and speed for the AI.

Crouch walking in a crowd would be deemed an attention drawing weightage

The actual in-game reaction would be the same as running up buildings in the game

It is not that hard for a player to grasp a concept like "Crouching draws attention" thereby feeding into the "Socially Unacceptable" loop. It is a natural mechanic which feeds of real life and hence the player can assume that his actions are drawing attention. Logic is a beauty.
So player feedback (An extremely important part of a stealth game - heck any game - since it allows him to understand the basic rules) is not really an issue here

Crouch walking would be an attention drawing yet socially acceptable action. It's consequences will be entirely clear thanks to the crowd reacting to it in a manner which lets the player understand that its a weird thing that he is doing (which he/she would anyway)

3. Transitional Animations and Actions:
Toggle crouch -> High profile running brings you out of it
-> Getting into a crowd to blend? They'll disperse thanks to you being a weirdo - Natural reactions to player actions...best form of feedback and problem solving
-> Combat brings you out of it
-> Any overt action brings you out of it

It is not a locked state....fluidity should be maintained at all times


Now the ONLY argument which I feel is actually worth considering is - Technical limitations and the effort required to implement it...is it worth it?

Absolutely.

Crouching, taking cover and other elements are essential to a stealth game. Stalking zones and automated crouching is a bad idea from a Designer's POV. It never is able to capture the flexibility required in a stealth game with regards to the actual mechanics of moving silently. Were it so...then you wouldn't have anyone asking for a crouch option in the first place

The fact is that tech limitations and time required are fair points when it comes to BLACK FLAGS......its done...can't add a feature like crouching now..that'd be daft. However in the future instalments...**** yes!

I would rather they beef up the game with solid gameplay additions like crouching rather than a tangential system of economics and fluffy combat.

Assassin's Creed has on more than one occasion pleasantly surprised me as designer....and also severely disappointed me. There are glaring flaws in some aspects of the gameplay....one of which being the lack of a flexible, robust and engaging stealth experience - Social AND LOS.

TinyTemplar
05-12-2013, 10:01 PM
I don't know about stealth roll, not sure if it is necessary (I'm agree with people who says that it's not natural to crouch and roll trying to blend with crowd), but AC lacks ability of free rolling in fight.

Sushiglutton
05-12-2013, 10:07 PM
@Farlander: Finally I'm back to my PC again after visiting some Swedish castle ruins from 1308 :).

Before I go into the details I want to say that I really believe you are overhtinking this. It's a crouch button, something real standard in video games. It can't possibly be as difficult as you make it out to be relative what it is in any other game. The social stealth in AC is not advanced enough to cause any significant problems.

Crouch should be a low profile action. Low/high profile have, as you mentioned, lost their original meaning. I don't think a socially unaccepted action in low profile would cause much confusion. If you are crouching the social blends won't work. This should be easily understood by the player becuase first you won't get the visual cue that you are blending and secondly it does looks silly if you are crouching in public. So that it's not socially acceptable is pefectly natural.

As for witch button I have allready suggested a control scheme a way back :). I would change the function of the B button so it basically becomes the low button. Tap to crouch (toggle mode), tap again to stand up. When climbing tap to let go, when falling tap to grab, when running tap to slide (hold to end the slide in a crouched position). In other words B does the low actions. Interact is moved to Y and the tools are triggered Arkham style by combining a trigger with a facebutton. AC uses the buttons very uneconomically compared to Arkham!

Keeping track of a crouching "profile" would not be that hard me thinks. Most buttons should work as in low profile. Ofc they have to keep track of line of site, but that is standard stuff. If we are moving crouched and hold the high-profile button we should start running (exit crouch).

We can not blend in crowds when crouched, so yes you would have to tap a button to stand. I don't understand how this would be so cumbersome. If we crouch near a crowd, then stand up and walk among them we should blend. Social stealth is not anywhere near advanced enough to take such an action into account. There are several spots where crouch could come in handy: On rooftops, in hostile area, in the wild, in a part of town with few civilians (like an alley).

Implementing a crouch button isn't anywhere near as complex as "perfecting social stealth". First off the former is clearly defined the latter is not. Secondly Ubi Montreal have a crouch button in at least two of their major franchises. Only AI adjustment needed is to tune line of site for when we crouch next to a waist high objects. The animations are allredy made (stalking zones).

Narrative-wise it makes zero sense that the assassin can't hide behind a waist high crate. If the player chooses to use this ability in the city, so be it. If you want to cross a plaza you would still have to rely on blending in the crowd. The assassin can pull off some crazy moves, but he can't hide behind objects that I easily could. Makes him feel incompetent imo.


Edit: I guess I should have read the whole thread :). Also what Shobbit said ;)!

TinyTemplar
05-12-2013, 10:30 PM
@Farlander: Finally I'm back to my PC again after visiting some Swedish castle ruins from 1308 :).

Before I go into the details I want to say that I really believe you are overhtinking this. It's a crouch button, something real standard in video games. It can't possibly be as difficult as you make it out to be relative what it is in any other game. The social stealth in AC is not advanced enough to cause any significant problems.

Crouch should be a low profile action. Low/high profile have, as you mentioned, lost their original meaning. I don't think a socially unaccepted action in low profile would cause much confusion. If you are crouching the social blends won't work. This should be easily understood by the player becuase first you won't get the visual cue that you are blending and secondly it does looks silly if you are crouching in public. So that it's not socially acceptable is pefectly natural.

As for witch button I have allready suggested a control scheme a way back :). I would change the function of the B button so it basically becomes the low button. Tap to crouch (toggle mode), tap again to stand up. When climbing tap to let go, when falling tap to grab, when running tap to slide (hold to end the slide in a crouched position). In other words B does the low actions. Interact is moved to Y and the tools are triggered Arkham style by combining a trigger with a facebutton. AC uses the buttons very uneconomically compared to Arkham!

Keeping track of a crouching "profile" would not be that hard me thinks. Most buttons should work as in low profile. Ofc they have to keep track of line of site, but that is standard stuff. If we are moving crouched and hold the high-profile button we should start running (exit crouch).

We can not blend in crowds when crouched, so yes you would have to tap a button to stand. I don't understand how this would be so cumbersome. If we crouch near a crowd, then stand up and walk among them we should blend. Social stealth is not anywhere near advanced enough to take such an action into account. There are several spots where crouch could come in handy: On rooftops, in hostile area, in the wild, in a part of town with few civilians (like an alley).

Implementing a crouch button isn't anywhere near as complex as "perfecting social stealth". First off the former is clearly defined the latter is not. Secondly Ubi Montreal have a crouch button in at least two of their major franchises. Only AI adjustment needed is to tune line of site for when we crouch next to a waist high objects. The animations are allredy made (stalking zones).

Narrative-wise it makes zero sense that the assassin can't hide behind a waist high crate. If the player chooses to use this ability in the city, so be it. If you want to cross a plaza you would still have to rely on blending in the crowd. The assassin can pull off some crazy moves, but he can't hide behind objects that I easily could. Makes him feel incompetent imo.


Edit: I guess I should have read the whole thread :). Also what Shobbit said ;)!

I just want to add, that most of AC moves are conneccted to plot. Maybe they're just not comfortable to tell us a story with such ability? Maybe crouch ruins the atmosphere? =) I don't want to look like a complete funboy, but I must admit that their attitude to a story is so carefull, they strictly adjust the gameplay for it's needs. Or maybe I don't want to see the truth.

GreySkellig
05-13-2013, 05:42 AM
I've been off and on about crouch. On the one hand, I can see why Ubisoft has resisted implementing it. Particularly with the most recent AC3, the control layout is pretty crowded. You could maybe throw it on right stick, which is currently "center camera," although my copy of AC3 on PS3 often has camera lockup issues and I somewhat rely on the click-for-center feature. On the other hand, I have frequently wished for crouch, particularly on rooftops and in the frontier. AC3's guards especially have such long LOS and such short fuses that any bump to my sneaking would be invaluable.

That said, I'm against cover-to-cover rolling. It just somehow doesn't feel right for the series. The Assassins are more conventionally sneaky-stealthy, less full-on black-ops.

The one thing I absolutely think should be added is a low cover lock-on. This ought to work just like the current corner lock-on--if you push against a low wall, crate, fallen branch etc. you should crouch and be able to move along it/vault over it. I seem to recall something along these lines being promised early on for AC3. Something about "taking cover behind low obstacles," but obviously that never materialized. Can't recall where I read it.

STDlyMcStudpants
05-13-2013, 06:39 AM
You have admit though..the hiding in the grass was a great stealth improvement.
So they have been improving...(they just havent made it the main focus like hitman does)
which of course i dont mind at all since its a game where you control your ancestors body and are just told to try and repeat what they did..i like the freedom of not having to sneak around since im a pretty aggressive player.
But as far as the rolling thing...almosr every game i play im just like "How the heck do I roll" Naturally thats what I want to do..but only in shooter...i have the urge to roll and also blind fire (idk how the f so many shooters have skipped blind fire)
But in Assassins Creed I've never wanted to roll...I view rolling as a defensive move..not really a stalker move..though it does work fairly well in a game like uncharted during its stealth parts..but ehh..i wouldnt mind if they added it..i just dont know which button would trigger it as they are all used lol......

I can live without rolling BUT
maybe a change of clothes thing would be something cool..kill a templar .pull him in the hay..take his clothes..like a sly cooper kind of thing...but then again eh..im kind of fine with how things are going now.
Piles, wells, and tall grass is fine for me.

montagemik
05-13-2013, 12:44 PM
[QUOTE=STDlyMcStudpants;9069332]You have admit though..the hiding in the grass was a great stealth improvement.
So they have been improving...(they just havent made it the main focus like hitman does)
which of course i dont mind at all since its a game where you control your ancestors body and are just told to try and repeat what they did..i like the freedom of not having to sneak around since im a pretty aggressive player. [QUOTE]


Hiding in the grass seemed to be introduced primarily as part of the Hunting mechanics if we're honest - Mission stealth use was a secondary bonus .

I myself don't mind many of the game's limitations - As we're replaying memories the way they happened ............ But to be 5 games into a series following the lives of highly skilled Assassins before we're able to do ANY kind of stealth /crouch navigation IS BEYOND RIDICULOUS.

Crouch should be a basic option in Any stealth based game shouldn't it ?? , long before hiding in haystacks or hiding underwater & or even wall hugging corner cover .

PS-3-PK
05-14-2013, 11:39 PM
I think crouching is good idea but not rolling from cover to cover

EarthlyStudio1
05-14-2013, 11:53 PM
I don't think giving "Assassins Creed" stealth features is a good thing. I think that they should focus more on the epic action parts where you run through battlefields and all about the combat. THAT is a good Assassins Creed!