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sfbaytf
03-09-2004, 02:15 PM
I was playing around with a quick mission. 4 P-38 vs 4 Ki-84. I played both sides and so far I find the Ki-84 a better bird. I'm sure there are may who have a differing opinion and I would like to hear them. So far I haven't really gotten the hang of the P-38 in ACE.

sfbaytf
03-09-2004, 02:15 PM
I was playing around with a quick mission. 4 P-38 vs 4 Ki-84. I played both sides and so far I find the Ki-84 a better bird. I'm sure there are may who have a differing opinion and I would like to hear them. So far I haven't really gotten the hang of the P-38 in ACE.

BuzzU
03-09-2004, 02:21 PM
Use the drag brake to turn the P-38, and keep it's speed up. I've done your test too, and beat the crap out of the Ki-84.

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Buzz
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Jaws2002
03-09-2004, 03:45 PM
the P-38 is no match for the Ki

noshens
03-09-2004, 03:54 PM
I wasted all ammo trying to down one ki84.

ZG77_Nagual
03-09-2004, 03:56 PM
Ki is fast, sturdy, well-armed, fast climbing, tight turning with excellent performance at all speeds. It is hands down the best piston engined dogfighter in the simm at low to med alts. beating a well-flown ki in anything but another ki is a challenge

Korolov
03-09-2004, 04:09 PM
Ki-84 excels in the game until you get to high altitude, at which the P-38 will kick it's butt.

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/newsig1.jpg

SlickStick
03-09-2004, 04:19 PM
The trick is getting the Ki to come up and fight at that higher altitude.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

The Ki in AEP is certainly NOT the Ki from V1.22. It is faster on the deck and even the 1c turns like a top. When I flew my Lavochkin Performance Series up through V1.22, the two toughest opponents were another LA7 and the manual/auto prop pitching 109-K4s.

As AEP gets distributed further, I'm looking forward to facing the new and improved Kis in 1 vs 1 matches against the LA7.

However, in my experience so far, the smart Ki pilot eats the P38 for lunch.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

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03-09-2004, 05:26 PM
That's because the smart Ki pilots usually stay away from smart P-38 pilots http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

SlickStick
03-09-2004, 05:32 PM
Indeed, that may also be quite a relevant point. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

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noshens
03-09-2004, 05:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kweassa1:
That's because the smart Ki pilots usually stay away from smart P-38 pilots http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
So how do they eat them?

MysticBlackCat
03-09-2004, 05:45 PM
With lots of hot sauce.

I'm about to saddle up in my trusty P-38 and see about taking on a few Ki's. Maybe I can have some good luck, I have almost exclusively been flying the P-38 since I got the expansion. Only stopped long enough to try the other planes at least once.

BuzzU
03-09-2004, 05:57 PM
No smart pilot involved in the original posters test.

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Buzz
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crazyivan1970
03-09-2004, 05:59 PM
Buzzy play nice http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif

V!
Regards,

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VFC*Crazyivan aka VFC*HOST

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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

BuzzU
03-09-2004, 06:06 PM
Huh? I mean he's flying against the AI, as I was in the test. Everybody comes on and says the Ki-84 is tough with humans flying it. It probably is, but the AI flying the Ki-84 is not that tough to kill. Which was the point of my first post.

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Buzz
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SlickStick
03-09-2004, 06:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by yay1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kweassa1:
That's because the smart Ki pilots usually stay away from smart P-38 pilots http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
So how do they eat them?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fresh BBQ via two Ho-5 30mm wing-mounted cannons, served over a freshly fallen snow of mountain.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

___________________________
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SlickStick
03-09-2004, 06:41 PM
D*a*m*n, I gotta start seeing when people are posting about AI FMs. Missed that. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

I only compare online, and forget that others mileage may vary offline against limited-physics AI, given the added human variable to the equation.

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Mitlov47
03-09-2004, 07:17 PM
I don't understand P-38/Dora/P-51 pilots, who (at least on this board) seem to believe that no plane is good unless it's good at high altitude. "Well, if we're smart, we'll lure you to high altitude and then maul you." Yeah, well if the rest of us are smart, we'll lure you to LOW altitude, and then maul you. This line of thinking proves nothing except that no plane is good when fighting outside of its element.

Which leads me to my main point. Who will win in a P-38 v Ki-84 dogfight? Given equally-skilled pilots, it depends largely on the altitude at which they fight.

---------------------------

"I hear the roar of a big machine; Two worlds and in between.
Love lost, fire at will; Dum-dum bullets and shoot to kill.
I hear dive bombers and Empire down, Empire down..."
--Sisters of Mercy

KI-84-1a -- "Kaoru"

sfbaytf
03-09-2004, 08:24 PM
Ok Now I gotta respond...so you play a game online and you look down on a person who is not a total geek and spends his life playing a computer game online.

That's why I don't bother playing games online. Too many idiots like you online who have an attitude.



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BuzzU:
Huh? I mean he's flying against the AI, as I was in the test. Everybody comes on and says the Ki-84 is tough with humans flying it. It probably is, but the AI flying the Ki-84 is not that tough to kill. Which was the point of my first post.

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Buzz
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto/mcguire3.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

ZG77_Nagual
03-09-2004, 08:30 PM
Online at low level the KI is the easiest to fly and most capable dogfighter - it is faster, tougher and more maneuverable than any other piston engined plane at low alt - also rolls like a 190 and recovers from stalls and spins very easily - with 30mm cannons it's like the a9 used to be - except you can also dogfight with it and it's faster. It's no problem to hop onto most servers and just rack up kills against whatever. Offline the 109k4 has a better ai model - they separate more and go for alt whereas the kis tend to stay in close in a group (I allways fly against four). I've been practicing in the J - not the L - with no dive flaps - it's harder to fly but faster on the deck and besides - when my server turns into a ki84 farm and I limit it to '43 I'll be ready.

BuzzU
03-09-2004, 08:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sfbaytf:
Ok Now I gotta respond...so you play a game online and you look down on a person who is not a total geek and spends his life playing a computer game online.

That's why I don't bother playing games online. Too many idiots like you online who have an attitude.



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BuzzU:
Huh? I mean he's flying against the AI, as I was in the test. Everybody comes on and says the Ki-84 is tough with humans flying it. It probably is, but the AI flying the Ki-84 is not that tough to kill. Which was the point of my first post.

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Buzz
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto/mcguire3.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You have a hard time understanding English? Where did I put you down in any way? I was the only one on this thread that said I was fighting the AI like you. At the moment I don't play online. I don't have the time. Thanks for the insult. You should make sure of the facts before handing them out. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

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Buzz
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto/mcguire3.jpg

sfbaytf
03-09-2004, 08:34 PM
"No smart pilot involved in the original posters test."

Ok mabye I took it the wrong way and I don't want to get into a flame war...so let's just drop it.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BuzzU:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sfbaytf:
Ok Now I gotta respond...so you play a game online and you look down on a person who is not a total geek and spends his life playing a computer game online.

That's why I don't bother playing games online. Too many idiots like you online who have an attitude.



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BuzzU:
Huh? I mean he's flying against the AI, as I was in the test. Everybody comes on and says the Ki-84 is tough with humans flying it. It probably is, but the AI flying the Ki-84 is not that tough to kill. Which was the point of my first post.

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Buzz
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto/mcguire3.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You have a hard time understanding English? Where did I put you down in any way? I was the only one on this thread that said I was fighting the AI like you. At the moment I don't play online. I don't have the time. Thanks for the insult. You should make sure of the facts before handing them out. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

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Buzz
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto/mcguire3.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

BuzzU
03-09-2004, 08:45 PM
"No smart pilot involved in the original posters test."

Ivan misunderstood that too, and I explained it to him. Guys were coming on the thread, and talking about online play, and smart pilots flying the Ki-84. I said there weren't any smart pilots involved in your test, because you were flying against the AI. I WASN'T TALKING ABOUT YOU!!! The not smart pilots I was talking about were the AI. Get it now?

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Buzz
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto/mcguire3.jpg

Fillmore
03-09-2004, 09:02 PM
What makes anyone think the P38 will own Kis at high altitude? If Il-2compare is any indicator (and for top level speeds it is for most planes) the P38 has no advantages at high altitude. Looking at Il2 compare P38 has a couple altitudes where top speeds are equal (otherwise it is much slower), but it is outturned and has no climb advantage so I would think that it gets pwned across the board. From 5000-7000m the Ki spikes and has a big advantage, then by 8000m they are equal again (though ki climbs better at all alts - though climb may not be as correct in Il2 compare as top speeds are).

BuzzU
03-09-2004, 09:11 PM
Because we were talking about the AI. They don't know what to do at high altitude anymore than they do at low altitude.

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Buzz
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galingula
03-09-2004, 09:14 PM
Ahhh, the olden days

CHN_EagleHeart
03-09-2004, 09:20 PM
I had done some 1x P38L aganist 4xAce Ki84_1a or 1c's Quick mission.

Some use BNZ, some use BFM tac.
P38L BNZ Ki84 AI is simple. So I would not say more about it.

But to point it, I had found P38L has good ability in Energy-Flip, If I use it, just 4~5 rounds flips, ki84 will not follow...So P38L can easilier shot them down.

I had the trk files, But seemd no where to upload it to share. The alt is in about 1000m-3000m. Not too high.

BuzzU
03-09-2004, 09:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by galingula:
Ahhh, the olden days<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Looks like it, but the difference is I really wasn't spamming this time.

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Buzz
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