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View Full Version : Assassin's Creed III devs speak out against "easy mode" (new interview)



DoNNiEDaRkO50
09-04-2012, 04:19 AM
While the producer for notoriously difficult RPG Dark Souls is considering an "easy mode" in the series' next game, Assassin's Creed III lead designer Alex Hutchinson has spoken out against easy games.

Speaking to Edge, Hutchinson goes so far as to say he believes easy modes are "ruining" games.

"A lot of games have been ruined by easy modes," he said. "If you have a cover shooter and you switch it to easy and you don't haave to use cover, you kind of broke your game."

He continues: "It's like if I picked up a book and it said 'Do you want the easy version or the complicated version?' [Game designers] can simplify the language, you know; we can make it two syllables."

For those afraid Assassin's Creed III will considerably up the difficulty level, rest assured that balance is crucial for the team. "We're not trying to make a brutally difficult game, so we go through all the playtest data and make sure it works."
source : here (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/366279/assassins-creed-iii-devs-speak-out-against-easy-mode/)
Sounds promising !!
Also It's weird that CVG posts wrong information :confused:

Ork3n
09-04-2012, 04:45 AM
Hey Alex, i agree that Easy mode breaks game... **** how stupid it is to play god of war in easy mode, i don't even need to counter attack ._.

But i think that Hard mode wouldn't hurt the game, BUT do not make an achievement for doing the game in Hard. Take god of war example on that matter, they know their games in Very Hard are nearly imposible so they don't even put an archievement for doing it, instead they have the Challenges that are short and hard but uses normal dificidulty so after a few tries, people can find out what to di.

Also, i've been reading you've tried to make a combat system similar do arkham asylum and i think it's great you do so, however, in both Batman games and The Amazing Spiderman (which has a very similar combat), what was really funny was to sneak arround killing everyone. However, in both games we play as superheroes making it easier to sneak :X

I hope the combat is worth it unlike AcB :D

GunnarGunderson
09-04-2012, 04:47 AM
That's ironic considering AC is one of the easiest game series I've ever played. Does Hutchinson have anything against a hard mode?

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 04:48 AM
That's ironic considering AC is one of the easiest game series I've ever played. Does Hutchinson have anything against a hard mode?
Yeah... he couldn't win Mine sweeper

Ork3n
09-04-2012, 05:02 AM
That's ironic considering AC is one of the easiest game series I've ever played. Does Hutchinson have anything against a hard mode?

Not sure if you know but he was not the creative director of the any asasssin's creed game to date. And if the combat is as he said (similar to arkham asylum), it may not be hard to beat the enemies, but it will be interactive enough, unlike the AcB/R killstreaks.



Yeah... he couldn't win Mine sweeper

Mine sweeper is not hard ._.

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 05:05 AM
Mine sweeper is not hard ._.
Exactly..

ACfan443
09-04-2012, 08:55 AM
That's ironic considering AC is one of the easiest game series I've ever played. Does Hutchinson have anything against a hard mode?

That Leonardo flying machine mission in AC2 was freakin difficult, it felt like I was playing on torture mode

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 09:02 AM
That Leonardo flying machine mission in AC2 was freakin difficult, it felt like I was playing on torture mode
Really ? Hm..

Interesting..

playassassins1
09-04-2012, 09:26 AM
This is why I don't play that much shooters anymore. Even in a harder difficulty you won't have to use cover..... And it's good that Alex finally said it, Games are too easy nowadays, they just want to attract the mainstream audience... Thats what ruined Splinter Cell: Blacklist....

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 09:34 AM
It wasnt never hard to complete mission in AC series, but in some mission to get 100 % sync wasnt easy .And to be honest i dont know single game that was too hard for me.

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:09 AM
It wasnt never hard to complete mission in AC series, but in some mission to get 100 % sync wasnt easy .And to be honest i dont know single game that was too hard for me.

You should play - > Devil may cry ( Hell and Hell ) Or God of war ( God mode ) Or Dead Space ( Hard mode ) Or Uncharted ( Hard mode )

I really like hard mode... I normally play a game on ''normal mode''.. To see.. In what ''normal'' way the game should have been played, but in most games even this ''normal'' mode is easy.
So that's why it's so fun to find a challenge in HARD MODE! ... And in AC i ''NEVER'' died in combat ( only from jumping of buildings ) ...

It would be fun to .. ''really'' 'run'' away from guards... cause you can't overpower them.... i'm guessing nobody of the ac gamers had that feeling.
I mean... In ACR I even made special routes to kill groups of guards.... just for fun... and after you kill a dozen of templars.. it gets old....

But i asked the question at Alex a couple of weeks ago... he said '' he likes the ''normal'' difficulty of games ( not easier nor harder )
My reply on this was : 1. It would make the game ''hard to play'' so... the game hours would extend 2. Replay value 3. Hardcore games would find a challenge 3. Stealth would be used ! ( cause it would be necessary )

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 10:13 AM
i'm guessing nobody of the ac gamers had that feeling.
Explain..

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 10:24 AM
You should play - > Devil may cry ( Hell and Hell ) Or God of war ( God mode ) Or Dead Space ( Hard mode ) Or Uncharted ( Hard mode )

I really like hard mode... I normally play a game on ''normal mode''.. To see.. In what ''normal'' way the game should have been played, but in most games even this ''normal'' mode is easy.
So that's why it's so fun to find a challenge in HARD MODE! ... And in AC i ''NEVER'' died in combat ( only from jumping of buildings ) ...

It would be fun to .. ''really'' 'run'' away from guards... cause you can't overpower them.... i'm guessing nobody of the ac gamers had that feeling.
I mean... In ACR I even made special routes to kill groups of guards.... just for fun... and after you kill a dozen of templars.. it gets old....

But i asked the question at Alex a couple of weeks ago... he said '' he likes the ''normal'' difficulty of games ( not easier nor harder )
My reply on this was : 1. It would make the game ''hard to play'' so... the game hours would extend 2. Replay value 3. Hardcore games would find a challenge 3. Stealth would be used ! ( cause it would be necessary )

What feeling?

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:34 AM
What feeling?

Being scared of ''dying'' from guards in combat. ( Being overpowered ) And ''really'' fleeing from combat. ( something I miss in AC, oke He's an assassin. But even assassin should have their limits )

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 10:36 AM
Being scared of ''dying'' from guards in combat. ( Being overpowered ) And ''really'' fleeing from combat. ( something I miss in AC, oke He's an assassin. But even assassin should have their limits )
Oh wow, so you think every AC gamer never played anything but AC ?? Wow.. What a Concept..

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 10:38 AM
Being scared of ''dying'' from guards in combat. ( Being overpowered ) And ''really'' fleeing from combat. ( something I miss in AC, oke He's an assassin. But even assassin should have their limits )

I am not sure that i felt scared to die in any game lol.

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:40 AM
Oh wow, so you think every AC gamer never played anything but AC ?? Wow.. What a Concept..

No? I mean.. ''gamers who are playing assassin's creed '' never had that feeling in assassin's creed games. ?
You know what I am trying to say, don't get so defensive. ?

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:42 AM
I am not sure that i felt scared to die in any game lol.

Hell I'm scared to die in Mario? cause i have to play the whole lv again!? ... And if you don't have the tension of dying in most games.. you should play '' dark souls ''.

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 10:42 AM
No? I mean.. ''gamers who are playing assassin's creed '' never had that feeling in assassin's creed games. ?
You know what I am trying to say, don't get so defensive. ?

I think that AC gamers felt so many things that other gamers didnt ....or maybe i love AC series too much.

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 10:42 AM
No? I mean.. ''gamers who are playing assassin's creed '' never had that feeling in assassin's creed games. ?
You know what I am trying to say, don't get so defensive. ?
Defensive ? Pff Im not..

I just thought you were some COD fan-boy parading on AC gamers...

That makes it clearer, Thank you.. and no I never felt "Afraid" of dying in any game..

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:48 AM
Defensive ? Pff Im not..

I just thought you were some COD fan-boy parading on AC gamers...

That makes it clearer, Thank you.. and no I never felt "Afraid" of dying in any game..

Yeeezz.. COD. Blegh ... If I should play a first person shooter! Let it be Battlefield 3

Really? Maybe ''scared'' is the wrong english word. But you know what I mean. The heart-beating feeling you get when your health is low... while fighting a boss! come on! that tension!
Never had it in assassin's creed. While in the other games ( God of War,Dead Space, Devil may cry, Uncharted, ect. ( all the other good games I didn't mention ) Hell I even have the feeling while fighting the boss battle in fighting games ! )
...... Ah! I know another very good game that never had that ''tension'' .... L.A Noire. It's a really nice game.... But you know you ''cant'' die... therefore you don't have the '' I should be careful'' feeling while playing it.

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 10:49 AM
Hell I'm scared to die in Mario? cause i have to play the whole lv again!? ... And if you don't have the tension of dying in most games.. you should play '' dark souls ''.

eH not my type of game ...

playassassins1
09-04-2012, 10:51 AM
Yeeezz.. COD. Blegh ... If I should play a first person shooter! Let it be Battlefield 3

Really? Maybe ''scared'' is the wrong english word. But you know what I mean. The heart-beating feeling you get when your health is low... while fighting a boss! come on! that tension!
Never had it in assassin's creed. While in the other games ( God of War,Dead Space, Devil may cry, Uncharted, ect. ( all the other good games I didn't mention ) Hell I even have the feeling while fighting the boss battle in fighting games ! )
...... Ah! I know another very good game that never had that ''tension'' .... L.A Noire. It's a really nice game.... But you know you ''cant'' die... therefore you don't have the '' I should be careful'' feeling while playing it.

I wouldn't call Uncharted so hard... But that's me..

obliviondoll
09-04-2012, 10:53 AM
If it's true that the AC devs think easy games are ruining the industry, WHY ARE THEY STILL MAKING THE WORST EXAMPLES? No, really. Kingdom Hearts doesn't have a single boss fight that doesn't outclass the entire Assassin's Creed series in terms of difficulty. And they're DISNEY games. Disney is better at living up to what the Assassin's Creed devs are saying than AC devs are at fulfilling their own promises.

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:53 AM
I wouldn't call Uncharted so hard... But that's me..

Dude? Uncharted in Crushing mode? ( That's the fun of difficulties ) ... You can make it as hard as you want.

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:55 AM
If it's true that the AC devs think easy games are ruining the industry, WHY ARE THEY STILL MAKING THE WORST EXAMPLES? No, really. Kingdom Hearts doesn't have a single boss fight that doesn't outclass the entire Assassin's Creed series in terms of difficulty. And they're DISNEY games. Disney is better at living up to what the Assassin's Creed devs are saying than AC devs are at fulfilling their own promises.

Thumbs up for KH ! I was just a little kid when i played the first one? At what age will I be able to play the third ?

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 10:55 AM
Yeeezz.. COD. Blegh ... If I should play a first person shooter! Let it be Battlefield 3

Really? Maybe ''scared'' is the wrong english word. But you know what I mean. The heart-beating feeling you get when your health is low... while fighting a boss! come on! that tension!
Never had it in assassin's creed. While in the other games ( God of War,Dead Space, Devil may cry, Uncharted, ect. ( all the other good games I didn't mention ) Hell I even have the feeling while fighting the boss battle in fighting games ! )
...... Ah! I know another very good game that never had that ''tension'' .... L.A Noire. It's a really nice game.... But you know you ''cant'' die... therefore you don't have the '' I should be careful'' feeling while playing it.
Nah..

Last time I had that feeling.... I was 6 and I was fighting true Ogre... after that ? Never..

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 10:55 AM
Do you all really see AC as one of most easiest games?

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 10:59 AM
Nah..

Last time I had that feeling.... I was 6 and I was fighting true Ogre... after that ? Never..

DAMMM...... That sucks ?! I love that feeling. Gaming would feel boring without it... I like to be "sucked" in the tension of a game. Well If you play tekken you should fight against the computer on hard mode. ( Untill your heart start to beat ) OR PLAY AGAINST ME AND MY YOSHIMITSU ; ) hehe

ACfan443
09-04-2012, 11:01 AM
I was scared of the guards in AC1 probably because it had a much darker atmosphere, plus that red beeping abstergo logo just symbolised danger .

And yes M, I did find the flying machine mission pretty difficult, it took me like 100 tries to finally get to the plaza(or whatever it was called) and hearing "MI COSA...SHOOT! SHOOT THE FLYING DEMON!" over and over again scarred my brain and left me with absolutely no self worth. I hated that mission :L

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:01 AM
Do you all really see AC as one of most easiest games?

Not ''most''. But It is very easy. I would play it a lot more and longer if you could have a ''hard'' mode or something. I like when i need to retry a level 10 times before I get it right! ( Makes you feel so good )

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 11:02 AM
DAMMM...... That sucks ?! I love that feeling. Gaming would feel boring without it... I like to be "sucked" in the tension of a game. Well If you play tekken you should fight against the computer on hard mode. ( Untill your heart start to beat ) OR PLAY AGAINST ME AND MY YOSHIMITSU ; ) hehe

Well I assume that is your opinion and feelings

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 11:04 AM
DAMMM...... That sucks ?! I love that feeling. Gaming would feel boring without it... I like to be "sucked" in the tension of a game. Well If you play tekken you should fight against the computer on hard mode. ( Untill your heart start to beat ) OR PLAY AGAINST ME AND MY YOSHIMITSU ; ) hehe
Mate... I`v finished Tekken from cover to cover on hard Mode, Beat Uncharted on Hard Mode, Beat Mafia II on Extreme, Beat every spider man game on hard, Beat every Spyro game on hard, beat every Street fighter on extreme, beat GOW on God, raped Mario on every Mode, Finished Sin city on hard and destroyed Max Payne..

Never did I have those "Tensions".... ever..


I was scared of the guards in AC1 probably because it had a much darker atmosphere, plus that red beeping abstergo logo just symbolised danger .

And yes M, I did find the flying machine mission pretty difficult, it took me like 100 tries to finally get to the plaza(or whatever it was called) and hearing "MI COSA...SHOOT! SHOOT THE FLYING DEMON!" over and over again scarred my brain and left me with absolutely no self worth. I hated that mission :L

I usually just kill myself to hear that line xD

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:04 AM
I was scared of the guards in AC1 probably because it had a much darker atmosphere, plus that red beeping abstergo logo just symbolised danger .And yes M, I did find the flying machine mission pretty difficult, it took me like 100 tries to finally get to the plaza(or whatever it was called) and hearing "MI COSA...SHOOT! SHOOT THE FLYING DEMON!" over and over again scarred my brain and left me with absolutely no self worth. I hated that mission :LYeah The first 2 heavily armed Templars you needed to kill in the Kingdom. Where really hard ! .. They looked so powerfull..... to bad you could easy kill them while in the air. ( but only ***** assassin would do that ! ) .. I liked fighting them face to face.

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:08 AM
Mate... I`v finished Tekken from cover to cover on hard Mode, Beat Uncharted on Hard Mode, Beat Mafia II on Extreme, Beat every spider man game on hard, Beat every Spyro game on hard, beat every Street fighter on extreme, beat GOW on God, raped Mario on every Mode, Finished Sin city on hard and destroyed Max Payne..

Never did I have those "Tensions".... ever..



I usually just kill myself to hear that line xD

hehe ... That sucks ... Well time to find another hobby!
You should cam some of your gameplay. Cause it's really hard to believe you finished Devil May cry on HELL OR HELL ?

But Hey! I'm gladd I still find the tension in some ''hard modes'' ... Or els I should be shouting '' Make your games harder!!! ''

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 11:09 AM
hehe ... That sucks ... Well time to find another hobby!
You should cam some of your gameplay. Cause it's really hard to believe you finished Devil May cry on HELL OR HELL ?

But Hey! I'm gladd I still find the tension in some ''hard modes'' ... Or els I should be shouting '' Make your games harder!!! ''
You make it sound like i`m sick or something...

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:10 AM
Well I assume that is your opinion and feelings

Yeah.. i said '' I LOVE ''... I don't say '' you NEED TO LOVE THAT FEELING ''.
I'm not saying AC should make the game ''harder''! just because of me!.. i'm just asking or hoping or wanting they made a hard mode ( optional )... So that every gamer can play the game on the level they need to find the ''tension'' in combat. = Everybody happy

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:13 AM
You make it sound like i`m sick or something...

No, just sad. ( it's sad to see a gamer with no challenge in gameplay ) ( They should make a mode just for the dubble hardcore gamers then, like you ) Anyway we are getting off-topic.

Chocoburger
09-04-2012, 11:15 AM
I'm going to disagree with Alex. The people reading his interview, us the core gamers, we don't need 'easy mode'. But there are countless gamers out there that need to play with less of a challenge, be it a young child, or an adult newbie to gaming in general, there is no reason to exclude them. I've seen newbies try to comprehend complex gaming, and it is not a pretty sight. Easy mode is for them, not for us.

That said, I actually enjoy AC series being fairly easy games, if it got too challenging it could become frustrating quickly. I love AC as an 'experience' and not so much as a challenge that many other games offer.

Assassin_M
09-04-2012, 11:17 AM
No, just sad. ( it's sad to see a gamer with no challenge in gameplay ) ( They should make a mode just for the dubble hardcore gamers then, like you ) Anyway we are getting off-topic.
I do not have to be "Tensioned" or "Afraid" all the time to actually feel the challenge of a Game... I don't know about you, but when I find a game EXTREMELY hard or am put in a "scary" position or situation, I just use experience and analyze the thing and I still enjoy the game immensely..

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:19 AM
I'm going to disagree with Alex. The people reading his interview, us the core gamers, we don't need 'easy mode'. But there are countless gamers out there that need to play with less of a challenge, be it a young child, or an adult newbie to gaming in general, there is no reason to exclude them. I've seen newbies try to comprehend complex gaming, and it is not a pretty sight. Easy mode is for them, not for us.

That said, I actually enjoy AC series being fairly easy games, if it got too challenging it could become frustrating quickly. I love AC as an 'experience' and not so much as a challenge that many other games offer.

And what if the ''modes'' were optional ? They you could choose between the ''challenge'' or just the ''experience''. Or you could play both!?

obliviondoll
09-04-2012, 11:20 AM
Do you all really see AC as one of most easiest games?

I can honestly say that I've played games which only use 2 buttons and are more challenging than Assassin's Creed. Every game I've played so far in the series has fallen well short of most games' easy modes. ACR is the closest to offering a challenge, and it does it the wrong-est way.

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 11:22 AM
I can honestly say that I've played games which only use 2 buttons and are more challenging than Assassin's Creed. Every game I've played so far in the series has fallen well short of most games' easy modes. ACR is the closest to offering a challenge, and it does it the wrong-est way.

Wow you are really talented.

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:23 AM
I do not have to be "Tensioned" or "Afraid" all the time to actually feel the challenge of a Game... I don't know about you, but when I find a game EXTREMELY hard or am put in a "scary" position or situation, I just use experience and analyze the thing and I still enjoy the game immensely..

I just like to beat something.. that's ''bigger'' then me. But that's al ''personal''.
AC didn't give me that feeling in the prev games. ( And even without it it gave me the shivers ). SO it isn't the only thing I like or seek in games.
It's just something i miss in AC. But as I said that personal, Let's stick to the ''modes'' option topic.

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:28 AM
I can honestly say that I've played games which only use 2 buttons and are more challenging than Assassin's Creed. Every game I've played so far in the series has fallen well short of most games' easy modes. ACR is the closest to offering a challenge, and it does it the wrong-est way.

You are over acting it. But there is a truth in it. In ACR you needed to ''make'' your own challenges, cause everyone could kill thousand of guards. ( especially with the bombs ) Therefore ac gamers tried to kill templars the ''coolest'' way. But.. I'm thinking If the combat is ''hard'' You ''must'' use the stealth gameplay and all your tools to make ''any'' kill.

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 11:33 AM
I like stealth ,but i only would use it if there is too many guards i prefer more combat,so Ubisoft should make it more difficult to figh to many guys with guns so you should sometimes use stealt more often not just if mission demands .

corbinmahieu
09-04-2012, 11:36 AM
I like stealth ,but i only would use it if there is too many guards i prefer more combat,so Ubisoft should make it more difficult to figh to many guys with guns so you should sometimes use stealt more often not just if mission demands .

True! ... I always 'try'' to play stealthy .. but when i fail I just kill everybody in one ''chain'. ( because I can ! ) ... It's really hard to play stealthy when it's so easy to kill everybody.
( I sometimes see Hitman ( or MGS or Splinter cell )as the modern Assassin's creed... In that franchise it's ''easier'' to play stealthy.. cause they game really favors stealthy gameplay )

pacmanate
09-04-2012, 11:58 AM
I don't think Assassin's Creed games have ever been hard or easy. It is just right, and AC games aren't about it being hard, personally I think they are more for the fun, the story, the fluidity and the scale.
I rarely ever die in combat in AC games, more just me being stupid and jumping of a building when I forget I don't have parachutes.
That being said overall AC had me more "on edge" so to speak seeing as there were no smelling salts to get high off and refill my health bar which is why in AC3 I am glad its back to an AC1 style. I would hate for Connor to be addicted to Cat Nip or a wolf equivalent.

TheHumanTowel
09-04-2012, 12:14 PM
I don't agree with him. Games that have multiple levels of difficulty add replay value and can make the game appealing to inexperienced and hardcore gamers. Comparing a game with easy mode to a book with a complicated and less complicated mode is just wrong. Video games are their own unique medium and playing games is a completely different experience than reading a book and people who buy games are looking for a different experience than what a book offers. There isn't always an equivalent for a feature in gaming in another medium.

I don't see how easy mode "ruins" games when it's completely optional. If you don't want to play the game on easy play it on normal then.

LightRey
09-04-2012, 12:46 PM
I agree with him mostly. Though I am not against easy modes per se, I think making a game easier or hard than the "regular way", so to speak, makes it deviate from its essence and story. Things that would have been really hard for the main character in the story could be something you breezed through on easy mode. That kills immersion among other things. The same thing goes for things that would've been (relatively) easy for the main character on hard mode.

With Assassin's Creed specifically, they've always been adamant on making gameplay and story part of the same thing, that becomes a practical (if not entire) impossibility with different difficulty settings.

Other than all that, the idea of games having to be especially challenging I think is archaic and something to be reserved for games specifically designed for challenge. I am one to play games for their story and I think their difficulty should match that in the sense that any player would be able to acquire the skill that would reflect the abilities of the main character and at the same time still feel similarly challenged. Of course, (overly) experienced players will then still find the games easy, but there's little that can be done about that. Difficulty settings generally will not really fix that, just put a proverbial band-aid on it.

SixKeys
09-04-2012, 02:37 PM
And what if the ''modes'' were optional ? They you could choose between the ''challenge'' or just the ''experience''. Or you could play both!?

The challenge is part of the experience, though. You get a completely different experience from a game where you plow through enemies like they're made of cardboard and a game where you actually have to think about strategy and worry that making one wrong move will send you back to the beginning.

While AC1 wasn't hard, it did have at least a little more challenge than the Ezio games. From AC2 onwards the games HAVE basically been on Easy mode thanks to medicine. Hopefully the changes to combat in AC3 will create a nice balance for a game that both experienced and casual gamers can enjoy.

RatonhnhakeFan
09-04-2012, 03:12 PM
Alex is on a roll lol

freddie_1897
09-04-2012, 03:14 PM
couldn't help but notice the article in the related articles bit saying 'AC3 creative designer accuses game critics of subtle racism'

RatonhnhakeFan
09-04-2012, 03:15 PM
couldn't help but notice the article in the related articles bit saying 'AC3 creative designer accuses game critics of subtle racism'

That's why I said Alex is on a roll :p

Kit572
09-04-2012, 03:16 PM
Really? Whats it say?

freddie_1897
09-04-2012, 03:17 PM
Really? Whats it say?
they are racist because they give japanese games high ratings no matter what. people were complaining about AC releasing the same thing every year but mario do it all the time and still get really high scores

Kit572
09-04-2012, 03:22 PM
Oh. Okay.

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 04:07 PM
I don't think Assassin's Creed games have ever been hard or easy. It is just right, and AC games aren't about it being hard, personally I think they are more for the fun, the story, the fluidity and the scale.
I rarely ever die in combat in AC games, more just me being stupid and jumping of a building when I forget I don't have parachutes.
That being said overall AC had me more "on edge" so to speak seeing as there were no smelling salts to get high off and refill my health bar which is why in AC3 I am glad its back to an AC1 style. I would hate for Connor to be addicted to Cat Nip or a wolf equivalent.

Completly agree ,couldnt say it better myself :D ,,IT IS JUST RIGHT,,

HisSpiritLives
09-04-2012, 04:09 PM
The challenge is part of the experience, though. You get a completely different experience from a game where you plow through enemies like they're made of cardboard and a game where you actually have to think about strategy and worry that making one wrong move will send you back to the beginning.

While AC1 wasn't hard, it did have at least a little more challenge than the Ezio games. From AC2 onwards the games HAVE basically been on Easy mode thanks to medicine. Hopefully the changes to combat in AC3 will create a nice balance for a game that both experienced and casual gamers can enjoy.

I think combat will be harder because no magic potions >medicines and those enemies have guns.

Kit572
09-04-2012, 04:12 PM
^But connor can always use a friendly british/american soldier as a human-shield...

dxsxhxcx
09-04-2012, 04:45 PM
I agree with him mostly. Though I am not against easy modes per se, I think making a game easier or hard than the "regular way", so to speak, makes it deviate from its essence and story. Things that would have been really hard for the main character in the story could be something you breezed through on easy mode. That kills immersion among other things. The same thing goes for things that would've been (relatively) easy for the main character on hard mode.

this will depend by how each PLAYER see the character/story and not the game, IMO Ezio defeating a legion of soldiers by himself in a matter of seconds is way more immersion breaking than play the game in different modes...



With Assassin's Creed specifically, they've always been adamant on making gameplay and story part of the same thing, that becomes a practical (if not entire) impossibility with different difficulty settings.

[SPOILER - ACR ENDING]

we see Desmond waking up at the end of ACR but after the credits we are back to the Black Room without a proper explanation to why that happened (and I doubt we'll ever have one), so if they can break their own rule (of make everything makes sense gameplay/story-wise) in this case for the sake of gameplay why can't they break their rule for something like different difficulty settings that would be completely optional, there's also the recap cutscene that IMO doesn't make sense story-wise (it doesn't fit with the story like some other elements, why the hell would Desmond need to recap his own story at the beginning of every game?!) and the ending of AC2 where we fight the Abstergo guards while the credits roll, where is their "golden rule" during these moments?!

Something so trivial like this excuse they made to make everything makes sense should be the last thing to stop them from adding features that could be atractive for the players and make the game more interesting (gameplay-wise), immersion IMO comes from a good story and not from little details like this, if during the Desmond sequences we had a health bar and could be killed this would be the last thing that would worry me if the story is good and something like this would make possible for them to focus more in the modern day part and make the whole story much more interesting than already is...

Blind2Society
09-04-2012, 04:45 PM
I don't think the devs have any right to say whether an easy difficulty ruins a game. It's up to the fans (consumers) to decide whether the game was ruined or not. Some people may like the easy road and others might not. That is why the option to change difficulty should always be there.

matheus_737
09-04-2012, 10:05 PM
so I hope I have a real and difficult challenge for the first time in the series because every thingis good in all games but not in terms of challenge so Alex make some badass missions and hard misssion please.

matheus_737
09-04-2012, 10:07 PM
I don't think the devs have any right to say whether an easy difficulty ruins a game. It's up to the fans (consumers) to decide whether the game was ruined or not. Some people may like the easy road and others might not. That is why the option to change difficulty should always be there.

That's what I think too good point, difficulty level always !!!!

Chocoburger
09-05-2012, 01:06 AM
And what if the ''modes'' were optional ? They you could choose between the ''challenge'' or just the ''experience''. Or you could play both!?
As long as Achievements or Trophies weren't tied to a 'hard mode' I would be okay with having it in the game. :)

But the fact is, if it were in the game, then a Ach/Tro would be tied to do it, no way getting around that. :(

Calvarok
09-05-2012, 01:38 AM
He didn't say it's bad if a game is easy, he said that if games have easy modes which make playing the game as intended unnecessay, that's bad. And I agree. You can have a normal mode and a hard mode, but easy mode will always be a terrible version of what the game is supposed to be.

Umbra_Blade
09-05-2012, 02:29 AM
I think it is a good idea to have difficulty settings, but I think if it was to be done it should be done in a fashion similar to MW2 (wait, wait , hear me out:p). At the start of the game when going through a tutorial, the game assesses how well you play and then recommends a difficulty to you, this way each individual gamer gets an experience to suit their own skill to provide enough of a challenge, without the game becoming "broken" for them.

D.I.D.
09-05-2012, 03:01 AM
There have been times when I would not have bothered finishing a game if there had not been an Easy mode. It's not always about difficulty, either.

There are certain games with poorly implemented combat, where I could slug it out but it's not actually enjoyable to do so. Being able to switch into a mode where enemies take, say, four hits to kill instead of eight allowed me get through the combat faster to enjoy the things those games did really well: great art, fun exploration, interesting story.

I really appreciate the rare games which scale down the difficulty temporarily if you're having to restart one area lots of times. This is especially a problem with cinematic games, where you end up seeing the same set pieces and script multiple times before you finally get through that section, which sabotages the whole idea of the game mimicking cinema at all. GTA IV was pretty easy, so few players realised the feature was even there, but they recorded hours of alternative script for every mission so that you'd hear a different conversation on subsequent replays. I hope more developers will do that with the next-gen machines when the storage capacity of NeXtBox and PS4 discs/downloads are more equal.

Most of us will never play a game on an easier level than Normal, but we shouldn't crow about it as if it proves something about us. Remember that there are players who want to experience the games in different ways, and that some people's reaction times simply aren't up to it – plus we're all getting older, and I'd quite like to be able to pick up a game and play it when I'm 80! Also, there are people with physical disabilities which prevent them from playing games on tougher difficulty settings. There was a lot of sympathy here for the player who requested a controller remap feature for AC3, and the same applies here.

dxsxhxcx
09-05-2012, 03:04 AM
He didn't say it's bad if a game is easy, he said that if games have easy modes which make playing the game as intended unnecessay, that's bad. And I agree. You can have a normal mode and a hard mode, but easy mode will always be a terrible version of what the game is supposed to be.

IMO is up to the player to choose what kind of experience he/she wants from a game, A hard game by default will never please someone who prefers to have a smoothly experience because this isn't the kind of experience this kind of player looks for in a game, the same applies for someone who prefers the other way around, the best way to ensure both kind of players will have what they're looking for is by giving them the option to choose in which difficulty they want to play.

D.I.D.
09-05-2012, 03:07 AM
The challenge is part of the experience, though. You get a completely different experience from a game where you plow through enemies like they're made of cardboard and a game where you actually have to think about strategy and worry that making one wrong move will send you back to the beginning.

While AC1 wasn't hard, it did have at least a little more challenge than the Ezio games. From AC2 onwards the games HAVE basically been on Easy mode thanks to medicine. Hopefully the changes to combat in AC3 will create a nice balance for a game that both experienced and casual gamers can enjoy.

On that score, I'd like to see the difficulty rely more on intelligence than reactions in AC. I do want to see the game get harder than it is now, but I'd like the solution to be smarter use of items and the environment. I was attracted to this series because I generally prefer agile, light, clever characters to barrel-chested warriors, so a puzzle aspect to the assassinations would suit me better.

SixKeys
09-05-2012, 03:23 AM
On that score, I'd like to see the difficulty rely more on intelligence than reactions in AC. I do want to see the game get harder than it is now, but I'd like the solution to be smarter use of items and the environment. I was attracted to this series because I generally prefer agile, light, clever characters to barrel-chested warriors, so a puzzle aspect to the assassinations would suit me better.

Can you elaborate? Do you mean we should be able to pick up and use objects during fights or that we should adjust our use of the items we already have according to the situation? (E.g. switch from a delicate dagger to a heavy axe if your opponent is wearing heavy armor.)

Ork3n
09-05-2012, 03:37 AM
Defensive ? Pff Im not..

I just thought you were some COD fan-boy parading on AC gamers...

That makes it clearer, Thank you.. and no I never felt "Afraid" of dying in any game..

Stop using Cod fan as an insult of any kind. Just STOP it.

This is the kind of actitudes that make society suck. Your likes are not superior and therefor you should not treat others' likes as inferior. If someone like Call of Duty let it be, personally, i like the call of duty singleplayer and only because you can't enjoy the game, it doesn't mean ejoying it means being a kid or a ****** or whatever you believe I am.

Black_Widow9
09-05-2012, 03:41 AM
Unless you guys need to take a break from the Forums I suggest you get back on Topic.

Assassin_M
09-05-2012, 03:41 AM
Stop using Cod fan as an insult of any kind. Just STOP it.

This is the kind of actitudes that make society suck. Your likes are not superior and therefor you should not treat others' likes as inferior. If someone like Call of Duty let it be, personally, i like the call of duty singleplayer and only because you can't enjoy the game, it doesn't mean ejoying it means being a kid or a ****** or whatever you believe I am.
BATMAN TO THE RESCUE !! Upholding justice against bad, evil M..

I said "Fan-boys" there is a difference between a "Fan-boy" and a "CoD-Fan" Yeah ? and try going out for a while... you know.. meeting people... find something else to do other than trying to kick my butt every now and then..

Back on-topic..

Unless you guys need to take a break from the Forums I suggest you get back on Topic.

And guys ?? he dug up an old post of mine and raged all over it...So you put me in the same light as him ??

D.I.D.
09-05-2012, 03:42 AM
Can you elaborate? Do you mean we should be able to pick up and use objects during fights or that we should adjust our use of the items we already have according to the situation? (E.g. switch from a delicate dagger to a heavy axe if your opponent is wearing heavy armor.)

I'd like the game to be completely reimagined, for the designers to think again about how a real assassin would approach their job.

"Assassin" has become almost meaningless now, like they're just a kind of tribe called Assassin against another tribe called Templar. I liked Bartolomeo's character, but the idea of him as an Assassin was ridiculous: a blundering loudmouth with a five-foot sword! Ezio, and seemingly Connor too, made the player a one man army. I should be afraid of guards, and rarely engage them. A few guards close together should be capable of seriously hurting and/or killing me if I attack them with melee. At my best, if I take on three guards, I should only be able to fight a couple at once, and the third man ought to be running away to get help.

A real assassin would be quiet. He or she might use light sources to change the environment, maybe snuffing out some lights, but also perhaps placing lights in other spots to create useful shadows elsewhere. Maybe they would disturb those groups of pigeons at a distance to use the distraction to their advantage. I ought to worry about using weapons that make noise, whereas as things stand guns don't attract much attention at all. I want to use noisy things in the environment to allow me to use noisy tactics that wouldn't work elsewhere (for example, if we go into a mechanical age in history, the player could have an easier time using noisy weaponry near a loud machine). Perhaps my target would be heading to a room which would make my kill very difficult, but I could steal guards' keys or otherwise block corridors to force the victim into a different room in a building.

kudos17
09-05-2012, 03:52 AM
Alex, Alex, Alex...

Why on earth would you call out other games' difficulty when you're making a game like AC3? That's basically giving people an irony gun and asking them to aim for the head.

BATISTABUS
09-05-2012, 04:09 AM
The hardest levels in the AC games are the missions where you control something that isn't an Assassin. This includes horse-drawn carriages and Da Vinci's inventions. The problem is that they're hard because of bad controls or bad conveyance. It's either very difficult to control the machine, you can't figure out how to kill your enemies (first carriage chase in Revelations), or both.

SixKeys
09-05-2012, 04:37 AM
I'd like the game to be completely reimagined, for the designers to think again about how a real assassin would approach their job.

"Assassin" has become almost meaningless now, like they're just a kind of tribe called Assassin against another tribe called Templar. I liked Bartolomeo's character, but the idea of him as an Assassin was ridiculous: a blundering loudmouth with a five-foot sword! Ezio, and seemingly Connor too, made the player a one man army. I should be afraid of guards, and rarely engage them. A few guards close together should be capable of seriously hurting and/or killing me if I attack them with melee. At my best, if I take on three guards, I should only be able to fight a couple at once, and the third man ought to be running away to get help.

A real assassin would be quiet. He or she might use light sources to change the environment, maybe snuffing out some lights, but also perhaps placing lights in other spots to create useful shadows elsewhere. Maybe they would disturb those groups of pigeons at a distance to use the distraction to their advantage. I ought to worry about using weapons that make noise, whereas as things stand guns don't attract much attention at all. I want to use noisy things in the environment to allow me to use noisy tactics that wouldn't work elsewhere (for example, if we go into a mechanical age in history, the player could have an easier time using noisy weaponry near a loud machine). Perhaps my target would be heading to a room which would make my kill very difficult, but I could steal guards' keys or otherwise block corridors to force the victim into a different room in a building.

I don't quite agree. The real life Hashashin made a point of performing their assassinations in broad daylight. They weren't necessarily quiet about it. Even in modern day real life an assassin is simply someone whose job it is to kill an assigned target. Subtle poison or blowing up a building are both acceptable methods, anything that gets the job done. In the games silent kills are more challenging which is what makes stealth a more fun option (IMO), but I don't think it should always be forced on the players. An assassin doesn't have to be one way or always choose the subtle approach. I liked Bartolomeo and Mario in AC2 exactly because they were different from what you'd expect from an assassin, yet just as efficient.

I do agree that it shouldn't be possible (or at least encouraged) to use every weapon in every environment. I generally don't like using the gun in the Ezio games because it's unrealistic that hardly anyone ever seems to pay attention to the loud bang. I like the idea of noisy machines masking the sound, but I imagine such a thing would be very difficult to program. Enemies should always have a certain range at which they can hear and see things the player does - in reality anyone could hear a gunshot from a mile away - and having that range be dynamically affected by the environment would make for some unpredictable enemy behavior. I can foresee players complaining when they were spotted one time but not another when doing the exact same thing because for some reason the enemy AI didn't react properly to the environment on the second playthrough.

ProletariatPleb
09-05-2012, 06:54 AM
Couldn't help but laugh....AC is pretty much an easy mode ._. game

D.I.D.
09-05-2012, 09:13 AM
I don't quite agree. The real life Hashashin made a point of performing their assassinations in broad daylight. They weren't necessarily quiet about it. Even in modern day real life an assassin is simply someone whose job it is to kill an assigned target. Subtle poison or blowing up a building are both acceptable methods, anything that gets the job done. In the games silent kills are more challenging which is what makes stealth a more fun option (IMO), but I don't think it should always be forced on the players. An assassin doesn't have to be one way or always choose the subtle approach. I liked Bartolomeo and Mario in AC2 exactly because they were different from what you'd expect from an assassin, yet just as efficient.

I do agree that it shouldn't be possible (or at least encouraged) to use every weapon in every environment. I generally don't like using the gun in the Ezio games because it's unrealistic that hardly anyone ever seems to pay attention to the loud bang. I like the idea of noisy machines masking the sound, but I imagine such a thing would be very difficult to program. Enemies should always have a certain range at which they can hear and see things the player does - in reality anyone could hear a gunshot from a mile away - and having that range be dynamically affected by the environment would make for some unpredictable enemy behavior. I can foresee players complaining when they were spotted one time but not another when doing the exact same thing because for some reason the enemy AI didn't react properly to the environment on the second playthrough.

I see that point about the Hashashin, although of course in AC1 Al Mualim leaned towards silent kills unless the job required a very public killing. I wouldn't advocate jumping from one kind of narrowness to another, so I would like the big kills to stay too. I just feel that, just as the game's theme attracted me in the past, a newcomer arriving at AC3 would perhaps be disappointed if they came to the series because he/she found the assassin image intriguing.

No matter what the 11th century Hashashin did, by Ezio's period of history assassination was mostly a subtle affair. I'm all for choice in play styles, but it's very out of balance with the recent moves towards balletic multikills. Maybe AC3 is going to fix that element of danger, but ultimately they're still trying to find a way to make these mass killings work. I suppose it's too late now, and maybe there's no way back; perhaps this is the type of combat with which AC will be associated in the future.

I'm not 100% against it, if the game world reacts to that choice. It could be similar to those moments when you've only got a couple of bullets in a gun, and deciding when and how to use them is important. I'd be fine with knowing I could swoop down from my hiding place and kill those five guards if there were permanent consequences – choose the easy kill now and gain an advantage in this mission, but know that you'll cause later missions in this district to be much more heavily defended because of the terror you've caused. I really hope Dishonored lives up to the promise of its gameplay demos, because it looks as though they've brought back that exact feeling of being a very dangerous character but also very tense. It looks as though you'll always be weighing up the benefits of each kind of approach before you execute each action, and if the ability to alter lasting circumstances is true then there should be a lot of replay value there.

I see what you mean about the noise vs gunshot thing. That wasn't the best example, and I should have used the example of a bow instead (since bows are actually pretty loud in a quiet location). I've had more ideas since then, and a lot of them are pretty simple. Choosing to close curtains could even be a mechanism (trading a little visual security for the risk of an NPC noticing that something is out of place). I realise there are AI problems here, but nobody's going to be able to hide from this in the coming years. I wouldn't be surprised to see companies working on nothing but AI engines and farming them out to developers in the future, in the same way some companies make graphics and physics engines now.

AustinGamer
09-05-2012, 10:56 AM
Brad ! truly said. I think Assassin's Creed needs a hard mode to be honest.

LightRey
09-05-2012, 01:05 PM
this will depend by how each PLAYER see the character/story and not the game, IMO Ezio defeating a legion of soldiers by himself in a matter of seconds is way more immersion breaking than play the game in different modes...




[SPOILER - ACR ENDING]

we see Desmond waking up at the end of ACR but after the credits we are back to the Black Room without a proper explanation to why that happened (and I doubt we'll ever have one), so if they can break their own rule (of make everything makes sense gameplay/story-wise) in this case for the sake of gameplay why can't they break their rule for something like different difficulty settings that would be completely optional, there's also the recap cutscene that IMO doesn't make sense story-wise (it doesn't fit with the story like some other elements, why the hell would Desmond need to recap his own story at the beginning of every game?!) and the ending of AC2 where we fight the Abstergo guards while the credits roll, where is their "golden rule" during these moments?!

Something so trivial like this excuse they made to make everything makes sense should be the last thing to stop them from adding features that could be atractive for the players and make the game more interesting (gameplay-wise), immersion IMO comes from a good story and not from little details like this, if during the Desmond sequences we had a health bar and could be killed this would be the last thing that would worry me if the story is good and something like this would make possible for them to focus more in the modern day part and make the whole story much more interesting than already is...
You're jumping to conclusions all over the place here. First of all I'm not saying the game should be too easy. As I made quite clear, I'm as much against an "easy" mode as I am against a "hard" mode.

The problem with your reasoning here is that you're not looking at the alternatives. For instance, ACR had to end with Desmond waking up out of his coma (that was the whole point), but they can't really put in a free-roaming Desmond segment in at the last point. That would be way too much work for a small bit like that story-wise. Besides, they don't even want to be explored that much. It's a cliffhanger. It has to end there without giving people the ability to take all the time they want to look around and study every bit in there.
What do we have left then? The animus. There's no good story reason to put him back in there, but they need him to be in there or you have to take away the entire concept of replayability, which would be ridiculous. It's a small sacrifice on the basis of story to preserve a key feature of the game, assuming it even is one, as theoretically there could well still be an explanation.

The same goes for everything else you've mentioned. In every case it's a small sacrifice for the sake of convenience, for the sake of enjoyment.

This does not apply to difficulty settings. It has never been a part of the AC franchise, it's an unnecessary and arguably not very popular theoretical addition and let's not forget it would take a huge amount of work to implement and test such a feature (and don't you dare pass it off as something that could be implemented easily), work I imagine they don't want to waste on such a, in their eyes (and mine for that matter), trivial matter.

You can't expect a game to have the perfect balance between story and gameplay, that's an (almost) impossible dream. The point is that the devs will make the sacrifices as small as possible for as great a prize as possible and I think that this example falls under that. That the sacrifice in story regarding difficulty settings, be they too easy or too hard, is too great and the feature itself too small a prize.

Finally, to several other people here, to claim that the devs don't have the "right" to say whether difficulty ruins a game is bs. They are in a sense artists and have the right, if not the necessity, to express their opinions, to have their own vision. If you do not agree with that, hell, if the (vast) majority of players does not agree with that, then too bad. If you disagree with an artist's vision then go appreciate some other art.

Ork3n
09-05-2012, 03:13 PM
The hardest levels in the AC games are the missions where you control something that isn't an Assassin. This includes horse-drawn carriages and Da Vinci's inventions. The problem is that they're hard because of bad controls or bad conveyance. It's either very difficult to control the machine, you can't figure out how to kill your enemies (first carriage chase in Revelations), or both.

o.o I see everyone complaining about this kind of stuff, am i the only one that found them everything but hard? ._. Would like to know if PC gamers found that hard, maybe for PC the machines controls are better? idk...

ProletariatPleb
09-05-2012, 03:18 PM
o.o I see everyone complaining about this kind of stuff, am i the only one that found them everything but hard? ._. Would like to know if PC gamers found that hard, maybe for PC the machines controls are better? idk...
Not for me.
Also from what I understand, he wasn't really saying they're hard, he was humorously saying that AC is an easy game and the only things that are...'hard' because of being different are those where we are not controlling our character like usual.