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Rushin Russian
08-02-2004, 02:06 PM
This might be common knowledge among you guys, but this question has always bugged me. What does the Bf designation for the 109's stand for? I've found that most WW2 veterans prefer to call them "Me109's," which makes more sense since it was manufactured by Messerschmitt, but the fact that it's more commonly refered to with the Bf designation has always puzzled me. Is it German?

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Supermarine Spitfire Mk. IXc

"On the European Front the most important development of the past year has been the crushing offensive of the Great Armies of Russia." - Franklin D. Roosevelt, April 1942

Rushin Russian
08-02-2004, 02:06 PM
This might be common knowledge among you guys, but this question has always bugged me. What does the Bf designation for the 109's stand for? I've found that most WW2 veterans prefer to call them "Me109's," which makes more sense since it was manufactured by Messerschmitt, but the fact that it's more commonly refered to with the Bf designation has always puzzled me. Is it German?

http://www.sighost.us/members/RushinRussian/il2sig.jpg
Supermarine Spitfire Mk. IXc

"On the European Front the most important development of the past year has been the crushing offensive of the Great Armies of Russia." - Franklin D. Roosevelt, April 1942

nickdanger3
08-02-2004, 02:10 PM
Thanks for asking since i wanna know too !

XyZspineZyX
08-02-2004, 02:10 PM
Bayerischen Flugzeugwerks.

Bavarian Aviation Works.

SUPERAEREO
08-02-2004, 02:11 PM
Bayerische Flugzeugwerke

That's Bavarian Aircraft Factory, which became Messerschmitt only later.

S!



"The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down." - Chuck Yaeger

"Ja, Hunde, wollt ihr denn ewig leben?" - Friedrich der Gro├če

"Timeo Danaos, et dona ferentes" - Ë*neid

Zyzbot
08-02-2004, 02:12 PM
Bayrische Flugzeugwerke produced the 109...hence the Bf-109 designation.

Rushin Russian
08-02-2004, 02:14 PM
Never would have guessed that...

Thanks guys!

http://www.sighost.us/members/RushinRussian/il2sig.jpg
Supermarine Spitfire Mk. IXc

"On the European Front the most important development of the past year has been the crushing offensive of the Great Armies of Russia." - Franklin D. Roosevelt, April 1942

Taylortony
08-02-2004, 02:15 PM
It is to do with where it is built and the company name.

Origins
The Messerschmitt Bf 109 began as an entry by the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke in a Luftwaffe (German Air Force) fighter competition in the early 1930's. Willy Messerschmitt's creation incorporated one of the most advanced aerodynamic designs at the time, with retractable landing gear, an enclosed cockpit, automatic slats, cantilever wings, and stressed skin construction. During the trials, the Bf 109 clearly outperformed the larger and heavier favorite, Heinkel's He 112. The first production model, the Bf 109B, began coming off the lines in 1936. The redesignation of the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke AG (Aktiengesellschaft or Corporation) to the Messerschmitt AG in 1938 led many to call it the Me 109, although the official Luftwaffe designation of the aircraft remained the Bf 109 throughout the war.


see http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/air_power/ap14.htm

Similar to BMW that is german for BAYERISCHE MOTOREN WERKE. Infact the BMW logo on the cars is a spinning prop harking back to their Aircraft Engine days.

Gooner01
08-02-2004, 02:28 PM
As mentioned, the "Bf" is for "Bayerische Flugzeugwerke"; in mid-1939, the aforementioned company was sold, to a consortium of investors headed by Bf's head designer, Willy Messerschmitt, and the Bf company was renamed, "Messerschmitt AG" - Thus, a/c designed after the sale receive the "ME" designation. But the -109 and -110, having been designed by the forerunner company, are usually referred to by the "Bf" prefix...

S! Gooner

Zayets
08-03-2004, 01:48 AM
Now you know what BMW stands for! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

EFG_Zeb
08-03-2004, 02:34 AM
Yes Zayets, and do you know what the BMW logo represents??? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"See, Decide, Attack, Reverse or Coffee Break" E.H.

SUPERAEREO
08-03-2004, 02:36 AM
The colours of the Bavarian coat of arms?

S!



"The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down." - Chuck Yaeger

"Ja, Hunde, wollt ihr denn ewig leben?" - Friedrich der Gro├če

"Timeo Danaos, et dona ferentes" - Ë*neid

EFG_Zeb
08-03-2004, 02:47 AM
Yes for the colors SUPERAERO, but that's not all... In fact this logo represents a stylized propeller... This is because BMW started out a an aero engine manufacturer long before making motocycles and cars...

Regards,

"See, Decide, Attack, Reverse or Coffee Break" E.H.

F19_Ob
08-03-2004, 02:51 AM
Bf 109 or Me 109 are both valid in ww2 research texts.....Both were also used during the war. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

IL2-chuter
08-03-2004, 02:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Taylortony:

The redesignation of the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke AG (Aktiengesellschaft or Corporation) to the Messerschmitt AG in 1938 led many to call it the Me 109, although the official Luftwaffe designation of the aircraft remained the Bf 109 throughout the war.


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



And yet while reading technical Luftwaffe reports you will find both Bf and Me used, often in the SAME report (I've even seen where post-war authors have CORRECTED such glaring mistakes by Luftwaffe officials http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif ). I believe Messerschmitt (both the man and the company) was just as happy if people referred to the 109 as an Me (He, the man, did so himself in a postwar engineering article).

Oddly, since there were no other 109's (i.e. Fw109, Bv109, Ar109) the number alone would be a definate ID . . . http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

"I fly only Full Real in Il2 Forgotten Battles." -Mark Donohue

Zayets
08-03-2004, 03:25 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EFG_Zeb:
Yes Zayets, and do you know what the BMW logo represents??? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"See, Decide, Attack, Reverse or Coffee Break" E.H.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well,there are two versions.First one,the most accepted one is that it derives from the arms of Bavaria (fusilly in bend argent and azure).
The second one says that it derives from the whirl of an aircraft propeller.We all know that BMW did aircraft engines in its beginning.
Focke Wulf anyone? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Zayets out

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Zayets
08-03-2004, 03:27 AM
Ah,Zeb already responded http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Zayets out

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EFG_Zeb
08-03-2004, 08:46 AM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Zayets...

And yes Focke Wulf all the way my friend...

"See, Decide, Attack, Reverse or Coffee Break" E.H.

ASM 1
08-03-2004, 09:40 AM
And was there not a post war company in east-germany called EMW, which shared the bmw spinner logo but it had red segments instead of blue....

I may be wrong of course but I'm sure I read this somewhere.... anyone?

S!

Andrew

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v299/asm016/WW2%20Stuff/Sig_Pic.jpg

Franzen
08-03-2004, 10:11 AM
I collect pics and movies from around WW2 time. I found some advertisements from a wartime aviation magizine. It's really interesting to see common company names of today and realize they were building planes or plane parts. Really cool. Wish I new how to post them on here. I'd be happy to share. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

My MSN Messenger address is ttbfranzen@hotmail.com . I'm online often and would be happy send file to anyone.

Fritz Franzen

NegativeGee
08-03-2004, 10:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ASM 1:
And was there not a post war company in east-germany called EMW, which shared the bmw spinner logo but it had red segments instead of blue....

I may be wrong of course but I'm sure I read this somewhere.... anyone?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay, you got me interested. Guess what google found:

http://www.emw-r35.de/logoKL.gif

EMW, Eisenacher Motoren Werke, is (or was more to the point) BMW. A history here:

http://8w.forix.com/df2-emw.html

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - G├╝nther Rall

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Look Noobie, we already told you, we don't have the Patch!