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View Full Version : 190A5 vs La-7/La-5FN



XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 08:46 PM
´ve been Flying FB on a Lan connection with another guy who frecuently flies online (thing that I cannot do, sadly).
The fact is that he literally wiped me out from the sky every time we engaged...
So, need help.

Here´s the cuestion:

You are flying an 190A5 (my, since a kid, favourite a/c) on a 1 vs 1 combat against an La5FN or La-7.
Wich tactics, maneouvres and engine procedures would you use to get the most from the "Wurger"?

I know this sounds as a silly cuestion, but I´d like to give him a surprise next time. Would apreciate you "experten" advise...(veterans cheats accepted)

Thanx!!

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 08:46 PM
´ve been Flying FB on a Lan connection with another guy who frecuently flies online (thing that I cannot do, sadly).
The fact is that he literally wiped me out from the sky every time we engaged...
So, need help.

Here´s the cuestion:

You are flying an 190A5 (my, since a kid, favourite a/c) on a 1 vs 1 combat against an La5FN or La-7.
Wich tactics, maneouvres and engine procedures would you use to get the most from the "Wurger"?

I know this sounds as a silly cuestion, but I´d like to give him a surprise next time. Would apreciate you "experten" advise...(veterans cheats accepted)

Thanx!!

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 08:54 PM
Get him to install the beta patch. The La5FN/La7 isn't as tough, and the Fw190 is improved.

Da Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:02 PM
LOL Bail out while you have a chance /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

The La5FN pretty much outclasses the A5 in every aspect....

Climb - La5FN is way superior
Turn Rate - Way better (as it should be)
Firepower, La5FN ShvaK cannons are more accurate with less dispersion and no real convergence. Hits to the wings are lethal for the 190 and engine kills are easy.

The MGFF (Outer wing cannons) of the 190A5 are lower velocity cannons - use at very close range. The MG's (7.92 mm) are almost useless but the Inner Cannons MG151/20 are fairly effective.

Against a half decent La5FN pilot you are dead meat. You have a better roll rate and decent speed so this is really all you can do to maximise your advantage. Bear in mind the La5FN is very hard to overheat, bleeds little energy, can dive faster than you (LOL) and has better overall handling characteristics.

Your best bet is somehthing like a FW190 A-9.

The La-7 is more powerful but the FN climbs better and is overall more nimble. The only thing you can do is use your superior roll-rate to gain angles on him and hope he does something stupid. Otherwise forget it.

JG5_UnKle

"Know and use all the capabilities of your airplane. If you don't sooner or later, somebody who does, will kick your ***"


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JG5_UnKle

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:05 PM
BuzzU wrote:
- Get him to install the beta patch. The La5FN/La7
- isn't as tough, and the Fw190 is improved.

So, as things are now, for you there´s no chance for the 190 to win that fight...

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:10 PM
I would say use B&Z tactics on him since he turns better, but he also has a better engine.

Get an Energy advantage on him.
Energy = Altitude + Speed
After that, win quickly.

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:11 PM
There is always a chance. you'll have to be a better pilot, because your plane is at a disadvantage You have to use altitude to your advantage, and take quick deflection shots at him. Once your at the same altitude/speed, your dead.

Da Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:12 PM
JG5_UnKle wrote:
- LOL Bail out while you have a chance /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
-
- The La5FN pretty much outclasses the A5 in every
- aspect....

"...Your best bet is somehthing like a FW190 A-9."


And wich a/c would be of your choice? I mean a stable fire platform, good speed and and acceptable maneouvre rating a/c...

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:16 PM
Use the Yak3 against him.

Da Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:20 PM
Hate to say it but... the 190Ax is not a 1v1 bird, it's a team bird....

... now, with that in mind... use the roll, Luke!

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:25 PM
BuzzU wrote:
- Use the Yak3 against him.


NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

If you're anything like me then you like a good challenge. Stay in the disadvantaged bird. He may have bragging rights in the beginning but you're gaining the most experience in the deal. Plus you'll be able to fly more planes having trained at a disadvantage. He'll be stuck in the uber (great, best) planes.


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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:29 PM
Gem,
He's trying to win at a game. Give him a break.

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:34 PM
A Yak-3... Never thought on it...

Anyway... What about headon passes? Dive, extend, make a high "g" loop and come back for another frontal shoot? (Sorry, I did this only against AI and works. Of course a human beign is different)

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:38 PM
Personally, i never do headons. To risky.Even a noob can get a lucky shot in a headon. Unless i'm in an A8, and your in a Mig../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:42 PM
alitomdq wrote:
- A Yak-3... Never thought on it...
-
- Anyway... What about headon passes? Dive, extend,
- make a high "g" loop and come back for another
- frontal shoot? (Sorry, I did this only against AI
- and works. Of course a human beign is different)



In a Yak-3 get level and out turn him (oh fun).

In the FW-190 A5 stay higher than him. Make him climb to you. If he goes into a steep climb watch him, when he loses speed and begins to nose down you be able to dive and strafe him with out him being able to lift his nose to return fire. After you pass him use the energy you built on the dive to climb back up out of his reach. Continue this until he's dead, but be quick because with the La-7 engine it wont take too long for him to reach you.




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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:43 PM
I say (in this instance, not always) "it's the pilot, not the plane"... what I mean is that maybe some use of psychological warfare is required here:

he's kicked your *** several times so chances are good that he's 1- fallen into a routine; 2- gotten used to your "standard" counter-maneuvers; and 3- become over-confident and liable to be a bit sloppy.

conclusion: surprise him take advantage of his overconfidence! let him think you're going to fight the way you normally combat him... if you avoided head-ons before, now play chicken as much as you can (the Fw can put up a heavy barrage, and is fairly well protected from the front), if you were trying to extend from the fight away before, now TnB when he's not expecting it... that kind of thing.

You may need to take greater risks too (if you're going down in a blaze of glory might as well make it a flamethrower rather than a bic, eh)- take very high deflection angle shots with mg; if he's on your six and you're doing scissors do the old "drop it all, last chance maneuver" (ie throttle down to 75%, open radiator, and then dump gear and flaps, and pull up/push down) to force an overshoot- it's a desperate maneuver but if he's not expecting it he might just end up in your sights if he's forced to overshoot.

anyways, I think you get the idea... do the unexpected.
good luck /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
Cold_gambler

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:55 PM
Well, think this was really interesting. I´m taking note...

The only thing that last, is HE reading your comments.

I´m still thinking on the Yak-3.. That really surprised me.

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 10:04 PM
alitomdq

Why are you surprised at the Yak3? It was one of the best dogfighters on the eastern front.


Gem,

You can fight the Yak3 the same way you use your P-39. It's not all horizontal turn fighting. I hardly ever use it that way. B&Z a Yak works pretty dam good.

Da Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 10:10 PM
BuzzU wrote:
- alitomdq
-
- Why are you surprised at the Yak3? It was one of
- the best dogfighters on the eastern front.

Never used the Yak-3 in FB (But you can be sure I´ll check it out now). In fact I always thought it was the La-7 the best Eastern Front Fighter.

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 10:17 PM
The La7 is a good plane, but I have more success with the Yak3. Go see for yourself.

Da Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 10:43 PM
You have no chances.. surrender, and turn to the dark side (VVS).. no, seriously.. it will be very hard, esspecially if you play with arcadish settings.. meaning you cannot surprise him with a dive (B&Z), if he used outside view to spot you..in FB LA5FN is better at almost everything, except firepower and roll rate.. your only chance really is to start the fight from way above, assuming he doesn't see you coming, and pray you can B&Z him..If he sees you are diving, it is relatively easy to manouver with LA5FN, and avoid your Boom&Zoom Firing..

B&Z can be very hard with cramped FW-190 Gunsight in FB.. and deflection shooting is esspecially very hard for FW-190..

Instead, wait for the patch, and wipe his *** with Dora after that /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif and pray, that we get a more realistic Forward gunsight for FW-190 someday..

If you want to take easy, then just pick up a La-7/Yak-3 and eat him in turnfight with VVS n00b-planes /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif You wanna do it the hard way, then stick with the FW-190..

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 10:55 PM
Guys thanx a lot for the support.
Know what to do now... Play full real.
Great fire power, roll rate and "no externals" (acording to those known words "Loose sight loose fight") might give me an edge with the 190A5.

Once more, Thanx.

Alitomdq.

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 11:15 PM
Use the A9. But dont turn much at all, the A9 turns much worse than the A5, but it has way better guns and speed. I like to use hammerheads and wingovers in the 190 because I can usually hang on the prop for a long time and come out above them. This might be tougher against an La because of the lazer cannons. For some reason online I have never come up against a LA that was any real threat. This isnt a challenge to any talented La pilots out there, I know there are some, it just seems like whenever I encounter one in my 190, they either fly really sloppy or really dumb, making my 4 20mms a good awakening for them.


"Ich bin ein Wuergerwhiner"

"The future battle on the ground will be preceded by battle in the air. This will determine which of the contestants has to suffer operational and tactical disadvantages and be forced throughout the battle into adoption compromise solutions." --Erwin Rommel

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 11:49 PM
get yourself a Yak-9K.

All you need is a single hit.

Do you think you can manage one little hit?

I mean, one BIG hit (i think a 45mm cannon round counts as big)

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 11:55 PM
If you go that route, get the 9T instead, at least you will be able to turn descent.


"Ich bin ein Wuergerwhiner"

"The future battle on the ground will be preceded by battle in the air. This will determine which of the contestants has to suffer operational and tactical disadvantages and be forced throughout the battle into adoption compromise solutions." --Erwin Rommel

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--NJG26_Killa--

XyZspineZyX
07-25-2003, 12:07 AM
BuzzU wrote:
- Gem,
-
- You can fight the Yak3 the same way you use your
- P-39. It's not all horizontal turn fighting. I
- hardly ever use it that way. B&Z a Yak works pretty
- dam good.


I'm not saying the Yak-3 is hard to fight. Rather it's just a little too easy for getting kills. A La-7 versus a Yak-3 is a nice fight indeed. I would just prefer the FW-109 A5 in the fight. Not only for the challenge but it's more historical. Don't get me wrong I'm not one of those "you must fly historically" kind of people, it's just a German design versus a Russian design is more fun from a strategic stand point.


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XyZspineZyX
07-25-2003, 02:48 AM
Another quick thing that might help is to change the A5s loadout to remove the two outer cannons. I used to fly with a friend whom I used to best repeatedly in an LA5FN, pre-FB, against his A5.

One day, he started changing the loadout and could turn very well with me plus retained/improved the A5's climbing capabilities. He may have even got the better of me once or twice after that./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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XyZspineZyX
07-25-2003, 03:11 AM
LA-5 and LA-7 basically out-everything a 190a5.

Try to BnZ him if at all possible, and a rope-a-dope works fine: pass by him at high speed and then climb in a shallow angle at first, increase climb angle more and more till you know he`s out of speed following you - then hammerhead over and nail him.

In a co-E situation, use your slighly superiour roll rate to keep out of plane. If he has locked on your six, your best hope is a horizontal scissors again using the roll rate to get him out of sync. Throttle down to make him overshoot and pray you can nail him quick.