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sasukeuchiha50
07-26-2012, 07:22 PM
What if the Assassins and the Templars actually existed
Which would you choose?

What if there was actually a email network called Hephaestus Email Network wouldnt it be cool?

JumpInTheFire13
07-26-2012, 07:28 PM
There's been many threads like this already. But welcome to the forums :D

RatonhnhakeFan
07-26-2012, 07:30 PM
Assassins of course

LoyalACFan
07-26-2012, 09:22 PM
Well, let's see... would I rather be like this guy
http://images.wikia.com/assassinscreed/images/7/7a/Char_ezio.png

or this guy
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20111202143632/assassinscreed/images/thumb/6/65/ACR_Manuel_Art_HD.png/1000px-ACR_Manuel_Art_HD.png

lol

Acrimonious_Nin
07-26-2012, 09:29 PM
Between these two...
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110924112755/assassinscreed/images/thumb/e/e0/DesmondsMilesRev.png/250px-DesmondsMilesRev.png http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120130152112/assassinscreed/images/thumb/6/64/DanielCross.png/250px-DanielCross.png

I believe this makes the choice a bit less biased and more difficult.... unlike the one above.... :D

BTW I choose the assassins...

playassassins1
07-26-2012, 09:34 PM
Between these two...
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110924112755/assassinscreed/images/thumb/e/e0/DesmondsMilesRev.png/250px-DesmondsMilesRev.png http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120130152112/assassinscreed/images/thumb/6/64/DanielCross.png/250px-DanielCross.png

I believe this makes the choice a bit less biased and more difficult.... unlike the one above.... :D

BTW I choose the assassins...

I would choose Daniel Cross tbh.

AssassinGame1
07-26-2012, 10:48 PM
What if the Assassins and the Templars actually existed
Which would you choose?

What if there was actually a email network called Hephaestus Email Network wouldnt it be cool?

Assassin's, of course. Cool thought.

AssassinGame1
07-26-2012, 10:52 PM
Well, let's see... would I rather be like this guy
http://images.wikia.com/assassinscreed/images/7/7a/Char_ezio.png

or this guy
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20111202143632/assassinscreed/images/thumb/6/65/ACR_Manuel_Art_HD.png/1000px-ACR_Manuel_Art_HD.png

lol



HA! good one!

ShaneO7K
07-26-2012, 11:31 PM
Both pretty much share an equal amount of pros and cons in the modern era, it's a tough decision. But most probably would want to be an assassin simply because we play as them so we are sort of more inclined to like them more.

SixKeys
07-27-2012, 12:29 AM
Let's see, choice between this guy:

http://images.wikia.com/assassinscreed/images/b/b5/Armor_Of_Brutus_v.png

Or this guy:

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110903173517/assassinscreed/images/archive/1/17/20110924175615%21Renegade.png
Yeah, I know who I would choose. ;)


(Actually, I'd go with the assassins.)

WolfTemplar94
07-27-2012, 12:56 AM
The thought process should actually go more towards the belief system you're more aligned with, rather than who you'd want to be more like physically.

I agree with the Templars, to be honest. I think that humans need to be ruled. Without laws, we turn into barbarians. With one ruler, there would be no wars, and we'd be able to concentrate on progress.

LoyalACFan
07-27-2012, 01:55 AM
I agree with the Templars, to be honest. I think that humans need to be ruled. Without laws, we turn into barbarians. With one ruler, there would be no wars, and we'd be able to concentrate on progress.

Assassins aren't anarchists. They don't want to overthrow the governments of the world or get rid of laws, they just want to allow freedom of choice. In other words, they want to give people the freedom to overthrow oppression as it rises. The ideal Templar system would have one supreme ruling body reigning over humanity, with absolutely no chance of a change in regime. Which would be OK, assuming the ruling body was going to be looking out for the people's interests rather than their own. But power is the most corrupting influence in the world. It wouldn't take much of a push to turn the oh-so-noble Templar agenda into a fascist state with the power to retain authority indefinitely. So at the end of the day, I find the Assassins have the more realistic worldview. Allow democratically-elected leaders to govern the world, but leave the populace with enough power to resist governmental decisions that negatively impact the people as a whole.

De Filosoof
07-27-2012, 01:55 AM
The thought process should actually go more towards the belief system you're more aligned with, rather than who you'd want to be more like physically.

I agree with the Templars, to be honest. I think that humans need to be ruled. Without laws, we turn into barbarians. With one ruler, there would be no wars, and we'd be able to concentrate on progress.

Dude...WTF.
Seriously.

RatonhnhakeFan
07-27-2012, 02:17 AM
Without laws, we turn into barbarians.Even the most totalitarian regimes/dictators in history with the tightest laws didn't manage to prevent people from breaking laws and being barbaric. The only way to do it would be complete mind control. But that would mean someone would have to be NOT under control to be able to control other people. Now the question is to you? Why should someone be allowed free will while others would be brainless slaves?

kudos17
07-27-2012, 02:37 AM
The problem is, when it comes down to it, both sides of the secret war are in the wrong.

The Templars are controlling, maniacal forces of shady freedom-oppressors, while the Assassins are a bunch of idealistic, but ultimately naive, freedom-fighters.

Just look at Al Mualim. The guy lived and breathed Assassin, and in the end, even he figured the best way was to cave and just take over everyone's mind.

I have a feeling, that in the end, the best solution is a combination of both ideals. Templar and Assassin. Otherwise, one will always fight the other. How, though, is anyone's guess.

In terms of joining one side, however, I'd easily join the Assassin's. I believe humanity is troubled, but I don't think the answer to that is taking away what makes us human - the freedom of will.

Acrimonious_Nin
07-27-2012, 02:38 AM
The thought process should actually go more towards the belief system you're more aligned with, rather than who you'd want to be more like physically.

I agree with the Templars, to be honest. I think that humans need to be ruled. Without laws, we turn into barbarians. With one ruler, there would be no wars, and we'd be able to concentrate on progress.

Really ??? With one ruler = no wars ? when china was united by that crazy emperor did civil war end ? Did it stop corruption ? Did it stop abuse of power ? Did the world stop spinning ? I do not think so. One world government means rules created by an individual or a small group of "people"(demons) that would make laws according to how they see fit, but what they see fit is their biased and does not entail truth or lifestyle denoting any form of reality.

any ways going back to the point are you saying between this man
http://gameabuser.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/dannywallace.jpg

or this man

http://costumeplayercatalog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/sweeneytodd.jpg

that you would find a difficulty understanding why you would nearly have to care about your image....If daniel cross looked like this guy, do you really think people would want to be templars ?

Kestrel_OvO
07-27-2012, 02:42 AM
You were made to be ruled. I would join the Templars. Assassins tend to have more interesting ancestors though...

xcamthemandudex
07-27-2012, 02:42 AM
Assassins aren't anarchists. They don't want to overthrow the governments of the world or get rid of laws, they just want to allow freedom of choice. In other words, they want to give people the freedom to overthrow oppression as it rises. The ideal Templar system would have one supreme ruling body reigning over humanity, with absolutely no chance of a change in regime. Which would be OK, assuming the ruling body was going to be looking out for the people's interests rather than their own. But power is the most corrupting influence in the world. It wouldn't take much of a push to turn the oh-so-noble Templar agenda into a fascist state with the power to retain authority indefinitely. So at the end of the day, I find the Assassins have the more realistic worldview. Allow democratically-elected leaders to govern the world, but leave the populace with enough power to resist governmental decisions that negatively impact the people as a whole.

Well the idea of the Assassin's is good, but the problem is what we saw in the first game. The leader turned to look out for his own power. Al Mualim turned into the absolute rule and almost to the essence of the Templar philosophy. Same with Abbas Sofian who let his anger and hate take over him. The point is that power can corrupt lots of people, both sides are susceptible to it. I would prefer the Assassins, but I am just saying it could be chaotic. Honestly, it matters about the subjects and not the leaders. It the subjects are willing to listen to the leader then ever thing is fine. If not, then there will be revolutions and wars.

I'd choose the Assassins because of the choice. They have the discipline to control themselves from urges and actually appear to give a hoot about humanity. Though, I'd want to be in the Templars because they would actually have the funding and resources to sustain their lifestyles. If we could take the Assassin's discipline and empathy, and mix it with the ability to control and their resources, then we'd be golden.

Acrimonious_Nin
07-27-2012, 02:49 AM
It wouldn't be chaotic because the assassins, within their own community, live a
life of rigerous discipline. If the world would naturally have this mutual understanding
of life and the basic architecture of civilization. Mankind would most likely head
towards a better path than if they were forced to do something against there will.
People must be taught and shown through example, not force. Look at all the
totalitarian regimes from china in the early 1900 to cuba in 1967 to syria 2012...
All regimes that are made to force people to obey and is totalitarian end up in
revolution for what you may ask...for freedom to choose how to live their own lives
and coexist with eachother and survive...with some stains like serial killers and
Templars running lose. ;P

one man should not have the ability to have so much power. This only happens because we have this system of heirarchy and this naturally tends to make people believe that they are different than everybody else because they have some form of special merit that they sometimes didn't earn...it was usually a birthright like being born to a rich family, you did not earn it, you lucked out. So we really never know who or how a certain tyrant got into power, so I say NO! to Templar rule lol :D

EDIT: BTW freedom does not correlate with chaos that is a common misconception. Ruled by force has more of a correlation to chaos. From teenagers to adults, anyone who is forced a lifestyle against their will tend to be more rebellious than if they were to be left to freely choose to make their own decisions. Look at tibet free thinker society of buddhists...the only problem they are having is coming from china that does not like free thinkers because free thinkers, like assassins, can influence people to break free from the grips of government delusions. I mean look at the story of jesus or martin luther king jr. or ghandi...killed for what ? they were all free from the ignorance of their respective social time and location whether it be racial ignorance, violent outburst of retaliation, or spiritual enlightenment. Chaos heightens when order tends to start to be enforced in human society, and when order becomes too suffocating, what happen as a result is chaos within human society

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/Lorenz_attractor_yb.svg/300px-Lorenz_attractor_yb.svg.png

Sarari
07-27-2012, 03:19 AM
I would like to take over the world with a golden apple. Sounds fun, I might try it some time.

xcamthemandudex
07-27-2012, 03:22 AM
Then again, Altair said it himself, "Our Creed does not command us to be free. It commands us to be wise." So, the Assassins don't really want people to be free -- not to say they are enslaving people -- but more so they want people to be wise about temptations, corruption, and other things that would cause them to go to (HERE IT COMES) the dark side.

SixKeys
07-27-2012, 03:28 AM
The cleverness behind the plot in the series is that we're supposed to pretend the assassins really do exist currently in the world, we just don't know about them because they work behind the scenes. So the world as it is right now exists (in part) due to the influence of assassins. Since the world is not in complete chaos and anarchy, you can't claim that the assassins' influence would necessarily do that.

Then again, parts of the world are the way they are also because of Templar influence. Since Templars aren't really evil and assassins can make mistakes too, it's hard to say which countries are ruled more by people siding with either sect. Judging by the Templar ideology, it seems safe to assume that countries with more totalitarian regimes would be more Templar-influenced whilst the more liberal countries are mroe assassin-influenced.

The assassins are all about giving power to the people whereas Templar believe in investing in strong leaders. Sometimes when you give people the freedom to make their own decisions, they will choose for forms of government that you personally may not agree with. Sometimes the assassins fight for the people, thinking they will be happier once they're free of Templar oppression, but the people may make the "wrong" choices. The assassins must accept that possibility, and resist the urge to direct people towards the choices that they (assassins) themselves would prefer.

Templars, on the other hand, believe that giving people the freedom to make the "wrong" choices is exactly what's wrong with the world. They don't strive for power for their own benefit (not all of them, at least) but because they sincerely believe they know what's best for everyone.

Since both sides make use of manipulators and murderers, there's always the danger of sliding scales to the extremes. When an assassin decides he knows what's best for the people and acts accordingly instead of letting people make their own decisions, he's sliding towards the Templar ideology. When a Templar gains power and uses it for his own benefit instead of protecting other people, he loses sight of the true Templar goal of world peace and becomes just another greedy dictator.

I hope and believe that AC3 will deal with these issues more in-depth. Connor being a native American fights for justice, but at some point he will inevitably realize there will never be true justice for his own people, despite the assassins' efforts. It must be hard for a person to continue fighting for the freedom of others when he sees those people making choices that are harmful to minorities like his own people. Many of the people he liberates will ultimately become slave owners and corrupt land owners, while the native Americans get to suffer.

Turul.
07-27-2012, 03:40 AM
give me liberty or give me death!

RatonhnhakeFan
07-27-2012, 04:33 AM
Connor being a native American fights for justice, but at some point he will inevitably realize there will never be true justice for his own people, despite the assassins' efforts. It must be hard for a person to continue fighting for the freedom of others when he sees those people making choices that are harmful to minorities like his own people. Many of the people he liberates will ultimately become slave owners and corrupt land owners, while the native Americans get to suffer.But you're talking from our historic perspective, where we know what happened and how it eventually ended. He doesn't and can't know that. This is something that's very tricky with historical storytelling. You can't have the characters act like they posses the knowledge of 21st century people.

Granted, there already is the entire time-manipulation mess present in the franchise (Abstergo's experiment & Ezio seeing Desmond) so it's possible that Ratonhnhaké:ton will recieve an information where everything eventually leads to, but if that doesn't happen, then I'm not sure why "at some point he will inevitably realize there will never be true justice for his own people".

De Filosoof
07-27-2012, 10:32 AM
You were made to be ruled. I would join the Templars. Assassins tend to have more interesting ancestors though...

Wow...And you live in that wonderful place called New Zealand?

Kestrel_OvO
07-27-2012, 11:08 AM
Wow...And you live in that wonderful place called New Zealand?

What's that supposed to mean, hmm?

BeCk41
07-27-2012, 01:04 PM
I'd say Templar now that I think about it, being evil is too much fun!!! http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/evilgrin/evilgrin0007.gif

EzioAssassin51
07-27-2012, 02:13 PM
The annoying thing about these threads are that they are very biased. Of course 99% of people are going to say assassins, after playing games with them, believing they're the good guys and agreein with they ideals over the Templars'. If we played as the templars for the past 5 years, things would be different.

I guess realistically, without any prejudicial knowledge about either factions, you'd side with the Templars, just because of their immense power, resoucres and ability to keep you safe after the launch, if you're an elite in the templars, like a successful agent

lonewarrior30
07-27-2012, 02:53 PM
The annoying thing about these threads are that they are very biased. Of course 99% of people are going to say assassins, after playing games with them, believing they're the good guys and agreein with they ideals over the Templars'. If we played as the templars for the past 5 years, things would be different.

I guess realistically, without any prejudicial knowledge about either factions, you'd side with the Templars, just because of their immense power, resoucres and ability to keep you safe after the launch, if you're an elite in the templars, like a successful agent
True....the way I see it is like the templars are like the nazis...best technology immense recourses but twistes minds and the assassins are the communists they fight for freedom but they dont have as much recourses ...both sides have goods and bads..might sound cheesy tho :p

SixKeys
07-27-2012, 03:05 PM
But you're talking from our historic perspective, where we know what happened and how it eventually ended. He doesn't and can't know that. This is something that's very tricky with historical storytelling. You can't have the characters act like they posses the knowledge of 21st century people.

Granted, there already is the entire time-manipulation mess present in the franchise (Abstergo's experiment & Ezio seeing Desmond) so it's possible that Ratonhnhaké:ton will recieve an information where everything eventually leads to, but if that doesn't happen, then I'm not sure why "at some point he will inevitably realize there will never be true justice for his own people".

The devs have hinted that this is an issue that will be addressed in the game somehow. He may not realize the full extent of his people's suffering until the end. Maybe he believes that helping some key figures in the revolution will help bring justice to his people, but ends up being betrayed. We know the natives have always been swindled and promises that were made to them have been broken. Also, Washington (among many others) owned slaves. If Connor is friends with him and if he believes slavery to be wrong, he must see through the injustice that even his allies are capable of committing. If Connor starts out believing Washington is a friend to the natives and later realizes George is just like the rest of the white oppressors, that could end up embittering him.

Slayer_WTF
07-27-2012, 03:06 PM
Assassins.

LightRey
07-28-2012, 10:02 AM
I would choose Daniel Cross tbh.
You'd choose the brainwashed, clinically insane coward/traitor over the guy that is uniquely tied to TWCB and has the skills of the greatest masters of the Assassin Order?
To each their own I guess.

Altair661
07-28-2012, 10:07 AM
Well technically there was Assassin's and Templars way back when. I don't believe they're still here lol, but while the Templars have the resources, the influence, and the power. I still have to go with Assassins. But I want to be more like a stealthy hunter Connor Assassin, and less like a confused boring Desmond Assassin. ( so far at least )

connor_bg
07-28-2012, 10:53 AM
Well technically there was Assassin's and Templars way back when. I don't believe they're still here lol, but while the Templars have the resources, the influence, and the power. I still have to go with Assassins. But I want to be more like a stealthy hunter Connor Assassin, and less like a confused boring Desmond Assassin. ( so far at least )

Well "templars" do exist in present day, but the people who think themselves as such are actually the past templar's followers, bunch of guys who have a lot of free time...
There is no such thing as society of "assassins", but people who make those type of murdering exist, but in more realistic condition, and i dont believe there is society teaching them discipline.. those will be more like the contract agency from hitman, which is more acceptable.

OriginalMiles
07-29-2012, 02:09 AM
Templars.
Because I actually have a sadistic, and somewhat mean personality most of the time, except on the forums, mostly.