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Franzen
05-03-2004, 05:49 AM
Hi all,

I like to fly the K4 sometimes. I was curious about the MW50(Monkey Wizz 50). How long can you expect it to last? When I'm playing online there always seems to be a dfight and a flock of vulchers hovering over my airbase. I like to run the MW50 with no flaps during take-off to get manueverability as soon as my wheels are off the ground. Is there a gage to show me how much I have? Am I using the majority of it on take off?

Fritz Franzen

Franzen
05-03-2004, 05:49 AM
Hi all,

I like to fly the K4 sometimes. I was curious about the MW50(Monkey Wizz 50). How long can you expect it to last? When I'm playing online there always seems to be a dfight and a flock of vulchers hovering over my airbase. I like to run the MW50 with no flaps during take-off to get manueverability as soon as my wheels are off the ground. Is there a gage to show me how much I have? Am I using the majority of it on take off?

Fritz Franzen

JG5_UnKle
05-03-2004, 06:16 AM
Well we never really got a stright answer from 1C on this but I don't think the MW50 as modelled in FB actually ever runs out.

In real life you could run for about 10mins then you would have to lay off the MW50 (maybe for 5-8 mins?) then you could apply it again for 10 mins or so and then off again. That would give you about 25-30 mins of MW50 (in ideal circumstances) just not all in one go.

In FB (as IRL) the MW50 only engages at over 100% power so "engaging" it doesn't mean you are "using" it. But I'm sure you are aware of this bit http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

There is no guage in the cockpit to refer to at this time which leads me to believe that it never runs out in FB. Then again you can't run the MW50 for realistic times anyway http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/53.gif so I'm not even going there.

So basically go low throttle, engage it - leave it switched on. Go full power to get the most out of it (110%) and back off every know and then - just don't switch it off http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif Others may disagree but I don't think it runs out.

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Kamikaze_Gibbon
05-03-2004, 06:22 AM
Unfortunately I am not an MW50 experten but the guys over at theLuftwaffe Experten Message Board (http://p069.ezboard.com/fluftwaffeexperten71774frm9) may be able to help.

As far as I understand the MW50 system may be used for 10 minutes, after which a 5 minute break must be allowed before using the system again.

As for the capacity of the tank - the TA152 carried 140 litres of MW50 [source] (http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/ta152h.html) . I have no ideas of the injection rates or pressures so I cannot say how long the tank will last.

Hope this helps.

Kamikaze_Gibbon.

Dora-9
05-03-2004, 06:27 AM
I'm not a real MW50-Experte but I'm quite aware of the WO-50, the same thing like MW50, only the russian version of it.

50 liters of Wodka and 50 drops of orange-juice. I doesn't cool down the engine as the MW50 should, but it makes a happy pilot. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/53.gif

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[This message was edited by Dora-9 on Mon May 03 2004 at 05:38 AM.]

Franzen
05-03-2004, 06:30 AM
Thx guyz. Actually I switch it on right after the engine is running. I don't turn it off until I land. What about the boost in the 190's. Does that work the same way?

Fritz Franzen

TgD Thunderbolt56
05-03-2004, 06:34 AM
Yes, it's similar, but it won't cook your engine if you turn it on/off with impunity...as will the MW-50.



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JG14_Josf
05-03-2004, 06:34 AM
JG5_Unkle,

Are you running AEP?

Please correct me if I am wrong but I think the MW50 is now modeled to show up as high manifold pressure when at low altitude even when the throttle is set under 100 percent. I think you will find that MW 50 cannot be left on anymore without adverse consequences such as overheat at low altitude.

Engine damage still seems to occur when activating MW50 while the throttle is over 100 percent, or when turning MW50 on/off/on too fast.

I am not really too sure about this WEP use since it is needed during times when things are very busy.

I have not done much testing.

I found the problem flying around in low clouds trying to avoid a P-51 in a War Clouds dog fight server.

My engine would not cool down with full radiator open and 95 percent throttle. I had the MW50 button left on for these types of close in combat situations where turning it on and off was asking for trouble. Well, I finally looked down to see that my manifold pressure gauge was Maxxed out!

I turned the WEP button off, the manifold pressure went back to 1.4 or so and the engine cooled right down.

Someone else entered the fight and gave me a chance to land.

Also a new patch is on the way with more possible undocumented changes so it pays to keep checking the guages.

VW-IceFire
05-03-2004, 07:45 AM
Yup...manifold pressure certainly increases with MW50 engaged, even if the engine is at 0% throttle.

I usually turn it on on startup and turn off if the engine gets much too hot.

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JG5_UnKle
05-03-2004, 08:37 AM
Yes I should have been more specific - the manifold pressure does increase when MW50 is engaged true.

The question though from the original poster was does it run out? I don't think it does.

I hope it does change in the patch so that it:

(a) Does not become effective until over 100% power
(b) Does Run out - with some sort of message as there is no working guage.

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Kurfurst__
05-03-2004, 10:47 AM
Historically u could use it for a total of 26-30 mins at WEP. Practically it means w/o limits, it will not run out and leave you pants down, by the time it does, you will be VERY low on fuel - after half an hour of MW, even when tank was full, you don`t have more than 100 liters.. MW was only being injected (automatically, if enabled) at full power, at a rate of 180 lit/hour. Tank capacity was 75-85 liters. Could be used up to 10 mins at a time, about 5 mins were required after to cool down the engine, then again it could be used.. more than enough!

There is no volume gauge, however there was a pressure gauge for the system, which if fell, meant you were out... it`s located just right of the gunsight of the K-4. And it`s aint working. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif But there`s not much need for it anyway. I am not sure if it can actually run out, think yes, once I did engine overheat test and engine died at around the 26th minute at WEP enabled. But as said, it was no issue in RL, so use in generously. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Me myself, I take off with it, just watch out not to engage it when above 100% throttle.

And Unkle is right, pressing 'W' should not change engine boost under 100% at all. It was NOT injected and boost did not raise until throttle past 100%. In fact it was 'armed' or 'disarmed', not switched on/off.

Historically, when MW disabled:

At 100% throttle : 2600 rpm, 1.45ata boost
At 110% throttle : 2800 rpm, 1.5 (DB engine) or 1.8ata (DC engine or DB)

When MW was ENABLED :

At 100% throttle : 2600 rpm, 1.45ata boost
At 110% throttle : 2800 rpm, 1.75ata (DM engine) or 1.8ata (DB engine) or 1.98ata (DC engine)

So you can see it only effect 100%+ boost when enabled.

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"One day a Tiger Royal got within 150 yards of my tanks and knocked me out. Five of our tanks opened up on him at ranges of 200 to 600 yards and got 5 or 6 hits on the front of the Tiger. They all just glanced off and the Tiger backed off and got away. If we had a tank like that Tiger, we would all be home today."
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3.JG51_Stecher
05-03-2004, 04:43 PM
So apparently when it was switched on but not engaged it did not increase boost pressure in RL as it does in FB. Do we know that it actually is increasing engine performance though? While the boost pressure rises, notice that the RPM does not. In fact, it actually slightly decreases for a second.

Also, I'd just like to confirm the 26 minute limit in FB. I did some testing right after AEP came out. It doesn't matter whether you run it at 101% continually for 26 minutes, or in spurts of 110%, which accumulate to 26 minutes. At the 26 minute usage mark the engine will come to a screeching halt very quickly. Of course, given the typical events of a mission, you will probably run out of fuel in a 109 before you cook the engine from 26 minutes of WEP. So it's not really anything you need to worry about.

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JG5_UnKle
05-04-2004, 11:04 AM
I will try this with a drop tank Stecher http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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JG5_UnKle
05-06-2004, 05:46 AM
OK this was an easy test - I won't bore you to death with a track of it (pretty dull) but I get 27 mins - so you guys are totally right!

I set up with a K-4 100% internal fuel and a drop tank. Immediately engaged MW50 and went to 110% power. Climb!

At about 6000M I reduced the prop-pitch to about 50% (this avoided overheat) and carried on with MW50 and 110% throttle.

Sure enough at pretty much 27 mins on the nose the engine gave up the ghost and started running rough.

So there you have it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif maybe 27mins is a little short - not sure. I didn't test any other types - just the K-4.

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ZG77_Lignite
05-06-2004, 09:02 AM
"And Unkle is right, pressing 'W' should not change engine boost under 100% at all. It was NOT injected and boost did not raise until throttle past 100%. In fact it was 'armed' or 'disarmed', not switched on/off."



Can you guys give some historical proof on this? In my opinion, it is perfectly normal for the manifold pressure to rise, even with the throttle below the (arbitrary) '100%' reading in FB. I certainly agree that the MW-50 is not being injected below this '100%' mark, but that is because it is not necessary to prevent detonation/engine damage, which is the purpose for the MW-50. As I understand it, MW-50 in and of itself does NOT increase manifold pressure, it simply improves engine performance (anti-detonation) to Allow higher manifold pressures. Please correct me if I'm wrong.