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crash3
05-12-2012, 05:37 PM
The running assassinations in the Gameplay Premiere did look very good and in terms of free ruuning, they would certainly increase fluidity however, I am concerned that we will be able to carry out running assassinations to casually and therefore possibly some of the challenge of avoiding enemies is lost.

In AC1 if you tried to assassinate a guard who had spotted you from the front, he would push you away which I think was more realistic-In the gameplay premiere, Connor was running through a british camp and had clearly been spotted but was shown doing 2 running assassinations before killing the british general. I hope at least elite enemies will push you away or stop you mid-run somehow.

What are your thoughts?

GunnarGunderson
05-12-2012, 05:45 PM
I think they just turned off the enemy AI for that trailer to get those combat shots. If you notice, in the combat clips all of the redcoats that aren't currently being attacked are just standing there watching, in addition, the officer that Connor assassinates doesn't even notice him until the pre-canned animation starts

albertwesker22
05-12-2012, 05:50 PM
I think they just turned off the enemy AI for that trailer to get those combat shots. If you notice, in the combat clips all of the redcoats that aren't currently being attacked are just standing there watching, in addition, the officer that Connor assassinates doesn't even notice him until the pre-canned animation starts

Exactly. Ubi do this all time.

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 05:51 PM
Obviously AI is turned off..
You see a guy running scared, a couple of guys backing off, a few guys shooting their Muskets and another soldier gets up the rock to find a clear shot..
Yup its turned off alright..

CrazySN
05-12-2012, 05:54 PM
Perhaps the running assassinations take form in a kill-streak? Since there are many more times of npc's in this game, we'll certainly be needing to kill more people, so I think it would be cool if they implemented that.

Calvarok
05-12-2012, 05:54 PM
AI is not "turned off". The AI just responds differently. In large groups they back off and shoot at you. And we've always had a small window of time to assassinate our target while exposed. I'd bat that it's just raised now. Which is fair, since we have guns and health that doesn't recharge till we're out of combat.

GunnarGunderson
05-12-2012, 06:11 PM
Obviously AI is turned off..
You see a guy running scared, a couple of guys backing off, a few guys shooting their Muskets and another soldier gets up the rock to find a clear shot..
Yup its turned off alright.. Severly limited then, I'd rather believe that than accept that that's going to wind up in the final game



AI is not "turned off". The AI just responds differently. In large groups they back off and shoot at you. And we've always had a small window of time to assassinate our target while exposed. I'd bat that it's just raised now. Which is fair, since we have guns and health that doesn't recharge till we're out of combat. When Connor ran for the Officer, they backed up there, but the Officer didn't even notice him, it was obviously scripted. But in the close combat clips, Connor is killing those redcoats while the other ones just stand and watch.

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 06:15 PM
Severly limited then, I'd rather believe that than accept that that's going to wind up in the final game


When Connor ran for the Officer, they backed up there, but the Officer didn't even notice him, it was obviously scripted. But in the close combat clips, Connor is killing those redcoats while the other ones just stand and watch.
Yes, Toned down... Not turned Off. There is no "turning off A.I"
This is Pre-Alpha

pacmanate
05-12-2012, 06:16 PM
I stand by what I have said in another thread. At this pre alpha stage, I think they MADE the AI more dumb just so it was easier for them to capture awesome footage quicker. Remember this trailer wasn't to show off how difficult the AI was. It was to just show some of the awesome things Connor can do.

SaintPerkele
05-12-2012, 06:17 PM
I doubt that we can say anything about AI until we see actual gameplay. Whether or not the sequences were scripted or the AI turned off, we can hardly tell.

On topic though, the guard was surprised and did not expect Connor to assassinate him. Imagine you're in the middle of the battlefield and a civilian runs towards you - my first reaction wouldn't be "This guy is probably going to impale me with some sort of secret blade!".

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 06:19 PM
or the AI turned off,

I swear to god... THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS TURNING A.I OFF !!

naran6142
05-12-2012, 06:20 PM
id agree that the AI was altered for the trailer, i too would hope that it wont b that easy... tho it was pretty cool

SaintPerkele
05-12-2012, 06:25 PM
I swear to god... THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS TURNING A.I OFF !!
I said "we can hardly tell" as a subtle reply to your post that on closer expection, guards move and draw their weapons ;) If they didn't move at all, then the AI could possibly be completely turned off, making the soldiers nothing but assassinateable objects.

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 06:27 PM
I said "we can hardly tell" as a subtle reply to your post that on closer expection, guards move and draw their weapons ;) If they didn't move at all, then the AI could possibly be completely turned off, making the soldiers nothing but assassinateable objects.
Look, man
You cannot demonstrate a game with the A.I "turned off", ok ? we`re clear on that ?
Other wise everyone you see will just be standing in a crucified position not moving AT ALL !!
Not even being able to be assassinated..

SaintPerkele
05-12-2012, 06:30 PM
Re-read my post, I clearly said "didn't move at al," ;) . And yes, they could be assassinated, just the way a player can interact with certain objects in games too. An object (or an NPC in this case) does not require any AI at all to be assassinated.

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 06:32 PM
An object (or an NPC in this case) does not require any AI at all to be assassinated.
Are you for real ?
I dont want to bore you with any technical details, but your claim is ABSOLUTELY absurd..

SaintPerkele
05-12-2012, 06:39 PM
Ehm, no. I don't have any programming knowledge whatsoever, but I'm aware that interaction with an object does not require the object to have any AI (e.g., shooting in different parts and cause it to behave the way the physics force it to do). Assuming that the assassination is nothing but a scripted interaction between the object and the players, which is already programmed to happen that exact way, the object, which simply appears to resemble an NPC will be caused to, after being interacted with, slumb down, with the programmed physics applied, and continue its status as being a prop while laying on the floor.

If this is still wrong, then please explain me why.

dxsxhxcx
05-12-2012, 06:43 PM
is funny how the excuse for everything "wrong" people noticed in the trailer seems to be pre-alpha, I'm not saying that isn't the case but what if is not, what if what was adressed by the OP is something they didn't realize?!

Now is the time to make suggestions like this when they're still working in the game, or do you prefer people creating countless threads about this when they can't do nothing about it anymore?!

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 06:46 PM
Ehm, no. I don't have any programming knowledge whatsoever, but I'm aware that interaction with an object does not require the object to have any AI (e.g., shooting in different parts and cause it to behave the way the physics force it to do). Assuming that the assassination is nothing but a scripted interaction between the object and the players, which is already programmed to happen that exact way, the object, which simply appears to resemble an NPC will be caused to, after being interacted with, slumb down, with the programmed physics applied, and continue its status as being a prop while laying on the floor.

If this is still wrong, then please explain me why.
Im a Computer Science Student, if you`ll be happy to know :)
Now, with that out of the way..
An A.I is the intelligence of machines and the branch of computer science that aims to create it. A.I is one thing, but Physics is in a different field..
Ok so now a Program is lines of Code representing understandable commands by the computer, A.I is a program, an Intelligence that differs between actions, commands, animations etc..
A.I determines which Animation is to be used during, after and before a given command which meets a certain situation, If the situation is true, then the program proceeds with the adjacent execution, in this case "Assassination victim Animation #3" for sake of example..
The Physics will just make the Character simply fall to the ground using the Physics engine applied..
This is as simple as I can be..

BBALive
05-12-2012, 06:46 PM
I swear to god... THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS TURNING A.I OFF !!

There is such a thing, it just wasn't used in the trailer.

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 06:49 PM
There is such a thing, it just wasn't used in the trailer.
Thats what I said a couple of posts back..


is funny how the excuse for everything "wrong" people noticed in the trailer seems to be pre-alpha, I'm not saying that isn't the case but what if is not, what if what was adressed by the OP is something they didn't realize?!

Now is the time to make suggestions like this when they're still working in the game, or do you prefer people creating countless threads about this when they can't do nothing about it anymore?!

Really ? A couple hundred Programming experts did not realize such a thing ? and a random poster does ? hmm makes sense..

BBALive
05-12-2012, 06:50 PM
Ehm, no. I don't have any programming knowledge whatsoever, but I'm aware that interaction with an object does not require the object to have any AI (e.g., shooting in different parts and cause it to behave the way the physics force it to do). Assuming that the assassination is nothing but a scripted interaction between the object and the players, which is already programmed to happen that exact way, the object, which simply appears to resemble an NPC will be caused to, after being interacted with, slumb down, with the programmed physics applied, and continue its status as being a prop while laying on the floor.

If this is still wrong, then please explain me why.

In order for the NPC to enter the assination animation it must have been programmed to do so. If you remove that then you cannot interact with it at all. Just like how interactive objects in the game are programmed to be interactive. Think of a building in an open world game that you cannot enter. The reason you cannot enter the building it because it hasn't been programmed to be enterable, additionally, it doesn't have an interior, but that's 3D modelling rather than programming. Anyway, the same thing applies to everything in a game. If it hasn't been programmed to do something, it will not do it. Therefore removing the AI from an NPC will turn it into nothing more than a mesh that cannot be interacted with.

To sum up, AI was 'turned on' when the trailer was created. There's a possbility that the AI is still incomplete, but it was definitely there.

SaintPerkele
05-12-2012, 08:29 PM
Im a Computer Science Student, if you`ll be happy to know :)
Now, with that out of the way..
An A.I is the intelligence of machines and the branch of computer science that aims to create it. A.I is one thing, but Physics is in a different field..
Ok so now a Program is lines of Code representing understandable commands by the computer, A.I is a program, an Intelligence that differs between actions, commands, animations etc..
A.I determines which Animation is to be used during, after and before a given command which meets a certain situation, If the situation is true, then the program proceeds with the adjacent execution, in this case "Assassination victim Animation #3" for sake of example..
The Physics will just make the Character simply fall to the ground using the Physics engine applied..
This is as simple as I can be..
That's a pretty good explanation actually, thanks. I was assuming that the term AI would simply refer to how NPCs react, move and so on ;)

Assassin_M
05-12-2012, 08:32 PM
That's a pretty good explanation actually, thanks. I was assuming that the term AI would simply refer to how NPCs react, move and so on ;)
Programming is a fascinating subject ;)

notafanboy
05-12-2012, 08:38 PM
i think the ones that ran away was trying to form a firing line

Calvarok
05-13-2012, 12:22 AM
Severly limited then, I'd rather believe that than accept that that's going to wind up in the final game


When Connor ran for the Officer, they backed up there, but the Officer didn't even notice him, it was obviously scripted. But in the close combat clips, Connor is killing those redcoats while the other ones just stand and watch.
The officer was just sitting there, yeah, but I'd imagine it's just because it's an early mission. He just sits there and expects his soldiers to protect him. As to the combat clips, the combat is going to be faster, but that doesn't mean that all soldiers will attack at once during close-combat. The game is not going to be that hard, point blank.

Calvarok
05-13-2012, 12:30 AM
In order for the NPC to enter the assination animation it must have been programmed to do so. If you remove that then you cannot interact with it at all. Just like how interactive objects in the game are programmed to be interactive. Think of a building in an open world game that you cannot enter. The reason you cannot enter the building it because it hasn't been programmed to be enterable, additionally, it doesn't have an interior, but that's 3D modelling rather than programming. Anyway, the same thing applies to everything in a game. If it hasn't been programmed to do something, it will not do it. Therefore removing the AI from an NPC will turn it into nothing more than a mesh that cannot be interacted with.

To sum up, AI was 'turned on' when the trailer was created. There's a possbility that the AI is still incomplete, but it was definitely there.
Exactly. It may not have all of its reactions enabled, or complete, as we can guess by the npc casually walking through Connor's chase scene. With all they've said about the crowd being more reactive, I would expect that AI is going to react to what Connor is doing a lot more than shown in the trailer. I believe in certain interviews they've mentioned that they're not ready to talk about the specifics of AI, meaning it's possible that they don't have a feature-complete version of it ready, or only got it done recently and are still polishing before the reveal. It's extremely common for in-game trailers to include dumbed-down AI, so the player in the video can look like they're awesome. Expecially trailers done from mostly cinematic angles. So that's also a possibility. But as many people have said before, AI is more than just what an enemy uses to figure out how to attack you. It's the only way that they can react to anything you do in the game. If you turn it off they're nothing but a 3d model. they wouldn't even be able to run any animations.