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View Full Version : Character Presentation Changes Take Away from the Sense of Immersion and Continuity



DiamondBlade_R
04-03-2012, 01:05 PM
The fact that Ubisoft has chosen to make so many changes to the character designs and presentations throughout the series has really detracted from the sense of immersion (in which continuity has a sufficient part) of the series as a whole - and it's particularly noticeable when looking at all the design changes made to the Middle Ages-era in Revelations: both its characters and Masyaf . How am I supposed to by into the idea that The Mentor's Wake takes place right after the conclusion of memory block 7 of the first game, when everything related to the Middle Ages era looks so different in Revelations compared to how in did in the first game, including Al Mualim himself? Some of the changes they made to the presentation of the Middle Ages era don't even make any sense: why change Abbas' voice when you still have its original voice actor (Nolan North, AKA Desmond) working for you anyway? Yes, I realize Abbas' dialogue in AC1was extremely brief, but I still liked Nolan's depiction of the character much better than the new one. And don't even get me started about the voice changes to the main cast... Why change so many of the things that fans of the franchise have come to know, and are familiar and comfortable with? Why the hell did they need to change Subject 16's voice? His entire personality changed along with his voice. And why change the voice for Altair? Of all the characters this huge franchise has, they had to mess with the most iconic one, the very icon of the franchise, if you will. Lastly, what was so bad about the original voice actor they cast for William (which can be heard during the credits in Brotherhood and the DLC "The Da Vinci Disappearance), that they had to actually replace him before he even started his actual job with them? Wiliam's old voice suited him much better than his current creeper voice, in my opinion. It's such a shame that they've chosen to make so many design and presentation changes from the first game... I still think AC1 had the best atmosphere out of all the games in the series thus far, and that is, in part, thanks to the gritty, dark presentation, which is absent in all the games after the first one.

Assassin_M
04-03-2012, 04:01 PM
I can see where you`re coming from..
and I agree with some of the points, but here are the ones that I dont agree with..

1-16..
In AC II Clay was pretty banged up and half-insane, his VA suited that personality very well; now in Revelations His VA changed, for the better IMO, to a more calm and witty individual..
true that it kills some immersion, but its not to the worse..

2-Altair
Altair is not, by far, the Icon of AC, if anything he just got the smallest bite of the big cake which saw Ezio have more than 1/2 of it alone..

3-Abbas didnt really unnerve or kill anything, his personality was that of a whinny coward, his VA provided just that..
Actually I believe the new VA reflected on his personality much better than Nolan..

apart from those, I agree with ya..

LightRey
04-03-2012, 04:13 PM
I can see where you`re coming from..
and I agree with some of the points, but here are the ones that I dont agree with..

1-16..
In AC II Clay was pretty banged up and half-insane, his VA suited that personality very well; now in Revelations His VA changed, for the better IMO, to a more calm and witty individual..
true that it kills some immersion, but its not to the worse..

2-Altair
Altair is not, by far, the Icon of AC, if anything he just got the smallest bite of the big cake which saw Ezio have more than 1/2 of it alone..

3-Abbas didnt really unnerve or kill anything, his personality was that of a whinny coward, his VA provided just that..
Actually I believe the new VA reflected on his personality much better than Nolan..

apart from those, I agree with ya..
Clay's VA didn't change.

Assassin_M
04-03-2012, 04:17 PM
Clay's VA didn't change.
Yes he did..
I says so in the credits..

DiamondBlade_R
04-03-2012, 04:19 PM
I'm pretty sure he did. He sounds drastically different than how he did in previous games, and the AC wiki also supports that.

UrDeviant1
04-03-2012, 04:21 PM
Cam Clarke (AC2/B)
Graham Cuthbertson(revelations)

AC Wiki Is your friend!

LightRey
04-03-2012, 04:22 PM
Yes he did..
I says so in the credits..



Really? I could've sworn his voice sounded almost exactly the same in TLA.

Assassin_M
04-03-2012, 04:22 PM
Cam Clarke (AC2/B)
Graham Cuthbertson(revelations)

AC Wiki Is your friend!
Leave my buddy alone :p

UrDeviant1
04-03-2012, 04:23 PM
Leave my buddy alone :p

Huh?

DiamondBlade_R
04-03-2012, 04:23 PM
Wow, LightRey, one more post and you'll be at ten thousand lol

LightRey
04-03-2012, 04:26 PM
Wow, LightRey, one more post and you'll be at ten thousand lol
Just posted my 10,000th posts in the BUWYWL thread. :p

Assassin_M
04-03-2012, 04:37 PM
Huh?
You didnt get the joke ?
Uhhhh :(

UrDeviant1
04-03-2012, 04:39 PM
You didnt get the joke ?
Uhhhh :(

Nah man xD sorry

Cornik22
04-03-2012, 05:13 PM
Funny thing is, in my country (Spain) all the people who dubbed previous characters (Altair, Al Mualim, Clay,...) are exactly the same in all AC games, so no voice problem for me :D

JCearlyyears
04-03-2012, 08:54 PM
Speaking of continuity errors, in ACR, if you listen to the civilians in Masyaf, you'll notice they speak turkish... and in Brotherhood, the French soldiers had no French accent, and in AC2, I'm almost positive that there is supposed to be different dialects of Italian in the different cities.(the last parts aren't continuity errors, but language errors.)

rileypoole1234
04-03-2012, 08:57 PM
Speaking of continuity errors, in ACR, if you listen to the civilians in Masyaf, you'll notice they speak turkish... and in Brotherhood, the French soldiers had no French accent, and in AC2, I'm almost positive that there is supposed to be different dialects of Italian in the different cities.(the last parts aren't continuity errors, but language errors.)

I never noticed the Italian dialect thing. I'll have to go back and listen.

LightRey
04-03-2012, 09:27 PM
Speaking of continuity errors, in ACR, if you listen to the civilians in Masyaf, you'll notice they speak turkish... and in Brotherhood, the French soldiers had no French accent, and in AC2, I'm almost positive that there is supposed to be different dialects of Italian in the different cities.(the last parts aren't continuity errors, but language errors.)
I'm pretty sure they didn't know exactly how the different Italian accents sounded back then.

SixKeys
04-03-2012, 09:33 PM
I think they could have found language experts who could have told them that. A more realistic reason was probably lack of time or resources. The NPCs all say the same things no matter where in Italy you are and for most non-Italian people, all Italian sounds the same so there was little point in training the main cast to do different accents. I think they went to some lengths with the accents in the Italian dub of AC2, I seem to recall some Italian player commenting that Ezio had a genuine Florentine accent. I wouldn't be surprised if the other characters from different cities had proper dialects as well.

JCearlyyears
04-03-2012, 09:48 PM
What about the French accents and the Turkish speaking Syrians in Masyaf?

LightRey
04-03-2012, 09:52 PM
What about the French accents and the Turkish speaking Syrians in Masyaf?
Those are continuity errors. Though I strongly suspect they're there out of convenience, not as an oversight.

albertwesker22
04-03-2012, 09:57 PM
Those are continuity errors. Though I strongly suspect they're there out of convenience, not as an oversight.

Funny that they gave us Mongol character models, but not Arabic ones. It is a bit strange seeing Masyaf full of Greeks and Turks.

JCearlyyears
04-03-2012, 10:22 PM
I'm not sure that the French accent is a continuity error, because right when they are introduced it is wrong.(By the way, I am saying it as if this was tv productions.I'm not sure if there is a difference, but a continuity error as taught to me is when something is shown, and when shown again, it is incorrectly shown. EX. Character is shown wearing a jacket and talking to somebody and are both facing a certain direction, then you hear a gun shot and the camera turns to show the shooter, and when it returns to the characters at the beginning at the shot, they switched sides and are now wearing different clothes.) So I am thinking of it as a language error, not as a continuity error.

LightRey
04-03-2012, 10:25 PM
Funny that they gave us Mongol character models, but not Arabic ones. It is a bit strange seeing Masyaf full of Greeks and Turks.
Well the Greeks made sense because of the Byzantines and I guess the Turks were considered "close enough".

Calvarok
04-04-2012, 03:13 AM
Really? I could've sworn his voice sounded almost exactly the same in TLA.

I'd imagine that's the point.

To the OP, have you ever considered that the fact that they're in different versions of the animus might have something to do with it? This is the reason that Altair's mechanics and health system changes to match Ezio's, and also the reason that his voice is different. A new animus signifies also the change of engine from AC1, which is why things are done in a certain style in AC2-Revs. The core game structure changed drastically for the Ezio trilogy. you can't just copy-paste an AC1 map and expect the same experience.

SixKeys
04-04-2012, 03:39 AM
A new animus signifies also the change of engine from AC1, which is why things are done in a certain style in AC2-Revs. The core game structure changed drastically for the Ezio trilogy. you can't just copy-paste an AC1 map and expect the same experience.

I don't see why not. The Alta´r segments were only about 5 minutes each, it would have been great if they had felt drastically different from the Ezio segments. It would have been a nice homage to the first game and how far the series has come since then. I was very disappointed when I realized it was literally impossible to play Alta´r the same way he handled in AC1. It just felt wrong that he would automatically go into Ezio-like kill streaks. I tried to play the first fight in Masyaf the same way I played AC1 (don't start kill streaks, don't kick the guards), for nostalgia's sake, but you just can't because the guards' AI is the same as Ezio's foes so they are much more aggressive. I had looked forward to playing as Alta´r again but that's when I realized I was just playing Ezio with a different skin.

Calvarok
04-04-2012, 05:59 AM
I don't see why not. The Alta´r segments were only about 5 minutes each, it would have been great if they had felt drastically different from the Ezio segments. It would have been a nice homage to the first game and how far the series has come since then. I was very disappointed when I realized it was literally impossible to play Alta´r the same way he handled in AC1. It just felt wrong that he would automatically go into Ezio-like kill streaks. I tried to play the first fight in Masyaf the same way I played AC1 (don't start kill streaks, don't kick the guards), for nostalgia's sake, but you just can't because the guards' AI is the same as Ezio's foes so they are much more aggressive. I had looked forward to playing as Alta´r again but that's when I realized I was just playing Ezio with a different skin.

You can't just put an entirely different core game into a few missions of an existing one. Not without a lot of effort and time. And Revelations was on a one-year dev cycle, so guess what they were short of?

EDIT: Also, throwing something like that at new players is a bad idea. Each game gains new fans, and each game has to account for them.