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BaDFusion
02-07-2007, 11:05 AM
I know we have all sat here and complained about this weapon needs to be in the game and that weapon and there is some legal issuse in doing so. But there is always a way around it. So i would like to know from Ubi themselves how come they cant get a gun that looks similar to the M16 or M4 and put it in the game this is a wide range of weapons out there that look like and fire just like those weapons but made from different companys. so if you could get back to us on the reason why you couldnt bring a AR that looks just like the ones i have listed let us all know. Because looking at the forums there is alot of people who would like to Have these weapons in the game and will pay DLC to get them. If it was me i would do what i can to make more money even if its 5 Dollars a person. So If ubi can get back to us that would be great...

BaDFusion
02-07-2007, 11:05 AM
I know we have all sat here and complained about this weapon needs to be in the game and that weapon and there is some legal issuse in doing so. But there is always a way around it. So i would like to know from Ubi themselves how come they cant get a gun that looks similar to the M16 or M4 and put it in the game this is a wide range of weapons out there that look like and fire just like those weapons but made from different companys. so if you could get back to us on the reason why you couldnt bring a AR that looks just like the ones i have listed let us all know. Because looking at the forums there is alot of people who would like to Have these weapons in the game and will pay DLC to get them. If it was me i would do what i can to make more money even if its 5 Dollars a person. So If ubi can get back to us that would be great...

NOiR.FoX
02-07-2007, 11:09 AM
yah a m4 would be nice http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

But thre is one big problem you would still just get pwned by some kid using a mp7a1 with a f'n 6x scope.

So mabee we could get the AR's some more Acc or knock down power before we add more guns that ppl wont use.

BaDFusion
02-07-2007, 11:40 AM
Well I agree the AR do not have acc. and i read up on it. If you run and gun with an AR you not going to acc. at all real life or gaming life. But if you sit around a corner and just pray down range with a AR you will destory people. I do it everyday with a G36C and that gun sucks in its stats.. But you got to look at the MP7 on future weapons its basically a AR. So ya maybe not hold down a straight line of fire but you could Brust fire longer and hit your target faster. So maybe everyone needs to check that guy out just go to youtube.com and type in Future weapons and look for the MP7 and you will be surprised to learn what that gun in real life is able to do. But i would still like my M4, M16 style of a rifle. Better yet a Bushmaster AR-15 with a 14 1/2 inch barrel with a retractable stock. Theres your M4 right there

NousDefions
02-07-2007, 12:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BaDFusion:
Well I agree the AR do not have acc. and i read up on it. If you run and gun with an AR you not going to acc. at all real life or gaming life. But if you sit around a corner and just pray down range with a AR you will destory people. I do it everyday with a G36C and that gun sucks in its stats.. But you got to look at the MP7 on future weapons its basically a AR. So ya maybe not hold down a straight line of fire but you could Brust fire longer and hit your target faster. So maybe everyone needs to check that guy out just go to youtube.com and type in Future weapons and look for the MP7 and you will be surprised to learn what that gun in real life is able to do. But i would still like my M4, M16 style of a rifle. Better yet a Bushmaster AR-15 with a 14 1/2 inch barrel with a retractable stock. Theres your M4 right there </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The MP7 is not an AR or even close to an AR in reality. It is a PDW that fires an anemic pistol round, which penetrates CRISAT (equivalent of a ballistic helmet or most modern soft Armor vests) It has terminal ballistics similar to a .22LR target round, it is seeing a lot of serious acquisitions in the security market, with a British body-guard unit (forget which one, sorry) buying some, but much like the P90, no serious military takers. These anemic pistol rounds and the PDW concept have been around for awhile with no serious takers, they were designed for support troops who needed similar power to their pistol but with more range and with more portability than a rifle. Here is a good article to read for more in-depth discussion about PDW rounds.

--Hayes C: "Personal Defense Weapons"”Answer in Search of a Question"ť, Wound Ballistic Review. 5(1):30-36; Spring 2001

Future Weapons is an entertaining program, but should not be viewed as anything more then that, the tests preformed are usually fairly marginal compared to what is actually preformed before selecting a weapons/armor system. The Dragon Skin armor episode is a prime example, all they did was shoot a few rounds at it, and detonate a grenade under it, fun stuff but no environmental testing, no MMG or full sized rifle rounds, only pistol and intermediate cartridges. Dragon Skin failed the US Army tests for it by the 8th test (out of 30), but that information was nowhere to be heard in the show.

darylluff
02-07-2007, 12:43 PM
How about an M16A1 - that would be reminicient

D---Fingers
02-07-2007, 12:51 PM
the M4 and M16 will never be in this game. it was stated by the dev because of something with Colt. they wont say why, just that it will never happen.

i would personally like for at least an HK416 in its place but we'll see.


also the thing on Future Weapons about the MP7... i mean come on, HYPE?

i dont take anything they show there as fact until i see more and more military units around the world successfully adopt that weapon.

in the meantime HK can grease as much of the media as possible to positively portray this gun.

darylluff
02-07-2007, 01:19 PM
I agree about futureweapons - a lot of hype on that show - good facts - but technical accuracy? I think not...

BaDFusion
02-07-2007, 03:50 PM
Well thats fine but being in law enforcement Myself I have seen what the MP7 has been able to do rather the show says this or that and talking with HK myself and what they have done with that gun is exterme. I agree that your not going to get the range out of a MP7 as you would a AR but the game is Based on Close range combat and being that that weapon is able to go through Not only law enforcement Vest with But also a Military Vest also in a short range to med. range with easy really goes to show how powerful the weapon is. But to your knowledge the Military is in the Process of replacing the MP5 with the MP7. But this is off the the subject of having a AR that looks similar to those guns colt makes. The gun world has alot of guns that shoot and look just like the M4 or M16..

BaDFusion
02-07-2007, 04:08 PM
http://www.bushmaster.com/le/images/LESpec.jpg

BaDFusion
02-07-2007, 04:11 PM
Now there is a Bushmaster AR-15 with smaller barrel and stock with some upgrades what would be so hard about adding that guy to the list of AR that no one uses. So basically take the guns no one Use out of the AR section and put a Few new ones in...

OKChilders
02-07-2007, 11:37 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NousDefions:
The Dragon Skin armor episode is a prime example, all they did was shoot a few rounds at it, and detonate a grenade under it, fun stuff but no environmental testing, no MMG or full sized rifle rounds, only pistol and intermediate cartridges. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

WTF? You are a FOOL.

I read these boards occasionally to gain some inside knowledge on R6LV. I have passed on all the other posts buy experts on shotguns or morons who know all about special forces.

As for idiots spreading bad information as the truth, you take the cake. Dragon Skin beats the Interceptor OTV hands down. The only thing Dragon Skin had going against it was the lack of a retired COL or General working for the company.

As for the supposed lack of full sized rifle rounds what the hell do you call 7.62 and 5.56? Do you have any idea what you are talking about? A Frag Grenade failed to impress you? You have obviously never had to trust your life to that piece of inferior equipment. Learn what you are talking about before you post again moron.

NousDefions
02-08-2007, 12:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by OKChilders:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NousDefions:
The Dragon Skin armor episode is a prime example, all they did was shoot a few rounds at it, and detonate a grenade under it, fun stuff but no environmental testing, no MMG or full sized rifle rounds, only pistol and intermediate cartridges. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

WTF? You are a FOOL.

I read these boards occasionally to gain some inside knowledge on R6LV. I have passed on all the other posts buy experts on shotguns or morons who know all about special forces.

As for idiots spreading bad information as the truth, you take the cake. Dragon Skin beats the Interceptor OTV hands down. The only thing Dragon Skin had going against it was the lack of a retired COL or General working for the company.

As for the supposed lack of full sized rifle rounds what the hell do you call 7.62 and 5.56? Do you have any idea what you are talking about? A Frag Grenade failed to impress you? You have obviously never had to trust your life to that piece of inferior equipment. Learn what you are talking about before you post again moron. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you say so sir, you obviously know more about it then me, I bow to your superiour knowledge and intelect. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif If you want to trust your life to Dragon Skin in a area with a 120 degree ambient temperature with a 7.62x54mm AP Round threat that's your business, but I trust the men who ran the army testing, Karl Masters and James Zheng, and the Natick Soldier Systems Center, more then the Pinnacle armor hype machine.

As for the 5.56x45mm and 7.62x39mm, they are considered intermediate cartridges. And no a grenade doesn't really impress me all that much; it's done fairly often in testing.

randolfphe
02-08-2007, 02:13 AM
will they ever explain why the colt weapons aren't featured?

D---Fingers
02-08-2007, 03:41 AM
probably not, but i do find it odd that a M1911 pistol is used as the icon for Equipment in the PEC loadout screen.

MrBungle72
02-08-2007, 04:40 AM
I think Colt refused to license thier guns to UBI once they found out that the weapons would be handicapped.

MrAgent47
02-08-2007, 04:44 AM
they should add the 1911, colt isn't the only company making them, and bring back the five-seven. Maybe a benelli inertia driven shotgun(they are fast)M1014 http://www.usmcweapons.com/articles/M1014/M1014NF.htm

wormil
02-08-2007, 07:23 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NousDefions:
If you say so sir, you obviously know more about it then me,... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Apparently he knows quite a bit more about it than you. Dragon Skin is impressive armor and has passed tests by many agencies. The problem with the army test is that the army, specifically Karl Masters, ridicule Dragon Skin but refuse to release their test results.

If you want to read Pinnacle's version of what happened:
http://www.pinnaclearmor.com/20060630-pr.php

BaDFusion
02-08-2007, 10:05 AM
Well i don't know how we all got off subject about dragon skin and etc.. The point is there are many AR out there that look similar or pretty damn close to a M4 or M16. And i did not say a MP7 is a AR i said it basically is with the type of high Velocity round that has the penatrating force of a AR from Short to Mid range.. But again off subject. My question is to UBI and that is no matter if colt said no or not. How come they gave up once colt said no and havent tryed to get another company that makes the same thing Like Bushmaster if they could copy there guns into the game.I would just like to know from UBI the reason why they didnt add that style of AR into the game. Even if its downloadable Content..

BaDFusion
02-08-2007, 10:14 AM
Its almost like someone has to take it in there own hands and talk to a gun company and have the gun company call UBI themselves and get something going...On that note does anyone have UBI's CEO's email???

piratefalcon325
02-08-2007, 10:15 AM
I don't know much about Dragon Skin armor, but to me the proof is in the pudding. The US Army supplies regular infantry (etc) units with the interceptor body armor (called IBA by the troops who wear it). I've see it save lives firsthand.

But then again, Paraclete supplies light to heavy body armor for a lot of SF units (which have unit expense purses per year with which to buy WHAT THEY WANT rather than what is regularly issued). I suspect that IBA is contracted by the US Army because they offered the best combination of low-bid/decent quality. Why do you think the Army switched standard uniform issue to the ACU pattern in the middle of a war? To save money. Instead of having to issue both woodland camouflage BDU's and desert camouflage uniforms, they issue "all-purpose" camouflage that is "better" and will work in "any environment." Most SF units still prefer DCU's in country. Thus the IBA contract is less about the superiority of the armor (though it is adequate) and more about saving costs.

And NousDefions, don't get too dismayed that people are jumping up your a** like a plumbing snake. I mean, you have probably never seen what 7.62 or even 5.56 can do to a human body (for that matter, even 9mm). I'd just be careful about using an SF motto as your user name when your knowledge is lacking.

piratefalcon325
02-08-2007, 10:20 AM
Back on topic. In this case it might be more effective to write an actual letter (yes, I know, gasp, snail mail) to UBI (or Colt) and tell them that fans of these games are really dismayed that such a staple of the special ops community like the M4 or 1911 are not available for use for one reason or another. It might help to have someone with actual military experience to write and say: "I like those weapons systems b/c I actually used them, it contributed to realism, blah blah blah."

I, for one, was really irritated to find that those weapons were not available. It's like playing basketball and not being allowed to wear nikes.

BaDFusion
02-08-2007, 10:39 AM
Who are you talking to? Because i have seen first had what a 9mm to 45 cal can do to people..Maybe not 7.62 or 5.56 but than again i dont run into many towel heads as a police officer..

piratefalcon325
02-08-2007, 11:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Who are you talking to? Because i have seen first had what a 9mm to 45 cal can do to people..Maybe not 7.62 or 5.56 but than again i dont run into many towel heads as a police officer.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thought I said I was talking to NousDefions. And I called em Hajjis, even though that is technically an honorific term for a muslim who has completed the hajj.

I found it dubious that nousdefions seemed to scoff at the fact that Dragonskin stopped 5.56, 7.62 and several other calibers at &lt;10 meters. I saw an IBA stop an AK 7.62 round but we were in a far ambush (about 600 meters)... So to me, the episode of Futureweapons he was referring was impressive in terms of Dragonskin's protective power.

He might not have been scoffing. It's always hard to read inflection on these boards.

NousDefions
02-08-2007, 11:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wormil:

Apparently he knows quite a bit more about it than you. Dragon Skin is impressive armor and has passed tests by many agencies. The problem with the army test is that the army, specifically Karl Masters, ridicule Dragon Skin but refuse to release their test results.

If you want to read Pinnacle's version of what happened:
http://www.pinnaclearmor.com/20060630-pr.php </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes because we all know that companies trying to sell their products would NEVER issue a smear campaign against testing officials, especially when they can still make large lucritive contracts with other branches of the military, and private security corporations, all of which vanishes if it turns out their armor has kinks in it. I trust Karl Masters word over Pinnacles any day of the week. Ive served in Afghanistan, I do find Dragon Skin to be interesting, however I trust Masters, and Natick more then Pinnacle, and contrary to popular belief Natick does try and provide the best possible equipment to the soldiers, anyway, if people want to take Pinnacles word about its armor in 120 Degree ambient temps, with a 7.62x54mmR AP threat thats their business like I said.

EDIT: And no I wasnt scoffing at its protective power, I know its there and that it has its uses and is a great piece of equipment, however I also know better then to believe all the crud Pinnacle is throwing out about it, and have more trust in the testers and Natick then Pinnacle's tests. And while the FutureWeapons gun tests were entertaining I did not find it terribly conclusive, I should hope it can stop 5.56x45, and 7.62x39mm rounds, since its rated as LVL IV armor, if it couldn't then there is a problem with the rating system.

piratefalcon325
02-08-2007, 12:18 PM
Even the IBA did not protect against 7.62 AP until late 2005 when a new ceramic anti-AP plate was issued, but not everyone got one. And they were slightly but noticeably heavier than the original issue trauma plates, making them just that much more of a pain in the ***.

SF prefers paraclete because it is lighter weight and basically offers the same level of protection without the restriction of movement that all the add-ons of the IBA cause.

And think about the converse of your argument: if you think that pinnacle is "smearing" to gain a market advantage, don't you think there might be self-interested parties in company contracted for the IBA? Can you imagine how much money that company would lose if it no longer had the contract to supply the regular army with body armor?

Again, I'm not saying that the IBA is a bad product. I have no idea whether dragonskin is superior to the IBA, and even if it was, if the IBA is cheaper to make and still provides adequate protection, then I suspect the DoD would still be ordering them. I'd personally rather be wearing paraclete when baking at 120 degrees in the f*ing desert, and second to that the IBA, just because I've seen it work. In any case, it isn't up to us or even the regular soldiers what body armor they get. That's up to the guys in DoD who dole out the money for these contracts.

What was the thread topic again?

NousDefions
02-08-2007, 12:26 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by piratefalcon325:
Even the IBA did not protect against 7.62 AP until late 2005 when a new ceramic anti-AP plate was issued, but not everyone got one. And they were slightly but noticeably heavier than the original issue trauma plates, making them just that much more of a pain in the ***.

SF prefers paraclete because it is lighter weight and basically offers the same level of protection without the restriction of movement that all the add-ons of the IBA cause.

And think about the converse of your argument: if you think that pinnacle is "smearing" to gain a market advantage, don't you think there might be self-interested parties in company contracted for the IBA? Can you imagine how much money that company would lose if it no longer had the contract to supply the regular army with body armor?

Again, I'm not saying that the IBA is a bad product. I have no idea whether dragonskin is superior to the IBA, and even if it was, if the IBA is cheaper to make and still provides adequate protection, then I suspect the DoD would still be ordering them. I'd personally rather be wearing paraclete when baking at 120 degrees in the f*ing desert, and second to that the IBA, just because I've seen it work. In any case, it isn't up to us or even the regular soldiers what body armor they get. That's up to the guys in DoD who dole out the money for these contracts.

What was the thread topic again? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I havent yet come out in defence of IBA either, it works, its heavy, its bulky, the groin and neck sections get in the way alot. Ive come out in defence of Karl Masters and Natick is all. All I know is that IBA passed all the enviromental testing at Natick, Dragon Skin failed in test 8, if it offers better protection 'out of the box and in a lab' is besides the point if it can not pass enviromental testing phases, or survive storage in the armories. I know all about smear campaigns by companies and their hype machines, that was the point of the original post, dont always believe the greatness of something, just because the manufacturer says its that good.

Paraclete makes some fine plate carriers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

zulizin
02-08-2007, 05:23 PM
Forget about the Colt... I would like to start wearing Dragon Skin armor, maybe the Army is too dumb to purchase and wear the stuff but Logan, Jung & Michael could sure use it.

Now if they could only make a full headgear Dragon Skin helmet for us to keep our heads from exploding in a cloud of blood.

wormil
02-09-2007, 05:51 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NousDefions:
... if people want to take Pinnacles word about its armor in 120 Degree ambient temps, with a 7.62x54mmR AP threat thats their business like I said. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Since Masters will not release the results and apparently did not even complete the testing and apparently has made false statements in the past, he leaves himself open to very deserved criticism. Dragon Skin has been tested by other agencies/branches and Masters is the only tester who has come public with claims that the product is not effective.

Now it may not be the best product or the most cost efficient product, I can't testify to either but frankly to publicly criticize someone's product and then hide behind the Army to keep from having to justify the criticism is just cowardly.

wormil
02-09-2007, 05:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by piratefalcon325:
Back on topic. In this case it might be more effective to write an actual letter (yes, I know, gasp, snail mail) to UBI (or Colt) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Supposably, Redstorm is licensed for Colt instead of Ubi which is why you find Colts in GRAW but not in R6

D---Fingers
02-10-2007, 12:46 AM
but in graw arent they using Barret's M4 clone, not Colt M4?

the gun says M468. i am assuming it is a Barret M468. it looks exactly like one.

i am pretty sure it is not the original colt M4. not in GRAW or GRAW2

TROUBLENSB
02-10-2007, 01:12 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wormil:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by piratefalcon325:
Back on topic. In this case it might be more effective to write an actual letter (yes, I know, gasp, snail mail) to UBI (or Colt) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Supposably, Redstorm is licensed for Colt instead of Ubi which is why you find Colts in GRAW but not in R6 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is also my understanding that Redstorm is only programming the MP portion and UBI is programming the SP portion of GRAW2. So the Licensing arguement doesn't seem to hold up. I have heard alot of things on here and since Colt lost their likeness and name (M4)suit against Bushmaster, I don't see how they could really sue UBISOFT over using the likeness anyways. It seems to be a mystery that will never be answered. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif Thanks.

TROUBLENSB

TROUBLENSB
02-10-2007, 01:20 AM
As to the whole discussion/arguement over Dragon Skin. Anyone who has actually served knows that what you are issued is usually from the lowest bidder. This is not a joke, nor is it funny when you are betting your *** on that lowest bid piece of equipment. You usually hope and pray that it will do what it says it does. As to DOD testers, they are not infallable, but I would ask this of those who seem hell bent to hang this guy... What does he have to gain from speaking out against Dragon Skin and Pinnacle? Do you know? Do you have proof or just an assumption? I personally don't know anything and I am sure there is alot more than any of us know firsthand. As to Pinnacle, my guess is that they have alot more reason to lie and smear ($$$) than a lowely DOD test does. Back to the discussion. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Thanks.

TROUBLENSB

wormil
02-11-2007, 12:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TROUBLENSB:What does he have to gain from speaking out against Dragon Skin and Pinnacle? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the question is: What does he have to gain from speaking out when he reportedly didn't complete the tests or release the results?

When there is a lack of evidence we have to ask: Is there corroborating evidence? The answer being: No.

I've been involved in Army test programs, as a tester/guinea pig, and in my experience the Army's decisions are not based on test results and it often seemed they had made their decision prior to the testing. The actual decision making process was way over my head but I suspect it is more political (and probably financial) than anything else. How many of these defense companies hire ex-military?

OKChilders
02-14-2007, 07:06 PM
Exactly Wormil, they have 3 retired Generals and 5 ret Colonels working for them. It's not who you know, it's who you blow. Somewhere a procurement officer is waiting on retirement and making deals to line his pockets for the rest of his life. Unfortunately for our Soldiers it is at the expense of their lives. For Gods sake people, these are the same type of guys that told us a Bradley could float!

Psymon0666
02-14-2007, 09:08 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BaDFusion:
http://www.bushmaster.com/le/images/LESpec.jpg </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

this is a beautiful gun, what would be so hard about adding this to the new pack, an unlock for say captains? it' would be a wonderful assualt rifle to have for general badass look, and a more decent assault rifle.

and why have no Devs posted their thoughts?

D---Fingers
02-15-2007, 12:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">and why have no Devs posted their thoughts? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


they did, albeit extremely vague... here is goliath's exact words regarding Colt and Variants of M4


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> You could have 14 million votes the M4 or any colt weapons are never going to be in Vegas. Thats unfortunatly undebatable.

Many people suggested the HK variant, theres a problem there as well (though not hopeless).

All i can say is that i love the weapon myself however without wanting to crush your hopes, i wouldnt hold my breath to find that in vegas for now.

Would require some content added later at least.

So its not that we dont want to listen to you, it's just not a possibility.

Hope you understand. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

randolfphe
02-15-2007, 04:25 AM
he doesn't offer and explanation, why so secretive about it?

is it really like what he's saying?:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MrBungle72:
I think Colt refused to license thier guns to UBI once they found out that the weapons would be handicapped. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


don't cross colt. if they want something done, you do it.

TROUBLENSB
02-15-2007, 12:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by randolfphe:
he doesn't offer and explanation, why so secretive about it?

is it really like what he's saying?:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MrBungle72:
I think Colt refused to license thier guns to UBI once they found out that the weapons would be handicapped. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


don't cross colt. if they want something done, you do it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Colt is not the powerhouse they used to be. Bushmaster won their countersuit against Colt over the M4. Colt dropped their suit against HK, and FN has taken over Colt's M4 contracts. Colt has long lost it's luster and power. I have serious doubts that Colt has anything to do with their (Ubi's) decision. Thanks.

TROUBLENSB

P.S. Those lawsuits were over the likeness of the M4 as well as the name M4. Seems to me such a precident would clear up the "legal issue". Especially since Bushmaster and HK are direct competitors, UBI doesn't even touch Colt's market.