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View Full Version : "STUKA" the plane for the real "experten" online



F19_Ob
12-21-2004, 07:10 AM
Stuka aces needed online.

A plane seldom flown online because of it extreemly low survivability.
Actually its the most difficult plane to survive in and master in combat because of its generally horrible performance, low energy and poor defensive armament (exept for a later variant with two 20mm cannons forward wich can bring down fighters if they hit).

Infact stukas cant really escape any enemy plane in the game and even the twoseater il-2 must be considered a potent fighter compared to it (Il-2 is Faster, turns better and with heavy armament and armour) and normally twoseater il-2's themselves are sitting ducks online and also require expert pilots to be able to survive for a while on servers like GG and F16.

In both these planes an expert is needed to be able to make the right tactical judgement in the right situation and achieve maximum turns in evasion and attacks against vastly better planes, and especially so in the stuka.
Anyone can do one or two evasive turns to avoid fire but a real energy-juggler is needed to be able to do it for longer periods and its usually this what separates the average or veteran pilots from the experts.

-----------------------------

My mission here is to mildly provoke and challange (in a good way) those "experts" online who fly superior planes, to sometimes try the worst of the worst and see how U do in it, but also because the pounderboys are in minority and need cunning mates.

Anyone can get kills in fighters but only experts do it on regular basis in stukas or 2seater il-2's or bombers.
Trying these worser planes also give the fighterboys a good insight in what its like to be exposed to risks and having no margins for error, compared to the safety of flying in superior planes with altitude and speed advantage and multiple choices available, especially the "disengage at will" thing.

Ahh!...what a challange! Maybe U have what it takes?? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

xanty
12-21-2004, 07:22 AM
Well, all I know is that bombers are like magnets: you sare in one and EVERY bugger will come after you, no matter how dangerous it is for them. Many will be even burning, under attack by other fighters, or simply determined to RAM you. I can't understand the desperation or pleasure that those people have when they see a bomber close by.

It sure is depressing to fly for 10-15 min and reach the correct altitude and path, or even bombing a few nice targets, to then be rammed or downed by the "refly" pilots online. Wish they got an electro-shock when they die doing that.

Rab03
12-21-2004, 07:25 AM
Flew Stuka once on Greatergreen, and shot down a MiG. I subsequently ran out of fuel (courtesy of enemy AA) and had to crash land. At present time, I cannot practice online flying since I have no Internet connection (this post written from office).

BTW, I prefered Il-2 , much more fun to search for ground kills while fighters are buzzing around you. Shot down only once or twice, 12 (don't remember) ground kills.

Important note: I don't consider myself an expert.

F19_Ob
12-21-2004, 07:55 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rab03:
Important note: I don't consider myself an expert. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No worries mate. The "expert" word is only a part of my mild and friendly provokation and do not exclude less experienced flyers from the invitation and challange.
The real importance is found in these these words;

"Trying these worser planes also give the fighterboys a good insight in what its like to be exposed to risks and having no margins for error, compared to the safety of flying in superior planes with altitude and speed advantage and multiple choices available, especially the "disengage at will" thing."

I also suspect that if more experienced flyers used the stuka or other "inferor" planes and do well in them it would draw attention and also inspire others to want to do well in cr@ppier crates too..and take some risks instead of being
on the "safe" side all the time.
In short,being a good sport.

TgD Thunderbolt56
12-21-2004, 08:01 AM
It's really cool when you can get three or more to fly together and take a more circuitous route then rain hell upon them when they least expect it.

Even a single fighter escort can ensure the survival of a couple of the suicidal Stuka jockeys as long as they don't loiter.

Attack and get out. As soon as the enemy determines what you're doing they'll come a runnin' so you have to be stealthy in your retreat as well.

Definitely one of the more rewarding, and challenging, planes to fly successfully.

TB

SkyPiggies
12-21-2004, 08:09 AM
Well, I have an irrational liking for the Bf-110

Spitbait, I know, but it's oddly satisfying to fly

That big belly gun can be devastating, with a litte luck and skill

As for the Stuka - I think the Gustav is more than a match for the Il-2

Has anyone tried running a Gustav vs Il-2 server?

Hawgdog
12-21-2004, 08:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> A plane seldom flown online because of it extreemly low survivability.
Actually its the most difficult plane to survive in and master in combat because of its generally horrible performance, low energy and poor defensive armament (exept for a later variant with two 20mm cannons forward wich can bring down fighters if they hit).
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

and there you have it in a nutshell. The stuka is a pig, and was so shortly after any enemy the germans encountered who had planes. Any planes. Its best used against civilians, livestock and ground troops with no guns.

I foolishly joined a co-op, we flew stukas against soft vehicle supply lines. We were attacked by rata's....we lost. quickly. I joined again....no way could we all get hammered so quickly by rata's. Wrong. Out gunned, out manuevered by an equal number of I-16's. We killed a few, but lost. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
next.......

LeadSpitter_
12-21-2004, 08:36 AM
Best people i seen in stukas are the llv34s im sure they would all enjoy flying them.

I think they have a couple ntrks of large group ground pounding on www.virtualpilots.fi (http://www.virtualpilots.fi)

Marek_Steele
12-21-2004, 08:51 AM
Altough I almost only fly 109's, on your server I always take a stuka when I can, both D5's and G1s are very fun to use. The problem is that most times people almost only take fighters, dogfight in a map area relatively close to targets and us groud pounders don't get any support. Actually the only chance to survive is constant switching between seat positions (kind of hard due to low alt flying and no auto level)and then force the enemy to overshoot, but most times someone on the six means death.

SkyPiggies
12-21-2004, 09:04 AM
Many will be even burning, under attack by other fighters, or simply determined to RAM you.

Yeah, I get rammed a lot flying the 110

What probably happens is your rear gunner kills them on the way in, so they don't pull out of the dive

mortoma
12-21-2004, 09:06 AM
A good way to fly them is in coops, but you have to wait for the rare coop that has stukas in it.
Unless you can run your own coop of course. But a coop is better than dogfight servers cause at least you could get a human gunner if you're lucky. And human gunners are a lot better than AI are.

p1ngu666
12-21-2004, 09:43 AM
i think the b2 is much much nicer to fly than the g/dx

my tips are
in dive bombing, forget the dive brakes, ull need the speed after, and i tend to put on rudder all the time (twist stick) so im inacutrate, but extra speed reduces rudder effect http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

careful use of dive breaks and break turns (with flaps) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

also u may want todo a maxium attack if your in combat, i mean be very agressive, fly it to get on someones 6 and stay there. they may well twist and turn alot, forgetting if thy just nailed it they could extend away.

low flying with bombs, at a correct distance u can drop bomb, and blow up enemy fighter http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

LilHorse
12-21-2004, 09:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hawgdog:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> A plane seldom flown online because of it extreemly low survivability.
Actually its the most difficult plane to survive in and master in combat because of its generally horrible performance, low energy and poor defensive armament (exept for a later variant with two 20mm cannons forward wich can bring down fighters if they hit).
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

and there you have it in a nutshell. The stuka is a pig, and was so shortly after any enemy the germans encountered who had planes. Any planes. Its best used against civilians, livestock and ground troops with no guns.

I foolishly joined a co-op, we flew stukas against soft vehicle supply lines. We were attacked by rata's....we lost. quickly. I joined again....no way could we all get hammered so quickly by rata's. Wrong. Out gunned, out manuevered by an equal number of I-16's. We killed a few, but lost. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
next....... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Stukas were never meant to compete with fighters. It's mainly Goerings foolish use of them in the BoB that branded them with the reputation of being "obsolete". Up until that time they were used to great effect and continued to be in the East.

And it may be the case now online that you don't see Stukas much. But that has to do with the decline in popularity of venues like VEF http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif Several guys in my squad and other whole squadrons specialized in the Stuka. And they survived because in those servers there were actual mission objectives that were planned out with escorts.

Taking a Stuka up in a DF room or even in a scripted server is a mostly losing proposition since almost nobody wants to provide an organized escort, let alone an actual planned out mission objective.

VW-IceFire
12-21-2004, 09:52 AM
Given the choice between a Stuka and a Bf-110 I chose the 110 simply because then it means that I can possibly out run some of the opposition.

Of course, you can see why the FW190 replaced the Ju-87.

BBB_Hyperion
12-21-2004, 09:53 AM
About time that someone noticed that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Poor guys that think they archived something while downing jabos, bombers .

Not even to talk about fighter vs fighter combat .

When you really want to shine fly the ju87 and not only survive but archive the given targets .)

http://www.butcherbirds.de/hypesstorage/ju87shipbombing.zip

Here some training tracks for ship bombing .)

LStarosta
12-21-2004, 10:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hawgdog:
Its best used against civilians, livestock and ground troops with no guns. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

D@mn straight.

SkyPiggies
12-21-2004, 10:33 AM
BTW forgive the utter noob question - but how do I check my six in the 87/110 without changing cockpits?

Surely these planes had mirrors in RL?

F19_Ob
12-21-2004, 10:42 AM
My personal interest In the stuka and il-2 is to try to maximize survival by thoughtful evasion and attack if possible. The fact that I'm fighting from a disadvantage point just makes me more determined to try to fly to the limit, wich actually makes a difference.
By always recording tracks I have learned to understand how the most common attacks are done and how to counter them, how much I have to turn to get out of the bulletstream, and so on.
I ofcourse get shot down often, especially when outnumbered, but by being an agressive attacker aswell as defender I also get surprizingly many opportunities to shoot at the enemy, especially in the twoseater il-2 because of its high rate of fire and flat trajectory, wich makes it possible to hit on long ranges ( 500m and beyond) better than any other plane. The problem is to maneuver to a firing position with very limited energy. But again, thats the big challange, to squeese out max performance.
The reward comes on those sharp days when U manage to drop your bombs on target and survive repeated fighter attacks or damage an enemy and/or even get a kill in a dogfight and manage to get home to land (sometimes without elevators and ailerons).
Then there is the freaky combined "luck and skill days" where u get multiple kills in a stuka or il-2 in dogfighting.
Luck is an under-rated ingredience of combat.

StG77_Kondor
12-21-2004, 12:23 PM
What????

Who says survivability in a stuka is low??? Only if you fly by yourself with landing lights on http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

You have to get several stukas, atleast 3 in formation, the rear gunners make mince meat of any fighter that dares attack you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

I fly the stuka 75% of my online time, the rest is either in He111's, Me110's or fighter/bomber Me109/Fw190.

The best stuka IMO, is the D3/5. Both have great speed, decent climb rate, good armament (especially the D5 with the 20mm cannons...which are great for shooting down IL-2's enroute to target http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif).

LStarosta
12-21-2004, 01:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by StG77_Kondor:
What????

Who says survivability in a stuka is low??? Only if you fly by yourself with landing lights on http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

You have to get several stukas, atleast 3 in formation, the rear gunners make mince meat of any fighter that dares attack you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

I fly the stuka 75% of my online time, the rest is either in He111's, Me110's or fighter/bomber Me109/Fw190.

The best stuka IMO, is the D3/5. Both have great speed, decent climb rate, good armament (especially the D5 with the 20mm cannons...which are great for shooting down IL-2's enroute to target http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif). <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Your rear gunners mince meat only if you fly on their dead Six O'clock "with your landing lights on".

Call_me_Kanno
12-21-2004, 04:23 PM
I really like flying the bomber's Stuka and IL2. The TB-3 too. One of my best memories online was a turning fight between me in my IL2 and a Bf-109. It went on for 20 minutes before he stalled and crashed. Wish I could remember his name cause he was a good pilot.

p1ngu666
12-21-2004, 06:55 PM
i had a fight like that, but i was il2 pilot, got shot up pretty good
109 eventully cliped earth and exploded, i went on to rocket target, when i ran out of fuel over exploding fuel tanks :O

i coaxed her down but she exploded http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

had gear collapse on me today too, gentle landing and boom http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif

stuka rear gunner, of full ai aicraft is very effective btw http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

ElmerFuddGantry
12-22-2004, 02:09 AM
It all depends on when, where and how you fly the Stuka. As for all bombers, keep away from severs that have any sort of icon enabled. Make them lazy fighter jocks do some actual searching for their victims. As a bomber you have two approaches. First one is the high dive, where you often find nobody at 5000m to intercept you. Interception only happens after you have bombed the target or alerted the AA defences. The other method is a ground level approach all the way to the target. Try it with a SC1800 Satan and a 3 second delay. Don't plot an obvious direct course and try to in behind if after tanks. You will make a terrific mess of the target. I prefer the D3, as its a bit smaller and more handier then the D5 or any twin engined job. A Stuka has very good manuverability, no speed and can take a fair number of hits. You can get kills with it, as you often do in an IL2, but that is not what it is designed for. If attacked, stay low, jink weave, combat flaps, use your lower stall speed, anything unpredictable and above all maximise the time where your gunner can shoot, but not be shot at. It can be done, I got a Spitfire and Mustang with a D5 last week and boy did it feel great to shoot a fighter down in a Stuka. If there are no icons, you can often loose the pursuing fighter in the landscape background if you use the terrain properly. Sometimes you get lucky. Goodluck

HansKnappstick
12-22-2004, 02:47 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by F19_Ob:
Anyone can get kills in fighters but only experts do it on regular basis in stukas or 2seater il-2's or bombers.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is a vast exaggeration. I for one can only get killed in a fighter, but I don't remember getting a kill. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

FiAW_Vaijy
12-22-2004, 02:54 AM
Look at pilot callsign LeosK_Polkku.
Quit a good flight , destroy 40 ground targets and rescue anotother pilot , not bad. Take a look...

http://il2fb-bellum.com.ar/rep/rep_02224.html

F19_Ob
12-22-2004, 02:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ElmerFuddGantry:
.... Make them lazy fighter jocks do some actual searching for their victims. As a bomber you have two approaches. First one is the high dive, where you often find nobody at 5000m to intercept you. ........ <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I agree...but I wont survive on 5000m on my servers.

Flying the stuka I either try to blend in close to the ground and try to fly as much as possible over forrests where spotting is hardest and even if the enemy has seen u he may lose sight of u again.
On GG or f16 (often frequented with same players) I may go up to cloudheight in the stuka so I can hide and have some energy for maneuvering for shots if I have the variant with 20mm cannons, but normally not higher because the opposition are stepped up to 4-5000m and I still cant dive away or outmaneuver them and have to constantly watch behind and below, so I calculate my chances much higher in clouds or close to ground.

Its fun to sneak by furballs on low altitude and pass it on the way back again http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

As strange as it may ssound, a stuka with the 20mmm cannons can be very good in a furball dogfight on very low altitude when shooting at enemies that chase friendlies in circles, and in the constant turning the reargunner often gets a good hit or two on enemies behind.
The stuka fares often worse with only one determined BnZ'er, but in a furball the stress is higher and noone is left alone for long and an enemy who parks himself in a slow turning with a stuka soon gets targeted by friendlies with better energy.
Once I shot down 3 spits this way in a 20mm cannon stuka ( I got 2 and my gunner 1), before I was downed, and while dangling in my chute, I counted and recounted my kills , quite happy with the tradeoff.

One of my favorite moves to get out of doge is to either bunt hard followed by hard turning climb or a hard diving turn followed by a leveling bunt and a pullup in the other direction.
In an il-2 the first often place me in a position to fire on an enemy after his pass on me.

F19_Ob
12-22-2004, 03:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HansKnappstick:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by F19_Ob:
Anyone can get kills in fighters but only experts do it on regular basis in stukas or 2seater il-2's or bombers.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is a vast exaggeration. I for one can only get killed in a fighter, but I don't remember getting a kill. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LoL hans.. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif I think U are pulling my leg here.......anyway, that textpart was only a part of my mild provokation to wind up the fighterjocks a bit http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif and have no deeper meaning.

F19_Ob
12-22-2004, 03:10 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by FiAW_Vaijy:
Look at pilot callsign LeosK_Polkku.
Quit a good flight , destroy 40 ground targets and rescue anotother pilot , not bad. Take a look...

http://il2fb-bellum.com.ar/rep/rep_02224.html <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


THNX for posting... yes that must have been a great mission and a good feeling on tuchdown.

F19_Ob
12-22-2004, 03:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by StG77_Kondor:
What????

Who says survivability in a stuka is low??? Only if you fly by yourself with landing lights on http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

You have to get several stukas, atleast 3 in formation, the rear gunners make mince meat of any fighter that dares attack you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

I fly the stuka 75% of my online time, the rest is either in He111's, Me110's or fighter/bomber Me109/Fw190.

The best stuka IMO, is the D3/5. Both have great speed, decent climb rate, good armament (especially the D5 with the 20mm cannons...which are great for shooting down IL-2's enroute to target http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif). <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


LoL...ok U love the stuka too. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
And I agree that in a group with the 20mm cannon stuka the situation is a bit improved since a hit actually can bring a fighter down and its likely that one in the group can maneuver to a shooting position.
(Often the foe has no idea that this stuka has two 20mm cannons)
But not even this stuka is a match for the twoseat il-2. In my Il-2's I have met them frequently and instead of shooting them down I just fly away from them.
Occasionally I may squeeze of a burst on them, not so much to shoot down but to just alert them of my presence and remind them to watch their 6 more often. Unfortunately a friendly burst from an il-2 usually is whats required to bring a plane down.
The only time I have considered them a problem is when they have ended up on an unsuspecting friendlys tail, but I remove them quickly enough.
I cant understan how u shoot down Il-2's enroute to target? But then, it ofcourse depends on who is flying the stuka, and perhaps also the Il-2.

If u go to GG or F16... we may fly stuka in a group http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Vipez-
12-22-2004, 05:42 AM
Stukas are indeed for only patient, experten people.. back in VEF2 times only chance of survival was definately escort, plus stukas taking alternative routes to targets, going around the soviet interceptors.. this way I'd say we were pretty effective in VEF-2 with 6 human stukas..

Best stuka pilot: I would say LeOs.K_Polkku; probably the only blue ground attack pilot in VEF-2 exceeding 2000 points with flying purely in Stuka (Lt. Colonel rank.. he got about 1998 points to be exact http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif )

In short, if you want to make it, learn to use the rear gunner effectivily.. learn, when not go in the rear gunner compartment to avoid PK.. Learn how to evade soviet Air-to-air missles.. (most important, biggest threat for stukas in formation are those nasty rockets, one hit and its over...) If planes without rockets, then formation is good defensive..

B-2 stuka probably has the best chances on 1-on-1 combat against soviet planes.. its fastest, climbs better than D-3/d-5, much more agile, it can outturn planes like Yak-7 and Lagg-3 Series 4.... though it has much worse rear gunner (MG-15 is kinda useless).. Personally I prefer D-3.. D-5 is simply too clumsy, its very rare that you get a chance to shoot with the 20mms.. you get many kills with the rear gunner against too arrogant soviet pilots, who stick in your rear gunner section http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Platypus_1.JaVA
12-22-2004, 10:36 AM
Well, you hit the nail on the head (DUtch saying) The Stuka was designed with this in mind. It should operate always under friendly air superiority. Furthermore, it is not a fighter, it should be considered a bomber. Furthermore, Ju-87 can be flown with succes but, all icons on a server should be off and there should be no outside view. This way, you can take off, look to your map, take a detour to the enemy base, gradually climbing. When you arive at the enemy base, (preferably at 2500m or so) bomb it in a stuka worthy fashion (enemy pilots, in the proces of starting-up their aircraft are the best targets) and be gone. Fly very close to the ground but, avoid flying too low because the dust cloud of the prop wash will tell your position to enemy fighters. Take the detour again to your base, preferably another. Most of the time, you can succesfully and a flight in this way. For the enemy, you come from an un-expected direction. Drop your bombs and most of the time, you are allready long gone by the time the enemy figures out what happened.

This is a usefull online STUKA tactic. It is not very heroic and you don't get many points but, when you vulched an enemy that way, there is no greater satisfaction in this game.

Happy flying http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

LilHorse
12-22-2004, 11:25 AM
Glad to see some of the old VEF2 vets in here. As I mentioned before squadrons like StG77 did very well in their Stukas. We had the pleasure of escorting a number of their guys on successfull missions.

StG77_Kondor
12-22-2004, 01:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LilHorse:
Glad to see some of the old VEF2 vets in here. As I mentioned before squadrons like StG77 did very well in their Stukas. We had the pleasure of escorting a number of their guys on successfull missions. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I remember those old VEF1 and VEF2 stuka missions. While they were fun, I was never too fond of them. The waypoints were obvious, and it was at a time that the B2/D3 couldn't climb for the life of them http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif. Not to mention, the target selection was rather weak, tanks were very spaced out, hard for a stuka formation to effectively attack and stick together.

There were several missions were our escorts just wiped the field and allowed for us stukas to attack the target. I remember one such incident, I was rolling over the target at 3500m, drop my bomb at 250m, start pulling up, and the explosion killed me http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

polkku
12-22-2004, 03:19 PM
those who say Stuka is useless in this game obviously don't know how to fly the thing and are too spoiled by the superfast fighters to even try. I have plenty of experience with this plane and have always been willing to help those who want to know this tool better http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif .
As others have mentioned here, flying the 87 requires a lot of planning and a good eye to see what is happening in the area in order to navigate through the mission succesfully (with or without escort). This makes the wole mission exciting from start to finish.

I can strongly recommend Stuka missions for those who are not afraid to select the plane which has never been labelled ├╝ber http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

StG77_Fritz_X
12-23-2004, 07:24 AM
... and if you want to know what it is to fly Stukas, and fly with the real experten, join Stukageschwader 77.

Couldnt resist. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

F19_Ob
12-23-2004, 12:07 PM
Good show Polkku and stG77_Fritz_x. Its good to help out mates and give tips on how to get started.
GreaterGreen and F16 (or any server) needs stukapilots with this attitude.
But above all the servers need stukas who dont
give up after being shot down a few times.

The stukas are often, in my experience and on GG and F16, not able to strike back at an attacker at same rate as the il-2 is, if the pilot can maneuver to a position to shoot.
The later stuka with two 20mm cannons can down a plane for sure, if they hit on closer ranges, the problem is that experienced fighters dont stay on close ranges, but the Il2 have such high rate of fire and flat trajectory that it can hit beyond 500m and most attackers reach that distance pretty quickly after the attack wich makes it harder to counterattack with a stuka (in many situations). On the other hand its more problems to find a bouncer climbing away in an il-2 because of the slightly worse visibility from cockpit.

Some have said that stukas or bombers wasnt ment to fight with fighters, but sometimes u just are out of options and have to do whatever u can to save your skin. And to learn how to hit fighters
with less energy and maneuverability is an important part of flying these babies, for me anyway. (its fun too)

Even in RL stukas often had to go through flak and fighters who knew they were coming, so hiding and safe routes wasnt always possible. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

corvette93
12-23-2004, 12:43 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SkyPiggies:
BTW forgive the utter noob question - but how do I check my six in the 87/110 without changing cockpits?

Surely these planes had mirrors in RL? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hit C. Will give you rear gunner view.

corvette93
12-23-2004, 12:47 PM
I fly it a lot. Fly at 50 m and try to stay in any mist. Follow land countours. Bomb and get the h out. Check 6 a lot. Cross water at narrowest point or fly around. Cross hills at paasses. Have flown under enemy fighters many times and not been seen doing this. The JU 87 has an uncanny ability to sneak in, but come in through the back door. One final bit of advice- USE VIGOROUS PRAYER! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

LordOliver
12-23-2004, 03:37 PM
Go Stuka...

Copperhead310th
12-23-2004, 04:06 PM
Stuka is a sitting duck for the IL-2.
IL-2 has got to be my hands down fav VVS plane in the sim. in the right hands it can tangle with early & mid war fighters down in the weeds.
It can trun with the 109's, and it every grts be hind you....it's over. Use flaps a lot and you can do some pretty amazing stuff.

one of the thing i love to do is when a 190 gets on me just dive down and the side of the nearest mountiuan (if on the map) and head straight for the side of it. Since most 109 drivers are target fixated 90% of the time it doesent occur to them to pull out till it's too late. So head right at the mountain and pop full flaps & loop. If they don't crash and are able to folow just come out of the loop very low. that should do it. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

SkyPiggies
12-23-2004, 05:22 PM
One final bit of advice- USE VIGOROUS PRAYER!

Good advice http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Vipez-
12-24-2004, 04:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Copperhead310th:
Stuka is a sitting duck for the IL-2.
IL-2 has got to be my hands down fav VVS plane in the sim. in the right hands it can tangle with early & mid war fighters down in the weeds.
It can trun with the 109's, and it every grts be hind you....it's over. Use flaps a lot and you can do some pretty amazing stuff.

one of the thing i love to do is when a 190 gets on me just dive down and the side of the nearest mountiuan (if on the map) and head straight for the side of it. Since most 109 drivers are target fixated 90% of the time it doesent occur to them to pull out till it's too late. So head right at the mountain and pop full flaps & loop. If they don't crash and are able to folow just come out of the loop very low. that should do it. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

this is why IL-2 is not required to be flown by Experten http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif