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View Full Version : Is it good to shoot far away or get in close towards the enemy?



Tuskegee1989
06-13-2008, 01:38 AM
I'm used to battlefield 1942 flying and I can tell you this now , It is nothing like this lol You didn't have to alot of stuff to take off and what not. And what weapons should you use to shoot down other players online? For some reason , I keep on picking bombs by mistake.

Tuskegee1989
06-13-2008, 01:38 AM
I'm used to battlefield 1942 flying and I can tell you this now , It is nothing like this lol You didn't have to alot of stuff to take off and what not. And what weapons should you use to shoot down other players online? For some reason , I keep on picking bombs by mistake.

rnzoli
06-13-2008, 01:53 AM
sure enough, with bombs you need to get close, real close

but if you try hard enough, it will work in any dogfight

DKoor
06-13-2008, 02:08 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
sure enough, with bombs you need to get close, real close

but if you try hard enough, it will work in any dogfight </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is one way how to (http://www.esnips.com/doc/a2ca0ab0-c423-447e-ba6b-5e5be9fc1b41/KunaIL2-vs-He111bombkill-402) do it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif.

PanzerAce
06-13-2008, 02:56 AM
If you keep your loadout as 'standard', without adding anything, you should have more than enough to kill people, as long as your convergence distance is set properly. Get in close, and when you are close enough, get in even closer, now EVEN CLOSER, then unload everything you have into the enemy.

Capt.LoneRanger
06-13-2008, 03:06 AM
Compared to BF it's extremely hard to hit a target effectively in IL2. You have to get very close with a 1000lb - bomb, to kill a tank and speeds and object-sizes are very different to BF.

In terms of engaging enemy planes, it depends on what type of aircraft you are flying. If you fly planes with MGs or heavy MGs, like the P51 or P47, you need to get very close. Quite opposed to BF, the bullets in IL2 get slower the longer they fly and thereby do less damage.
A good method is to start firing, when the wingtips of the plane you're aiming at both touch the ring on your crosshairs. You should also set your convergence to 150 if you engage at these distances, as it will aim the MGs to that point.

Cannons instead use explosives, so they can do pretty much damage even on large distances. They have a lower rate of fire, though and are more difficult to fire aimed on lighter aircraft.

SeaFireLIV
06-13-2008, 03:14 AM
Haha! BF. I used to play Bf when I didn`t feel like making an effort.

yea IL2`s a different story since it`s attempting to simulate real life combat where BF throws reality out. everything is far too close for modern warfare. for instance, if a jet or helo attacked you on the ground, you probably wouldn`t see it before being blown up. Everything would be much longer distance and you couldn`t take more than two rounds before being dead or seriously injured if you were lucky. And taking off and landing aircraft are ridiculously unrealistic.

The only realistic part of BF is that vehicles/weapons look like the real ones.

Anyway, once you stop picking bombs and have guns, go in close, so the target is almost filling the crosshairs- then CLOSER and shoot. KEEP CALM when you shoot. A lot of people get excited and don`t realise that they create their own `shake` putting them off aim. Breathe out as you shoot can help.

M_Gunz
06-13-2008, 03:45 AM
Far away or close?

If you shoot while closing in at a high rate then 300-400 meters out with deflection only
takes a few seconds. You wait till you're close and a short burst is all you get with no
time to correct your aim.

If you come in from the side or a rear quarter you don't even have to be faster to close in.

Tuskegee1989
06-13-2008, 04:11 AM
Yeah because everytime when I get close , I start to get nervous because I know that i'll get my first ever kill in this game. (Had this game for 2 days now and been playing in mutiplayer like forever lol) and in single player mode in the training , it usually says aim for the tail of the plan or the wings. I do that and I end up missing the plane all together.

DKoor
06-13-2008, 05:25 AM
If you have this game for two days, forget about multiplayer unless you know you play vs guys who have game for a few days just like you.

As you play, you will come across people who rarely if ever miss an average chance, let alone a good chance to hit.
Such people aren't rare online, and I think you have already probably witnessed it.

Instead of torturing yourself in multiplayer, go ahead pick your fav fighter in QMB (quick mission builder) fill in the friendly flights, de-select any enemy, and practice your gunnery vs steady targets (friendlies wont evade at all).

When you can shoot two or more aircraft that way, you are ready to take on the enemy on easiest level.
And progress.

Yes.... that's true only if you know how to take off, fly around and land first. Because of what goodness would it be to know how to shoot someone down and not know how to take/off land and basic machine management in flight?

stalkervision
06-13-2008, 05:34 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DKoor:
If you have this game for two days, forget about multiplayer unless you know you play vs guys who have game for a few days just like you.

As you play, you will come across people who rarely if ever miss an average chance, let alone a good chance to hit.
Such people aren't rare offline, and I think you have already probably witnessed it.

Instead of torturing yourself in multiplayer, go ahead pick your fav fighter in QMB (quick mission builder) fill in the friendly flights, de-select any enemy, and practice your gunnery vs steady targets (friendlies wont evade at all).

When you can shoot two or more aircraft that way, you are ready to take on the enemy on easiest level.
And progress.

Yes.... that's true only if you know how to take off, fly around and land first. Because of what goodness would it be to know how to shoot someone down and not know how to take/off land and basic machine management in flight? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

mmitch10
06-13-2008, 06:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DKoor:
If you have this game for two days, forget about multiplayer unless you know you play vs guys who have game for a few days just like you.

As you play, you will come across people who rarely if ever miss an average chance, let alone a good chance to hit.
Such people aren't rare offline, and I think you have already probably witnessed it.

Instead of torturing yourself in multiplayer, go ahead pick your fav fighter in QMB (quick mission builder) fill in the friendly flights, de-select any enemy, and practice your gunnery vs steady targets (friendlies wont evade at all).

When you can shoot two or more aircraft that way, you are ready to take on the enemy on easiest level.
And progress.

Yes.... that's true only if you know how to take off, fly around and land first. Because of what goodness would it be to know how to shoot someone down and not know how to take/off land and basic machine management in flight? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

In the real world, of course you need to learn how to take off/land/machine mangement etc before you could even think of going into combat. But this is a combat sim, and people buy this sim because they want to shoot stuff...if they just wanted a flight sim they'd buy a Microsoft Product.

So I agree with what I think is your general point...keep having fun and practising gunnery skills offline in the QMB, and also practice take off/landing, basic machine management etc (the Straight from the Farm campaign is great for this)

BadA1m
06-13-2008, 07:44 AM
One thing I would add is to keep in mind that IL2 is a simulation of very complex machines that were extremely difficult to fly even for experienced pilots and they regularly killed guys with hundreds of hours of the best training money could buy. So have patience with yourself, you'll get it. (And don't forget to thank God for the refly button)

Xiolablu3
06-13-2008, 08:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DKoor:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
sure enough, with bombs you need to get close, real close

but if you try hard enough, it will work in any dogfight </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is one way how to (http://www.esnips.com/doc/a2ca0ab0-c423-447e-ba6b-5e5be9fc1b41/KunaIL2-vs-He111bombkill-402) do it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Classic!

Xiolablu3
06-13-2008, 08:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
Yeah because everytime when I get close , I start to get nervous because I know that i'll get my first ever kill in this game. (Had this game for 2 days now and been playing in mutiplayer like forever lol) and in single player mode in the training , it usually says aim for the tail of the plan or the wings. I do that and I end up missing the plane all together. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just try and hit any part of the pane, if you have cannons it should cause bad damage.

Like others have said, you really need toi practice shooting offline a bit first.

Did I see you on Skies Of Valour server yesterday? I saw someone called Tuskagee flying a FW190A4 which is not the best plane to start with, as the temptation is to dogfight everything when you first start flying. However superior the FW190A4 is over the Spitfire V, trying to dogfight even those underpowered SPitfires V's on the horizontal with a FW190A4 will get you killed.

The FW190 requires you learn more about flying and in particular 'energy management' for you to be succesful in this plane.

I know quite a few of the SOV maps, I recommend when flying on there, you try a Bf109F4, Bf109G2, La5FN, Ki84 or a Spitfire IX instead, these planes are much more forgiving for new pilots. And remember externals are on on that server, you are not locked in the cockpit.

M_Gunz
06-13-2008, 08:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
Yeah because everytime when I get close , I start to get nervous because I know that i'll get my first ever kill in this game. (Had this game for 2 days now and been playing in mutiplayer like forever lol) and in single player mode in the training , it usually says aim for the tail of the plan or the wings. I do that and I end up missing the plane all together. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Set up keys to start and stop track recording and use them to make ntrks of when you're shooting.
Watch the tracks in slow-mo with pausing and switch POV to the target to see where the shots
are actually going and what your sight picture and slip-ball are showing you as you shoot.

Yah, the slip ball makes a difference in aim. If it's much off center then the best sight
picture is worthless.

Next is range and your convergence setting especially if you have wing guns. Getting in
close with convergence set to long, the shots go high and around the aiming point even when
firing with the ball centered.

If the target is movinbg relative to you then you also must lead the target so he passes into
the path of your shots by the time they reach him.

Sight picture, Slip, Lead, and Range at Convergence ALL have to be there at once to have good
effect or you need to compensate well.

In your favor is you having automatic fire. If you can see your tracers or the shots and get
them over to the target then you can swing your shots and have at least half-fast effect,
although you will be wasting ammo badly if you're not using very short bursts until you do
manage to put metal on target. You can at least find out how long it takes your shots to
reach and pass him with blip-short bursts, if they hit otherwise it's optical illusion time
and every burst telling him to start dodging....

M_Gunz
06-13-2008, 08:51 AM
hey maybe you can tell IL2fan where to find a copy of 1946... that one is lost for months now
even with sister helping get to the mall and holding hands to the game ripoff store.

Hey, I'm just going by the posts IL2fan made. I didn't make that up except for the ripoff
store part which is only my view of mall game store prices.

Tuskegee1989
06-13-2008, 08:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
Yeah because everytime when I get close , I start to get nervous because I know that i'll get my first ever kill in this game. (Had this game for 2 days now and been playing in mutiplayer like forever lol) and in single player mode in the training , it usually says aim for the tail of the plan or the wings. I do that and I end up missing the plane all together. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just try and hit any part of the pane, if you have cannons it should cause bad damage.

Like others have said, you really need toi practice shooting offline a bit first.

Did I see you on Skies Of Valour server yesterday? I saw someone called Tuskagee flying a FW190A4 which is not the best plane to start with, as the temptation is to dogfight everything when you first start flying. However superior the FW190A4 is over the Spitfire V, trying to dogfight even those underpowered SPitfires V's on the horizontal with a FW190A4 will get you killed.

The FW190 requires you learn more about flying and in particular 'energy management' for you to be succesful in this plane.

I know quite a few of the SOV maps, I recommend when flying on there, you try a Bf109F4, Bf109G2, La5FN, Ki84 or a Spitfire IX instead, these planes are much more forgiving for new pilots. And remember externals are on on that server, you are not locked in the cockpit. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yeah , I think that was me. I was wondering around and trying out new planes then. I didn't have no idea what I was doing then. I'm starting to get the hang of this game. Now if I only got my first kill. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

M_Gunz
06-13-2008, 10:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
Now if I only got my first kill. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Getting greedy is the best way to shortcut your tactics, blow your energy, and lose.

Learning to fly cleanly and well without combat distractions is a quicker road to not being a
victim, though there is more to that road even after you learn to fly and maneuver right.

Practicing your gunnery on drones until you know where your shots are going all the way out
(time to range, how far the target moves while the shots travel) is the next step.

After that you learn tactics without having bad piloting and gunnery screwing you up.

OTOH you can bumble around online possibly for years and never put the pieces together.
It's up to you.
They guys that did it for real at least went to some kind of pilot school first. Those
who did not have much time and no advanced training generally died before learning much more.
Online you just die a lot for every little bit you may learn.

Rakkasan1967
06-13-2008, 10:45 AM
Tuskegee welcome to the community. I also saw you yesterday, not sure where, might have been the 334th server. You were flying a 51 with a bomb load. I tried to give you some take off tips? Anyways if you come up on the 334th TeamSpeak tonight I'll be happy to fly with you and answer any quastion you may have. We should have a fair amount of pilots on by 2000 pdt. I think the P47 is a good bird to learn in, it has plenty of firepower can shoot a large cone of fire. Dives like hell. It also takes much more damage than most A/C in the game.

dbuff
06-13-2008, 11:18 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
I'm used to battlefield 1942 flying and I can tell you this now , It is nothing like this lol You didn't have to alot of stuff to take off and what not. And what weapons should you use to shoot down other players online? For some reason , I keep on picking bombs by mistake. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

When you think you are close, get closer...

Aaron_GT
06-13-2008, 12:12 PM
Individually the 20mm cannon have pretty close to the same ROF as most of the heavy MGs apart from the Soviet ones. Planes armed with only MGs tend to be armed with more, the main exception used online being the P51B and Mustang III. Some bomber-killer versions of the 190 can mount up to 6 20mm cannon AND 2 MGs, but your performance will suffer.

The 30mm MK108 has a rather low rate of fire, and also the muzzle flash can sometimes cause frame rate slow downs.

The best overall balance of ROF, killing power, and trajectory in the game is probably a 4 20mm cannon setup.

JSG72
06-13-2008, 01:49 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

Sometimes I find it pays to shoot when the enemy is not in the sights but will fly through "The curtain".

However. Only shoot deliberately to acheive this.

Xiolablu3
06-13-2008, 02:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
Yeah because everytime when I get close , I start to get nervous because I know that i'll get my first ever kill in this game. (Had this game for 2 days now and been playing in mutiplayer like forever lol) and in single player mode in the training , it usually says aim for the tail of the plan or the wings. I do that and I end up missing the plane all together. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just try and hit any part of the pane, if you have cannons it should cause bad damage.

Like others have said, you really need toi practice shooting offline a bit first.

Did I see you on Skies Of Valour server yesterday? I saw someone called Tuskagee flying a FW190A4 which is not the best plane to start with, as the temptation is to dogfight everything when you first start flying. However superior the FW190A4 is over the Spitfire V, trying to dogfight even those underpowered SPitfires V's on the horizontal with a FW190A4 will get you killed.

The FW190 requires you learn more about flying and in particular 'energy management' for you to be succesful in this plane.

I know quite a few of the SOV maps, I recommend when flying on there, you try a Bf109F4, Bf109G2, La5FN, Ki84 or a Spitfire IX instead, these planes are much more forgiving for new pilots. And remember externals are on on that server, you are not locked in the cockpit. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yeah , I think that was me. I was wondering around and trying out new planes then. I didn't have no idea what I was doing then. I'm starting to get the hang of this game. Now if I only got my first kill. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Mate, this is VERY important:-

Next time you enter a game, open the chat box as if you were about to chat, now drag the corner of the window bigger with the mouse. Make it so you can see 6 lines of chat and not just one (which is the default)

Now you can ask questions and see what is happening on the server.

If I see you again, I will wing up with you and give you a few pointers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Tuskegee1989
06-13-2008, 03:28 PM
Ok , So I kinda got it down now with the dogfighting. I shoot when I get within 10 Meters of the enemy plane. It almost worked. My aiming was off though.

Xiolablu3
06-13-2008, 03:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
Ok , So I kinda got it down now with the dogfighting. I shoot when I get within 10 Meters of the enemy plane. It almost worked. My aiming was off though. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

.10 is 100 metres mate.

VW-IceFire
06-13-2008, 03:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tuskegee1989:
Ok , So I kinda got it down now with the dogfighting. I shoot when I get within 10 Meters of the enemy plane. It almost worked. My aiming was off though. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That would be 100 meters. At 10 meters you'd be chewing the other guys tail off with your propeller.

I find my best shooting distance is at 300 meters to 100 meters. Closer than that is dangerous (and normally well inside my convergence range) and outside of that produces too few hits and too little power from HMGs to make the difference. Only in desperation or in order to goad a less experienced pilot to make a mistake will I fire at longer ranges.

The key is convergence range where all of your guns enter a small area at the center of the gunsight. Setting this is essential to gunnery and is something you should experiment by yourself.

I find 250 meters most appropriate to my gunnery needs but everyone is different.