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Siwarrior
10-10-2004, 01:06 AM
What do you prefer Heavy mgs or cannons
eg 8 .50cals or 1 mk108?

Personally i prefer the .50cals

p1ngu666
10-10-2004, 01:55 AM
ppfff @ mk108

37mm and up russian cannons are where its at http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

dispatched 7 109s or MORE and a iar8X in a single yak9t sortie yesterday, and i drifted back to base after runin out of fuel.
score after "ditching" was 560 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

my ONE good sortie of the day, rest of day im very **** http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

_Neveraine_
10-10-2004, 02:05 AM
Russian/Hispano Cannons seem to work best, 8x.50 isn't bad but the mk108 is :S

F19_Orheim
10-10-2004, 02:49 AM
I really prefer peashooters..... I enjoy a lon exhausting dogfight

Von_Zero
10-10-2004, 02:58 AM
cannons all the waaaaaaay
mk 108 and mg151/20 are my favs http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

F19_Ob
10-10-2004, 03:28 AM
I like the cannons best.

The most effective cannon in FB is the German 30mm and the one I feel easiest to hit with as soon one have learned the deflection for it.
Although I fly the 109 nowadays I often pick the 110, and its very interesting to try to hit planes with it beyond 1000m (with a 20mm and a 30mm gunpod).
The 15mm cannon on bf109F2 is fun because the enemy have a chance to survive a hit or two.

The big russian cannons are much harder to hit with, especially the p39 cannon....I'm not sure why.

I much like the cannons on Hurricane IIc and the field model. The planes performance is still poor but with the cannons u can hit with a deadly punch on 1000m wich cant be done with the mkIIb mg's.

My absolute favorite gunsetup is in the Il-2 with two 23mm cannons and mg's. Its fun to see how well two or a group of Il-2's can protect eachother by spraying at the foes on friends tails http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
he rate of fire is so great that it is possible to hit frequently on the ranges 4-600m
So these guns are fantastic and the only problem is to be able to maneuver to a shootingposition because of bad visibility and the heavyness of the twoseater.

Other than that I really begin to like the p38 and its cannon because I have seen fw's and 109's lose wings from long ranges (I always like that). Although I'm poor in fighting axis planes in it I still am quite good at running and hiding in clouds.

F19_Ob
10-10-2004, 03:33 AM
I like the cannons best.

The most effective cannon in FB is the German 30mm and the one I feel easiest to hit with as soon one have learned the deflection for it.
Although I fly the 109 nowadays I often pick the 110, and its very interesting to try to hit planes with it beyond 1000m (with a 20mm and a 30mm gunpod).
The 15mm cannon on bf109F2 is fun because the enemy have a chance to survive a hit or two.

The big ru

Cajun76
10-10-2004, 03:39 AM
A short burst with 8 x .50cals into a pit or eng can be extremely satisfying. I don't like most cannons over 20mm. 12.7mm or 20mm batteries is the best option for A2A, imho, unless there's loads of heavy bombers to take down. Otherwise, the 12.7 or 20mm are very effective, good balistics, ROF, and firepower.

My 0.02 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

HansvonEnde
10-10-2004, 09:51 AM
Hi to all,

cannons are deadlier than heavy MG but ammo load is less, nevertheless if the a/c has more number of MGs than another a/c with cannons the final effect is equal or higher,

30 mm cannon is like shooting little bombs,

in Luftwaffe cannons were needed mainly to shot down allied bombers, B-17 and B-24 needed fire cannon to stop flying,

imagine you hit one of these heavies with a 30 mm shell in the cockpit or in the fuel deposit, bomber says goodbye, ...

if Hitler hadn´t had western front CCCP would have fallen down (Mussolini unsense attack to Greece and allied supply of weapons for Stalin made damage to Hitler army in eastern front) but where he lost was in the western front due to allied bombing and later invasion where he had to maintain more than 1.500.000 men, these men located in CCCP would have been decisive). Also Hitler committed an "error", when he made his revolution, he never had to declare jewish-marxism-bolshevism as his enemy, but Germany was target of bolshevism after Russia, so he had to do forced, remember that bolshevism and Stalin is much more criminal than Hitler (60 million deads).

the final lesson is willpower, like Nietszche said, war among human is unstoppable.

thanks

MEGILE
10-10-2004, 09:57 AM
2 x 20mm Hispano "laser" cannons. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

4 x 20mm when the Tempest arrives! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

LStarosta
10-10-2004, 09:58 AM
20mm cannon is the best of both worlds. Quantity AND sheer firepower is where it's at.

I dislike the MK108 due to its poor ballistics. Delta wood is impervious to it, anyway.

Hartford688
10-10-2004, 10:12 AM
"but Germany was target of bolshevism after Russia, so he had to do forced, remember that bolshevism and Stalin is much more criminal than Hitler (60 million deads)."

How did a justification of Hitler and the Nazis make it into a discussion on HMGs and cannon?
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/353.gif

I like 20mm. And in the Tempest best of all.

Atomic_Marten
10-10-2004, 10:59 AM
12,7mm is IMO the best weapon overall in game. I prefer Me109's 2x13mm + 1x30mm.

Cajun76
10-10-2004, 11:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HansvonEnde:
Hi to all,

cannons are deadlier than heavy MG but ammo load is less, nevertheless if the a/c has more number of MGs than another a/c with cannons the final effect is equal or higher,

30 mm cannon is like shooting little bombs,

in Luftwaffe cannons were needed mainly to shot down allied bombers, B-17 and B-24 needed fire cannon to stop flying,

imagine you hit one of these heavies with a 30 mm shell in the cockpit or in the fuel deposit, bomber says goodbye, ...

if Hitler hadn´t had western front CCCP would have fallen down (Mussolini unsense attack to Greece and allied supply of weapons for Stalin made damage to Hitler army in eastern front) but where he lost was in the western front due to allied bombing and later invasion where he had to maintain more than 1.500.000 men, these men located in CCCP would have been decisive). Also Hitler committed an "error", when he made his revolution, he never had to declare jewish-marxism-bolshevism as his enemy, but Germany was target of bolshevism after Russia, so he had to do forced, remember that bolshevism and Stalin is much more criminal than Hitler (60 million deads).

the final lesson is willpower, like Nietszche said, war among human is unstoppable.

thanks <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Quite the history study for just a discussion of HMGs and cannons. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

To me, number of deaths dosen't equate with evilness, or being criminal. The intent for me is more the deciding factor. The millions the Nazis put to death in some of the most dehumanizing ways possible,in assembly line like effiecency, is the deciding factor. Stalin was a monster, no doubt, but he wasn't on a campaign of premeditated genocide. It unfortunately happaned that millions died, but it was his paranoia and fears that resulted in deaths, not a ideological "crusade" by an organized group of like minded people with an agenda. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

As an example of 12.7mm being effective, take USAAC fighters for example. They didn't face many large-multi engine bombers. They main goal was escort and ground attack, at which installations of 6 and 8 gun batteries seem suited, not to mention logistics issues like spare parts, common ammunition and the like. Had they faced a bigger threat of enemy bombers, I'm sure calibers would have gone up accordingly. IIRC, the XP-72, based on the P-47, was to carry 4 x 37mm guns. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/research/p72.htm

What a monster. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

HART_dreyer
10-10-2004, 12:29 PM
MK108 by far. Once you learn how to use it, it has no drawbacks. At first you'll be frustrated by the seemingly low ammo count and its low muzzle velocity. However after you learn proper deflection shooting both of those issues fall away. There's more than enough ammo to shoot down 10 aircraft as long as you make your shots. I don€t like the 37mm cannon or the Mk103 though; those are awful for vs. fighters imho.

1 shot 1 kill.

steiner562
10-10-2004, 12:39 PM
MK108 all the way.

georgeo76
10-10-2004, 01:22 PM
I prefer 20mm cannons. Multiple HMG would be my next choice.

LStarosta
10-10-2004, 01:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cajun76:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HansvonEnde:
Hi to all,

cannons are deadlier than heavy MG but ammo load is less, nevertheless if the a/c has more number of MGs than another a/c with cannons the final effect is equal or higher,

30 mm cannon is like shooting little bombs,

in Luftwaffe cannons were needed mainly to shot down allied bombers, B-17 and B-24 needed fire cannon to stop flying,

imagine you hit one of these heavies with a 30 mm shell in the cockpit or in the fuel deposit, bomber says goodbye, ...

if Hitler hadn´t had western front CCCP would have fallen down (Mussolini unsense attack to Greece and allied supply of weapons for Stalin made damage to Hitler army in eastern front) but where he lost was in the western front due to allied bombing and later invasion where he had to maintain more than 1.500.000 men, these men located in CCCP would have been decisive). Also Hitler committed an "error", when he made his revolution, he never had to declare jewish-marxism-bolshevism as his enemy, but Germany was target of bolshevism after Russia, so he had to do forced, remember that bolshevism and Stalin is much more criminal than Hitler (60 million deads).

the final lesson is willpower, like Nietszche said, war among human is unstoppable.

thanks <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Quite the history study for just a discussion of HMGs and cannons. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

To me, number of deaths dosen't equate with evilness, or being criminal. The intent for me is more the deciding factor. The millions the Nazis put to death in some of the most dehumanizing ways possible,in assembly line like effiecency, is the deciding factor. Stalin was a monster, no doubt, but he wasn't on a campaign of premeditated genocide. It unfortunately happaned that millions died, but it was his paranoia and fears that resulted in deaths, not a ideological "crusade" by an organized group of like minded people with an agenda. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

As an example of 12.7mm being effective, take USAAC fighters for example. They didn't face many large-multi engine bombers. They main goal was escort and ground attack, at which installations of 6 and 8 gun batteries seem suited, not to mention logistics issues like spare parts, common ammunition and the like. Had they faced a bigger threat of enemy bombers, I'm sure calibers would have gone up accordingly. IIRC, the XP-72, based on the P-47, was to carry 4 x 37mm guns. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/research/p72.htm

What a monster. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I don't want to drag this any more than it has to, but Cajun, I don't think you could be any more wrong. What Stalin did was EXACTLY genocide. A lot of things Stalin did, which I won't go into detail about, were simply supressed by the American and British media during and after the war in hopes of keeping Stalin happy. If it weren't for Truman and his aggressive anti-communist stance, we'd probably still be referring to Stalin as Uncle Joe.

fordfan25
10-10-2004, 05:47 PM
well i dont like the 1 cannon set up.but if i had a choice between 2X2 20mm like in the hurrican with equil ammo load as 4X4 50s like in the p47 i would go with the 20mm's.the only thing i dont like about cannon armed fighters in f.b is most never have enough ammo

e5kimo
10-10-2004, 05:56 PM
german cannons are the law http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

as to the 'history' debate falring up.

hitler and stalin .. both bad mkay.

hansvonende, you and your lame attempt at justifying hitlers actions is exactly what gives germans abroad (like me) still a bad name. shame on you !

Hunde_3.JG51
10-10-2004, 05:57 PM
In-game the Mk-108 is by far the best weapon IMO, with the Hispano placing second.

I think the armament also depends on the type of aircraft, in other words for a slashing or hit and run type of aircraft I would want as much punch as possible in as few bursts as possible (Mk-108). For more maneuverable, latch onto your 6'o'clock type planes I would prefer 20mm or 12.7mm with more firing time so that I could spray and cripple my opponent and then finish him off.

Imagine a FW-190 with 12.7mm machine guns, IMO it would be very ineffective as the 190 can't stick around to finish things off, he needs to hold the advantage as long as possible and to finish his opponent quickly. Now imagine a Spitifre with Mk-108, having only a few low trajectory shots to try and cripple/slow down that enemy that is trying to extend or disengage.

Zen--
10-10-2004, 06:54 PM
I agree with Hunde, the weapon mix depends on how you fly the plane primarily. High speed BnZ does seem to favor big punch weapons, TnB types do well with a mix of cannon and MG.

For me the firepower arrangement of the Ta152 has become my favorite...2x20mm for general shooting and the mk108 for point blank work. I think this arrangement gives you the most flexibility to engage all types of targets from fighters to IL2's, to heavy bombers and ground objects like light tanks and AA guns, perhaps more flexible overall than anything else or just MG or MG and big cannon armed planes(P51/P47 or 109K4/P39 for example).

p1ngu666
10-10-2004, 07:35 PM
big cannon on yak more fun, more sport in that http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

mk108 is very good, and so is hispano, but lacking the sport bit..
its like flyin ki84c, u win, but wheres the challenge?

(but not as much)

HansvonEnde
10-10-2004, 09:18 PM
Yes you are right, ... but it is not a justification, it´s true history.

Remember that "nazi" is the contemptuous abbreviation of national-socialist made by their foes.

This subject came to my mind when i thought about big heavies in the western front.

Johann

Johann

HansvonEnde
10-10-2004, 09:28 PM
No shame on me.

Review history deeper.

kit_lg2002
10-11-2004, 12:15 AM
I just started flying the Ta and i'm loving it so i guess the Mk108 RULEZ http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif, and the combination of 1 x 30mm + 2 x 20mm is kind of deadly http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Siwarrior
10-11-2004, 12:46 AM
I think that 8 .50 cals are quite effective on me109 wings. But facing a large/medium bommber i would go the mk108