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XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 08:43 AM
And had to read through all the scathing, belligerent, tactless, hostile, whiney posts in this forum daily I'd say screw it and look for a new job.

Those developers are stuck between a rock and a hard place - everyone wants everything fixed yesterday. They're hammered if they take longer than wished for to release a patch. They're hammered if they bow to all the pressure to get it out ASAP and miss an error or three.

They've already made their money - we all bought the game already (didn't we?). If ya think about it, it's pretty darned nice of them to spend so much time improving a product that's already been sold (with no gaurantee it would be improved).

I think we would all benefit from a calmer, more cooperative attitude in interacting with the dev staff. And we'd probably get a better product, too.

As it stands now, even with it's faults, FB is still BY FAR the best flight sim on the market. Let's not ruin it. Please.

-Bill

XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 08:43 AM
And had to read through all the scathing, belligerent, tactless, hostile, whiney posts in this forum daily I'd say screw it and look for a new job.

Those developers are stuck between a rock and a hard place - everyone wants everything fixed yesterday. They're hammered if they take longer than wished for to release a patch. They're hammered if they bow to all the pressure to get it out ASAP and miss an error or three.

They've already made their money - we all bought the game already (didn't we?). If ya think about it, it's pretty darned nice of them to spend so much time improving a product that's already been sold (with no gaurantee it would be improved).

I think we would all benefit from a calmer, more cooperative attitude in interacting with the dev staff. And we'd probably get a better product, too.

As it stands now, even with it's faults, FB is still BY FAR the best flight sim on the market. Let's not ruin it. Please.

-Bill

XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 08:57 AM
Agreed. I can only admire people who made this sim.

But some of us are real enthusiasts, and it is very hard to please such people /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 09:02 AM
Well said. Bravo.
S!
Chris

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XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 09:18 AM
Although I appreciate the work of the developers (being programmer too) I think you make an mistake in saying "they made their money".

All these Add-ons do what ?
They will attract MORE customers. How many ppl don't like IL2:FB for the simple reason that it's eastern front.
Did you ever wonder why they do western planes now ?

As with Counterstrike for Halflife it did what ?
It made Halflife the most sold game YEARS after release of original halflife.

I highly respect their work and some comments in this forum are plain sick, but the fact that they DO add-ons proves that they're getting money for it.
This will certainly produce bigger revenue as more and more ppl are attracted.

unfortunately Simmers are a demanding audience (check fate of Falcon 4.0) and need careful listening, but again they stick to a product if it's good and even take it with some errors as long as they feel their opinion counts.

BUT fact remains:
a) A lot of simmers behave immature
b) a lot of issues on IL2FB leave the impression that there's still a lot of room for improvement...

XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 09:41 AM
hi,
I'm missing a strong quality management after a product is released ...and after a long test by the market.

programmers in other industrial and business area would fired !

or..we have to live with this problems in this genre...?

even because it's software.. service is the first point !

XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 10:04 AM
Hawk I agree: respect and constructive comments the right way to go about it. Instead of people acting like spoilt brats.
Anyway I raise my pint to Oleg and his team!


hawkmeister wrote:
- And had to read through all the scathing,
- belligerent, tactless, hostile, whiney posts in this
- forum daily I'd say screw it and look for a new job.
-
- Those developers are stuck between a rock and a hard
- place - everyone wants everything fixed yesterday.
- They're hammered if they take longer than wished for
- to release a patch. They're hammered if they bow to
- all the pressure to get it out ASAP and miss an
- error or three.
-
- They've already made their money - we all bought the
- game already (didn't we?). If ya think about it,
- it's pretty darned nice of them to spend so much
- time improving a product that's already been sold
- (with no gaurantee it would be improved).
-
- I think we would all benefit from a calmer, more
- cooperative attitude in interacting with the dev
- staff. And we'd probably get a better product, too.
-
- As it stands now, even with it's faults, FB is still
- BY FAR the best flight sim on the market. Let's not
- ruin it. Please.
-
--Bill
-
-

XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 10:15 AM
- They're hammered if they take longer than wished for
- to release a patch. They're hammered if they bow to
- all the pressure to get it out ASAP and miss an
- error or three.
-


It's funny that you mention that, and how we're all "too hard on the dev team" or whatever the hell... It's also funny how this is a forum where people come to report inconsistancies with the game and reality. If you can't handle the fact that the game isn't as real as it could be, and that the reason people "complain" about the P-47 roll rate etc. etc. is that they would like to have the most realistic and enjoyable sim they can.... then you shouldn't post on this forum.

Also, exactally how are they "hammered" ?? I don't recall anyone calling the dev. team at their places of residence and complaing / whining.... this is a damned forum for god sakes.. it's our right to say what's on our mind. At any rate, if you think they should quit their jobs, how about you find them another one, because im sure they're all terribly miserable at their job where they sit behind a computer and do what they're trained to for top dollar...

As a final note... where do you get off telling everyone here who has a valid complaint or request about this game, that they're essentially being whiny about it... get over yourself.

XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 11:55 AM
Legitimate complaints, error reports, suggestions, requests, desires, do not require the belligerent, scathing tone that so many of the posts in this forum are composed of.

I was about to say that if you weren't behaving badly then you're not part of the problem. But then I went through the most recent posts and clipped the stuff below for your reading pleasure. VERY constructive feedback.

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about (names withheld out of a misplaced sense of decency):

"Okay i have been nice in here too long, for all you forum brown nosers and development team supports I have to say this. This patch is the biggest peace of crap since the day i brought CFS3 home and tried it and took it back. And if you dont like what i have to say moderators good bann me i dont care. I mean how in the hell u put out a patch called final and the BF109 K4 rudder dont work. This is patethic, oversight i dont think so its call the developer not even testing the damn FM in the patch for the aircraft..."


"You all actually think the K-4 is f'ed by accident? The one plane that was f'ed and really bad was the plane that was most whined about. Of course they tested it to make sure the rudder don't work, it's Oleg's lil payback. You all must be real arrogant to think it was an accident."


This guy is familiar...

"it's already been posted, but the fact that this happend is simply enfuriating... how in gods name can you release a patch and NOT KNOW that the RUDDER of a plane doesn't work?! What did you do, finish the patch, and throw it at us as soon as you could?? JESUS CHRIST, do some go**amn quality testing... never in my entirety of playing online have i seen such a grandiose mistake in a patch...
I'm sorry to break the friendly attitude towards UBI and Maddox games, but if this isn't fixed w/ in the next few weeks, you can find another ****ing customer.. this is horse****
Note: and yes, i'm a K-4 jock... it's funny how the only damned plane that i want to fly got slowed down in the beta patch, and then COMPLETELY broken in the latest patch... good work Dev. team... two thumbs up."


"You say only human error, no its lazy error, only way this could have happened is if someone did not even test the damn patch. I am sick of you brown nosers sucking up to the development team. These are mistakes that should not be made. A FM is difficult i agree to get right, but to have a rudder that dont work, why not just have a gunsight that is not there, or a gun that dont work, this can only be screwed up without proper testing in my opinion. This game has raised all our standards for flight sims. So we want the developement team to raise there standards, and for those of you who say a 8 month patch is a rush your lost in sauce. Most game have a minor patch or fix in a month or 2. Small patches would have made me much happier thus knowning another fix on the way soon, with progress we have so far we have a long time to wait for say a 109 k4 that is flyable again."


"The final patch is absolute crap. None of the promised things are better. Sound, Netcode still sucks. Additional bugs were implemented instead to solve them. FB is patched to death and botchy."

Dark_Knight_667
09-05-2003, 12:01 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=Olegmaddoxreadyroom&id=zussl
plz read the above thread

DK

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XyZspineZyX
09-05-2003, 12:16 PM
It's mostly very simple. If they don't fix their product, nobody will come back for more. Also, when you spend alot of time creating something, you want it to turn out to the liking of other people - that's called human pride. Those are the reasons why they still haven't told us to go lump it for being so tragically greivous and whiny.

IL-2: Forgotten Battles is by far the most entertaining computer game in the entire world. and if you don't like it, just don't play it. Let us others have some fun.

Now I'm off to do some barrel rolls in my P47.