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View Full Version : Came across something interesting in 'The Big Show'....



dazza9806482
09-07-2005, 02:45 AM
Totally enjoying Pierre's book, fantastic descriptions of action and seems that IL2 often can be related to what he describes in terms of damage to aircraft and deflection shooting etc.


intense and inexcusable waste of lives is what also comes across. truely terrible as so many of his friends die.

one thing came up that so far ive been unable to get any more info from google on.

Pierre at one point describes a shortage of new Tempests and parts, due to a strike at Hawker.

i was very surprised by this, i wasnt aware of much industrial action during the war.

anyone have any more info on this?

i found a couple of neo-communist sites but nothing specific to Hawker

ta

dazza9806482
09-07-2005, 02:45 AM
Totally enjoying Pierre's book, fantastic descriptions of action and seems that IL2 often can be related to what he describes in terms of damage to aircraft and deflection shooting etc.


intense and inexcusable waste of lives is what also comes across. truely terrible as so many of his friends die.

one thing came up that so far ive been unable to get any more info from google on.

Pierre at one point describes a shortage of new Tempests and parts, due to a strike at Hawker.

i was very surprised by this, i wasnt aware of much industrial action during the war.

anyone have any more info on this?

i found a couple of neo-communist sites but nothing specific to Hawker

ta

WTE_Ibis
09-07-2005, 04:01 AM
I believe it is true, have read it somewhere but can't remember where.

WOLFMondo
09-07-2005, 05:32 AM
I tried to look into this but theres very little on it.

Other than creating terrible moral problem with pilots you can probably guarentee that the owners of Hawker had connections in parliament or the house of Lords so it was probably brushed under the carpet to save embarrisment or problems within the RAF.

Try looking at the history of BAe (British Aerospace) as Hawker is essentially one of the main companies that started BAe, there might be some information there.

Low_Flyer_MkII
09-07-2005, 06:13 AM
http://www.unionhistory.info/timeline/1939_1945.php

Although strikes and lockouts were illegal during wartime, they were not unheard of.

FoolTrottel
09-07-2005, 07:29 AM
From the book 'Mosquito Typhoon Tempest At War' by Chaz Bowyer, Arthur Reed and Roland Beamont:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v668/fooltrottel/tempest.jpg

dazza9806482
09-07-2005, 08:11 AM
Thanks guys, in the book Pierre describes the strike as 'despicable'...

for some reason i had this idea of an unshakeble unity and everyone pulling together for victory...

in saying that im not against the idea of a strike without knowning the motivation behind it. thats why i was keen to find out more.

its an interesting subject, whether the extraordinary situation of war justifies any industrial action. Especially taking into account people risking their lives and left berefit of material or parts due to those at home.


Pierre's book presents an fascinating juxtaposition between his undoubted love of flying and moments of incredible beauty in the sky, combined with the horror of constant death and comrades lost.

best chapter so far was the brief section on Walter Nowotny. Pierre describes the feelings of affinity and respect pilots felt for each other and the sadness at Walter's death. Quite moving. And then u learn he was only 24.

unbelievable

anarchy52
09-07-2005, 08:31 AM
Fueltank in front of the cockpit. In case of fire it blow-torches the pilot. Not a good design feature.

dazza9806482
09-07-2005, 08:41 AM
Absolutely and Clostermann describes tempests going on fire a couple of times...

u get some idea of the size of the planes there too, all the tempest pilots seemed to fear any kind of forced landing- at 7 odd tons these could be pretty hairy

all this reading has made me even more desperate for the Tempest in IL2

Hoarmurath
09-07-2005, 09:06 AM
In 1940, while french combat units were desperately in need of equipment and replacement parts, many syndicalists were in fact stalling the production of military equipment, and sabotaging it on production lines. Because, in 1940, the soviet union wasn't at war with germany.

Yet in 1941, the same people entered french resistance and did fight bitterly to throw out the germans out of their country. Once the soviet union was at war with germany.

You could probably find many of these contradictions in the history of most of the countries that were involved in ww2.

Low_Flyer_MkII
09-07-2005, 09:24 AM
Don't forget that while there certainly was a 'wartime spirit' in Britain, a true willingness to accept hardship, 'get the job done' and build a better future; aircraft manufacturers were not charities, and factory workers (many of them women) were not treated (nor did they see themselves) as slave-labour (although a form of industrial conscription was in use). Remember that the U.K. population overwhelmingly voted Churchill out in 1945 being in no doubt about his suitability to oversee immediate post-war industrial relations and social welfare, based on his past (peacetime) record. He was jeered and even stoned during his election campaign.

Wonder if they ever went on strike at the Me262 factory?