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MB_Avro_UK
10-17-2008, 04:11 PM
Hi all,

Inspired by VF-17_Jolly's thread http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I would like to see a film about the first non-stop flight over the Atlantic Ocean.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vickers_Vimy

Allcock and Brown in 1919 flew a converted RAF WW1 Vickers Vimy from New Foundland to Ireland.

They suffered fatigue and icing etc. but made it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Lindbergh did the same about 10 years later solo but media wise has got the credit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Lindbergh


10 Years is a long time in aviation development!


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

MB_Avro_UK
10-17-2008, 04:11 PM
Hi all,

Inspired by VF-17_Jolly's thread http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I would like to see a film about the first non-stop flight over the Atlantic Ocean.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vickers_Vimy

Allcock and Brown in 1919 flew a converted RAF WW1 Vickers Vimy from New Foundland to Ireland.

They suffered fatigue and icing etc. but made it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Lindbergh did the same about 10 years later solo but media wise has got the credit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Lindbergh


10 Years is a long time in aviation development!


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

JSG72
10-17-2008, 04:57 PM
Mmmm?

I would like to see a Film about "The defense of the Reich" From the German perspective.

You know the one where. The frightened German pilots are up against the Hordes of Allied aircraft. Bombing their country to Oblivian.

What with Air enthusiasts penchant for Replicating the Steeds of that Era. It would be fascinating to bring them together to reproduce such a time.
I feel that it could be an informative and spectacular "Classic".

But not a "Box Office" hit. I fear.(Who could make such a Film?)
Indeed Films of the Pacific Airwar from the Japanese perspective of 1945. Are thin on the ground.
There are always films from a simpathetic "Allied" perspective. But never have we seen a True reflection. of War from the other side "Das Boot" Stalingrad" and "Come and see" Are considered good because they appeal to the "War is Hell" train of thought.(Of course it is!)
Stop making Propaganda films and start making "Real Life" scripts. That involve "Joe Bloggs" having to cope with the Effects of War the Decision makers have brought upon them.

Mr_Zooly
10-17-2008, 05:33 PM
A new BoB film with state of the art CGI would be a start, then a remake of the BoM using the same high detail CGI modelling.

Feathered_IV
10-17-2008, 05:58 PM
I'd like to see a film on Lilya Litvak. LowFlyer can do the casting. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://pratt.edu/~rsilva/images/litvyak.jpg
http://www.cbrnp.com/profiles/quarter2/yak-1/yak-1_yellow-44.jpg

steiner562
10-17-2008, 06:15 PM
Henderson Field

sw25th
10-17-2008, 06:17 PM
I would like to see a film that portrays the Germans in a better light, who are fighting the evils of communism, while The americans, and the British simply help to spread communism throughout eastern europe by not helping Germany.

VMF-214_HaVoK
10-17-2008, 06:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sw25th:
I would like to see a film that portrays the Germans in a better light, who are fighting the evils of communism, while The americans, and the British simply help to spread communism throughout eastern europe by not helping Germany. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Phas3e
10-17-2008, 07:46 PM
AS long as it doesn't have an overly sappy storyline and is kept fairly to the facts I'm keen for any aviation film.

I've allways liked the idea of a band of brothers type show, but each ep is a different air forces view of a day, any particular day.
Say the First ep is RAF Spitfires escorting B17s over France, the next ep is the B17 Crews POV of the day and then from the German interceptors.
Then over to the Pacific

BOA_Allmenroder
10-17-2008, 08:45 PM
Operation Tidal Wave: the first Ploesti Raid for my WW2 movie.

Also, I'd love to see a movie based upon the the Son Tay raid in Vietnam.

Buzzsaw-
10-17-2008, 10:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sw25th:
I would like to see a film that portrays the Germans in a better light, who are fighting the evils of communism, while The americans, and the British simply help to spread communism throughout eastern europe by not helping Germany. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah fighting the evils of communism by murdering 30 million civilians...


Maybe you should look at the evidence gathered by the Nuremberg tribunals before you start voicing such nonsense:


Buzzsaw: your text is clear enough. Heliopause.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/subject_menus/nca_vol1.asp

Buzzsaw-
10-17-2008, 10:43 PM
Salute

I think a film which deals with the Battle over Germany would be very interesting. Preferably from the perspective of fighter pilots of both sides.

R_Target
10-17-2008, 11:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MB_Avro_UK:

Lindbergh did the same about 10 years later solo but media wise has got the credit. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And rightfully so. Lindbergh handled double or triple the workload of the multi-crew attempts (such as the trans-Atlantic crossing by a USN crew a month before Alcock and Brown) that were common at the time. Lindbergh also flew twice the distance.

I_KG100_Prien
10-18-2008, 02:29 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JSG72:
Mmmm?

I would like to see a Film about "The defense of the Reich" From the German perspective.

You know the one where. The frightened German pilots are up against the Hordes of Allied aircraft. Bombing their country to Oblivian.

What with Air enthusiasts penchant for Replicating the Steeds of that Era. It would be fascinating to bring them together to reproduce such a time.
I feel that it could be an informative and spectacular "Classic".

But not a "Box Office" hit. I fear.(Who could make such a Film?)
Indeed Films of the Pacific Airwar from the Japanese perspective of 1945. Are thin on the ground.
There are always films from a simpathetic "Allied" perspective. But never have we seen a True reflection. of War from the other side "Das Boot" Stalingrad" and "Come and see" Are considered good because they appeal to the "War is Hell" train of thought.(Of course it is!)
Stop making Propaganda films and start making "Real Life" scripts. That involve "Joe Bloggs" having to cope with the Effects of War the Decision makers have brought upon them. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


This.

P.FunkAdelic
10-18-2008, 03:51 AM
I want the WW2 aviation version of Das Boot. Simple as that. No other requirements or qualifications than it needs to meet that standard of honest portrayal.

One other requirement I guess. No American actors! Real Germans please! Thats what made Das Boot so fantastic. It wasn't Matthew McConnohay in a friggin VII-C!

*chills out*

F19_Orheim
10-18-2008, 04:11 AM
IJN or IJA...

Why not about Saburu Sakai? He is pretty much a symbol and an icon for great pilots and did truly expericence a lot in both Southeast Asia
and the Pacific Theatre

How bout this? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.f19vs.se/temp/sakaithemovie.jpg

F19_Orheim
10-18-2008, 04:24 AM
I would actually prefer a miniseries la "Band of brothers" or the upcoming "Pacific".

Films are toooo short!!!

VF-17_Jolly
10-18-2008, 05:24 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by F19_Orheim:
I would actually prefer a miniseries la "Band of brothers" or the upcoming "Pacific".

Films are toooo short!!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif operation barbarosa from both sides or the Winter war?

Feathered_IV
10-18-2008, 05:30 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by F19_Orheim:
IJN or IJA...

Why not about Saburu Sakai? He is pretty much a symbol and an icon for great pilots and did truly expericence a lot in both Southeast Asia
and the Pacific Theatre

How bout this? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.f19vs.se/temp/sakaithemovie.jpg </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thats great! But who is C*nt Eastwood? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

leitmotiv
10-18-2008, 05:47 AM
There is a film about Sakai. Japanese. I rented it on videotape around 1987. Was pretty horrible as I recall.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0074370/

I second the nomination for an Operation Tidal Wave (Ploesti) film. The special effects fans would get their wiring short-circuited.

What I'd really like to see would be an epic film on the Battle of Jutland. With CGI, it could now be done.

DuxCorvan
10-18-2008, 06:23 AM
I'd like to watch an air war Spanish Civil War movie, with superior I-15s and I-16s facing competent Fiats till they have to cope with the arrival of technologically advanced Legion Kondor stuff.

Something about the Escuadrillas de Chatos of Captain Lacalle and others -including foreign volunteers- would be fine.

Feathered_IV
10-18-2008, 08:36 AM
The defence of Malta would make another good one.

Also, the fall of the Far East from an RAF perspective. Hmmm.. Maybe a movie about the Schneider Trophy races too. Or KG-200...

redhornet07
10-18-2008, 09:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">...I've allways liked the idea of a band of brothers type show, but each ep is a different air forces view of a day, any particular day.
Say the First ep is RAF Spitfires escorting B17s over France, the next ep is the B17 Crews POV of the day and then from the German interceptors.
Then over to the Pacific </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That, sir, is an excellent idea. Very original and would be extremely compelling. That has the most potential, in my opinion. Now, who here is a screen writer or knows one?

Buzzsaw-
10-18-2008, 01:40 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Heliopause:

Buzzsaw: your text is clear enough. Heliopause.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah great, we have censorship to eliminate anyone questioning those who think the Nazis were just good old boys fighting communism...

Where were you Heliopause when this moron sw25th came up with his little paen to Nazi heroism?

Why didn't you censor his comments then?

Seems its ok to post on these boards comments to the effect Adolf Hitler and his cronies were heroes just doing everyone a favour.

But of course, when someone provides a little contrasting factual reality, well, that has to be eliminated. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

All hail revisionism... If Truth isn't palatable, then censor it. Great job. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

A lot of WWII veterans I know would be ashamed.

joeap
10-18-2008, 02:00 PM
+1 to Buzzsaw.

As for the other suggestions, some very good ones indeed. Spanish Civil War, Lilya Litvak or Ploesti as well.

Interesting last night, Thunderball was on TV, James Bond (Sean Connery version best one with Daniel Craig second) has to recover nukes stolen from a hijacked Vulcan ... well I was tickled to see Bond and his at-that-moment girl get rescued by a Coast Guard rescue version of the B-17... Lifeboat (http://www.uscg.mil/history/articles/B-17Lifeboat.asp)

http://uscgaviationhistory.aoptero.org/images/history02/b17_coastguard_sized.jpg

Mr_Zooly
10-18-2008, 02:00 PM
I heard that history was written by the victor, that could also be regarded as revisionism and is that good, bad or indifferent?
I might add though that all countries had heroes and villains, war can 'muddy the waters' as the saying goes and we have to be thankful that we played no part and didnt have any of the morally vague decisions to make.

MB_Avro_UK
10-18-2008, 02:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DuxCorvan:
I'd like to watch an air war Spanish Civil War movie, with superior I-15s and I-16s facing competent Fiats till they have to cope with the arrival of technologically advanced Legion Kondor stuff.

Something about the Escuadrillas de Chatos of Captain Lacalle and others -including foreign volunteers- would be fine. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good call http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Both Russia and Germany gained aviation combat experience in the Spanish Civil War.

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

joeap
10-18-2008, 02:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mr_Zooly:
I heard that history was written by the victor. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Another cliche that should go into the trash heap. History is written by everyone..."properly" by trained, objective (but biased though hopefully aware of it) academics or thorough researchers, "winners" or losers (hence our "revisionist" friend) or in between. Facts are facts, it's what facts you select and how you interpret them that makes the difference.

Factoid, only 4% of deaths in WWII were civilians from Axis countries.

Mr_Zooly
10-18-2008, 02:13 PM
To say '<span class="ev_code_RED">I heard</span>' doesnt mean that I agree with the statement.
I do though believe that 'if you dont learn from history then we are doomed to repeat it'

MB_Avro_UK
10-18-2008, 02:21 PM
Hi all,

I'd like to see a film about the early years of aviation. Has anything ever been made about the Wright brothers? Not just the first flight in 1903 but also the work done in the years following?

Also, Frenchman Bleriot's first crossing of the English Channel in 1909 caused a big upset in Britain. For once Britain was no longer an island! A foretaste of things to come....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Bl%C3%A9riot


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

P.FunkAdelic
10-19-2008, 03:48 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by joeap:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mr_Zooly:
I heard that history was written by the victor. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Another cliche that should go into the trash heap. History is written by everyone..."properly" by trained, objective (but biased though hopefully aware of it) academics or thorough researchers, "winners" or losers (hence our "revisionist" friend) or in between. Facts are facts, it's what facts you select and how you interpret them that makes the difference.

Factoid, only 4% of deaths in WWII were civilians from Axis countries. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thats awfully naive.

There is no truth, there are no facts. Its all perceived. None of us were there when it happened and the vast majority of us have never even seen any of the substantiating proof. What we know was told to us. We read a book, see someone said they saw something. We trust it or we don't. We have the weight of conformism on our shoulders to agree with the mainstream side. The victors might not be the only ones to write history but they definitely have the power to publish it more.

I don't want to get into a big thing about human behavior and how we love to become sheep in a herd, but saying that winning has nothing to do with how we perceive history is absolute tosh. Most people don't exercise the necessary critical thinking skills to differentiate between when they're hearing truth and when they're being sold a lie. They just trust the stuff that comes from their side. Thats why conservatives fear the left and claim things about Marx even though they've never read Das kapital and lefties all think that pulling out immediately from any conflict and disarming is sensible, as if having no military will end wars. They have a side, they side with it without thinking. The victors are the righteous ones, and they get to convince the next generation of little kids who was right last time civilization had a sparring match. The establishment of the victors gets to vet the truth that flows through our culture.

There are many takes on history and many books frame event differently. I know that if I learn of something from one book and read another immediately the first book sits atop a throne as if its the right account and the new material has to challenge it, though it may be the truer account.

I know a few Americans that said they were given the impression from their high school history classes that America won the war of 1812. As a Canadian... well lets just say we have a wonderful song that celebrates us burning down the White House... but it wasn't white then it was brown and it was British soldiers over here fighting that did it. But I also know America didnt win that war.

History is written by the victors. They have far too much vested in it to let it be told against their benefit or exaggerated sense of righteousness. Plenty of allied behavior is controversial though we are always given that feeling that we were the victims who were fighting for survival. The Blitz is seen as cowardly but we don`t often hear much disdain for how the allies firebombed dresden, inflicting much worse damage than the Blitz.

Its all a measure of degrees. Truth is irrelevant. Motive is more the important thing we should be looking at. Thats when you can filter the facts and most people don`t want that chore. Therefore they just believe the party line. No doubt the Great Patriotic war goes down much differently as told in say 60s Russia than it did in 60s America, but certainly 60s Germany didn`t get much of a say about how it was told. They were still occupied.

Sharpe26
10-19-2008, 05:59 AM
what about a remake of the 1969 Battle of Britain movie?

and secondly as far as the Luftwaffe fighters go, what about something that deals with JG26 and the 56th FG?

and maybe, just maybe, the raid that brought the Mustang to Europe, Schweinfurt.

joeap
10-19-2008, 06:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by P.FunkAdelic:

Thats awfully naive.

There is no truth, there are no facts. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Uh huh, so the USS Arizona was not sunk at Pearl Harbor? It's still there, want to check?

They say two nuclear bombs were used at Hiroshima and Nagasaki...never been to Asia let alone Japan or those two cities. Never been there, read accounts of those who were there. Yet I seem to think being anywhere a nuke explosion would be a bad idea. Strange huh?

Just what is "fact" and what not? The number of battleships sunk during the war? Number of planes lost? Number of people killed? I grant in each case it becomes more difficult to establish numbers but in principle a finite number exists in each case.

So, I hate to bring this up but it's a solid example, you do not think holocaust negationists should not be challenged for what they say? You don't think there is a proper way to go about history and historical research (how did they find out the White House was in fact Brown?) and a poor way?

Darth_Reagan
10-19-2008, 06:51 AM
The Falklands war, as seen from both sides perspective. These were highly trained pilots on both sides unexpectedly fighting each other without the usual backdrop of a huge conflict. It must have seemed odd to pilots on both sides to suddenly be fighting it out for real. The war is short enough to take a personal view of the whole conflict.

M_Gunz
10-19-2008, 07:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by joeap:
Factoid, only 4% of deaths in WWII were civilians from Axis countries. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Does that include those rounded up and exterminated by the Axis country they lived in?
Or did those all get killed before the war so they had to send out for more?

GBrutus
10-19-2008, 08:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
The defence of Malta would make another good one.

Also, the fall of the Far East from an RAF perspective. Hmmm.. Maybe a movie about the Schneider Trophy races too. Or KG-200... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

+1 for the defence of Malta, there certainly wouldn't be any shortage of action. The Schneider Trophy races would also make a great film.

I'd like to see a remake of 'The Flying Tigers' too.

R_Target
10-19-2008, 08:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by P.FunkAdelic:
I know a few Americans that said they were given the impression from their high school history classes that America won the war of 1812. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was taught that it ended in stalemate.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">As a Canadian... well lets just say we have a wonderful song that celebrates us burning down the White House. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Would you mind sharing the lyrics?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">.. but it wasn't white then it was brown </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, it was white, then it was burned black, then it was reconstructed and painted white again.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> and it was British soldiers over here fighting that did it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Which Canadian units sailed from Europe with General Ross?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But I also know America didn't win that war. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agreed. Nobody did.

joeap
10-19-2008, 01:50 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by joeap:
Factoid, only 4% of deaths in WWII were civilians from Axis countries. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Does that include those rounded up and exterminated by the Axis country they lived in?
Or did those all get killed before the war so they had to send out for more? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, it means what it says. At least it puts everything in one sack. Anyway it's probably not that big compared to the others actually, given the burden country by country was so disproportionate. Just a quick example very few Jews in Germany before the war afaik.

We ought to discuss this elsewhere anyway.

What about a film on the WAAFs or WAACS?

waffen-79
10-19-2008, 02:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Phas3e:
AS long as it doesn't have an overly sappy storyline and is kept fairly to the facts I'm keen for any aviation film.

I've allways liked the idea of a band of brothers type show, but each ep is a different air forces view of a day, any particular day.
Say the First ep is RAF Spitfires escorting B17s over France, the next ep is the B17 Crews POV of the day and then from the German interceptors.
Then over to the Pacific </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

EPIC WIN

MB_Avro_UK
10-19-2008, 02:09 PM
Maybe Spielberg is following this thread in search of inspiration http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

DuxCorvan
10-19-2008, 02:43 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MB_Avro_UK:
Maybe Spielberg is following this thread in search of inspiration http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh yes, sure. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Fenice_1965
10-19-2008, 04:11 PM
I heard George Lucas is going to make a movie about "RED TAILS". I'm not jockin'. Think it will be great with Industrial light and magic effects...

WTE_Galway
10-19-2008, 05:08 PM
A movie that really should be made, but clearly is not modern Hollywood material, is the story of the very young and previously handsome pilots from the BoB that went through years of experimental facial reconstruction with New Zealand plastic surgeon Archibald McIndoe to replace the noses ears, eyelids and large chunks of faces that had been burnt off when they were shot down.

ploughman
10-19-2008, 05:23 PM
Rotary wing aviation in the current Afghan war.

Buzzsaw-
10-19-2008, 10:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by P.FunkAdelic:
There is no truth, there are no facts. Its all perceived. None of us were there when it happened and the vast majority of us have never even seen any of the substantiating proof. What we know was told to us. We read a book, see someone said they saw something. We trust it or we don't. We have the weight of conformism on our shoulders to agree with the mainstream side. The victors might not be the only ones to write history but they definitely have the power to publish it more.

I don't want to get into a big thing about human behavior and how we love to become sheep in a herd, but saying that winning has nothing to do with how we perceive history is absolute tosh. Most people don't exercise the necessary critical thinking skills to differentiate between when they're hearing truth and when they're being sold a lie. They just trust the stuff that comes from their side. Thats why conservatives fear the left and claim things about Marx even though they've never read Das kapital and lefties all think that pulling out immediately from any conflict and disarming is sensible, as if having no military will end wars. They have a side, they side with it without thinking. The victors are the righteous ones, and they get to convince the next generation of little kids who was right last time civilization had a sparring match. The establishment of the victors gets to vet the truth that flows through our culture.

There are many takes on history and many books frame event differently. I know that if I learn of something from one book and read another immediately the first book sits atop a throne as if its the right account and the new material has to challenge it, though it may be the truer account.

I know a few Americans that said they were given the impression from their high school history classes that America won the war of 1812. As a Canadian... well lets just say we have a wonderful song that celebrates us burning down the White House... but it wasn't white then it was brown and it was British soldiers over here fighting that did it. But I also know America didnt win that war.

History is written by the victors. They have far too much vested in it to let it be told against their benefit or exaggerated sense of righteousness. Plenty of allied behavior is controversial though we are always given that feeling that we were the victims who were fighting for survival. The Blitz is seen as cowardly but we don`t often hear much disdain for how the allies firebombed dresden, inflicting much worse damage than the Blitz.

Its all a measure of degrees. Truth is irrelevant. Motive is more the important thing we should be looking at. Thats when you can filter the facts and most people don`t want that chore. Therefore they just believe the party line. No doubt the Great Patriotic war goes down much differently as told in say 60s Russia than it did in 60s America, but certainly 60s Germany didn`t get much of a say about how it was told. They were still occupied. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You make me ashamed to be a Canadian.

There are plenty of heroes, who died so that people like you could prattle on about ambiguities. Its a good thing for us that you weren't the one we had to depend on instead of them.

You'd be the first one to go into the gas chambers if Hitler was running the world, he and his ilk had no time for any questioning.

You whine about the "Party Line"? Try the Nazi Party line. You have NO idea. Compulsion at the point of a gun is a very different thing from the prevailing democratic consensus.

You are welcome to your little imaginings, but if you really want to get close to the truth, then do some reading of authors who spend years and years researching primary documents, and interviewing people who were there.

If you want to keep on in your fantasy, then don't bother with the hard work education takes.

And by the way: "The Destruction of Dresden" by David Irving, is the work of a convicted liar and Neo Nazi propagandist. So if you are relying on that for your ideas, don't.

I have already been edited on this board for speaking the truth, it seems some moderators prefer to let comments of those who advocate the policies of Adolf Hitler stand, while censoring those who try to present the factual truth.

P.FunkAdelic
10-19-2008, 10:22 PM
Fantastic follow up Buzzsaw. Using the dead as an argument for your point is a low shortcut. Same for attacking my character by assuming I would be some chickensh1t coward in the event of a major war that our nation depended on. And once again drawing in the Nazi argument....

If you revere talented and committed authors of history so much you don't show it by using arguments that are far below the calibre of such accomplishment. The gas chamber? You aren't making points, you're just using character attacks. You may be an intellectual but you don't meet disagreement head on like one.

Don't bring Hitler into the mix so easily. Its pathetic and overdone. Its a lack of imagination to fall back on Hitler as some kind of uni-purpose boogie man to reinforce your point, or lack thereof. Hitler was far too evil to be worn out in pointless and endless online bickering. Its an insult to people's sacrifice if you merely use it to shut people up online. Hide behind your own points or even better actually quote me an author. Your tactics of disagreement are not academic so far.

Save your pejoratives and craft a real argument.

P.FunkAdelic
10-19-2008, 10:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by joeap:
So, I hate to bring this up but it's a solid example, you do not think holocaust negationists should not be challenged for what they say? You don't think there is a proper way to go about history and historical research (how did they find out the White House was in fact Brown?) and a poor way? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I don't want to make this into a hostile argument. Far from it. The internet however makes everything seem as hostile as our own imaginations might want it to, because if we feel criticized we immediately throw up a shield of defense where suddenly if he yells at me he looks like a fool. Don't think I'm trying to be a loudmouth.

With that said, I want to talk about your points. I said right away in my post that I don't believe in rehabilitating the image of Hitler. Quite the opposite. No we should not outright defend those that argue against the Holocaust. Should we listen to them and then strike down their arguments one by one? Absolutely, if we can. But thats not the real point.

I am trying to make the point that what we call fact and truth is so negotiable that nothing is absolutely certain. The foundation of science is on theories, not truth or fact. Everything we 'know' about the universe is only confirmed by a failure to disprove a theory. Often basic understandings go agreed on for centuries til someone finds a way to show its incorrect. Scientific fact is really just a so far an un-disproven thesis.

Truth is an abstraction, just like time. We perceive it. So to say that victors have no sway over the perception of history is naive. Everything is perception. Watch an election, hear the locals make fools of themselves repeating the lies of one candidate or another.

As for a proper way to record history, there surely is. But even the founder of accurate history recording, Thucydides, could not ignore the perceptions of the Greeks about their history as it was. The way they perceived the Trojan war as told by Homer defined who they were to an extent. Even Thucydides assumed it was true, as if it were true history.

All this is really about is the assumption that history is unbiased, throwing out that old saying about the victors. I doubt we even disagree about most things. This was meant more as a tangent about metaphysics and abstract ideas. Not a challenge to the holocaust.

Buzzsaw-
10-19-2008, 11:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by P.FunkAdelic:
Truth is an abstraction, just like time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

OFFICIAL RELEASE:

I.D. # J-93970 PILOT OFFICER IRVINE CLIFFORD BRADLEY, RCAF.
P.O. BRADLEY OF 464 SQUADRON, WAS THE PILOT OF MOSQUITO NT231 WHICH TOOK OFF ON JANUARY 1ST 1945, TO CARRY OUT A NIGHT INTRUDER OPERATION OVER NORTH LUXEMBOURG. THE AIRCRAFT FAILED TO RETURN.
P.O. BRADLEY AND HIS RAF NAVIGATOR WERE PRESUMED KILLED DURING AIR OPERATIONS. THE TWO BODIES AND THE PLANE WERE FOUND LATER NEAR 'SIX PLANES' NORTH LUXEMBOURG.
P.O. BRADLEY HAD VOLUNTEERED FOR HIS 2ND TOUR ON MULTI-ENGINED AIRCRAFT.

22 years.

http://www.inmemories.com/Cemeteries/Heverlee3.jpg

Swivet
10-20-2008, 12:10 AM
Hmm..i guess i'd like to see something like Letters from Iwojima, but from a pilots point of view. Or Pearl Harbor without Ben Aflook and that sappy romance and CGI

WTE_Galway
10-20-2008, 12:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Swivet:
Or Pearl Harbor without Ben Aflook and that sappy romance and CGI </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

.... and without the idiotic anachronisms like an electric start crop duster biplane in 1929 or Pearl and BoB taking place at more or less the same time.

The only thing surprising about Pearl Harbor is they didn't somehow get the same guy to fly in BoB, defend Pearl Harbor, fly the the Doolittle Raid (somehow moving from fighters to multies) and then also fly the Enola Gay and drop the bomb after some unspecified technical glitch where the bomb threatened to explode early and destroy the Pacific Fleet.

joeap
10-20-2008, 11:22 AM
Hmmm good point P.Funk. I still think a bit too much is made of "winners write the history" (Japanese nationalists being one example, but that's because they got on the winner's side [US] against the winner's old allies [Newly Red china and the USSR]) but yea I see what you mean.

Now I do think there are types of "history" that can't be categorised as winners vs. losers as in social and cultural history, at least not as "clear" as military and political.

Didn't mean to come across aggressive, sorry if it seemed that way.

F19_Orheim
10-20-2008, 03:00 PM
whatever happened to the actual topic`?

MB_Avro_UK
10-20-2008, 03:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by F19_Orheim:
whatever happened to the actual topic`? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


I agree.

Guys,please let's get back on topic http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

There is sooo much to contemplate.

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Low_Flyer_MkIX
10-21-2008, 02:20 AM
Well, as long as most of the film is taken up with the lead pilot romancing a nurse, I'll be happy. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

mayestdo
10-21-2008, 05:26 AM
Some time ago I heard of a project based upon Alex Kershaw's "The Few" (about the story of the first american pilots who fought in the BOB), and the actor chosen to play the main role was Tom Cruise. Yet, I haven't heard anything else since then (it was a year ago, more or less)

joeap
10-21-2008, 06:18 AM
That went to the trash I hope. We don't need "Top Guns-the few, the shirtless, the well oiled" *insert vomit smiley here*

Mysticpuma2003
10-21-2008, 06:27 AM
I'd like to see the following:

A film about the 325th Fighter Group.....oh, it's okay I'm doing that one:

Seriously I'd like to see a similar series to Band of Brothers about either "The Black Sheep" and Pappy Boyington.

Or a Band of Brothers style series following the Tuskagee Airmen. There is so much history in both of these groups that one film cannot capture it all, so a mini-series would be brilliant.

Finally as another Band of Brothers style series, I think the part played by the Luftwaffe pilots on the Russian front would be a fascinating story to follow, with the likes of Galland and Heinz Bar, there would be so much reference material.

Anyway, that's my input.

Cheers, MP.

zardozid
10-21-2008, 10:56 AM
A good Russian front movie would be nice...maybe something involving Stalingrad. A sweeping epic encompassing the time of Operation Blau, the air lift and the surrender of Paulus. A movie with a "das Boot" feel...gritty & realistic.

Another nice idea would be the air battle of "Khalkhin Gol"...epic sized air battles that bridged the old world of "dogfighting" and the realities of modern technologies. Their where lots of "real life" stories of "comicbook style" acts of heroics...like pilots landing at enemy airstrips and sabotaging machines or fighter pilots that land behind enemy lines to pick up downed buddy's. Thousands of deaths that resulted in no change of the border. Japan "won" most of the airbattles but still "lost" the conflict...just think of the frustration & sadness the pilots must have felt, good drama.

The "Spanish Civil War" could make a good movie but it would be complicated...it would have to be one of those movies with 3 or 4 parallel stories that come together at the end. In order to really capture the flavor of the conflict you would have to have a Republican family, fascist soldiers, the German Condor legion and some "foreign volunteers" from the UK, USA or someplace... If done properly it could be grand...Guillermo del Toro anyone?

I like the idea of a Pappy Boyington (Black Sheep) or a "P-47's over the Gustav line" type of HBO series...

OR I would really like to see an HBO a'la "Band of Brothers" type mini-series about "F-86 Sabre's & Mig 15's" over Korea... A good "Mig Alley" series...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8d/F-86s-Korea.JPG

MB_Avro_UK
10-21-2008, 01:57 PM
Hi all,

There is a huge amount of potential material out there.

Civil Airline flight has produced amazing drama.

IIRC it was about 1990 when a US Airline crew struggled against the odds to land their aircraft with total hydraulic failure. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif


The event was perhaps 40 minutes long and would translate well to film.

Spielberg, are you still listening to us?


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Bo_Nidle
10-21-2008, 02:34 PM
MB: I think you are talking about the United Airlines flight 232 from Denver to Chicago. It eventually crashed at Sioux City airport in Iowa, but most of the passengers got out. It was made into a film called "A Thousand Heroes" (a.k.a: "Crash Landing: The Rescue of Flight 232") and starred Charlton Heston
( http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0104020/ ) as I recall for a TV movie on a limited budget it wasn't too bad.

I always wanted to see "Yeager" made into a film. ( http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif I had heard that Hal Needham, he directed "Smokey and the bandit" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif , had acquired the rights not long after it was published!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif Thank the Lord he hasn't tried to make it!!!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif) a great book about one of the legends of aviation.
http://www.sci.fi/~fta/Yager_book.jpg

The book "The shadows of war" by Thomas Childers would make an excellent film. It tells the real life saga of B-17 pilot Roy Allen. Shot down over occupied France. Befriended by the French Resistance, betrayed to the Nazis, Roy becomes one of one-hundred and sixty-eight Allied airmen who are imprisoned at Buchenwald Concentration Camp. It was made into a drama-documentary called "Shot from the sky" and shown on the History Channel which was pretty good but it would make an excellent Hollywood blockbuster.

And WTH happened to the Dambusters remake? I was looking forwards to that! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

rsalopek
10-21-2008, 03:33 PM
Keeping any kind of romance out of aviation movies would be tough. Das Boot worked because it's hard to have a heavy romantic plot tale when your out to sea for 30+ days lol. My choice would be a movie about Saburu Sakai. The book was an excellent read, I remember when I first read it (yes I have read that book several times IT'S THAT GOOD). A movie about Sakai would cover just about the whole Pacific war and has just the right amount of romantic storyline (it doesn't take over the movie). Another interesting aspect of making a movie about Sakai it would draw into contrast how much better off German pilots fared after the war compared to Japanese counterparts.

R_Target
10-21-2008, 04:05 PM
For sure Sakai would be excellent subject matter, but I would hate to see it drawn from BS-laden Martin Caidin book.

rsalopek
10-22-2008, 09:02 AM
Really? I thought "SAMURAI!" was a very good read..what is BS laden about it? Not being a smart arse here just want to know why you made that statement as I always assumed the book was based on fact, if it isn't I sure would like to know.

CUJO_1970
10-22-2008, 08:57 PM
Someone needs to do a serious movie about Erich Hartmann. What an amazing life.

http://mccoy.mine.nu/109/gwp-109g-hartmann-300kill.jpg

R_Target
10-22-2008, 09:14 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rsalopek:
Really? I thought "SAMURAI!" was a very good read..what is BS laden about it? Not being a smart arse here just want to know why you made that statement as I always assumed the book was based on fact, if it isn't I sure would like to know. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is a good read, but it has numerous errors. Although Sakai is credited as the author, it's entirely ghost-written by Caidin from interviews that Fred Saito conducted with Saburo. Caidin never even paid Sakai. For an accurate account, try Henry Sakaida's Winged Samurai: Saburo Sakai and the Zero Fighter Pilots.

jarink
10-22-2008, 09:39 PM
I'd like to see a movie about Jay Zeamer, Joseph Sarnoski and the rest of the crew of merry misfits in their rescued-from-the-scrapheap B-17 flying their June 16th, 1943 mission to photograph airfields around Buka.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">From Wikipedia:
On 16 June 1943, volunteered to fly an unescorted B-17 nicknamed Old 666 to Buka, a small island off the north coast of Bougainville, a 1200-mile round-trip mission, to photograph Japanese installations and map the west coast of Bougainville as far south as Empress Augusta Bay in preparation for Allied landings scheduled for early November. Apparently unbeknownst to Allied intelligence, the Japanese had moved about 400 fighters into the Solomon Islands on 15 June. The mission was Zeamer's 47th in combat.

The photo reconnaissance mission was without incident, although Zeamer's crew reported observing 20 fighters taking off from Buka airfield. Zeamer continued south to the mapping run and shortly before its completion, his B-17 was intercepted by five Japanese fighters attacking from the front. Though wounded in the attack, bombardier 2nd Lt. Joseph Sarnoski continued to fire his nose gun, shooting down two airplanes, including a Mitsubishi Ki-46 "Dinah" reconnaissance plane. Zeamer also destroyed one of the attackers using a nose gun fired remotely by a switch on the flight control column. A 20-millimeter cannon shell exploded in the nose of the B-17, severely wounding Sarnoski and knocking him out of the compartment. Sarnoski dragged himself back to his station and continued to fire until he died at his position.

The B-17's oxygen and hydraulic systems were destroyed, as were the pilot's flight instruments, in the initial attack. Zeamer, injured with a broken leg and numerous fragment wounds, dove the bomber steeply from its assigned mission altitude of 25,000 feet to approximately 10,000 feet (where the crew could survive without use of the oxygen system), estimating the altitude by an increase in engine manifold pressure. An estimated 17 fighters began a series of attacks after the bomber leveled off, waging a 45-minute battle until low on fuel. Zeamer saved the B-17 by taking evasive action to disrupt their deflection, and the crew of the B-17 shot down at least two additional fighters.

Zeamer refused first aid for his wounds and flew the B-17 until the fighters broke off the engagement. Lapsing in and out of consciousness, he assessed the battle damage to the bomber, and concluded they would be unable to climb over the Owen Stanley Mountains, instructing the copilot, who was unwounded, to make an emergency landing at an Allied fighter airstrip at Dobodura, New Guinea. Without operable brakes or flaps because of the destroyed hydraulic system, the B-17 was ground-looped by the co-pilot. The casualties were one killed (Sarnoski) and six wounded.

At first thought dead from a massive loss of blood, Zeamer survived the ordeal, although nearly losing his leg during recovery. Colonel Merian C. Cooper, chief of staff to the deputy commander of the Fifth Air Force, Major General Ennis Whitehead, recommended Zeamer be awarded the Medal of Honor, to which Fifth Air Force commander General George Kenney concurred. He received the award from Chief of the Army Air Forces General Henry H. Arnold on 16 January 1944, at the Pentagon.

Sarnoski was also awarded the Medal of Honor, <span class="ev_code_yellow">the only instance of World War II when two members of one crew were honored for separate acts of heroism in the same combat engagement</span>. All other members of Zeamer's crew received the Distinguished Service Cross. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Many of you may have seen this mission on the TV show "Dogfights", but there's actually much more to the story. Accoring to the book "Flying Forts: The B-17 in WWII", Zeamer was originally a B-26 copilot and was considered by many to be something of a dud. He transferred (not necessarily by his choice) to the 43rd BG and was stuck in the rear echelon in Australia for a time. While there, he appropriated a B-17 that had been written off in a landing accident and managed to talk the mechanics into repairing it to the point where it was again airworthy. He then collected a group of other castoffs into a combat crew (much like Pappy Boyington did with VMF-214) and volunteered for any crazy mission that came down the pike.

No love story, but I'm sure Hollywood would throw something in there like him doing it all for an old girlfriend or some other nonsense. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

AWL_Spinner
10-22-2008, 09:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">..I've allways liked the idea of a band of brothers type show, but each ep is a different air forces view of a day, any particular day. Say the First ep is RAF Spitfires escorting B17s over France, the next ep is the B17 Crews POV of the day and then from the German interceptors.
Then over to the Pacific..... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is an outstanding idea.

Pleases everyone, for a start, central theme being AVIATORS not SIDES.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

rsalopek
10-22-2008, 10:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by R_Target:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rsalopek:
Really? I thought "SAMURAI!" was a very good read..what is BS laden about it? Not being a smart arse here just want to know why you made that statement as I always assumed the book was based on fact, if it isn't I sure would like to know. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is a good read, but it has numerous errors. Although Sakai is credited as the author, it's entirely ghost-written by Caidin from interviews that Fred Saito conducted with Saburo. Caidin never even paid Sakai. For an accurate account, try Henry Sakaida's Winged Samurai: Saburo Sakai and the Zero Fighter Pilots. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
\
Thanks R_Target I will check out that book you recommended.

rsalopek
10-22-2008, 10:41 PM
I don't know how a Band of Brothers theme would work in a movie, maybe an HBO mini series, but not in a regular movie. Figure a regular movie runs between 90-120 mins. That wouldn't give you much time to cover all sides. It would just start getting interesting and you would have to cut away.

zardozid
10-23-2008, 02:05 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rsalopek:
I don't know how a Band of Brothers theme would work in a movie, maybe an HBO mini series, but not in a regular movie. Figure a regular movie runs between 90-120 mins. That wouldn't give you much time to cover all sides. It would just start getting interesting and you would have to cut away. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


I could be wrong but when people say "a BoB type of thing", I think that they have the HBO mini-series format in mind...at least I did. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Esel1964
10-23-2008, 03:00 AM
--- DAMBUSTERS--- http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
And I agree with CUJO_1970!!

rsalopek
10-23-2008, 05:41 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zardozid:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rsalopek:
I don't know how a Band of Brothers theme would work in a movie, maybe an HBO mini series, but not in a regular movie. Figure a regular movie runs between 90-120 mins. That wouldn't give you much time to cover all sides. It would just start getting interesting and you would have to cut away. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


I could be wrong but when people say "a BoB type of thing", I think that they have the HBO mini-series format in mind...at least I did. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

True, but the thread title is about a new film and when I see that I tend to think a regular movie not a mini-series http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif. Besides I don't have HBO http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif But honestly the BoB type story telling would be hard to pull off trying to cover all sides of the conflict. It would end up being like 30 parts or more to get the rich in-depth charater development like BoB did (or "Das Boot" the mini series). You would have to still pick one side, one squadron. Don't forget the purpose of making movies first and foremost is to make a buck.

HotelBushranger
10-23-2008, 06:14 AM
Wouldn't mind seeing a movie about Clive Caldwell, Australia's top fighter pilot. There would be little need to dramatisation as his life was quite amazing anyway.

b2spirita
10-23-2008, 06:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Esel1964:
--- DAMBUSTERS--- http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
And I agree with CUJO_1970!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Its coming, its coming, be patient.

OT: Bushranger have you heard of the govt grant of $1000

Mr_Zooly
10-23-2008, 04:00 PM
Mr Jackson of LoTR fame is doing the new DB movie apparently.