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robban75
09-26-2004, 11:42 AM
(Yes I have tracks.)

Ok, here's a simple zoomclimb test. Pull up speed 500km/h TAS, starting alt ~3-4m, climbangle 30 degrees.

Planes in the following order,,

D-9 - La-7 - IXc - Yak-3 - A-4 - La-5FN


500km/h -- 3 --- 3 --- 4 ---- 3 --- 4 --- 3

450km/h - 248 - 263 - 209 - 223 - 195 - 246

400km/h - 490 - 512 - 421 - 436 - 401 - 480

350km/h - 744 - 780 - 648 - 663 - 606 - 726

300km/h - 1035-1088-909 - 911 - 816 - 1020

280km/h - 1171-1226-1018-1021-907 - 1153

I know 500km/h is perhaps somewhat slow for a zoomclimb, but it gives a pretty good idea anyways as to why certain fighters climb right up ones tail during dogfights. It looks like the zoomclimb ends at around 300-350km/h.

Notice how the La-7 excells in the zoomclimb, also notice how the Spitfire MkIXc outzooms the Fw 190A-4.



Below is a diveacceleration test,(can't have enough of those now can we). The procedure is simple, starting at 5000m, pushing the nose forward while giving maximum power with boost, dive angle 40 degrees. Each plane was tested 3 times, and the best numbers are shown below.

Planes are in the following order.

Bf 109G-6(late), P-47D-27, Fw 190A-4, Fw 190D-9, P-51D, Yak-3, La-7, Spit MkIXc.

Type - 109 - P47 - 190 - 190 - P51 - Yak - La7 - IXc

5000 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310
4500 - 488 - 488 - 487 - 493 - 480 - 481 - 495 - 486
4000 - 612 - 613 - 610 - 623 - 610 - 613 - 619 - 613
3500 - 699 - 707 - 701 - 718 - 710 - 708 - 710 - 706
3000 - 766 - 779 - 770 - 792 - 787 - 780 - 780 - 774
2500 - 818 - 837 - 827 - 854 - 851 - 838 - 841 - 828
2000 - 857 - 884 - 871 - 906 - 902 - 885 - 890 - 869
1500 - 887 - 922 - 907 - 948 - 946 - 925 - N/A - 901
1000 - 910 - 953 - 935 - 983 - 981 - 951 - N/A - 926
500 - 927 - 978 - 958 - 1010 - 1012 - N/A - N/A - 936

Notice how the P-51 closes in on the Fw 190D-9 at the higher speeds. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Also notice the superiority of the La-7 in terms of dive acceleration.

This plane actually outturns, outclimbs, outdives, outzooms, outaccelerates, and outspeeds most, if not all fighters in the game at some point. What a machine. Did it have any flaws?

robban75
09-26-2004, 11:42 AM
(Yes I have tracks.)

Ok, here's a simple zoomclimb test. Pull up speed 500km/h TAS, starting alt ~3-4m, climbangle 30 degrees.

Planes in the following order,,

D-9 - La-7 - IXc - Yak-3 - A-4 - La-5FN


500km/h -- 3 --- 3 --- 4 ---- 3 --- 4 --- 3

450km/h - 248 - 263 - 209 - 223 - 195 - 246

400km/h - 490 - 512 - 421 - 436 - 401 - 480

350km/h - 744 - 780 - 648 - 663 - 606 - 726

300km/h - 1035-1088-909 - 911 - 816 - 1020

280km/h - 1171-1226-1018-1021-907 - 1153

I know 500km/h is perhaps somewhat slow for a zoomclimb, but it gives a pretty good idea anyways as to why certain fighters climb right up ones tail during dogfights. It looks like the zoomclimb ends at around 300-350km/h.

Notice how the La-7 excells in the zoomclimb, also notice how the Spitfire MkIXc outzooms the Fw 190A-4.



Below is a diveacceleration test,(can't have enough of those now can we). The procedure is simple, starting at 5000m, pushing the nose forward while giving maximum power with boost, dive angle 40 degrees. Each plane was tested 3 times, and the best numbers are shown below.

Planes are in the following order.

Bf 109G-6(late), P-47D-27, Fw 190A-4, Fw 190D-9, P-51D, Yak-3, La-7, Spit MkIXc.

Type - 109 - P47 - 190 - 190 - P51 - Yak - La7 - IXc

5000 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310 - 310
4500 - 488 - 488 - 487 - 493 - 480 - 481 - 495 - 486
4000 - 612 - 613 - 610 - 623 - 610 - 613 - 619 - 613
3500 - 699 - 707 - 701 - 718 - 710 - 708 - 710 - 706
3000 - 766 - 779 - 770 - 792 - 787 - 780 - 780 - 774
2500 - 818 - 837 - 827 - 854 - 851 - 838 - 841 - 828
2000 - 857 - 884 - 871 - 906 - 902 - 885 - 890 - 869
1500 - 887 - 922 - 907 - 948 - 946 - 925 - N/A - 901
1000 - 910 - 953 - 935 - 983 - 981 - 951 - N/A - 926
500 - 927 - 978 - 958 - 1010 - 1012 - N/A - N/A - 936

Notice how the P-51 closes in on the Fw 190D-9 at the higher speeds. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Also notice the superiority of the La-7 in terms of dive acceleration.

This plane actually outturns, outclimbs, outdives, outzooms, outaccelerates, and outspeeds most, if not all fighters in the game at some point. What a machine. Did it have any flaws?

LEXX_Luthor
09-26-2004, 12:15 PM
Yes, La~7 high speed acceleration may have suffered compared to Dora as the Dora may have had better high speed aerodynamics, as your previous accel tests seemed to indicate. At lower speeds the higher power/mass ratio of La~7 seems confirmed in your tests, at speeds where aerodynamics is overpowered by power/mass. Such power/mass advantage may explain the low initial speed zoom climb advantage of La~7 in your test.

Only in roll, high speed dive, firepower, bombload, high speed handling, and also general high altitude performance should Dora beat La~7. But only in those few areas. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Not sure about DM though, but I was "raised" to think of Fw~190 as a pretty tough bird.

Don't ever fly it, but FB La~7 is reported to not suffer high altitude penalties like we have come to expect.

JaBo_HH-BlackSheep
09-26-2004, 12:59 PM
i did such a test a while ago, result: Spit catches every 190A

WWMaxGunz
09-26-2004, 01:55 PM
Robban, try zooming from level flight at 500kph to reduce the effect of transition,
and be gentle with the FW at least at the start. Also go for a steeper angle, 45 or
better to minimalize P/W as the planes slow down.

La-7 is supposed to be a hotrod isn't it?

The P-51 might be catching up speedwise to the D-9 in the dive by alt, but the D-9
I am sure took less time getting there! I see it at higher speed nearly all the way
down, it should have a lead all that way down. The catching up is only interms of
the D-9 not gaining by as much per second.


Neal

Kwiatos
09-27-2004, 03:39 PM
30 DEGRES - ZOOM CLIMB???

LEXX_Luthor
09-27-2004, 04:17 PM
Very Slightly yes, not many planes can maintain 30 degrees climb, except maybe Me~163 and....K4 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BI~1 too.

p1ngu666
09-27-2004, 04:45 PM
onwhine, ive found the la7 better than yak9 u in everything i think
i find aiming la7 cannons hard tho http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

lovin teh 9m and k atm http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

gates123
09-27-2004, 04:55 PM
La-7's break apart easy. They will start thier shakes at about 610kph and won't make it past 680kph. Most planes can out dive them. I've gotten a yak-3 up to 800kph in a dive and it held togather, relatively good for a russian bird.

faustnik
09-27-2004, 05:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gates123:
La-7's break apart easy. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not when you're shooting at them with Mg151 20mm rounds. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Zen--
09-28-2004, 02:15 PM
I've had similar experiences against the La7 and Spitfire. It's not uncommon to make a shallow dive on a Spit and see that you are gaining rapidly, only to have him enter a steep climb and end up pulling away before you enter firing range.

VW-IceFire
09-28-2004, 03:28 PM
La-7 is definately a hotrod...its very very hard to beat but on rare occasion I have out zoomed them with a FW190D-9. Not sure why I did but he kept coming and I figured oh no...here we go...they usually get me but I kept my speed up for whatever reason and he stalled out. It didn't give me any advantage however...he was able to regain control quicker than I did when I stalled a second later.

I think overall the physics engine doesn't always give advantage to the heavier aircraft even when it should. Spits, Yak's, La's, and most of those seem to do well (even 109's to an extent)...while the FW190's and P-47's seem to not get quite as much performance in some areas as they should. I think overall its just processing power and the number of variables calculated. I'd expect that the next major upgrade of the FM in their new engine (BoB) would be able to portray this better.

KGr.HH-Sunburst
09-28-2004, 04:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gates123:
La-7's break apart easy. They will start thier shakes at about 610kph and won't make it past 680kph. Most planes can out dive them. I've gotten a yak-3 up to 800kph in a dive and it held togather, relatively good for a russian bird. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not true, the La-7 brakes apart at about 770kph
depending on alt ,at 1k it can mantain 770kph

i had this happenend on our training server, where 262's had to skip bomb ships so they came in low and fast ,i dived on them to the deck going 770kph IAS http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BuzzU
09-28-2004, 06:22 PM
It seems you got the La7 up to 890kph. How did you do that?

LEXX_Luthor
09-28-2004, 07:53 PM
Goes real fast with wings folded back

robban75
09-28-2004, 11:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BuzzU:
It seems you got the La7 up to 890kph. How did you do that? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's true airspeed. IAS was 780km/h. It actually lost an aileron right then and there.http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif