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MB_Avro_UK
06-02-2008, 08:15 AM
Hi all,

At the weekend, I visited the Hannover Air Museum in Germany (Luftfahrt Museum).

This FW 190 A-8 was constructed from a number of wrecks. The pics are not as clear as I would have wanted but the lighting was difficult http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I also have pics of the Me 109 G2 that I'll post another time.


1.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02121.jpg

2.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02122.jpg

3.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02123.jpg

4.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02125.jpg

5.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02126.jpg

6.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02127.jpg

7.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02129.jpg

8.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02130.jpg

9.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02131.jpg

10.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02132.jpg

11.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02134.jpg

12.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02166.jpg



Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

MB_Avro_UK
06-02-2008, 08:15 AM
Hi all,

At the weekend, I visited the Hannover Air Museum in Germany (Luftfahrt Museum).

This FW 190 A-8 was constructed from a number of wrecks. The pics are not as clear as I would have wanted but the lighting was difficult http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I also have pics of the Me 109 G2 that I'll post another time.


1.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02121.jpg

2.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02122.jpg

3.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02123.jpg

4.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02125.jpg

5.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02126.jpg

6.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02127.jpg

7.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02129.jpg

8.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02130.jpg

9.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02131.jpg

10.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02132.jpg

11.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02134.jpg

12.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02166.jpg



Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Metatron_123
06-02-2008, 08:19 AM
Was there a bar in the Fw-190?? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

But more seriously, what's that quote from Churchill in German?

elephant_il2
06-02-2008, 08:29 AM
It's impressive that there is not even a hint of a bar visible! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

foxyboy1964
06-02-2008, 08:40 AM
Very nice. Pics look fine to me. Cockpit shots are great. The BMW badge on the engine surprises me, did they have that during WWII?

Thanks for posting http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Freiwillige
06-02-2008, 08:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by foxyboy1964:
Very nice. Pics look fine to me. Cockpit shots are great. The BMW badge on the engine surprises me, did they have that during WWII?

Thanks for posting http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

B.M.W. stands for Bayeriche Motor Werks and they started out during ww1 making aircraft engines. The BMW blue and white emblem is actually a stylised propeller spinning!

Also Daimler Benz (Mercedes) Made the BF-109 engines.

Mitsubishi Made the Zero
Kawisaki made the ki-27 etc.

Alot of those company's made war equipment.

foxyboy1964
06-02-2008, 08:59 AM
Yeah but what I meant was did they have a badge fitted to the engine in WWII?

Odirroh
06-02-2008, 09:21 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Metatron_123:
...
But more seriously, what's that quote from Churchill in German? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If one in war is not in a position
to defeat the combatant with its own means
then one has to acquire a tactics
which is at least as similar as possible to the combatant´s once.

(No guarantee; bear my poor English in mind).

Odirroh

jolly_magpie
06-02-2008, 09:49 AM
Yes, the logo appeared om wartime engines. In the Battle of Britain Museum in Hendon, I saw the JU88R with the BMW badges on the cowling.

foxyboy1964
06-02-2008, 09:55 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jolly_magpie:
Yes, the logo appeared om wartime engines. In the Battle of Britain Museum in Hendon, I saw the JU88R with the BMW badges on the cowling. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif Cheers. I find that quite interesting. I would never have thought they would have spent time and resources on that during wartime. I mean, who was the advert aimed at, Spitfire pilots? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Farran1966
06-02-2008, 10:17 AM
Great pics thanks for sharing, there are not many places you can go to see a Butcher Bird.

Regarding the BMW badge, I am by no means an expert, but a little while ago I saw a freshly restored 190 and it definitely did not have a badge. However, if this is correct for all 801's or not I do not know, to me the badge looks almost too modern.

Schwarz.13
06-02-2008, 10:48 AM
Hi Avro

This is the one in Laatzen, yes? I hope to see it (and maybe sit in it too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/halo.gif) someday!

"<span class="ev_code_yellow">Reconstruction containing original parts as Engine+cowling, Aft fuselage, Flaps,ailerons, cockpit interior, undercarriage etc, main fuselage built by Flugwerk GmbH in Gammelsdorf</span>"

Nice pics, thanks! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I too am curious about the BMW badge - gonna have to sift through hundreds of photos now to see if i can find a wartime example...

MB_Avro_UK
06-02-2008, 11:00 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Schwarz.13:
Hi Avro

This is the one in Laatzen, yes? I hope to see it (and maybe sit in it too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/halo.gif) someday!

"<span class="ev_code_yellow">Reconstruction containing original parts as Engine+cowling, Aft fuselage, Flaps,ailerons, cockpit interior, undercarriage etc, main fuselage built by Flugwerk GmbH in Gammelsdorf</span>"

Nice pics, thanks! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I too am curious about the BMW badge - gonna have to sift through hundreds of photos now to see if i can find a wartime example... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


The museum is situated within Hannover town. So,I'm not sure about the Laatzen connection although Laatzen is near Hannover.

I was going to ask the Museum guide if it was possible to sit in the cockpit and take pics but my camera batteries died http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif

As you can see from the pics, there is a ladder leading to the cockpit.

I will probably return there later this summer and try again...


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

cawimmer430
06-02-2008, 11:03 AM
Nice pictures! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

If you took the pictures with a DSLR camera (doesn't look like it) you could select -3 / -7 exposure rating and perhaps even select a higher ISO rating (400-600 even 800 if need be). That's what I have would done in that environment - works for me. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I saw a BMW engine at the BMW Museum in Munich which was fitted to the Junkers Ju-52/3m and it had a proud BMW badge on it. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


Funny thing is I don't see a Mercedes star on the DB600 engines! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

cawimmer430
06-02-2008, 11:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by foxyboy1964:
I find that quite interesting. I would never have thought they would have spent time and resources on that during wartime. I mean, who was the advert aimed at, Spitfire pilots? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Indeed. It was designed to make Spitfire pilots feel like they were flying the inferior machine.

Once they saw that BMW badge on the FW they were fighting, they knew they were tangling with The Ultimate Flying Machine! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

SeaFireLIV
06-02-2008, 11:23 AM
Any notice that it actually says `Uber` on the undercarriage leg?

Is that little BMW symbol historical?

Interesting views, cheers.

p.s. Already answerd. I too am a bit surprised to see the BMW there myself.

MB_Avro_UK
06-02-2008, 11:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
Any notice that it actually says `Uber` on the undercarriage leg?

Is that little BMW symbol historical?

Interesting views, cheers. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good observation there re 'Uber' http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Did you notice that the drop tank is stamped 'Not a Bomb'(In German of course http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif).

@Christian Thanks for the advice http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Airmail109
06-02-2008, 11:38 AM
I thought the "Swastika" was illegal in Germany? The reason why its banned on all German models, and why it wasnt in IL2 originally?

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

SeaFireLIV
06-02-2008, 11:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MB_Avro_UK:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
Any notice that it actually says `Uber` on the undercarriage leg?

Is that little BMW symbol historical?

Interesting views, cheers. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good observation there re 'Uber' http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Did you notice that the drop tank is stamped 'Not a Bomb'(In German of course http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif).

@Christian Thanks for the advice http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif


Best Regards,
MB_Avro. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I saw the fuel tank and even though I know very little German, figured that`s that what it was saying. I wonder if that`s historical too?

JZG_Thiem
06-02-2008, 11:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Aimail101:
I thought the "Swastika" was illegal in Germany? The reason why its banned on all German models, and why it wasnt in IL2 originally?

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Swastika is allowed to use for purpose of showing history, in museums for example, or on exhibitions (afaik).
Using the Swastika for other *profane* reasons is banned.

SeaFireLIV
06-02-2008, 11:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JZG_Thiem:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Aimail101:
I thought the "Swastika" was illegal in Germany? The reason why its banned on all German models, and why it wasnt in IL2 originally?

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Swastika is allowed to use for purpose of showing history, in museums for example, or on exhibitions (afaik).
Using the Swastika for other *profane* reasons is banned. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

yea, it`s legal in germany but only like strictly historical stuff like Museums. Not allowed in games, comics, etc...

IL2 is seen as a game, I guess.

Bremspropeller
06-02-2008, 11:56 AM
über = above/ over http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

MB_Avro_UK
06-02-2008, 11:57 AM
Hi all,

I forgot to include these pics of a display in the museum dedicated to fallen pilots of all nations.

A nice thought.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02152.jpg


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/MB_Avro/2008-06-02153.jpg



Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Heliopause
06-02-2008, 12:00 PM
Great Pics MB_Avro_UK http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I was in Hannover not so long ago...didn't know about the museum.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Perhaps you still have the adress?

foxyboy1964
06-02-2008, 12:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Schwarz.13:
I too am curious about the BMW badge - gonna have to sift through hundreds of photos now to see if i can find a wartime example... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Let us know how you get on, eh?

MB_Avro_UK
06-02-2008, 12:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Heliopause:
Great Pics MB_Avro_UK http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I was in Hannover not so long ago...didn't know about the museum.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Perhaps you still have the adress? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Hi Helio,

My guide for the weekend was fellow squadmate MB_Mitgard who lives nearby. He was the driver!

This link may help:

http://www.luftfahrtmuseum-hannover.de/neu/enewsites1/astart.htm


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Xiolablu3
06-02-2008, 12:18 PM
Fantastic Avro, thanks!

Xiolablu3
06-02-2008, 12:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bremspropeller:
über = above/ over http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

California, above all ,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_%C3%9Cber_Alles

Heliopause
06-02-2008, 12:21 PM
Thanks MB_Avro_UK. Next time in Hannover I go check it out! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Schwarz.13
06-02-2008, 02:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:I saw the fuel tank and even though I know very little German, figured that`s that what it was saying. I wonder if that`s historical too? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

keine Bombe!: that is definately historical - i've seen countless pics of that stamped on Luftwaffe droptanks.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by foxyboy1964:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Schwarz.13:
I too am curious about the BMW badge - gonna have to sift through hundreds of photos now to see if i can find a wartime example... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Let us know how you get on, eh? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

OK - do you think there'll still be anyone here in a year's time? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

F0_Dark_P
06-02-2008, 02:53 PM
Nice pics, thanx

Btw: Yeah! Dead Kennedys! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/metal.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/metal.gif

Schwarz.13
06-03-2008, 06:42 AM
Hold on! Doesn't the White 1 Foundation have an original BMW 801 engine???

Surely Crump/Kettenhunde can answer the question about the badge!


<span class="ev_code_red">EDIT:</span> Found it myself on the White 1 site: here (http://www.white1foundation.org/restoration_engine.htm)

...and half of the badge can be seen,at the bottom left, in the detailed cutaway drawing from the original manual (scroll down to bottom of page on link above).

*errrm thanks White 1* http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

foxyboy1964
06-03-2008, 01:17 PM
Very well spotted Shwarz http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif. By the look of that drawing it looks as though the engine case was cast with the circle for the badge already built on.

MB_Avro_UK
06-03-2008, 02:41 PM
Hi all,

I was also amazed to see the BMW badge so I took the pic. Good research guys http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

I_JG78_Max
06-05-2008, 06:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by cawimmer430:
Funny thing is I don't see a Mercedes star on the DB600 engines! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


You need to look closer./Schau mal genauer hin. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://upload.wik...%26hs%3DElZ%26sa%3DN (http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/99/Daimler_Benz_DB_605A.jpg/230px-Daimler_Benz_DB_605A.jpg&imgrefurl=http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daimler-Benz_DB_610&h=254&w=230&sz=17&hl=de&start=10&um=1&tbnid=46hByHG4NLzmZM:&tbnh=111&tbnw=101&prev=/images%3Fq%3Ddaimler%2Bbenz%2B603%26um%3D1%26hl%3D de%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:dehttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_redface.giffficial%26hs%3DElZ%26sa%3DN)

Bolt40
06-09-2008, 09:18 AM
Those are some good pics of the 190 , I was in San Antonio , Tx. 2 yrs ago and came upon the Stinson Air Museum there , and lo and behold they have a FW 190 A7 on display .the museum doesnt look that great from the outside , but it has a treasure trove of artifacts , equipment ..etc .. the 190 and the video of the German pilot who actually flew it with JG5 in Norway was a nice touch . If I rememeber right , it was shot down in a dogfight with RAF Mustangs in '45 and it and 3 other 190's were recovered and restored ..3 were sent back to Norway and 1 was kept for the museum ..will send pics , when I get back from Iraq ..cheers http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif Bolt