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View Full Version : Do we need a division of flying skill on Hyperlobby in order to make it more fun?



signalnorth
12-09-2005, 12:28 PM
Here is a thought that will probably get me shot down in flames (makes a change it being verbally!)

The thread that's running about being a poor online flyer seems to suggest that I'm not the only one out there getting shot down frequently and regularly. It seems to me that there are only really two types of flyers on Hyperlobby. Thoses scoring very high score eg 200, 500 1200 etc and the rest of us scoring 0, 10 perhaps on a good day 30 during a session.

I can't help but wonder if like in football (and other sports) there are different divisions where teams/players of an equal skill compete, that theres a need for that on hyperlobby to a degree.

Perosnally I find it very disheartening to constantly take off , quickly get 'jumped' and then 'die' everytime I fly on line.
OK I know some of you will say but that's how you learn, that's how you improve. To a degree that's true, yes, but there will always be better fliers than others. A 3rd division footballer will not become a Premier League player simply by putting him among top players - There is a limit to peoples skills and a limit to the arc of any improvement to their skills.

Wouldn't it be more fun if we were flying against people of roughly the same skill levels, at least for some of the time?

Come on, I can't be the only one thinking this! Any thoughts? Any suggestions?

signalnorth
12-09-2005, 12:28 PM
Here is a thought that will probably get me shot down in flames (makes a change it being verbally!)

The thread that's running about being a poor online flyer seems to suggest that I'm not the only one out there getting shot down frequently and regularly. It seems to me that there are only really two types of flyers on Hyperlobby. Thoses scoring very high score eg 200, 500 1200 etc and the rest of us scoring 0, 10 perhaps on a good day 30 during a session.

I can't help but wonder if like in football (and other sports) there are different divisions where teams/players of an equal skill compete, that theres a need for that on hyperlobby to a degree.

Perosnally I find it very disheartening to constantly take off , quickly get 'jumped' and then 'die' everytime I fly on line.
OK I know some of you will say but that's how you learn, that's how you improve. To a degree that's true, yes, but there will always be better fliers than others. A 3rd division footballer will not become a Premier League player simply by putting him among top players - There is a limit to peoples skills and a limit to the arc of any improvement to their skills.

Wouldn't it be more fun if we were flying against people of roughly the same skill levels, at least for some of the time?

Come on, I can't be the only one thinking this! Any thoughts? Any suggestions?

JG52Uther
12-09-2005, 12:42 PM
Join a squad,get some training,and shoot the other guy down http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

nickdanger3
12-09-2005, 12:46 PM
Get on teamspeak - probably no better way to protect your virtual life than to be in constant communication with your teammates.

SlickStick
12-09-2005, 12:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by signalnorth:
Here is a thought that will probably get me shot down in flames (makes a change it being verbally!)

The thread that's running about being a poor online flyer seems to suggest that I'm not the only one out there getting shot down frequently and regularly. It seems to me that there are only really two types of flyers on Hyperlobby. Thoses scoring very high score eg 200, 500 1200 etc and the rest of us scoring 0, 10 perhaps on a good day 30 during a session.

I can't help but wonder if like in football (and other sports) there are different divisions where teams/players of an equal skill compete, that theres a need for that on hyperlobby to a degree.

Perosnally I find it very disheartening to constantly take off , quickly get 'jumped' and then 'die' everytime I fly on line.
OK I know some of you will say but that's how you learn, that's how you improve. To a degree that's true, yes, but there will always be better fliers than others. A 3rd division footballer will not become a Premier League player simply by putting him among top players - There is a limit to peoples skills and a limit to the arc of any improvement to their skills.

Wouldn't it be more fun if we were flying against people of roughly the same skill levels, at least for some of the time?

Come on, I can't be the only one thinking this! Any thoughts? Any suggestions? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Granted, it's difficult to assess the talent on any one server unless you know all of the pilots or have flown with them, but you have to ask around and just keep trying different servers until you find one that is frequented by newer or not-so-serious pilots. I would propose it to you this way:

Flying against better pilots will make you a better pilot. Eventually, you'll get sick of being shot down all of the time and you're going to want to do something about it. That's when you take the above advice and join a squadron or at least secure an Ace from HL to train you individually. Many of the experienced guys will take the time to show a novice the ropes.

Once you get a few months or so of training under your belt, are applying the same tips and tactics that are being used against you and learn how to maximize your plane's strengths, while minimizing it's weaknesses, then you will be on the road to Acedom.

However, one thing to remember....no matter how ace-like a pilot becomes, there's always an equivalent or slightly better one around. This game has many pilots that know how to push the envelope of the flight models.

Don't become dejected or bitter and don't EVER give up. We were all in the same boat you are now and had to fight our way out into the ocean, too. Some of the best pilots we have now were some of the crappiest pilots when they started. Just ask them. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

danjama
12-09-2005, 01:45 PM
Fish will be along soon to tell you there are only people who are ACES, have ACE in their blood, or are not ACE material.

Actually not soon, he doesnt come here much.

Just take the above comment as my own.

Time = Better flying.

BTW you will appreciate your online time more if you judge your session by how well you flew, not how big your score is. Once you do this, you will see your score and ego get bigger. However this takes months or years.

*edit* re-reading your post, there is a simple answer also.

Different servers seem to have different levels of players.

334th + AFJ = crappy flyers or good flyers looking for kicks (good flyers feast on the delight of killin the crappy playaz)

Warclouds = flyers who like realism but not boredom. Usually better pilots in a serious mindset although friendly.

WOP and Spits vs 109s etc = Fully committed hardcore flyers. Not necessarily better skilled but more into their mission and like spending time on flying, IE two hour sorties.

In short, if you want to fly with crappy people to improve, go to 334th.

If u wanna fly with good pilots and improve, go to warclouds.

If u want to fully commit and possibly die from boredom, go to spits vs 109s or zeeks/wildcats.

Here is a final piece of knowledge, usually doing something (a hobby) with people better than you, usually means u learn quicker and get better quicker. This is definately here!

rnzoli
12-09-2005, 02:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by signalnorth:
Wouldn't it be more fun if we were flying against people of roughly the same skill levels, at least for some of the time?

Come on, I can't be the only one thinking this! Any thoughts? Any suggestions? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I do agree with you. I run my own server for this reason http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Seriously, it is much easier to make friends on smaller servers. Once you can hang out with a few regular friends, it becomes a totally different ballgame. Avoid the big, famous servers with high ego pilots. All that **** they tell you about more time, more learning, more reading, etc., is just a simple way to trick you and make you stay there for enhancing &lt;b&gt;their&lt;/b&gt; fun! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif Joining a squad is a good idea, if you like pretending you are a soldier http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

SlickStick
12-09-2005, 02:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by danjama:
"334th + AFJ = crappy flyers or good flyers looking for kicks (good flyers feast on the delight of killin the crappy playaz)"

"In short, if you want to fly with crappy people to improve, go to 334th."
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If I didn't know better, I'd think you had it in for the 334th, lol. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

SlickStick
12-09-2005, 02:05 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by signalnorth:
Wouldn't it be more fun if we were flying against people of roughly the same skill levels, at least for some of the time?

Come on, I can't be the only one thinking this! Any thoughts? Any suggestions? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I do agree with you. I run my own server for this reason http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Seriously, it is much easier to make friends on smaller servers. Once you can hang out with a few regular friends, it becomes a totally different ballgame. Avoid the big, famous servers with high ego pilots. All that **** they tell you about more time, more learning, more reading, etc., is just a simple way to trick you and make you stay there for enhancing their fun! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif Joining a squad is a good idea, if you like pretending you are a soldier http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bah, total rubbish. The advice the great players give is exactly how they got to the status they are at.

Also, there are many squadrons that aren't all about rank and file. Some are just groups of like-minded online pilots who enjoy flying together and watching each other's back.

Small, narrow-minded servers fall into a rut as they usually feature the same pilots everyday and their knowledge of this sim becomes quite stagnant, because they are not flying at a level that will improve their skills, just maintain them. My .02βΆ.

rnzoli
12-09-2005, 02:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SlickStick:
Small, narrow-minded servers fall into a rut as they usually feature the same pilots everyday and their knowledge of this sim becomes quite stagnant, because they are not flying at a level that will improve their skills, just maintain them. My .02βΆ. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There is a truth to this. But only makes sense, if everyone would want to climb the learning curve like a maniac. If someone wants to take a slower pace, small servers give the needed greenhouse effect. Don't forget that that the people who gave up due to frustration are not here anymore to tell their side of the story.

By the way, there is a 2nd league of pilots already, no need to split Hyperlobby in any way. The lower class of pilots fly on UBI.com http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

SlickStick
12-09-2005, 02:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
The lower class of pilots fly on UBI.com http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL, Zing! Good one. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

danjama
12-09-2005, 02:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SlickStick:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by danjama:
"334th + AFJ = crappy flyers or good flyers looking for kicks (good flyers feast on the delight of killin the crappy playaz)"

"In short, if you want to fly with crappy people to improve, go to 334th."
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If I didn't know better, I'd think you had it in for the 334th, lol. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Long Story http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

polak5
12-09-2005, 02:48 PM
It seems like a good idea to have servers for new pilots only.
But from what ive experienced in other games this dosent work. Ive seen servers that are called "Noobs only" but when u get there its nothing but experienced pilots trying to get easy kills.
Ur best bet would be to find small rooms and ask around to see who is new and who is not, and make friends from there.
Also keep in mind what slickstick said "Don't become dejected or bitter and don't EVER give up."
I remember getting quite agrevated back in the day when i coulnt buy a kill to save my life. Now its much easier. The key for me anyways is to get in that zone were the aircracft is a part of you, instead of u being part of the aircraft....make sense?. Dont forget practice makes perfect.
Also,know the advantages of ur aircraft and the dissadvantages of ur enemy. For that i recommend this. http://www.airwarfare.com/Sims/FB/fb_essential_files.htm#001
And remember have fun, good luck http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

SlickStick
12-09-2005, 03:08 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by polak5:
It seems like a good idea to have servers for new pilots only.
But from what ive experienced in other games this dosent work. Ive seen servers that are called "Noobs only" but when u get there its nothing but experienced pilots trying to get easy kills.
Ur best bet would be to find small rooms and ask around to see who is new and who is not, and make friends from there.
Also keep in mind what slickstick said "Don't become dejected or bitter and don't EVER give up."
I remember getting quite agrevated back in the day when i coulnt buy a kill to save my life. Now its much easier. The key for me anyways is to get in that zone were the aircracft is a part of you, instead of u being part of the aircraft....make sense?. Dont forget practice makes perfect.
Also,know the advantages of ur aircraft and the dissadvantages of ur enemy. For that i recommend this. http://www.airwarfare.com/Sims/FB/fb_essential_files.htm#001
And remember have fun, good luck http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Any experienced pilots that need to invade a Noob server to score kills, have other issues that we need not discuss here. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Good post, polak5. Especially, the part about remembering to have fun! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

SeaFireLIV
12-09-2005, 03:27 PM
Yea. Noob servers would be more of a disservice to the new guys than a help, I think. There used to be lots of new guy servers once, but as Polak said, they became a magnetic for Aces or medium skilled pilots to sucker the rookies into being easily shot down... Sad, but true.


It`s also true imho, that MANY pilots are much more skilled. There was a time I could easily go on a server and get 4-5 kills on my own against 109s and 190s... now I`m lucky to get 2... even as part of a team (or is it the new FMs, I wonder?).

Just keep flying and practising. Patience and endurance is all, it`s a testament to the authenticity of the sim.

danjama
12-09-2005, 03:57 PM
"The key for me anyways is to get in that zone were the aircracft is a part of you, instead of u being part of the aircraft....make sense?"

For me it was this bit! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gif

You know when you've had a great night, caus you go to bed with that smug smile across your face and go to sleep thinkin about that last great shot that took off his wing http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Oh yes, be one with your plane, it isn't just a real life thing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

polak5
12-09-2005, 04:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by danjama:


Oh yes, be one with your plane, it isn't just a real life thing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I couldnt have said it better myself....I tried http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Nice sig by the way http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/9476/cimg07235vk.jpg

Banger2004
12-09-2005, 04:26 PM
You got to keep at it, you'll then slowly find the frustration becomes less and less, and you start thinking 'wow, that guy had no chance in front of my guns!' more and more. At least that is how it mostly seems to me now.

I have been flying for a little over a year now, and I often make mincemeat out of other players..........trouble is another one then comes and hands me MY ***, thats how you learn. Make tracks of some engagements, look at them after an evenings flying, and try to learn from your mistakes (and the other guys mistakes too!!).

Even better, you will make buddies with one or two fellow fliers, and they will give you sound advice (hiya SlickStick, where you been lately?) In particular one flier (who knows who he is) has been a godsend to me with helping my flying, he must have the patience of a saint though, I'm a slow learner!

Like I say, I've been flying for a year, and still got a great deal to learn, BUT I'VE HAD SOME FANTASTIC FUN ALONG THE WAY.

SlickStick
12-09-2005, 05:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Banger2004:
Even better, you will make buddies with one or two fellow fliers, and they will give you sound advice (hiya SlickStick, where you been lately?) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've been around, but limited lately. I've only had an hour or two a few days a week to run my 1 vs 1 server. I'm hoping BBloke finishes moving and has his server up this weekend. Maybe I'll see you there. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

danjama
12-09-2005, 05:26 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by polak5:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by danjama:


Oh yes, be one with your plane, it isn't just a real life thing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I couldnt have said it better myself....I tried http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Nice sig by the way http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/9476/cimg07235vk.jpg </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oops i been caught http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

danjama
12-09-2005, 05:30 PM
Also i agree, get a solid bunch of friends online! Thats a must. If anything so you can whine at em when ur shot down in flames http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Seriously, friends who you fly with and talk to regular are great!

SlickStick
12-09-2005, 05:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
There is a truth to this. But only makes sense, if everyone would want to climb the learning curve like a maniac. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

From the original poster's intent, I felt that he indeed wanted to improve as quickly as he could. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

sparty7200
12-09-2005, 05:42 PM
What niggles me (i've been flyin with a sqaud that works together) i've really come to notice how ( for want of a better word word) 'ignorant' some ppl are ...today on Hyper lobby, i attacked a Bf 109 g series ( in a p40E) which i let go because he dropped his landing gear as a sign of submittal, then i joined a dogfight where another red team member was being attacked, he and another buggered off and left me to 4 109's on my own to which i got wasted!!..fair doos i s'pose but what about covering each other??..if anything its taught me to cover my wing man properly and i know i'll do a better job next time!..and if its (outside the fight) to deal with it when i can!

just my happeny worth

Sparty

WWTharn
12-09-2005, 05:59 PM
Sparty makes a point I'd like to add to.
When these guys are suggesting to join a squad-It's not only for the training but the wingman techniques and having someone or group to fly with...

"fly alone, die alone" has always stuck in my head ever since I first heard it..
if you find yourself getting gang raped soon after take off on a server its not because you aren't capable its because no one is watching out for you-The enemy has position and its soon over.

take the Team speak post/ the join squad post and the "Fly as a team post and put em all together and it will add to your enjoyment a great deal.
S~

signalnorth
12-10-2005, 01:22 AM
Excellent posts all. Yep I need to keep at it. I think I need some 1-1 flying tuition and to join a squad (Already made a move towards this)

Good suggestion to record some tracks post 'death' to see where I went wrong - Obvious suggestion really, but didn't really think about that - Will do!

Tully__
12-10-2005, 01:33 AM
Servers for beginners don't work unless they have an administrator present at all times the server is operating. Unfortunately un-administered servers that claim to be for beginners tend to end up being used by a few unscrupulous more experienced pilots as bait for easy targets.

That being said there's a group organising a combat flight school for sim pilots. I don't have a link handy but a quick search should bring up a mention of it.

rnzoli
12-10-2005, 01:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SlickStick:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
There is a truth to this. But only makes sense, if everyone would want to climb the learning curve like a maniac. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

From the original poster's intent, I felt that he indeed wanted to improve as quickly as he could. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
No. I my read, he was about to come to accept that he cannot climb as fast as he wants to (hence the idea of divisions to make the learning more fun ). It is a commonly occurring feeling among people climbing the learning curve - some parts you take faster, some others take more effort.

And then you guys come along and tell him, PUSH, PUSH, YOU MUST GET BETTER, MORE TIME, MORE TIME, MORE SQUAD, MORE TS, MORE READING, COME ON, YOU CAN DO IT, DON'T EVER STOP, MOVE YOU ***, DON'T LET UP, I DID IT, SO YOU CAN DO IT AS WELL...etc.

Sounds like a typical multi-level marketing conference http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Although I generally agree with such advice, important points seem to be forgotten. For example, that just like airplanes have a "power budget" (alt, speed), people have a patience budget. Have to be careful how you spend it and how you get some re-fill bottles from time to time. The original poster clearly needs a source of such refill, instead of spending more of what's left.

Another common mistake is to say "practice makes perfect". The real formula is far more complicated:

perceived competence level =
practice time *
flight-gear quality (stick, pedals, trackIR, monitor) *
personal characteristics (vision, reaction time)
* support from others.

For example, spending more time with practice is nearly 100% waste with bad joystick (need to get the gear right first). Similarly, at a higher level of the curve, spending more time fighing alone is wasted in the same way (need to team up to learn more). The generic "GO, GO,GO" kind of advice can result in the opposite effect than the intention is.

Regarding UBI.com and 2nd class. I was surprized when discovered that quite a few (former) squad members fly there under different callsigns. Some retired from online wars, some came back to practice on less competent enemies. Just makes me think that there is a peak of that much referred "learning curve", and when you reach it, there is nowhere else to go. The fight patterns get boring: if your aircraft has worse T&B characteristics than your opponents, then you B&Z him, if not, you do wide barrel rolls to evade B&Z attacks.

And whatever we do, nothing will save anyone from a lucky shot from uber AI. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

rnzoli
12-10-2005, 02:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by signalnorth:
Good suggestion to record some tracks post 'death' to see where I went wrong </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
It is useful, but don't expect too much out of it, since you will not see exactly what your opponent was doing better. The really useful track is the one recorded by your opponent. Ask for THAT to learn. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

polak5
12-10-2005, 02:17 AM
rnzoli, ur sig always makes me want to go fly the Il2. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif just thought id let u know

rnzoli
12-10-2005, 02:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by polak5:
rnzoli, ur sig always makes me want to go fly the Il2. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif just thought id let u know </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL, thanks! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif I like to fly her, too, from time to time (tough chick!).

The screenshot however, was taken from a friend's server. I could not fly due to RL obligations, but since external views were enabled, I joined to "watch the movie". My friend got a bit annoyed about me taking up one of his slots, so he gave my IL2 a nice vulching run. But tough armor kept me and my rear-gunner alive (see, I am lying face down besides the wreckage), and my fiend's plane was eventually shot down by AAA.... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Next day I told my friend about the "kick" command http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

rnzoli
12-10-2005, 03:05 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tully__:
Servers for beginners don't work unless they have an administrator present at all times the server is operating. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was surprized to see how many "beginners" took refuge on my server from time to time, although the title clearly says "full difficulty" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Then I figured that beginners liked it, too, because of:
- fairly hard sim settings, as it levels the playing field and discourages people looking for easy kills (nothing is easy without map and plane icons http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif)
- scripted features which "imitate the presence" of the admin at all times
- availability of ground targets to practice aiming and get some points, anyway
- heavy AAA around home bases, where beginners can safely take off, and return to, if someone locked on their six
- less than 8 slots, where it is easier to maintain SA and make new friends, too
- a simple system to keep track of personal scores in a comparable way, but not to boost the egos too much.

(Stats: http://web.axelero.hu/rnzoli/IL2DSC/stats.html)

Monty_Thrud
12-10-2005, 07:43 AM
Finding the right server is paramount to enjoying all online gaming

All i can suggest is, take your time to find that server

Decide what you want to do...IE DF, bomber escort, Coop, etc, and search for that type

Dont be put off by the rude types that you'll come across...pity them

Select server...read server rules...read mission objectives...spawn...navigation lights ON...slowly taxi to runway...take off...undercarriage/flaps up...nav lights off...fly high....join up with a fighter...or take high cover/recon

I would like to see different types of servers as far as those who are stat obsessed(point *****s) and those who want to fly with historical objectives or just a good ol' dogfight http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Viper2005_
12-10-2005, 08:32 AM
Success is made up of 3 components IMO

i) Situational awareness - you've got to see the other guy in good time so that you can make decisions.

ii) Gunnery - good flying never killed anyone.

iii) Comms - when you get into trouble, your buddies on comms will bail you out.

iv) Gear - sadly technology does come into it.

Let's look at those individually:

For good situational awareness you need a lookout scan. I favour mouse look. Every minute or so I bellycheck (an aileron roll executed whilst looking backwards to check my low 6 blindspot). I spend most of my time looking around, and very little time "head down" in the cockpit.

Gunnery is best improved using the QMB. Pick an aeroplane to fly (I fly the Fw-190), and put some time in to making sure you can hit your targets. Start out with friendlies and work your way up. My current training mission is:

Crimea @ 1000 m vs
2 average Spitfire VIII(CW)
2 average P-39D-2
2 average P-38L Late
2 average P-51D-5

I almost always get myself shot down, but generally manage to take about 3 of them with me. I find that translates to considerable success online. In fact, I do better online than against the AI because I can sneak up on real players, and I can generally disengage more easily too. In addition I've got buddies on comms to get me out of trouble.

Comms are a real life-saver. Learn the phonetic alphabet. Learn some brevity. Give map grids using the phonetic alphabet, and for added precision quote the "num pad" (Imagine the grid you're in is the num-pad on your keyboard - quote the number you're flying over).

The most useful call is:

MAYDAY MAYDAY MAYDAY
&lt;Callsign&gt;
Dragging &lt;n&gt; bandits
Heading for &lt;destination&gt; (pick a friendly base!)
My location is:
&lt;Grid&gt;
&lt;Numpad&gt;
&lt;Altitude&gt;

This call will serve you well. All you've got to do is learn it, and fill in the blanks as required.

I started out a fairly long time ago now (I guess ~3.02) flying Spitfires on warclouds. I swapped to the Fw-190 in around 3.03 and I've never looked back. It took me something like 8 flying hours to even get my first kill, and for the first few months I spent my whole time dying.

iv) I run a rather old PC. IMO as long as you're getting an average of more than about 30 fps you're doing fine. I find a 6600GT is quite enough. I used to fly with a 5600 and that was ok provided that I stayed away from perfect mode. I fly in 1024*768 and find this acceptable.

I recently spent a lot of money on getting a U2Nxt Cougar and when combined with a set of rudder pedals it makes a big difference. A good stick is probably the single most important investment you can make once your rig is "good enough".

However, I only made this investment after my X-45 died. Otherwise I would probably have stuck with the X-45 forever.

...

When you get into combat, stay fast, only engage from a position of advantage. Make one pass and get out. This will keep you alive. As your gunnery improves you'll find it's quite possible to score kills in that one pass.

As your confidence grows you might be happy making 2 passes...

Stay fast, and always try to stay alive. Getting kills should always come a distant second to staying alive. The difference between a score of 10 and a score of 100 is a landing. Heck if you make it across the lines and jump you'll still get 50!

<span class="ev_code_RED">Most people have the potential to be better at many things than they give themselves credit for.</span>

ForkTailedDevil
12-10-2005, 08:42 AM
I have been flying for a little over a year online now. My overall impression of HL has been very negative.

I get the feeling that in order to have success there you need teamspeak and a track IR. When I first started to fly online I flew only on HL and I was lucky to be flying for 5 minutes before I realized I had a wing missing and gravity was pulling me down.

I flew a variety of servers and only rarely could get anyone to talk to me and give me hints. I tried taking off in groups with other pilots only to get bounced when I realized that they weren't going to help cover me.

I only fly UBI now, while I feel HL has a few advantages in terms of server options, I prefer the how much more friendly the people there are.

rnzoli
12-10-2005, 09:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Viper2005_:
Success is made up of 3 components IMO </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
And you name 4 of them... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Viper2005_:
The difference between a score of 10 and a score of 100 is a landing. Heck if you make it across the lines and jump you'll still get 50! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
If you emergency land in the field, without damaging the plane, you even get 70.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Viper2005_:
<span class="ev_code_RED">Most people have the potential to be better at many things than they give themselves credit for.</span> </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I see this as the best post so far, addressing typical intermediate-stuck-on-learning-curve-half-way problems. Unfortunately, we have tons of generic advice for beginners, but much less like this one, specific and motivating http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Von_Rat
12-10-2005, 11:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">personal characteristics (vision, reaction time) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



in that case im screwed,,,, i got thick glasses and im a old fart, with a old farts reacton time, lol.

but then again i find that age and treachery often overcomes youth and talent.

Clan_Graham
12-10-2005, 11:56 AM
Yes. We need to segregate the servers in Hyper Lobby.
Only the unskilled should fly against the unskilled. Only the highly skilled should fly against the highly skilled.

Just like it was in real life during the war.

danjama
12-10-2005, 02:49 PM
Don't be oppressive!

rnzoli
12-10-2005, 04:46 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Clan_Graham:
Just like it was in real life during the war. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thank you for your understanding. Next time you crash and die, uninstall your IL2. Just like in real life.