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View Full Version : OK, who primarily plays offline?---let's get some statistics



leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 08:05 AM
I am a 100% offliner.

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 08:05 AM
I am a 100% offliner.

tomtheyak
10-08-2007, 08:17 AM
30% Offline - 70% Online

Love different aspects of both; campaigns offline for the get in and go with formations, combat with goals and immersion in the campaign; online for the cameraderie, the challenge of flying against pilots who know what they are doing and the humour!

JG53Frankyboy
10-08-2007, 08:20 AM
100% online - 0% offline

(offline use of the game only COOP missionbuilding and testing planes and weapons in QMB)

KRISTORF
10-08-2007, 08:27 AM
100% online, I use(d) offline when I am(was) skinning

Feathered_IV
10-08-2007, 08:27 AM
About 50/50 here.

F19_Orheim
10-08-2007, 08:28 AM
100% online

mrsiCkstar
10-08-2007, 08:31 AM
perhaps a poll would have been better?

100% online.

skarden
10-08-2007, 08:32 AM
70% online

30% offline

gotta play some offline as their's some sweet campaigns out there that'd be a shame to miss out on,but gotta play online because there's no substitute for flying with and fighting against real people IMHO http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

jasonbirder
10-08-2007, 08:32 AM
You're asking in the wrong place...this is the home of the online mafia...

There is no reason to dis-believe this game is significantly different from anything else in the sim genre, where previous statistics have always hovered around 95% exclusively offline and 5% being made up of Online only and people who play a mix of online/offline

I suspect that that is probably overly generous in favour of on-liners (and reflects the fact they are emore likely to respond to online polls and questionaires) How many people regularly fly online on Hyperlobby...compared to the hundreds of thousands of copies of Forgotten battles, Pacific Fighters, Complete Edition, Il2 1946 actually sold worldwide?

TheCrux
10-08-2007, 08:34 AM
60 pct Offline

40 pct Online

They both offer things the others don't, and so I couldn't just choose one over the other.

I like online for the varied and interesting maps & objects ( as even after 3+ years I still find the FMB a bit too "labor intensive" to set up )

I like offline for the flexibility of A/C and scenarios...plus, the fact I can pause the action while I grab another beer or piss if I need to.

okb001
10-08-2007, 08:37 AM
100% offline

flyingloon
10-08-2007, 08:40 AM
100% offline

Uncle_Stranger
10-08-2007, 08:46 AM
10% offline:
- COOP mission building and testing

90% online
-playing COOP's with my friends
-playing on full switch on, dogfight servers

carts
10-08-2007, 08:51 AM
I guess about 50/50,as others have said,both have there own rewards.

choxaway
10-08-2007, 08:51 AM
Don't play anything online.

berg417448
10-08-2007, 08:53 AM
100% Offline.

SeaFireLIV
10-08-2007, 08:56 AM
I thought this was going to be a poll? Should be.

80% offline. 20% online. Average.

I like offline cos I can concentrate on a proper world war. not airquake. even Coops are often an exercise in airquake as a lot of pilots don`t want to fly to real world situations. Lufty boys don`t want to do the objective (stay in the stratosphere for eternity) and allied boys tend to be undisciplined.

At the moment I`m flying `41 over Leningrad and getting kicked by AI 109s that know what to do. I spend most of my missions running away... But that will change in the winter cos that`s when the Hurricanes and Spits come over from the UK. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gifB239s are nice to tackle though.


jasonbirder is right though. You`ll get a skewed result since most replies will be from onliners, unless we get lucky and the quiet offliners decided to add their voice this once.

Inadaze
10-08-2007, 08:56 AM
Offline 99.9%

LEBillfish
10-08-2007, 09:01 AM
100% Online

Pirschjaeger
10-08-2007, 09:01 AM
100% offline.

Is it possible to edit this thread and make it a poll?

Would this community accurately represent online/offline stats? I don't think so as I'm sure the majority of those who own IL-2 do not participate in this community.

Fritz

JG52Uther
10-08-2007, 09:03 AM
99% online.

Divine-Wind
10-08-2007, 09:05 AM
Right now I'm completely playing offline, when I play at all (Mission building and testing). Otherwise I usually dabble a in multiplayer.

Bearcat99
10-08-2007, 09:08 AM
If you want statistics you would be better off using a poll... that way you wouldnt have to wade through the entire thread unless you wanted the particulars of who.. etc..

SeaFireLIV
10-08-2007, 09:11 AM
Start again, Leitmotive!

LEBillfish
10-08-2007, 09:12 AM
By no means is this a perfect number, considering besides HL there is the ASE, Ubi portal, and a host of others as well as many (like the far east) by IP....Yet easily 95% of all HL players fly IL2FB.......

HL Stats:
Our users have posted a total of 7635 articles
We have 15273 registered users
The newest registered user

LEBillfish
10-08-2007, 09:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bearcat99:
If you want statistics you would be better off using a poll... that way you wouldnt have to wade through the entire thread unless you wanted the particulars of who.. etc.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

An "onliner" would of known to do that... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif
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Sorry had to http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

csThor
10-08-2007, 09:25 AM
95% offline, 5% online.

Hatter_RAF
10-08-2007, 09:26 AM
95% online, 5% offline.

bzc3lk
10-08-2007, 09:30 AM
100% OFFLINE

crucislancer
10-08-2007, 09:31 AM
99% offline.

FlatSpinMan
10-08-2007, 09:33 AM
99% offline. Looks like the offliners are determined to be represented here.

joeap
10-08-2007, 09:33 AM
Well roughly 70-80% offline, in fact that has been shifting as I am a latecomer to the online world and liking it...though I am looking more to co-ops than DF servers.

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 09:34 AM
I don't want a poll. I want to know who the offliners are. I want faces, not just numbers.

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 09:37 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FlatSpinMan:
99% offline. Looks like the offliners are determined to be represented here. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

THAT'S THE SPIRIT!

DKoor
10-08-2007, 09:38 AM
It used to be 50/50 when I flew.

JG53Frankyboy
10-08-2007, 09:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
I don't want a poll. I want to know who the offliners are. I want faces, not just numbers. By God, only a idiot wouldn't know who the onliners are---I don't know why they bother to post here. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

you asked for statistics, and statistics are numbers - not faces http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

at least i was told in university http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 09:43 AM
I'm getting both, obviously.

Klemm.co
10-08-2007, 09:46 AM
99% offline, 1% or less online. Online is great though, for the added immersiveness from the opposition's and friendlies actions.

nealn
10-08-2007, 09:46 AM
99% offline
1% online

Would probably play 10% online but more time constraints.

Neal

OMK_Hand
10-08-2007, 09:46 AM
Hi leitmotiv.

Offline for the past year.

Online again soon http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

SeaFireLIV
10-08-2007, 09:47 AM
Well it`s good to see the offliners posting, but we should give it a run over night or so.

IF the true number of offliners post here I guarantee that Onliners would be a small percentage of the number (10% or so).

But what we`ve seen so far shows in a small way how the OFFLINER gets forgotten because they by nature are not going to be so vocal as the constant onliners. Even those who must go online everyday don`t necessarily want to PLAY online. It is a mistake to think that there are fewer offliners than onliners as a result.

jensenpark
10-08-2007, 09:49 AM
99% online. I'm hoping you guys can figure out the math for the offline part.

GIAP.Shura
10-08-2007, 09:54 AM
About 70% online 30% offline.

However, I did play for about 3 years 100% offline and I didn't post on the forums during that time.

AKA_TAGERT
10-08-2007, 09:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
I am a 100% offliner. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>99.9% online.. the only time I fly offline is to test out my most recent hack

JG53Frankyboy
10-08-2007, 10:02 AM
btw, in the good old day , lets say b.h. (before hack) it was mainly :

red vs blue players
or
noobs vs veterans
in the near past it was somtimes
European vs US americans

it was awlays
idiots vs smarts


but offline vs online , that happend not so often in the past IIRC http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
its a.h. (after hack)

rnzoli
10-08-2007, 10:05 AM
90% online = this is the combat zone
10% offline = this is the training zone.
But that is about 4 hours per week.

How does that compare with a 10% onliner doing 16 hours per week? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I guess my friend will only find out the "faces" (well, nick, TBH), but statistics - forget about it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jasonbirder:
You're asking in the wrong place...this is the home of the online mafia... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thanks for the kind words again Jason http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">There is no reason to dis-believe this game is significantly different from anything else in the sim genre </div></BLOCKQUOTE>...expect for the very unique feature of fairly secure online play - until now of course! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
How many people regularly fly online on Hyperlobby...compared to the hundreds of thousands of copies of Forgotten battles, Pacific Fighters, Complete Edition, Il2 1946 actually sold worldwide? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
It's not possible to compare figures that way. "Sold" does not equal "used", right? Also, when you see 1000 people in HL and another 1000 in ASE, you know 2000 people are flyign at that moment. But when you see the same figures next day, it's not necessarily the same 2000 people http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Matz0r
10-08-2007, 10:08 AM
101% online!!!11

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 10:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
Well it`s good to see the offliners posting, but we should give it a run over night or so.

IF the true number of offliners post here I guarantee that Onliners would be a small percentage of the number (10% or so).

But what we`ve seen so far shows in a small way how the OFFLINER gets forgotten because they by nature are not going to be so vocal as the constant onliners. Even those who must go online everyday don`t necessarily want to PLAY online. It is a mistake to think that there are fewer offliners than onliners as a result. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Absolutely. That's why it is good to have them come forward.

Phil_C
10-08-2007, 10:12 AM
85% offline, 15% online...

but thats not to say i dont enjoy my online play, or that i am frustrated with it. I feel that the user created campaigns are gems, and i love how immersive they are with the story lines and historical details.

If i wana just go and shoot up the sky, online is where its at- Online is a heck of an education on how to dogfight a thinking opponent.

crazyivan1970
10-08-2007, 10:16 AM
poll would be good for it too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

ploughman
10-08-2007, 10:18 AM
99.9% of my time is off line.

MEGILE
10-08-2007, 10:23 AM
Perhaps a more pertinent question would be, do you as a player support modding of the game, considering the amount of mods seen online recently. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Haigotron
10-08-2007, 10:27 AM
I am 99% offline, and 1% online, although I am part of an awesome squadron, even then, I am playing less and less of Il-2 generally ...damn schoolwork..damn work...damn it all http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif damn Company of Heroes OpFronts http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Also if you do make a poll, I think a good way to make the possible choices would be (and allowing users to choose the closest possible answer)

1) 90% offline 10% online
2) 75% offline 25% online
3) 50% offline 50% online
4) 25% offline 75% online
5) 10% offline 90% online

triad773
10-08-2007, 10:31 AM
90% offline
8% LAN
2% online

Sturm_Williger
10-08-2007, 10:32 AM
90% online.

10% offline thanks to some wonderfully immersive campaigns people have made.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Monty_Thrud
10-08-2007, 10:36 AM
99% <span class="ev_code_YELLOW">Offline</span>

SeaFireLIV
10-08-2007, 10:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:

It's not possible to compare figures that way. "Sold" does not equal "used", right? Also, when you see 1000 people in HL and another 1000 in ASE, you know 2000 people are flyign at that moment. But when you see the same figures next day, it's not necessarily the same 2000 people http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is really reaching and you know it.

Ha! I love it, trying to insinuate that the people who buy IL2 to play offline don`t play it! LOL.

How about the people who you see online are maybe spending all their time chatting in the chat bar and not playing the game or don`t even have IL2 `46 or are the same regulars? i see a lot of the same regulars, the only real change happens overnight when the US wakes up.

You should sign in to be a politician.

Whatever, far more will fly offline than on.

Hatter_RAF
10-08-2007, 10:41 AM
Of course this thread is representative only of people who visit this forum. Most of my online organization - around 35 regulars - don't normally bother.

TgD Thunderbolt56
10-08-2007, 10:48 AM
Don't criticize it...just answer. Or not.


online por moi. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Stew278
10-08-2007, 10:49 AM
About 95% offline

I'd fly online more but I've found many of the other pilots are too dang good and I'm just target practice. Unfortunately I don't have the free time available that it would take for me to reach that level of skill.

mrsiCkstar
10-08-2007, 10:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Ha! I love it, trying to insinuate that the people who buy IL2 to play offline don`t play it! LOL. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Where exactly did he "try to insinuate" that? All he said was that the amount of games sold does not equal the amount of games being used. That's offline AND online.

I've bought a bunch of games that turned out to be **** and I never play.

And even if 90% of the people who play this game are strictly offliners, so what? What does it matter?

Frankly, I personally don't understand how anyone could play this game and play 100% offline because that portion of the game is ridiculously bad out of the box. Why bother with it? But whatever floats your boat, if it's fun for you then cool beans I guess.

foxyboy1964
10-08-2007, 10:51 AM
100% offline. I dont play any games online. And, if I might add, it really pi$$e$ me off the way online gamers dictate the way that most games are developed these days.

Monty_Thrud
10-08-2007, 10:51 AM
The statistics for Online-vs-Offline was done a few years ago, i think it was Tully who replied that the Offliners far outway the Onliners, it would be nice to see the latest figures for this.

Bearcat99
10-08-2007, 10:54 AM
Yeah well you wont see them in here.. unless you or someone else does the math... this needs to be a poll.. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

strider1
10-08-2007, 10:56 AM
80 % offline, 20 % online, including training that will shift soon to more online play.
As others have said, community campaigns are not only immersive but show aspects of the sim not generally seen online, except in coops.
I like the variety of choice available and don't see going with one exclusively.

rnzoli
10-08-2007, 10:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
Ha! I love it, trying to insinuate that the people who buy IL2 to play offline don`t play it! LOL. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Oh, dear. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif Define "play" then. Let's say a copy was sold 7 months ago, but the offliner got bored and put it on the shelf 3 months ago. Is this copy "played" offline right now?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">How about the people who you see online are maybe spending all their time chatting in the chat bar and not playing the game </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Ha! I love it, trying to insinuate that the people who buy IL2 to play online don`t play it! LOL. (Thanks for this sentence btw http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">or don`t even have IL2 `46 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Huh? How else can they be in-game?


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Whatever, far more will fly offline than on. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Most probably, the question is how "far" more.

We had this discussion with LEXX some time ago.
The trouble is that tendencies show a lot more onliners. More high-speed digital lines, more servers, more tools to connect (HL, ASE, Xfire). More competitions, LAN parties, squadrons etc.

So it would be nice to know where we really stand, because I feel that the tendencies work against the dominance of offline play (provided it is cheat-free online). Look at the kids nowadays, and see how many of them use the computer for offline activities only, and think +5 years from now.

Of course, if the sole purpose of this inventory is to demonstrate that offliners must be given all rights to decide, there is no point to discuss further. I can close it already - ultimately Oleg decides, not us. We can only vote with our feet.

GIAP.Shura
10-08-2007, 10:58 AM
Seafire, I don't think rnzoli was pushing for either camp really, just saying that the numbers can't be relied on to be totally accurate, in the same way that your example was. It is pretty sure that there will be a rotation of the pilots on HL throughout the day as pilots in different time periods come on.

I think the thing about sold and used is pretty valid. I'm sure there are quite a few people who have bought it and don't use it either because they don't have a joystick or have been unable to cope with the aspects of the sim which are not very user friendly.

arjisme
10-08-2007, 11:17 AM
100% offline.

User made campaigns are great. I know online is fun too, but I would want to play more often than I currently have time for if I were going to go online.

BOA_Allmenroder
10-08-2007, 11:19 AM
99.9% Online.

mr.keith
10-08-2007, 11:24 AM
My name is Keith and I am a "off liner"

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 11:30 AM
It's patent this is threatening BC because he would have me scuttle this and start over as a poll. I did not want a simple poll. I wanted to see the people, and have the onliners see them, too. They are the real statistics. Let the offliners step forward. The growling of the onliners who maintained we didn't exist is hilarious.

bhunter2112
10-08-2007, 11:35 AM
100% offline
If I could launch online right from the game menu with no hassales that might be diff.

Pyrres
10-08-2007, 11:38 AM
100% offliner. Just don´t have time to all the hasle with online stuff.

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 11:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mrsiCkstar:
And even if 90% of the people who play this game are strictly offliners, so what? What does it matter?

Frankly, I personally don't understand how anyone could play this game and play 100% offline because that portion of the game is ridiculously bad out of the box. Why bother with it? But whatever floats your boat, if it's fun for you then cool beans I guess. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Arrant nonsense. Balderdash. More of the online hubris. Our experience is invalid because, ostensibly, engaging in a choreographed arcade shoot-out, which no more resembles real air combat of WWII, is more interesting than what we do, whether it be a "quickie" or a deeply-involved campaign. How many online players ever get ambushed or surprised? Very few to read their own accounts.

lowfighter
10-08-2007, 11:45 AM
Most of my il2 time offline, with a short half a year online action (mostly on that very nice old warbirdsofprey PF server http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif)

Xiolablu3
10-08-2007, 11:47 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
How many online players ever get ambushed or surprised? Very few to read their own accounts. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Leitmotiv, on your first flight in a full real server, its extremely likely, that you will get ambushed and shot down in flames.


I am 90% online

10% Offline

Flying against dumb robots (and they ARE dumb when compared to real people, no matter how good the AI) just seems daft when you can play against real people.

ultraHun
10-08-2007, 11:49 AM
100% off-line, but 50% solo and 50% in LAN coop (in pair or element with a good friend of mine)

Please do not forget the LAN players, like ElectronicArts did with Battlefield II compared to Battlefield 1942! I know, LAN is quire rare nowadays, but some dedicated guys are still out there.

SeaFireLIV
10-08-2007, 11:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
It's patent this is threatening BC because he would have me scuttle this and start over as a poll. I did not want a simple poll. I wanted to see the people, and have the onliners see them, too. They are the real statistics. Let the offliners step forward. The growling of the onliners who maintained we didn't exist is hilarious. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hear, hear.

One of the reasons I go online here is to speak up for the offline part of IL2, to help be one of the voices that often get ignored purely for the online `loudest` minority. This is why i speak up for improvements to campaigns offline and Ai, etc... everything that will increase off line immersion. NOT only that, but icreasing offline immersion often works to the ONLINER`S favour too.

How about the time I constantly petitioned Oleg for the chance to ESCAPE enemy territory? for the longest time I took all kinds of opposition, but one day a patch came out and now the pilot had a chance to escape enemy area if he wasn`t too close to enemy concentrations! Not only did it add a little more realism immersivness for oflliners, but it works as well for onliners.

Sometimes, i think Onliners are the least helpful and least imagintive when it comes to making a game more IMMERSIVE, not JUST concentrating on DMs and FMs which is all onliners do. A lot of onliners are also extremely biased, arguing for their fave plane to do well and their `hated` enemy plane to be porked, but never things that actually help make a greater sim all round.

It`s for the Offliner to do I think.

Hatter_RAF
10-08-2007, 11:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TgD Thunderbolt56:
Don't criticize it...just answer. Or not.


online por moi. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I did.

SeaFireLIV
10-08-2007, 12:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xiolablu3:


Flying against dumb robots (and they ARE dumb when compared to real people, no matter how good the AI) just seems daft when you can play against real people. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Daft?

Playing unreal airquake seems daft.
Being shot down by shoulder shooters seems daft.
Being chased by 3 enemy online with a friendly who leaves you seems daft.
Watching 4 friends cahsing 1 enemy seems daft.
Having to wait 30 minutes for a CO OP seems daft.
Watching an enemy pilot disconnect himself just as you are about to shoot him seems daft.
listening to his whine or accusation of cheating seems daft.

By comparison, the AI is a dream.

I`m not saying playing against Humans is always bad, when it`s good, it`s VERY good, closest to reality you can get. but when do we get that? maybe 1 out of 10 flights once the initial euphoria wears off and it`s back to airquake.

Even flying with a squad can take a lot of effort before you get a real battle going.

AI is good enough that when I have little time or can`t stand the foolishness online, I can don my cap and goggles and SERIOUSLY go fight offline where at least the AI gets on with fighting a war.

horseback
10-08-2007, 12:03 PM
100% offline.

I suspect that the offline community is greatly underrepresented on these forums. It looks to me as though Oleg & Co have optimized the game for their own online preferences, and added the offline capability to bring in the greater number of customers.

That's not a bad thing, as long as he throws us a bone once in a while.

cheers

horseback

buzzsaw1939
10-08-2007, 12:04 PM
So far, 100% offline, but after reading in here the last few days, it may stay that way!

Leitmotiv... At the risk of sounding like I'm takeing sides with anybody, I have to say, I admire anybody who thinks for themselves, an stands up for what they belive in! I see the world as full of wishy washy followers, good to see a fighter once in a while, for that alone, I would fly with you any day! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

willyvic
10-08-2007, 12:22 PM
Online except for checking paint schemes, making vids, and training.

My reasons for online are multiple but I can boil it down to this: I enjoy the interaction with other fliers and I appreciate the challenge of facing human intelligence when I fly.

And I don't understand the US vs. THEM mentality of some here. I've always looked at it as one community, just living in different neighborhoods.

WV

BOA_Allmenroder
10-08-2007, 12:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
How many online players ever get ambushed or surprised? Very few to read their own accounts. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Leitmotiv, on your first flight in a full real server, its extremely likely, that you will get ambushed and shot down in flames.


I am 90% online

10% Offline

Flying against dumb robots (and they ARE dumb when compared to real people, no matter how good the AI) just seems daft when you can play against real people. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have to agree with Xiolablu3 on this. Online, I find that I can do, and certainly statistically am subject to much more, of the bouncing etc, on a full real server, that I ever can get offline.

I think there is a vast community of full real/near full real players (just to name a few servers and this is by no means all: Spitsv109, ZekevWilcats, Warclouds etc). I think the arcade community is much different from the full realers (didn't say better or worse).

You fly alone on one of the full real/near full reals and the hairs on your neck really stand up; and you're very interested in sun position etc.

Too many times I've experienced what the vast (80%) of WW2 pilots experienced in thier last moments: bullets coming from out of nowhere and my plane exploding while I thought (since I'm only bleeding electron blood) 'where the heck did he come from!!!'

papotex
10-08-2007, 12:25 PM
OFFLINER 100% here

yes AI is dum but what i like is ground attack

and who can say no to a well maid historical campaign

Gitano1979
10-08-2007, 12:28 PM
75% online

25% offline

Friendly_flyer
10-08-2007, 12:34 PM
About 50/50 online/offline.

I'm with SeaFire on this one. I flew exlisively offline for a very long time. I think most new players do. Good offline play is essential to keep new people.

striker-85
10-08-2007, 12:37 PM
100% online

Doolittle81
10-08-2007, 12:42 PM
100% Offline for me.


Oleg himself admitted long ago that no more than 5% of his customers were On-liners. This Forum is not an accurate reflection of a cross-section of that customer base....On-Liners by definiton are hooked into the Internet, it's their lifeblood, so they naturally congregate here (and similar IL2 forums).

I've always questioned Oleg's business plan, which has him/1C always bending over backwards to cater to 5% of his customer base.Specifically, the worries about "Cheats" has driven compromises negatively effecting the Offline community...(I won't even mention the latest Sound thingamajig as an example).

My suspicion is that Oleg(more likely UBI) sees all the other "On-Line" game companies doing the on-line dance and knee-jerk-reacts to do the same...But for those other companies,their business is Driven in some cases almost solely by the On-line segment, their customers are 95% On-Line, some even charge fees for On-Line and make more profit thereby.

SOW:BofB is likely being continually delayed in large measure due to On-Line concerns and 'safety' measures against Cheats.....I think a much smarter business plan would be to release SOW:BofB as soon as possible as Offline Only...Get the Cash Flow flowing and use it to crash hard on the ON-Line aspects of coding, etc....then follow up at a later time (when it becomes cheat-proof feasible) with the release of the On-Line version.

It's possible that one can't (or shouldn't) do both in the same product, so make two slightly different ones...each emphasizing its own strengths and appealing to it's own market... on-line or off-line. Sell one product (either one) at $49 and the second as an optional "Upgrade" for an additional $15 or so to those customers who want Both worlds (probably less than 2-3% of all BofB customers)
That would be my business plan.

x6BL_Brando
10-08-2007, 12:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">So far, 100% offline, but after reading in here the last few days, it may stay that way! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't be put off by what you read on the forums. The on-line scene has niches for everyone. Get TeamSpeak, look around, ask around, you will find people who are flying the kind of missions that you enjoy.

In answer to Leitmotiv: 90% on-line with my friends ( of which about 80% flight, 10% tech support for the group, 10% gassing to the gang ), and 10% off-line, building missions and trying out campaigns.

B

nickdanger3
10-08-2007, 12:44 PM
99% Online

Offline only to train.

Though since BOTH of my X-45's have gone on the fritz 0% to either....

leitmotiv
10-08-2007, 12:44 PM
Frankly, I never created this we vs. "the other" situation. It is understood on this forum that online is the only way to go, and that is it. I never bought it. My life is bloody stressful, and the last thing I want is dealing with personalities when I am trying to relax. I am damned grateful for "HAL 9000's" cool neutrality. I enjoy the intellectual challenge of the tactical situation---if I want to get my hormones going, I can have plenty of that in real life. Another matter, there is enough competition in my life that so I do not need to go out and ask for more. Thus, I am more than grateful for the AI. Those who want something else, go for it. The last thing I'd do is try to argue from a position of superiority as the onliners love to do. This is why I do what I do, and that's that.

Ken_Det
10-08-2007, 12:53 PM
After getting DSL its been 100% for me http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
Full real servers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

LEBillfish
10-08-2007, 01:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Doolittle81:....On-Liners by definiton are hooked into the Internet, it's their lifeblood, so they naturally congregate here (and similar IL2 forums).

I've always questioned Oleg's business plan, which has him/1C always bending over backwards to cater to 5% of his customer base.Specifically, the worries about "Cheats" has driven compromises negatively effecting the Offline community.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry to say........Yet if you're posting here you're an "onliner" (though not by how you're defining it)....Those who go online either to play or post here ARE the greatest bit of advertising the simulation has....

Now to say, "here's a sim, go crawl into your hole alone and play "alone" (i'll not add the sezzual connatation)...enjoy!"...Will turn many people right off from buying it. HOWEVER, say to them "here's a sim that you can meet and play with others online or alone!" boosts sales as those looking for social interaction doing that they enjoy and sharing ideas like we do here will be attracted to it.

More so, initial buyers wanting online or not, like the phrase "the most accurate and realistic WWII air combat available. (with safeguards to insure fair play)".......So right off the bat folks are interested (about the only reason to buy the sim) in experiencing the best they can WWII air combat as it was.

Doesn't have to be accurate, and doesn't have to be realistic....Yet the buyer must believe it is the best they can get and that online they'll not be outflown by someone who simply has creative programming skills......

No one, not a single person it would be my guess bought this sim with the intention of altering the realistic play......No one.....

So to state the sales method was unsound because play other then as the sim delivers out of the box was sought....Would be simply wrong. They're not catering to off or on liners......They cater to providing you the best product for the money, that product being the most realistic available.

If not then name another...better, WWII air combat flight sim and yes all aspects go into that (sound, graphics, FMs, etc.)...Put them all together and tell me of a better all inclusive sim.

You can't or you'd be there not here....and if you're here, then seems to me the business plan worked quite well.

mrsiCkstar
10-08-2007, 01:14 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Arrant nonsense. Balderdash. More of the online hubris. Our experience is invalid because, ostensibly, engaging in a choreographed arcade shoot-out, which no more resembles real air combat of WWII, is more interesting than what we do, whether it be a "quickie" or a deeply-involved campaign. How many online players ever get ambushed or surprised? Very few to read their own accounts. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You know better than that Jeff. I in no way, shape or form think that the offline experience is invalid, and I never said that. What I meant was that I, personally, don't understand the allure of it. It's not for me.

You explained a bit just now about why you like offline. I like online because to me, gaming is a bit of a social outlet. I enjoy interacting with people from all over the world and playing with or against a human beings. I enjoy being on comms and planning a mission etc and then flying it. Or having a club day with my league and discussing car setups etc.

About what I said about the offline experience being **** out of the box. Well isn't that what a lot of people here have been saying for a long time now? AI sucks, this and that. The whole interface of the game is really bad IMO and the campaigns are even worse. It's out of whack. And it must be even more irritating for those who play only offline.

About that last part. Dude I get ambushed all the time. And if you only play 100% offline, how would you know what online play is like? I play in those "choreographed arcade shoot-out" servers and I do get ambushed regularly. I see the enemy employing well thought out team tactics against me and if I'm alone, I've a snowball's chance in hell. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif Nobody's however crashing into a nearby mountain while on final approach.

For someone who gets upset when the evil online bullies talk rubbish about offline, you don't seem to have much problems belittling online gameplay.

It's getting quite boring to see some of the offliners here playing victim all the time. Why are people complaining about the "loud online minority" spoiling the sim for the "silent offline majority"?

Rally your troops and get louder than the online crowd and maybe you'll get better things, that I also think you need, in the next sim. Instead of lashing out at the onliners for being loud, get louder and let the devs know how you want to improve the offline experience so they know.

PS: Quit being so panache all the time. I had to look up the words arrant and hubris! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

rnzoli
10-08-2007, 01:47 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by buzzsaw1939:
So far, 100% offline, but after reading in here the last few days, it may stay that way!

Leitmotiv... At the risk of sounding like I'm takeing sides with anybody, I have to say, I admire anybody who thinks for themselves, an stands up for what they belive in! I see the world as full of wishy washy followers, good to see a fighter once in a while, for that alone, I would fly with you any day! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif Do I see bonding between 2 offliners?! Nooooooooo.....! Stay away from each other! If you happen to fly with each other, you automatically became ugly, arrogant, oppressive, loud onliners!!!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I warn you: that's how my online experience started - flying together with a friend over the internet, against each other, and then even better, on the same side, against common opponents (AI, other humans). It is an experience people never ever forget. No AI can bring the same level of immersion, than you friend shouting over the comms, "Break! Break left!"

stalkervision
10-08-2007, 01:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
Frankly, I never created this we vs. "the other" situation. It is understood on this forum that online is the only way to go, and that is it. I never bought it. My life is bloody stressful, and the last thing I want is dealing with personalities when I am trying to relax. I am damned grateful for "HAL 9000's" cool neutrality. I enjoy the intellectual challenge of the tactical situation---if I want to get my hormones going, I can have plenty of that in real life. Another matter, there is enough competition in my life that so I do not need to go out and ask for more. Thus, I am more than grateful for the AI. Those who want something else, go for it. The last thing I'd do is try to argue from a position of superiority as the onliners love to do. This is why I do what I do, and that's that. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

I play for relaxation too.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

jasonbirder
10-08-2007, 02:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Rally your troops and get louder than the online crowd and maybe you'll get better things </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well our offliners wallets have always spoken far far louder than onliners...so you'd think the developer would take more notice of us!
If our spending power doesn't warrent much regard from the devloper why on earth would posting on a forum he no longer visits?

MB_Avro_UK
10-08-2007, 02:03 PM
Hi all,

I started 100% offline in 2002 and then read the manual a bit more. I had never been online in any sim before but I gave it a go.(moral is..RTFM!).

Stuck my virtual toe in the online shark-bath that is online and never looked back.

Got bored with DF servers and now fly 80% online with real and virtual mates in co-ops.

The remaining 19% is campaigns and co-op tests.

The remaining 1% is trying to decide offline or online http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif


Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

adriaan_v
10-08-2007, 02:04 PM
Offline 100%

GerritJ9
10-08-2007, 02:17 PM
I play 100% offline.

ImMoreBetter
10-08-2007, 02:48 PM
I play 95% offline.

I think I'm growing to the point where I should be switching over to more online.

I just haven't had time to dedicate myself a night to play.

clayman_52
10-08-2007, 02:51 PM
100% off right now. 80 off - 20 on (in the past)

Got to get back online one of these days. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

GIAP.Shura
10-08-2007, 03:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
Arrant nonsense. Balderdash. More of the online hubris. Our experience is invalid because, ostensibly, engaging in a choreographed arcade shoot-out, which no more resembles real air combat of WWII, is more interesting than what we do, whether it be a "quickie" or a deeply-involved campaign. How many online players ever get ambushed or surprised? Very few to read their own accounts. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I disagree with mrsiCkstar that IL-2 is bad out of the box, especially with all the content that you now have with 1946. The interface doesn't have the bells and whistles that we may be used to but the product itself is solid.

There are two reasons I still play offline so much. The first is that a lot of my flying is ground attack and offline is similar enough for training purposes. The second is the talented mission builders out there have produced some great stuff which is very immersive and enjoyable.

However, I have to say the immersion from a full real SEOW campaign puts offline play in the shade, even for someone who does ground attack. Of course, they require a lot of time, effort and organisation but in my opinion, it is the closest experience we have so far to the real air combat of WW2.

Scharnhorst1943
10-08-2007, 03:48 PM
I am strictly an offline flyer. I have spent alot of time working on a DCG campaign, which still is not done, but alas, life gets into the way. Even if I had all the time in the world, I would still be an offline flyer only. I am not knocking the online experience, I am just saying I don't have the time for it, and it frankly does not appeal to me as much.

bigbossmalone
10-08-2007, 05:04 PM
95% offline
The occasional foray into online coops...
Online DF servers I've experienced are filled with preschool mentality whiners.
But that's just my experience, don't take offense, puh-leeeze!!
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

buzzsaw1939
10-08-2007, 07:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by buzzsaw1939:
So far, 100% offline, but after reading in here the last few days, it may stay that way!

Leitmotiv... At the risk of sounding like I'm takeing sides with anybody, I have to say, I admire anybody who thinks for themselves, an stands up for what they belive in! I see the world as full of wishy washy followers, good to see a fighter once in a while, for that alone, I would fly with you any day! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif Do I see bonding between 2 offliners?! Nooooooooo.....! Stay away from each other! If you happen to fly with each other, you automatically became ugly, arrogant, oppressive, loud onliners!!!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I warn you: that's how my online experience started - flying together with a friend over the internet, against each other, and then even better, on the same side, against common opponents (AI, other humans). It is an experience people never ever forget. No AI can bring the same level of immersion, than you friend shouting over the comms, "Break! Break left!" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm puzzled at why my post offends you! I've read yours three times, to make sure! how about reading mine a little more carefully! I meant what I said!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

LEXX_Luthor
10-08-2007, 10:11 PM
First, I have to apologize to TaylorTony for my getting hot in another thread. I always feel dirty after letting the board get to me.

These pages show an unusual amount of poastings without SiGs at their bottom. They are coming out here.

Today -- 0% Online -- 0% Offline -- I moved to another sim, but it offered something never done before, not even by that sim's developer. Now, and when I played the FB, I was 100% Offliner.

What would tempt me Online would be something rnzoli is great at -- a hardcore Online War with some kind of semi-immediate motivations for flying missions as should be expected. I would be most attracted to a "fantasy" Luftwaffe strategic strike campaign against the Soviets using whatever map works best. Need an He-177 mod. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif


I "feel" that crazyivan is right -- the Offline/Online ratio has been moving more to Online since Oleg's 95% poasting, but I "feel" that is because Oleg personally favours being an Online play developer.

And yes leitmotive, like the real aces, even the most experienced Online players get Bounced, from time to time. For an Online War, I'd expect the Bounce to be the primary war winning fighter tactic.

leitmotiv:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">How many online players ever get ambushed or surprised? Very few to read their own accounts. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I have read some. But, it maybe something one does not like poasting about. hehe

Enforcer572005
10-08-2007, 10:35 PM
Currently, 75% online. Most offline is working in the FMB and trying to fly some of the incredible cmpns out there. Those cmpns are what make offline so good sometimes.

I flew offline only the first 4 yrs I had this thing, but nearly 2 yrs ago I got invited into the hellhounds, and Ive flown alot with them and the Danger Dogz and it's incredible if you find some good guys to fly with. Have flown in several inter squadron fights to, including a very intense SEOW cmpn against the evil minions of the 352cd (the online equivalent to the Borg...you WILL be assimilated). That SEOW cmpn was the most intensive online experience I ever had.

My current east/west 1947 cmpn is going to be available in both off and online versions - both styles have their good features.

Mithrandir63
10-08-2007, 10:57 PM
about 60/40 offline/online depends on my moood

Radoye1
10-08-2007, 11:07 PM
100% offline

rnzoli
10-08-2007, 11:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by buzzsaw1939:
I'm puzzled at why my post offends you! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
No worries, it didn't, not at all http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
I just wanted to mock the occasional labeling (on both sides, to be honest) that goes beyond proportions sometimes, and bearing that in mind, I found it amusing that you say "100% offline, [..] it may stay that way!" and immediately after that "Leitmotiv... I would fly with you any day!". I assumed you meant flying in this sim, and that is only possible via the multiplayer (online) option. Inviting the newly rising iconic leader of the "offliners unite, online sucks!" movement for an online session is kinda funny http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif and highlights very well that if you can unite "offliners", you might as well fly online too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Maybe that also explains why the online people seem to be more vocal and more united on certain issues - they interact with each other (often flying on the same side) more closely.

But anyhow, perhaps you meant RL flying, in that case, just disregard everything I wrote.

ImpStarDuece
10-08-2007, 11:53 PM
90% offline at the moment

Started as a 100% offliner. Got online about 2 1/2 years ago and played about 50:50 for six months or so before slowly gravitating back to offline play. Still dream of finishing my own campaign one day.

I'll occasionally, but very intermittently, feel the need to do online Mosquito bombing runs online, or a few high alt P-47 sorties.

The urge has been somewhat dampened by this whole .SFS being cracked hooha. One of the few things that separated IL-2 from the rest of the sim world was its closed box approach, which, in my book, meant that very little cheating went on.

Dagnabit
10-09-2007, 12:09 AM
100% Offline I am mainly a ground pounder, and I also very much enjoy the missions and created campaigns.
Dag

timholt
10-09-2007, 12:43 AM
99% offline with an occasional foray in HL.

buzzsaw1939
10-09-2007, 01:40 AM
rnzoli... Actually I did mean in real life! but looking again, I can see what you mean! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif it does sound strange doesn't it?

It was a complement to a guy struggling for his right to be who he is, in his own way, I've had a lot of experience in what thats like, as the old saying goes, I may agree or disagree with you, but I'll fight for your right to say it!

btw.. thanks for clearing that up. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

mmitch10
10-09-2007, 01:42 AM
100% offline

sdcruz
10-09-2007, 02:19 AM
100% off line and incredible fun!! Excellent sim!

WOLFMondo
10-09-2007, 02:21 AM
100% online. But I go through phases.

ultraHun
10-09-2007, 03:51 AM
Doesn't the on-line vs. off-line discussion suffer from two wrong premises?

1. off-liners don't care so much about flight model nuances, because they do not measure plane against plane.

2. on-liners don't care about the AI because they do not need it.

First, historical air-wargaming is independent from off-line vs. on-line. As off-liner, I am very grateful for all those red-blue flamewars because I believe that in the end they increase the quality of the flight model, if only by all the details and accounts they bring to surface (forget about unbiased evaluation for a moment).

Second I like flying in LAN - pseudo on-line so to say - together with a friend, because that team-work can be so much fun and greatly adds to the immersion. Yet for this, one needs a real good AI to have a proper wargame. I believe that could be true for the more "on" on-liners as well, if only to "man" all the planes in a scenario.

ViktorViktor
10-09-2007, 04:17 AM
I'm 95% online now.

I flew 100% offline for 4 years and was happy until the recent patch where the AI seems to be able to fly 10% better than a human flyer in the same plane.

This year, since I had read so much on this forum about how thrilling it was to fly online, and I finally had a rig which could handle online play, I decided to give it a try.

Well, I have to say that online play is head-and-shoulders above offline play in the excitement department. It's not unusual for my heart to start pounding and my joystick hand to tremble from strain after I've been flying online.

The human element is both a curse and a blessing, but mostly a blessing. One thing I really enjoy is the variety of ways people fly planes online. You get to see first-hand why they say 'it's the pilot, not the plane'. A good online rule-of-thumb for me has been to never take any engagement for granted.

By the way, it seems that choice of server has a decisive impact on how rewarding the online experience can be.

jasonbirder
10-09-2007, 04:34 AM
100% Offline for me!
I'm only really interested in playing user created campaigns or creating my own missions in the FMB.
Also i've never really had much of an interest in anything from late 1943 onwards...so that counts me out of most online servers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

FluffyDucks2
10-09-2007, 05:21 AM
99% Online, the other 1% spent reviewing online tracks for some of the "funny stuff" that goes on http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
As well as some of the good stuff http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Breeze147
10-09-2007, 06:13 AM
100% offline. I don't have friends and I hate other people. They cheat and lie.

Offline I can be Oberstrupemfuhrer Snickleberg, scourge of the Eastern skies or 1st Lieutenant Buzz Barfly, scourge of the Pacific skies.

Online people are snotty. I always get kicked off servers because I don't know what to do and no one will help.

Online people are circle jerkers. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Xiolablu3
10-09-2007, 06:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jasonbirder:
100% Offline for me!
I'm only really interested in playing user created campaigns or creating my own missions in the FMB.
Also i've never really had much of an interest in anything from late 1943 onwards...so that counts me out of most online servers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Try Ukded servers, they have maps throughout the whole period of the war, in all theatres.

http://www.battle-fields.com/commscentre/forumdisplay.php?f=70

LEXX_Luthor
10-09-2007, 06:22 AM
There are also biplane servers, attempting to simulate the late 1930s. By definition, you will find a much higher class and attitude of player. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif I assume old matching period monoplanes may be available also in many Biplane servers.

SeaFireLIV
10-09-2007, 07:23 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Breeze147:
100% offline. I don't have friends and I hate other people. They cheat and lie.

Offline I can be Oberstrupemfuhrer Snickleberg, scourge of the Eastern skies or 1st Lieutenant Buzz Barfly, scourge of the Pacific skies.

Online people are snotty. I always get kicked off servers because I don't know what to do and no one will help.

Online people are circle jerkers. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Some of this I find interesting because some of the posters I assumed were 100% onliners, like Breeze147 for example. His take on the onliner is also telling.

But a potential onliner can be made or broken by his first time experiences. For example, I decided, after completing SWAT4 offline to go on an online server co-op. The team play was abysmal and I said after a few matches that maybe we should try working together, like in real Swat teams?

The response was to be constantly insulted and then continuously team killed until I left.

Why?

It was an 18-rated team-orientated game, yet I was met with juveniles who were nothing like the characters they were supposed to be.

I know there must be good teamplayers somewhere, but this just blew my whole respect for Swat4 onliners.

I never went back online, staying offline with the excellent AI. This is why a GOOD offline componenet is essential to ANY game worth its salt.

jarink
10-09-2007, 07:30 AM
100% offline ever since I started playing this sim.

I've thought about trying online, but a huge lack of time at home - I rarely am able to sit down at the PC for more than 30-45 mins at time - have kept me away. Crying baby/child/wife? Gotta love that Pause button! Frankly, bad online experiences (poor play, juvenile behavior, network lag) with other games have influenced my decision to stay offline also.

erco415
10-09-2007, 09:02 AM
95% online, 5% off.

Stew278
10-09-2007, 09:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ViktorViktor:
By the way, it seems that choice of server has a decisive impact on how rewarding the online experience can be. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So, in the onliner's opinion, which servers are a good experience and which are best avoided?

I tried Warclouds and while the behavior of the other players was good, they were generally out of my league skill wise.

Sturm_Williger
10-09-2007, 10:30 AM
Well, I got dragged kicking and screaming into Warclouds by my squad - and to be honest, a lot of them (WC pilots) are out of my league skill-wise too.

But flying somewhere out of your league is good for development ( I believe ) and I have improved. Granted, I still pad a lot of people's stats, but I do get kills from time to time.

What I like about it is the teamwork ( I fly Blue ) and despite it being a dogfight server, I find a lot of immersion.
Oh and To answer another question about online play - I get bounced a lot !

I have also in the past flown on the UKDedicated servers and they also have a lot of good mission oriented maps covering most theatres.

Swivet
10-09-2007, 10:40 AM
20% off----80% on

-HH-Quazi
10-09-2007, 11:22 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jasonbirder:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Rally your troops and get louder than the online crowd and maybe you'll get better things </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well our offliners wallets have always spoken far far louder than onliners...so you'd think the developer would take more notice of us!
If our spending power doesn't warrent much regard from the devloper why on earth would posting on a forum he no longer visits? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Wallets? lol Well I believe we all purchased this game just the same. And the day we purchased we had no idea whether or not we would fly online or offline.

What is the big issue here anyway, and this question is not meant strictly for you Jason. Actually it for anyone that can answer. Why is it the ones that fly offline seem to hold anomosity towards those that choose to fly online? And this statement that is being hearld as fact that offline players make up 90% of the crowd? Total BS. It is is looking to me to be about 50\50. And this is just on our forums. What about all the other forums from IL-2 players that never frequent here? You'll never be able to get an accurate number. Maybe that wasn't the purpose of this thread to start with. But it seems to be of interest to several posting here quoting percentages. So again, what is so important about how many fly offline vs. how many fly online? Why would this concern anyone as long as you enjoy the sim the way you want to.

Just fyi though sense the subject is as such. In the first two years I owned this sim I played it totally offline. I felt my dial-up just wouldn't be good enough to try online. I was wrong but didn't find this out until I got a broadband connection & started giving the online scene a shot. First it was participating in coops through HL. I then got the ****** to try joining a squadron. Long story short, now I can't even get myself to fly no more than one mission at a time on any given day offline. Flying with friends on comms in real time...flying against human pilots instead of AI...using team tactics to approach a mission objective...I am hopelessly addicted to flying online at any time I crank this sim up.

bigbossmalone
10-09-2007, 11:35 AM
Hi Quazi
My personal experience of this sim started upon release of the original iL2. I played offline only through the years, until about 4 months ago when I eventually got a decent broadband connection(still pretty pricey in my part of the world).
Hence, I said 95% offline and 5% online. I agree with you, we can't read much from these stats, but at least on these forums, it helps a bit, I suppose.
The online experiences I've had range from superb to silly - this largely depends who you fly with. As for the whole offline/online debate, it's a bit silly, and as usual, there are only a handful who like to shout out to the world their feeling on the matter.
It shouldn't really make a difference, though - every offliner is a potential onliner, and yes, we are all paying customers as far as game sales go.
Happy flying!
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

SeaFireLIV
10-09-2007, 11:36 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by -HH-Quazi:
. Why is it the ones that fly offline seem to hold anomosity towards those that choose to fly online? And this statement that is being hearld as fact that offline players make up 90% of the crowd? Total BS. It is is looking to me to be about 50\50. . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You`ve been here long enough to know the answer to everything you`ve just asked.

It`s not the offliner with the animosity. the offline is simply responding to the perceived animosity, snobbishness and ignorance of some onliners. come on, don`t deny you haven`t seen it...

`I don`t know how people can play IL2 offline`

`IL2 offline is just for low skilled pilots.`

`There are more online IL2 players than offline therefore we deserve more` insinuations...


Over and over again, reducing and belittling offliners at a steady pace until they appear less than an irritant. Offliners are simply made their presence known in only 2 threads - a rare event and you don`t like it? Soon the offliners will return to enjoyable offline play and be forgotten about again. At the moment they`re just making themselves noticed. hard luck if you don`t like the fact that you`re not one of the `elite` any more.

Also, as said again and again, the poll will be skewed because most who post will be onliners anyway as we`ve already said in this thread, so the 50/50 score is obviously inacurate.

What this poll and threads have served to do is prove that offliners are a very real presence that`s unappreciated by most onliners.

And it`s the BS from self-assured onliners `who can`t imagine anyone playing offline` that gets on a person`s wick!

GIAP.Shura
10-09-2007, 11:43 AM
I think some of those who fly exclusively offline think that updates cater mainly for online flying, as though if Oleg hadn't been messing around with miniscule changes in dive rates he would have been producing some sort of super realistic AI. I think they also resent the rather overbearing attitude that can be a part of the competitive online environment.

Some of those who fly exclusively online think that what offliners do has little meaning because it is not at the competitive edge of the IL-2 experience. The belief that the only ones who stick with the game over an extended period are onliners makes them think that consequences of updates, or any other "development", on online play are paramount.

JG53Harti
10-09-2007, 11:51 AM
100% online

a Poll would be better.

foxyboy1964
10-09-2007, 11:59 AM
I dont have any animosity towards online players. I think it's great that a bunch of people get together and play online, and if my rig and connection were up to the task I'd play online too.

The thing that gets me is that over the past couple of years there has been a tendency for games, on all platforms, to be geared towards online play at the expense of the offline experience.

I would have thought that it was possible to include enough options to keep everybody happy, but when it comes to some games (not specifically IL2) onliners seem to be intolerant of other people's preferences.

rnzoli
10-09-2007, 01:04 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
What this poll and threads have served to do is prove that offliners are a very real presence [...] </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Sorry SeaFire to cut the **** http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif but being a very vocal onliner, I would like to agree with the above. And move onto the main thing: both parts are big enough to hurt the other by leaving. The prices we pay now, cannot be maintained if either of us quits and doesn't buy any longer the subsequent releases, add-ons etc. So we have got to find a solution to the problems together, else we are going to be doomed. We can discuss percentages, trends, it is interesting, but irrelevant. Hurt one side fatally, and the other will be insufficient to keep Oleg's boat floating.

Von_Rat
10-09-2007, 01:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by -HH-Quazi:
. Why is it the ones that fly offline seem to hold anomosity towards those that choose to fly online? And this statement that is being hearld as fact that offline players make up 90% of the crowd? Total BS. It is is looking to me to be about 50\50. . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You`ve been here long enough to know the answer to everything you`ve just asked.

It`s not the offliner with the animosity. the offline is simply responding to the perceived animosity, snobbishness and ignorance of some onliners. come on, don`t deny you haven`t seen it...

`I don`t know how people can play IL2 offline`

`IL2 offline is just for low skilled pilots.`

`There are more online IL2 players than offline therefore we deserve more` insinuations...


Over and over again, reducing and belittling offliners at a steady pace until they appear less than an irritant. Offliners are simply made their presence known in only 2 threads - a rare event and you don`t like it? Soon the offliners will return to enjoyable offline play and be forgotten about again. At the moment they`re just making themselves noticed. hard luck if you don`t like the fact that you`re not one of the `elite` any more.

Also, as said again and again, the poll will be skewed because most who post will be onliners anyway as we`ve already said in this thread, so the 50/50 score is obviously inacurate.

What this poll and threads have served to do is prove that offliners are a very real presence that`s unappreciated by most onliners.

And it`s the BS from self-assured onliners `who can`t imagine anyone playing offline` that gets on a person`s wick! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ive seen alot more hostility coming from offliners towards onliners than ive ever seen vice versa.

for some reson they blame onliners for bad ai, no modding allowed, ect,,. blame oleg, not us.

and you are one of the most hostile ones.
those supposed insults you listed are just onliners reasons why they dont play offline. they are entitled to their opinion. as you are to yours.


from the tone of your post you obviously have some sort of issues with online players. you dont see onliners taking it as a personal insult that you prefer offline play, but for some reason you are insulted when they give their reasons for not flying offline.

the only crime onliners commit is that they just mostly ignore offliners. but hey, thats their right.

SeaFireLIV
10-09-2007, 01:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Von_Rat:

ive seen alot more hostility coming from offliners towards onliners than ive ever vice versa.

for some reson they blame onliners for bad ai, no modding allowed, ect,,. blame oleg, not us.

and you are one of the most hostile ones.
those supposed insults you listed are just onliners reasons why they dont play offline. ive never seen the one that offliners are less skilled. all i have ever seen thats close to that is the statment that ai isnt a challagne.
from the tone of your post you obviously have some sort of issues with online players. for some reason your insisting into making it us vs them, and trying to create aminosity where there was none.

the only crime onliners commit is that they just mostly ignore offliners. but hey, thats their right. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Haha. funny.

What you don`t realise or would if you`ve read enough of my posts is that I go online quite a lot. Not as much as offline, but still quite a bit.

I am an ardent offliner, yet I enjoy online when it`s good.

I am the commanding officer of the Okinawa Pacific Fleet that`s taking on Japan in an online persistent scorched Earth campaign. Look for it on mondays and Thursdays at around 20:30 Brit time. Anyone can join the jap fleet.



What you don`t understand is that I like to be FAIR. I like to stand up for the little man, the one who gets hidden or down trodden. the offliner tend to be badly treated by onliners who don`t care cos many of them simply don`t do offline.

I come across as hostile cos I`m speaking up for the offliner in the same tone that most onliners tend to take when talking about offliners, especially when offliners never get much of a say. I like to remind Oleg that there`s an offline crowd don`t just dabble in QMB, but much more. the offliner appreciates the FMB, the campaign, the AI, the command system, yet there are many things missing that could add so much more IMMERSION, not only for offliners but onliners too.

You haven`t been here long enough, but I (and others) have actually HELPED make things better for both onliner and offliner concerning realism and immersion. I won`t go through what we`ve done here though.

I`m not trying to create animosity between 2 sides, just getting some of you onliners to wake up to the fact that offliners exist, are a valuable part of IL2 and are here!

If I have issues with onliners it`s only that they can sometimes treat offliners like an inferior sort of player.

What you have or haven`t seen regarding attitudes to offliners simply means you haven`t looked.

Make of that what you will.

Von_Rat
10-09-2007, 01:53 PM
what you actually play most, offline or online, is immaterial to the fact that you are blaming online players for having bad attitudes, when in my opinion its reversed.

i read these forums as much as anybody. this attitude you claim onliners have is in your head. they just give their reasons for not flying offline, and you turn those reasons into insults.

and this stuff about standing up for the little guy, thats in your head too. jeez get real. who elected you defender of the weak and down trodden. lol.

seriously complain to oleg as loud as you can about offlines problems, but leave us onliners out of it, and stop blaming us for the games shortcomings offline.

oh btw, ive been here longer than my date indicates.

with all you've claimed to have done for the game,(realism and all that) im suprised i dont see your name in the credits. why dont you give yourself some more pats on the back,, http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

willyvic
10-09-2007, 02:11 PM
Holy Christmas!!! This thread has become a class war. Don't believe me? Just insert "the haves" wherever you see onliner and "the have nots" wherever you see offliner. Then re-read the thread.

We are indeed a reflection of our societies, even in a virtual world.

WV

Doolittle81
10-09-2007, 02:13 PM
<span class="ev_code_RED">Let's join hands and sing, shall we?</span> (http://members.cox.net/oberstwiley/moviesKBY.htm)

Low_Flyer_MkVb
10-09-2007, 02:14 PM
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y231/Low_Flyer/Untitled-1.png

Xiolablu3
10-09-2007, 03:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BOA_Allmenroder:

You fly alone on one of the full real/near full reals and the hairs on your neck really stand up; and you're very interested in sun position etc.

Too many times I've experienced what the vast (80%) of WW2 pilots experienced in thier last moments: bullets coming from out of nowhere and my plane exploding while I thought (since I'm only bleeding electron blood) 'where the heck did he come from!!!' </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Absolutely Allmen. IL2 still makes my heart pound and gives me goosebumps when you are bouced all of a sudden with 20mm Hispano flying over your cockpit as you slam your FW190A6 into a hard dive to try desperately to escape.

If you are on Teamspeak and hear the shout 'Woooooahhhhh!!!!! Im in a Me110, just been bouced at c3 3000m' 'Damaged bad, jettisoning bombs and running for home on the deck, can anyone assist??!"

Seeing the red tracer down below , Zooming down behind the enemy as he closes in for the kill. Shooting desperately even when out of range to try and scare him off the tail of your comrade, and saving your teammate by sheer seconds.

Covering him from further attack like a guardian angel 1000m above. He limps back to base, one engine smoking, wing in tatters, missing one elevator, and makes a safe crash landing on the airfield.

Its just fantastic.

Saving a 'bot' offline just doesnt do it for me. I never get the 'heart pounding/goosebumps' sensation unless flying with real people online.

SeaFireLIV
10-09-2007, 03:05 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Von_Rat:
what you actually play most, offline or online, is immaterial to the fact that you are blaming online players for having bad attitudes, when in my opinion its reversed.

i read these forums as much as anybody. this attitude you claim onliners have is in your head. they just give their reasons for not flying offline, and you turn those reasons into insults.

and this stuff about standing up for the little guy, thats in your head too. jeez get real. who elected you defender of the weak and down trodden. lol.

seriously complain to oleg as loud as you can about offlines problems, but leave us onliners out of it, and stop blaming us for the games shortcomings offline.

oh btw, ive been here longer than my date indicates.

with all you've claimed to have done for the game,(realism and all that) im suprised i dont see your name in the credits. why dont you give yourself some more pats on the back,, http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What a load of inane rubbish. why even bother having a keyboard?

LEXX_Luthor
10-09-2007, 03:14 PM
SeaFire, its pretty much a small and established set of Online players here that are hostile to Offliners and mainly when certain topics come up. They give the impression they speak for the Online player community, but as we have seen in the last few days, some of the decent or less "verbal" Online play community is moving beyond these few, now that they have the ability to do so.

It works both ways on rare occasions, two I recall, where Offline players came to this forum from other sims to BASH all Online players overall ~or~ freaking out on Oleg's FM and wanting to "fix" it.

Then we have Stiglr from TagertWare who is the most hardcore ONLINE player of them all. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Von_Rat
10-09-2007, 04:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Von_Rat:
what you actually play most, offline or online, is immaterial to the fact that you are blaming online players for having bad attitudes, when in my opinion its reversed.

i read these forums as much as anybody. this attitude you claim onliners have is in your head. they just give their reasons for not flying offline, and you turn those reasons into insults.

and this stuff about standing up for the little guy, thats in your head too. jeez get real. who elected you defender of the weak and down trodden. lol.

seriously complain to oleg as loud as you can about offlines problems, but leave us onliners out of it, and stop blaming us for the games shortcomings offline.

oh btw, ive been here longer than my date indicates.

with all you've claimed to have done for the game,(realism and all that) im suprised i dont see your name in the credits. why dont you give yourself some more pats on the back,, http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What a load of inane rubbish. why even bother having a keyboard? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

so now come the insults ehh.

Xiolablu3
10-09-2007, 04:16 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
SeaFire, its pretty much a small and established set of Online players here that are hostile to Offliners and mainly when certain topics come up. They give the impression they speak for the Online player community, but as we have seen in the last few days, some of the decent or less "verbal" Online play community is moving beyond these few, now that they have the ability to do so.

It works both ways on rare occasions, two I recall, where Offline players came to this forum from other sims to BASH all Online players overall ~or~ freaking out on Oleg's FM and wanting to "fix" it.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Guys, most of us online players dont want to bash ANYONE. We totally understand you love your offline play, however please bear with us if we try and drag you into the online world.

Its akin to asking mates down the pub for a drink rather than sitting in on their own.

Most of us can remember being offliners, and wondering afterwards we took the plunge online why we didnt do it sooner? WHat fun/immersion we were missing!

But mainly its just one big invite for eveyone to get online and join in the fun togther...

Come and try out online flying, you will LOVE it! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

LEXX_Luthor
10-09-2007, 04:30 PM
Well, I would like to shoot down ElAurens. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d178/Lexx_Luthor/Smileys/00.gif

Offliners don't drink alone. A large and fun Offline community can exist on a webboard ... ShockWave's BoB2 forum is a good example. If you mean get out onto the DANCE FLOOR, well okay. Offliners stay at the bar. I see your point.

Offliners want to mix new types of drinks or bring their own snacks into the bar while they rapp and party. Granted, some of these beverage or food mods may be not always be the best to bring onto the dance floor.

mortoma
10-09-2007, 05:09 PM
Right now 100% offline, 0% online. Used to be about 95/5 but I've not had the ability to play anything online for the past 6 months. Will be a while before I get online again. I used to play the occasional COOP mission online. No use for DF rooms. Tried 'em, hate 'em!!

Overall though online just does not cut it for me most of the time. All the strange warping and such due to lag and compare that to glass smooth offline play. I have to put up with limited AI capability but it's worth it for the smooth gameplay alone. Who wants to be on someone's butt only to have him warp away at lighning speed? Kind of get fed up after a few coops, then go back to the sanity of offline.

mortoma
10-09-2007, 05:17 PM
By the way, the title of the post indicates the desire for some "statistics". Why then was this not a poll so a person could actually glean some stats to begin with? I'm not going to read every post in here and cound the online vs, offline posts. To heck with that.

mortoma
10-09-2007, 05:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
SeaFire, its pretty much a small and established set of Online players here that are hostile to Offliners and mainly when certain topics come up. They give the impression they speak for the Online player community, but as we have seen in the last few days, some of the decent or less "verbal" Online play community is moving beyond these few, now that they have the ability to do so.

It works both ways on rare occasions, two I recall, where Offline players came to this forum from other sims to BASH all Online players overall ~or~ freaking out on Oleg's FM and wanting to "fix" it.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Guys, most of us online players dont want to bash ANYONE. We totally understand you love your offline play, however please bear with us if we try and drag you into the online world.

Its akin to asking mates down the pub for a drink rather than sitting in on their own.

Most of us can remember being offliners, and wondering afterwards we took the plunge online why we didnt do it sooner? WHat fun/immersion we were missing!

But mainly its just one big invite for eveyone to get online and join in the fun togther...

Come and try out online flying, you will LOVE it! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Xiolablu3, I tried online years ago, possibly before you were even a simmer. Why didn't I become immersed in all the fun and comraderie?? I was flying the old Air Warrior sim ( arcadish but fun ) way back about 1995 both online and off. It had little offline content but I still played it mostly offline!! Why have I always gone back to offline then?? In a nice way I'd like to say that onliners should get it into their heads that no matter how much they wish it to be, online is not everybody's cup of tea. I know people like you and LeBillfish can't understand that but you will never change it. Please remember I'm trying to be nice and civil here. Some people like me will always prefer offline, and you may scratch your head but we will not likely change.
In a way, I actually do the opposite from you. I kind of sit there wondering why people play online. But I do play online a tiny bit.

Lurch1962
10-09-2007, 05:42 PM
Offline only. But that's probably because I don't have internet at home. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

-HH-Quazi
10-09-2007, 05:52 PM
But we are all IL-2 brethren. Can I get an amen! Group hug?

LEXX_Luthor
10-09-2007, 05:52 PM
mortoma:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">By the way, the title of the post indicates the desire for some "statistics". Why then was this not a poll so a person could actually glean some stats to begin with? I'm not going to read every post in here and cound the online vs, offline posts. To heck with that. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
leitmotiv poasted that he/she will be doing the counting. The goal was to get some idea of who is who hiding behind the data.

I suggest leit update the thread on the data by Editing the very first line in the opening poast here, and offer current counts in all his/her poastings here.

Also, leit should add to the first poast the reasoning for lack of poll. Teh internets communities have forgotten the traditional method of doing polls -- hand counting. This would save much hand waving from others who missed this.

SeaFireLIV
10-09-2007, 05:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:


Then we have Stiglr from TagertWare who is the most hardcore ONLINE player of them all. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah, Stiglr... I used to enjoy locking horns with him.

You understand, Lexx, that I don`t think all onliners are bad to offliners. I`m just sticking a hyperdemic needle in the old bod and giving it a wake up.

BaldieJr
10-09-2007, 06:18 PM
i play offline.

mortoma
10-09-2007, 06:30 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:


Then we have Stiglr from TagertWare who is the most hardcore ONLINE player of them all. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah, Stiglr... I used to enjoy locking horns with him.

You understand, Lexx, that I don`t think all onliners are bad to offliners. I`m just sticking a hyperdemic needle in the old bod and giving it a wake up. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I remember that guy!! Oh and guess why Targetware is not all that popular?? Because it's online only. Therefore it only appeals to about half the audience it could appeal to. If IL-2 would have been online only, then it would have had much less success than it has otherwise enjoyed. It is successful because it appeals to both onliners and offliners.

Stigler was also known for his dissing of Oleg's flight models, very highly critical of most of the aircraft's FMs. He used to call the stall and spin characteristics in this sim "Oleg's banana peel stall". He was a piece of work, be sure.

Bo_Nidle
10-09-2007, 06:48 PM
Offline 99.9%

I was always terribly disappointed with online mainly due to opponents suddenly warping away or turning on a knife edge. Also a lot of servers I went onto were rather abrupt or downright rude.I know that I just probably found the wrong servers but it had its effect and I gave up.

I haven't been back online now for something like 3 years.

I assume this census taking is the result of the apparent wedge driven into the community by the now infamous "sound-mod"?

I just hope Oleg gets the sound right for SoW! I still long for the most beautiful sound on Earth- a Merlin engine at full throttle! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif

-HH-Quazi
10-09-2007, 06:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by -HH-Quazi:
. Why is it the ones that fly offline seem to hold anomosity towards those that choose to fly online? And this statement that is being hearld as fact that offline players make up 90% of the crowd? Total BS. It is is looking to me to be about 50\50. . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You`ve been here long enough to know the answer to everything you`ve just asked.

It`s not the offliner with the animosity. the offline is simply responding to the perceived animosity, snobbishness and ignorance of some onliners. come on, don`t deny you haven`t seen it...

`I don`t know how people can play IL2 offline`

`IL2 offline is just for low skilled pilots.`

`There are more online IL2 players than offline therefore we deserve more` insinuations...


Over and over again, reducing and belittling offliners at a steady pace until they appear less than an irritant. Offliners are simply made their presence known in only 2 threads - a rare event and you don`t like it? Soon the offliners will return to enjoyable offline play and be forgotten about again. At the moment they`re just making themselves noticed. hard luck if you don`t like the fact that you`re not one of the `elite` any more.

Also, as said again and again, the poll will be skewed because most who post will be onliners anyway as we`ve already said in this thread, so the 50/50 score is obviously inacurate.

What this poll and threads have served to do is prove that offliners are a very real presence that`s unappreciated by most onliners.

And it`s the BS from self-assured onliners `who can`t imagine anyone playing offline` that gets on a person`s wick! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I'll try my best to put this as simple as possible. You sir, are correct about onliners making comments along the lines you posted as examples. And I now think I am understanding more where some of you m8s are coming from & why you feel you are constantly under attack.

And I guess I am one of the guilty ones because I have made such statements as, "I can't imagine anyone constantly playing offline without even giving online play a shot".

But know that when I have made statements like that, it wasn't to belittle anyone that plays offline. It was my way of letting them know that they are missing out on a whole other aspect of the sim they had come to enjoy. I know m8s in my squadron & our sister squadron the DD's that were offline players nearly 100% of the time until they accepted an invite to fly with us at one time or another. And to this day they will tell anyone that the sim became a whole new game to them and it brought about more enjoyment & entertainment and how much better they enjoy it now. Not that they stopped playing offline. Just that they found out they could enjoy the sim just that much more playing with others in real time. So whenever I have made any kind of statement like the example I gave above, it was only to try to show them or let them know that they could have a great time flying online also.

mortoma
10-09-2007, 06:54 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bo_Nidle:
Offline 99.9%

I was always terribly disappointed with online mainly due to opponents suddenly warping away or turning on a knife edge. Also a lot of servers I went onto were rather abrupt or downright rude.

I haven't been back online now for something like 3 years.

I assume this census taking is the result of the apparent wedge driven into the community by the now infamous "sound-mod"?

I just hope Oleg gets the sound right for SoW! I still long for the most beautiful sound on Earth- a Merlin engine at full throttle! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Too bad that Oleg did not make more planes sound like or similar to the DO-335 or Me-110. Those two birds actually have a decent sound to them. Russian, British and American planes all sound like Hoover vaccums!! Or maybe Kirby vaccumm?? I can't make up my mind.

Taylortony
10-09-2007, 06:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bo_Nidle:

I just hope Oleg gets the sound right for SoW! I still long for the most beautiful sound on Earth- a Merlin engine at full throttle! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Bo what you hear in the cockpit for real is nothing like the sound you hear from the ground, the sweet song of the Merlin or Griffon is replaced by a mechanical whiring noise a bit like a coffee grinder on heat..... it's a bit of a let down for those when they fly them.

But until you get your dream here's a quick fix for you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.spitcrazy.com/spitsound.htm

and some others
http://www.enginehistory.org/sounds.htm

mortoma
10-09-2007, 07:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Taylortony:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bo_Nidle:

I just hope Oleg gets the sound right for SoW! I still long for the most beautiful sound on Earth- a Merlin engine at full throttle! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>This is true even of a GA aircraft, such as a Cessna. They don't sound as good when flying them as they do when they are flying overhead and you're on the ground.


Bo what you hear in the cockpit for real is nothing like the sound you hear from the ground, the sweet song of the Merlin or Griffon is replaced by a mechanical whiring noise a bit like a coffee grinder on heat..... it's a bit of a let down for those when they fly them.

But until you get your dream here's a quick fix for you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.spitcrazy.com/spitsound.htm

and some others
http://www.enginehistory.org/sounds.htm </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Doolittle81
10-09-2007, 10:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by -HH-Quazi:
But we are all IL-2 brethren. Can I get an amen! Group hug? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I say again, let's all stand up, shoulder to shoulder, hold hands, and raise our voices in song, in love and friendship, in the spirit of camraderie:
<span class="ev_code_RED">Click here...and join in...Uhh 1...Uhh 2..uhh 3...let's hear it!</span> (http://members.cox.net/oberstwiley/moviesKBY.htm)

rnzoli
10-10-2007, 05:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bo_Nidle:
I was always terribly disappointed with online mainly due to opponents suddenly warping away or turning on a knife edge. Also a lot of servers I went onto were rather abrupt or downright rude.I know that I just probably found the wrong servers but it had its effect and I gave up. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's not directed to you only, but the concerns about warping and vulgarity are the most commonly mentioned. And they are indeed terrible, I agree (because I have seen both.)

For anyone that goes online from an already strong offline background, I recomment checking out one of the co-op servers first. Warping is nearly non-existed because the plane numbers are limited by each mission, and the co-op format filters out immature players very nicely (vulgar people have absolutely no patience http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif) The waiting time for new mission start is also minimal, because it's based on a simple automatic 'vote' system, instead of depending solely on just one person. In short: co-op servers offer the most protected environment online, and a better chance to gain that very important first impression about teamplay with other "breethers" online. After that, when you know what to look for, you will certainly find your way to the best Dogfight servers around, too.

Sorry for this intercourse, but I thought it was worth to mention this. I know about someone who went this way and became quite successful on high-profile dogfight servers later on.

SeaFireLIV
10-10-2007, 05:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
the co-op format filters out immature players very nicely (vulgar people have absolutelyu no patience http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif) . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dunno, maybe. When I join a CO OP I now by default post, "Check your front before moving!"
because at least one onliner will forget there are other planes out there and just rev his engines straight into someone infront of him, destroying himself and usually 2 other guys.

It never fails.

What is it with these guys? they don`t read the brief. they seem to have no idea of there situation on the ground and they don`t check. then they quit sheepishly without an apology after ruining other people`s day.

It`s just common sense to check first, but they don`t. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

p.s. And what`s this driving AROUND the lead aircraft in line? can`t they wait in the queue and takeoff orderly? No, far too impatient for that! forget teamwork, YEEHAA! as they bounce along the runway into the Tower or another aircraft!

Breeze147
10-10-2007, 06:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
the co-op format filters out immature players very nicely (vulgar people have absolutelyu no patience http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif) . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dunno, maybe. When I join a CO OP I now by default post, "Check your front before moving!"
because at least one onliner will forget there are other planes out there and just rev his engines straight into someone infront of him, destroying himself and usually 2 other guys.

It never fails.

What is it with these guys? they don`t read the brief. they seem to have no idea of there situation on the ground and they don`t check. then they quit sheepishly without an apology after ruining other people`s day.

It`s just common sense to check first, but they don`t. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

p.s. And what`s this driving AROUND the lead aircraft in line? can`t they wait in the queue and takeoff orderly? No, far too impatient for that! forget teamwork, YEEHAA! as they bounce along the runway into the Tower or another aircraft! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You just summed up the offliners point in a very neat nutshell. No one will help you and even disdain you and try to get rid of you ASAP. I have identified myself as a noob and asked for help and been completely dissed. I have taxied aimlessly around parking ramps and simply could not find my way out. I got on one server that was all Russians using a Cyrillic alphabet. I've stalled and been laughed at and ridiculed. There is no discipline and it's just aimless flying in a circle. I've been bounced out of the startup screen because I didn't know what to do. Instead of offering advice, people were ratting me out! The only good thing is the scenery in some of the online maps.

I would say I have tried online 10 times and never had an even reasonably fun experience. Whereas offline, I have become immersed to the point of feeling sorrow over losing a wingman who had been with me for 10 - 15 missions, questioning myself if I had done everything possible to save him. I have landed and sat on the apron watching my squadmates land. I have toasted the missing with a beer (it's a good excuse, eh?)

Okay, the caffeine is wearing off.

MadBadVlad
10-10-2007, 06:01 AM
100% offline here

LEXX_Luthor
10-10-2007, 06:42 AM
Breeze:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I've stalled and been laughed at and ridiculed. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
In the real WW2 era, you might give up after the first try. I'm thinking the guys back then could be pretty rough, as they were all scared since they were dropping like flies during training.

Try to find a Biplane server. One possibility -- find other Offline players like SeaFire who have some bad experiences with Online players, start flying together -- the Offline Squad -- and become the Enemy. Maybe its a Xen thing?

And fly with people you know. Then you won't need some man in Moscow to chaparone your group to "protect" you from those who might cheat you. If enough do this, maybe Oleg won't have to cripple his own sims in the future to save Online play from itself.

csThor
10-10-2007, 06:43 AM
The very fact that 99% of online dogfighting consists of the same ole, same ole "Take-Off - Furball - Die - Repeat" ******** at 500ft is nothing particular to Il-2. That has been there as long as combat flight sims of the WW2 age have been played online. Any old-time Warbird players remember the old MED map? And what happened between F4 and F9? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

In my opinion people who are seeking historical gameplay instead of "Instant-Ace-o-Matic" are better off flying offline or limiting themselves to a small, tight-knit group of pilots who share their ideals. This was also the pre-dominant reason why I gave up online-flying on the grand scale I was used to. The mindset (dogfight this, dogfight that etc) was just too overwhelmingly omnipresent in pretty much everything that went on online, so I sought my own "niche" in offline campaigns or quick missions, FMB building and skinning. Right now I'm considering devoting a little time to one or two servers again, but I'm still not convinced.

My main reason for my interest in combat flight sims of the WW2 era is my interest in history. What I don't care for is the steady fragfest I've seen so many times. My 0,02 € ... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Bo_Nidle
10-10-2007, 06:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Taylortony:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bo_Nidle:

I just hope Oleg gets the sound right for SoW! I still long for the most beautiful sound on Earth- a Merlin engine at full throttle! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Bo what you hear in the cockpit for real is nothing like the sound you hear from the ground, the sweet song of the Merlin or Griffon is replaced by a mechanical whiring noise a bit like a coffee grinder on heat..... it's a bit of a let down for those when they fly them.

But until you get your dream here's a quick fix for you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.spitcrazy.com/spitsound.htm

and some others
http://www.enginehistory.org/sounds.htm </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I understand the difference between the in-cockpit sounds and the flyby heard from the ground.(Doppler effect etc) But for me the sound is part of the experience. Being a primarily offline player and have dabbled in movie making I believe the sound is very important from both in and out of the cockpit.

Thanks for the links m8. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Diablo310th
10-10-2007, 07:15 AM
this should be a poll 100% online

rnzoli
10-10-2007, 09:44 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by rnzoli:
the co-op format filters out immature players very nicely (vulgar people have absolutelyu no patience http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif) . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dunno, maybe. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The things that you refer to are typically due to inexperience with co-op missions. More frequent during days when schools are closed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif The dedicated coop servers are perhaps even less effected, because they are continuously online, so it's possible to join alone, experiment without harming others, figure out the things, and when playing with other humans later on, everything goes remarkably smooth.

If I recognize someone new on my side, I quickly do a Tab -&gt; 8 -&gt; 5 sequence after launch, asking for takeoff permission from Tower. This often rings a bell also.

About the overtaking, this is no issue. The guy crashes, leaves, and then we quickly restart the mission if needed. All it takes just another minute, nobody needs to leave the server. Definitely not ruining our whole day http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Once we were running our Filthy Few campaign, and during takeoff from carrier, I noticed that one guy in the front row was strangely "fiddling" with his SBD. Putting his ligths on and off, flaps down and up, canopy open closed etc. I just commented on TS, "he doesn't find the chocks? uh-oh! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif" when BAAAAANGGGG! all aircraft on the deck evaporated in a huge fireball. Of course, he was searching for the chocks, and finally tested the bomb release button as well http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif The interesting thing was that he didn't leave the mission, just asked in chat "hmmm... did I do something wrong?" It was hilarious. We told him that he just evaporized the entire strike force which the fighters should have covered http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif But beleive me, the guy was persistent and he told us he was sorry, looking for the chocks (he read it in the brief, but did not have it mapped). So we told him how to map it, restarted the mission quickly, and from than on, everything went smooth, we flew another 2-3 missions together that night. Good times http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

igitur70
10-10-2007, 09:52 AM
100% offline. I like to crash down on my own.

crucislancer
10-10-2007, 10:15 AM
I have yet to try a co-op, mainly because it seems I'm lucky to get 30-45 online (or offline) before real life comes crashing in. It sounds like a blast, though. I should try to set aside a few hours on the weekend, send the family to the Mall while I fly. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Having only flown DF servers, I prefer those that have some kind of mission objective, so at the very least you hope that some team work is encouraged. I was really enjoying UKDed1 for a while, though there where times that I got quite frustrated with a few people. I''m the kind of guy that wants to line up on the runway, take off in proper fashion, cover my teammates as needed, follow the server rules, etc. It seems that there was always one person being a pain in the ***, and my luck tends to get me in his/her sights. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

Regardless, online play is a lot of fun. Given more time, I would most likely do it more often, and give the rule-breakers a run for their money. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

I still love to fly offline, though. While obviously the AI can't hold a candle to a human opponent, I still get practice, I have fun with some of the fantastic static campaigns out there, and when the family needs me I can pause the game as needed. I've been having a great time playing some of the dynamic campaigns with the Enjoyr patches, and the multitude of static campaigns really gives me a chance to fiddle around with aircraft I wouldn't usually fly.

Without a doubt, this sim offers something for both online or offliners. I don't see any need to argue the merits or lack of same on either side of it. Offline, play how you like. Online, follow the server rules and respect your fellow pilots. Either way, have fun! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

buzzsaw1939
10-10-2007, 11:20 AM
Wow!.. Now this thread is turning into something that makes sense to me, I'm getting a better picture of what online is all about, tempers are cooling and I'm learning a lot more, as always, you are in high form Lexx! I like your analagy of the dance floor, some of us just don't want to make a fool of our selves, so we just sit at the bar, or we just don't want to jump into a free for all while trying to learn this stuff.

I decided I want to figure out how to join a friend, (lan I think) to get comfortable with online, before joining anything in HL.

I thank you all for a very informative morning! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

csThor
10-10-2007, 12:18 PM
After re-reading all 9 pages I've found a post by ultraHun who said something very true:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Doesn't the on-line vs. off-line discussion suffer from two wrong premises?

1. off-liners don't care so much about flight model nuances, because they do not measure plane against plane.

2. on-liners don't care about the AI because they do not need it.

First, historical air-wargaming is independent from off-line vs. on-line. As off-liner, I am very grateful for all those red-blue flamewars because I believe that in the end they increase the quality of the flight model, if only by all the details and accounts they bring to surface (forget about unbiased evaluation for a moment). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What he called "historical air-wargaming" can be easily translated into "simulation of aerial warfare" (isn't that one of your pet topics, Lexx? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif ). This term pretty much sums up what a good combat flight simulation is about - the accurate simulation of the role of combat aircraft in an armed conflict and the environment they fly and fight in. It is, just as ultraHun said, irrelevant whether the "aerial warfare" gets simulated online or offline - both worlds need a few basics to work and surprisingly these are the same for both worlds (even though for different reasons).

a) Decent AI. While for offliners the necessity for a good AI is rather obvious (without it the whole experience will be rather dull) onliners should have a need for a good AI which can be used online, too. Some of you onliners might wrinkle your noses, but please bear with me. I'll explain ASAP.

Currently the online DF servers put up a pretty homogenous picture - the overwhelming majority of the players flies fighters or fighter bombers (for obvious reasons) while some die-hard bomber jocks hold up the flag of the heavier mudmovers. However the historical ratios between bombers, fighters and the other aircraft classes (recon, Stuka, transport etc) aren't simulated anywhere. On top of it players are complaining about a lack of coordination and communication (I'm lurking the boards of various servers and read. They're a source of information and possibly inspiration after all http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif). And why is that? Because players are playing mostly for their own enjoyment, I have even heard of squads who barely cooperate when flying online. And here the AI comes into play. You can put it into bombers and create missions for them. Players can either escort them or intercept them. AI can also fly transports or recon planes. And if everything is connected (recon information, supply situation, aircraft losses etc) it can be pretty much like playing a dynamic offline campaign just with real people piloting some of these aircraft you encounter.

The current dominance of fighters is taking away a lot of potential enjoyment. It is also the best example why the "Storm of War" dedicated server desperately needs to allow moving AI objects (both on the gound/sea and in the air).

2.) FMs. For onlines realistic FMs are a must ... even if it's used just for the old "my d*ck is longer than yours" comparisons http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif. But I say it's equally important for offliners to enjoy their campaigns. If a Bf 109 E-4 is outrun and outclimbed by the Hurri I the whole point of flying is gone as the FM of either is fubar. Without accurate FM and DM there can be no "historical immersion" for offliners, either.

I hope that made some sense ... It's been a long day for me with a lot of "brain work" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

JG53Frankyboy
10-10-2007, 12:26 PM
indeed, the AI is also important for onliners !!

because in COOPs , and thats the way i like this game most online, even when red and blue are manned by human players, very often there is AI around too(bombers and fighters)...........

and in SoW it will even more inportant.
because as i understood MAddox, it will be possible than to have AI planes on (the now so called) Dogfightmaps ! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Stew278
10-10-2007, 12:42 PM
So with Co-Ops, is it usually both sides as humans or is it one team human vs. AI?

JG53Frankyboy
10-10-2007, 12:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stew278:
So with Co-Ops, is it usually both sides as humans or is it one team human vs. AI? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
sure both is possible.................

well, intercepting 12 B17, escorted by 8 human P-51 intercepted by 10 Bf109/Fw190 - thats an expereince you can opnly get on COOPs (i miss VOW http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif )

BOA_Allmenroder
10-10-2007, 01:41 PM
Shameless plug follows:

Although I haven't been at his site for a long time, mzoli's dedicated COOP server is a very good place to start your online experience. Good missions, good planesets and generally good folks participate.

But YOU MUST READ THE BRIEFING;

SeaFireLIV
10-10-2007, 02:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stew278:
So with Co-Ops, is it usually both sides as humans or is it one team human vs. AI? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It`s usually humans both sides since that`s more enjoyable, but if there aren`t many people about the enemy side goes AI.

rnzoli
10-10-2007, 02:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stew278:
So with Co-Ops, is it usually both sides as humans or is it one team human vs. AI? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
sure both is possible.................

well, intercepting 12 B17, escorted by 8 human P-51 intercepted by 10 Bf109/Fw190 - thats an expereince you can opnly get on COOPs (i miss VOW http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Check 2nd picture in my sig... it's from a mission like that. P51's escort B17s, intercepted by Fw190s. At 8000m or so.
Breathtaking mission - it's like the veteran memoirs coming alive. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif


Unfortunately, I doubt you can get this with AI in dogfight servers either http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Stew, if a slot is empty, AI will take control it. So it is quite flexible, can be played in many ways - one team against AI, 2 teams against each other (mixed human and AI on same side), or also 2 teams against AI.)
Sometimes howerver, mission designed choses to put AI only flight, so they don't show up in briefing and remain a big surprise to the human pilots http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Gele_Mi
09-09-2008, 03:33 PM
I play offline because I dont know how to play online (In other people's servers, I know how to make my own. Nobody joins though XD)

WTE_Galway
09-09-2008, 05:54 PM
wow what an ancient thread ... who dug this up ???

I have not flow online for several years.

When I did it was in squad servers and co-ops.

huggy87
09-10-2008, 05:12 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
I am a 100% offliner. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Same here. Although I haven't played at all in probably over a year. I dabbled once or twice on hyperlobby. It was fun having real opponents, but it seemed like so much time was spent in transit or looking for a fight. I know, that is more realistic, but since I fly professionaly in real life I get more than my fill of transiting. When I'm on a computer I want instant gratification.

PapaLazarou.LoG
09-10-2008, 12:16 PM
I was 1/3 online, 2/3 offline.

Heliopause
09-10-2008, 12:28 PM
Never saw this thread before... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

99% online

nealn
09-10-2008, 01:16 PM
100% offline

Single missions missions when only have a few minutes to play, and Lowengrins DCG and some great static campaigns made by this community when I have a bit more time.

Neal

Mr_Zooly
09-10-2008, 01:25 PM
offline feels a little sterile to me where as online gets my blood pumping as you never know what your opponent is going to do.

RegRag1977
09-10-2008, 01:57 PM
Offline 90%

Online 10%

Viper2005_
09-10-2008, 04:09 PM
99.9% online

M2morris
09-12-2008, 12:35 AM
I was once a 100% on-liner.
Then came a wife, then came kids, now I'm lucky to even get in some offline IL2 flying.

I'm a 100% off line geek.

leitmotiv
09-12-2008, 01:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by huggy87:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
I am a 100% offliner. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Same here. Although I haven't played at all in probably over a year. I dabbled once or twice on hyperlobby. It was fun having real opponents, but it seemed like so much time was spent in transit or looking for a fight. I know, that is more realistic, but since I fly professionaly in real life I get more than my fill of transiting. When I'm on a computer I want instant gratification. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Completely agree, tho' I don't fly professionally---I just don't have the time for online. When I have the time, I am able to dash to the game computer for 15 to 30 minute aerial orgies once or twice a day, if that. I think it would be fun to "fly" with a squadron because the tactics must be fascinating if the group is hard core and practices together. I joined an excellent squadron but never had the time to fly with them. Lately I spend more time with FSX developing engine handling skills with multi-engine WWII bombers. I love brawling, but developing technical skills is fun, too.

timholt
09-12-2008, 03:03 AM
100% off line

knightflyte
09-13-2008, 11:47 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Gele_Mi:
I play offline because I dont know how to play online (In other people's servers, I know how to make my own. Nobody joins though XD) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Check out the NUGGETS GUIDE at the top of this forum in the stickies. Download Hyperlobby. There you will come to nirvana.

What version of IL2 are you playing? IL2 1946 4.08 is the most common version used in Hyperlobby. (and the latest for online play)

JadehawkII
09-14-2008, 07:01 AM
100% offline here. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

henriksultan
09-14-2008, 07:35 AM
100% offline right now, used to play online but couldn't find any 4.09 servers when I looked and I couldn't care less right now anyways http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

When the full 4.09 is out, maybe I start doing some dog fighting again... but till then... im to lazy to find any servers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

larschance
09-14-2008, 10:20 AM
100% offline immersed in campaigns when time allows. Intend to set up LAN and maybe take up online when money permits new system and more time available.
One wonders with increasing bills and decreasing resources if we will all be on rationed electricity in years to come. Need a laptop with a very large battery unit. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Sirrith
09-14-2008, 11:07 AM
70% offline 30% online

jdigris001
09-14-2008, 03:19 PM
100% OFFline, mainly DCG generated campaigns, although occasionally I have a play in full mission builder and make a mini campaign

Offline is not by choice though, I live in the bush and our pathetic main telco refuses to upgrade our exchange to enable ADSL, and there is no wireless service here either so my only choice for broadband is two way satellite, and the severe LAG prevents online games being playable

Billy_DeLyon
09-14-2008, 03:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by huggy87:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
I am a 100% offliner. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Same here. Although I haven't played at all in probably over a year. I dabbled once or twice on hyperlobby. It was fun having real opponents, but it seemed like so much time was spent in transit or looking for a fight. I know, that is more realistic, but since I fly professionaly in real life I get more than my fill of transiting. When I'm on a computer I want instant gratification. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Huggy, I'd recommend you just spend a bit more time checking out the various servers on HL. There's a pretty wide variety of scenarios, even just on the DF servers - some have most of their maps set up so that the opposing bases are very close to each other, which means fast action.

Personally I don't frequent those kind of servers, as they tend to have relaxed difficulty settings - not my preference. But it can be fun if you're just looking for some quick, chaotic fun.

The full-switch servers do require more time commitment.

Oh - I'm about 25% offline, 75% online. I'd probably be nearly 100% online, but my weird work schedule means sometimes HL is dead when I have some time to "fly."

X32Wright
09-14-2008, 04:11 PM
Never played OFLLINE and only then I ask squad memebrs to do for training.

I am 100% ONLINE and 0% offline even when I started almost 3 years ago.

ploughman
09-14-2008, 04:18 PM
I have played online, and once scored a wonderful 5 kills in a mission on a full switch server that had me feeling all super and stuff, but lag issues ultimately made the whole experience pointless, net weather being what it is, so... 99% off line, thanks very much. Work on that AI there Oleg, thanks.

p-11.cAce
09-15-2008, 08:17 AM
100% offline now - 2 years ago it was 50/50 with a pretty linear reduction down to 0% online by a year ago.

panther3485
09-15-2008, 08:24 AM
100 percent offline and always have been. Unlikely to change. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Feathered_IV
09-15-2008, 08:33 AM
100% offline for a year now. Online play became extremely stale after a while. Now with the mods, my offline game is pimped to perfection. I'll venture back for RoF, but not any sooner than that.

horseback
09-15-2008, 02:51 PM
100% offline.

cheers

horseback

zlin
09-15-2008, 04:31 PM
100% offliner http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/typing.gif

TheFamilyMan
09-15-2008, 04:51 PM
50-50 here

Most of my online time is with a group of co-workers and local friends, flying our own coop missions and training in dogfight mode. I dabble in HL but I'm generally dismayed by the gross lack of discipline on the DF servers I've tried; but still, it can be a blast at moments (pun intended). At least with offline there can be some semblance of discipline (even though half the time the AI ignores your orders and even worse won't tell you when or where they are flying off to). And if the wife or kids call, you can put the mission on hold.

Dance
09-15-2008, 04:57 PM
Predominantly offline for the last 3 years.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

catahoulak-9
09-15-2008, 09:18 PM
100% offline

GregGal
09-16-2008, 12:03 AM
100% offline

Doolittle81
09-16-2008, 11:15 AM
100% Offline

This should have been a Poll thread.

Feathered_IV
09-17-2008, 05:09 AM
Pretty important bit of market research here. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/crackwhip.gif

mmitch10
09-17-2008, 05:18 AM
100% offline.

blairgowrie
09-17-2008, 05:56 AM
100% On-Line. Really surprised that so few fly on-line. I don't think I would fly iL2 very often without my m8s and Teamspeak.

leitmotiv
09-17-2008, 06:12 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
Pretty important bit of market research here. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/crackwhip.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep. That's why I posted it a year ago---to howls of dismay!

LEXX_Luthor
09-17-2008, 07:12 AM
FamilyMan:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">And if the wife or kids call, you can put the mission on hold. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
mmm, this could be SiG worthy..

"If the wife has a baby, you can put the mission on pause." ~TheFamilyMan

jasonbirder
09-17-2008, 07:23 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">100% On-Line. Really surprised that so few fly on-line </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Funny that...as given the online experience i've always been suprised so many people fly online http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

LEXX_Luthor
09-17-2008, 09:46 AM
Careful jason. Exactly for the reason you state, many escape to private servers, so there may be far more than we know about.

TheFamilyMan
09-17-2008, 11:57 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
"If the wife has a baby, you can put the mission on pause." ~TheFamilyMan </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Don't you just hate it when you are mis-quoted? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

DKoor
09-17-2008, 01:56 PM
Cool fixes are okhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif .

Hoatee
09-17-2008, 02:11 PM
DKoor's wearing me edimensional glasses. 'Cos of those I'm 100% offline for some time now.

WTE_Galway
09-17-2008, 05:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jasonbirder:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">100% On-Line. Really surprised that so few fly on-line </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Funny that...as given the online experience i've always been suprised so many people fly online http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Squad tend make it more tolerable and some co-ops actually can be quite good http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

But that said, I haven't flown online myself since 2003 and do not miss it one bit.

Feathered_IV
09-18-2008, 06:03 AM
Just read through the entire thread **pant pant**

Seems the pure offliners are the majority by far. A significant number of players that like a bit of both (but 50/50 is rare) and the pure online players are very few indeed. I'd love to see a thread like this at the banana lounge where Oleg might get a chance to read it. It chilled the blood earlier to hear that SoW's ofline experience was being outsourced to RRG. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

leitmotiv
09-18-2008, 06:43 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
Just read through the entire thread **pant pant**

Seems the pure offliners are the majority by far. A significant number of players that like a bit of both (but 50/50 is rare) and the pure online players are very few indeed. I'd love to see a thread like this at the banana lounge where Oleg might get a chance to read it. It chilled the blood earlier to hear that SoW's ofline experience was being outsourced to RRG. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Methinks Oleg designed an online game which is mainly played offline and he is making the same error again.

leitmotiv
09-18-2008, 07:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
I'd love to see a thread like this at the banana lounge where Oleg might get a chance to read it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Done:

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?p=49825#post49825

Feathered_IV
09-18-2008, 07:58 AM
Replied!
Good to see you too btw Leit http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

leitmotiv
09-18-2008, 08:38 AM
Always good to see your cheerful Zero!

P.S. Lookit this:

http://www.hyperscale.com/2008/galleries/a6m2type2132ra_1.htm