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View Full Version : what exactly is a scripted campaign?



stugumby
05-10-2006, 02:33 PM
saw some stuff about scripted campaigns, do they use the dogfight maps??

and where can I find battle over europe?? didnt see it on go gamer.

stugumby
05-10-2006, 02:33 PM
saw some stuff about scripted campaigns, do they use the dogfight maps??

and where can I find battle over europe?? didnt see it on go gamer.

CapBackassward
05-10-2006, 03:13 PM
A scripted campaign is scripted to come out a certain way. As opposed to a dynamic campaign that is somewhat - to very random - in its outcome.

I believe a linear campaign is also a scripted campaign.

Some people have knocked IL 2 for having linear and scripted campaigns, but this sim is so good on every other level, I can live with the scripted campaigns. In fact, some of the campaigns people have made for IL 2 are excellent.

The old Red Baron 3D game had a dynamic campaign generator, and it is probably the best to date.

Not sure where you can find BOE.
Scratch that last sentence and try here:

http://rrgstudios.com/EN_02_03_BoE.shtml

Rick http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Skycat_2
05-10-2006, 03:31 PM
All of the campaigns that come with the game are 'dynamic campaigns.' This means that a program randomly generates the waypoints, aircraft types, ground objects, etc., and throws up a generalized yet appropriate mission briefing. If you play a campaign long enough you'll end up seeing the same briefings get repeated when using DGen. Dynamic campaigns are cool in that you won't know what you'll encounter in each mission (because of the random generator) so campaigns are infinitely replayable in theory. Some drawbacks of dynamic campaigns are that events are ahistoric, the briefings are generic and the briefings become unintersting after a while.

'Scripted' campaigns are a series of hand-plotted missions (made in Full Mission Builder) that are strung together in a sequence. The original IL-2 Sturmovik and most freeware campaigns are this way. On one hand, because a human has authored the missions instead of the computer, the player may experience a much higher quality of briefings, better ground object placement, and a more interesting variety of missions. The author can highlight actual events and attempt to recreate the aircraft that flew in the operations, the historic front lines, etc. Generally speaking, 'scripted' campaigns are better for story-telling.

I believe that any map could be used for a dynamic campaign. Lil'Pup created a dyamic Italian campaign for the MT Online map. Scripted campaigns can certainly use any map and even force the player to change maps or even aircraft between missions within one campaign.

Battle Over Europe is available at JustFlight.com for about $15 USD including free shipping to the States, Canada and UK. Look in the Terminal menu to the left of the main page and then browse "Addons."

Aguila_Azteca
05-10-2006, 04:38 PM
dynamic campaign is the worst thing that has come to the series in my honest opinion, they are very repetive, not creative..... and having for example fighters as bombers... and not bombers at all in most missions, it ruins it.... midway camping for example... hellcats and zeros atacking the carriers, if you were lucky u would spot a dive bomber or torpedo plane......

i lovehand made missions, there is no match for them

WWSensei
05-10-2006, 04:50 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Aguila_Azteca:
dynamic campaign is the worst thing that has come to the series in my honest opinion, they are very repetive, not creative..... and having for example fighters as bombers... and not bombers at all in most missions, it ruins it.... midway camping for example... hellcats and zeros atacking the carriers, if you were lucky u would spot a dive bomber or torpedo plane......

i lovehand made missions, there is no match for them </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

To each their own. Lack of a Dynamic campaign (came from the RB3D world) almost had me bypass this sim. Tried the scripted campaigns and found them so mind numbingly dull I've never gotten more than 5 missions deep in them because nothing you do has any effect.

I agree DGen is stale, but DCG has brought the sim alive for me. IF DCG and Dgen hadn't come along I would have left this sim a couple of years ago.

If I want to play linear, scripted campaigns with no replayability I'll just play another FPS.

Aguila_Azteca
05-10-2006, 05:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by WWSensei:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Aguila_Azteca:
dynamic campaign is the worst thing that has come to the series in my honest opinion, they are very repetive, not creative..... and having for example fighters as bombers... and not bombers at all in most missions, it ruins it.... midway camping for example... hellcats and zeros atacking the carriers, if you were lucky u would spot a dive bomber or torpedo plane......

i lovehand made missions, there is no match for them </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

To each their own. Lack of a Dynamic campaign (came from the RB3D world) almost had me bypass this sim. Tried the scripted campaigns and found them so mind numbingly dull I've never gotten more than 5 missions deep in them because nothing you do has any effect.

I agree DGen is stale, but DCG has brought the sim alive for me. IF DCG and Dgen hadn't come along I would have left this sim a couple of years ago.

If I want to play linear, scripted campaigns with no replayability I'll just play another FPS. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

well always the their views are right... and if you disagree with them..... just play FPS....

as diference from me, towards you.... i like to re live history... not rewrite... having historicals battles was what got me into the sim, in the original il2... i loved to play off line mostly.... afther Dynamic campaing..... it just send me right to the online play, or make my own missions....

having static camping in the pe2 add on makes it worth enough to get alone...

Dynamic camping is not yet advance enough for me to find it fun still

major_setback
05-11-2006, 03:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Aguila_Azteca:
dynamic campaign is the worst thing that has come to the series in my honest opinion, they are very repetive, not creative..... and having for example fighters as bombers... and not bombers at all in most missions, it ruins it.... midway camping for example... hellcats and zeros atacking the carriers, if you were lucky u would spot a dive bomber or torpedo plane......

i lovehand made missions, there is no match for them </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I liked the scripted campaigns in the original IL2. There seemed to be more variety to the missions.
The Pluswave series of add-ons does very good varied missions. I liked the one (in the Wings over Waves demo) where you had to intercept Catalinas that were picking up a submarine crew that had to abandon ship. You got to straffe several Catalinas as they were taking off from by the u-boat. That sort of mission really adds to the immersion...for me anyway.

joeap
05-11-2006, 04:34 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by WWSensei:


To each their own. Lack of a Dynamic campaign (came from the RB3D world) almost had me bypass this sim. Tried the scripted campaigns and found them so mind numbingly dull I've never gotten more than 5 missions deep in them because nothing you do has any effect.

I agree DGen is stale, but DCG has brought the sim alive for me. IF DCG and Dgen hadn't come along I would have left this sim a couple of years ago.

If I want to play linear, scripted campaigns with no replayability I'll just play another FPS. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well I love DCG as well, except I disagree that your actions should have an effect...you are only one pilot after all! A well written scripted campaign can surprise the first time and if difficult enough can be replayed.

WWSensei
05-11-2006, 11:43 AM
Actions having little affect on a strategic level I agree. On a tactical level I disagree. They should have affects otherwise why were they done?

If I blow up a bridge it should stay blown to the next mission. Maybe repaired in a day or two but it should hamper local, tactical supply. If after 5 or 6 sorties I've destroyed enough enemy assets in an area they shouldn't suddenly materialize a scant few hours later with magical replacements.

IL2 isn't a strategic simulation. It's a tactical one. On a tactical level one pilot can and does make a difference in a number of historical incidents.

When I've flown scripted campaigns they just end up being a series of individual missions, loosely connected with little to no flow, nothing I do matters so the incentive to do much of anything is gone and they become boring. There is little to no variety...just figure out the "trick" to the mission and you are done. That's why I compared them to an FPS game.

I'm not saying individual missions can't be fun--they can. But they are individual missions--not a campaign. To me, a scripted campaign is a lot like watching a sporting event on TV versus actually playing a sport. I'm not into being a spectator.

I love having to decide if pursuing the flight lead of my enemy just 30 seconds more and killing him is worth it or not. If I kill him now he isn't there next mission. In a scripted campaign it won't matter because he will magically re-appear. I love the fact that I had to succeed in 20 straight missions of bombing an enemy's supply line before the odds tilted just enough to allow my side's ground forces to capture a key town.

Just trying to point out that there are a variety of opinions on the subject.

In my opinion, if IL2 hadn't been rescued by DGen and DCG with some sort of dynamic capability it would have long ago drifted into the pile of my games gathering dust that offerred a few scant hours of entertainment and no replayability.

Nimits
05-11-2006, 11:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">and having for example fighters as bombers... and not bombers at all in most missions, it ruins it.... midway camping for example... hellcats and zeros atacking the carriers, if you were lucky u would spot a dive bomber or torpedo plane...... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not to too my own horn here, but my True Pacific mod was made in part to address just such issues. And while not complete (0.07c covered carrier campaigns through Midway) I have generally eliminated the goofy situations. F4Fs appearing as bombers is not the fault of DGen per se, just an error in the way the original campaigns were designed.