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zxwings
09-10-2011, 10:11 PM
I have long observed that while flying a plane in IL2, with my hand not touching my joystick at all, the control stick in the cockpit may, however, shake rapidly (possibly above 10 cycles per second) in the 'pitch' direction. I fly the bf109 the most, so it is in this plane that I sometimes see the spontaneous shaking.

I used always to think it was my joystick that caused it, by sending signal spikes to the computer and the sim. But this belief was proved totally wrong: several days ago I observed the very same shaking in the cockpit while my joystick was not even connected to the computer (IL2 had started without joystick), and the aircraft was flying with no input.


Does anyone know what causes the shaking of the control stick?

zxwings
09-10-2011, 10:11 PM
I have long observed that while flying a plane in IL2, with my hand not touching my joystick at all, the control stick in the cockpit may, however, shake rapidly (possibly above 10 cycles per second) in the 'pitch' direction. I fly the bf109 the most, so it is in this plane that I sometimes see the spontaneous shaking.

I used always to think it was my joystick that caused it, by sending signal spikes to the computer and the sim. But this belief was proved totally wrong: several days ago I observed the very same shaking in the cockpit while my joystick was not even connected to the computer (IL2 had started without joystick), and the aircraft was flying with no input.


Does anyone know what causes the shaking of the control stick?

Tully__
09-11-2011, 05:07 AM
Imminent stall, air turbulence, compressibility issues (only at very high speeds), damage, impact of enemy bullets...

ROXunreal
09-11-2011, 07:16 AM
I get this too sometimes, and on externals the elevator shakes in the same way as well. I was sure it was a joystick joystick issue, but as yous ay I think I only ever got this on the 109, or possibly on the J2M sometimes. It's annoying because it makes you lose speed...

danjama
09-11-2011, 08:55 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zxwings:
I have long observed that while flying a plane in IL2, with my hand not touching my joystick at all, the control stick in the cockpit may, however, shake rapidly (possibly above 10 cycles per second) in the 'pitch' direction. I fly the bf109 the most, so it is in this plane that I sometimes see the spontaneous shaking.

I used always to think it was my joystick that caused it, by sending signal spikes to the computer and the sim. But this belief was proved totally wrong: several days ago I observed the very same shaking in the cockpit while my joystick was not even connected to the computer (IL2 had started without joystick), and the aircraft was flying with no input.


Does anyone know what causes the shaking of the control stick? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have experienced the exact same thing consistently since I started flying this sim, all those years ago. However, I can't agree or disagree with ROX, i've never noticed any effects to performance during this visual oddity.

K_Freddie
09-11-2011, 12:41 PM
Never seen it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

zxwings
09-12-2011, 03:07 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tully__:
Imminent stall, air turbulence, compressibility issues (only at very high speeds), damage, impact of enemy bullets... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thank you Tully.

Air turbulence is probably the answer, since I observed that oddity at the beginning of offline quick missions where there was only my own aircraf in the map, and it was flying horizontally at 300-400 km/h.

If I were familiar with old propellor aircraft in real life, then turbulence as the reason would be completely understandable to me.

Suppose a Bf109 is on the ground with nobody sitting in its cockpit, but someone at its tail pushes its elevator up and then down. Will the Bf109's control stick be moved backward and then forward, as if controlled by the elecvator?

I think so, but I have not seen it be tried in real life.

zxwings
09-12-2011, 03:24 AM
In reply to ROXunreal and danjama:

Thanks for the reponse, haha. It is good to hear that it happens to others as well; I almost think the copy of IL2 Sturmovik on my computer has flaws, LOL.

Tully__
09-12-2011, 04:22 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zxwings:
Suppose a Bf109 is on the ground with nobody sitting in its cockpit, but someone at its tail pushes its elevator up and then down. Will the Bf109's control stick be moved backward and then forward, as if controlled by the elecvator?

I think so, but I have not seen it be tried in real life. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes, that is exactly what will happen in not just the 109, but any aircraft that is not fly by wire.

zxwings
09-14-2011, 01:22 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tully__:
Yes, that is exactly what will happen in not just the 109, but any aircraft that is not fly by wire. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I see. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

zxwings
09-17-2011, 04:03 AM
Tully, after doing an experiment I have made the conclusion that turbulence is not the reason for the control stick's shaking I described. It is in the offline trk file downloadable below.

trk file (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=XOFHSL08)

[Track Description] Stock IL-2 4.10.1m was used in making the trk file. In the Full Mission Builder I chose Kuban as the map, placed one Bf-109 G-10 in it, in the air, and set all wind and turbulence settings to 0. Before starting the offline mission, in the Difficulty Settings, Wind & Turbulence was turned off. Be the way, my joystick was not connected to the computer. After entering the mission, I used the keyboard to control, slightly, the elevator trim of the 109. The first instance of control stick vibration can be seen during (00:11-00:27), lasting for 16 seconds.

When I replay the trk I see the stick vibration just as when I was recording the track. I wonder whether you and others can also see this phenomenon in the playback.

Other readers of this post please also download and watch the track, and see if you observe the same stick shaking on your computer.

Tully__
09-17-2011, 06:12 AM
I'm not sure what it is. The altitude changes suggest it's not low atlitude turbulence and not having the stick plugged in suggests its not a FFB feedback loop. More investigation required, anyone else have ideas?

major_setback
09-19-2011, 04:35 PM
I get extremely strong vibrations on my stick in these situations:

Low level turbulence - Disappears if I climb.

Flaps are stuck. Flaps may only be slightly deployed but still cause trouble. (Caused by deploying flaps at a high speed).

Airframe damage. If I have pulled too hard on the stick in a turn, or pulling up from a dive, causing damage to the airframe.

tolodada
09-20-2011, 12:03 PM
setback, I have had this too, long ago, before this structural damage thing came with 4.10, so that is not the cause, I think...

zxwings
09-21-2011, 04:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by major_setback:
I get extremely strong vibrations on my stick in these situations:

Low level turbulence - Disappears if I climb.

... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well, I proved that turbulence was not the cause, in a previous post:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">... after doing an experiment I have made the conclusion that turbulence is not the reason for the control stick's shaking I described. It is in the offline trk file downloadable below.

trk file (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=XOFHSL08)

[Track Description] Stock IL-2 4.10.1m was used in making the trk file. In the Full Mission Builder I chose Kuban as the map, placed one Bf-109 G-10 in it, in the air, and set all wind and turbulence settings to 0. Before starting the offline mission, in the Difficulty Settings, Wind & Turbulence was turned off. Be the way, my joystick was not connected to the computer. After entering the mission, I used the keyboard to control, slightly, the elevator trim of the 109. The first instance of control stick vibration can be seen during (00:11-00:27), lasting for 16 seconds.

When I replay the trk I see the stick vibration just as when I was recording the track. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
The reason why the vibration disappears if you climb, lies very probably in the change in your plane's speed - you climb and your speed drops. It seem to me that the speed of approximately 400km/h plus a little backward deflection of the control stick from the centre (by trimming or by pulling the stick a little) is well likely to induce the stick vibration.

-----------------------
The track file has been re-uploaded.